Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Sunday Night

Elizabeth Smart Abductor Ruled Incompetant To Stand Trial; Christian Camp Trial To Convert Gays, Lesbians

Aired July 31, 2005 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

CAROL LIN, CNN ANCHOR: CNN SUNDAY NIGHT. The crisis in Niger, millions of lives are hanging in the balance, and why the next two or three weeks might make the difference between life and death.
Discovery, come home. New problems for a mission that's under the microscope more than any other. What will it take to get the astronauts home safely?

Who's on top? Oprah Winfrey, Julia Roberts, Condi Rice. Forbes has the list of the 100 most powerful women. These stories and a lot more next on CNN SUNDAY NIGHT.

Good evening, I'm Carol Lin from the CNN Center in Atlanta. Also this hour, she was kidnapped more than a week ago. Now an eight-year old girl is back in her mother's arms after police find her in Mexico.

And the man who police say took Elizabeth Smart doesn't have to stand trial. That is on our rap sheet tonight.

A Christian camp tries to convert gay teens to a straight life. Can you make gay teens go straight? Get ready to call us with your opinion.

Up first tonight, danger in space for Discovery. Flying foam during the shuttle's lift-off, future launches are scrapped. A sudden decision to extend the crew's time in orbit. And now, the possibility that the shuttle needs a life saving repair job.

Space correspondent Miles O'Brien reports on the high hopes at NASA that this is the last glitch.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): So far, so good. But still, no final clearance for Discovery to endure the searing heat of re-entry. Engineers on the ground, pouring over reams of images, say the orbiter's thermal tiles are just fine and so are the blankets that guard the top of the spacecraft. But there is still work to do before they blast the leading edge of the wing and two spots on the nose where gap fillers between tiles are protruding.

PAUL HILL, FLIGHT DIRECTOR: We have various options that range from pulling the gap filler out, to trimming the gap filler or putting it back down into the gap.

O'BRIEN (on camera): The uneven surface is of concern because it can create a blow torch effect, as the space shuttle re-enters the atmosphere, greatly increasing temperatures at the rough spots. And in their wake, the shuttle team will now try to determine just how hot those spots will be, and whether the tiles in those locations can take the added heat.

When I spoke with shuttle commander Eileen Collins a little while ago, she didn't seem too concerned.

EILEEN COLLINS, DISCOVERY COMMANDER: I believe the gap fillers are within - are similar to what we have seen on some previous flights. So it's definitely not a big concern to me right now.

O'BRIEN: We caught up with Discovery's crew on a day between space walks. On Saturday, astronaut Steve Robinson and Suichi Naguchi spent just shy of seven hours working in the void, practicing some rudimentary techniques for repairing the shuttle heat shield in space.

It looked like the Michelin man trying to patch a hole in some dry wall.

STEVE ROBINSON, DISCOVERY MISSION SPECIALIST: We want to have this back up that we never plan to use. And yesterday's experiments actually went pretty well. It's nothing like it has been done on a space walk before.

O'BRIEN: While the big piece of foam that fell off Discovery's fuel tank during launch did not cause any damage to the orbiter, it did prompt NASA to ground the shuttle fleet. And that has changed Discovery's mission.

The crew will spend an extra day docked at the space station, so the station crew can scavenge for supplies, because no one knows when or if the shuttle will return to the space station.

But no decisions on that front yet.

MICHAEL GRIFFIN, NASA ADMINISTRATOR: We would feel awfully silly if we made some premature decision to shut down the shuttle, and then it turned out that the fix wasn't all that difficult, and we could get on with flying the shuttle safely.

O'BRIEN: For now, the safety of this flight is uppermost on NASA's mind. Shuttle managers are now deciding whether they should send the space walkers on a mission to the bulging gap fillers, to either trim them back or simply yank them out.

Miles O'Brien, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LIN: So NASA says it's not concerned about this latest hiccough, but nobody argues that America's triumphant return to space has been a bumpy one. Are we right to worry about the courage and future shuttle missions?

Randy Avera is the author of "The Truth about Challenger." He's also a former senior aerospace engineer at NASA. Randy Avera joins me right now on set.

Randy, give me a best case, worst case scenario right now?

RANDY AVERA, AUTHOR, FMR. NASA ENGINEER: Well, the best case is that the orbiter's insulation on the outside is in mint condition to support a high speed re-entry through the atmosphere, all the way down to landing and rollout on the runway at Kennedy Space Center.

The worst case is that they have to actually do the extra vehicular activity or space walk to go outside and around on the belly of the orbiter, to possibly push the gap filler back between the tiles, or to trim it off.

LIN: Why is that a worst case scenario?

AVERA: Well, the worse case scenario, any time you are performing activities outside of the spacecraft, it's much more of a hazard level to the astronauts and to the hardware. You can imagine being in an extra vehicular activity pressure suit and working around.

What you don't want to do is to create new damage, trying to repair something that, like the gap filler, for example. So the exposure to new hazards is as much as a factor as repairing the problem that you're trying to solve.

LIN: And even causing more damage. I mean, these are astronauts who have - they're making history. They've never done this before.

AVERA: The entire mission is historic. And that's an important thing. With all the facts that we've been discussing for many days, the important thing is space shuttle Discovery has returned America to flight. It's in space. It's on its mission. And it's historic.

LIN: And we don't want to discount the credit of this mission that they are accomplishing things up there. But what if they can't fix the gap fillers? Then what?

AVERA: Well, they can be fixed if they need to be fixed. But what NASA's doing is analyzing, as we speak, and into tomorrow, does it have to be repaired?

And what they're looking at, if a gap filler on the belly of the orbiter is protruding, the question is the heat - the added heat that it creates by sticking out into the viscous boundary layer real close to the skin of the - or to the tiles of the orbiter, really create a hot spot that would cause the tiles to do what's called slumping. Sort of like a grape when it turns into a raisin, the slumping effect. Or to actually burn through and get into the aluminum skin of the orbiter.

LIN: All right, Randy, right now we want to take a picture of NASA Select. We've been taking in the pictures and the feed all day of what is going on.

Give me an idea of what you're seeing right here? AVERA: Okay, these are the high temperature reusable tiles. They're called HRSI tiles. The black tiles. And what that looks like is a gouge or possibly a gap filler that's filled up.

If you see that white part, it makes you think it's a gouge in the tile.

LIN: Right.

AVERA: But it's actually the Aim's gap filler protruding up from the gap between the tiles. And the reason it's called an Aims gap filler, NASA Center in California, Ames near San Francisco, they developed these gap fillers back in the early '70s, late '60s. And it's called an Ames gap filler.

And what it does, it goes down in between the tiles. If you have two adjacent tiles, the gap filler goes between the two tiles...

LIN: Right, like grout. That's how I kind of imagine. And I know it's thicker and...

AVERA: More like a shim. It's a physical item that's placed in there. But the reason that the tile has to have the gap, the vehicle flexes during flight...

LIN: Right.

AVERA: ...and if you don't have that gap, the tiles will bang into each other and crack.

LIN: All right.

AVERA: But you also need to seal the aero thermal effect, so the heat doesn't get to the skin.

LIN: All right, big decisions that they're going to have to make sometime in the next 24 hours.

AVERA: It will be very critical.

LIN: Very critical. Thank you very much.

AVERA: You're welcome.

LIN: In the meantime, CNN is paying close attention to every move the Discovery mission is making. So we are going to bring you updates and live pictures around the clock as they happen.

All right, in the meantime, British police raided homes outside London today and took into custody seven more people, all believed connected to the July 21st failed attempt to bomb the subway and a bus there.

The six men and a woman were arrested without incident in Brighton, a coastal city southeast of London. The new arrests raise the number of suspects detained to 21 now. 18 in Britain, 3 in Italy. One of them, we're told, confessed to Italian police that he indeed intended to bomb the London subway, but only to raise attention, not hurt anyone.

That suspect, Hussein Osman remains in Rome tonight, where he's scheduled to appear in court tomorrow. It's up to a judge to decide whether to approve his extradition to Britain.

A close source to the investigation says Osman has been cooperating with his interrogators, telling them how and where he received the bombs and instructions on where to place them.

Around the world this hour, it's the last thing they need in Western India - more rain, flooding, and mudslides killed more than 1,000 people since last week, when more than three feet of rain fell in a day. A massive clean-up is underway in Mumbai, but it is raining again.

Iranian officials, defiant today, threatening to resume uranium conversion if the European Union fails to offer up a package of economic and political incentives by tomorrow. The EU wants more negotiations.

And Iraq's national security adviser says to expect Saddam Hussein's war crimes trial to begin before mid October. He told CNN the trial will be broadcast throughout the Arab world and will not be a stage for the former Iraqi leader's rhetoric.

Now in this country, a harrowing journey has come to an end for an eight-year old who vanished from her home near Reno, Nevada. She was abducted and taken to Mexico by a convicted sex offender who wooed her mother.

CNN's Jen Rogers reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEN ROGERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It was a reunion neither mother nor daughter will ever likely forget. After eight agonizing days, a mother had her little girl back in her arms again.

CARMEN BAUER, MOTHER: I want to thank everybody, the police in Mexico, all the authorities, everybody that helped me finding my daughter.

ROGERS: Police say Fernando Aguerro, the mother's live-in boyfriend, disappeared with the eight-year old on July 22nd, allegedly taking her birth certificate, Social Security card, photos and even her dog.

It was Mexican authorities who found the two in a low income shelter in Ensenada after locals recognized them from photographs on flyers that had been distributed.

Police who questioned Aguerro say he admitted to sexually abusing the young girl, while he was living with her family near Reno. ANTONIO MARTINEZ, ATTY. GEN. NORTHERN BAJA, MEXICO: When we interviewed him with the district attorney's office, he said that four months previous to today, he had sexually assaulted or molested the little girl, and that he decided to bring her to Mexico.

ROGERS: Despite several efforts, CNN was unable to confirm whether Aguerro has an attorney. The victim's mother said she had no idea Aguerro was a convicted sex offender or that he posed a risk to her daughter.

BAUER: He loved her. They were very close. They became like father and daughter. They got along really well.

CAPT. JEFF PAGE, LYON CTY., NEVADA SHERIFF'S DEPT.: This man was a predator. He's a manipulator. He spent a great deal of time working his way into this family. He had planned this abduction for quite some time.

ROGERS: If convicted, authorities say Aguerro could face up to 38 years in a Mexican prison.

(on camera): U.S. and Mexican officials will likely meet next month to discuss extradition issues as well.

Jen Rogers for CNN, Los Angeles.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LIN: Christian camps converting homosexual teens who try to go straight. That is the talk tonight. The controversial theory that being gay is a choice.

Also, the latest from Niger. The United Nations plans to double its relief in the region, plagued by starvation. We are going to show you how you can help.

The list includes Oprah Winfrey and Condoleezza Rice. But who really is the most powerful woman in the world? You are going to see the Forbes 100 list. You are watching CNN SUNDAY NIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LIN: Homosexuality, is it something you're born into or something you choose? That question sparked some big fires on both sides of the issue. And in Tennessee, some homosexual teens are spending time at a conversion camp, where they're being taught they can escape their gay temptations with the help of God.

Deborah Feyerick has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Memphis, Tennessee, home to the blues, Elvis, some 2,000 churches, and one program that claims to help gay and lesbian teenagers give up homosexuality. How many teens are here at any given time?

REV. JOHN SMID, LOVE IN ACTION: We've had anywhere from two to six at any given time in the youth program. One of the reasons, of course, is you've experienced...

FEYERICK: It's called Refuge and it's run by Reverend John Smid as part of a larger program, Love in Action.

So when people say you cure gays, what is your answer?

SMID: I don't cause it, I don't cure it, I don't create it. There's no way I can cure gays. There isn't a cure for homosexuality.

What we find is there is an opportunity to learn how to live responsibly, even with homosexual attractions or desires.

FEYERICK: But that's not the way 18-year old Ben Marshall first saw it. Last summer, his parents told him he was going, whether he liked it or not.

BEN MARSHALL, LOVE IN ACTION GRADUATE: I was just so angry that my parents weren't accepting who I thought I was and that they were sending me to get fixed. I told all my friends they were sending me to straight camp.

FEYERICK: Religion has always been a big part of Ben Marshall's life. He was raised Southern Baptist. His parents were strict. Dating wasn't allowed. Then last year, Ben told friends he was gay.

B. MARSHALL: It was surprising to me how much - people just flocked to me after I came out and how all these people that I considered untouchable as far as popularity was concerned, wanted to hang out with me now.

FEYERICK: Three months later, the boy who'd never dated anyone, was in his first serious relationship with a high school senior. It was short, it was painful, and Ben wondered whether it was right.

B. MARSHALL: That became my identity was Ben, the homosexual. I liked the attention that I got from that.

FEYERICK: His parents, Sharon and Larry, didn't like it at all.

LARRY MARSHALL, FATHER: I'd had enough. And you know, as a parent, and I felt that with my beliefs and with my rights, that this is the way it's going to be.

FEYERICK: Sharon packed up the family camper, leaving Pensacola, Florida, driving Ben eight hours to Tennessee.

SHARON MARSHALL, MOTHER: And I said, okay, Lord, we're going to go to Memphis.

FEYERICK: In Memphis, they met program director Reverend Smid. Married 16 years, he renounced his own homosexuality two decades ago after attending a similar program.

At Refuge, there's no touching, no flashy clothes. Teens and young adults study scripture, attend group therapy, pray, and keep journals, what they call moral inventories.

SMID: When they express things that have gone on internally, and they find other people who've shared those thoughts or feelings, it actually releases the shame.

FEYERICK: Yet others say the opposite is true.

DR. JACK DRESCHER, AMERICAN PSYCHIATRIC ASSN.: It increases their feeling of shame. It increases their feeling of failure. It makes them feel worse about themselves when they're done.

FEYERICK: Dr. Jack Drescher has written a book on homosexuality and psycho analysis. He says programs like Love in Action are misguided.

DRESCHER: It offers the possibility that somehow homosexuality is a result of not being religious enough, not having enough faith. And if you just increase your faith, then that should help the homosexuality go away, which would be nice I suppose if that were true.

FEYERICK: Not being religious enough certainly wasn't true for evangelical Christian Brandon Tidwell. In the summer of 2002, he spent three months at Love in Action's adult program.

BRANDON TIDWELL, LOVE IN ACTION GRADUATE: I was at a place of such desperation, believing that the only alternative was to not be gay. Not being able to see things from a different perspective that I see it from now.

And so, it was, in my opinion, the last and only attempt to get fixed.

FEYERICK: But something else happened instead.

TIDWELL: I realized quite quickly that I could be a person of faith and embrace who God had made me to be.

FEYERICK: Tidwell, a trained social worker, is critical of Love in Action's counselors. Only one is licensed. Last month, state agencies began investigating after a teenager entering the program described his feelings of depression on a web blog. Reverend Smid is confident the state will find nothing wrong.

But the blog struck a chord with Ben Marshall.

B. MARSHALL: There's one comment that he made about he did come out fixed on the other side, he was going to be so depressed and emotionally unstable. That was what I kept telling my parents.

FEYERICK: Yet not only did Ben survive the initial two week program, he stayed eight months. B. MARSHALL: There is that lust that's still there. It's subsiding. I don't know that it'll ever go away all together, but it's not nearly as strong as it used to be. I don't go to the same places in my head that I used to.

FEYERICK: Asked if he's gay...

B. MARSHALL: I have trouble with the word 'gay' period, because it has a label. And I don't necessarily think anyone is clearly heterosexual or homosexual.

FEYERICK: Before Love in Action, Ben planned to go to New York to study journalism. Now he's part of a church group and plans to study psychology in Memphis, with an eye towards theology and the seminary.

As for a wife and children...

B. MARSHALL: ...possible. I think I'm attracted to women enough right now that it can eventually develop into a relationship. I know I'm capable of that. If I don't get that, that's fine. Celibacy is an option for me right now.

FEYERICK: Texas born Brandon Tidwell is also staying in Memphis. He goes to church regularly with his new boyfriend and trains young people to become community leaders.

TIDWELL: I've never felt more true to myself, more true to my community, more true to my family and to my relationship with God than I am now.

FEYERICK: Deborah Feyerick, CNN, Memphis, Tennessee.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LIN: That leads us to our last call question. Can you make a gay teen live a straight life? Give us a call at 1-800-807-2620. And the debate is coming up. Is homosexuality a choice? Or are gays born that way? Up next, I'll be talking about the controversial issue with both sides.

And later in rap sheet, he's accused of kidnapping and sexually abusing Elizabeth Smart. But a judge ruled Brian David Mitchell is not competent to stand trial. But is this the end of the story? Well, that's on the rap sheet.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LIN: All right, so the talk tonight, converting gays to straight. Some people think it is possible to cure homosexuality to change a person from gay to straight through therapy or prayer or abstinence.

But others say it is impossible to change a person's sexual orientation. Not only that, such attempts are destructive and dangerous. That is the view shared by Joe Solmonese, president of the Human Rights Campaign. He's in San Francisco. Warren Throckmorton is an associate professor of psychology at Grove City College in Pennsylvania. He wrote and produced the film, "I Do Exist" about people who claim to be ex-gays. He joins me from Pittsburgh.

Good to see both of you. Mr. Solmonese, let me begin with you. Do you think that gay teens can live a straight life?

JOE SOLMONESE, PRES., HUMAN RIGHTS CAMPAIGN: No, Carol, I don't. And more to the point, neither does the American Medical Association, the American Psychiatric Association, or the National Association of Social Workers.

LIN: Dr. Thorckmorton, what do you say?

WARRAN THROCKMORTON, GROVE CITY COLLEGE: Well, it's important to understand what those organizations really said. What they're opposed to is coercion. And they're opposed to views of homosexuality that make it a pathology.

As far as the evaluation of programs that are therapy or ministry programs, the APA hasn't done a thorough evaluation of those programs to support the statement that your other guest just made.

LIN: Dr. Throckmorton, let me ask you...

SOLMONESE: I think...

LIN: Hold on a second, because I want to make a point, a clarification or at least a clarity about something that Dr. Throckmorton I think believes.

You have said that same sex attraction is not the same thing as homosexuality, that these teenagers who may feel an attraction for the same sex, well it doesn't mean they're gay. What do you mean by that?

THROCKMORTON: Well, it's true. Surveys of young people find that many young people in middle school, in high school, are confused about their sexuality. They feel same sex attractions, but many of those people go on to identify straight.

Surveys of adults find very low percentage, somewhere between one and three percent, of those who identify as homosexual, gay or lesbian or bisexual. And in - however, in middle school and younger, many students feel same sex attractions - you later then go into identify as straight.

LIN: All right, Mr. Solmonese?

SOLMONESE: Well, you know, Dr. Throckmorton makes a good point, which is that young people may initially identify as being gay or lesbian and then determine that they're straight or vice versa. I think though the most important point is that as they go through that process, they go through that process with the full support and unconditional love of their parents. And that is where that process really needs to play itself out. And not at one of these camps, which are largely unregulated.

LIN: Mr. Solmonese, do you think that people are born gay? And is there any scientific evidence that you have of that?

SOLMONESE: Well, I do think that people are born gay. And I think I can only really speak from experience as a gay person. And I believe that it is innate. And it is the way we are. And it is - and that it is something that young people should, you know, develop again with the unconditional love and support of their parents.

LIN: Mr. Solmonese, Dr. Throckmorton, I'd like you to listen to something that a man named Gerald Wellman told our Paula Zahn last week. He went to a similar program, but for adults. And this is what he had to say about the experience.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAULA ZAHN, CNN ANCHOR: You think about men. So how can you tell us tonight that's a successful conversion?

GERALD WELLMAN, CONVERSION PGM. PARTICIPANT: Well, it's not about the temptation. It's about behavior. It's entirely about behavior. It's about adjusting behavior - for me, it was adjusting my behavior to fit my faith.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LIN: Mr. Solmonese, what do you think happens psychologically to someone who once professed to be homosexual, to then conduct a life - an intentional lifestyle, a heterosexual lifestyle?

SOLMONESE: Well, the - as the gentleman said, you know, it's about behavior. I mean, I don't agree. I think that, you know, as I said before, it is something that is innate. It is something that we are born as.

And so, you know, if you are gay or lesbian, that is what you are. And I think the most important thing to do is to live your life as happily and prosperously as you can. And be true to yourself.

LIN: Dr. Throckmorton, do you think that people who were homosexual and then profess to be ex gays, do you think that they can actually experience real intimacy with another person in a relationship?

THROCKMORTON: Well, yes, I do. I don't know that everybody experiences the same degree of type of change that others do. This is along a continuum of change that occurs here. But some people do. You mentioned the "I Do Exist" video; people in that video describe that kind of change...

LIN: Really?

THROCKMORTON: It's not everybody... LIN: They have kids? They get married, they have kids?

THROCKMORTON: Yes, that's right.

LIN: Really? And do any of them backslide? Do they enter into homosexual relationships at any point? Have they made that mistake?

THROCKMORTON: It depends on how they view it, I suppose, but yes, there are people who view themselves as ex-gay, and then become ex-ex-gay. I certainly wouldn't deny that.

LIN: I mean, so doesn't that tell you that they are going against nature, not nurture?

THROCKMORTON: Well, no, not necessarily, because there are other people who don't do that. I do believe the people who say that they tried to become ex-gay, and then they, for whatever reason, they changed their plan or their perspective or their viewpoint. But I don't want to ignore the stories and lives of people who had made pretty incredible changes, and they're often ignored and told that they don't exist.

LIN: Mr. Solmonese, a quick last word.

SOLMONESE: Well, the fact of the matter is, there has really been no extensive research done on the success or failure of these programs, and for the most part, as I said before, you know, you are who you are, and although there can be all sorts of behavioral modification efforts, but the fact of the matter is that there are millions of openly happy gay and lesbian people living all across this country, and that to me is what is most important.

LIN: My thanks to both of you. Let's hear from our viewers. Don't forget our "Last Call" question. Do you think, can you make a gay teen live a straight life? Let us know what you think. We're going to air some of your remarks at the end of the program. 1-800- 807-2620.

All right, now the headlines tonight and tomorrow. NASA officials have yet to decide how to deal with the problem on the Shuttle Discovery. A couple of so-called gap fillers are sticking out of the orbiter's belly. Left unattended, they could complicate reentry. Among the options, an unplanned and risky space walk.

Seven more people, one of them a woman, arrested today in Britain. They are believed connected to the failed terror attack in London July 21st. Now, we're told one other suspect in custody in Rome has been cooperating with investigators.

President Bush makes good on the Boy Scout rain check. The president addressed the 40,000-odd Scouts and leaders today south of Washington, site of the Boy Scouts national jamboree. An earlier planned presidential visit was rained out. He praised the young men for, his words, "laying the foundation of peace for decades to come."

And trouble for the pioneers of the low-carb diet craze. Atkins Nutritionals has filed for bankruptcy protection. The company's namesake, Diet Plan, enticed millions to steer clear of breads and pasta. The so-called Atkins diet is far less popular and far less profitable these days. A bankruptcy hearing is set for tomorrow.

Still ahead on CNN SUNDAY NIGHT, help is on the way for thousands in need of food in Niger. The latest on the crisis facing the nation and the numbers you can call to help.

Also, with Congress taking a summer break, President Bush threatens to bypass Congress and force his controversial choice for U.N. ambassador. You're watching CNN SUNDAY NIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LIN: Now, a story you'll only see on CNN. Thousand, perhaps millions of lives hang in the balance in the West African nation of Niger. A crippling drought has left many on the verge of starvation. The crisis has caught the world's attention, and donations have began flooding in.

As we hear from CNN's Jeff Koinange, all that's left for many in Niger is hope.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEFF KOINANGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Praying for a miracle in a land where devastating famine has killed thousands and threatens millions more. Christians make up a small percentage of Niger's nearly 12 million people, but that's not stopping them from seeking answers to the country's crisis from a higher authority.

Father Jose Collado knows a thing or two about survival. He's lived and worked in Niger for nearly four decades, and says he sees no end in sight to the suffering.

"This year has been very difficult," he says. "Many have died and many more are dying nearly every day, especially in the countryside."

Islam is the dominant religion here, and signs of the faithful performing their daily rituals are everywhere. Here, the faithful too admit these are tough times in any language or religion.

"This famine has made us completely useless as a people," he says. "Our dignity, our pride, everything is destroyed."

Despite the bruised egos, some here say they aren't too proud to ask for a helping hand.

"The situation is catastrophic," says policeman Musa Jibu. "We urge the international community to help the people of Niger out of their misery. Please help us."

A short drive outside the main towns, and it's evident the famine is taking its toll. Man and animal find themselves competing for precious resources. Sometimes, the razor-thin herds of cattle get priority.

Other times, humans find themselves having to dig a little deeper. Dry riverbeds like this can only mean more doom and gloom for the people of Niger. And in village after village, it's the same story. Hunger has a way of making people turn to prayer in search of an elusive miracle.

"Our children are dying. Our elderly are dying. Look at us. We're all dying. We need help," he pleads.

As an entire nation prays for more rain, a group of nomadic women performs a rain dance, but even they know that a country cannot survive on hope alone.

Jeff Koinange, CNN, Maradi, in southern Niger.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LIN: CNN's Anderson Cooper is in Niger. Today, he visited some of the hardest hit and most desperate areas. He's gathering information for a special report, "Niger Famine," to be broadcast Monday night, at 7:00 Eastern.

Well, time may be running out for many of the children of Niger. Several relief agencies are rushing to provide help. And you can log onto their Web sites or call the numbers you see on the screen and make a donation. We are going to put up their numbers again later in this broadcast. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LIN: Time now for "The Rap Sheet," and word that man accused of kidnapping Elizabeth Smart has been declared mentally incompetent to stand trial, well, at least for now. And a Connecticut newlywed disappears during a Mediterranean honeymoon cruise. A tragic accident, or murder most foul? More importantly, how do you find out? You put these questions to our "Rap Sheet" panelists.

Stacey Honowitz is a Broward County prosecutor, and criminal defense attorney Jayne Weintraub is with us tonight.

JAYNE WEINTRAUB, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Hi, Carol.

LIN: Welcome, guys.

STACEY HONOWITZ, BROWARD COUNTY PROSECUTOR: Hi, Carol.

LIN: All right, let's start with Brian David Mitchell. He's not going to stand trial at the moment because he's ruled insane. Jayne, do you give credit to his defense attorney, or did he just get lucky this time?

WEINTRAUB: Well, contrary to public opinion, defense lawyers don't just make these things happen. And I think what gets confused in the public eye also, Carol, is incompetence is not insanity. This is not a defense, this is not an excuse. This has nothing to do with standing trial for the charges, or getting off in some way.

This means that he's not even competent, he's not able to assist counsel or understand the charges enough to get to the next step. He will remain locked up, not free.

LIN: Well, there's going to be a review in three moths, Stacey.

HONOWITZ: Yeah, that's what happens, Carol. There is a review in three months. He comes before the court again. There is evaluations by the doctors that will see him to determine whether or not he's incompetent.

But what happens, Carol, is if you're incompetent for a certain amount of time, just like in Florida for five years, then the state can drop charges against you. So I'm sure that's what they're banking on. But...

LIN: You think that's a possibility?

HONOWITZ: If he remains incompetent for a certain amount of time, and they drop charges, of course that's a possibility.

LIN: He took this girl and sexually assaulted her and made her his wife, quote/unquote, for nine months.

WEINTRAUB: The Smarts won't (ph) let that happen.

HONOWITZ: Absolutely, but if he -- if he comes into court, and each time he's incompetent, he sings and he dances and he does whatever, and the doctors say he can't assist, then the state can drop charges. But remember one thing: Once his competency is restored, the state then can refile the charges. So we're hoping that that's not going to happen.

LIN: Well, how old is Elizabeth Smart going to be then? Jayne?

WEINTRAUB: She's going to be older. She's never going to forget these memories. I am sure they have all been taken down in sworn statements by her, her sister, her parents. This evidence is going to be preserved. I'm sure it is.

LIN: So, how do they determine his fitness then overtime, Jayne?

WEINTRAUB: Psychiatrists will be called by both sides for the court to make a final analysis. Here, the judge gave a 60-page order after hearing from psychiatrists, from the defense, as well as from the prosecutors.

LIN: All right. Let's talk about this missing husband. I mean, how does a guy disappear on his honeymoon on a cruise? I mean, his wife wakes up and goes and works out, doesn't even see the blood in the state room. Does this sound fishy to you, Stacey? Do you think this was murder, and do you think she might be responsible?

HONOWITZ: Boy, I hate to say that it sounds like murder, but it -- you know, you hear about it, you hear what's going on, you hear the fact that there was blood in the state room, and she got up, he wasn't there, and she went to the gym and didn't report it, it certainly does sound fishy. But we have to wait, Carol. This investigation has to start. They have to interview people, see what was going on, and the evidence so far showing that there was heavy drinking the night before, maybe some gambling going on, so once the interviews come out, we're going to find out what really happened.

LIN: All right, heavy drinking on a cruise ship, not a crime, pretty common. Jayne, the Turkish prosecutor says that the wife is not a suspect right now. So where does the prosecutor go from here?

WEINTRAUB: Well, you know, there's been a lot of talk about the wife not cooperating with the police and not being forthcoming, and I think that before Scott Peterson's trial, we all might have had a few eyebrows up. But after Scott Peterson's trial, I think we can all understand why she would keep her mouth not closed, not want to talk to anybody or do anything.

HONOWITZ: Oh, Jayne, what are you, crazy?

WEINTRAUB: I really think that, Stacey.

HONOWITZ: Oh, my God! I don't know how you can say that.

WEINTRAUB: Stacey...

HONOWITZ: She was on their honeymoon...

WEINTRAUB: They were high school sweethearts!

HONOWITZ: I don't care what -- I don't care if they met...

WEINTRAUB: She didn't kill him.

HONOWITZ: .. when they were 4 years old. They were on their honeymoon. The guy's missing, and there's blood. And she doesn't want to cooperate?

WEINTRAUB: There was blood on the outside railing. You know, after so many years of marriage, I might like get up and run out the door to go to the gym and come back, but I think on my honeymoon, I wouldn't have done that. However, I would not have seen blood on the outside railing.

HONOWITZ: You cooperate (INAUDIBLE).

LIN: There was blood on the inside the state room, and she was not the one who claimed that her husband was missing. I mean, it was (INAUDIBLE).

WEINTRAUB: The cleaning crew actually reported it.

LIN: Right.

WEINTRAUB: The cleaning crew actually reported it, Carol. But she might not have seen it. She might have just woken up, you know, was very tired, and just stumbled out the door...

HONOWITZ: Jayne, you are way too nice. You are too nice.

LIN: Me bad. Me bad, I ignored the bell. All right, Stacey, Jayne, always great to have you. Thanks so much.

WEINTRAUB: Thank you, Carol.

HONOWITZ: Thank you, Carol.

LIN: Well, in Washington, John Bolton has sparked a lot of controversy, but are the rumors true that the president will shove his U.N. nominee straight past Congress and into the job? The latest from the White House.

And this list is out. One of these leading ladies is the world's most powerful woman. At least according to "Forbes" magazine. Coming up, we're going to tell you who is on top.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LIN: All right, lawmakers on Capitol Hill are taking a little summer vacation, heading home for their traditional August recess, and speculating -- well, at least speculation is growing that President Bush will use the congressional absence as a way to get his controversial nominee appointed as U.N. ambassador. Elaine Quijano reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. President, when will you appoint John Bolton to the U.N.?

ELAINE QUIJANO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Bush isn't talking publicly, but two senior administration officials say as early as this week, he could bypass the Senate and use a recess appointment to make John Bolton ambassador to the United Nations. The White House, which had been seeking an up-or-down vote in the Senate, has now signaled time is running out.

SCOTT MCCLELLAN, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The United Nations will be having their General Assembly meeting in September, and it's important that we get our permanent representative in place.

QUIJANO: Democrats initially stalled Bolton's nomination over access to documents from his time at the State Department. Last week, Democrats seized on another issue. The State Department acknowledged Bolton incorrectly filled out a questionnaire for the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, failing to tell members he had been interviewed by the department's inspector general as part of an investigation into alleged attempts by Iraq to get uranium from Niger.

A department spokesman says when Bolton completed the form, he didn't recall the interview.

That prompted 35 Democratic senators and one independent to send this letter to President Bush Friday, urging him not to appoint Bolton.

Longtime Bolton critic Christopher Dodd called Bolton quote, "damaged goods."

SEN. CHRISTOPHER DODD (D), CONNECTICUT: That's not what you want to send up, a person who doesn't have the confidence of the Congress.

SEN. JOSEPH LIEBERMAN (D), CONNECTICUT: There will be a cloud over his head. On the other hand, he will be our representative at the United Nations for the next year and a half. I hope members of Congress of both parties will then unite and try to give him support.

QUIJANO: Still, Republicans maintain Bolton's blunt style is what the U.N. needs.

SEN. JON KYL (R), ARIZONA: He's a tough guy, but I think they appreciate the fact that the president felt at this time in the U.N.'s history, when it could use a little tough love, that John Bolton is the kind of guy to do the job that the president wants done there.

QUIJANO (on camera): If President Bush moves ahead with a recess appointment, John Bolton would hold his post as ambassador to the U.N. until January of 2007, when the current Congress' term ends.

Elaine Quijano, CNN, the White House.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LIN: This just in to the CNN Center. The vice president of Sudan is dead. He is the former rebel leader John Garang. He was flying in a helicopter after traveling to meet with the Ugandan president. There was bad weather in the area, and initially, there was some confusion as to whether his helicopter had crashed or not. The government then issued a statement that, no, he was fine, but that turns out not to be the case, according to the Reuters wire service. John Garang was sworn in as vice president just three weeks ago. It was part of the long-term peace deal in Sudan.

We'll have much more on this story as it develops.

In the meantime, she has brains, beauty, money and power. But does Oprah Winfrey have "Forbes" magazine's top spot as the world's most powerful woman? Up next on CNN SUNDAY NIGHT, find out who makes the list and why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LIN: Finally, she wasn't born rich and privileged, but someone who's comfortable in the halls of power tops "Forbes" magazine's list of the world's most powerful, at least most 100 -- 100 most powerful women. Hard work and dedication are the hallmarks of Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice, number one on this year's list. The most powerful woman in the world.

Oprah Winfrey is the magazine's most powerful celebrity, at number nine. New York Senator Hillary Clinton comes in 26th. And "Harry Potter" author J.K. Rowling ranks 40th.

So how do you get on such a powerful list, you might ask?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHANA SCHOENBERGER, STAFF WRITER, FORBES: There were three criteria that we looked at. One was global media exposure. We basically counted the number of times that she was mentioned anywhere in the world. That is a measure of buzz, a measure of what people are saying about her and how much they're saying about her.

We looked at the amount of money she had influence over. So for instance, Meg Whitman, the CEO of eBay, we gave her the revenues of eBay. We gave every CEO the revenues of her company. And national politicians would get some fraction of their national GDP, depending on what kind of a national politician they were. Foundation presidents would get some fraction of their assets, or they might get their foundation's budget.

And in addition to those two things, we also looked at her resume. We looked at what she's doing now, what her job title is, and what she's done in the past.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LIN: Well, it's the second year in a row that Condoleezza Rice has ranked first on the list.

Up next, a check of the headlines and then, "CNN PRESENTS: Is Anybody Out There?"

But right now, we leave you with your responses to our "Last Call" question. Can you make a gay teen live a straight life? Here's what you had to say. Have a great night.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CALLER: No, you cannot. You can't change someone from who they are.

CALLER: I believe that you can make a gay teen live a straight life, but the question is, is he really being true to himself, or is she being true to herself?

CALLER: No, you cannot. They are born that way. God intended it. Leave them alone.

CALLER: In my opinion, I don't think that you can make a gay teen live a straight life. I think that once they get involved with that type of lifestyle, I think that they're (INAUDIBLE), that is who they are.

CALLER: A licensed psychologist and a gay man, and I know from personal and professional experience that if someone is truly gay, there is no way, without a lot of denial and lies that you can say that they're straight. CALLER: I have never experienced or heard of a gay person changing his ways and becoming straight. It's almost as difficult as getting a straight person to become gay.

CALLER: No, you cannot convert anyone, no matter what age they are. And you should not even be trying to convert a gay teen to live a straight life.

CALLER: I believe that you cannot make a gay teen live a straight life. I'm 24, and I'm gay. And I feel that if any person, gay or straight, you live your life who you are and who you are born to be, and in the same retrospect of asking a straight person, they say it's a choice to be a gay -- well, is it a choice to be straight or are you born that way?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com