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Wolf

Witness Filmed Shooting Speaks Out; State Police Reviewing Dashboard Cam Video; Protests and Questions; Dash Cams on Order and More to Come; Body Cameras for Officers; Iran's Deal Comments. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired April 09, 2015 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's 1:00 p.m. here in Washington, 6:00 p.m. in London, 8:00 p.m. in Jerusalem, 9:30 p.m. in Tehran. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

Up first, what happened before a police officer fatally shot a man in the back as he was running away. That's one of the key questions in the deadly police shooting in North Charleston, South Carolina.

The witness who recorded the video of the shooting says there was a struggle but he never saw the victim grab the officer's stun gun.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FEIDIN SANTANA: Before the video, I saw that he was trying to get away of the taser. And his reaction was just, you know, to get away of the taser.

LESTER HOLT, ANCHOR, NBC NIGHTLY NEWS: Was there a struggle over the taser that you saw? Were they fighting over it?

SANTANA: No, he never grabbed the taser of the police. He never grabbed the taser.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Dash cam video from police patrol cars may also provide some answers about what happened. State police say they'll release the footage once they finish reviewing it.

And in the future, every patrol officer in the city will have body cameras similar to these. The mayor says the city is purchasing 150 cameras in addition to the 100 already on order.

South Carolina state police say they're reviewing videos from patrol cars of officers who responded to the deadly shooting. That footage could be key in determining what happened before the officer, Michael Slager, shot and killed Walter Scott.

Let's go to Christina Elmore. She's a reporter for the Charleston newspaper, "The Post and Courier." Christina, thanks very much for joining us. What are you hearing about when those dash camera videos will -- video will be released? How crucial is it, potentially, based on your reporting, in figuring out how all of this started, how it unfolded?

CHRISTINA ELMORE, REPORTER, "THE POST AND COURIER": Yes. Thank you for having me today. Yes, like you mentioned, one of the main things we're trying to get track of today is copy of dash cam video that would tell us a little bit about what led to that fatal shooting on Saturday. We've been trying to get ahold of that -- of that video, up to this point, but it hasn't been released quite yet. We're not sure if it's going to be released today. But if it is, we'll definitely bring it to the community so they can know exactly what happened to bring on that shooting.

BLITZER: It's possible that dash cam video might be released today. Are you getting any indications from your sources there in North Charleston about what that video might show, whether or not it does have a bombshell, if you will? Whether it just doesn't show much more than we've already seen? Are you getting any indications how significant it could be, Christina?

ELMORE: You know, there hasn't been a lot of talk about what exactly is on that video. When we've asked North Charleston police for specifics, a lot of times they've directed us toward SLED, the state police, to inform us about what all might be on there.

And, you know, they haven't been forthcoming with what that video may hold. It -- we're under the impression that it wouldn't show any of the actual shooting itself since that would be off the camera from where the actual car was placed. But it would show, we're under the impression, the initial stop, initial conversations between the officer and Scott could potentially be on that video. So, we definitely --

BLITZER: Yes, that could be significant.

ELMORE: -- want to get our hands on it so we can see. It could be very --

BLITZER: Yes, we would like to see it too.

ELMORE: significant. You're right.

BLITZER: I think you're absolutely right. It could be very significant. SLED is the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division which is now the statewide agency in charge of this whole investigation. The city of North Charleston, they've referred everything, handed over the investigation to the state, in effect.

Christina, we also saw protests yesterday. We had live coverage of that news conference, the mayor, the police chief. We heard demonstrators chanting, no justice, no peace. What are the protestors that you're seeing, and I know you've spoken to several of them, what do they want to see happen now?

ELMORE: You know, I've spoken with a few protestors. I was at a protest earlier yesterday morning, actually. And the main concern that I'm hearing is that people are wanting to know what would have happened if that video had not been recorded. You know, this has been an ongoing discussion in North Charleston, going back decades, especially when you consider that eight years ago, this city was considered one of the most dangerous in the nation. So, police tactics that were, you know, implemented in the city to help, you know, quell those numbers brought on questions of police brutality, of racial profiling.

So, the citizens, from what I'm hearing, they just want to have a continued discussion about what needs to change in the city. I know that -- I went to a NAACP press conference earlier today and there was a call for a citizen's review board just so that you don't have officers policing other officers. You have citizens who have a say in what goes on in their city.

[13:05:06] BLITZER: How would you describe, Christina, and you're there, the state of relations between local police in North Charleston and the African-American community?

ELMORE: You know, like I mentioned before, North Charleston Police Department is -- has roughly -- 18 percent of the department is African-American. But you're talking about a city where 45 percent of the community here is African-American. And that's naturally going to bring about questions about just racial relations between those officers and the citizens that they're patrolling and keeping an eye over.

And, like I mentioned before, when the city was considered one of the most dangerous, you know, North Charleston made an effort to quell those numbers. They wanted to get involved in the community so that it would not have that reputation anymore. And those numbers did come down. The city did fall off of that list. But some are asking, at what cost?

So, something like this, many citizens are saying it's just evidence of what they've been saying have been going on in the city the entire time. So, hopefully -- they just want to see change.

BLITZER: So, what I hear you saying, Christina, is that the community, the African-American community, fears there is still extensive racial profiling going on in your city. Is that right?

ELMORE: That's right. And the main question that they're asking is, would this investigation have led to a speedy arrest had that video not occurred or would the officer's word just been taken off face? And, like I said, that question -- it's hard to answer that question because we actually have the video, in this case. But there are some out there who are suggesting that this would've just been another shooting, another black man, and it would've been forgotten and it would not have gotten nearly as much attention.

BLITZER: Yes. Without that video, I assume that is probably true. Christina Elmore with the "Post and Courier." Christina, thanks very much for joining us.

ELMORE: Thank you for having me.

BLITZER: All Right, let's get some more insight now from the law enforcement perspective. Joining us, two guests. Cedric Alexander is the President of the National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives. He's joining us from the CNN center in Atlanta. Also here in Washington with me is Tom Fuentes, our Senior Law Enforcement Analyst, the former FBI assistant director.

Cedric, first of all, how important is that dash cam video that may be released as early as today? What's taking so long for authorities to release it?

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL ORGANIZATION OF BLACK LAW ENFORCEMENT EXECUTIVES: Well, the reason why they may be taking them a while, I'm quite sure they want to take a very good look at it, process the information that's on it, tie it in with the piece of video that we all have been watching for the last number of days. And I think it's going to be important for them to be as detailed as possible because whenever they do release that piece of video, it certainly may raise some questions or some -- and-or some doubts as in regards to what occurred.

But it's going to be -- have to be pretty dramatic, to be honest with you, Wolf, to change trajectory of what we just saw happen in that shooting. And that would have to be pretty dramatic information.

BLITZER: Yes. And, Tom, I think he's right because, as we heard from Christina Elmore, the reporter we just spoke to, she says that it may show the beginning of the conversation going on between these two individuals, the police officer, Michael Slager, and Walter Scott. But I don't know if we're going to get a whole lot more than just the initial -- it's significant to know what led up to the dramatic video that we eventually saw with the police officer shooting him in the back as he was running away.

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Exactly, Wolf. What we need to know here is what starts out as just a regular traffic stop turns anything but routine. You know, the stop is made where they actually have the altercation which Santana starts the video is almost two blocks away in this park. What happens at that traffic stop that causes Scott to get out of his car and take off running? Do they fight at the car? Is there an attempt to arrest him on the spot by Slager? Do they get in an argument? So, at what point that happens, we should see from the dash cam when this routine traffic stop goes bad.

BLITZER: You like -- Cedric, you like the fact that there are these dash cameras on these vehicles. I assume you want all police vehicles to have dash cameras. What about body cameras? Is that a good idea for all police officers, not only where you are in Georgia but all over the country, to have body cameras?

ALEXANDER: Well, I think it's really a -- it certainly is one of the primary recommendations that came out of the 21st Century Task Force Report in understanding the importance of body cameras in the sense they are not the end all to be all. But what they do help us understand, Wolf, it gives us pieces of a puzzle that may have been missing. So, it either supports or negates the statements that are made by the officer or the citizen that's in question. So, I truly support the whole idea of having body cameras, but I think each and every community and police department need to make that assessment for themselves.

[13:10:08] I am a strong proponent of them. And I'm -- and many of the professional law enforcement organizations across the country are in support of them as well too. And that is the future of policing in this country. We're headed in that direction whether we support that idea or not.

BLITZER: Yes, I think you're right on that point as well. All right, Cedric stand -- stay with us. Tom, stay with us as well. We're going to continue this discussion, police tactics, reporting. A lot more coming up after the break.

Also, another major story we're following right now. Iran's supreme leader, he comes out swinging today. He says there are no guarantees for a nuclear deal, that he's never been optimistic about the negotiations with the United States, and he's saying a lot more. We'll talk about his comments, the impact. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: Once again, we're back with Cedric Alexander. He's president of the National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives. He's joining us from the CNN center in Atlanta. With me here in Washington, Tom Fuentes, CNN Law Enforcement Analyst, former FBI assistant director.

And I just want to make sure, Tom, you agree with Cedric, body cameras for cops on the street all over the country. Maybe years ago, you didn't support that but you do support that now.

FUENTES: That's exactly right. I support it now and I think that 99.9 percent of the time it's going to exonerate the police officer when there's a physical altercation and the questions come up.

BLITZER: And I think you agree with that. Do the cops want it or are they nervous about it, Cedric?

ALEXANDER: Well, no. I mean, most of the young officers that I talk to every day here in the Cobb County, Georgia, they look forward to it. They have a very different attitude about it. They understand the significance of technology. Many of them have grown -- many of those young officers have grown up with technology so it's something that they welcome.

[13:15:10] But the most important thing here to remember, that regardless of where you are in your career, whether you're at the beginning of your career or at the end of your career, this is going to become a very useful tool and one in which I think as well too in which the general public across this country is asking for as it relates to as much transparency and openness that we can see because here again, as you just heard Tom said, it certainly is going to support officers. And it's also maybe even support the statements of our citizens as well too that might be different from officers' as well. So it's going to serve a benefit to everyone that's involved.

BLITZER: Yes, I think well said.

All right, let's talk a little bit about the investigation, Tom. Local community in North Charleston, they've handed over the investigation to what's called SLED, the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division. So it's a statewide investigation. But there is a role, and you're a former assistant director of the FBI, for the federal government, right?

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, the civil rights investigation of the FBI is completely separate in a way as far as the charges go from the state investigation. So you have a murder investigation being conducted by South Carolina authorities. And then the civil rights investigation by the FBI is actually a separate charge and does not mean double jeopardy. And there have been previous cases, go back to Rodney King, who those officers were exonerated and acquitted in local court. The FBI investigation took them into federal court and they went to prison. And there has been other cases. The Katrina bridge shootings, as a more recent example, where the FBI investigation resulted in prison sentences to the officers that were involved in denying victims of their civil rights.

BLITZER: You want to weigh in on that, Cedric? What's your thought?

ALEXANDER: Well, you know, I mean, you know, the most important thing here, you know, Wolf, going forward, as, you know, as we begin to look at the relationships between police and community in a much broader sense, even in spite of this incident in South Carolina and other tragic incidents we've seen over the last number of months, I think what's most important here for all of us to remember is this, there are a lot of good police officers that are out there. And those that are out there who are doing things in a very different kind of way, we're going to deal with them. We're going to identify them. We're going to contend with them.

And - but I think it's very important as well, too, and we start talking about investigations, that every department, and certainly we have done this here in DeKalb, if we're involved in a shooting that is fatal or appear it may become fatal, what we have automatically are moving to, or what we're moving to, what will automatically happen is that the Georgia Bureau of Investigation will step in. And what does that create for us? It create an environment in which the community can - can certainly feel comfortable in the idea that we're going to - not going to investigate our own, which we've done a very good job at doing, but we're going to move it to an outside agency who are going to look at it in a fair and a balanced way - a fair and balanced way and a way in which the community feel good about as well too.

But it is important for my own detectives, who have for years worked shootings, they have done an incredible job, because if they had found something wrong, they would have dealt with that and presented it to the local D.A. But in light of everything that's happening in this country, we find it important now because the community is asking for this, is that we move these investigations to an outside entity.

BLITZER: I think that's a good point. All right, Cedric Alexander, thanks very much for joining us. Tom Fuentes, thanks to you as well.

We'll have much more on this story coming up from South Carolina.

But there's another major story we're following today right here on CNN. A major snag involving that nuclear deal with Iran. What Iran's supreme leader is now demanding. We have details. We'll have a live report.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:22:25] BLITZER: One week after agreeing on a framework deal, a nuclear deal, Iran seems to be backing away from the U.S. version of what was agreed to in a very public way. Here's the Iranian president, Hassan Rouhani.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRES. HASSAN ROUHANI, IRAN (through translator): We will not sign any deal unless on the very first day of its implementation all economic sanctions against Iran are lifted all at once.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: But here's what Iran agreed to supposedly last week. U.S. and EU nuclear related sanctions will be suspended after the IAEA, the International Atomic Energy Agency, has verified that Iran has taken all of its key nuclear related steps.

Then there's this from the Iranian supreme leader, the Ayatollah Ali Khamenei. First, his tweet, and I'll read it precisely what he tweeted, "all sanctions should be removed just when the deal is reached. If sanctions removal depends on another process then why we started to talk?" That's his tweet. And then he also said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AYATOLLAH ALI KHAMENEI, IRAN'S SUPREME LEADER (through translator): If you ask me if I support or oppose the nuclear agreement, I neither support it nor oppose it because nothing has happened yet. Nothing has been done yet. The whole issue lies in the details that they are meant to discuss one by one.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Last hour during a visit to Jamaica, President Obama responded with this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: As I've said from the start, this is not done until it's done. And the next two to three months of negotiations are going to be absolutely critical for making sure that we are memorializing an agreement that gives us confidence and gives the world confidence that Iran in fact is not pursuing a nuclear weapon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's go to our chief national security correspondent Jim Sciutto. He's joining us.

So let's talk a little bit about - it's one thing for Zarif, the foreign minister, to say something. It's another thing for the president, Rouhani, to say something. But when the Grand Ayatollah Khamenei says it, he's the - he's the bottom line in all of this. And if he says the talking point, that four-page document the U.S. released last week, in his words, "were mostly wrong," what does that say, Jim?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, listen, it says either several of these issues have not been finally agreed, including that sanctions issue, or both sides are spinning for a domestic audience or perhaps both are true. I mean it's very confusing.

I was reading this morning through the language. And keep in mind, there was no written agreement that came out of this interim deal. It's only a U.S. interpretation of it. Nothing that the Iranians signed to. You read that, it says on those oil embanking sanctions, they will be suspended immediately, but only after Iran has taken all the steps under the deal. So they have to go through the full process. Once that's verified, then there will be immediate relief. That's not on day one of signing, that's after it takes all the steps required.

[13:25:17] On the U.N. sanctions, a whole other category of sanctions, Iran will get some relief as each gateway is passed. In other words, as they meet each step, some of those sanctions will be lifted. So you have two different categories of sanctions and two different plans for relieving those sanctions from Iran. You know, that's a pretty big difference, though. And also, you know, when you look at that, at least from the U.S. side, it doesn't say that everything's going to go on the first day.

So if the Iranian supreme leader is demanding that everything goes on the first day this deal is signed, there isn't a deal. But it could be just domestic spin. It could also mean that they've got a lot more work to do between now and that June 30th deadline than we thought.

BLITZER: Could it also mean that the grand ayatollah totally disagrees from what Zarif thought was part of the deal or Rouhani thought was part of the deal? You've been to Iran many times.

SCIUTTO: That - I have and I've been to several rounds of these talks. That's unlikely just because Zarif and Rouhani, they're not going to do anything, sign anything, agree to anything that doesn't have the OK of the supreme leader. And the supreme leader, in that same speech he gave today said, you know, that he - and in previous speeches he says he supports the talks. He's not going to stand in the way of them. So, you know, it's an open question here.

It could also be posturing as this negotiation continues. But I'll tell you, Wolf, when you listen to the disparate statements and those disparate statements started within minutes of that agreement being announced last week, when you hear those disparate statements from two sides, it makes it very clear they've got a long way to go to getting to a final agreement. And because those differences appear to be so great, it does raise the possibility they don't reach a final agreement. That they've still got - and the president said as much there. He said, there's no deal until you have a final deal. And there's a long distance to be bridged in these final two and a half months or so.

BLITZER: Yes, but clearly what the ayatollah just said today is going to undermine the administration's stance going into those critically important Senate Foreign Relations hearings next week.

SCIUTTO: Absolutely.

BLITZER: And a potential vote in the United States Senate. It's going to only build opposition to what the administration wants. And that's a serious issue right now.

SCIUTTO: No question.

BLITZER: We're going to have a lot more on this, obviously, throughout the day.

Jim Sciutto reporting for us. Thank you.

The ayatollah - the Ayatollah Khamenei didn't stop with criticizing the nuclear negotiations. He also took direct aim at Saudi Arabia for those airstrikes it's been launching in Yemen against the Shiite backed Houthi rebels who are aligned with Iran. Up next, we'll go live to Saudi Arabia for more on how Iran is impacting that battle.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)