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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Iraqi Militants Take Hostages, Threaten To Burn Them Alive; Reaction To Condoleezza Rice's Testimony Today; Sugar Ray Looking For Roadies
Aired April 08, 2004 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Condoleezza Rice under oath. She said, he said, who's telling the whole truth?
The real facts about bin Laden what the administration knew and when they knew it.
New fears that Shiite uprising is spreading. Insurgents threaten to burn hostages alive on TV.
Tough times for radio's tough talker. The FCC hammers Howard Stern. Six stations drop the shock jock.
And "The Power of Forgiveness," one woman forgives sexual abuse when doctor says maybe you shouldn't. When is forgiveness not a good idea?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good evening to you.
Chilling video from Iraq. Japanese citizens, one of them a journalist, blindfolded, held hostage at knifepoint, a new terror tactic by Iraqi insurgents. We'll get to that in a moment.
But first, Condoleezza Rice in Washington in the hot seat before the 9/11 commission, on record, under oath, that's a first. The Q&A, at times intense, lasting almost three hours.
Tonight on 360, extensive coverage. In Washington, Wolf Blitzer, the iron man of news and with the president in Crawford, Texas, our White House Correspondent Suzanne Malveaux.
We begin in Washington. Wolf, a dramatic day of testimony.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Anderson, dramatic it was indeed. The national security adviser had come forward reluctantly but once she did she made her case forcefully and under oath.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
THOMAS KEAN, CHAIRMAN, 9/11 COMMISSION: Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: I do.
BLITZER (voice-over): And with that, Condoleezza Rice delivered a carefully worded 25-minute opening statement with this bottom line.
RICE: There was no silver bullet that could have prevented the 9/11 attacks.
BLITZER: Unlike her former counterterrorism deputy Richard Clarke, she did not formally apologize to the families of the 9/11 victims, some of whom were in the audience.
She strongly defended President Bush's record in the months leading up to 9/11 but acknowledged that longstanding legal barriers preventing the FBI and CIA from communicating with each other were a key problem.
RICE: In hindsight, if anything might have helped stop 9/11 it would have been better information about threats inside the United States.
BLITZER: Changes did not occur until after 9/11. During the occasionally acrimonious questioning she repeatedly denied that she and the president had been negligent in ignoring the al Qaeda terror threat.
Still, she disclosed that the U.S. intelligence community had intercepted communications from al Qaeda suspects during the summer of 2001 that included these words.
RICE: Unbelievable news coming in weeks. Big event. There will be a very, very, very, very big uproar. There will be attacks in the near future. Troubling yes, but they don't tell us when. They don't tell us where. They don't tell us who and they don't tell us how.
BLITZER: Democratic commissioners pressed hardest for her to concede that the president and his administration could and should have done more.
BOB KERREY, 9/11 COMMISSIONER: You said the president was tired of swatting flies. Can you tell me one example where the president swatted a fly when it came to al Qaeda prior to 9/11?
RICE: I think what the president was speaking to...
KERREY: No, no, what fly had he swatted?
RICE: Well, the disruptions abroad was what he was really focusing on when the CIA would go after Abu Zubaydah, go after this guy. That was what he meant.
KERREY: He hadn't swatted. Dr. Rice, we didn't -- we only swatted a fly once on the 20th of August, 1998. We didn't swat any flies afterwards. How the hell could he be tired? BLITZER: She says that the warnings were not specific and that the briefing did not raise the possibility that terrorists would use airplanes as missiles. But what about now?
RICE: I believe that we have really hurt the al Qaeda network. We have not destroyed it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: Meanwhile, the former President Bill Clinton followed Dr. Rice in the hot seat. He spent three and a half hours before the panel this afternoon but it was all behind closed doors. Commissioners later said that he answered all their questions. They also said they learned a great deal from him -- Anderson.
COOPER: We're going to talk to one of the commissioners about that, about what President Clinton talked about behind those closed doors. Wolf Blitzer, thanks very much in Washington.
The White House says President Bush watched the TV coverage at his ranch in Crawford, Texas. White House Correspondent Suzanne Malveaux is there tonight. Suzanne, was the president pleased?
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, yes, he was very pleased. We're told that the president watched all three hours of Rice's testimony at his Crawford ranch and then later he got in his pickup truck and he called her from his cell phone to congratulate her, saying that she had done a great job, that she articulated the administration's position very well.
We expect to see Rice here at the Crawford ranch sometime in the next couple of days. She's actually going to be sharing the Easter holiday with the first family -- Anderson.
COOPER: Suzanne, the White House is now apparently moving to declassify a key document that was discussed today, this August 6 PDB, the presidential daily brief. How soon are they going to be able to do it and is that a done deal?
MALVEAUX: It is not yet a done deal but they are certainly working aggressively to do this and why it's important is this is a document that was focused on today in the testimony.
This was something the president had in his hands one month before the September 11th attacks when he was vacationing at the Crawford ranch. It is about threats from al Qaeda.
Dr. Rice today saying that it really was a summary and it was some sort of historical look at this that it did not necessarily lay out some sort of imminent plan of attack.
Now this is something that commissioners say they want to declassify. They want the public to be able to see the full daily presidential brief. The White House is working on that but it is not clear whether or not they're going to release all portions of it -- Anderson. COOPER: All right, Suzanne Malveaux at Crawford, thanks Suzanne.
We have extensive coverage of today's testimony still ahead. We're going to talk with one member of the 9/11 commission. We're also going to closely compare Dr. Rice's testimony with that of Richard Clarke, what she said versus what she said, a 360 fact check, all that ahead.
A lot of developments elsewhere though. Much of Washington, of course, focused on the past today. The present in Iraq is anything but clear. Five hostages, three of them Japanese citizens, were paraded in front of a camera, you see it here, held at gunpoint and knifepoint.
In Fallujah, meanwhile, the fighting continues to be fierce. Dramatic images, dramatic fighting, these pictures from Fallujah where Sunni insurgents killed a U.S. Marine, another Marine wounded. You see him here when his tank was hit by a grenade. He is all right.
Events on the ground, however, moving fast. A top U.S. commander says Shiite militiamen now have partial or full control over three Iraqi cities, Kut, Najaf, and Kufa. As for the hostages, their fate right now remains uncertain.
CNN Senior International Correspondent Walter Rodgers is in Baghdad.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WALTER RODGERS, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Shown here three Japanese taken hostage. Other video shows them being manhandled and humiliated and threatened with guns and knives, obviously for the benefit of the camera.
The Japanese government has been given three days to pull its troops out of the American-sponsored coalition in Iraq or a shadowy group calling itself the Mujahedeen squadrons threatens to burn the Japanese hostages alive.
In another incident two Israeli Arabs, Palestinian aid workers, were also seized and seven Korean Christian missionaries were also taken hostage by Islamic militants. They were later released. Still, the sudden (unintelligible) of hostage taking of foreigners seems a new tactic.
Sunni insurgents in Fallujah continue to battle U.S. Marines trying to retake control of that city. This U.S. tank was hit at Fallujah, the crew wounded, attesting to the ferocity of the outgunned Arab fighters. Increasingly, the Iraqi people see these Marines as the aggressors accusing them of killing women and children.
LT. GEN. RICARDO SANCHEZ, U.S. ARMY: We do everything possible to protect infrastructure, to protect non-combatants, but that is a fact when you're on a battlefield of this nature in an urban environment.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: That report from Walter Rodgers in Baghdad.
A quick news note for you regarding those three Japanese hostages. Despite today's kidnappings, Japan says its troops will stay in Iraq. There are 1,000 Japanese troops there on a non-combat mission, non-combat mission in Iraq supplying water and repairing roads in the south of the country. Insurgents say they're going to burn the hostages alive if Tokyo does not withdraw.
Well, will the taking of hostages now be a tool for the Iraqi terrorists? We're going to talk about it with Security Analyst Kelly McCann coming up later on, on 360.
In Spain, a disturbing discovery, Spain's interior minister says they have found a video in that apartment building, as you just saw, where suspected terrorists blew themselves up on Saturday.
On the tape three heavily armed men reading a statement giving Spain a deadline to withdraw its troops from Iraq and Afghanistan. Already, of course, Spain's incoming Socialist government has said it will withdraw Spanish soldiers from Iraq by June 30th unless the U.N. takes control.
Right now we are following a number of developing stories for you "Cross Country." Let's take a look.
Jamestown, New Mexico, gasoline refinery explosions, two blasts ripped through a giant industry's facility. Four people were injured, at least three of them with life threatening burns. The cause of the explosion not yet known.
Indianhead, Maryland, preparing for terror, the U.S. military turns RFK Stadium into a makeshift terror target for training purposes. They were simulating terror attacks involving nuclear or biological weapons and are preparing for situations involving massive evacuations, all a drill.
Washington, D.C., an energy firm with too much power? A federal grand jury hands down a six-count indictment against energy giant Reliant and four of its officers accusing them of manipulating California energy prices in June of 2000.
In Rockford, Minnesota, high price hoax. Audrey Seiler, the young woman who has claimed she was abducted sparked a nationwide manhunt. She is back home today. Back in Wisconsin they are still adding up the cost of searching for her. Authorities now estimate the tab at $96,000.
And Washington, D.C., gas guzzles wallets. The government says we can expect to pay a record average price of $1.76 a gallon for gas this summer during the busy driving season. It may get even worse. It's estimated the national price pump may reach, hold on 100 -- $1.80. Did I say 100, $1.80, bad indeed. That's a look at stories for you "Cross Country" tonight.
Pulling the plug on Howard Stern. Clear Channel yanks his show off the air waves. How far will the Janet Jackson nipple ripple go?
Plus more on the testimony of Condoleezza Rice. What did she know about Osama bin Laden and when did she know it? We'll check the facts.
And coming up "The Power of Forgiveness." You're going to meet one woman who forgave sexual abuse and also a doctor who says maybe you shouldn't, all that ahead.
First, let's take a look "Inside the Box" at top stories on tonight's network newscasts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: We're talking about Howard Stern now. He's calling it a witch hunt after the FCC popped a half million dollar fine against the nation's largest radio chain for airing a Stern show regulators called indecent. The radio chain has responded by yanking Stern off the air.
The latest now from Chris Huntington.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Howard Stern's incessant banter about sex often with sound effects has earned him and the radio stations that carry him hundreds of millions of dollars.
HOWARD STERN: Beth said, first of all she said that she was in some pain for me (unintelligible) her too hard.
HUNTINGTON: But the FCC said enough is enough and slapped a $495,000 fine on the nation's largest radio company, Clear Channel Communications, for Stern's remarks about anal sex carried on six clear channel stations in April of last year.
Stern reacted in a statement saying: "This is not a surprise. This is a follow up to the McCarthy type witch hunt of the administration and the activities of this group of presidential appointees in the FCC, led by 'Colin Powell, Jr.' and his band of players. They and other are expressing and imposing their opinions and rights to tell us all who and what we may listen to and watch and how we should think about our lives." Stern has never been shy about lashing out on his program.
STERN: The people who are against us are organized. They have a clear agenda. They're as smart as Nazis.
HUNTINGTON: Clear Channel suspended Stern from its stations in February but dropped him completely after the FCC ruling. CEO John Hogan saying: "Mr. Stern's show has created a great liability for us and that's a risk we're just not willing to take."
FCC Chairman Michael Powell was not in Washington for the ruling but fellow Commissioner Michael Copps said: "Today's decision is a step forward towards imposing meaningful fines. For the first time, the commission assesses a fine against more than a single utterance, rather than counting an entire program as one utterance."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HUNTINGTON: Now, the FCC also singled out Infinity Broadcasting. That's a unit of Viacom that syndicates the Howard Stern show and broadcasts it on 35 stations.
Today's FCC ruling calls for enforcement action against Infinity for the same Stern offense and that could add up to fines of more than $2.8 million. Infinity said it has no plan to stop airing Stern. In fact, Anderson, they've been through this before. They've paid fines before for Infinity. It's pretty clearly a cost of doing business.
COOPER: All right, they're going to stick with him. All right, Chris Huntington thanks.
HUNTINGTON: OK.
COOPER: We are tracking a number of developing stories right now around the globe. Let's take a quick look at the "Up Link."
Paris, France, rail scare over. Train stations reopen and rail traffic is back on track after a terror threat is lifted. French police evacuated thousands of Paris rail passengers when the U.S. warned them of a possible bomb attack. A search of the metro rail line found nothing suspicious.
Afghanistan, provincial capital city falls to powerful warlord militias. Forces loyal to a renegade adviser to Afghan President Hamid Karzai invaded the capital in one of Afghanistan's provinces. The Afghan governments sent in troops to maintain control.
In Moscow, bomber's jail sentence, a Russian court gives 20 years to a Chechen woman who backed out of a plan to blow herself up last July. She was caught with a bomb in her bag as she tried to enter a restaurant in central Moscow. She is suspected of being part of the Chechen gang as two women who blew themselves up at an open air music festival just a week earlier.
The Vatican now, Holy Week observance, Pope John Paul II celebrates mass to commemorate Christ's Last Supper with his Apostles. The Holy Thursday mass marks the start of the four-day Easter celebration.
In Beijing, one butt at a time. This man is on a personal crusade, did you see what he did, on a personal crusade to cut down on China's 350 million smokers. He is literally ripping the cigarette from the mouths of puffers on the streets of Beijing and handing out literature on the dire health consequences of smoking.
No word on how many cigarettes he snuffed out or presumably how many people or how many times he's been smacked in the face for that matter but his mission continues. All right. That's a look at tonight's "Up Link."
Our special series is next, "The Power of Forgiveness," the question is it always really a good idea to forgive? One woman's story of sexual abuse and the impossible choice she has had to make. You won't want to miss it.
Also tonight, hostages held in Iraq. Will this new strategy of terror impact the U.S. coalition?
Also a little later, he said, she said, two very different versions of 9/11. We'll sort out fact from fiction and speak one-on- one with a commission member seeking the truth.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well this week as Christians and Jews around the world celebrate Holy Week and Passover we continue our special series on "The Power of Forgiveness." Tonight the question is forgiveness always the answer? Two very different viewpoints.
In a moment you're going to hear from a therapist who says there is too much pressure to forgive and there are alternatives.
But first a woman sexually abused by her own father and forced to watch him physically abuse her mother. Now after years of anger and heartache she is faced with the question can she forgive?
CNN's Jonathan Freed has her story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARIANNE ROSEN, INCEST SURVIVOR: I deeply hated my father.
JONATHAN FREED, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From about the age of three, Marianne Rosen would dread the sound of her bedroom door opening at night.
ROSEN: You kind of float above and look down and say, well go ahead. Just lie there. The real me will be up here. Don't worry. He's not touching, he's not touching me. He's touching that shell.
FREED: The sexual abuse lasted about eight years until her father died leaving Rosen to carry anger into adulthood. But thanks to a University of Wisconsin study in the early 1990s, Rosen discovered forgiveness and it has empowered her.
ROSEN: How could anyone do that to a beautiful child?
FREED: To turn the page.
ROSEN: It's such an unconditional peaceful full sense of forgiveness that if my father walked into this room right now I would embrace him.
FREED: Suzanne Freedman is the researcher who helped change Rosen's life.
PROF. SUZANNE FREEDMAN, FORGIVENESS RRESEARCHER: We believe that you can forgive but you don't forget. FREED: Using the study's model, Rosen was able to frame her father as a victim when she realized he was likely an abused child himself.
FREEDMAN: The dangers of not forgiving is that their life is being controlled by their injury and they can't move beyond it.
FREED: Her acceptance of the situation is letting Rosen better relate to her own family.
ROSEN: It is forgiving the unforgivable but it has brought me a sense of peace.
FREED: Jonathan Freed, CNN, Madison, Wisconsin.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well there are those who feel forgiveness is not always the answer. Clinical psychologist Dr. Janis Abrahms Spring wrote the book "How can I Forgive you, the Courage to Forgive, the Freedom not to." I asked her if it's always a good thing to strive for forgiveness.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JANIS ABRAHMS SPRING, PH.D., CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: I don't believe that forgiveness is the goal necessarily. I believe that emotional resolution is the goal and restoring of the best self. Genuine forgiveness for me in my very unconventional model is an interpersonal exchange. It asks as much of the offender as it does of the hurt party.
COOPER: If the offender is not willing to make amends, not willing to be apologetic, then you say the person who has been -- had a crime committed against them should not forgive.
SPRING: I'm not saying they shouldn't forgive. They need to do something else and what I've done is I've developed a middle ground, something between the all too warm fuzziness of forgiveness and the all too impenetrable coldness of not forgiving and I call that radical new something acceptance.
COOPER: So, let's talk about how you move to acceptance. You identify three sort of main steps. Let's talk about the first one. See the offender as separate from you. What does that mean?
SPRING: This is a very important step. What happens in the process of acceptance is you learn to separate out the way the person treated you from the way you feel about yourself.
COOPER: The second step to acceptance stop obsessing about the injury and reengage with life, a hard thing to do.
SPRING: Yes. Well, we hear all the time that we must forgive. Forgiveness is good for us. The truth is that that's a distortion of the facts because it makes us believe that forgiving causes good health when, in fact, what makes us feel better is not necessarily forgiving but giving up the grudge, giving up the obsessive preoccupation with the injury and our need to get even.
COOPER: Let's talk about the third step. Know that acceptance does not require reconciliation.
SPRING: It doesn't require reconciliation but it doesn't rule it out either. With acceptance you have to make a thoughtful decision about what kind of relationship is in your best interest. It may be that you decide to stay attached and to accept this person's limitations if you are safe physically.
Let me say, for example, with genuine forgiveness what happens is let's say this father who sexually abused you later on in adult life apologizes. In a way where he really demonstrates to you he understands how he's hurt you. What you may find is as he reaches out to heal you, you not only accept him but that you can forgive him and you are more likely to want him in your life.
COOPER: But it's not essential for acceptance.
SPRING: No, it's not essential.
COOPER: That's fascinating work. Dr. Janis Abrahms Spring, thank you very much.
SPRING: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: We're going to wrap up our series "The Power of Forgiveness" tomorrow by asking the question can you forgive yourself? You're going to meet a woman who wrongly accused a man of rape. She talks about the guilt she says she still faces every day. Can you forgive yourself for past mistakes? Something we can all relate to. That's tomorrow on 360.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): New fear the Shiite uprising is spreading. Insurgents threaten to burn hostages alive on TV.
The real facts about bin Laden, what the administration knew and when they knew it.
360 continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: In the next half hour on 360, extensive coverage of Condoleezza Rice's testimony. What did she know about Osama bin Laden and when? We'll do a fact check.
We'll also talk to a commission member about how bipartisan this investigation really is.
Plus, is taking hostages the new method of terror in Iraq? And if so, how to fight against it. All that ahead.
Let's check our top stories right now in "The Reset." Rice was grilled by the September 11 Commission today. National Security Adviser Rice testified in public under oath, first time. She say was there was quote "no silver bullet that would have prevented the attacks." Rice also said President Bush understood the threat of terrorism on U.S. soil and believed al Qaeda was determined to strike.
In Iraq, a troubling new tactic: Japanese nationals held hostage at gunpoint and knifepoint. Along with this chilling footage a message, withdraw Japanese troops from Iraq within three days or these hostages will be burned alive. The japanese government says no, it won't with 3 draw its humanitarian force and it's demanding the hostages be released.
In Milwaukee a call to end the chaos. During a campaign stop Democratic presidential contender John Kerry issues a challenge to President Bush, urging the commander in chief to make a bold and honest appeal to end the fighting in Iraq.
In Texas: ranch tour. The president opens his property to sporting aficionados and conservation groups. At least one of the groups, the National Rifle Association, has been a major campaign contributor.
In Florida: Cuban rafters case closed. Two migrants found not guilty of assaulting Coast Guard officers during their successful escape to the U.S. They were accused of using a pitchfork-like spear and knife against Coast Guardsmen who intercepted them.
That is a look at tonight's "Reset."
Today's testimony by Condoleezza Rice was at times a direct reply to damning charges made just two weeks ago by former Counterterrorism Chief Richard Clarke. Let's take a look now at some of what she said today, and what he said in the past.
Did former Counterterrorism Chief Richard Clarke ask National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice to brief President Bush on counterterrorism? He said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICHARD CLARKE, FRM COUNTERTERROISM CHIEF: I asked for a series of briefings on the issues in my portfolio, including counterterrorism, and cybersecurity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: She said...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: I have to say, I have to say, Mr. Roman (ph) to my recollection...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're saying he didn't?
RICE: Never asked me to brief the president on counterterrorism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Did the Clinton administration hand over to the bush administration a finalized plan to fight al Qaeda? He said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLARKE: The update to the Delinda (ph) plan that we did in October, November, December of 2000 was handed to the national -- the new National Security Adviser in January of 2001.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: She said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICE: I just want to be very clear on this, because it's been a source of controversy. We were not presented with a plan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Did Richard Clarke warn the Bush administration of the threat posed by sleeper cells in the U.S.? He said yes.
She said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICE: I don't remember the al Qaeda cells as being something that we were told we needed to do something about.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Did the Bush administration understand the importance of terrorism? He said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLARKE: I believe the Bush administration in the first eight months considered terrorism an important issue, but not an urgent issue.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: She said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICE: President Bush understood the threat, and he understood its importance. He made clear to us that he did not want to respond to al Qaeda one attack at a time. He told me he was tired of swatting flies. (END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Richard Clarke apologized to 9/11 victims' families for not preventing the attacks on September 11.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLARKE: And for that failure, I would ask, once all the facts are out, for your understanding and for your forgiveness.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Condoleezza Rice did not.
Well, one of the members of the 9/11 commission is former Illinois Governor James Thompson, a Republican. I asked him if some of the noticeable discrepancies between what Rice and Clarke testified to were irreconcilable?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JAMES THOMPSON (R) 9/11 COMMISSION: Like a jury, the commission's going to have to sit down, all ten of us, and really talk it out. And then we'll make the decision whether any of it really matters to our final conclusions.
COOPER: Today you repeatedly asked Dr. Rice about the administration's response and/or lack of response to the USS Cole. She said it was more of a strategic response, not a tactical one. Did you understand her answer? And if you did can you maybe explain it to me?
THOMPSON: I'm not sure I understood her answer other than her saying that you didn't want to strengthen bin Laden by sending missiles over every time he did something. And if you didn't kill him, making him appear big and better in the Muslim world or in the terrorist world.
COOPER: During his testimony, Senator Mitch McConnell said that he was disappointed in the direction the commission is going. He said it doesn't seem like a bipartisan commission. He said, in fact, it's become a political casualty of the electoral hunting season. Those were his words.
There was a difference in tone between some of the questions you asked and some of the Democratic members of the commission asked. Is this truly a bipartisan commission?
THOMPSON: It is a bipartisan commission. And I don't agree with my friend Mitch on that point. We are striving mightily to be bipartisan. Granted, some of the questions of Dr Rice by some of the Democratic members were sharp questions. But we've all asked sharp questions of witnesses in both public and private. And I think they're all fair questions. And Dr. Rice can take care of herself as I think she amply demonstrated today. COOPER: If it's a bipartisan commission why are Democrats asking, as you describe, sharp questions, or sharper questions than yourself or some of the Republican members of the commission?
THOMPSON: Well, you know, each commissioner has their own individual style.
COOPER: It's just style, it's not politics?
THOMPSON: It's style. It's style. These are lawyers. These are elected officers. They all have their own style. Don't be misled by style. And don't be misled by tone or aggressiveness or passiveness. Listen to the question. Listen to the answer. And we'll work it out.
COOPER: We just received a statement saying that former President Clinton testified today in front of the commission, they met in closed -- he met in closed, private session. How was that testimony?
THOMPSON: President Clinton was as impressive as he has been through his entire political career. He is a master. He's the best natural politician and one of the best original thinkers I've ever met in my entire life.
We had an extraordinary time with former President Clinton today. We were with him for almost four hours this afternoon in a secure facility. He was enormously helpful to the commission, and I think we all very much appreciated his being with us.
COOPER: As you look back on Dr. Rice's testimony today, were you satisfied? Did you hear everything you needed to hear from her?
THOMPSON: I thought she was a strong and accomplished witness. I think she more than held her own. In describing what she did and what the administration's position was on all of these issues.
COOPER: Governor James Thompson. Appreciate you being on the program. Thank you.
THOMPSON: My pleasure.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well now to Iraq where insurgents are using a new tactic: kidnapping. This disturbing video of three Japanese hostages being held at gunpoint aired on Arab television. Two Arab civilians have also been abducted in Iraq. And Britain is searching for a missing national last seen in Nasiriyah. Is this the Iraqi terror tactic of the future?
Joining us from Washington, CNN security analyst Kelly McCann. Kelly good to see you. Is this the tactic? Are we going to see this thing more and more now?
KELLY MCCANN, CNN SECURITY ANALYST: You know, we had intel on this all the way back, Anderson, to January where there was starting to be a growing threat, or at least the warnings of threat of abductions back to January. It is not a typical Iraqi TTP or tactic, technique or procedure and there's some noise about it being maybe a learned situation from outside fighters. So everybody's interested in seeing where this goes.
COOPER: And how do you deal with it? Because it's not like a hostage getting kidnapped in Colombia where there's a kidnapping and ransom situation, I'm assuming. Is that true?
MCCANN: That is true. But some of the things that happened today, for example, may not be related. For instance, the elements of the Korean kidnapping coming in from Jordan are elements of a criminal kidnapping. In other words, a criminally run checkpoint, maybe for money.
Down in the south, it was different with the Japanese journalists and the researcher. That was done by people in black militia gear, which kind of speaks to, perhaps, Sadr's people.
And then again in the north a different set of circumstances. So I don't think we can jump to the conclusion yet that these were all linked.
COOPER: And yet the question is, how do you fight against it? I mean who is really watching after these people? It's not really the military's job. It's not the government's job. These people are there of their own free will.
MCCANN: Unfortunately, some of the contractors, there are really two kinds of contractors in Iraq. There are security contractors who provide security for people like these. And then are contractors that do combat service support, they set up construction outfits and telecommunications. And then there are, of course, aid workers, journalists, NGOs, et cetera.
It's a littered battlefield. And when I was talking to one senior intelligence official today about these incidences, he actually said to me they were just scooped up. They were in the wrong place at the wrong time and scooped up. So, whenever you have a battlefield situation with all these disparate elements, you're going to have some of these things happen.
COOPER: And you've trained for these kind of situations. I can only only imagine what is going through the minds and hearts of these people being held right now. Just got to be horrible
MCCANN: Well initially, of course, there's that whole shock and kind of feeling of surrealism that this can't be happening to them. Totally helpless. Typically, if they've been trained, they'll try to develop some family ties, make them seem to be human, not let themselves be dehumanized by their abductors.
And actually, you know, a lot of these have been taken care of by going to the tribal elders who have cooler heads and cooler heads have prevailed where the elders have said, look, these are not the kind of people we're after. They're not involved in hostilities and then they broker a release. It's a very strange and complex environment, Anderson.
COOPER: Well, I know that worked a lot in Somalia. Let's hope that works here. Kelly McCann, thank you very much.
MCCANN: Thank you.
COOPER: What else did we learn today from Dr. Condoleezza Rice? What did she learn about Osama bin Laden and when did she learn it, before and after entering the White House. We're going to have a fact check on that just ahead.
Also tonight, you've seen how we cover the war in Iraq. Do you ever wonder what they're saying on al Jazeera? An inside behind the scenes of al Jazeera coming up.
And it's not all serious stuff tonight. We're going to tell you about one politician's unique way to get young people to vote for him. Definitely not for the squeamish.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well even after all of today's testimony, the questions still remain, could the 9/11 attacks have been prevented? What did the U.S. officials really know about Osama bin Laden and his al Qaeda network and exactly when did they know it? Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has tonight's 360 fact check.
(BEGIN VIDOETAPE)
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Three years before 9/11, President Clinton uses cruise missiles in retaliation for al Qaeda's bombing of U.S. embassies in East Africa.
GEN. HUGH SHELTON, JOIN CHIEFS CHAIRMAN: This is by no means the first time that bin Laden network has been connected to terrorist attacks.
STARR: Then the attack on the USS Cole in Yemen in October 2000, but no U.S. response. Now, the 9/11 commission struggling to understand what the Bush administration knew about bin Laden, and what it was prepared to do as threat reports spiked in the months before September 11.
RICE: The president had been told by the director of Central Intelligence that it was not going to be a silver bullet to kill bin Laden. That you had to do much more.
STARR: In august 2001, the president was warned in a classified intelligence document that al Qaeda might be planning to hijack airplanes, but no specific information.
Rice revealed that during the summer, the FBI was conducting 70 full field investigations of suspected al Qaeda cells in the U.S. Now, she says, in hindsight, the FBI and CIA failed to communicate about the threats they saw at home and abroad.
(on camera): Here at the Pentagon, there was constant military planning to try and attack Osama bin Laden. But, like today, the intelligence was never good enough to capture or kill him. Barbara Starr, CNN, the Pentagon.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, certainly, as Barbara mentioned, a lot of focus today on that August 2001 document. We heard, as Barbara said, for the first time that months before 9/11 the FBI had 70 ongoing investigations into al Qaeda members here in the U.S. I asked just a short time ago Peter Bergen, CNN terrorism analyst, how significant he thought that information is.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETER BERGEN, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, to me, that's a pretty large number. We don't know what those investigations were exactly, was that investigating a falafal stand, was that investigating somebody like Muhammad Atta, we don't know yet. But that's a pretty large number.
If you go back to the summer of 2001, the very elevated threat environment, the fact that there were 70 ongoing field investigations by the FBI into members of al Qaeda in the United States allegedly, that I think speaks volumes.
And if you ally that to the fact that it appears that the FBI was also investigating the likelihood of hijacking apparently in the United States in the summer of 2001 also, I think these are pretty telling things that come out of this presidential briefing.
COOPER: Richard Clarke has made the point that if high level administration people had held sort of higher level meetings, had attended those meetings and shaken the tree so to speak, more information might have filtered up. Condoleezza Rice today saying the tree was being shaken, but the information wasn't coming up.
BERGEN: Well, there was a big disconnect between something that she said and something the commission said. And this may be cleared up next week when the FBI hearings start. But she said she told the FBI to inform the 56 field offices of the FBI in the summer of 2001 to short of shake the tree. The commission says based on the 1,000 or so interviews there's no no evidence this happened.
Is that a fault with the FBI? Is that a fault with the National Security Council? It's not really clear. Fact is it didn't happen. So I think the hearings next week on Tuesday and Wednesday that look at the FBI's activities are going to be pretty contentious, I think.
COOPER: Commissioner Thomas and Commissioner Kerrey both asked Dr. Rice about the lack of response to the on USS Cole? In hindsight, was it a mistake not to respond directly, tactically right away, or soon after? BERGEN: Well certainly, apparently from detainee interviews, that we now know of, the lack of American response, which was partly a Clinton thing and partly a Bush thing, really kind of felt -- made al Qaeda feel empowered, that they were sort of immune from attack from the United States.
So I think in retrospect, and not even in retrospect, I think at the time it was pretty astonishing that we didn't respond to it, after all, it was an act of war, it was clearly al Qaeda, you didn't need to be Sherlock Holmes to realize this. 17 Americans dead. One of the most advanced destroyers in the U.S. Navy nearly sunk and we did nothing.
COOPER: What surprised you most about Condoleezza Rice's testimony today?
BERGEN: I don't think there was anything earth shattering surprising. I think she did a good job. We learned some news about this presidential briefing. We should have pressed a little bit more perhaps on why this obsession with Iraq after 9/11 when, in fact, there's been no evidence of Iraq being involved in anti-American terrorism for more than a decade.
Also no one asked Condoleezza Rice why it was such a big deal, al Qaeda, bin Laden, did you never talk about it publicly before 9/11.
COOPER: It was fascinating testimony to watch today. Peter Bergen, thanks for talking about it.
BERGEN: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Every Thursday we take a look at a story or an event that's been overkilled. Tonight, government commissions, committees and hearings. Now, we're not saying the 9/11 commission isn't important, far from it. But Washington sure does seem to form a lot of commissions. The question is, do they ever really solve the problems they set out to.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BOB KERREY, (D) 9/11 COMMISSION MEMBER: You said the president was tired of swating flies. Can you tell me one example where the president swatted a fly when it came to al Qaeda prior to 9/11?
RICE: I think what the president was speaking to...
KERREY: No, no, what fly had he swatted?
COOPER (voice-over): Even if commissions don't actually provide answers they've often supplied plenty of controversy. In the '50s the McCarthy hearings were supposed to expose Communists and ended up shaming the nation.
The Warren Commission looked at the Kennedy assassination, and created a conspiracy theory that still will not die.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The American people are looking to this committee as the representative of all the Congress for enlightenment and guidance.
COOPER: The Watergate hearings helped bring down a president and Iran/Contra exposed dirty dealing, but did little to tell us how to stop them.
And those are the commissions we've actually heard of. Washington has had commissions on presidential press conferences, election reform, mental health, postal rates, aviation and safety. Right now, there are commissions on American battle monuments, Artic research and libraries. Though you probably won't see those on TV.
We don't doubt the intentions of the people who work hard to form commissions to try and find answers. The bureaucratic wrangling and partisan politics often interfere. So what's the cure for commission overkill? Perhaps somebody ought to form a commission to figure it out.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, do you ever wonder what they're saying on al Jazeera about the U.S. and Iraq? Coming up a first look at a new film that takes you behind the scenes.
Also tonight, on a far lighter note, Sugar Ray is looking for some help on the road. Do you have what it takes to be a roady? That and other stories in the pop culture "Current." That's all ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: All right, a look at some lighter stories in the pop culture "Current."
The band Sugar Ray is entering into reality show business in Spike TV's "On the Road." Cameras will follow eight contestants as they work on tour. The winner gets a job with the record company. The losers continue working on tour with Sugar Ray.
A West Virginia politician running for secretary of state is trying to register voters with the slogan, "Vote Naked." Ken Heckler says it shows he can speak the language of young people. It also shows he can creep them out in the process, as well, and that's important. A new wave battle is brewing, Robert Smith of the Cure is blasting Morrissey. Smith says Morrissey said some horrible things about him during the 1980s. But he's only decided now to go public with their feud, giving people around the world a chance to ask, who are these people, what is A Morrissey, and why should anyone care?
A school district in Indiana is using Global Positioning System equipment to track its school buses. Officials said the system will track the bus's every move, including its speed and when stop arms are used. Sadly the system will fail to catch Butch, the school bully as he dispenses wedgies to the freshman sitting in the front of the bus. And a new film about TV coverage during the war in Iraq is creating a lot of buzz. It goes behind the scenes the Arab language network Al Jazeera. It's called "The Control Room." We talked with the director, Jehane Noujaim and got an exclusive first look at the film.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wake up, wake up. There is a war in our view. Something is happening. This is the message of Al Jazeera.
JEHANE NOUJAIM, DIR., "THE CONTROL ROOM": In the Middle East, everybody has a set of views of what's going on, and in the U.S. and in the Western world there's a completely other view of what's going on.
DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Al Jazeera has a pattern of playing propaganda over and over and over again.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rumsfeld is saying, parading the footage of the captives is a violation in violation of the Geneva Convention.
What do you call Guantanamo Bay?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It benefits Al Jazeera to play their nationalism, because that's their audience. Just like Fox plays to American patriotism for the exact same reason.
NOUJAIM: I saw a lot of journalists really struggling to try and figure out the truth. And trying to figure out how to report in a way that was not biased.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can't give you any better answer than that. Good try, though.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seems like there's an effort to manage the news, in an unmanageable situation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We say it all the time. No spin. Don't spin it. And we catch ourselves doing it. I catch myself doing it.
NOUJAIM: I think every single journalist that I followed would say that they did have a point of view. That it's very, very difficult to report on a war without having a point of view.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am representing my station but I'm also representing my people.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Your journalists have a position on the war.
NOUJIAM: Are any U.S. journalists objective about this war?
The debate and the discussion that happens after the film is just as important as the film itself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This word objectivity is almost a mirage.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, tough talk. Condoleezza Rice under oath with unwelcome applause. We take that to "The Nth Degree," that just ahead. Plus tomorrow we wrap up our series the power of forgiveness. Can you forgive yourself?
A woman who accused a man of rape who was later cleared, shares the guilt she says she lives with every day.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Taking applause to "The Nth Degree."
Thank you very much. Applause it seems are breaking out all over. On sitcoms you're supposed to laugh, but more and more the jokes end up getting clapped. Don't ask me why. It happens during presidential debates, as well. No matter how many times the moderator says don't, politician supporters say we will. And today in the midst of testimony in front of the 9/11 Commission people couldn't stop clapping. It started when someone asked a question that 9/11 victims' families liked. Then Dr. Rice's supporters felt they should clap, as well. We understand people want to be part of the process and make their presence known. But there's a time and place for everything. Preventing a bipartisan commission from becoming a partisan clapping contest, that's something we should all applaud.
I'm Anderson Cooper thanks for watching. Coming up next "PAULA ZAHN NOW."
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired April 8, 2004 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Condoleezza Rice under oath. She said, he said, who's telling the whole truth?
The real facts about bin Laden what the administration knew and when they knew it.
New fears that Shiite uprising is spreading. Insurgents threaten to burn hostages alive on TV.
Tough times for radio's tough talker. The FCC hammers Howard Stern. Six stations drop the shock jock.
And "The Power of Forgiveness," one woman forgives sexual abuse when doctor says maybe you shouldn't. When is forgiveness not a good idea?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good evening to you.
Chilling video from Iraq. Japanese citizens, one of them a journalist, blindfolded, held hostage at knifepoint, a new terror tactic by Iraqi insurgents. We'll get to that in a moment.
But first, Condoleezza Rice in Washington in the hot seat before the 9/11 commission, on record, under oath, that's a first. The Q&A, at times intense, lasting almost three hours.
Tonight on 360, extensive coverage. In Washington, Wolf Blitzer, the iron man of news and with the president in Crawford, Texas, our White House Correspondent Suzanne Malveaux.
We begin in Washington. Wolf, a dramatic day of testimony.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Anderson, dramatic it was indeed. The national security adviser had come forward reluctantly but once she did she made her case forcefully and under oath.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
THOMAS KEAN, CHAIRMAN, 9/11 COMMISSION: Do you swear or affirm to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: I do.
BLITZER (voice-over): And with that, Condoleezza Rice delivered a carefully worded 25-minute opening statement with this bottom line.
RICE: There was no silver bullet that could have prevented the 9/11 attacks.
BLITZER: Unlike her former counterterrorism deputy Richard Clarke, she did not formally apologize to the families of the 9/11 victims, some of whom were in the audience.
She strongly defended President Bush's record in the months leading up to 9/11 but acknowledged that longstanding legal barriers preventing the FBI and CIA from communicating with each other were a key problem.
RICE: In hindsight, if anything might have helped stop 9/11 it would have been better information about threats inside the United States.
BLITZER: Changes did not occur until after 9/11. During the occasionally acrimonious questioning she repeatedly denied that she and the president had been negligent in ignoring the al Qaeda terror threat.
Still, she disclosed that the U.S. intelligence community had intercepted communications from al Qaeda suspects during the summer of 2001 that included these words.
RICE: Unbelievable news coming in weeks. Big event. There will be a very, very, very, very big uproar. There will be attacks in the near future. Troubling yes, but they don't tell us when. They don't tell us where. They don't tell us who and they don't tell us how.
BLITZER: Democratic commissioners pressed hardest for her to concede that the president and his administration could and should have done more.
BOB KERREY, 9/11 COMMISSIONER: You said the president was tired of swatting flies. Can you tell me one example where the president swatted a fly when it came to al Qaeda prior to 9/11?
RICE: I think what the president was speaking to...
KERREY: No, no, what fly had he swatted?
RICE: Well, the disruptions abroad was what he was really focusing on when the CIA would go after Abu Zubaydah, go after this guy. That was what he meant.
KERREY: He hadn't swatted. Dr. Rice, we didn't -- we only swatted a fly once on the 20th of August, 1998. We didn't swat any flies afterwards. How the hell could he be tired? BLITZER: She says that the warnings were not specific and that the briefing did not raise the possibility that terrorists would use airplanes as missiles. But what about now?
RICE: I believe that we have really hurt the al Qaeda network. We have not destroyed it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BLITZER: Meanwhile, the former President Bill Clinton followed Dr. Rice in the hot seat. He spent three and a half hours before the panel this afternoon but it was all behind closed doors. Commissioners later said that he answered all their questions. They also said they learned a great deal from him -- Anderson.
COOPER: We're going to talk to one of the commissioners about that, about what President Clinton talked about behind those closed doors. Wolf Blitzer, thanks very much in Washington.
The White House says President Bush watched the TV coverage at his ranch in Crawford, Texas. White House Correspondent Suzanne Malveaux is there tonight. Suzanne, was the president pleased?
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, yes, he was very pleased. We're told that the president watched all three hours of Rice's testimony at his Crawford ranch and then later he got in his pickup truck and he called her from his cell phone to congratulate her, saying that she had done a great job, that she articulated the administration's position very well.
We expect to see Rice here at the Crawford ranch sometime in the next couple of days. She's actually going to be sharing the Easter holiday with the first family -- Anderson.
COOPER: Suzanne, the White House is now apparently moving to declassify a key document that was discussed today, this August 6 PDB, the presidential daily brief. How soon are they going to be able to do it and is that a done deal?
MALVEAUX: It is not yet a done deal but they are certainly working aggressively to do this and why it's important is this is a document that was focused on today in the testimony.
This was something the president had in his hands one month before the September 11th attacks when he was vacationing at the Crawford ranch. It is about threats from al Qaeda.
Dr. Rice today saying that it really was a summary and it was some sort of historical look at this that it did not necessarily lay out some sort of imminent plan of attack.
Now this is something that commissioners say they want to declassify. They want the public to be able to see the full daily presidential brief. The White House is working on that but it is not clear whether or not they're going to release all portions of it -- Anderson. COOPER: All right, Suzanne Malveaux at Crawford, thanks Suzanne.
We have extensive coverage of today's testimony still ahead. We're going to talk with one member of the 9/11 commission. We're also going to closely compare Dr. Rice's testimony with that of Richard Clarke, what she said versus what she said, a 360 fact check, all that ahead.
A lot of developments elsewhere though. Much of Washington, of course, focused on the past today. The present in Iraq is anything but clear. Five hostages, three of them Japanese citizens, were paraded in front of a camera, you see it here, held at gunpoint and knifepoint.
In Fallujah, meanwhile, the fighting continues to be fierce. Dramatic images, dramatic fighting, these pictures from Fallujah where Sunni insurgents killed a U.S. Marine, another Marine wounded. You see him here when his tank was hit by a grenade. He is all right.
Events on the ground, however, moving fast. A top U.S. commander says Shiite militiamen now have partial or full control over three Iraqi cities, Kut, Najaf, and Kufa. As for the hostages, their fate right now remains uncertain.
CNN Senior International Correspondent Walter Rodgers is in Baghdad.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
WALTER RODGERS, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Shown here three Japanese taken hostage. Other video shows them being manhandled and humiliated and threatened with guns and knives, obviously for the benefit of the camera.
The Japanese government has been given three days to pull its troops out of the American-sponsored coalition in Iraq or a shadowy group calling itself the Mujahedeen squadrons threatens to burn the Japanese hostages alive.
In another incident two Israeli Arabs, Palestinian aid workers, were also seized and seven Korean Christian missionaries were also taken hostage by Islamic militants. They were later released. Still, the sudden (unintelligible) of hostage taking of foreigners seems a new tactic.
Sunni insurgents in Fallujah continue to battle U.S. Marines trying to retake control of that city. This U.S. tank was hit at Fallujah, the crew wounded, attesting to the ferocity of the outgunned Arab fighters. Increasingly, the Iraqi people see these Marines as the aggressors accusing them of killing women and children.
LT. GEN. RICARDO SANCHEZ, U.S. ARMY: We do everything possible to protect infrastructure, to protect non-combatants, but that is a fact when you're on a battlefield of this nature in an urban environment.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: That report from Walter Rodgers in Baghdad.
A quick news note for you regarding those three Japanese hostages. Despite today's kidnappings, Japan says its troops will stay in Iraq. There are 1,000 Japanese troops there on a non-combat mission, non-combat mission in Iraq supplying water and repairing roads in the south of the country. Insurgents say they're going to burn the hostages alive if Tokyo does not withdraw.
Well, will the taking of hostages now be a tool for the Iraqi terrorists? We're going to talk about it with Security Analyst Kelly McCann coming up later on, on 360.
In Spain, a disturbing discovery, Spain's interior minister says they have found a video in that apartment building, as you just saw, where suspected terrorists blew themselves up on Saturday.
On the tape three heavily armed men reading a statement giving Spain a deadline to withdraw its troops from Iraq and Afghanistan. Already, of course, Spain's incoming Socialist government has said it will withdraw Spanish soldiers from Iraq by June 30th unless the U.N. takes control.
Right now we are following a number of developing stories for you "Cross Country." Let's take a look.
Jamestown, New Mexico, gasoline refinery explosions, two blasts ripped through a giant industry's facility. Four people were injured, at least three of them with life threatening burns. The cause of the explosion not yet known.
Indianhead, Maryland, preparing for terror, the U.S. military turns RFK Stadium into a makeshift terror target for training purposes. They were simulating terror attacks involving nuclear or biological weapons and are preparing for situations involving massive evacuations, all a drill.
Washington, D.C., an energy firm with too much power? A federal grand jury hands down a six-count indictment against energy giant Reliant and four of its officers accusing them of manipulating California energy prices in June of 2000.
In Rockford, Minnesota, high price hoax. Audrey Seiler, the young woman who has claimed she was abducted sparked a nationwide manhunt. She is back home today. Back in Wisconsin they are still adding up the cost of searching for her. Authorities now estimate the tab at $96,000.
And Washington, D.C., gas guzzles wallets. The government says we can expect to pay a record average price of $1.76 a gallon for gas this summer during the busy driving season. It may get even worse. It's estimated the national price pump may reach, hold on 100 -- $1.80. Did I say 100, $1.80, bad indeed. That's a look at stories for you "Cross Country" tonight.
Pulling the plug on Howard Stern. Clear Channel yanks his show off the air waves. How far will the Janet Jackson nipple ripple go?
Plus more on the testimony of Condoleezza Rice. What did she know about Osama bin Laden and when did she know it? We'll check the facts.
And coming up "The Power of Forgiveness." You're going to meet one woman who forgave sexual abuse and also a doctor who says maybe you shouldn't, all that ahead.
First, let's take a look "Inside the Box" at top stories on tonight's network newscasts.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: We're talking about Howard Stern now. He's calling it a witch hunt after the FCC popped a half million dollar fine against the nation's largest radio chain for airing a Stern show regulators called indecent. The radio chain has responded by yanking Stern off the air.
The latest now from Chris Huntington.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHRIS HUNTINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Howard Stern's incessant banter about sex often with sound effects has earned him and the radio stations that carry him hundreds of millions of dollars.
HOWARD STERN: Beth said, first of all she said that she was in some pain for me (unintelligible) her too hard.
HUNTINGTON: But the FCC said enough is enough and slapped a $495,000 fine on the nation's largest radio company, Clear Channel Communications, for Stern's remarks about anal sex carried on six clear channel stations in April of last year.
Stern reacted in a statement saying: "This is not a surprise. This is a follow up to the McCarthy type witch hunt of the administration and the activities of this group of presidential appointees in the FCC, led by 'Colin Powell, Jr.' and his band of players. They and other are expressing and imposing their opinions and rights to tell us all who and what we may listen to and watch and how we should think about our lives." Stern has never been shy about lashing out on his program.
STERN: The people who are against us are organized. They have a clear agenda. They're as smart as Nazis.
HUNTINGTON: Clear Channel suspended Stern from its stations in February but dropped him completely after the FCC ruling. CEO John Hogan saying: "Mr. Stern's show has created a great liability for us and that's a risk we're just not willing to take."
FCC Chairman Michael Powell was not in Washington for the ruling but fellow Commissioner Michael Copps said: "Today's decision is a step forward towards imposing meaningful fines. For the first time, the commission assesses a fine against more than a single utterance, rather than counting an entire program as one utterance."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HUNTINGTON: Now, the FCC also singled out Infinity Broadcasting. That's a unit of Viacom that syndicates the Howard Stern show and broadcasts it on 35 stations.
Today's FCC ruling calls for enforcement action against Infinity for the same Stern offense and that could add up to fines of more than $2.8 million. Infinity said it has no plan to stop airing Stern. In fact, Anderson, they've been through this before. They've paid fines before for Infinity. It's pretty clearly a cost of doing business.
COOPER: All right, they're going to stick with him. All right, Chris Huntington thanks.
HUNTINGTON: OK.
COOPER: We are tracking a number of developing stories right now around the globe. Let's take a quick look at the "Up Link."
Paris, France, rail scare over. Train stations reopen and rail traffic is back on track after a terror threat is lifted. French police evacuated thousands of Paris rail passengers when the U.S. warned them of a possible bomb attack. A search of the metro rail line found nothing suspicious.
Afghanistan, provincial capital city falls to powerful warlord militias. Forces loyal to a renegade adviser to Afghan President Hamid Karzai invaded the capital in one of Afghanistan's provinces. The Afghan governments sent in troops to maintain control.
In Moscow, bomber's jail sentence, a Russian court gives 20 years to a Chechen woman who backed out of a plan to blow herself up last July. She was caught with a bomb in her bag as she tried to enter a restaurant in central Moscow. She is suspected of being part of the Chechen gang as two women who blew themselves up at an open air music festival just a week earlier.
The Vatican now, Holy Week observance, Pope John Paul II celebrates mass to commemorate Christ's Last Supper with his Apostles. The Holy Thursday mass marks the start of the four-day Easter celebration.
In Beijing, one butt at a time. This man is on a personal crusade, did you see what he did, on a personal crusade to cut down on China's 350 million smokers. He is literally ripping the cigarette from the mouths of puffers on the streets of Beijing and handing out literature on the dire health consequences of smoking.
No word on how many cigarettes he snuffed out or presumably how many people or how many times he's been smacked in the face for that matter but his mission continues. All right. That's a look at tonight's "Up Link."
Our special series is next, "The Power of Forgiveness," the question is it always really a good idea to forgive? One woman's story of sexual abuse and the impossible choice she has had to make. You won't want to miss it.
Also tonight, hostages held in Iraq. Will this new strategy of terror impact the U.S. coalition?
Also a little later, he said, she said, two very different versions of 9/11. We'll sort out fact from fiction and speak one-on- one with a commission member seeking the truth.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well this week as Christians and Jews around the world celebrate Holy Week and Passover we continue our special series on "The Power of Forgiveness." Tonight the question is forgiveness always the answer? Two very different viewpoints.
In a moment you're going to hear from a therapist who says there is too much pressure to forgive and there are alternatives.
But first a woman sexually abused by her own father and forced to watch him physically abuse her mother. Now after years of anger and heartache she is faced with the question can she forgive?
CNN's Jonathan Freed has her story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARIANNE ROSEN, INCEST SURVIVOR: I deeply hated my father.
JONATHAN FREED, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): From about the age of three, Marianne Rosen would dread the sound of her bedroom door opening at night.
ROSEN: You kind of float above and look down and say, well go ahead. Just lie there. The real me will be up here. Don't worry. He's not touching, he's not touching me. He's touching that shell.
FREED: The sexual abuse lasted about eight years until her father died leaving Rosen to carry anger into adulthood. But thanks to a University of Wisconsin study in the early 1990s, Rosen discovered forgiveness and it has empowered her.
ROSEN: How could anyone do that to a beautiful child?
FREED: To turn the page.
ROSEN: It's such an unconditional peaceful full sense of forgiveness that if my father walked into this room right now I would embrace him.
FREED: Suzanne Freedman is the researcher who helped change Rosen's life.
PROF. SUZANNE FREEDMAN, FORGIVENESS RRESEARCHER: We believe that you can forgive but you don't forget. FREED: Using the study's model, Rosen was able to frame her father as a victim when she realized he was likely an abused child himself.
FREEDMAN: The dangers of not forgiving is that their life is being controlled by their injury and they can't move beyond it.
FREED: Her acceptance of the situation is letting Rosen better relate to her own family.
ROSEN: It is forgiving the unforgivable but it has brought me a sense of peace.
FREED: Jonathan Freed, CNN, Madison, Wisconsin.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well there are those who feel forgiveness is not always the answer. Clinical psychologist Dr. Janis Abrahms Spring wrote the book "How can I Forgive you, the Courage to Forgive, the Freedom not to." I asked her if it's always a good thing to strive for forgiveness.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JANIS ABRAHMS SPRING, PH.D., CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: I don't believe that forgiveness is the goal necessarily. I believe that emotional resolution is the goal and restoring of the best self. Genuine forgiveness for me in my very unconventional model is an interpersonal exchange. It asks as much of the offender as it does of the hurt party.
COOPER: If the offender is not willing to make amends, not willing to be apologetic, then you say the person who has been -- had a crime committed against them should not forgive.
SPRING: I'm not saying they shouldn't forgive. They need to do something else and what I've done is I've developed a middle ground, something between the all too warm fuzziness of forgiveness and the all too impenetrable coldness of not forgiving and I call that radical new something acceptance.
COOPER: So, let's talk about how you move to acceptance. You identify three sort of main steps. Let's talk about the first one. See the offender as separate from you. What does that mean?
SPRING: This is a very important step. What happens in the process of acceptance is you learn to separate out the way the person treated you from the way you feel about yourself.
COOPER: The second step to acceptance stop obsessing about the injury and reengage with life, a hard thing to do.
SPRING: Yes. Well, we hear all the time that we must forgive. Forgiveness is good for us. The truth is that that's a distortion of the facts because it makes us believe that forgiving causes good health when, in fact, what makes us feel better is not necessarily forgiving but giving up the grudge, giving up the obsessive preoccupation with the injury and our need to get even.
COOPER: Let's talk about the third step. Know that acceptance does not require reconciliation.
SPRING: It doesn't require reconciliation but it doesn't rule it out either. With acceptance you have to make a thoughtful decision about what kind of relationship is in your best interest. It may be that you decide to stay attached and to accept this person's limitations if you are safe physically.
Let me say, for example, with genuine forgiveness what happens is let's say this father who sexually abused you later on in adult life apologizes. In a way where he really demonstrates to you he understands how he's hurt you. What you may find is as he reaches out to heal you, you not only accept him but that you can forgive him and you are more likely to want him in your life.
COOPER: But it's not essential for acceptance.
SPRING: No, it's not essential.
COOPER: That's fascinating work. Dr. Janis Abrahms Spring, thank you very much.
SPRING: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: We're going to wrap up our series "The Power of Forgiveness" tomorrow by asking the question can you forgive yourself? You're going to meet a woman who wrongly accused a man of rape. She talks about the guilt she says she still faces every day. Can you forgive yourself for past mistakes? Something we can all relate to. That's tomorrow on 360.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): New fear the Shiite uprising is spreading. Insurgents threaten to burn hostages alive on TV.
The real facts about bin Laden, what the administration knew and when they knew it.
360 continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: In the next half hour on 360, extensive coverage of Condoleezza Rice's testimony. What did she know about Osama bin Laden and when? We'll do a fact check.
We'll also talk to a commission member about how bipartisan this investigation really is.
Plus, is taking hostages the new method of terror in Iraq? And if so, how to fight against it. All that ahead.
Let's check our top stories right now in "The Reset." Rice was grilled by the September 11 Commission today. National Security Adviser Rice testified in public under oath, first time. She say was there was quote "no silver bullet that would have prevented the attacks." Rice also said President Bush understood the threat of terrorism on U.S. soil and believed al Qaeda was determined to strike.
In Iraq, a troubling new tactic: Japanese nationals held hostage at gunpoint and knifepoint. Along with this chilling footage a message, withdraw Japanese troops from Iraq within three days or these hostages will be burned alive. The japanese government says no, it won't with 3 draw its humanitarian force and it's demanding the hostages be released.
In Milwaukee a call to end the chaos. During a campaign stop Democratic presidential contender John Kerry issues a challenge to President Bush, urging the commander in chief to make a bold and honest appeal to end the fighting in Iraq.
In Texas: ranch tour. The president opens his property to sporting aficionados and conservation groups. At least one of the groups, the National Rifle Association, has been a major campaign contributor.
In Florida: Cuban rafters case closed. Two migrants found not guilty of assaulting Coast Guard officers during their successful escape to the U.S. They were accused of using a pitchfork-like spear and knife against Coast Guardsmen who intercepted them.
That is a look at tonight's "Reset."
Today's testimony by Condoleezza Rice was at times a direct reply to damning charges made just two weeks ago by former Counterterrorism Chief Richard Clarke. Let's take a look now at some of what she said today, and what he said in the past.
Did former Counterterrorism Chief Richard Clarke ask National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice to brief President Bush on counterterrorism? He said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICHARD CLARKE, FRM COUNTERTERROISM CHIEF: I asked for a series of briefings on the issues in my portfolio, including counterterrorism, and cybersecurity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: She said...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: I have to say, I have to say, Mr. Roman (ph) to my recollection...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're saying he didn't?
RICE: Never asked me to brief the president on counterterrorism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Did the Clinton administration hand over to the bush administration a finalized plan to fight al Qaeda? He said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLARKE: The update to the Delinda (ph) plan that we did in October, November, December of 2000 was handed to the national -- the new National Security Adviser in January of 2001.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: She said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICE: I just want to be very clear on this, because it's been a source of controversy. We were not presented with a plan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Did Richard Clarke warn the Bush administration of the threat posed by sleeper cells in the U.S.? He said yes.
She said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICE: I don't remember the al Qaeda cells as being something that we were told we needed to do something about.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Did the Bush administration understand the importance of terrorism? He said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLARKE: I believe the Bush administration in the first eight months considered terrorism an important issue, but not an urgent issue.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: She said...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICE: President Bush understood the threat, and he understood its importance. He made clear to us that he did not want to respond to al Qaeda one attack at a time. He told me he was tired of swatting flies. (END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Richard Clarke apologized to 9/11 victims' families for not preventing the attacks on September 11.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CLARKE: And for that failure, I would ask, once all the facts are out, for your understanding and for your forgiveness.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Condoleezza Rice did not.
Well, one of the members of the 9/11 commission is former Illinois Governor James Thompson, a Republican. I asked him if some of the noticeable discrepancies between what Rice and Clarke testified to were irreconcilable?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JAMES THOMPSON (R) 9/11 COMMISSION: Like a jury, the commission's going to have to sit down, all ten of us, and really talk it out. And then we'll make the decision whether any of it really matters to our final conclusions.
COOPER: Today you repeatedly asked Dr. Rice about the administration's response and/or lack of response to the USS Cole. She said it was more of a strategic response, not a tactical one. Did you understand her answer? And if you did can you maybe explain it to me?
THOMPSON: I'm not sure I understood her answer other than her saying that you didn't want to strengthen bin Laden by sending missiles over every time he did something. And if you didn't kill him, making him appear big and better in the Muslim world or in the terrorist world.
COOPER: During his testimony, Senator Mitch McConnell said that he was disappointed in the direction the commission is going. He said it doesn't seem like a bipartisan commission. He said, in fact, it's become a political casualty of the electoral hunting season. Those were his words.
There was a difference in tone between some of the questions you asked and some of the Democratic members of the commission asked. Is this truly a bipartisan commission?
THOMPSON: It is a bipartisan commission. And I don't agree with my friend Mitch on that point. We are striving mightily to be bipartisan. Granted, some of the questions of Dr Rice by some of the Democratic members were sharp questions. But we've all asked sharp questions of witnesses in both public and private. And I think they're all fair questions. And Dr. Rice can take care of herself as I think she amply demonstrated today. COOPER: If it's a bipartisan commission why are Democrats asking, as you describe, sharp questions, or sharper questions than yourself or some of the Republican members of the commission?
THOMPSON: Well, you know, each commissioner has their own individual style.
COOPER: It's just style, it's not politics?
THOMPSON: It's style. It's style. These are lawyers. These are elected officers. They all have their own style. Don't be misled by style. And don't be misled by tone or aggressiveness or passiveness. Listen to the question. Listen to the answer. And we'll work it out.
COOPER: We just received a statement saying that former President Clinton testified today in front of the commission, they met in closed -- he met in closed, private session. How was that testimony?
THOMPSON: President Clinton was as impressive as he has been through his entire political career. He is a master. He's the best natural politician and one of the best original thinkers I've ever met in my entire life.
We had an extraordinary time with former President Clinton today. We were with him for almost four hours this afternoon in a secure facility. He was enormously helpful to the commission, and I think we all very much appreciated his being with us.
COOPER: As you look back on Dr. Rice's testimony today, were you satisfied? Did you hear everything you needed to hear from her?
THOMPSON: I thought she was a strong and accomplished witness. I think she more than held her own. In describing what she did and what the administration's position was on all of these issues.
COOPER: Governor James Thompson. Appreciate you being on the program. Thank you.
THOMPSON: My pleasure.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well now to Iraq where insurgents are using a new tactic: kidnapping. This disturbing video of three Japanese hostages being held at gunpoint aired on Arab television. Two Arab civilians have also been abducted in Iraq. And Britain is searching for a missing national last seen in Nasiriyah. Is this the Iraqi terror tactic of the future?
Joining us from Washington, CNN security analyst Kelly McCann. Kelly good to see you. Is this the tactic? Are we going to see this thing more and more now?
KELLY MCCANN, CNN SECURITY ANALYST: You know, we had intel on this all the way back, Anderson, to January where there was starting to be a growing threat, or at least the warnings of threat of abductions back to January. It is not a typical Iraqi TTP or tactic, technique or procedure and there's some noise about it being maybe a learned situation from outside fighters. So everybody's interested in seeing where this goes.
COOPER: And how do you deal with it? Because it's not like a hostage getting kidnapped in Colombia where there's a kidnapping and ransom situation, I'm assuming. Is that true?
MCCANN: That is true. But some of the things that happened today, for example, may not be related. For instance, the elements of the Korean kidnapping coming in from Jordan are elements of a criminal kidnapping. In other words, a criminally run checkpoint, maybe for money.
Down in the south, it was different with the Japanese journalists and the researcher. That was done by people in black militia gear, which kind of speaks to, perhaps, Sadr's people.
And then again in the north a different set of circumstances. So I don't think we can jump to the conclusion yet that these were all linked.
COOPER: And yet the question is, how do you fight against it? I mean who is really watching after these people? It's not really the military's job. It's not the government's job. These people are there of their own free will.
MCCANN: Unfortunately, some of the contractors, there are really two kinds of contractors in Iraq. There are security contractors who provide security for people like these. And then are contractors that do combat service support, they set up construction outfits and telecommunications. And then there are, of course, aid workers, journalists, NGOs, et cetera.
It's a littered battlefield. And when I was talking to one senior intelligence official today about these incidences, he actually said to me they were just scooped up. They were in the wrong place at the wrong time and scooped up. So, whenever you have a battlefield situation with all these disparate elements, you're going to have some of these things happen.
COOPER: And you've trained for these kind of situations. I can only only imagine what is going through the minds and hearts of these people being held right now. Just got to be horrible
MCCANN: Well initially, of course, there's that whole shock and kind of feeling of surrealism that this can't be happening to them. Totally helpless. Typically, if they've been trained, they'll try to develop some family ties, make them seem to be human, not let themselves be dehumanized by their abductors.
And actually, you know, a lot of these have been taken care of by going to the tribal elders who have cooler heads and cooler heads have prevailed where the elders have said, look, these are not the kind of people we're after. They're not involved in hostilities and then they broker a release. It's a very strange and complex environment, Anderson.
COOPER: Well, I know that worked a lot in Somalia. Let's hope that works here. Kelly McCann, thank you very much.
MCCANN: Thank you.
COOPER: What else did we learn today from Dr. Condoleezza Rice? What did she learn about Osama bin Laden and when did she learn it, before and after entering the White House. We're going to have a fact check on that just ahead.
Also tonight, you've seen how we cover the war in Iraq. Do you ever wonder what they're saying on al Jazeera? An inside behind the scenes of al Jazeera coming up.
And it's not all serious stuff tonight. We're going to tell you about one politician's unique way to get young people to vote for him. Definitely not for the squeamish.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well even after all of today's testimony, the questions still remain, could the 9/11 attacks have been prevented? What did the U.S. officials really know about Osama bin Laden and his al Qaeda network and exactly when did they know it? Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has tonight's 360 fact check.
(BEGIN VIDOETAPE)
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Three years before 9/11, President Clinton uses cruise missiles in retaliation for al Qaeda's bombing of U.S. embassies in East Africa.
GEN. HUGH SHELTON, JOIN CHIEFS CHAIRMAN: This is by no means the first time that bin Laden network has been connected to terrorist attacks.
STARR: Then the attack on the USS Cole in Yemen in October 2000, but no U.S. response. Now, the 9/11 commission struggling to understand what the Bush administration knew about bin Laden, and what it was prepared to do as threat reports spiked in the months before September 11.
RICE: The president had been told by the director of Central Intelligence that it was not going to be a silver bullet to kill bin Laden. That you had to do much more.
STARR: In august 2001, the president was warned in a classified intelligence document that al Qaeda might be planning to hijack airplanes, but no specific information.
Rice revealed that during the summer, the FBI was conducting 70 full field investigations of suspected al Qaeda cells in the U.S. Now, she says, in hindsight, the FBI and CIA failed to communicate about the threats they saw at home and abroad.
(on camera): Here at the Pentagon, there was constant military planning to try and attack Osama bin Laden. But, like today, the intelligence was never good enough to capture or kill him. Barbara Starr, CNN, the Pentagon.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, certainly, as Barbara mentioned, a lot of focus today on that August 2001 document. We heard, as Barbara said, for the first time that months before 9/11 the FBI had 70 ongoing investigations into al Qaeda members here in the U.S. I asked just a short time ago Peter Bergen, CNN terrorism analyst, how significant he thought that information is.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PETER BERGEN, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, to me, that's a pretty large number. We don't know what those investigations were exactly, was that investigating a falafal stand, was that investigating somebody like Muhammad Atta, we don't know yet. But that's a pretty large number.
If you go back to the summer of 2001, the very elevated threat environment, the fact that there were 70 ongoing field investigations by the FBI into members of al Qaeda in the United States allegedly, that I think speaks volumes.
And if you ally that to the fact that it appears that the FBI was also investigating the likelihood of hijacking apparently in the United States in the summer of 2001 also, I think these are pretty telling things that come out of this presidential briefing.
COOPER: Richard Clarke has made the point that if high level administration people had held sort of higher level meetings, had attended those meetings and shaken the tree so to speak, more information might have filtered up. Condoleezza Rice today saying the tree was being shaken, but the information wasn't coming up.
BERGEN: Well, there was a big disconnect between something that she said and something the commission said. And this may be cleared up next week when the FBI hearings start. But she said she told the FBI to inform the 56 field offices of the FBI in the summer of 2001 to short of shake the tree. The commission says based on the 1,000 or so interviews there's no no evidence this happened.
Is that a fault with the FBI? Is that a fault with the National Security Council? It's not really clear. Fact is it didn't happen. So I think the hearings next week on Tuesday and Wednesday that look at the FBI's activities are going to be pretty contentious, I think.
COOPER: Commissioner Thomas and Commissioner Kerrey both asked Dr. Rice about the lack of response to the on USS Cole? In hindsight, was it a mistake not to respond directly, tactically right away, or soon after? BERGEN: Well certainly, apparently from detainee interviews, that we now know of, the lack of American response, which was partly a Clinton thing and partly a Bush thing, really kind of felt -- made al Qaeda feel empowered, that they were sort of immune from attack from the United States.
So I think in retrospect, and not even in retrospect, I think at the time it was pretty astonishing that we didn't respond to it, after all, it was an act of war, it was clearly al Qaeda, you didn't need to be Sherlock Holmes to realize this. 17 Americans dead. One of the most advanced destroyers in the U.S. Navy nearly sunk and we did nothing.
COOPER: What surprised you most about Condoleezza Rice's testimony today?
BERGEN: I don't think there was anything earth shattering surprising. I think she did a good job. We learned some news about this presidential briefing. We should have pressed a little bit more perhaps on why this obsession with Iraq after 9/11 when, in fact, there's been no evidence of Iraq being involved in anti-American terrorism for more than a decade.
Also no one asked Condoleezza Rice why it was such a big deal, al Qaeda, bin Laden, did you never talk about it publicly before 9/11.
COOPER: It was fascinating testimony to watch today. Peter Bergen, thanks for talking about it.
BERGEN: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Every Thursday we take a look at a story or an event that's been overkilled. Tonight, government commissions, committees and hearings. Now, we're not saying the 9/11 commission isn't important, far from it. But Washington sure does seem to form a lot of commissions. The question is, do they ever really solve the problems they set out to.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BOB KERREY, (D) 9/11 COMMISSION MEMBER: You said the president was tired of swating flies. Can you tell me one example where the president swatted a fly when it came to al Qaeda prior to 9/11?
RICE: I think what the president was speaking to...
KERREY: No, no, what fly had he swatted?
COOPER (voice-over): Even if commissions don't actually provide answers they've often supplied plenty of controversy. In the '50s the McCarthy hearings were supposed to expose Communists and ended up shaming the nation.
The Warren Commission looked at the Kennedy assassination, and created a conspiracy theory that still will not die.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The American people are looking to this committee as the representative of all the Congress for enlightenment and guidance.
COOPER: The Watergate hearings helped bring down a president and Iran/Contra exposed dirty dealing, but did little to tell us how to stop them.
And those are the commissions we've actually heard of. Washington has had commissions on presidential press conferences, election reform, mental health, postal rates, aviation and safety. Right now, there are commissions on American battle monuments, Artic research and libraries. Though you probably won't see those on TV.
We don't doubt the intentions of the people who work hard to form commissions to try and find answers. The bureaucratic wrangling and partisan politics often interfere. So what's the cure for commission overkill? Perhaps somebody ought to form a commission to figure it out.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, do you ever wonder what they're saying on al Jazeera about the U.S. and Iraq? Coming up a first look at a new film that takes you behind the scenes.
Also tonight, on a far lighter note, Sugar Ray is looking for some help on the road. Do you have what it takes to be a roady? That and other stories in the pop culture "Current." That's all ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: All right, a look at some lighter stories in the pop culture "Current."
The band Sugar Ray is entering into reality show business in Spike TV's "On the Road." Cameras will follow eight contestants as they work on tour. The winner gets a job with the record company. The losers continue working on tour with Sugar Ray.
A West Virginia politician running for secretary of state is trying to register voters with the slogan, "Vote Naked." Ken Heckler says it shows he can speak the language of young people. It also shows he can creep them out in the process, as well, and that's important. A new wave battle is brewing, Robert Smith of the Cure is blasting Morrissey. Smith says Morrissey said some horrible things about him during the 1980s. But he's only decided now to go public with their feud, giving people around the world a chance to ask, who are these people, what is A Morrissey, and why should anyone care?
A school district in Indiana is using Global Positioning System equipment to track its school buses. Officials said the system will track the bus's every move, including its speed and when stop arms are used. Sadly the system will fail to catch Butch, the school bully as he dispenses wedgies to the freshman sitting in the front of the bus. And a new film about TV coverage during the war in Iraq is creating a lot of buzz. It goes behind the scenes the Arab language network Al Jazeera. It's called "The Control Room." We talked with the director, Jehane Noujaim and got an exclusive first look at the film.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Wake up, wake up. There is a war in our view. Something is happening. This is the message of Al Jazeera.
JEHANE NOUJAIM, DIR., "THE CONTROL ROOM": In the Middle East, everybody has a set of views of what's going on, and in the U.S. and in the Western world there's a completely other view of what's going on.
DONALD RUMSFELD, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Al Jazeera has a pattern of playing propaganda over and over and over again.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rumsfeld is saying, parading the footage of the captives is a violation in violation of the Geneva Convention.
What do you call Guantanamo Bay?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It benefits Al Jazeera to play their nationalism, because that's their audience. Just like Fox plays to American patriotism for the exact same reason.
NOUJAIM: I saw a lot of journalists really struggling to try and figure out the truth. And trying to figure out how to report in a way that was not biased.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can't give you any better answer than that. Good try, though.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seems like there's an effort to manage the news, in an unmanageable situation.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We say it all the time. No spin. Don't spin it. And we catch ourselves doing it. I catch myself doing it.
NOUJAIM: I think every single journalist that I followed would say that they did have a point of view. That it's very, very difficult to report on a war without having a point of view.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am representing my station but I'm also representing my people.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Your journalists have a position on the war.
NOUJIAM: Are any U.S. journalists objective about this war?
The debate and the discussion that happens after the film is just as important as the film itself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This word objectivity is almost a mirage.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, tough talk. Condoleezza Rice under oath with unwelcome applause. We take that to "The Nth Degree," that just ahead. Plus tomorrow we wrap up our series the power of forgiveness. Can you forgive yourself?
A woman who accused a man of rape who was later cleared, shares the guilt she says she lives with every day.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Taking applause to "The Nth Degree."
Thank you very much. Applause it seems are breaking out all over. On sitcoms you're supposed to laugh, but more and more the jokes end up getting clapped. Don't ask me why. It happens during presidential debates, as well. No matter how many times the moderator says don't, politician supporters say we will. And today in the midst of testimony in front of the 9/11 Commission people couldn't stop clapping. It started when someone asked a question that 9/11 victims' families liked. Then Dr. Rice's supporters felt they should clap, as well. We understand people want to be part of the process and make their presence known. But there's a time and place for everything. Preventing a bipartisan commission from becoming a partisan clapping contest, that's something we should all applaud.
I'm Anderson Cooper thanks for watching. Coming up next "PAULA ZAHN NOW."
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