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New Day

Key Sen. Joe Manchin (D-WV) Offers Little Comfort to Frustrated Democrats; Pence Says, Trump and I may Never See Eye-to-Eye on January 6; New York City Beginning In-School Vaccine Program for Kids Ages 12- 19. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired June 04, 2021 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: But a more effect to the Suns.

[07:00:01]

And for the first time since 2010, we're going to have an NBA Finals without LeBron or Steph Curry. So, it's an end of an era. Anthony Davis tried to play with a groin injury last night pretty ended it early on, left with just five and a half minutes into the game.

And Devin Booker, meanwhile, he was on fire early in this one, six threes in the first quarter. Phoenix led by 22 after the opening period. Booker had 47 in the game. Suns went pretty easily, 113-100 to knock out the defending champs.

After the game, LeBron James is going to be 37 later this year, he said the long break will do him some good.

All right, U.S. men's soccer team, meanwhile, playing last night for the first time in over 18 months, taking on Honduras in the Nations League semifinal. It wasn't looking great until the 89th minute. Jordan Siebatcheu turns header pass into a header goal. The U.S. celebrates the one-nil victory. They'll play Mexico in the CONCACAF Nations League Final on Sunday. That will be a nice test for the very young team.

All right, New Day continues right now.

JOHN KEILAR, CNN NEW DAY: I'm John Berman alongside Brianna Keilar on this New Day.

A CNN exclusive interview with Senator Joe Manchin, holding firm on his commitment to bipartisanship, while calls grow louder for Democrats to go it alone and leave Republicans behind.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN NEW DAY: And former Vice President Mike Pence publicly breaking with the former president, saying that he doesn't think the two will ever see eye-to-eye about the January 6th insurrection where rioters threatened to assassinate Pence.

BERMAN: Reports of a major change in how Facebook handles political speech as the company decides whether to permanently ban Donald Trump. KEILAR: And as this year's Supreme Court session winds down, questions about the future of the court and the pressure on one liberal justice.

BERMAN: Welcome to our viewers in the United States and all around the world. It is Friday, June 4th.

Senator Joe Manchin doesn't believe in unicorns, or does he? We don't think he does. But the question is might he as well? He's still a believer in bipartisanship and the sanctity of the filibuster. He also believes there's a chance to get a bipartisan commission to investigate January 6th even though Republicans blocked it and that his Republican colleagues will get onboard with an infrastructure bill.

KEILAR: So that puts Manchin on a very short list of Democrats who want to reach across the aisle on this issue. The moderate senator from ruby red West Virginia is also responding to a not so veiled swipe from President Biden.

CNN's Manu Raju tracked down Manchin for an exclusive interview and he's joining us now live from Washington.

I mean, this is the guy to talk to, Manu. What did he tell you?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, he made very clear that he's not willing to go where many Democrat in the House and the Senate want to go, which is essentially to abandon Republicans and then try to move legislation on their own. Remember, they have of the narrowest of majorities in the Senate. That's 50-50 in the Senate.

But there is a process to essentially cut out Republicans on the infrastructure negotiations that have been going between Senate Republicans and the White House. They're still hundreds of billions of dollars apart, the highest skepticism that they can actually reach a deal. And a lot of Democrats are saying, use this budget process, avoid working with Republicans and pass a bill straight along party lines.

But Manchin told me yesterday he is just not ready to go there. He said these things take time. We need to continue talking. And that's an important signal for Democratic leaders as they assess their next steps here because they'll need the support of Manchin in order to get a massive infrastructure package through. But he wants those negotiations to continue.

He's also making very clear, as he has for months, that he's not willing to get rid of or make serious changes to the filibuster to reduce that threshold. Right now, it requires 60 votes to advance legislation. There's a push to change the rules, so just a simple majority. 51 senators can move forward on legislation and break a filibuster. He's not ready to go there.

But I tried to push him yesterday to say he would, quote, never, ever reduce that 60-vote threshold, and he didn't exactly say that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Can you just say just take it off the table and say you'll never reduce a 60-vote threshold on a filibuster?

SEN. JOE MANCHIN (D-WV): Let me tell you one thing. We're going to make the Senate work the way it was intended to work. I'm totally committed to that. And I'm not throwing caution to the wind. I have never desired to do that. I've listened to everybody's point of view, but the bottom line is this country has got to unite. We can't divide it. It has to be united.

And right now, there are people that want to divide it further. They say it's useless. It can't work. Well, I've never given up on our country.

RAJU: You're not taking -- reducing the 60-vote threshold off the table?

MANCHIN: We're going to make the place work. I don't know what else to tell you.

[07:05:01]

And you can't make it work unless the minority has input. You can't disregard a person that's not in the majority.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now, at the same time, there's another key issue coming to the Senate floor later this month. That's the issue of voting. Democrats have had a sweeping voting overhaul, elections overhaul bill that they want to bring to the floor to try to combat these efforts in the Republican-led states to restrict voting in a number of states here. But Manchin does not support the Democrats' bill. He is trying to get behind an alternative proposal, a more narrow proposal, something he is working on with Lisa Murkowski, the Republican of Alaska.

Now, even that narrow bill does not have the 60 votes to move forward. And I asked him, would you support any sort of change in the filibuster rule to allow voting legislation to go through on a simple majority basis, and he threw cold water on that and said what comes around goes around, which is a warning to his party, if they do it in the majority, they're going suffer the consequences when they get back in the minority.

So it sounds like he's not willing to go there. And it also sounds like that proposal simply just does not have the votes in the Senate.

BERMAN: Yes. What struck me in this whole interview, Manu, which was terrific are the gaps in what Joe Manchin wants or hopes can happen and what reality really dictates. I mean, he is still clinging onto the hope that there will be a bipartisan commission to investigate the January 6th insurrection even though Republicans just blocked it.

RAJU: Yes. That was a bit of surprising statement given last week what we saw. Seven Republicans were in support of it, six who showed up actually voted to move forward. And, of course, you need 60 votes in the United States Senate to break a filibuster, and there just are not ten Republicans who will break ranks.

Yet, when I asked him his hope that Republicans could break ranks, I said, look what at Mitch McConnell, the Republican leader, did last week, his efforts to rally his troops to block this legislation going forward. What makes you think you can work with Republicans to get 60 votes on major legislation? He seemed to think there was still an opportunity to get that commission enacted.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MANCHIN: Everything they asked for was totally bipartisan. I think Nancy Pelosi was very gracious in what she had offered, basically making it totally bipartisan. Chuck Schumer said, okay, I'll do the same. They were able to -- if it came to a disagreement, they would have had the same staffing levels. Everything was done in the most bipartisan way. And for him --

RAJU: But they blocked it because of the filibuster.

MANCHIN: Well, one person blocked it on that. But the bottom line is we have seven people, six have voted, seven would, we need three more. Let's give it another shot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: So remember that earlier this week too, Joe Biden essentially called out Joe Manchin, said that Republicans -- he votes more with Republicans than Democrats. I asked him about that swipe from the president. He said it was taken totally out of context. He said he spoke to the White House about it but he didn't want to elaborate further on that point. Guys?

KEILAR: Very interesting. Manu Raju, great interview. Manu, thank you for joining us with the sound of the cicadas behind you, no less.

BERMAN: Stay safe, Manu.

KEILAR: I cannot stay away from you. I can't get enough of Manu Raju. Be strong.

All right, joining us now is CNN White House Correspondent Kaitlan Collins and CNN Political Director David Chalian.

Okay. Look, Senator Joe Manchin, he's not budging. He has so much power in all of this. What did you think of what he said to Manu?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Well, I think you have to remember first and foremost when it comes to infrastructure, if you look at everything that Joe Manchin has said, he's never said he's not willing to do it Democratic only, using that reconciliation process. He said, I want to exhaust the bipartisan outreach first.

So what was so interesting to me is that he's not exhausted at the bipartisan outreach yet, right? He thinks there should actually still be more of that even though Biden and his administration continue to make offers and concessions. Joe Manchin still wants to see more apparently. He's not willing to go there yet, but he's never ruled it out that he would get there on infrastructure.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: And I think what's so notable is look how much the White House offer has changed. We've seen these exchanges of offers and counteroffers, the white house offer has changed a lot from when President Biden first unveiled. The GOP offer has not changed as much when it comes to new spending and how far they're willing to go.

So, yes, you've seen President Biden come down about a trillion dollars off his initial proposal. They are still very far apart, and I think this hope of bipartisanship is still really far off in the future as much as Manchin is pushing for it.

BERMAN: I don't understand. Does he mean next week, next month, next year? I mean, how long is Joe Manchin willing to wait here? And that, to me, still is the part that's unclear. Maybe we'll get a sign in the next few days.

In the meantime, Kaitlan, we heard from the former vice president of the United States last night. He was the guy they wanted to hang at the January 6th insurrection, Mike Pence. He was speaking at a Republican dinner in New Hampshire. Listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, FORMER U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: January 6th was a dark day in the history of the United States Capitol. But thanks to the swift action of the Capitol Police and federal law enforcement, violence was quelled, the Capitol was secured.

[07:10:06]

President Trump and I have spoken many times since we left office, and I don't know if we'll ever see eye-to-eye on that day, but I will always be proud of what we accomplished for the American people over the last four years.

And I will not allow Democrats or their allies in the media to use one tragic day to discredit the aspirations of millions of Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: So, Kaitlan, I don't think we'll ever see eye-to-eye, Mike Pence really trying to have it all ways here. Can he?

COLLINS: Yes. Don't you hate when you don't see eye to eye with someone on the Constitution and what is possible? And I think that was probably the mildest criticism that Mike Pence could have put forward.

Though I will say I was surprised that he even brought it up at all during that speech, but saying you don't see eye-to-eye with the former president on what happened that day given that Mike Pence was there with his family, escorted out as rioters wearing T-shirts with the president's name were saying that they wanted to hang him is stunning, but it's not surprising. And I think we're going to see a lot more of that coming forward.

Basically, Mike Pence has kind of laid the groundwork for what other potential 2024 hopefuls can say about happened on January 6th, I think, with this. And you're going to see this balancing act playing out over the next two years.

KEILAR: Does it work? Does that work, that playbook work, David?

CHALIAN: I'm not sure that it will work. Remember, we're dealing with -- I think our last poll indicates that 77 percent of Republicans believe in the election lie, believe that the election was somehow stolen. So, there seems to be a real marketplace, and Donald Trump clearly believes this, to continue hammering away at that. So I'm not sure that what Mike Pence is doing and trying to separate himself from Donald Trump on this one day but attach him to everything else is going to be a successful strategy for him.

What's clear is what Kaitlan is saying, which is that this isn't the kind of thing that there really can be disagreement on or see eye-to- eye. I mean, I think some of the definitive images of Mike Pence on that day being hustled out of the Senate chamber, rushed down those stairs, that's going to be -- that's an iconic Mike Pence image.

And so he knows he has to deal with this in some way. I'm not sure what he did last night in New Hampshire is going to be his last attempt to try and somehow place the overturning of our democracy that he was trying to make sure didn't happen into the modern-day Republican Party that he's seeking the nomination to lead.

COLLINS: And I think that this is the status quo now for Republicans, which is, yes, it was a bad day, but we need to move on. That is what they used as their excuse for not voting for the commission, saying it was overpoliticized and saying that the media and Democrats are capitalizing on it and just talking about it repeatedly. But it was a moment in history where you have not seen an attack on the Capitol like that since the 1800s, I believe.

And so talking about the fact that people are highlighting a historical event that is going down in history books and saying that they're using it and abusing it is just this type of criticism that they're trying to use to turn the attention off of Trump, off of his role in it, off of Pence's role in it, and, of course, trying to move on from it, though that's not happening.

KEILAR: Man, they want to turn the page on this. Let's listen to what Mike Pence said about that at this Republican event.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PENCE: I was serving as chairman of the house Republican conference. We were in the minority. There was a new Democrat president advancing a liberal agenda. It was a Democrat majority in the Senate, a Democrat majority in the House of Representatives. If we offered a positive conservative agenda to the American people, we would win back the House, we'd win back the Senate, we'd win back America, and that's just what we did, and we're going to do it again in 2022 and 2024.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: I don't know. I mean I think we're seeing what the market wants, David. I don't know if it's that.

CHALIAN: Yes. I mean, the Republicans will need some sort of agenda to go out on the campaign trail and try to sell. That is not where the leader of the Republican Party, Donald Trump, is right now. He's being advised by person after person that he should think about getting to that kind of place and talk about what Republicans can bring to the table legislatively, proactively.

We'll hear from the former president this weekend at the North Carolina Republican Party event. I don't think we're going to get sort of the Republican contract with America that apparently he's trying to develop for the 2022 midterms. I think we're going to get more Trump grievances.

And it's very hard, I think, for other Republicans, as hard as Mike Pence is trying, to break through with something while Donald Trump is committed and obsessed with this notion that somehow he didn't lose the 2020 election.

[07:15:06]

KEILAR: Yes. What do you think?

COLLINS: I think that's true. And I think what you're going hear from Trump when he does speak is what we heard from him right after he left office in that final speech and what he has said repeatedly in these statements where he's given this platform to make these claims about the election. He is not in the -- let's -- it was a dark day, let's move on kind of crowd. When Mike Pence is saying, we don't see eye-to- eye, it's because Trump does not view what happened on January 6th the way that other people do. He didn't that day. We reported that day that he was borderline enthusiastic as he watched those people breach the Capitol. His opinion on this has not changed.

And so what we're going to hear is a lot of the same what we have been hearing from him, I think, on Saturday.

KEILAR: We'll see what Republican voters want, right? We'll see that.

BERMAN: Kaitlan, David, thank you both, nice to see your faces.

New reports this morning that Facebook plans to announce that it will no longer give politicians a pass when they break the company's hate speech rules. The company's faced a lot of criticism for being too timid while dealing with powerful leaders during the Trump era.

CNN Chief Media Correspondent, Anchor of Reliable Sources, Brian Stelter here early with us.

What is Facebook really going to do here?

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: They say that they are listening to that recommendation from the oversight board, from the Supreme Court, these independent arbiters that said last month, you can keep Trump off the platform, but you should have more rules and the rules should be applying to everyone. Right now, the rules are different for leaders and Facebook apparently, today, will make that change.

Look, Facebook has had a hands-off approach. And as a result, the car has drifted off the road and off on to the side and it's crashed. Now, Facebook is going to put a hand on the steering wheel. I think the question becomes, does it know how to drive.

BERMAN: I don't -- there are a few things here that are murky to me. Is it just hate speech or false stuff they're going to take down?

STELTER: Well, one person's hate speech is another person's false speech. This gets into all these debates about what free speech is and where the lines are on Facebook. Facebook has tried to step in and take more action against very clear examples of hate speech, but then with some of the content that President Trump was dinged for and scrutinized for, very much borderline.

A lot of these debates about social media are about what happens on the border and what Facebook should do and how aggressive it should be. But, clearly, today, they are making a big change. They are going to be more transparent about what happens when you get a strike against your account or two strikes or three strikes, and they say those strikes, those rules will apply to everyone. So if you are some wan to be dictator in some country trying to create a Facebook account and rile up the masses, according to Facebook, you will now be subject to the same rules you or I will be subject to.

BERMAN: Most times. Although they still say they leave an exception what they say are new worty.

STELTER: Well, that's the thing. That's the thing. I think we should be very skeptical. I don't know if Facebook knows how to drive. They're going to be more hands-on. We're going to see if they know how to do it. But it will be coming out later today.

BERMAN: Interesting. Color me among the skeptical. Brian Stelter, thanks so much for being with us this morning.

The former CDC director revealing he received death threats after speaking to CNN about the possible origins of coronavirus. Why his lab leak theory -- why the lab leak theory is now getting some traction.

KEILAR: And the Big Apple taking steps to get more kids vaccinated, bringing shots directly to schools.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:20:00]

BERMAN: Today, New York City bringing vaccines to public schools. The program starts with kids age 12 to 17 at four schools in the Bronx. That will expand to all five boroughs in the next few weeks. As for this morning, only about 8 percent of Americans showed that under 18 are fully vaccinated.

CNN's Alexandra Field joins us now with the latest. Alexandra?

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey there, John. Look, as we are seeing the pace of vaccinations nationwide dropping off pretty significantly, we are also seeing a renewed focus on getting young people to get their shots. That's where New York City is turning its attention. They're bringing shots directly into schools, like Bronx Writing Academy. They're offering free prizes for students who come to get the shots today, like video games and ice cream. That could certainly help.

The city reports that it has already vaccinated about a quarter of the population between the ages of 12 to 17. So they're certainly well ahead of that national average that you cited, but they are trying to make sure they reach as many young people as possible before school lets out for the summer. On top of bringing the vaccines into schools, where kids are already, they're also trying to put vaccines into other places that might attract children, places like the New York State Aquarium, where you can get free tickets if you get a vaccine.

And they're also looking beyond that teenage group. They are turning their focus again to people in their 20s and 30s, deploying vaccination buses to night life hot spots in the city. For example, tonight, you'll see some of those buses in places like the West Village and parts of downtown Brooklyn. They are hoping that when people are out and about, they might stop and get a shot. John?

BERMAN: My kids have their second dose on Monday. I couldn't be more excited. Alexandra Field, thanks so much for being with us. Brianna?

KEILAR: New this morning, former CDC Director Robert Redfield says he received death threats from fellow scientists after telling CNN he believed the coronavirus originated in a lab. This is the latest twist in the saga of the so-called lab leak theory, which is an idea initially dismissed by scientists now making a huge comeback.

John Avlon has more in our Reality Check.

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, COVID-19 is in retreat across the U.S. thanks to vaccinations. We've seen the danger that can come from denialism and politicizing a pandemic. That's why we can't afford to politicize the investigation into how COVID-19 found its way into the world, infecting more than 172 million people and killing more than 3.7 million to date.

In the early months of the spread, which began in Wuhan, China, many dismissed the idea that it could have escaped from a lab. The prevailing theory was that it leapt from animals into humans in a now notorious wet market, one that just happens to be steps away from the Wuhan Center for Disease Control and Prevention.

But Trump-era CDC Director Robert Redfield made big news when he told CNN this.

[07:25:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. ROBERT REDFIELD, FORMER CDC DIRECTOR: I still think the most likely etiology of this pathogen in Wuhan was from a laboratory, escaped.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AVLON: Now, Redfield is now he received death threats, even from fellow scientists for offering that opinion. But since then, President Biden has ordered U.S. intelligence to dig deeper into the lab leak theory. Chinese officials predictably slammed the investigation by engaging the old disinformation game of project and deflect. But here's the thing. An accidental lab leak is far from unprecedent.

Listen to former FDA Commissioner Scott Gottlieb.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. SCOTT GOTTLIEB, FORMER FDA COMMISSIONER: These kinds of lab leaks happen all the time, actually. Even here in the United States, we've had mishaps. And in China, the last six known outbreaks of SARS-1 have been out of labs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AVLON: That's true. In fact, there's a long history of accidental lab leaks, many being covered up by the countries in question. And human error is usually a more plausible explanation than some nefarious conspiracy.

For example, small pox was essentially eradicated in 1977. But between 1966 and '78, there were three leaks from British facilities and these were largely contained, making medical photographer Janet Parker smallpox's last known victim.

In 1989, there was an anthrax outbreak in Soviet Union, killing at least dozens. The communist regime blamed local livestock. But CIA satellite imagery showed a lot of activity around a military base. Soviets pushed, accusing the U.S. of pushing fake news. But after the fall of the Berlin Wall, scientists determined a malfunction, a secret bioweapons facility that was, in fact, the source of the spread. It's part of a pattern.

Scientists believe a lab mistake caused the 1970s Chinese H1N1 outbreak that had been blamed on birds. And 2004 SARS in China also came from a lab leak.

But it can happen here as well. In 2014, the CDC admitted that up to 75 of its scientists were potentially supposed to a live anthrax bacteria by mistake. The following year, a USA Today found more than 100 U.S. labs working with potential bioterror pathogens had faced secret federal sanctions for safety violations. And Reporter Alison Young's and a FOIA request uncovered more than 450 additional incidents at U.S. between 2015 and '19.

That's why there was widespread skepticism that the WHO's lead scientist declared that it was extremely unlikely that the pandemic began in a Wuhan lab, saying, if you look at the history of lab accidents, these are extremely rare events. They're not.

Now add to all of that information, U.S. Diplomatic Cables obtained by Josh Rogin showing warnings in 2018 about inadequate safety conditions at the Wuhan Institute of Virology, which was conducting research on coronaviruses from bats.

So, you can see why this needs to be explored further. The Chinese have not exactly been forthcoming. If they were actually interested in clearing up these concerns, they'd release the full medical records of some of COVID's earliest victims.

And we may never know exactly what caused this worldwide pandemic but we have an absolute obligation to try without fear or favor.

And that's your Reality Check.

KEILAR: John Avlon, thank you so much.

Coming up, this brutal attack on an Asian woman in New York's Chinatown. We're going tell you who the police commissioner is blaming for the sharp rise in crime.

BERMAN: Plus, the highly anticipated findings are in, what U.S. intelligence says about UFO encounters and what may be behind them. The truth is out there.

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