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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Tikrit Offensive; Britain Awaits President Bush; Muhammad Found Guilty
Aired November 17, 2003 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, HOST (voice-over): Sniper John Allen Muhammad guilty on all counts. How will the verdict affect the trial of his alleged accomplice?
The president off to Britain. What kind of welcome is waiting?
Rush Limbaugh back from rehab and behind the mike. Are criminal charges possible? Tammy Faye Messner on Rush , rehab and redemption.
A deadly anniversary. A former Jonestown cult member speaks out.
And will a same-sex kiss cost a high school girl her honor?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good Monday to you. Thanks for joining us on 360. We're going to take you tonight to California, as Governor Schwarzenegger celebrates his inauguration. That story ahead.
And more on Rush's return to ready. How the ditto heads respond on his first day back on the air since rehab.
First, however, we go to Iraq. Today, the U.S. military is in the midst of what it calls a massive counter-offensive in the place where support for Saddam Hussein thrives, his hometown, Tikrit. The crackdown comes as two more soldiers were killed today in separate attacks outside Baghdad.
More now from senior international correspondent Walter Rodgers.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WALTER RODGERS, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Punishing Iraqi insurgents for their increasingly deadly attacks on U.S. soldiers here, two more killed Monday, the 4th Infantry Divisions' big guns boom away around Tikrit. The U.S. military believes Tikrit to be a stronghold of Saddam Hussein loyalists and the anti-American resistance.
These 155-millimeter shells are seeking out the hideouts of Iraqi paramilitary groups. Sometimes they just shoot at patches of ground on which the Iraqis previously fired mortars at U.S. forces.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We fired two so far; both hit. We should be firing about nine more through the course of the night.
RODGERS: Only a reduction in the number of attacks on U.S. forces in the weeks ahead will determine the success of this offensive. But its minimum goal is to keep the insurgents off balance.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think we have a pretty good handle on the enemy in this area. We're noticing a definite trend that it's getting weaker.
RODGERS: Still, the American offensive in and around Tikrit infuriated Iraqi civilians, especially after the U.S. Army destroyed four houses said to be the homes of insurgents who earlier shot down a U.S. helicopter. This woman shouted, "They blamed my son. My son is innocent. I swear to god." Many young men in this crowd are now vowing to join the insurgents to fight the Americans.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
RODGERS: Like it or not, U.S. forces now appear to be slipping into a pattern of classic guerrilla warfare here in Iraq, and it's an open question as to whether major military operations like the one that's under way in Tikrit can make a dent in the insurgency -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Walter Rodgers, thanks very much.
There was word today from the Pentagon that the Chinook helicopter shot down November 2 was not equipped with the latest anti- missile system. Sixteen troops were killed in that attack. Now, officials said about half of the Chinook's deployed in Iraq do have the improved system, but that particular chopper was not among them. In a memo a few days after the attack, the acting Army secretary called for all helicopters in Iraq, as well as Afghanistan, to be outfitted with the latest equipment.
President Bush leaves for Britain tomorrow. No doubt the official welcome will be warm. But the unofficial reception may leave something to be desired. Anti-war demonstrators are preparing massive protests. Senior White House correspondent John King has a preview.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Across the Atlantic to celebrate a unique friendship, but also to once again confront the perception he is too eager to go to war, too dismissive of what Europe thinks and more.
PHIL GORDON, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: His style, his swagger, his way of speaking, frankly alienates a lot of European public opinion.
KING: The Buckingham Palace welcome for a formal state visit is meant to send a signal. CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: The depth of the special relationship between our too countries cannot be overstated. The United States has no greater friend.
KING: But protesters promise to turn out by the tends of thousands during the three-day visit. A "Daily Mirror" poll found only 27 percent of Britons believe the partnership is good for their country. And Mr. Bush is often the subject of ridicule in British and other European media.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's time for your 3:00 briefing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What time is it?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's mousy time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have to start using the numbers now, sir.
KING: Terrorism and Iraq will be the president's overwhelming focus: strategy sessions with Prime Minister Blair, meeting relatives of British victims killed in September 11 attacks, and thanking British troops who fought in Afghanistan and Iraq.
Image building is another priority: a forum with Mr. Blair on efforts to fight HIV AIDS, a visit to Blair's home district in northern England, and a major speech on the Transatlantic Alliance.
(on camera): The president has a bust of Winston Churchill in the Oval Office. It says it reminds him, "sometimes you're up, sometimes you're down, but you've got to do what you think is right." And he shrugs off talks of massive protests in London, casting them, in his words, as a "fantastic display of freedom."
John King, CNN, the White House.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, a quick news note for you. It is the first full state visit of a U.S. president to the United Kingdom since Woodrow Wilson in 1918. Now, a state visit means that President Bush will actually sleep at Buckingham Palace. That is an honor that even President Reagan did not receive. Though, as you can see in this picture, he did ride a horse alongside the queen in 1982.
Now, the last time George W. Bush dined with the queen was in 1992 at his father's White House. He reportedly showed up wearing cowboy boots emblazoned with "God Save the Queen."
Well, now to "Justice Served." A jury in Virginia finds John Allen Muhammad guilty on all four counts stemming from the D.C.-area sniper shootings. Now the big question: will this man face life in prison or death?
Here's CNN's Jeanne Meserve. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): If John Muhammad felt anything, he showed nothing as the verdict was read. Guilty on all four counts, including terrorism and capital murder, each of which carries a possible death penalty. The sister of Hong Im Ballenger, who was gunned down outside a Baton Rouge beauty supply store, sobbed as the verdict was read. She made it clear afterwards what she thought should happen next.
KWANG SZUSZKA, SISTER OF HONG BALLENGER: I'm glad they found him guilty, and I'm still looking for death penalty for justice.
MESERVE: As the jury moved on to consider whether Muhammad should die or spend the rest of his life in prison, defense attorney Jonathan Shapiro acknowledged the obvious. "Your decision will put John Muhammad in a box of one sort or another. One is made of concrete and one is made of pine."
Saying it is not necessary to extinguish one more life, Shapiro characterized Muhammad as a man of worth and value who had friends, admirers and loving children. But prosecutor Richard Conway said Muhammad was one of the worst of the worst, saying "He sits right in front of you without a shred of remorse."
The first witness in the penalty phase, Isa Nichols (ph), a former friend and business associate of Muhammad's, whose niece was shot, prosecutors contend, after Nichols (ph) alienated Muhammad by giving support to his ex-wife Mildred.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Jeanne Meserve joins us now. Jeanne, we talked a lot about the witness testimony which began in the Malvo trial today. We talked a lot about what the defense is going to argue. But are prosecutors in the Malvo case expected to kind of lay out the same case against him that they did against Muhammad?
MESERVE: Well, some obvious differences are clear already. They have already worked through two of the crime scenes, the murders of Linda Franklin and Dean Meyers. They've done so with 17 witnesses, put them on and off very quickly.
And it's a much less emotional trial. They are using some of the gruesome photographs. But still, the questioning tends to be much more matter of fact. One reason for that may be that there's a lot more circumstantial evidence that implicates Mr. Malvo than there was implicating Mr. Muhammad -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Jeanne Meserve covering both trials. Thanks very much, Jeanne.
We are following several other stories tonight "Cross Country." Let's take a look.
Washington, D.C.: Hinckley hearing. The man who shot President Reagan in 1981 wants to make unsupervised visits to his parents' home. Now, a lawyer for John Hinckley Jr. told a federal judge today his client is probably the least dangerous person on the planet. This is what the lawyer said.
Federal prosecutors are fighting the request. Hinckley has been staying at a psychiatric hospital since being acquitted of the shooting by reason of insanity.
New York City: constitutional rights evaluated. A federal appeals court is questioning the Bush administration's decision to classify a terrorism suspect as an enemy combatant and detain him indefinitely. It is reviewing the case of Jose Padilla, who is accused of plotting a dirty bomb attack inside the U.S. His lawyer, who you see there, says his rights to due process are being violated.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONNA NEWMAN, PADILLA'S LAWYER: American citizens have never before, in our history, been held without charges in a military brig as an enemy combatant, whatever that label may mean. So that to label somebody, according to the government, it would appear, enables you to avoid and rip up the Constitution.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Well, moving on.
Des Moines, Iowa: Dr. Dean on the scene with the help of an unidentified man. Democratic presidential candidate Howard Dean gave medical attention to a member of his staff who collapsed on the campaign trail on Saturday. Dean's credentials of course include physician. His staffer apparently had a seizure and was later treated and released from the hospital.
That is a look at stories Cross Country" tonight.
From the big screen to the governor's mansion...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER (R), CALIFORNIA: This election was not about replacing one man. It was not about replacing one party. It was about changing the entire political climate of this state.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Arnold Schwarzenegger takes charge of the most populated state in the nation. Will his movie star charm help balance the budget out West? We'll go live to Sacramento.
Plus back from rehab and on the radio. Rush Limbaugh breaks his addiction to painkillers. But will he face charges for buying them? We'll try to get the latest on that.
And Jonestown 25 years later. Almost 1,000 people led to their graves by their leader. Find out why they drank cyanide. But first, let's take a look "Inside the Box" at the top stories on tonight's network newscasts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, former bodybuilder and movie actor, Arnold Schwarzenegger, has started the third phase of his professional life as governor of California. Schwarzenegger was inaugurated today, almost six weeks after winning the recall election that removed Gray Davis from office. California, of course, faces some tough budget problems. But as senior political correspondent Candy Crowley reports, the new governor says he is prepared to do some heavy lifting.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SR. POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is going to take some getting used to.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Congratulations, Governor Schwarzenegger.
SCHWARZENEGGER: Thank you.
CROWLEY: Under unusual circumstances, an unusual politician took office in the traditional way: a stately walk through the capitol building, wife at the side, hand on the bible, speech full of hope.
SCHWARZENEGGER: With the eyes of the world upon us, we did the dramatic. Now we must put the rancor of the past behind us and do the extraordinary.
CROWLEY: California has the fifth largest economy in the world and the biggest deficit of any state in the country. And he has no political experience. He may be just the right guy. In a state indifferent, sometimes hostile to politicians, he's not one.
SCHWARZENEGGER: I did not seek this office to do things the way they've always been done. What I care about is restoring your confidence in your government.
CROWLEY: In a state run by Democrats, he's the Republican in-law of the nation's most prominent Democratic family.
SCHWARZENEGGER: In the words of President Kennedy, I am an idealist without illusions.
CROWLEY: In the most diverse state in the nation, he is an immigrant who knows what it is to be poor and make it big and all the dreams in between.
SCHWARZENEGGER: President Reagan spoke of America as the shining city on a hill. I see California as the golden dream by the sea.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CROWLEY: He has a star on Hollywood Boulevard in Los Angeles, and soon his portrait will hang in the capitol building in Sacramento. This may just work -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Candy Crowley, thanks very much.
I have a fast fact for you. As governor of California, Arnold Schwarzenegger will make $175,000 a year. Now that is, of course, a far cry from what he made as a movie star. But it is about on par with the highest paid governor in the nation, New York Governor George Pataki, who makes $179,000. The lowest paid governor -- in case you're curious in America is Nebraska's Mike Johanns, who makes $65,000.
Today was Rush Limbaugh's first day back on the air after a month in rehab for an addiction to painkillers. Did you think rehab would turn him into, as he puts it, a linguine-spined liberal? If you thought yes, you certainly do not know Rush Limbaugh. While he may not be kinder and gentler, he did sound a bit humbler.
Here's Jason Carroll.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On his first day back on the air since re-entering rehab, the king of talk radio, Rush Limbaugh, told listeners he wanted to say he was sorry.
RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: There are people I need to apologize to. When it comes to apologizing to you, those of you in this audience...
CARROLL: Limbaugh says he thought his will alone was enough to fight the addiction to OxyContin, a painkiller originally prescribed after a back injury.
LIMBAUGH: It's a powerful addiction this stuff has over me, and it's something that I am -- as I say, I'm going to be dealing with on a daily basis. And I'm excited to be doing it as well.
CARROLL: Limbaugh's loyal legion of listeners flooded his phone lines. Most callers sounded like Mary Jo (ph) from Montgomery, Alabama.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm so proud of you, and we've been praying for you.
CARROLL: Limbaugh has been in rehab twice before for addiction to painkillers. Medical experts say staying clean will not be easy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a difficult task for him. But I am an optimist. I don't think that anybody needs to give up. It will be a tough fight, but he has to face it.
CARROLL: On occasion, Limbaugh has been tough on convicted drug abusers, saying they should serve time. It's unclear if investigators will pursue criminal charges against Limbaugh for possible illegal trafficking of prescription drugs. Limbaugh did not address the subject, but did say this about his past comments... LIMBAUGH: I was honest with you throughout the whole time. I was not honest with myself.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CARROLL: And we were hoping Limbaugh would have a little bit more to say as he left his studio here across the street. But he had nothing more to say to the media.
He didn't spend the entire three-hour program talking about rehabilitation. He did do a little bit of what has made him so popular with his listeners, and that is taking a few stabs at liberals -- Anderson.
COOPER: Not surprised to hear that. Jason Carroll, thanks very much tonight.
That brings us to today's "Buzz" question. Should Rush Limbaugh face prosecution for buying prescription drugs illegally? Log on now to cnn.com/360. Cast your vote. The results we'll have for you at the end of the program.
Also coming up, we're going to talk with someone who understands a little bit about what Rush Limbaugh may be going through. Tammy Faye Messner, who has battled scandal and painkiller addiction of her own. She'll join us. We'll talk to her.
Now a look at some international stories on tonight's "UpLink."
Istanbul, Turkey: al Qaeda connection? There are reports the terrorist network has claimed responsibility for the bombings of two synagogues in the Turkish capital over the weekend. Twenty-four people were killed.
The Turkish government is not saying much about the connection. Regardless, the claim led to a dip in financial markets today from Tokyo to New York.
Southern Afghanistan: the U.N. suspends its operations. Now, the move comes after the murder of a French aid worker over the weekend. Two suspects were arrested. A security review is ongoing and will determine when U.N. staffers will be back on the job.
Seoul, South Korea: DMZ changes. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld met with the president of South Korea today. Rumsfeld announced the U.S. plans to pull back some of its forces along the DMZ dividing North and South Korea. He gave no details on the exact number of troops involved. He also called on North Korea to dismantle its nuclear weapons program.
And check this out. Central Taiwan: fireworks trouble. A firework factory went up in flames last night killing five people, injuring 15 others. No word on exactly what caused the fire, but quite a dramatic evening.
That is tonight's "UpLink." Back now to the war in Iraq. And with every attack there is the burning question: could Saddam Hussein actually be helping to direct a guerrilla war? A tape was aired yesterday on the Arab network Al Arabiya that was said to be the voice of Saddam Hussein that rallied resistance from the shadows, but U.S. officials aren't so sure it's him. The story now from senior Pentagon correspondent Jamie McIntyre.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It is supposedly the voice of Saddam Hussein on a new audiotape aired over the weekend by Al Arabiya television. But the CIA is not convinced the speaker, exhorting Iraqis to fight the U.S. occupation, is really Saddam. Its technical analysis is inconclusive.
However, the U.S. is convinced the former Iraqi leader is alive and in Iraq, and that neutralizing him would take much of the fight out of his sympathizers. Pentagon sources say the U.S. hopes to find Saddam by getting his top deputy, Izak Ibrahim Al Dhouri (ph), king of clubs in the deck of the most wanted, who is believed to be the brains behind the insurgents.
BRIG. GEN. MARK KIMMITT, U.S. ARMY: We are getting more intelligence which suggests that he was directly implicated in the killing of some coalition soldiers. Are we any closer? We're getting closer every day.
MCINTYRE: The stepped-up raids against dozens of suspected guerrilla hideouts are not based on any new intelligence as to Saddam Hussein's whereabouts, sources say. But they are designed to develop new leads for the elite units hunting him down.
KIMMITT: Every day we continue to seek intelligence to find him. Every day we continue to work to go after him. And that is daily business. And we will not stop the hunt for Saddam Hussein.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MCINTYRE: No one is predicting here at the Pentagon that they'll capture Saddam Hussein imminently. But they are saying that his capture or killing is just a matter of time -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon -- thanks.
Mutual fund corruption. New scandals raising new concern for investors. So where is it safe to put your money? We'll talk to Ben Stein about that.
Also tonight, the Jonestown massacre, 25 years later. Find out how a cult leader led hundreds of people to their death.
And stranded school bus. Rising waters take their toll in Texas.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: All right. Ninety-five million of us have some part of our savings, our retirement, our kids' education, perhaps, invested in mutual funds. And the past few weeks have been, well, unsettling, to say the least.
Headlines involving some of the best known mutual funds. The industry swept up in a widening scandal about questionable practices. Certainly left a lot of us wondering how worried should we be about our mutual funds.
You may know Ben Stein as an actor and the guy from "Win Ben Stein's Money." He's also an economist, very well respected. And we are pleased that he joins us now.
Ben, thanks for being with us.
BEN STEIN, ACTOR, ECONOMIST: Honored to be here -- thanks.
COOPER: If anyone has invested with a company under investigation, should they withdraw their money?
STEIN: I would say no. If you are a -- in certain situations where you are legally obligated to withdraw your money from a company that's under a financial investigation or regulatory investigation, yes. But for the ordinary investor, no.
These things are embarrassing, they're a black eye for the mutual fund industry. But they have almost nothing to do with the amount of money you can expect to earn from your mutual fund over the time you have it. Mutual funds are moved by profit predictions, by giant trends...
COOPER: So you would even recommend continuing to contribute money to it?
STEIN: Oh, I absolutely would continue to buy mutual funds, and I still am continuing to buy mutual funds. What's basically happened is that the mutual fund managers have themselves violated their own laws about when they can trade, how often they can trade. They've let big customers have better terms of trading than small customers.
But these things amount to very, very small amounts of losses for the ordinary investor. And for the amount of money that's in the mutual fund pool, which is trillions of dollars, the losses are extremely small.
COOPER: So these -- I mean, the mutual funds are not going away.
STEIN: Oh, they're not...
COOPER: They've been slapped around a little bit, they've been fined. But they're not going away.
STEIN: This isn't like the savings and loan scandal, it's not like Enron, it's not like WorldCom. These are not going to go out of business. It just means that for every $100,000 that a person might have invested in it, a few cents have been illegally taken away and unethically taken away by managers doing self-dealings. COOPER: But is it possible there's more to come? I mean, where there's smoke there's fire?
STEIN: There can't be. I mean, a mutual fund is a collection of stocks, huge amounts of them owned by various people, aggregated as mutual fund stockholders. The managers, no matter what they did, unless they were simply making up the existence of a mutual fund that were fictitious, could not steal more than a tiny amount of it.
COOPER: And you encourage Americans to be investing because -- I mean, you say there's basically a plague of people not investing...
STEIN: There's a retirement catastrophe. Seventy-seven million baby boomers preparing for retirement, they have very little saved up on the average. Social Security is not going to cover them. Their pension plans aren't going to cover them.
If they want to keep up the same lifestyle that they've been living, they've got to start saving a lot more now. Diversify, buy annuities. But things and keep them going until they leave until their 90s, which many of them are going to do. This savings and loan scandal -- I'm sorry, it's not a savings and loan scandal -- the mutual fund scandal should not be an excuse not to keep saving, and especially not to keep saving on the stock market.
COOPER: All right. We'll leave it there. Ben Stein, thanks very much.
STEIN: Thank you very much.
COOPER: All right.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): Tammy Faye on Rush, rehab and redemption.
Speaking out: a survivor of the Jim Jones cult on the deadly anniversary.
And what could be a very costly kiss.
We'll be right back.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Here's "The Reset," some of the day's top stories.
Virginia Beach, Virginia: sniper verdict. Accused Washington area sniper John Allen Muhammad has been found guilty on all four counts, including capital murder and murder in an act of terrorism. He could face the death penalty. The sentencing phase of the trial began this afternoon.
Washington, D.C.: presidential assurances. Meeting with a group of Iraqi women today, President Bush declared that the U.S. will not run out on its responsibilities. He says, U.S. troops will remain in Iraq, even after a new Iraqi government is established.
Washington, D.C.: AARP endorsement. The nation's largest senior citizen group has endorsed the Republican-backed plan to add prescription drugs to Medicare. The AARP says, while the bill is far from perfect, it will provide substantial relief for Americans facing high drug bills. And there are a lot of them.
Modesto, California: DNA decision. The judge in the Scott Peterson murder trial has agreed to let prosecutors use evidence from DNA tests on a single strand of hair found on Peterson's boat. Now, the test suggest the hair was from Peterson's wife, Laci -- Peterson, of course, accused of killing his wife and their unborn child.
Houston, Texas: bus rescue. Amazing images here. Several storms swept across Texas today, causing floods in the Houston area. Now, several students had to be rescued from a stranded school bus. Across the region, a total of 16 injuries were attributed to the storms, but not on this bus.
And that is a look at "The Reset" tonight.
A sad anniversary tomorrow to tell you about. It was 25 years ago more than 900 people committed suicide or were murdered at Jonestown in Guyana, South America. Now, most of those drank fruit punch laced with cyanide. All were followers of Jim Jones and his People's Temple.
Here's how some experts and some people close to the Jonestown tragedy described what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jim Jones was a reverend from California who had started a group called the People's Temple. He took these people to an encampment in Guyana, in the wilderness, in the jungles of Guyana, very far removed from civilization. And these were all Americans, people brought there, some, allegedly, against their will.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jones got the people financially, socially, emotionally, spiritually, dependent on him, totally cut off from any way of leaving.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I saw the faces of these vibrant, beautiful friends of mine who had come to the United States, who had been in Jonestown now for months. It was like getting off a truck into a leper colony.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You had people bring their little babies and their little kids up first. And the parents had nothing to live for when they saw these little dying babies.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There, in fact, were people with guns forcing people to take poison. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were good people who did the best they could. And this man came along and manipulated their willingness to be selfless.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Amazing, 25 years ago tomorrow.
Joining us now is a former Jim Jones follower who had the good fortune to be elsewhere in Guyana the day of the Jonestown murder- suicides.
Laura Johnston Kohl joins us from our San Francisco bureau.
Welcome, Laura. Appreciate you being with us.
LAURA KOHL, FORMER JIM JONES FOLLOWER: Thank you.
COOPER: What drew you to Reverend Jim Jones in the first place?
KOHL: I was an activist in the '60s. I was against the war. I really wanted to have a better world. And I kept seeing things, things that I wanted to see in the world around me demolished. I saw the Kennedys shot down and Malcolm X, Martin Luther King.
COOPER: But what about Jim Jones spoke to you?
KOHL: Well, when I went into the first service with Jim Jones, he had pulled together people from every walk of life, of every color. And we had progressive people who were involved and we supported progressive causes. I thought that it was really a way to speak out as a group and try and make the world a better place.
COOPER: So you move down to Jonestown in Guyana. Things begin to change. How strict were people controlled there? Were you -- were people able to leave if they wanted to?
KOHL: The -- one of the things that we didn't know is how many people wanted to leave, because no one talked about it publicly. Jim was not interested in having people leave and so people did not talk about it.
And so, when everything went down at the airstrip and people were anxious to leave Jonestown, many of us had no idea that there were people who were discontent there.
COOPER: But there were. There were mass suicide drills that you even took part in. What were you thinking at that time?
KOHL: All along -- I was in the temple for nine years. And one of the things that I learned early on was that Jim was very much involved in theatrics and drama.
And people talk about suicide drills. No one who participated in the drills ever thought that Jim was seriously doing that. We participated in a drama that Jim would set up or a theater to make a point. It would never have occurred to us to participate, to stay in a group, to follow along, if we seriously thought that was ever even -- could ever happen.
COOPER: Yes.
Now, Laura, you were away from Jonestown the day this tragedy happened. You were buying supplies for the camp.
KOHL: Yes.
COOPER: If you had been there, do you think you would have drunk the cyanide?
KOHL: I really can't tell at this point. I do know that, if I had seen, really, my adoptive family of 913 people all dying around me, it would have been a very tough decision not to.
COOPER: Really? You think you might have actually done it?
KOHL: Well, looking back 25 years, it seems really like a faraway decision. So -- but I think it would be really difficult not to in that setting.
COOPER: What's the No. 1 thing people still do not understand about what happened there, about that time, that place?
KOHL: Well, the thing that I think is the most understated was that we really did have a community that, had Jim Jones been forced aside or had he left willingly and let the triumvirate set up, we really had a structure in place that would make a successful community living there with people of all different races and backgrounds, which really would have been a promised land or heaven on Earth.
And except that Jim getting sicker, going crazier and crazier, and all of us isolated, all the people who lived in Guyana only heard what was going on in the world through Jim. And the result was, not only were we isolated, but Jim was isolated, too. And there was no one who could talk sense into him either. He had isolated himself, as well as us. And so, as he got crazier, there was no one who could set him straight, no one who could take him to task for what he was saying either.
COOPER: Yes.
KOHL: So it was wrong from every point of view.
COOPER: Well, I'm sure it's going to be a tough day for you tomorrow, the 25th anniversary.
Laura Kohl, we appreciate you joining us tonight. Thank you very much.
KOHL: Thank you.
COOPER: Well, still to come tonight, some advice for Rush Limbaugh on his return from rehab. And it's from none other than Tammy Faye Messner -- her struggle with painkiller addiction and her current rebound. We'll talk to her coming up.
Plus, an update on the two girls whose lip-lock at school got them in trouble, the case we talked about last week. One of them was going to get the boot from the National Honor Society. Is that still the case?
We'll hear from her tonight on 360.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Send us an e-mail anytime, CNN.com/360.
Rush Limbaugh returned today, the start of what will no doubt be a big comeback for the radio star. If anyone has any doubts about his ability to regain success, they should remember that plenty of folks before him have had their brush with scandal and simply come back swinging.
F. Scott Fitzgerald was wrong. There are plenty of second acts in American life, third and fourth acts as well.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): No better example of that Marion Barry. The former D.C. mayor was caught on tape smoking crack, was convicted for a previous incident, and then eventually got reelected.
MARION BARRY (D), MAYOR OF WASHINGTON, D.C.: We have dreamed the impossible dream and made the impossible possible.
COOPER: What's the best way to come back? Well, there's always the "appeal to God for forgiveness" approach.
JIMMY SWAGGART, TELEVANGELIST: Would you join us in prayer?
COOPER: Back in 1998, Jimmy Swaggart admitted that, yes, he had been with a prostitute.
SWAGGART: I have sinned against you, my lord.
COOPER: Today, Jimmy Swaggart telecasts runs in over 50 countries around the world.
What about Bill Clinton?
WILLIAM J. CLINTON, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I did not have sexual relationships with that woman, Ms. Lewinsky.
COOPER: He lied about that, got impeached.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In violation of his constitutional oath.
COOPER: And none of it seems to have hurt his marketability on the speech circuit.
CLINTON: Thank you very much. COOPER: How did Clinton stage his comeback? Impossible to say, but it certainly helped that many Americans thought his accusers were just looking for blood and political gain. These days, it doesn't seem to matter how bad a scandal is. Comebacks are always possible.
Just ask Michael Milken. The one-time junk bond king jailed for securities fraud is now a crusader for cancer research. But how do explain someone like Darryl Strawberry? Despite drug problems and his many scrapes with the law, he's just been hired by the Yankees as a player development instructor. His second act comes because he's gotten a second chance and a third and a fourth and a fifth.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, our guest tonight knows something about second acts and third and fourth acts. Tammy Faye Messner stood by her televangelist husband Jim Bakker during his sex and money scandals. Like Rush Limbaugh, Tammy Faye has struggled with addiction. She was addicted to Ativan, a tranquilizer. She went to the Betty Ford Clinic. Now she's an author and plans to get back into Christian broadcasting.
Now, earlier I spoke with Tammy Faye about Rush, rehab and her own recovery. And I asked her, when she first had Rush had a drug problem, what went through her mind?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TAMMY FAYE MESSNER, FORMER TELEVANGELIST: Well, I felt, for one thing, that he was really going to be hassled by it, as he was. But I knew that the people that really loved Rush, like me and millions of others, would stand by him and absolutely just say, you go get them, man.
COOPER: Were you surprised, though?
MESSNER: Well, I was surprised in one way. But in another way, I wasn't, because I knew he had had that hearing problem. And I was wondering if he wasn't having to take them for that hearing problem that he was having.
COOPER: I want to play a little bit of sound from some of the comments that Rush Limbaugh made today on the radio. And then let's talk about them.
(CROSSTALK)
MESSNER: Oh, good. OK.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP, "THE RUSH LIMBAUGH SHOW")
RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: I thought I was going into a treatment center to be treated for an addiction to opiates, to painkillers. And I was. But it is so much more than that. It is about so much more than that. I tried to treat myself twice for my addiction. I detoxed myself twice and tried to do it by force of will, which is not possible. This is something someone cannot do alone. It is someone -- it is something that requires several things to change in my life.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
COOPER: He talked on the radio, Tammy Faye, about things he had learned about himself in rehab. You've been through rehab. You were addicted to Ativan.
MESSNER: Yes.
COOPER: What did you learn about yourself?
MESSNER: Well, I also learned a lot of things about myself.
And the thing that I learned was knowledge. I had to have some knowledge about what Ativan was and what it did, and that you are not supposed to mix prescription medicines with over-the-counter medicines, which I was doing.
And then what I didn't realize was that prescription medicines, many of them have a build-up. And so, where you'd take one milligram one day, then you'd take another milligram the next day, well, there's still some left in your system. And so, eventually, as the weeks go by, your system demands more to take care of the same problem. What one milligram took care of at one time, now it takes three milligrams to take care of it.
COOPER: Let me ask you, at the time that you became addicted, you had a huge following of viewers and listeners, much like Rush Limbaugh.
MESSNER: Yes.
COOPER: Did you have a sense of letting people down at all?
MESSNER: Well, I think we're born thinking we're always going to let people down. And, yes, I did feel, because I was preaching the gospel of Jesus Christ. And I was preaching that God heals.
And then here I was taking something to help me through a nerve -- through an anxiety problem. So I did feel that way, to some extent, yes. But I was really glad when it was found out and I was able to speak about it and finally get some help that I needed, because I, too, couldn't do it by myself. I had tried to do it by myself. And Rush is absolutely right. You need help.
COOPER: Well, it's interesting that you say that. You felt relieved when people found out. You must have been scared that people were going to find out while you were doing it. But what was the relief?
MESSNER: The relief was that, finally, it was out. The Bible says everything hidden shall be revealed. And, boy, that was the case in my life.
And I was really glad when it was finally out, it wasn't hidden anymore, and people knew. And what I fund out was that it was totally different than I thought. People had great sympathy. People said, go get it taken care of. We're behind you all the way. Don't you dare give up.
And the people are what really helped me make it through those several months that I was coming off Ativan.
COOPER: And I know recovery, people say it just takes -- is a lifelong process. It's not something that it just ends in rehab. Any advice for Rush Limbaugh, for anyone else out there in the coming days and the coming weeks?
MESSNER: Well, I would like to tell Rush he doesn't owe anyone an explanation, that he needs to just get on with being free. Just practice what you have been taught about the medication. And, if you need help, just go ask for it. Don't be afraid to say, hey, I'm having a little bit of a struggle here and I need some help. Or, if you need help in the middle of the night, and you feel like you need one of those pills, go call somebody.
It's like AA. You need to get it like an AA buddy and just go for it.
COOPER: And you can always have a second chance, even a third and fourth chance?
MESSNER: Always a second chance. As long as you are trying, you always can have a second, a third and fourth chance at it.
COOPER: All right, Tammy Faye Messner, appreciate talking to you. Thanks very much.
MESSNER: And I would like to say to Rush, mega dittos.
(LAUGHTER)
COOPER: All right, thanks very much, Tammy Faye.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Tammy Faye Messner.
Up next in "The Current," the little elf that could. Well, he's actually a six-foot-tall elf, the one played by Will Ferrell, that came in No. one at the box office this weekend. We'll talk about that.
Also tonight, she got in trouble for kissing another girl in her high school cafeteria. Did it cost her a spot in the National Honor Society? We'll find out.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, time to check on pop news in tonight's "Current."
The FDA has approved the first chewable birth control pill. However, it will not be available in the shapes of Dino, Fred, Barney and Wilma.
Moving on, rapper 50 Cent has finally made it. He won two American Music Awards last night. However, he still has to win 21 more to catch up with the all-time winner, Alabama. Best of luck, 50.
Will Ferrell has mastered Russell Crowe and command Keanu Reeves. "Elf" is the weekend's top movie, beating the debut of "Master and Commander." "Elf" is also said by some critics to be even funnier than "Matrix Revolutions." Didn't know that.
And the "Harry Potter" books have now sold a quarter-billion copies worldwide. The series' success has encouraged literacy advocates and given new ammunition to critics who say young people have longer attention spans than they're given credit for.
And that's all the time we have in today's bundle of rapid-fire, 15-second pop-culture tidbits.
A follow-up now to a story we brought you just last week. Remember the two girls at a Maryland high school who were suspended after they kissed at a school? It was part of an English project to do something nonconformist. Well, today, we learned the suspension will not affect one of the girls' ability to join the National Honor Society.
Stephanie Haaser joins us from Washington.
So, congratulations, Stephanie.
STEPHANIE HAASER, STUDENT: Thank you.
COOPER: Are you pleased with how everything worked out?
HAASER: Yes, very.
It's more than I really had hoped for. At the end of the meeting of the student council committee, they cast a vote. And it turned out it was in my favor. So I was able to join.
COOPER: I want to read you a statement from your high school principal. And he said this: "It's unacceptable behavior to stand on a table in the school cafeteria to make out for an extended period of time. The kiss was an essential part of the decision to suspend the two students, but it was independent of any issue related to homophobia. I would have made the same decision if it had been a male and a female."
You say this was a protest against homophobia.
HAASER: Yes. COOPER: Do you think that's true, that, if you were kissing a boy, you would have been suspended for two days?
HAASER: I do recognize the fact that we would have been disciplined somehow, that disciplinary actions would naturally follow. But I do question the suspension itself, that we were suspended for two days and thus that I possibly would not be able to join NHS for that. So..
COOPER: You say this was a statement against what you say was homophobia in your school.
HAASER: Yes.
COOPER: Do you think it's had any impact and do you want to continue making these kind of statements?
HAASER: Not in the same fashion in my school, no, certainly not. But I do believe that it's had a very positive effect and will continue to have an effect on our school's environment.
COOPER: How big a problem, really, is it in your high school?
HAASER: I believe that it is considerable, not only in my own high school, but I hear it's a very big problem in today's society, really in our nation and our world, and just the remarks you hear from day to day and the issues that are currently important to many people.
COOPER: But, Stephanie, when you were on the program last week, we got a lot of e-mails, a lot of e-mails in support of you. But, also, a lot of people said, look, this is grandstanding. You stood on a table. You kissed another girl in front of everyone for 15 seconds, and that -- they didn't quite understand what you were trying to prove.
HAASER: Well, that's why I'm thankful for the sort of media attention that this has garnered, in order for me to explain the act to the public.
I believe that the school is a small enough environment for me to explain the message of it. And the statement that was prior to the act, "End homophobia now," I think pretty much summed up why I was doing it.
COOPER: What do you want to do next? You are a junior in high school. Where do you want to go to school?
HAASER: Ideally speaking, I'd attend Brown in college.
COOPER: And, ultimately, do you know what you want to do? Do you want to be president some day?
(LAUGHTER)
HAASER: Well, I'm not really sure. Politics has always sort of interesting to me. I haven't really thought about what I'd run for. COOPER: You know what? That's spoken like a true politician, if ever I've heard it. They never say what they are going to run for.
Stephanie Haaser, it's been interesting to talk to you. Good luck to you.
HAASER: Thank you very much.
COOPER: All right.
New reports of athletes testing positive for steroids. Is it time to overhaul the entire system? We'll take it to "The Nth Degree" tonight.
Plus, coming tomorrow on 360, Martha Stewart back in court and in the spotlight.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Tonight, taking performance enhancement to "The Nth Degree."
CBS Sportsline found out four NFL players have tested positive for THG, a type of steroid that was undetectable until recently. Now, Major League Baseball said last week that about 5 to 7 percent of its tests for steroids come back positive.
So I ask you, what is next, roid-raging chess players? At this rate, it's only a matter of time until some enterprising sports franchise turns the whole stigma of drug use into the hottest new trend, competitive sports where everyone is doped to the gills. Hey, at least it's more fair than when some guys get to use them.
A steroids sports league would guarantee not only new endorsement opportunities, but the ratings would be pumped up. People who'd never watched the Goodwill Games would totally tune in to watching pole vaulters who calves had mutated into the size of my head. You could call it the Good Pill Games. And if everyone was on the juice, it would eliminate issues of gender equality in sports once and for all. Heck, we wouldn't even need gender categories anymore. Administering anabolic steroids through a fire hose would eventually turn our finest athletes into finely toned machines of muscle, tendon and indeterminate genitalia.
Of course, we could avoid athletes taking drugs through tougher testing, public pressure, and by reducing the insane financial incentives for athletes to take the steroids in the first place. But if you think that's likely to happen, maybe you're the one on drugs.
That wraps up our program tonight.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Found Guilty>
Aired November 17, 2003 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, HOST (voice-over): Sniper John Allen Muhammad guilty on all counts. How will the verdict affect the trial of his alleged accomplice?
The president off to Britain. What kind of welcome is waiting?
Rush Limbaugh back from rehab and behind the mike. Are criminal charges possible? Tammy Faye Messner on Rush , rehab and redemption.
A deadly anniversary. A former Jonestown cult member speaks out.
And will a same-sex kiss cost a high school girl her honor?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good Monday to you. Thanks for joining us on 360. We're going to take you tonight to California, as Governor Schwarzenegger celebrates his inauguration. That story ahead.
And more on Rush's return to ready. How the ditto heads respond on his first day back on the air since rehab.
First, however, we go to Iraq. Today, the U.S. military is in the midst of what it calls a massive counter-offensive in the place where support for Saddam Hussein thrives, his hometown, Tikrit. The crackdown comes as two more soldiers were killed today in separate attacks outside Baghdad.
More now from senior international correspondent Walter Rodgers.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WALTER RODGERS, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Punishing Iraqi insurgents for their increasingly deadly attacks on U.S. soldiers here, two more killed Monday, the 4th Infantry Divisions' big guns boom away around Tikrit. The U.S. military believes Tikrit to be a stronghold of Saddam Hussein loyalists and the anti-American resistance.
These 155-millimeter shells are seeking out the hideouts of Iraqi paramilitary groups. Sometimes they just shoot at patches of ground on which the Iraqis previously fired mortars at U.S. forces.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We fired two so far; both hit. We should be firing about nine more through the course of the night.
RODGERS: Only a reduction in the number of attacks on U.S. forces in the weeks ahead will determine the success of this offensive. But its minimum goal is to keep the insurgents off balance.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think we have a pretty good handle on the enemy in this area. We're noticing a definite trend that it's getting weaker.
RODGERS: Still, the American offensive in and around Tikrit infuriated Iraqi civilians, especially after the U.S. Army destroyed four houses said to be the homes of insurgents who earlier shot down a U.S. helicopter. This woman shouted, "They blamed my son. My son is innocent. I swear to god." Many young men in this crowd are now vowing to join the insurgents to fight the Americans.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
RODGERS: Like it or not, U.S. forces now appear to be slipping into a pattern of classic guerrilla warfare here in Iraq, and it's an open question as to whether major military operations like the one that's under way in Tikrit can make a dent in the insurgency -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Walter Rodgers, thanks very much.
There was word today from the Pentagon that the Chinook helicopter shot down November 2 was not equipped with the latest anti- missile system. Sixteen troops were killed in that attack. Now, officials said about half of the Chinook's deployed in Iraq do have the improved system, but that particular chopper was not among them. In a memo a few days after the attack, the acting Army secretary called for all helicopters in Iraq, as well as Afghanistan, to be outfitted with the latest equipment.
President Bush leaves for Britain tomorrow. No doubt the official welcome will be warm. But the unofficial reception may leave something to be desired. Anti-war demonstrators are preparing massive protests. Senior White House correspondent John King has a preview.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Across the Atlantic to celebrate a unique friendship, but also to once again confront the perception he is too eager to go to war, too dismissive of what Europe thinks and more.
PHIL GORDON, BROOKINGS INSTITUTION: His style, his swagger, his way of speaking, frankly alienates a lot of European public opinion.
KING: The Buckingham Palace welcome for a formal state visit is meant to send a signal. CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: The depth of the special relationship between our too countries cannot be overstated. The United States has no greater friend.
KING: But protesters promise to turn out by the tends of thousands during the three-day visit. A "Daily Mirror" poll found only 27 percent of Britons believe the partnership is good for their country. And Mr. Bush is often the subject of ridicule in British and other European media.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's time for your 3:00 briefing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What time is it?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's mousy time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have to start using the numbers now, sir.
KING: Terrorism and Iraq will be the president's overwhelming focus: strategy sessions with Prime Minister Blair, meeting relatives of British victims killed in September 11 attacks, and thanking British troops who fought in Afghanistan and Iraq.
Image building is another priority: a forum with Mr. Blair on efforts to fight HIV AIDS, a visit to Blair's home district in northern England, and a major speech on the Transatlantic Alliance.
(on camera): The president has a bust of Winston Churchill in the Oval Office. It says it reminds him, "sometimes you're up, sometimes you're down, but you've got to do what you think is right." And he shrugs off talks of massive protests in London, casting them, in his words, as a "fantastic display of freedom."
John King, CNN, the White House.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, a quick news note for you. It is the first full state visit of a U.S. president to the United Kingdom since Woodrow Wilson in 1918. Now, a state visit means that President Bush will actually sleep at Buckingham Palace. That is an honor that even President Reagan did not receive. Though, as you can see in this picture, he did ride a horse alongside the queen in 1982.
Now, the last time George W. Bush dined with the queen was in 1992 at his father's White House. He reportedly showed up wearing cowboy boots emblazoned with "God Save the Queen."
Well, now to "Justice Served." A jury in Virginia finds John Allen Muhammad guilty on all four counts stemming from the D.C.-area sniper shootings. Now the big question: will this man face life in prison or death?
Here's CNN's Jeanne Meserve. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): If John Muhammad felt anything, he showed nothing as the verdict was read. Guilty on all four counts, including terrorism and capital murder, each of which carries a possible death penalty. The sister of Hong Im Ballenger, who was gunned down outside a Baton Rouge beauty supply store, sobbed as the verdict was read. She made it clear afterwards what she thought should happen next.
KWANG SZUSZKA, SISTER OF HONG BALLENGER: I'm glad they found him guilty, and I'm still looking for death penalty for justice.
MESERVE: As the jury moved on to consider whether Muhammad should die or spend the rest of his life in prison, defense attorney Jonathan Shapiro acknowledged the obvious. "Your decision will put John Muhammad in a box of one sort or another. One is made of concrete and one is made of pine."
Saying it is not necessary to extinguish one more life, Shapiro characterized Muhammad as a man of worth and value who had friends, admirers and loving children. But prosecutor Richard Conway said Muhammad was one of the worst of the worst, saying "He sits right in front of you without a shred of remorse."
The first witness in the penalty phase, Isa Nichols (ph), a former friend and business associate of Muhammad's, whose niece was shot, prosecutors contend, after Nichols (ph) alienated Muhammad by giving support to his ex-wife Mildred.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Jeanne Meserve joins us now. Jeanne, we talked a lot about the witness testimony which began in the Malvo trial today. We talked a lot about what the defense is going to argue. But are prosecutors in the Malvo case expected to kind of lay out the same case against him that they did against Muhammad?
MESERVE: Well, some obvious differences are clear already. They have already worked through two of the crime scenes, the murders of Linda Franklin and Dean Meyers. They've done so with 17 witnesses, put them on and off very quickly.
And it's a much less emotional trial. They are using some of the gruesome photographs. But still, the questioning tends to be much more matter of fact. One reason for that may be that there's a lot more circumstantial evidence that implicates Mr. Malvo than there was implicating Mr. Muhammad -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Jeanne Meserve covering both trials. Thanks very much, Jeanne.
We are following several other stories tonight "Cross Country." Let's take a look.
Washington, D.C.: Hinckley hearing. The man who shot President Reagan in 1981 wants to make unsupervised visits to his parents' home. Now, a lawyer for John Hinckley Jr. told a federal judge today his client is probably the least dangerous person on the planet. This is what the lawyer said.
Federal prosecutors are fighting the request. Hinckley has been staying at a psychiatric hospital since being acquitted of the shooting by reason of insanity.
New York City: constitutional rights evaluated. A federal appeals court is questioning the Bush administration's decision to classify a terrorism suspect as an enemy combatant and detain him indefinitely. It is reviewing the case of Jose Padilla, who is accused of plotting a dirty bomb attack inside the U.S. His lawyer, who you see there, says his rights to due process are being violated.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONNA NEWMAN, PADILLA'S LAWYER: American citizens have never before, in our history, been held without charges in a military brig as an enemy combatant, whatever that label may mean. So that to label somebody, according to the government, it would appear, enables you to avoid and rip up the Constitution.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Well, moving on.
Des Moines, Iowa: Dr. Dean on the scene with the help of an unidentified man. Democratic presidential candidate Howard Dean gave medical attention to a member of his staff who collapsed on the campaign trail on Saturday. Dean's credentials of course include physician. His staffer apparently had a seizure and was later treated and released from the hospital.
That is a look at stories Cross Country" tonight.
From the big screen to the governor's mansion...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. ARNOLD SCHWARZENEGGER (R), CALIFORNIA: This election was not about replacing one man. It was not about replacing one party. It was about changing the entire political climate of this state.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Arnold Schwarzenegger takes charge of the most populated state in the nation. Will his movie star charm help balance the budget out West? We'll go live to Sacramento.
Plus back from rehab and on the radio. Rush Limbaugh breaks his addiction to painkillers. But will he face charges for buying them? We'll try to get the latest on that.
And Jonestown 25 years later. Almost 1,000 people led to their graves by their leader. Find out why they drank cyanide. But first, let's take a look "Inside the Box" at the top stories on tonight's network newscasts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, former bodybuilder and movie actor, Arnold Schwarzenegger, has started the third phase of his professional life as governor of California. Schwarzenegger was inaugurated today, almost six weeks after winning the recall election that removed Gray Davis from office. California, of course, faces some tough budget problems. But as senior political correspondent Candy Crowley reports, the new governor says he is prepared to do some heavy lifting.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SR. POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is going to take some getting used to.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Congratulations, Governor Schwarzenegger.
SCHWARZENEGGER: Thank you.
CROWLEY: Under unusual circumstances, an unusual politician took office in the traditional way: a stately walk through the capitol building, wife at the side, hand on the bible, speech full of hope.
SCHWARZENEGGER: With the eyes of the world upon us, we did the dramatic. Now we must put the rancor of the past behind us and do the extraordinary.
CROWLEY: California has the fifth largest economy in the world and the biggest deficit of any state in the country. And he has no political experience. He may be just the right guy. In a state indifferent, sometimes hostile to politicians, he's not one.
SCHWARZENEGGER: I did not seek this office to do things the way they've always been done. What I care about is restoring your confidence in your government.
CROWLEY: In a state run by Democrats, he's the Republican in-law of the nation's most prominent Democratic family.
SCHWARZENEGGER: In the words of President Kennedy, I am an idealist without illusions.
CROWLEY: In the most diverse state in the nation, he is an immigrant who knows what it is to be poor and make it big and all the dreams in between.
SCHWARZENEGGER: President Reagan spoke of America as the shining city on a hill. I see California as the golden dream by the sea.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CROWLEY: He has a star on Hollywood Boulevard in Los Angeles, and soon his portrait will hang in the capitol building in Sacramento. This may just work -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Candy Crowley, thanks very much.
I have a fast fact for you. As governor of California, Arnold Schwarzenegger will make $175,000 a year. Now that is, of course, a far cry from what he made as a movie star. But it is about on par with the highest paid governor in the nation, New York Governor George Pataki, who makes $179,000. The lowest paid governor -- in case you're curious in America is Nebraska's Mike Johanns, who makes $65,000.
Today was Rush Limbaugh's first day back on the air after a month in rehab for an addiction to painkillers. Did you think rehab would turn him into, as he puts it, a linguine-spined liberal? If you thought yes, you certainly do not know Rush Limbaugh. While he may not be kinder and gentler, he did sound a bit humbler.
Here's Jason Carroll.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JASON CARROLL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): On his first day back on the air since re-entering rehab, the king of talk radio, Rush Limbaugh, told listeners he wanted to say he was sorry.
RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: There are people I need to apologize to. When it comes to apologizing to you, those of you in this audience...
CARROLL: Limbaugh says he thought his will alone was enough to fight the addiction to OxyContin, a painkiller originally prescribed after a back injury.
LIMBAUGH: It's a powerful addiction this stuff has over me, and it's something that I am -- as I say, I'm going to be dealing with on a daily basis. And I'm excited to be doing it as well.
CARROLL: Limbaugh's loyal legion of listeners flooded his phone lines. Most callers sounded like Mary Jo (ph) from Montgomery, Alabama.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm so proud of you, and we've been praying for you.
CARROLL: Limbaugh has been in rehab twice before for addiction to painkillers. Medical experts say staying clean will not be easy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a difficult task for him. But I am an optimist. I don't think that anybody needs to give up. It will be a tough fight, but he has to face it.
CARROLL: On occasion, Limbaugh has been tough on convicted drug abusers, saying they should serve time. It's unclear if investigators will pursue criminal charges against Limbaugh for possible illegal trafficking of prescription drugs. Limbaugh did not address the subject, but did say this about his past comments... LIMBAUGH: I was honest with you throughout the whole time. I was not honest with myself.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CARROLL: And we were hoping Limbaugh would have a little bit more to say as he left his studio here across the street. But he had nothing more to say to the media.
He didn't spend the entire three-hour program talking about rehabilitation. He did do a little bit of what has made him so popular with his listeners, and that is taking a few stabs at liberals -- Anderson.
COOPER: Not surprised to hear that. Jason Carroll, thanks very much tonight.
That brings us to today's "Buzz" question. Should Rush Limbaugh face prosecution for buying prescription drugs illegally? Log on now to cnn.com/360. Cast your vote. The results we'll have for you at the end of the program.
Also coming up, we're going to talk with someone who understands a little bit about what Rush Limbaugh may be going through. Tammy Faye Messner, who has battled scandal and painkiller addiction of her own. She'll join us. We'll talk to her.
Now a look at some international stories on tonight's "UpLink."
Istanbul, Turkey: al Qaeda connection? There are reports the terrorist network has claimed responsibility for the bombings of two synagogues in the Turkish capital over the weekend. Twenty-four people were killed.
The Turkish government is not saying much about the connection. Regardless, the claim led to a dip in financial markets today from Tokyo to New York.
Southern Afghanistan: the U.N. suspends its operations. Now, the move comes after the murder of a French aid worker over the weekend. Two suspects were arrested. A security review is ongoing and will determine when U.N. staffers will be back on the job.
Seoul, South Korea: DMZ changes. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld met with the president of South Korea today. Rumsfeld announced the U.S. plans to pull back some of its forces along the DMZ dividing North and South Korea. He gave no details on the exact number of troops involved. He also called on North Korea to dismantle its nuclear weapons program.
And check this out. Central Taiwan: fireworks trouble. A firework factory went up in flames last night killing five people, injuring 15 others. No word on exactly what caused the fire, but quite a dramatic evening.
That is tonight's "UpLink." Back now to the war in Iraq. And with every attack there is the burning question: could Saddam Hussein actually be helping to direct a guerrilla war? A tape was aired yesterday on the Arab network Al Arabiya that was said to be the voice of Saddam Hussein that rallied resistance from the shadows, but U.S. officials aren't so sure it's him. The story now from senior Pentagon correspondent Jamie McIntyre.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JAMIE MCINTYRE, CNN SR. PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It is supposedly the voice of Saddam Hussein on a new audiotape aired over the weekend by Al Arabiya television. But the CIA is not convinced the speaker, exhorting Iraqis to fight the U.S. occupation, is really Saddam. Its technical analysis is inconclusive.
However, the U.S. is convinced the former Iraqi leader is alive and in Iraq, and that neutralizing him would take much of the fight out of his sympathizers. Pentagon sources say the U.S. hopes to find Saddam by getting his top deputy, Izak Ibrahim Al Dhouri (ph), king of clubs in the deck of the most wanted, who is believed to be the brains behind the insurgents.
BRIG. GEN. MARK KIMMITT, U.S. ARMY: We are getting more intelligence which suggests that he was directly implicated in the killing of some coalition soldiers. Are we any closer? We're getting closer every day.
MCINTYRE: The stepped-up raids against dozens of suspected guerrilla hideouts are not based on any new intelligence as to Saddam Hussein's whereabouts, sources say. But they are designed to develop new leads for the elite units hunting him down.
KIMMITT: Every day we continue to seek intelligence to find him. Every day we continue to work to go after him. And that is daily business. And we will not stop the hunt for Saddam Hussein.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MCINTYRE: No one is predicting here at the Pentagon that they'll capture Saddam Hussein imminently. But they are saying that his capture or killing is just a matter of time -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right. Jamie McIntyre at the Pentagon -- thanks.
Mutual fund corruption. New scandals raising new concern for investors. So where is it safe to put your money? We'll talk to Ben Stein about that.
Also tonight, the Jonestown massacre, 25 years later. Find out how a cult leader led hundreds of people to their death.
And stranded school bus. Rising waters take their toll in Texas.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: All right. Ninety-five million of us have some part of our savings, our retirement, our kids' education, perhaps, invested in mutual funds. And the past few weeks have been, well, unsettling, to say the least.
Headlines involving some of the best known mutual funds. The industry swept up in a widening scandal about questionable practices. Certainly left a lot of us wondering how worried should we be about our mutual funds.
You may know Ben Stein as an actor and the guy from "Win Ben Stein's Money." He's also an economist, very well respected. And we are pleased that he joins us now.
Ben, thanks for being with us.
BEN STEIN, ACTOR, ECONOMIST: Honored to be here -- thanks.
COOPER: If anyone has invested with a company under investigation, should they withdraw their money?
STEIN: I would say no. If you are a -- in certain situations where you are legally obligated to withdraw your money from a company that's under a financial investigation or regulatory investigation, yes. But for the ordinary investor, no.
These things are embarrassing, they're a black eye for the mutual fund industry. But they have almost nothing to do with the amount of money you can expect to earn from your mutual fund over the time you have it. Mutual funds are moved by profit predictions, by giant trends...
COOPER: So you would even recommend continuing to contribute money to it?
STEIN: Oh, I absolutely would continue to buy mutual funds, and I still am continuing to buy mutual funds. What's basically happened is that the mutual fund managers have themselves violated their own laws about when they can trade, how often they can trade. They've let big customers have better terms of trading than small customers.
But these things amount to very, very small amounts of losses for the ordinary investor. And for the amount of money that's in the mutual fund pool, which is trillions of dollars, the losses are extremely small.
COOPER: So these -- I mean, the mutual funds are not going away.
STEIN: Oh, they're not...
COOPER: They've been slapped around a little bit, they've been fined. But they're not going away.
STEIN: This isn't like the savings and loan scandal, it's not like Enron, it's not like WorldCom. These are not going to go out of business. It just means that for every $100,000 that a person might have invested in it, a few cents have been illegally taken away and unethically taken away by managers doing self-dealings. COOPER: But is it possible there's more to come? I mean, where there's smoke there's fire?
STEIN: There can't be. I mean, a mutual fund is a collection of stocks, huge amounts of them owned by various people, aggregated as mutual fund stockholders. The managers, no matter what they did, unless they were simply making up the existence of a mutual fund that were fictitious, could not steal more than a tiny amount of it.
COOPER: And you encourage Americans to be investing because -- I mean, you say there's basically a plague of people not investing...
STEIN: There's a retirement catastrophe. Seventy-seven million baby boomers preparing for retirement, they have very little saved up on the average. Social Security is not going to cover them. Their pension plans aren't going to cover them.
If they want to keep up the same lifestyle that they've been living, they've got to start saving a lot more now. Diversify, buy annuities. But things and keep them going until they leave until their 90s, which many of them are going to do. This savings and loan scandal -- I'm sorry, it's not a savings and loan scandal -- the mutual fund scandal should not be an excuse not to keep saving, and especially not to keep saving on the stock market.
COOPER: All right. We'll leave it there. Ben Stein, thanks very much.
STEIN: Thank you very much.
COOPER: All right.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): Tammy Faye on Rush, rehab and redemption.
Speaking out: a survivor of the Jim Jones cult on the deadly anniversary.
And what could be a very costly kiss.
We'll be right back.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Here's "The Reset," some of the day's top stories.
Virginia Beach, Virginia: sniper verdict. Accused Washington area sniper John Allen Muhammad has been found guilty on all four counts, including capital murder and murder in an act of terrorism. He could face the death penalty. The sentencing phase of the trial began this afternoon.
Washington, D.C.: presidential assurances. Meeting with a group of Iraqi women today, President Bush declared that the U.S. will not run out on its responsibilities. He says, U.S. troops will remain in Iraq, even after a new Iraqi government is established.
Washington, D.C.: AARP endorsement. The nation's largest senior citizen group has endorsed the Republican-backed plan to add prescription drugs to Medicare. The AARP says, while the bill is far from perfect, it will provide substantial relief for Americans facing high drug bills. And there are a lot of them.
Modesto, California: DNA decision. The judge in the Scott Peterson murder trial has agreed to let prosecutors use evidence from DNA tests on a single strand of hair found on Peterson's boat. Now, the test suggest the hair was from Peterson's wife, Laci -- Peterson, of course, accused of killing his wife and their unborn child.
Houston, Texas: bus rescue. Amazing images here. Several storms swept across Texas today, causing floods in the Houston area. Now, several students had to be rescued from a stranded school bus. Across the region, a total of 16 injuries were attributed to the storms, but not on this bus.
And that is a look at "The Reset" tonight.
A sad anniversary tomorrow to tell you about. It was 25 years ago more than 900 people committed suicide or were murdered at Jonestown in Guyana, South America. Now, most of those drank fruit punch laced with cyanide. All were followers of Jim Jones and his People's Temple.
Here's how some experts and some people close to the Jonestown tragedy described what happened.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jim Jones was a reverend from California who had started a group called the People's Temple. He took these people to an encampment in Guyana, in the wilderness, in the jungles of Guyana, very far removed from civilization. And these were all Americans, people brought there, some, allegedly, against their will.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Jones got the people financially, socially, emotionally, spiritually, dependent on him, totally cut off from any way of leaving.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I saw the faces of these vibrant, beautiful friends of mine who had come to the United States, who had been in Jonestown now for months. It was like getting off a truck into a leper colony.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You had people bring their little babies and their little kids up first. And the parents had nothing to live for when they saw these little dying babies.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There, in fact, were people with guns forcing people to take poison. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were good people who did the best they could. And this man came along and manipulated their willingness to be selfless.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Amazing, 25 years ago tomorrow.
Joining us now is a former Jim Jones follower who had the good fortune to be elsewhere in Guyana the day of the Jonestown murder- suicides.
Laura Johnston Kohl joins us from our San Francisco bureau.
Welcome, Laura. Appreciate you being with us.
LAURA KOHL, FORMER JIM JONES FOLLOWER: Thank you.
COOPER: What drew you to Reverend Jim Jones in the first place?
KOHL: I was an activist in the '60s. I was against the war. I really wanted to have a better world. And I kept seeing things, things that I wanted to see in the world around me demolished. I saw the Kennedys shot down and Malcolm X, Martin Luther King.
COOPER: But what about Jim Jones spoke to you?
KOHL: Well, when I went into the first service with Jim Jones, he had pulled together people from every walk of life, of every color. And we had progressive people who were involved and we supported progressive causes. I thought that it was really a way to speak out as a group and try and make the world a better place.
COOPER: So you move down to Jonestown in Guyana. Things begin to change. How strict were people controlled there? Were you -- were people able to leave if they wanted to?
KOHL: The -- one of the things that we didn't know is how many people wanted to leave, because no one talked about it publicly. Jim was not interested in having people leave and so people did not talk about it.
And so, when everything went down at the airstrip and people were anxious to leave Jonestown, many of us had no idea that there were people who were discontent there.
COOPER: But there were. There were mass suicide drills that you even took part in. What were you thinking at that time?
KOHL: All along -- I was in the temple for nine years. And one of the things that I learned early on was that Jim was very much involved in theatrics and drama.
And people talk about suicide drills. No one who participated in the drills ever thought that Jim was seriously doing that. We participated in a drama that Jim would set up or a theater to make a point. It would never have occurred to us to participate, to stay in a group, to follow along, if we seriously thought that was ever even -- could ever happen.
COOPER: Yes.
Now, Laura, you were away from Jonestown the day this tragedy happened. You were buying supplies for the camp.
KOHL: Yes.
COOPER: If you had been there, do you think you would have drunk the cyanide?
KOHL: I really can't tell at this point. I do know that, if I had seen, really, my adoptive family of 913 people all dying around me, it would have been a very tough decision not to.
COOPER: Really? You think you might have actually done it?
KOHL: Well, looking back 25 years, it seems really like a faraway decision. So -- but I think it would be really difficult not to in that setting.
COOPER: What's the No. 1 thing people still do not understand about what happened there, about that time, that place?
KOHL: Well, the thing that I think is the most understated was that we really did have a community that, had Jim Jones been forced aside or had he left willingly and let the triumvirate set up, we really had a structure in place that would make a successful community living there with people of all different races and backgrounds, which really would have been a promised land or heaven on Earth.
And except that Jim getting sicker, going crazier and crazier, and all of us isolated, all the people who lived in Guyana only heard what was going on in the world through Jim. And the result was, not only were we isolated, but Jim was isolated, too. And there was no one who could talk sense into him either. He had isolated himself, as well as us. And so, as he got crazier, there was no one who could set him straight, no one who could take him to task for what he was saying either.
COOPER: Yes.
KOHL: So it was wrong from every point of view.
COOPER: Well, I'm sure it's going to be a tough day for you tomorrow, the 25th anniversary.
Laura Kohl, we appreciate you joining us tonight. Thank you very much.
KOHL: Thank you.
COOPER: Well, still to come tonight, some advice for Rush Limbaugh on his return from rehab. And it's from none other than Tammy Faye Messner -- her struggle with painkiller addiction and her current rebound. We'll talk to her coming up.
Plus, an update on the two girls whose lip-lock at school got them in trouble, the case we talked about last week. One of them was going to get the boot from the National Honor Society. Is that still the case?
We'll hear from her tonight on 360.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Send us an e-mail anytime, CNN.com/360.
Rush Limbaugh returned today, the start of what will no doubt be a big comeback for the radio star. If anyone has any doubts about his ability to regain success, they should remember that plenty of folks before him have had their brush with scandal and simply come back swinging.
F. Scott Fitzgerald was wrong. There are plenty of second acts in American life, third and fourth acts as well.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): No better example of that Marion Barry. The former D.C. mayor was caught on tape smoking crack, was convicted for a previous incident, and then eventually got reelected.
MARION BARRY (D), MAYOR OF WASHINGTON, D.C.: We have dreamed the impossible dream and made the impossible possible.
COOPER: What's the best way to come back? Well, there's always the "appeal to God for forgiveness" approach.
JIMMY SWAGGART, TELEVANGELIST: Would you join us in prayer?
COOPER: Back in 1998, Jimmy Swaggart admitted that, yes, he had been with a prostitute.
SWAGGART: I have sinned against you, my lord.
COOPER: Today, Jimmy Swaggart telecasts runs in over 50 countries around the world.
What about Bill Clinton?
WILLIAM J. CLINTON, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I did not have sexual relationships with that woman, Ms. Lewinsky.
COOPER: He lied about that, got impeached.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In violation of his constitutional oath.
COOPER: And none of it seems to have hurt his marketability on the speech circuit.
CLINTON: Thank you very much. COOPER: How did Clinton stage his comeback? Impossible to say, but it certainly helped that many Americans thought his accusers were just looking for blood and political gain. These days, it doesn't seem to matter how bad a scandal is. Comebacks are always possible.
Just ask Michael Milken. The one-time junk bond king jailed for securities fraud is now a crusader for cancer research. But how do explain someone like Darryl Strawberry? Despite drug problems and his many scrapes with the law, he's just been hired by the Yankees as a player development instructor. His second act comes because he's gotten a second chance and a third and a fourth and a fifth.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, our guest tonight knows something about second acts and third and fourth acts. Tammy Faye Messner stood by her televangelist husband Jim Bakker during his sex and money scandals. Like Rush Limbaugh, Tammy Faye has struggled with addiction. She was addicted to Ativan, a tranquilizer. She went to the Betty Ford Clinic. Now she's an author and plans to get back into Christian broadcasting.
Now, earlier I spoke with Tammy Faye about Rush, rehab and her own recovery. And I asked her, when she first had Rush had a drug problem, what went through her mind?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TAMMY FAYE MESSNER, FORMER TELEVANGELIST: Well, I felt, for one thing, that he was really going to be hassled by it, as he was. But I knew that the people that really loved Rush, like me and millions of others, would stand by him and absolutely just say, you go get them, man.
COOPER: Were you surprised, though?
MESSNER: Well, I was surprised in one way. But in another way, I wasn't, because I knew he had had that hearing problem. And I was wondering if he wasn't having to take them for that hearing problem that he was having.
COOPER: I want to play a little bit of sound from some of the comments that Rush Limbaugh made today on the radio. And then let's talk about them.
(CROSSTALK)
MESSNER: Oh, good. OK.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP, "THE RUSH LIMBAUGH SHOW")
RUSH LIMBAUGH, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: I thought I was going into a treatment center to be treated for an addiction to opiates, to painkillers. And I was. But it is so much more than that. It is about so much more than that. I tried to treat myself twice for my addiction. I detoxed myself twice and tried to do it by force of will, which is not possible. This is something someone cannot do alone. It is someone -- it is something that requires several things to change in my life.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
COOPER: He talked on the radio, Tammy Faye, about things he had learned about himself in rehab. You've been through rehab. You were addicted to Ativan.
MESSNER: Yes.
COOPER: What did you learn about yourself?
MESSNER: Well, I also learned a lot of things about myself.
And the thing that I learned was knowledge. I had to have some knowledge about what Ativan was and what it did, and that you are not supposed to mix prescription medicines with over-the-counter medicines, which I was doing.
And then what I didn't realize was that prescription medicines, many of them have a build-up. And so, where you'd take one milligram one day, then you'd take another milligram the next day, well, there's still some left in your system. And so, eventually, as the weeks go by, your system demands more to take care of the same problem. What one milligram took care of at one time, now it takes three milligrams to take care of it.
COOPER: Let me ask you, at the time that you became addicted, you had a huge following of viewers and listeners, much like Rush Limbaugh.
MESSNER: Yes.
COOPER: Did you have a sense of letting people down at all?
MESSNER: Well, I think we're born thinking we're always going to let people down. And, yes, I did feel, because I was preaching the gospel of Jesus Christ. And I was preaching that God heals.
And then here I was taking something to help me through a nerve -- through an anxiety problem. So I did feel that way, to some extent, yes. But I was really glad when it was found out and I was able to speak about it and finally get some help that I needed, because I, too, couldn't do it by myself. I had tried to do it by myself. And Rush is absolutely right. You need help.
COOPER: Well, it's interesting that you say that. You felt relieved when people found out. You must have been scared that people were going to find out while you were doing it. But what was the relief?
MESSNER: The relief was that, finally, it was out. The Bible says everything hidden shall be revealed. And, boy, that was the case in my life.
And I was really glad when it was finally out, it wasn't hidden anymore, and people knew. And what I fund out was that it was totally different than I thought. People had great sympathy. People said, go get it taken care of. We're behind you all the way. Don't you dare give up.
And the people are what really helped me make it through those several months that I was coming off Ativan.
COOPER: And I know recovery, people say it just takes -- is a lifelong process. It's not something that it just ends in rehab. Any advice for Rush Limbaugh, for anyone else out there in the coming days and the coming weeks?
MESSNER: Well, I would like to tell Rush he doesn't owe anyone an explanation, that he needs to just get on with being free. Just practice what you have been taught about the medication. And, if you need help, just go ask for it. Don't be afraid to say, hey, I'm having a little bit of a struggle here and I need some help. Or, if you need help in the middle of the night, and you feel like you need one of those pills, go call somebody.
It's like AA. You need to get it like an AA buddy and just go for it.
COOPER: And you can always have a second chance, even a third and fourth chance?
MESSNER: Always a second chance. As long as you are trying, you always can have a second, a third and fourth chance at it.
COOPER: All right, Tammy Faye Messner, appreciate talking to you. Thanks very much.
MESSNER: And I would like to say to Rush, mega dittos.
(LAUGHTER)
COOPER: All right, thanks very much, Tammy Faye.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Tammy Faye Messner.
Up next in "The Current," the little elf that could. Well, he's actually a six-foot-tall elf, the one played by Will Ferrell, that came in No. one at the box office this weekend. We'll talk about that.
Also tonight, she got in trouble for kissing another girl in her high school cafeteria. Did it cost her a spot in the National Honor Society? We'll find out.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, time to check on pop news in tonight's "Current."
The FDA has approved the first chewable birth control pill. However, it will not be available in the shapes of Dino, Fred, Barney and Wilma.
Moving on, rapper 50 Cent has finally made it. He won two American Music Awards last night. However, he still has to win 21 more to catch up with the all-time winner, Alabama. Best of luck, 50.
Will Ferrell has mastered Russell Crowe and command Keanu Reeves. "Elf" is the weekend's top movie, beating the debut of "Master and Commander." "Elf" is also said by some critics to be even funnier than "Matrix Revolutions." Didn't know that.
And the "Harry Potter" books have now sold a quarter-billion copies worldwide. The series' success has encouraged literacy advocates and given new ammunition to critics who say young people have longer attention spans than they're given credit for.
And that's all the time we have in today's bundle of rapid-fire, 15-second pop-culture tidbits.
A follow-up now to a story we brought you just last week. Remember the two girls at a Maryland high school who were suspended after they kissed at a school? It was part of an English project to do something nonconformist. Well, today, we learned the suspension will not affect one of the girls' ability to join the National Honor Society.
Stephanie Haaser joins us from Washington.
So, congratulations, Stephanie.
STEPHANIE HAASER, STUDENT: Thank you.
COOPER: Are you pleased with how everything worked out?
HAASER: Yes, very.
It's more than I really had hoped for. At the end of the meeting of the student council committee, they cast a vote. And it turned out it was in my favor. So I was able to join.
COOPER: I want to read you a statement from your high school principal. And he said this: "It's unacceptable behavior to stand on a table in the school cafeteria to make out for an extended period of time. The kiss was an essential part of the decision to suspend the two students, but it was independent of any issue related to homophobia. I would have made the same decision if it had been a male and a female."
You say this was a protest against homophobia.
HAASER: Yes. COOPER: Do you think that's true, that, if you were kissing a boy, you would have been suspended for two days?
HAASER: I do recognize the fact that we would have been disciplined somehow, that disciplinary actions would naturally follow. But I do question the suspension itself, that we were suspended for two days and thus that I possibly would not be able to join NHS for that. So..
COOPER: You say this was a statement against what you say was homophobia in your school.
HAASER: Yes.
COOPER: Do you think it's had any impact and do you want to continue making these kind of statements?
HAASER: Not in the same fashion in my school, no, certainly not. But I do believe that it's had a very positive effect and will continue to have an effect on our school's environment.
COOPER: How big a problem, really, is it in your high school?
HAASER: I believe that it is considerable, not only in my own high school, but I hear it's a very big problem in today's society, really in our nation and our world, and just the remarks you hear from day to day and the issues that are currently important to many people.
COOPER: But, Stephanie, when you were on the program last week, we got a lot of e-mails, a lot of e-mails in support of you. But, also, a lot of people said, look, this is grandstanding. You stood on a table. You kissed another girl in front of everyone for 15 seconds, and that -- they didn't quite understand what you were trying to prove.
HAASER: Well, that's why I'm thankful for the sort of media attention that this has garnered, in order for me to explain the act to the public.
I believe that the school is a small enough environment for me to explain the message of it. And the statement that was prior to the act, "End homophobia now," I think pretty much summed up why I was doing it.
COOPER: What do you want to do next? You are a junior in high school. Where do you want to go to school?
HAASER: Ideally speaking, I'd attend Brown in college.
COOPER: And, ultimately, do you know what you want to do? Do you want to be president some day?
(LAUGHTER)
HAASER: Well, I'm not really sure. Politics has always sort of interesting to me. I haven't really thought about what I'd run for. COOPER: You know what? That's spoken like a true politician, if ever I've heard it. They never say what they are going to run for.
Stephanie Haaser, it's been interesting to talk to you. Good luck to you.
HAASER: Thank you very much.
COOPER: All right.
New reports of athletes testing positive for steroids. Is it time to overhaul the entire system? We'll take it to "The Nth Degree" tonight.
Plus, coming tomorrow on 360, Martha Stewart back in court and in the spotlight.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Tonight, taking performance enhancement to "The Nth Degree."
CBS Sportsline found out four NFL players have tested positive for THG, a type of steroid that was undetectable until recently. Now, Major League Baseball said last week that about 5 to 7 percent of its tests for steroids come back positive.
So I ask you, what is next, roid-raging chess players? At this rate, it's only a matter of time until some enterprising sports franchise turns the whole stigma of drug use into the hottest new trend, competitive sports where everyone is doped to the gills. Hey, at least it's more fair than when some guys get to use them.
A steroids sports league would guarantee not only new endorsement opportunities, but the ratings would be pumped up. People who'd never watched the Goodwill Games would totally tune in to watching pole vaulters who calves had mutated into the size of my head. You could call it the Good Pill Games. And if everyone was on the juice, it would eliminate issues of gender equality in sports once and for all. Heck, we wouldn't even need gender categories anymore. Administering anabolic steroids through a fire hose would eventually turn our finest athletes into finely toned machines of muscle, tendon and indeterminate genitalia.
Of course, we could avoid athletes taking drugs through tougher testing, public pressure, and by reducing the insane financial incentives for athletes to take the steroids in the first place. But if you think that's likely to happen, maybe you're the one on drugs.
That wraps up our program tonight.
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