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New Day

Epic Battle Begins to Replace Ginsburg on Supreme Court; Tropical Storm Beta Takes Aim at Gulf Coast; New Coronavirus Cases Surge, Averaging 40,000 a Day in the U.S. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired September 21, 2020 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:00:00]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN NEW DAY: All right. Welcome to our viewers in the United States and all around the world. This is New Day.

And Americans are mourning the death of Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg. Her seat on the bench at the Supreme Court is adorned in black this morning. So many laid flowers and left messages outside the high court over the weekend.

The battle to replace her has exposed hypocrisy and naked power grabs, the likes of which we have rarely if ever seen in this country. The president has proposed to nominate a woman this week. Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell is promising to move quickly to vote on a nominee despite his refusal to allow President Obama to fill a vacancy more than 200 days before the 2016 election or even hold a hearing.

Senate Judiciary Chair Lindsey Graham is a human pretzel, a complete, utter, total, unmitigated reversal from his position of just two years ago. There are demonstrations outside Lindsey Graham's house this morning.

Joe Biden is urging Republican senators to let voters decide who fills the seat. So far, two key Republican senators have come out against taking up a nomination before Election Day. But, unless two others come out to share that position, the momentum will not change.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN NEW DAY: And a new national poll finds that 62 percent of Americans believe the winner of the November presidential election should be the one to appoint Ginsburg's replacement.

This morning, we have new details about the president's short list of potential nominees. Also, information on our top story this morning, coronavirus, the number of daily cases of COVID-19 are rising again in the U.S. This has the top scientists very concerned. So cases are spiking in 28 states. And the United States will likely pass the very sad number of 200,000 people killed within the next day or so.

All right, joining us now, we have CNN Political Commentators Bakari Sellers and Scott Jennings to talk about what's happening at the Supreme Court. Gentlemen, good morning.

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning. SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning.

CAMEROTA: Scott, I take it that what Republican senators like Lindsey Graham have figured out that the calculus they're doing is that voters will forgive them, hypocrisy, for the getting the brass ring of a Supreme Court pick. I mean, is that what's happening this morning? The reason that Lindsey Graham is a human pretzel and forgetting what he said just two years ago, is that the calculus that's going on?

JENNINGS: Well, I think there're two things. Number one, I think for Lindsey Graham, and you can go back and look at his remarks at the time, a lot of things changed for him during the Brett Kavanaugh hearings. I think he believes that the way Democrats behaved and acted and tried to destroy Kavanaugh's life, I believe that was Graham's words at the time, really changed how he viewed -- how he should be dealing with Democrats. So I think you're going to hear that out of him.

And number two, as a raw political matter, in South Carolina, the president has a lot of supporters. I don't think they would like it very much if Lindsey Graham put the brakes on a Supreme Court nomination. And as another practical matter, there's not one card- carrying member of the resistance in South Carolina who would vote for Lindsey Graham if he did what they're demanding that he would do.

So just from raw politics, I don't think graham has a choice. He's got to move forward in a state like his.

BERMAN: Well, let's just listen. Let's just listen to Lindsey Graham, shall we, who I think we have two pieces of sound, one from 2016 and one from 2018, as recently as 2018, he reiterated his promise. You can write it down, from Lindsey Graham. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): I want you to use my words against me. If there's a Republican president in 2016 and a vacancy occurs in the last year of the first term, you can say, Lindsey Graham said, let's let the next president, whoever it might be, make that nomination. And you can use my words against me you would be absolutely right.

If an opening comes in the last year of President Trump's term and the primary process has started, we'll wait until the next election. And I've got a pretty good chance of being the judiciary --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're on the record.

GRAHAM: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right.

GRAHAM: Hold the tape.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRAHAM: Hold the tape. CAMEROTA: Oh, we will.

GBERMAN: A man of conviction, Bakari Sellers. But what does this matter now? And what do Democrats do now, Bakari?

SELLERS: So who does it matter to, I think, is the better question. You know, it apparently doesn't matter to Lindsey Graham. It apparently doesn't matter to Republicans. Lindsey Graham absolutely has no conviction. I think a pretzel is the best way to define what he has become. He's a shell of what he used to be. And I think this is what people hate about politics. Lindsey Graham is a liar, period.

But Democrats -- one of the things that drove me crazy is, let's mourn the Notorious RBG, right?

[07:05:02]

Let's lift her up. But let's also stop this proverbial bedwetting that we always do and act like there's nothing that we have control of. The fact is very simple. If Republicans do this, when we get in control of the Senate, and I want you to know that it's not just two, if Mark Kelly wins, it's going to be a lot more difficult. He could be seated by November 30th.

But if Republicans win, what we'll do is very simple. We'll add D.C. and Puerto Rico as states, that's four new senators, we'll add two new Supreme Court justices, and we'll do what we should do, which is add another 70 to 100, which should be done regardless, federal court judges.

I mean, we're not helpless in this, but we're going to play the same game that Republicans play. And if Mitch McConnell wants to go down this road of trying to get this golden ring of a Supreme Court justice and destroy norms and destroy the United States Senate, so be it.

CAMEROTA: What do you think of that threat, Scott?

JENNIGNS: Well, I mean, I would think more of it if the Democrats weren't already threatening to do it before this came open. It's been, you know, mainstream in the Democratic Party that in order to erase Donald Trump's legacy, they should expand and pack the court and do what Bakari is suggesting by expanding and packing the United States Senate. So these aren't new threats. This is what Democrats already want to do.

I think as a political matter for Republicans, they should definitely be freaked out by what Bakari just said, because Democrats, in addition to what he said, and in addition to what Nancy Pelosi said over the weekend about impeaching Donald Trump and William Barr, the attorney general, you can how radical they really are.

And so on the one hand, you can complain about norms and politics all you want, and on the other hand, you can make these crazy radical arguments about drastically changing our government. I don't think voters are going to buy it. BERMAN: Except the issue is, whose norm busting is acceptable here? That's the issue, right? I mean, isn't that's what's being discussed at this point, Bakari?

SELLERS: You know, Donald Trump's legacy is one that the Republican Party can't escape. The reason that no one wants to add D.C. or Puerto Rico is because xenophobia, bigotry and racism has become pervasive from the top down. So that's first. So, I mean, if you're not going to win states that have black and brown people, I wouldn't want to add them either.

But you're correct, John, in the premise of your question. We're not just saying that we're going to do something that is uncalled for. I think that's growth. I think that's diversity. I think it's necessary. But just ramming something down the throats of the American people, when just four years ago, Lamar Alexander, four years ago, John Cornyn, four years ago, Mitch McConnell said that this was something that was unhealthy, but all of a sudden, today it's just right and it's just fine, because it's Donald Trump.

Nobody wants to erase the legacy of Donald Trump. Nobody does. You know why? Because we can hang this around the neck of the Republican Party for the next 20 years, either you're a Donald Trump Republican or you're something else, and most of the Republican Party belongs to him.

CAMEROTA: But, Scott, beyond the political machinations, let's just talk about the real upshot of this, because, you know, I think that the law of unintended consequences is always interesting to look at. And Joe Biden seems to be leaning into the -- here's what might happen if you get your wish of confirming a conservative judge.

I mean, he's talk about health care for Americans and trying to put it into sort of practical terms, in that the Affordable Care Act is on the docket in November, and people are concerned about pre-existing conditions, and the Republicans haven't offered any plan for what to do about that, in the middle of a pandemic. And so what do you think about that strategy, that he's talking about, that this actually affects your health care?

JENNINGS: Well, I think it's -- I think it's wise, frankly, for Democrats to try to make health care an issue in elections. It worked for them in the 2018 midterm, excuse me. And so I'm not surprised about that.

I do think just back to the politics of this for a second, everything Bakari is proposing this morning, Joe Biden has come out against, by the way. So what I am really looking forward to, Alisyn, to your question, is Joe Biden trying to have this high-minded debate over policy, and the radicals in the Democratic Party talking about expanding and packing the court in the U.S. Senate, and Joe Biden trying to balance the tension that inherently exists. And what he wants to do, talk policy and high-minded fairness. And what the base of his party wants to do, which is essentially burn it all down.

And so it's going to be interesting to see how Biden navigates that. BERMAN: He is on the record. You're right, Scott. Are you suggesting he might have to pull Lindsey Graham here though, Scott?

JENNINGS: I'm suggesting that I expect him to pull it, because he's done it on so many other issues. I mean, if you want to talk about fracking or taxes or anything else this morning. I mean, he is no stranger to changing his position from the spring to the fall.

BERMAN: On the issue of health care, it is interesting that the former vice president is leaning into the health care issue and trying to frame the Supreme Court decision about that, because, honestly, it will have that implication very quickly, very quickly. Right now, it's 4-4 on overturning Obamacare, which would mean it would be overturned.

[07:10:01]

And the next judge, if the next justice votes against it, Bakari, it would be gone.

SELLERS: Yes. And, you know, just so viewers understand, the fifth circuit ruling destroys Obamacare and a 4-4 Supreme Court actually upholds that fifth circuit ruling, unless we have somebody have a come-to-Jesus moment and actually vote their conscience and not their politics on the Supreme Court.

So health care is on the ballot. And it was such a winning issue in 2018. The unique thing about this versus the Republican Party, and I've never been called a radical, so my dad would be proud of me, I guess. But the unique thing about a Republican Party today is that the Republican Party wants to run on the courts. And Democrats, for a long period of time, have been afraid to actually even after these discussions.

I would encourage Joe Biden to put out a list of members or black women that he wants to go on the Supreme Court, Danielle Holley- Walker, who is the Howard Law School dean, Ketanji Brown Jackson, who is the first cousin of Paul Ryan, who's on the district court in D.C. or Michelle Childs who's on the district court in South Carolina.

I think that Joe Biden has to engage in this debate, but I think he's engaging it in the right way, talking about it and framing it for the rights that we have to win or the rights we have to lose, like health care.

CAMEROTA: But it has been so effective for President Trump to put out that list. Why hasn't he done that, Bakari?

SELLERS: That's a good question. I've asked the campaign to do it for about four or five months. I even -- I've asked every -- in fact, I was someone who got on T.V. and said every Democratic candidate for president in the primaries should release a list, especially if we're talking about having a black woman on the court. I think it would only do things to evaluate this debate and get people more excited about it.

But we have a long way to go on educating Democratic voters on the importance of the court. This is something that the Republican Party has done extremely well. And now they're sitting in what they believe to be the proverbial cat bird seat, although there is a great deal of energy around this debate in the Democratic Party, as evidenced by the money we've raised.

BERMAN: Scott, we're out of time, but I want to put up on the screen here so people can see. Senator Collins has said that it should be whoever wins the election, who gets the nominate the justice. Lisa Murkowski says she doesn't want to vote on it before Election Day. And there are three senators, Mitt Romney, Cory Gardner, I believe we have on the screen, Chuck Grassley from Iowa who have not yet said. We've got to go. In ten seconds or less, do you think two of those, because that's what it would be, what it would take. Two senators of those on the right, do you have any reason to believe that they would stand up and say, don't do this before Election Day?

JENNINGS: No reason to believe that this morning. And Republicans, by the way, won on this issue in '16. Four Democratic senators lost on this issue in '18. I think Republicans think this might be a winner for them and they're not afraid of it.

CAMEROTA: Scott, Bakari, thank you both very much for all of the punditry.

JENNINGS: Thank you.

BERMAN: We don't mean that pejoratively.

CAMEROTA: No, I didn't.

Meanwhile, Tropical Storm Beta slowly approaching the gulf coast. It could produce a significant storm surge and flooding rain for days.

CNN Meteorologist Chad Myers is tracking it for us. Here we go again, Chad.

CHAD MYERS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: -- anything we've really seen make landfall so far this year. But this is going to be another storm making very, very heavy rain fall all the way along the coast. We're already seeing surge three to four feet up and down the surge here, from Houston all the way down to Corpus Christi. So that's what we're already seeing at this point in time. And the storm is going to move onshore today as a 50-mile-per-hour gusting storm. So not a hurricane, not an eye, it tried.

This storm truly tried to become something over the weekend. It had a circular eye, it was trying, and all of a sudden, the wind blew it apart. We called it sheer. And the sheer tore the storm apart, thank goodness. Right now, it is just a tropical storm and that's what we'll live with for today.

There will be some flooding rainfall though all the way from Beaumont, Port Arthur, all the way down to Port Lavaca. This is will see -- we'll see some spots here with at least ten inches of rainfall.

Now, this isn't a stopping storm like Harvey. It will continue to move along and eventually even get into Mississippi and Alabama as about a 20 or 30-mile-per-hour event. But that's not what we're worried about. We're worried about this time down here, this 24 hours where it only moves about 50 or 60 miles. That's where the heavy rainfall is going to be.

CAMEROTA: Okay. Chad, thank you very much. We're keeping an eye on that.

Meanwhile, health experts sounding the alarm this morning as coronavirus cases spike across the U.S., 40,000 new cases a day. We discuss, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:15:00]

CAMEROTA: This morning, coronavirus cases are spiking in 28 states. Look at the map on your screen, of all of the orange and red. The U.S. is now reporting an average of 40,000 cases a day.

Joining us now is Dr. Peter Hotez. He's the Dean of the National School of Tropical Medicine at Baylor College of Medicine in Houston, and Dr. Jeanne Marrazzo, she is the Director of the Division of Infectious Diseases at the University of Alabama in Birmingham. Great to see you both as always.

Our Correspondent, Alexandra Field, just said something in the last hour that I think bears repeating. She said, imagine if on this past New Year's eve, okay, just, you know, nine months ago, if somebody had said, in the next nine months, there's going to be a pandemic and 200,000 Americans are going to lose their lives. You wouldn't have been able to process that or believe it. And yet, here we are. We are right on the edge of 200,000, that number. And still, Dr. Hotez, you say, no containment

strategy, no national containment strategy, even with this number.

DR. PETER HOTEZ, DEAN, NATIONAL SCHOOL OF TROPICAL MEDICINE AT BAYLOR SCHOOL OF MEDICINE: Yes, that's right, Alisyn. You know, we had gone up to around 66,000 new cases a day over the summer, end of July, beginning of August.

Finally, people started getting the message about masks, to some extent, we brought it down to 30,000 new cases a day, which is still a screaming high level, still one of the highest number of new cases worldwide, but now it's creeping back up to 40,000.

[07:20:06]

I'm really worried about this summer -- I'm sorry, this fall, as we go into the fall, that we are going to see even a huge peak.

And the reason I say that is remember how we peaked up to 66,000 new cases over the summer. We were at a real low by May, and this is far higher than we were by May. So we may be in for a very apocalyptic fall, I'm sorry to say. And it's happening because we're forcing schools to reopen in areas of high transmission, forcing colleges to reopen. And we don't have the leadership nationally telling people to wear masks and to social distance and do all the things we need to do. We still have that disinformation campaign coming out of the White House and it's literally killing Americans.

BERMAN: Dr. Marrazzo, that graph that we just showed should worry people, right? We put up on the screen the seven-day moving average of new cases there, and you can see, it is now rising again. The last time it had this kind of rise was back in May and June. So it is now rising again, north of 40 cases -- 40,000 cases a day as we head into the fall.

And we put up the map, again, it really feels like the last time we saw as much red as we're seeing on the map, this is the number of new cases here, orange and red, was in May and June. So we've seen this before, and this might have the feeling of here we go again.

DR. JEANNE MARRAZZO, DIRECTOR OF DIVISION OF INFECTIOUS DISEASES, UNIVERISTY OF ALABAMA AT BIRMINGHAM: Right, John. There's so much about this pandemic that is deja vu all over again, right? Here we are today with a very grim, almost numbing milestone of nearly 200,000 people who have lost their lives. And I think it's important to talk about them as individuals, not as deaths that we're tallying.

Why are we going back up? I think there are a few reasons. One is that there is general fatigue, right? People are really tired of this. I don't think anyone projected that we would be going into September and let alone 2021 with -- wrestling with this persistent roller coaster ride, right, of what you're describing.

And the second thing is, as you just alluded to, Alisyn, and talked about with Dr. Hotez, is the completely contradictory messages that we're getting, not just the misinformation but also the confusion about how things are spread. The CDC, as you may know, just the other day, started emphasizing aerosol transmission a little bit more, and that throws people into confusion, even if it is correct.

So that coupled with the lack of consistent role modeling and messaging from leadership, I think, has really merged to create this scenario, which, as Dr. Hotez notes, could be apocalyptic.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about that new CDC guidelines -- guidance and show exactly where it is today, because, as you say, they have clarified, I guess, their previous stance. So the updated information that people need to know this morning is through respiratory droplets or small particles, such as those in aerosols, produced when an infected person coughs, sneezes, sings, talks or breathes. So that is more expansive than what they previously had said in terms of how it is spread.

Then they say stay at least six feet away from others wherever possible. They had said maintain a distance of about six feet. So they've also clarified that. They also say, in terms of their guidance, stay home and isolate when sick and then use an air purifier indoors.

So, Dr. Hotez, what do you think about the updated guidance?

HOTEZ: You know, the updated guidance would have been fine if it came out last May. I mean, we knew all of these things months ago. I don't understand why we're talking about this as updated guidance. This was pretty self-evident to all of us. We know that there's been significant levels of aerosol transmission, and we know we have to wear masks.

And that six feet, quite honestly, is a guideline, but it's probably not adequate to indoor settings for a lot of transmission. This is a virus that replicates at very high levels in the upper airway and in the mouth, and we've known this.

So, again, this is a consequence of political interference from the White House and how they've contaminated the agencies. They've contaminated the CDC, they've contaminated the FDA. They tried to contaminate the NIH, but the NIH was able to hold the line on that a lot better. But this is unprecedented intrusion on Health and Human Services agencies.

BERMAN: Dr. Marrazzo, if you can, can you overlay this new guidance on a classroom, overlay it on an airplane flight, overlay it on, say, a Trump rally. What's the implication to those types of events?

[07:25:00]

MARRAZZO: Sure, it's a great question. So, a couple things, people would really like this to be black and white. Like you would love to say, if you put tape six feet away and you stand that distance, you will never get infected. The reality is that things are on a spectrum, right? There's a spectrum of transmission from airborne to droplet and there's a spectrum of behaviors you can take to protect yourselves.

Of course, the best thing to do, if you really never want to get infected, is to never go out. The next best thing is to make sure that you maintain social distance, wear a mask, and avoid places where the air is stagnant. And I think what's new about this guidance is that it emphasizes that air flow is probably very important. So go to a classroom.

If you're in a classroom where you're able to maintain social distance and you've got really good ventilation, and most new buildings, indeed, have this, then you probably are going to be okay, again, with caution, and really following this three measures that we've been talking about all along.

So, I think the ventilation part is really important here, and it's getting lost in the discussion of, you know, again, who told what to say -- who told whom to say what.

BERMAN: Dr. Marrazzo, Dr. Hotez, we thank you both for being with us this morning. We appreciate, as always, your guidance.

MARRAZZO: Thanks, have a good day. BERMAN: We want to remember some of the nearly 200,000 Americans lost to coronavirus.

65-year-old Harvey Fauria was a bus driver in San Antonio, Texas, for five years. Friends and coworkers described him as easygoing, charismatic with a smile bigger than life. The transit system honored Fauria last Monday by displaying his name on vehicle destination signs.

Sgt. Eric Twisdale served with the Clay County Sheriff's Office in Northern Florida for 22 years, most recently as head of the crime scene unit. The department described him as courageous with a huge heart. He earned an award in 2014 for rescuing someone from drowning and deputy of the year in 2015 for catching two murder suspects after a high-speed chase.

Tom Slade taught history at high school in Jackson County, Mississippi, for nearly 30 years. The beloved bowtie-wearing teacher was described by students as one of a kind. He was always himself. He was just 53 years old, some of the now nearly 200,000 Americans killed by coronavirus.

We'll be right back.

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