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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Al Qaeda's Recruiting Secrets; Some Question Timing of Increased Terror Threat Level; Will Truce in Najaf Hold?
Aired May 27, 2004 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening. I'm Anderson Cooper.
Al Qaeda's recruiting secrets, 360 starts right now.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): An American terror operative, how did he go from a California farm to an al Qaeda terror camp?
One day after a major terror alert is announced, some question its timing. Does Bush have American security or votes at heart?
A truce in Najaf, but what message does it send to insurgents? We'll talk to the U.S. general in a standoff with a radical Shiite cleric.
Controversy in the Kobe trial why is the judge calling for new DNA testing?
And his big beef with Atkins but will his low carb lawsuit go to trial? I'll talk to the dieter suing his diet.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from New York this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good evening to you.
Up first tonight new details on an American accused, suspected of aiding al Qaeda, 25-year-old Adam Gadahn is the only American among seven accused of terrorist ties and wanted right now by federal investigators.
CNN's Thelma Gutierrez is in Garden Grove, California with the latest information on the wanted American, in Washington, CNN Homeland Security Correspondent Jeanne Meserve on the question being raised over the timing of the new terror warning, and here in New York CNN's Deborah Feyerick on the London arrest of a one-eyed Muslim cleric with a steel hook for hand suspected of terror ties.
We begin in California. Thelma, what have you learned about Adam Gadahn?
THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, we're learning that Adam Gadahn was a very quiet man, a man who kept to himself. His family described him as a loner. They say that the past two days have been incredibly difficult for them because they cannot believe any of the allegations made against him.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GUTIERREZ (voice-over): Down this dusty dirt road in rural Riverside County, California is the family goat ranch where Adam Yahiye Gadahn grew up. Philip Gadahn says his son was a quiet kid who kept to himself. He said he was shocked to see his son's face on television and surprised to find the FBI at his ranch.
PHILIP GADAHN, FATHER: I really couldn't imagine he would do anything that would get him in this position but I'm not really sure he's done anything.
GUTIERREZ: The FBI believes Gadahn attended an al Qaeda training camp and may have served as an al Qaeda translator, allegations that have devastated his family.
NANCY PEARLMAN, AUNT: I am concerned, of course, very concerned. I know of a nephew that was a wonderful young man caring, loving.
GUTIERREZ: Philip Gadahn says he hasn't heard from his son in two and a half years.
GADAHN: Even when he was keeping in touch with us he'd only send us a card every six months when he was traveling around.
GUTIERREZ: Gadahn's family wonders how this quiet kid who was homeschooled ended up at the center of an FBI terror investigation.
PEARLMAN: He never espoused any kind of belief in terrorism or support of terrorism. I mean I never heard that at all.
GUTIERREZ: In November of 1995, Gadahn embraced Islam. Two years after becoming a Muslim he was arrested for physically attacking the president of the Islamic Society of Orange County. He was never seen in California again by the people at the mosque nor his family.
OMAR GADAHN, BROTHER: He left in 1998 to go there last time, was the last time we saw him was in 1998 and then we talked to him two years ago and he said that, you know, he was -- he was over there. He was, you know, living life and he was -- had a wife and he was ready to have a baby.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GUTIERREZ: Now, Gadahn's family say the last time they talked to him they believe that he was living in Pakistan. They say that he said that he had married an Afghan refugee and that he was about to have a baby but, again, that was about two years ago -- Anderson.
COOPER: A lot of questions still tonight. Thelma Gutierrez thanks.
Gadahn's case, of course, reminds us of another young American who converted to Islam, was accused of fighting against America. I want to give you an update in this 360 flashback.
John Walker Lindh, the so-called Taliban-American, was captured with Taliban forces in Afghanistan December, 2001. Lindh faced multiple charges but in a deal with federal prosecutors he pled guilty to two charges. He's now 23 and serving a 20-year sentence at a federal prison in California.
Later on 360 we'll take a look at what makes, especially an American, a tempting recruit for al Qaeda. I'll talk with terrorism expert Lorenzo Vidino a little later on 360.
Yesterday's terror alert seems to be bringing in new information, even while some are questioning the timing and the handling of the warning.
Here's CNN Homeland Security Correspondent Jeanne Meserve.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Twenty-four hours after it released photographs of seven people with suspected ties to terrorism, the FBI had received over 2,000 tips and it's asking for more. Thursday the attorney general repeated the ominous threat warning.
JOHN ASHCROFT, ATTORNEY GENERAL: It's multiply sourced credible intelligence that's growing -- that's a stream of intelligence that has been corroborated.
MESERVE: But an administration official says the Department of Justice has been taken to task for not coordinating with other agencies involved in counterterrorism. "All parties involved have been asked to ensure the greatest cooperation when announcing threat information," the official said.
Of concern a leak the night before the press conference, which said al Qaeda operatives were in the U.S. actively plotting a strike this summer. Some officials believe it overstated the threat and that it undermined homeland security's relationship with state and local officials who, one official said, were left shrugging their soldiers wondering what to do.
Also worrisome to some, apparently conflicting statements from Ashcroft and Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge.
ASHCROFT: A clear and present danger to America.
TOM RIDGE, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: There's no specific information.
DAVID HEYMAN, CENTER FOR STRATEGIC AND INTL. STUDIES: That sends a mixed message to the public. I think it confuses them and frankly angers them because they don't know what to expect from their government.
(END VIDEOTAPE) MESERVE: An administration official says the president asked Ridge and Ashcroft before Wednesday's press conference if they were in sync. They said yes believing he was referring to the release of the lookout for suspicious persons but, the official says, they were not and are not in agreement on the intelligence assessment.
Meanwhile, a Justice Department official disputes that homeland security was ever out of the loop saying DHS was at the table "every step of the way" -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right, Jeanne Meserve thanks from Washington.
A terror suspect, not on that list of seven most wanted, yet still desperately sought by U.S. authorities is behind bars in London right now. Radical Muslim cleric Abu Hamza al-Masri, that man right there, forced from the pulpit took his message to the streets. He's accused of trying to set up a terror training camp in the United States.
CNN's Deborah Feyerick reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): He has preached radical Islam in the streets of London for years. (AUDIO GAP) is denying links to terrorism but U.S. officials say Abu Hamsa al-Masri is a facilitator helping extremists in Yemen, Afghanistan and the United States.
ASHCROFT: This is a matter of serious concern to us and we believe that justice needs to be done and that's the basis for bringing these charges.
FEYERICK: Prosecutors accuse Abu Hamsa of helping a follower try to set up a terror training camp in rural Oregon, the indictment alleging Abu Hamsa was contacted by the organizer, saying weapons and arms were being stockpiled in the United States. The terror camp was never built. Prosecutors also say Abu Hamsa helped send followers to al Qaeda camps in Afghanistan using some money raised in New York.
RAY KELLY, NYPD COMMISSIONER: We think of him as a freelance consultant to terrorist groups worldwide.
FEYERICK: Abu Hamsa preached radical Islam at the Finsbury Mosque in London. Authorities say it's the same mosque attended by alleged 9/11 conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui and Richard Reed convicted of trying to blow up a plane with a bomb in his sneakers.
Abu Hamsa is also charged with hostage taking for an incident in Yemen six years ago. Four tourists died. The indictment focuses on no recent events.
At an extradition hearing, Abu Hamsa refused to stand, his lawyer telling a British magistrate Abu Hamsa would not agree to being sent to the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My client is fine, thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Has he been questioned yet?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And will he be fighting the extradition whatever happens?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, we will be.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FEYERICK: The attorney general says Abu Hamsa is eligible for the death penalty, something European countries oppose. A government official familiar with the case tells CNN prosecutors fully understand Britain's position. In the past that language has meant U.S. prosecutors would not seek the death penalty -- Anderson.
COOPER: Deborah Feyerick thanks very much.
Abu Hamsa has a diverse resume you might say. A "Fast Fact" now about the man, some of his many experiences. He fought in the Afghan- Soviet War, says he lost his arm and eye after tackling a landmine during that conflict. That's what he says.
He's an engineer by training, has worked as a bouncer at a London nightclub. Abu Hamsa was born in Egypt but married a British woman and gained British citizenship in 1981. That was revoked in 2003.
In Najaf today a troublemaker may be a potential deal maker. Renegade Iraqi cleric Muqtada al-Sadr says he will end a deadly standoff in the holy city under certain conditions.
CNN Baghdad Bureau Chief Jane Arraf reports from Najaf.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JANE ARRAF, CNN BAGHDAD BUREAU CHIEF (voice-over): The U.S. Army's battle with Muqtada al-Sadr's militia in Najaf has threatened the stability of the entire country but it has perhaps been diffused.
The Shia cleric whose militia has waged war for almost two months against U.S. forces has agreed with religious authorities to disband his militia. The move follows increasing military pressure on Sadr, including the arrest of one of his chief deputies.
DAN SENOR, CPA SPOKESMAN: We view this as a very positive step.
ARRAF: Under the plan, militia members in Najaf would give up their weapons. Iraqi police would secure the city. U.S. forces would still have a strong role here. There's been a lot of talk of deals before but U.S. military officials are seeing signs this may be the real thing.
(on camera): This coalition base usually wakes up to the sound of mortar fire but in the past two days there have been no attacks. That's so unusual. Military officials say it could very well be a sign that Muqtada al-Sadr is serious.
(voice-over): Whether his fighters will all comply is another matter.
MAJ. GEN. MARTIN DEMPSEY, U.S. ARMY: One of the things we have to do is either confirm or deny that the militia is doing what he told it to. It's not entirely clear that he controls the militia to the 100th percentile, so we'll see.
ARRAF: As for Sadr, he'll no longer face U.S. threats to kill or capture him. The radical cleric could parlay his support on the street to political power in the new Iraq.
Jane Arraf CNN, Najaf, Iraq.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: A member of the Iraqi Governing Council reportedly trying to negotiate the Najaf peace deal came under attack on the drive back to Baghdad today. Details in this quick news note.
Dr. Salima al-Qajafi (ph) survived the attack but three of her bodyguards and an aide were killed. In September, al-Qajafi replaced another female member of the council killed in an ambush in Baghdad.
A major development in the Scott Peterson case is just one of the stories we're following right now "Cross Country."
Redwood City, California, the jury is set, seven men, five women have been selected to decide the fate of Scott Peterson who's accused of killing his pregnant wife Laci and their unborn child. Six alternates also named, opening statements Tuesday.
Nationwide more people behind bars, the Justice Department says the number of people in prisons rose by almost 41,000 last year to nearly 2.1 million inmates. There were 715 inmates for every 100,000 U.S. residents in 2003, an incarceration rate that is the highest in the world according to a group that promotes alternatives to prison.
California, Arnold's all right, the governor of California Arnold Schwarzenegger's approval rating is running between 65 and 70 percent, according to several polls, which is close to record highs for any governor in the past 25 years.
Also nationwide, ashes to ashes the CDC says smoking rates are down but not enough. In 2002, 22.5 percent of Americans said they were smokers. Now that is down slightly from 2001 but at that rate it isn't likely the federal government will meet its goal of 12 percent by 2010, unless of course our favorite one man anti-smoking machine from China does a U.S. tour.
Let's take a look. That's the guy who rips cigarettes right out of people's mouths just for smoking. We'll use any excuse to show that video again. That's one of our favorites.
That's a look at stories right now "Cross Country." 360 next, he said, she said and a fight over DNA. Kobe Bryant pursues the ex-boyfriend of his accuser. Find out why ahead.
Plus, Atkins attack, a Florida businessman sues blaming the diet for clogged arteries. Is it really all just about sour grapes and publicity? I'll talk to him directly.
And free range chickens, cages banned, the toughest anti-cruelty laws on the books, find out where these feathered friends will forever run free.
First let's take a look at your picks, the most popular stories on cnn.com right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Before he joins the Lakers for a playoff game tonight, Kobe Bryant was trying to score a big legal victory. Charged with rape, Bryant listened for hours today as his defense team and prosecutors clashed in the courtroom.
Adrian Baschuk has the latest from Eagle, Colorado.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ADRIAN BASCHUK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Today's proceedings in Colorado unexpectedly send both sides back to the drawing table, the judge ordering that retests of key DNA evidence can be conducted because both sides remain at odds over whether or not the accuser had sex with multiple partners in the days before and one day after allegedly being raped by Kobe Bryant.
CRAIG SILVERMAN, FMR. DENVER DEP. DISTRICT ATTORNEY: It appears confirmed by the court discussion today that the prosecution got some results from the Colorado Bureau of Investigation that they very much don't like.
BASCHUK: Judge Terry Ruckriegle then addressed a defense motion asking that the alleged victim's AT&T text messaging records be released. Prosecutors argue that they are protected under the Federal Electronic Communications Privacy Act. The judge ruled he will examine the records and conduct a closed door hearing. Victim advocates are concerned this would cross the privacy line.
CYNTHIA STONE, COLORADO COALITION AGAINST SEXUAL ASSAULT: What it did show is that no one's privilege is absolute.
BASCHUK: That rings especially true for Kobe Bryant. The NBA all star has been forced to shuttle back and forth to Eagle while in the midst of the playoffs three times today leaving at 3:15 local time, four hours before tip off.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BASCHUK: Now, as we speak, Kobe Bryant is on his way back to L.A. and expected to make the game. Meanwhile, we just heard publicly for the first time in months from the D.A. Mark Hurlbert. He effectively said that this case will suffer even more delays because one witness has come forward and agreed to DNA testing, he dissented before, but that effectively pushes back any hopes of the judge setting a trial date anytime soon -- Anderson.
COOPER: Adrian Baschuk thanks very much from Eagle.
Rising waters bring a rising casualty toll in the Caribbean. That story tops our look at what's happening right now in the "Up Link."
Worsening situation in the Dominican Republic and Haiti, flooding submerges an entire Haitian town, more than 1,000 people feared dead in that town alone. Hundreds of bodies have been counted, many more yet to be collected, hundreds still missing in both nations and more rain is forecast.
In Moscow, a nuclear deal, the United States and Russia are signing an agreement to keep nukes out of the hands of terrorists. The initiative will collect highly enriched uranium from 20 reactors in 17 countries and take it to reprocessing facilities in Russia where it will be diluted.
In Beirut, gas price protest, several people were killed, many more wounded, when soldiers fired on people demonstrating against rising gas prices, the high cost of living and the government's economic policies.
Vienna, Austria, animal rights law, a sweeping new anti-cruelty law was approved today making it illegal to confine chickens in small cages or bind cattle tightly with ropes. The law also forbids the use of lions and other wild animals in circuses and bans restraining dogs with chains or choke collars.
And that is tonight's "Up Link."
360 next, Atkins attack, one man's crusade over clogged arteries, he is suing the diet for damages. What about personal responsibility? I'll ask him coming up next.
Also tonight, converting to terror, why al Qaeda is recruiting western sympathizers to help carry out its plots.
And a little later, the Bush budget 2006, the president's plan to tighten the belt if he is reelected, a sneak peak at his plan.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it's even gotten back to the farm. America is eating up all things Atkins. The late diet gurus books are best sellers, of course, high protein, low carb food products are lining supermarket shelves. Restaurants are changing their menus all in an effort to melt the pounds away and attract customers.
But Florida businessman Jody Gorren says the Atkins diet is, in reality, unfriendly and almost cost him his life. That's what he says. Now he is filing suit against the empire and Jody Gorren joins us live from Washington to talk about his case. Jody, thanks for being on the show tonight.
JODY GORREN, SUING OVER THE ATKINS DIET: My pleasure.
COOPER: You were on the Atkins Diet for two and a half years during which you say you ate cheese every day and cheesecake at least three times a week. Why were you surprised your cholesterol went up?
GORREN: Well, the issue with the Atkins Diet was not so much that my cholesterol went up but it's the fact that the Atkins empire constantly stated that in the absence of refined carbohydrates eating a great deal of saturated fat would not be a problem and that was a lie. That's why I'm suing them for negligent misrepresentation of the safety of the diet.
COOPER: But now in the book you read it actually said that some people, I think it said some one-third or so people, actually do have some problems with cholesterol and actually gave some remedies for that didn't it?
GORREN: Right. It said you could go on the low saturated fat version of the diet; however, it then went on to say if you're not happy with the low saturated fat version don't bother with it. Go back on the regular Atkins Diet you enjoyed more.
COOPER: Now, wait a minute, Jody, I actually read from that book. That's not what it said. You're actually misquoting it. It actually said that you should actually go back to the regular diet to test your blood fat saturation level and if you have a problem you should go back on the lean diet, isn't that more accurate?
GORREN: That is not accurate as a matter of fact. The issue was that they minimized the risk of the diet by saying specifically if you're not happy eating lean proteins, such as turkey roll and skinless chicken breasts, go back on the regular Atkins Diet you enjoyed more.
COOPER: We obviously disagree about it. I've read it differently.
GORREN: You got to the point where you determined whether or not you want to stick with that regime.
COOPER: All right. I read a different account. You're suing...
GORREN: If you're not happy with it don't go with it.
COOPER: Got it.
GORREN: So, one in three people who go on the diet could be suffering from cardiovascular disease and that's the issue here.
COOPER: Jody, you're suing for $28,000, no punitive damages. You're being assisted by a group that supports vegan diets that's gone after the Atkins Corporation before. Isn't this just really a quest for publicity?
GORREN: Well, it's a quest for knowledge. It's a quest to allow people to make sensible decisions when it comes to their health because...
COOPER: What about personal responsibility? I mean when people hear about your suit that's their first reaction. I mean don't you take some personal responsibility? Your sister apparently passed away of heart disease. Don't you have some...
GORREN: She didn't pass away from heart disease. She had a heart attack and she survived quite well and she happened to have had a cholesterol level which was 100 points higher than mine on the same low fat diet. So, consequently that was not an issue. All of my...
COOPER: But it's what doctors would term a positive family history. I mean I have a positive family history. That's what my doctor terms it and my dad died of heart failure.
GORREN: Well, that's fine but there has to be some underlying factor which is similar and there was none in this case. All the markers that I had showed that I was in good health, I had no problem, no problem with diabetes, no problem with anything. The issue here is that Atkins knew that one out of three people might have a problem with that sensitivity.
COOPER: All right, Jody, we're going to have leave it.
GORREN: Even the studies that -- even the studies...
COOPER: We're going to have to leave it there. We're going to have to leave it there. You made your case. I appreciate you being on the program. Jody Gorren, we'll follow the case. Thanks very much.
Now, the Atkins side of the story, we're joined by Stuart Trager, Medical Director of Atkins Nutritionals, Incorporated. Thanks for being on the program.
STUART TRAGER, ATKINS MEDICAL DIRECTOR: Thank you for having me.
COOPER: You've heard what he said, your response.
TRAGER: Sure. I think what we've heard is a case of sensationalism rather than science. We've seen 27 recent studies come out that show that controlling carbohydrates using the Atkins approach can help people lower their risk factors. It helps them lower their weight and manage their health.
COOPER: But he's saying if, I mean if there was a study, he said one-third of the people may have problems with their cholesterol. Why not put some sort of a warning on it?
TRAGER: Because it's a more complicated issue than that. In fact, although one-third of the people had a slight elevation in LDL cholesterol, we now know that LDL isn't just one type of cholesterol. There are subtypes of LDL cholesterol. There are other risk factors that improved in some of those people so that their triglycerides when people follow Atkins go down dramatically.
COOPER: Now he said the document basically told people well if you're, you know, if the low fat one doesn't work for you go back to the other one.
TRAGER: Sure.
COOPER: I had read a different one. Am I totally wrong here?
TRAGER: No, no, I agree with you 100 percent. I think what he's guilty of is really what the folks at PCRM have done before, this animal rights...
COOPER: PCRM that's the group he's working with.
TRAGER: It's this animal rights activist begging group who like to tell part truths and like to use, pick and choose which part of the truth they let out so that it supports their case.
I think that's a perfect example. We both read the same version where it very clearly says if your cholesterol goes up what you should do is try the low fat version and retest it.
We've been very clear that people who are following Atkins should have their cholesterol levels checked. Everybody should be under the care of a doctor and it's also important to know that when people follow a low fat diet LDL cholesterols can also go up.
COOPER: But the American Heart Association does not recommend high protein diets stating people that stay on the diets face potential health risks. I mean isn't maintaining a healthy lifestyle more important than just losing weight?
TRAGER: Absolutely it is but what's happening for many, many people, tens of millions of people controlling carbohydrates is letting them obtain that healthy lifestyle. It's letting them lower the risk factors, weight, HDL cholesterol is improving. Triglycerides are improving. It's giving people a tool that works for them.
Again, I think we have to look at science, at the science, the independently funded studies whether they're funded by the National Institute of Health, the American Heart Association, good clinical research done in peer reviewed fashion published in major journals are helping people understand that controlling carbohydrates is no longer an approach that can be overlooked.
COOPER: Is this trial ever going to see the light of day do you think?
TRAGER: I think that this is going to be a meritless case and I think we have to recognize that it's got to be about science not sensationalism, clinical research not this kind of headline grabbing anecdotal reporting that people like Mr. Gorren and the PCRM group would like us to believe is a substitute when science doesn't support their case.
COOPER: We're going to leave it there. Stuart Trager, Medical Director for Atkins, thanks very much for telling your side of the story.
TRAGER: Sure.
COOPER: Let's put this latest lawsuit in perspective by looking at how a similar suit turned out.
In 1979, a 73-year-old woman sued Dr. Atkins claiming his diet caused her heart disease. After three hours of deliberations a Manhattan jury ruled Dr. Atkins' book could not be held liable. The $2.5 million suit was dismissed.
Today's "Buzz" is this. Should people be able to sue over diets that don't work? What do you think? Log onto to cnn.com/360. Cast you vote, results at the end of the show.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): One day after a major terror alert is announced some question its timing. Does Bush have American security or votes at heart?
Controversy in the Kobe trial, why is the judge calling for new DNA testing, 360 continues.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Recruiting for terror, al Qaeda targeting young converts to Islam.
First tonight's "Reset."
In Washington, is it GOP belt tightening?
Preliminary Bush administration budget documents warn government agencies to prepare for cutbacks if the president is re-elected. Targeted for cuts, Homeland Security, education, other domestic programs touted by Bush's re-election campaign starting in 2006. Now, the documents were leaked by rival Democrats. For their part the White House says final budget decisions are months away.
In Seattle, Kerry on security. Presumptive Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry says the war in Iraq has weakened security in the U.S. In a speech today, Kerry outlined a four-point plan to overhaul U.S. policy.
In Washington, honoring here rows. Thousands of veterans descended on the National Mall for the dedication much the World War II memorial. The monument was opened to the public last month but will be dedicated in a ceremony on Saturday. That's a quick look at top stories in "The Reset." Adam Gadahn, U.S. citizen, suspected terrorist. He is on the list of seven terror operatives labeled a clear and present danger to the U.S. Gadahn converted to Islam as a teenager. But how exactly did he go from a goat farm in California to an al Qaeda training camp in Afghanistan? His path to radicalism is disturbing but not altogether unheard of among western converts. Lorenzo Vidino is terrorism analyst and deputy director of the Investigative Project, the Washington based think tank.
He joins us now. Lorenzo, thanks for being on the program. What is it that attracts someone like Gadahn or John Walker Lindh, if we can put them in the same category, we don't know that yet, to radical Islam?
LORENZO VIDINO, DEPUTY DIRECTOR, THE INVESTIGATIVE PROJECT: They both were looking in their young years, in their teenage years to some kind of sense of belonging, being part of a community. They were looking for some kind of guidance. Apparently both men were actually lured to Islam by looking online and the Internet. And wanting to know more about Islam.
COOPER: But how sit that they go from wanting to know about Islam, and practicing peacefully, studying with an Ammam to going to a terror camp in Afghanistan?
VIDINO: Apparently they both went to the Middle East or Muslim countries actually. Gadahn went to Pakistan to learn more about Islam. And probably the radicalization process started once in Pakistan or in Yemen In the case of John Walker Lindh.
COOPER: How does that process work, tell us?
VIDINO: Most of the time they go (UNINTELLIGIBLE) and basically wanting to know more about Islam. They go to these places, these Islamic schools in Pakistan, in Afghanistan, in Yemen or other places in the Middle East. And they are immersed in this radical Islam basicly for 24/7. They are very young. And they don't know about Islam per se, so the lies that are fed by the radical preachers sink in very easily with them. And they become radical being immersed in this culture.
COOPER: And they are wanted. They're prized by al Qaeda, because they are American, or Australian, or French, or European, and can blend in more easily. Is that correct?
I mean, it seems like increasingly al Qaeda is going for that.
VIDINO: Oh, yes. They made it very clear. They're prime targets were them, because they speak the languages. They know in the West, they speak English, they speak European languages. They blend in. They cannot be profiled. They don't look Middle Eastern. They're not Middle Easterners, so they're prime targets for al Qaeda. We have evidence of people, converts, European and Australian converts being in leadership position in al Qaeda.
COOPER: You've also written extensively about this. This guy Adam worked for a nonprofit charity, I hadn't heard of, called Charity Without Borders. It also has terrorist ties.
What do you know about the connection?
VIDINO: Well, he apparently worked with this charity in '98 and '99. Two of the individuals that are running the charity were linked to the millennium bombings in Jordan, to the thwarted plan to carry out attacks against American and Jewish targets in Jordan. We don't know what Gadahn exactly did there. But that was linked and the charity was also linked to Holyland Foundation, which is another charity that supported Hamas, that funneled money to Hamas and was designated by the Treasury Department.
COOPER: It's a fascinating topic. And as we said, there are a lot of questions unanswered tonight. We're still be looking into this, trying to find out more about Adam Gadahn. Lorenzo Vidino, thank you very much for being on the program.
VIDINO: Oh, my pleasure.
COOPER: Attorney General John Ashcroft said it isn't his job to worry about second-guessing, that in response to some Democrats who say it's no coincidence that the latest terror threat announcement comes while the Bush administration is trying to handle continuing problems in Iraq. The collective raising of the eyebrow over the timing of the announcement and John Kerry's more measured approach is "Raw Politics."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN ASHCROFT, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: Credible intelligence from multiple sources indicates that al Qaeda plans to attempt an attack on the United States in the next few months.
COOPER (voice-over): Yesterday's not so new, nonspecific terror threat is raising eyebrows of the political kind. Some Democratic critics are wondering aloud if the timing is linked to the blows Bush has been dealt in Iraq, and has all-time low approval rating. After all, six of the seven suspects named have been named before.
DONNA BRAZILE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: There's no question that the attorney general and the administration now have known for over a month, they had credible information that al Qaeda is planning some type of attack.
COOPER: John Kerry has stopped short of accusing the president of playing up the terror threat to help his campaign. But he does suggest Bush is putting public relations over protecting Americans.
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: we deserve a president of the United States who doesn't make Homeland Security a photo opportunity and the rhetoric of a campaign. We deserve a president who makes America safer.
COOPER: When Americans are asked which candidate would better handle terrorism, Bush beats Kerry, but not by as much as he used to. Republicans strongly reject suggestions that the president's team is trying to improve his advantage by warning al Qaeda may be ready to hit America hard.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that's an irresponsible thing to say. I mean, the bottom line is, we do know that there is going to be a serious attempt to go after a high profile event.
COOPER: The threat from al Qaeda is no doubt real, but so is some voters' skepticism. And pre-election America, even the war on terror can be viewed through the lens of "Raw Politics."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well in Najaf, Iraq, after weeks of fighting, a written promise could lead to a deal. Radical Shiite Cleric Muqtada Al Sadr is offering to withdraw his militia in exchange for a pullback of U.S. forces in the holy city. What's not known, what would happen to the radical cleric. I spoke about the proposal with major general Martin Dempsey, the commander of the U.S. Army's 1st Armored Division in Najaf.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Is any part of a deal, as far as you're concerned, have to entail the Muqtada Al Sadr give himself up to coalition authorities?
DEMPSEY: Well, from my perspective, the only, we would call it red line is that the Muqtada militia must disarm and disband. There is another side to this, of course, and that is the status of Muqtada Al Sadr personally. And I think that the Iraqi judicial system, and Iraqi leaders will have to determine that.
COOPER: If some sort of agreement is reached, and the baseline, as you said, is simply the Mehdi army disbanding, or basically stopping operations, isn't there a concern that that will be seen as a victory for Muqtada Al Sadr?
DEMPSEY: If the militia disbands and dissolves, and if Muqtada Al Sadr at some point agrees to subject himself to the secular Iraqi criminal court system, then we have achieved our goal. I mean, the issue at hand here as far as I'm concerned, and as far as we're concerned, is that those with the best ideas, not the most guns, should decide Iraq's future. And so, militias are anathema to that.
COOPER: At this point have you halted all military operations in and around Najaf?
DEMPSEY: No, absolutely not. What we've halted is all sense of operations. To state it another way, we have some intelligence on locations, safe houses, weapons caches, leaders, and what we've made the conscious decision to do is hold those in abeyance. We'll continue to do reconnaissance missions, and we have to, because one of the things Muqtada Sadr has said is that he will disband his militia, and have it leave town. The only way for me to know that because of the nature of a militia, which is to say men in civilian clothes putting down their weapons and leaving the city, the only way I can confirm that is by actually moving around the city and to make that determination myself.
COOPER: Major General Dempsey thank you for being on the program.
DEMPSEY: You're very welcome.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, back here at home a stunning new claim by lawyers for Kobe Bryant. Up next, what they say the DNA tested at the prosecution's own lab may reveal about the case.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Hmm, interesting statistic there. His performance on court is one thing, but it's in the courtroom where Kobe Bryant faces his biggest challenge. Today, Bryant accused of rape, listened as his defense tried to undermine the prosecution's case.
Covering all angles in "Justice Served" tonight, Court TV anchor Lisa Bloom, and from Miami, defense attorney Jayne Weintraub. Thanks for both being on the program.
Jayne, lab tests are being redone to try to determine whether or not the accuser had sex with multiple partners in the days before and one day after allegedly being raped by Kobe Bryant.
Why is this so important for the defense?
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: For two reasons. One it has nothing to do with any moral reason or breaking the rape shield law. It has to do very simply with whether or not she lied to investigators when she said that she did not have sex immediately before or immediately after, within 24 hours, of the alleged incident of rape. But more importantly than that, it brings to bear whether or not the injuries could have been caused by somebody else, if she had internal injuries. The biggest question I think, Anderson, will be the D.A. didn't have the courage to stand up to the sheriff when they arrested without being consulted to begin.
Is this going to be another case of celebrity injustice or are they going to have the courage to dismiss the case if it can't be proved that she lied?
COOPER: Nobody says alleged quite like you do.
Let me turn to Lisa Bloom there.
LISA BLOOM, COURT TV: Assuming a lot of facts that are not yet proved, Anderson. You know, not a shred of evidence has been introduced in a trial yet, not a single witness has testified.
COOPER: Credibility is key.
BLOOM: Credibility is key, but Anderson, we don't have any facts yet. What we have is a defense position that's been taken in court in pretrial hearings. That's it. That's not facts.
COOPER: Jayne, facts -- are there facts?
WEINTRAUB: Number one, I disagree. What we do know is that she already -- the police report is out and we already do know that she's denied having any sexual activity immediately after the rape. We also know from...
BLOOM: That's true.
WEINTRAUB: .... our experience, as rape trial lawyers on both sides of the spectrum, no person who is raped goes and has sex.
BLOOM: And we have no proof that she did have sex. What we have is a defense position, and let me add, that she said to the police immediately after the encounter with lobe that she had consensual sex with her boyfriend three days before. Now if there's some DNA in her related to somebody else, it could have been from that encounter.
COOPER: Can the defense really make a case on what is typical behavior for a rape victim?
WEINTRAUB: Absolutely. And I'm sure, Pamela Mackey, will do just that. She'll get an expert from the rape treatment center, from the best hospital in the country. Pamela Mackey will interview the best doctor, who has testified a thousand times for the prosecution in rape treatment cases. And that witness is going to say it would be highly unlikely, and completely inconsistent with a rape victim's actions to have consensual happy sex within 24 hours of being raped.
COOPER: Lisa, they're going to go against -- go after to the police just like in O.J., basicly, including the motives of police and conduct of the police.
BLOOM: There the defense actually has something. Because the police apparently did not photograph the crime scene. Didn't take the chair into evidence where the encounter allegedly occurred. They apparently did make some missteps, but that's a different issue than this issue about the DNA in this woman.
COOPER: We're going to have to leave it there, Lisa Bloom, Jayne Weintraub, thanks for being on the show.
WEINTRAUB: Thank you.
BLOOM: Thank you.
COOPER: Did you know, two out of every three new studies is just downright annoying?
"360" next our study says new studies are pure "Overkill." We're sick of them.
Also a little later the top dog at the park. Look at this. A team player whose talent is finally unleashed. Get it?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Seems like every day on some news program you hear about a new study. Usually the new study contradicts some old study. I hate to be the one to tell you. But there was a new study released today and we think it's a study in overkill.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A new study is a mixed blessing for women...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A new study suggests the wonder drug...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In what one doctor calls a landmark study...
COOPER (voice-over): The study released today wasn't landmark or ground-breaking or even particularly useful. It was published in "AARP, The Magazine" and showed that two-thirds of divorces in couples over 40 are initiated by the wives. Now that wouldn't surprise you if you were paying attention to another study done in 2000 that showed divorced men are more than twice as likely to kill themselves as married men.
So they better not get a Porsche. Another recent study in the German magazine "Men's Car" shows nearly half the men who drive Porsches are likely to have an affair.
Studying sex is a study favorite. A 2003 study by a condom company showed that Hungarians have the most sex, 150 times a year. The U.S. was 25th, just 118 times a year. So Hungarian women must have great skin, because a Scottish study cited by the "Chicago Tribune" says women who have sex three times a week have fewer wrinkles.
Researchers make meals out of drink and diets. A famous 1998 study by a French scientist shows two to three glasses of wine a day can reduce death rates by all natural causes by 30 percent. And a study shows Atkins dieters lose twice as much weight in six months as low-fat dieters. But another study says you'll be hungry and depressed doing it. That study was done by an M.I.T. researcher who's also pushing her own diet plan.
The bottom line is studies are big business. But for those of us who wake up every morning to another new study, they seem like 100 percent overkill.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: And this important note, a new study shows that 360 viewers, the most intelligent in television. But you already knew that, didn't you?
Time to study what's going on in tonight's current. Let's take a look. Sarah Ferguson is appearing in a new ad campaign. The Duchess of York is selling the abdominal toning belt to help lose weight. We hear the royal family is not happy about it at all. Though we suspect that's because Queen Elizabeth is eyeing an endorsement deal with the Thigh Master. Could happen.
The success of "Shrek 2" is promoting more rumors of a sequel and maybe even a TV series. The show would be about a larger than life ogre. We think it sounds great. We even have a name for it, "The Apprentice."
And don't hold your breath for a "Sex and the City" movie. Scheduling conflicts and salary demands may make it years before the film is made. By then instead of "Sex and the City" it will be called "The Golden Girls."
If more wholesome entertainment is your cup of tea, I thought "The Golden Girls" were pretty wholesome, have we got a story for you. We've uncovered or rather unleashed a major talent from the Minor Leagues. And trust us, his ability to fetch is in a league all its own. CNN's Jeanne Moos introduces us to a golden bat-triever. Sorry.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Down, bat boy, down. Here comes the bat dog. Batting averages aside, there's nothing average about having a dog pick up bats.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pretty cool.
MOOS: This is the second full season that Chase...
UNIDENTIFIED CHILDREN: Chase, Chase, Chase!
MOOS: Has served as bat dog for the Trenton Thunder, the Yankees AA farm team.
Trying to impress George Steinbrenner, huh?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, even Derek Jeter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good boy.
MOOS: Doesn't get his own pool at the stadium to cool off between innings.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Go get the bat. Go get it.
MOOS: You don't have to worry about bike marks on the bats?
RICK BRENNER, GEN. MANAGER, TRENTON THUNDER: Golden retrievers are a very soft-mouthed dog. As a breed, they're used for hunting and retrieving birds. You don't want puncture marks in the birds.
MOOS: Chase lives with general manager Rick Brenner, though a professional dog trainer trained him.
STUMP MERRILL, TRENTON THUNDER MANAGER: We enjoy him in the clubhouse. How he's almost one of us. MOOS: Just like the bat boy, Chase brings water in a basket to the umpires. He only fetches bats in the first inning.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's pretty good at it.
MOOS: Is he?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
MOOS: Better than you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know. We'll see to that.
MOOS: Chase committed no errors though he sometimes moves his mouth to avoid the pine tar players use to grip the bat. He also catches frisbees.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That a boy!
MOOS: And even caters to the press, fetching microphones on cue. The club sells his image on bats and T-shirts. Chase is already a stuffed animal. And they're making a bobblehead of him. What dog wouldn't want to hear...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Play ball!
MOOS: And though he doesn't bite the bats.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A little slobber, maybe.
MOOS: In this game, slobber is a plus. Jeanne Moos, CNN, Trenton, New Jersey.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, all right. Seems like I like to use those words a lot. One of our dedicated viewers, Shannon (ph), isn't shy about telling me so. Coming up we take that to the Nth Degree. First today's buzz. "Should people be able to sue over diets that don't work?" CNN.com/360. Cast your vote there. Results when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Time now for the buzz. Earlier we asked. "Should people be able to sue over diets that don't work?" More than 19,000 of you voted. 9 percent of you said yes, 91 percent of you said no. Not a scientific poll but it is your buzz. Thanks for voting.
Tonight taking statistical analysis to the Nth Degree. It's lovely having viewers hanging on every word, really it is. But Shannon may have gone too far. She sent us this, homemade charts, two of them, detailing the number of times I use the phrase "all right" and the number of times I use the word "well" to begin a sentence on 360 between the 1st of April and the 10th of May. She's got the mean and the median and the mode and all that sort of thing for both, including highest and lowest occurrences. Five is the highest for "all right."
Ten for "well." Well, that's it. Yeah, well. Though in fairness, we found 16 "wells" and 6 "all rights." Where well is concerned in the accompanying letter, Shannon notes that the sooner the word "well" was used in the broadcast, the more often it occurred throughout the show. Shannon says she works the night shift, 7:00 p.m. to 7:00 a.m. So mostly relies on transcripts to keep track of these ticks of mine. Well, all right. Thanks for watching. I'm Anderson Cooper. "PAULA ZAHN NOW" is next.
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired May 27, 2004 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening. I'm Anderson Cooper.
Al Qaeda's recruiting secrets, 360 starts right now.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): An American terror operative, how did he go from a California farm to an al Qaeda terror camp?
One day after a major terror alert is announced, some question its timing. Does Bush have American security or votes at heart?
A truce in Najaf, but what message does it send to insurgents? We'll talk to the U.S. general in a standoff with a radical Shiite cleric.
Controversy in the Kobe trial why is the judge calling for new DNA testing?
And his big beef with Atkins but will his low carb lawsuit go to trial? I'll talk to the dieter suing his diet.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from New York this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good evening to you.
Up first tonight new details on an American accused, suspected of aiding al Qaeda, 25-year-old Adam Gadahn is the only American among seven accused of terrorist ties and wanted right now by federal investigators.
CNN's Thelma Gutierrez is in Garden Grove, California with the latest information on the wanted American, in Washington, CNN Homeland Security Correspondent Jeanne Meserve on the question being raised over the timing of the new terror warning, and here in New York CNN's Deborah Feyerick on the London arrest of a one-eyed Muslim cleric with a steel hook for hand suspected of terror ties.
We begin in California. Thelma, what have you learned about Adam Gadahn?
THELMA GUTIERREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, we're learning that Adam Gadahn was a very quiet man, a man who kept to himself. His family described him as a loner. They say that the past two days have been incredibly difficult for them because they cannot believe any of the allegations made against him.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GUTIERREZ (voice-over): Down this dusty dirt road in rural Riverside County, California is the family goat ranch where Adam Yahiye Gadahn grew up. Philip Gadahn says his son was a quiet kid who kept to himself. He said he was shocked to see his son's face on television and surprised to find the FBI at his ranch.
PHILIP GADAHN, FATHER: I really couldn't imagine he would do anything that would get him in this position but I'm not really sure he's done anything.
GUTIERREZ: The FBI believes Gadahn attended an al Qaeda training camp and may have served as an al Qaeda translator, allegations that have devastated his family.
NANCY PEARLMAN, AUNT: I am concerned, of course, very concerned. I know of a nephew that was a wonderful young man caring, loving.
GUTIERREZ: Philip Gadahn says he hasn't heard from his son in two and a half years.
GADAHN: Even when he was keeping in touch with us he'd only send us a card every six months when he was traveling around.
GUTIERREZ: Gadahn's family wonders how this quiet kid who was homeschooled ended up at the center of an FBI terror investigation.
PEARLMAN: He never espoused any kind of belief in terrorism or support of terrorism. I mean I never heard that at all.
GUTIERREZ: In November of 1995, Gadahn embraced Islam. Two years after becoming a Muslim he was arrested for physically attacking the president of the Islamic Society of Orange County. He was never seen in California again by the people at the mosque nor his family.
OMAR GADAHN, BROTHER: He left in 1998 to go there last time, was the last time we saw him was in 1998 and then we talked to him two years ago and he said that, you know, he was -- he was over there. He was, you know, living life and he was -- had a wife and he was ready to have a baby.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GUTIERREZ: Now, Gadahn's family say the last time they talked to him they believe that he was living in Pakistan. They say that he said that he had married an Afghan refugee and that he was about to have a baby but, again, that was about two years ago -- Anderson.
COOPER: A lot of questions still tonight. Thelma Gutierrez thanks.
Gadahn's case, of course, reminds us of another young American who converted to Islam, was accused of fighting against America. I want to give you an update in this 360 flashback.
John Walker Lindh, the so-called Taliban-American, was captured with Taliban forces in Afghanistan December, 2001. Lindh faced multiple charges but in a deal with federal prosecutors he pled guilty to two charges. He's now 23 and serving a 20-year sentence at a federal prison in California.
Later on 360 we'll take a look at what makes, especially an American, a tempting recruit for al Qaeda. I'll talk with terrorism expert Lorenzo Vidino a little later on 360.
Yesterday's terror alert seems to be bringing in new information, even while some are questioning the timing and the handling of the warning.
Here's CNN Homeland Security Correspondent Jeanne Meserve.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN HOMELAND SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Twenty-four hours after it released photographs of seven people with suspected ties to terrorism, the FBI had received over 2,000 tips and it's asking for more. Thursday the attorney general repeated the ominous threat warning.
JOHN ASHCROFT, ATTORNEY GENERAL: It's multiply sourced credible intelligence that's growing -- that's a stream of intelligence that has been corroborated.
MESERVE: But an administration official says the Department of Justice has been taken to task for not coordinating with other agencies involved in counterterrorism. "All parties involved have been asked to ensure the greatest cooperation when announcing threat information," the official said.
Of concern a leak the night before the press conference, which said al Qaeda operatives were in the U.S. actively plotting a strike this summer. Some officials believe it overstated the threat and that it undermined homeland security's relationship with state and local officials who, one official said, were left shrugging their soldiers wondering what to do.
Also worrisome to some, apparently conflicting statements from Ashcroft and Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge.
ASHCROFT: A clear and present danger to America.
TOM RIDGE, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: There's no specific information.
DAVID HEYMAN, CENTER FOR STRATEGIC AND INTL. STUDIES: That sends a mixed message to the public. I think it confuses them and frankly angers them because they don't know what to expect from their government.
(END VIDEOTAPE) MESERVE: An administration official says the president asked Ridge and Ashcroft before Wednesday's press conference if they were in sync. They said yes believing he was referring to the release of the lookout for suspicious persons but, the official says, they were not and are not in agreement on the intelligence assessment.
Meanwhile, a Justice Department official disputes that homeland security was ever out of the loop saying DHS was at the table "every step of the way" -- Anderson.
COOPER: All right, Jeanne Meserve thanks from Washington.
A terror suspect, not on that list of seven most wanted, yet still desperately sought by U.S. authorities is behind bars in London right now. Radical Muslim cleric Abu Hamza al-Masri, that man right there, forced from the pulpit took his message to the streets. He's accused of trying to set up a terror training camp in the United States.
CNN's Deborah Feyerick reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): He has preached radical Islam in the streets of London for years. (AUDIO GAP) is denying links to terrorism but U.S. officials say Abu Hamsa al-Masri is a facilitator helping extremists in Yemen, Afghanistan and the United States.
ASHCROFT: This is a matter of serious concern to us and we believe that justice needs to be done and that's the basis for bringing these charges.
FEYERICK: Prosecutors accuse Abu Hamsa of helping a follower try to set up a terror training camp in rural Oregon, the indictment alleging Abu Hamsa was contacted by the organizer, saying weapons and arms were being stockpiled in the United States. The terror camp was never built. Prosecutors also say Abu Hamsa helped send followers to al Qaeda camps in Afghanistan using some money raised in New York.
RAY KELLY, NYPD COMMISSIONER: We think of him as a freelance consultant to terrorist groups worldwide.
FEYERICK: Abu Hamsa preached radical Islam at the Finsbury Mosque in London. Authorities say it's the same mosque attended by alleged 9/11 conspirator Zacarias Moussaoui and Richard Reed convicted of trying to blow up a plane with a bomb in his sneakers.
Abu Hamsa is also charged with hostage taking for an incident in Yemen six years ago. Four tourists died. The indictment focuses on no recent events.
At an extradition hearing, Abu Hamsa refused to stand, his lawyer telling a British magistrate Abu Hamsa would not agree to being sent to the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My client is fine, thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Has he been questioned yet?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And will he be fighting the extradition whatever happens?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, we will be.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FEYERICK: The attorney general says Abu Hamsa is eligible for the death penalty, something European countries oppose. A government official familiar with the case tells CNN prosecutors fully understand Britain's position. In the past that language has meant U.S. prosecutors would not seek the death penalty -- Anderson.
COOPER: Deborah Feyerick thanks very much.
Abu Hamsa has a diverse resume you might say. A "Fast Fact" now about the man, some of his many experiences. He fought in the Afghan- Soviet War, says he lost his arm and eye after tackling a landmine during that conflict. That's what he says.
He's an engineer by training, has worked as a bouncer at a London nightclub. Abu Hamsa was born in Egypt but married a British woman and gained British citizenship in 1981. That was revoked in 2003.
In Najaf today a troublemaker may be a potential deal maker. Renegade Iraqi cleric Muqtada al-Sadr says he will end a deadly standoff in the holy city under certain conditions.
CNN Baghdad Bureau Chief Jane Arraf reports from Najaf.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JANE ARRAF, CNN BAGHDAD BUREAU CHIEF (voice-over): The U.S. Army's battle with Muqtada al-Sadr's militia in Najaf has threatened the stability of the entire country but it has perhaps been diffused.
The Shia cleric whose militia has waged war for almost two months against U.S. forces has agreed with religious authorities to disband his militia. The move follows increasing military pressure on Sadr, including the arrest of one of his chief deputies.
DAN SENOR, CPA SPOKESMAN: We view this as a very positive step.
ARRAF: Under the plan, militia members in Najaf would give up their weapons. Iraqi police would secure the city. U.S. forces would still have a strong role here. There's been a lot of talk of deals before but U.S. military officials are seeing signs this may be the real thing.
(on camera): This coalition base usually wakes up to the sound of mortar fire but in the past two days there have been no attacks. That's so unusual. Military officials say it could very well be a sign that Muqtada al-Sadr is serious.
(voice-over): Whether his fighters will all comply is another matter.
MAJ. GEN. MARTIN DEMPSEY, U.S. ARMY: One of the things we have to do is either confirm or deny that the militia is doing what he told it to. It's not entirely clear that he controls the militia to the 100th percentile, so we'll see.
ARRAF: As for Sadr, he'll no longer face U.S. threats to kill or capture him. The radical cleric could parlay his support on the street to political power in the new Iraq.
Jane Arraf CNN, Najaf, Iraq.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: A member of the Iraqi Governing Council reportedly trying to negotiate the Najaf peace deal came under attack on the drive back to Baghdad today. Details in this quick news note.
Dr. Salima al-Qajafi (ph) survived the attack but three of her bodyguards and an aide were killed. In September, al-Qajafi replaced another female member of the council killed in an ambush in Baghdad.
A major development in the Scott Peterson case is just one of the stories we're following right now "Cross Country."
Redwood City, California, the jury is set, seven men, five women have been selected to decide the fate of Scott Peterson who's accused of killing his pregnant wife Laci and their unborn child. Six alternates also named, opening statements Tuesday.
Nationwide more people behind bars, the Justice Department says the number of people in prisons rose by almost 41,000 last year to nearly 2.1 million inmates. There were 715 inmates for every 100,000 U.S. residents in 2003, an incarceration rate that is the highest in the world according to a group that promotes alternatives to prison.
California, Arnold's all right, the governor of California Arnold Schwarzenegger's approval rating is running between 65 and 70 percent, according to several polls, which is close to record highs for any governor in the past 25 years.
Also nationwide, ashes to ashes the CDC says smoking rates are down but not enough. In 2002, 22.5 percent of Americans said they were smokers. Now that is down slightly from 2001 but at that rate it isn't likely the federal government will meet its goal of 12 percent by 2010, unless of course our favorite one man anti-smoking machine from China does a U.S. tour.
Let's take a look. That's the guy who rips cigarettes right out of people's mouths just for smoking. We'll use any excuse to show that video again. That's one of our favorites.
That's a look at stories right now "Cross Country." 360 next, he said, she said and a fight over DNA. Kobe Bryant pursues the ex-boyfriend of his accuser. Find out why ahead.
Plus, Atkins attack, a Florida businessman sues blaming the diet for clogged arteries. Is it really all just about sour grapes and publicity? I'll talk to him directly.
And free range chickens, cages banned, the toughest anti-cruelty laws on the books, find out where these feathered friends will forever run free.
First let's take a look at your picks, the most popular stories on cnn.com right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Before he joins the Lakers for a playoff game tonight, Kobe Bryant was trying to score a big legal victory. Charged with rape, Bryant listened for hours today as his defense team and prosecutors clashed in the courtroom.
Adrian Baschuk has the latest from Eagle, Colorado.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ADRIAN BASCHUK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Today's proceedings in Colorado unexpectedly send both sides back to the drawing table, the judge ordering that retests of key DNA evidence can be conducted because both sides remain at odds over whether or not the accuser had sex with multiple partners in the days before and one day after allegedly being raped by Kobe Bryant.
CRAIG SILVERMAN, FMR. DENVER DEP. DISTRICT ATTORNEY: It appears confirmed by the court discussion today that the prosecution got some results from the Colorado Bureau of Investigation that they very much don't like.
BASCHUK: Judge Terry Ruckriegle then addressed a defense motion asking that the alleged victim's AT&T text messaging records be released. Prosecutors argue that they are protected under the Federal Electronic Communications Privacy Act. The judge ruled he will examine the records and conduct a closed door hearing. Victim advocates are concerned this would cross the privacy line.
CYNTHIA STONE, COLORADO COALITION AGAINST SEXUAL ASSAULT: What it did show is that no one's privilege is absolute.
BASCHUK: That rings especially true for Kobe Bryant. The NBA all star has been forced to shuttle back and forth to Eagle while in the midst of the playoffs three times today leaving at 3:15 local time, four hours before tip off.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BASCHUK: Now, as we speak, Kobe Bryant is on his way back to L.A. and expected to make the game. Meanwhile, we just heard publicly for the first time in months from the D.A. Mark Hurlbert. He effectively said that this case will suffer even more delays because one witness has come forward and agreed to DNA testing, he dissented before, but that effectively pushes back any hopes of the judge setting a trial date anytime soon -- Anderson.
COOPER: Adrian Baschuk thanks very much from Eagle.
Rising waters bring a rising casualty toll in the Caribbean. That story tops our look at what's happening right now in the "Up Link."
Worsening situation in the Dominican Republic and Haiti, flooding submerges an entire Haitian town, more than 1,000 people feared dead in that town alone. Hundreds of bodies have been counted, many more yet to be collected, hundreds still missing in both nations and more rain is forecast.
In Moscow, a nuclear deal, the United States and Russia are signing an agreement to keep nukes out of the hands of terrorists. The initiative will collect highly enriched uranium from 20 reactors in 17 countries and take it to reprocessing facilities in Russia where it will be diluted.
In Beirut, gas price protest, several people were killed, many more wounded, when soldiers fired on people demonstrating against rising gas prices, the high cost of living and the government's economic policies.
Vienna, Austria, animal rights law, a sweeping new anti-cruelty law was approved today making it illegal to confine chickens in small cages or bind cattle tightly with ropes. The law also forbids the use of lions and other wild animals in circuses and bans restraining dogs with chains or choke collars.
And that is tonight's "Up Link."
360 next, Atkins attack, one man's crusade over clogged arteries, he is suing the diet for damages. What about personal responsibility? I'll ask him coming up next.
Also tonight, converting to terror, why al Qaeda is recruiting western sympathizers to help carry out its plots.
And a little later, the Bush budget 2006, the president's plan to tighten the belt if he is reelected, a sneak peak at his plan.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it's even gotten back to the farm. America is eating up all things Atkins. The late diet gurus books are best sellers, of course, high protein, low carb food products are lining supermarket shelves. Restaurants are changing their menus all in an effort to melt the pounds away and attract customers.
But Florida businessman Jody Gorren says the Atkins diet is, in reality, unfriendly and almost cost him his life. That's what he says. Now he is filing suit against the empire and Jody Gorren joins us live from Washington to talk about his case. Jody, thanks for being on the show tonight.
JODY GORREN, SUING OVER THE ATKINS DIET: My pleasure.
COOPER: You were on the Atkins Diet for two and a half years during which you say you ate cheese every day and cheesecake at least three times a week. Why were you surprised your cholesterol went up?
GORREN: Well, the issue with the Atkins Diet was not so much that my cholesterol went up but it's the fact that the Atkins empire constantly stated that in the absence of refined carbohydrates eating a great deal of saturated fat would not be a problem and that was a lie. That's why I'm suing them for negligent misrepresentation of the safety of the diet.
COOPER: But now in the book you read it actually said that some people, I think it said some one-third or so people, actually do have some problems with cholesterol and actually gave some remedies for that didn't it?
GORREN: Right. It said you could go on the low saturated fat version of the diet; however, it then went on to say if you're not happy with the low saturated fat version don't bother with it. Go back on the regular Atkins Diet you enjoyed more.
COOPER: Now, wait a minute, Jody, I actually read from that book. That's not what it said. You're actually misquoting it. It actually said that you should actually go back to the regular diet to test your blood fat saturation level and if you have a problem you should go back on the lean diet, isn't that more accurate?
GORREN: That is not accurate as a matter of fact. The issue was that they minimized the risk of the diet by saying specifically if you're not happy eating lean proteins, such as turkey roll and skinless chicken breasts, go back on the regular Atkins Diet you enjoyed more.
COOPER: We obviously disagree about it. I've read it differently.
GORREN: You got to the point where you determined whether or not you want to stick with that regime.
COOPER: All right. I read a different account. You're suing...
GORREN: If you're not happy with it don't go with it.
COOPER: Got it.
GORREN: So, one in three people who go on the diet could be suffering from cardiovascular disease and that's the issue here.
COOPER: Jody, you're suing for $28,000, no punitive damages. You're being assisted by a group that supports vegan diets that's gone after the Atkins Corporation before. Isn't this just really a quest for publicity?
GORREN: Well, it's a quest for knowledge. It's a quest to allow people to make sensible decisions when it comes to their health because...
COOPER: What about personal responsibility? I mean when people hear about your suit that's their first reaction. I mean don't you take some personal responsibility? Your sister apparently passed away of heart disease. Don't you have some...
GORREN: She didn't pass away from heart disease. She had a heart attack and she survived quite well and she happened to have had a cholesterol level which was 100 points higher than mine on the same low fat diet. So, consequently that was not an issue. All of my...
COOPER: But it's what doctors would term a positive family history. I mean I have a positive family history. That's what my doctor terms it and my dad died of heart failure.
GORREN: Well, that's fine but there has to be some underlying factor which is similar and there was none in this case. All the markers that I had showed that I was in good health, I had no problem, no problem with diabetes, no problem with anything. The issue here is that Atkins knew that one out of three people might have a problem with that sensitivity.
COOPER: All right, Jody, we're going to have leave it.
GORREN: Even the studies that -- even the studies...
COOPER: We're going to have to leave it there. We're going to have to leave it there. You made your case. I appreciate you being on the program. Jody Gorren, we'll follow the case. Thanks very much.
Now, the Atkins side of the story, we're joined by Stuart Trager, Medical Director of Atkins Nutritionals, Incorporated. Thanks for being on the program.
STUART TRAGER, ATKINS MEDICAL DIRECTOR: Thank you for having me.
COOPER: You've heard what he said, your response.
TRAGER: Sure. I think what we've heard is a case of sensationalism rather than science. We've seen 27 recent studies come out that show that controlling carbohydrates using the Atkins approach can help people lower their risk factors. It helps them lower their weight and manage their health.
COOPER: But he's saying if, I mean if there was a study, he said one-third of the people may have problems with their cholesterol. Why not put some sort of a warning on it?
TRAGER: Because it's a more complicated issue than that. In fact, although one-third of the people had a slight elevation in LDL cholesterol, we now know that LDL isn't just one type of cholesterol. There are subtypes of LDL cholesterol. There are other risk factors that improved in some of those people so that their triglycerides when people follow Atkins go down dramatically.
COOPER: Now he said the document basically told people well if you're, you know, if the low fat one doesn't work for you go back to the other one.
TRAGER: Sure.
COOPER: I had read a different one. Am I totally wrong here?
TRAGER: No, no, I agree with you 100 percent. I think what he's guilty of is really what the folks at PCRM have done before, this animal rights...
COOPER: PCRM that's the group he's working with.
TRAGER: It's this animal rights activist begging group who like to tell part truths and like to use, pick and choose which part of the truth they let out so that it supports their case.
I think that's a perfect example. We both read the same version where it very clearly says if your cholesterol goes up what you should do is try the low fat version and retest it.
We've been very clear that people who are following Atkins should have their cholesterol levels checked. Everybody should be under the care of a doctor and it's also important to know that when people follow a low fat diet LDL cholesterols can also go up.
COOPER: But the American Heart Association does not recommend high protein diets stating people that stay on the diets face potential health risks. I mean isn't maintaining a healthy lifestyle more important than just losing weight?
TRAGER: Absolutely it is but what's happening for many, many people, tens of millions of people controlling carbohydrates is letting them obtain that healthy lifestyle. It's letting them lower the risk factors, weight, HDL cholesterol is improving. Triglycerides are improving. It's giving people a tool that works for them.
Again, I think we have to look at science, at the science, the independently funded studies whether they're funded by the National Institute of Health, the American Heart Association, good clinical research done in peer reviewed fashion published in major journals are helping people understand that controlling carbohydrates is no longer an approach that can be overlooked.
COOPER: Is this trial ever going to see the light of day do you think?
TRAGER: I think that this is going to be a meritless case and I think we have to recognize that it's got to be about science not sensationalism, clinical research not this kind of headline grabbing anecdotal reporting that people like Mr. Gorren and the PCRM group would like us to believe is a substitute when science doesn't support their case.
COOPER: We're going to leave it there. Stuart Trager, Medical Director for Atkins, thanks very much for telling your side of the story.
TRAGER: Sure.
COOPER: Let's put this latest lawsuit in perspective by looking at how a similar suit turned out.
In 1979, a 73-year-old woman sued Dr. Atkins claiming his diet caused her heart disease. After three hours of deliberations a Manhattan jury ruled Dr. Atkins' book could not be held liable. The $2.5 million suit was dismissed.
Today's "Buzz" is this. Should people be able to sue over diets that don't work? What do you think? Log onto to cnn.com/360. Cast you vote, results at the end of the show.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): One day after a major terror alert is announced some question its timing. Does Bush have American security or votes at heart?
Controversy in the Kobe trial, why is the judge calling for new DNA testing, 360 continues.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Recruiting for terror, al Qaeda targeting young converts to Islam.
First tonight's "Reset."
In Washington, is it GOP belt tightening?
Preliminary Bush administration budget documents warn government agencies to prepare for cutbacks if the president is re-elected. Targeted for cuts, Homeland Security, education, other domestic programs touted by Bush's re-election campaign starting in 2006. Now, the documents were leaked by rival Democrats. For their part the White House says final budget decisions are months away.
In Seattle, Kerry on security. Presumptive Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry says the war in Iraq has weakened security in the U.S. In a speech today, Kerry outlined a four-point plan to overhaul U.S. policy.
In Washington, honoring here rows. Thousands of veterans descended on the National Mall for the dedication much the World War II memorial. The monument was opened to the public last month but will be dedicated in a ceremony on Saturday. That's a quick look at top stories in "The Reset." Adam Gadahn, U.S. citizen, suspected terrorist. He is on the list of seven terror operatives labeled a clear and present danger to the U.S. Gadahn converted to Islam as a teenager. But how exactly did he go from a goat farm in California to an al Qaeda training camp in Afghanistan? His path to radicalism is disturbing but not altogether unheard of among western converts. Lorenzo Vidino is terrorism analyst and deputy director of the Investigative Project, the Washington based think tank.
He joins us now. Lorenzo, thanks for being on the program. What is it that attracts someone like Gadahn or John Walker Lindh, if we can put them in the same category, we don't know that yet, to radical Islam?
LORENZO VIDINO, DEPUTY DIRECTOR, THE INVESTIGATIVE PROJECT: They both were looking in their young years, in their teenage years to some kind of sense of belonging, being part of a community. They were looking for some kind of guidance. Apparently both men were actually lured to Islam by looking online and the Internet. And wanting to know more about Islam.
COOPER: But how sit that they go from wanting to know about Islam, and practicing peacefully, studying with an Ammam to going to a terror camp in Afghanistan?
VIDINO: Apparently they both went to the Middle East or Muslim countries actually. Gadahn went to Pakistan to learn more about Islam. And probably the radicalization process started once in Pakistan or in Yemen In the case of John Walker Lindh.
COOPER: How does that process work, tell us?
VIDINO: Most of the time they go (UNINTELLIGIBLE) and basically wanting to know more about Islam. They go to these places, these Islamic schools in Pakistan, in Afghanistan, in Yemen or other places in the Middle East. And they are immersed in this radical Islam basicly for 24/7. They are very young. And they don't know about Islam per se, so the lies that are fed by the radical preachers sink in very easily with them. And they become radical being immersed in this culture.
COOPER: And they are wanted. They're prized by al Qaeda, because they are American, or Australian, or French, or European, and can blend in more easily. Is that correct?
I mean, it seems like increasingly al Qaeda is going for that.
VIDINO: Oh, yes. They made it very clear. They're prime targets were them, because they speak the languages. They know in the West, they speak English, they speak European languages. They blend in. They cannot be profiled. They don't look Middle Eastern. They're not Middle Easterners, so they're prime targets for al Qaeda. We have evidence of people, converts, European and Australian converts being in leadership position in al Qaeda.
COOPER: You've also written extensively about this. This guy Adam worked for a nonprofit charity, I hadn't heard of, called Charity Without Borders. It also has terrorist ties.
What do you know about the connection?
VIDINO: Well, he apparently worked with this charity in '98 and '99. Two of the individuals that are running the charity were linked to the millennium bombings in Jordan, to the thwarted plan to carry out attacks against American and Jewish targets in Jordan. We don't know what Gadahn exactly did there. But that was linked and the charity was also linked to Holyland Foundation, which is another charity that supported Hamas, that funneled money to Hamas and was designated by the Treasury Department.
COOPER: It's a fascinating topic. And as we said, there are a lot of questions unanswered tonight. We're still be looking into this, trying to find out more about Adam Gadahn. Lorenzo Vidino, thank you very much for being on the program.
VIDINO: Oh, my pleasure.
COOPER: Attorney General John Ashcroft said it isn't his job to worry about second-guessing, that in response to some Democrats who say it's no coincidence that the latest terror threat announcement comes while the Bush administration is trying to handle continuing problems in Iraq. The collective raising of the eyebrow over the timing of the announcement and John Kerry's more measured approach is "Raw Politics."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN ASHCROFT, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: Credible intelligence from multiple sources indicates that al Qaeda plans to attempt an attack on the United States in the next few months.
COOPER (voice-over): Yesterday's not so new, nonspecific terror threat is raising eyebrows of the political kind. Some Democratic critics are wondering aloud if the timing is linked to the blows Bush has been dealt in Iraq, and has all-time low approval rating. After all, six of the seven suspects named have been named before.
DONNA BRAZILE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: There's no question that the attorney general and the administration now have known for over a month, they had credible information that al Qaeda is planning some type of attack.
COOPER: John Kerry has stopped short of accusing the president of playing up the terror threat to help his campaign. But he does suggest Bush is putting public relations over protecting Americans.
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: we deserve a president of the United States who doesn't make Homeland Security a photo opportunity and the rhetoric of a campaign. We deserve a president who makes America safer.
COOPER: When Americans are asked which candidate would better handle terrorism, Bush beats Kerry, but not by as much as he used to. Republicans strongly reject suggestions that the president's team is trying to improve his advantage by warning al Qaeda may be ready to hit America hard.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that's an irresponsible thing to say. I mean, the bottom line is, we do know that there is going to be a serious attempt to go after a high profile event.
COOPER: The threat from al Qaeda is no doubt real, but so is some voters' skepticism. And pre-election America, even the war on terror can be viewed through the lens of "Raw Politics."
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well in Najaf, Iraq, after weeks of fighting, a written promise could lead to a deal. Radical Shiite Cleric Muqtada Al Sadr is offering to withdraw his militia in exchange for a pullback of U.S. forces in the holy city. What's not known, what would happen to the radical cleric. I spoke about the proposal with major general Martin Dempsey, the commander of the U.S. Army's 1st Armored Division in Najaf.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Is any part of a deal, as far as you're concerned, have to entail the Muqtada Al Sadr give himself up to coalition authorities?
DEMPSEY: Well, from my perspective, the only, we would call it red line is that the Muqtada militia must disarm and disband. There is another side to this, of course, and that is the status of Muqtada Al Sadr personally. And I think that the Iraqi judicial system, and Iraqi leaders will have to determine that.
COOPER: If some sort of agreement is reached, and the baseline, as you said, is simply the Mehdi army disbanding, or basically stopping operations, isn't there a concern that that will be seen as a victory for Muqtada Al Sadr?
DEMPSEY: If the militia disbands and dissolves, and if Muqtada Al Sadr at some point agrees to subject himself to the secular Iraqi criminal court system, then we have achieved our goal. I mean, the issue at hand here as far as I'm concerned, and as far as we're concerned, is that those with the best ideas, not the most guns, should decide Iraq's future. And so, militias are anathema to that.
COOPER: At this point have you halted all military operations in and around Najaf?
DEMPSEY: No, absolutely not. What we've halted is all sense of operations. To state it another way, we have some intelligence on locations, safe houses, weapons caches, leaders, and what we've made the conscious decision to do is hold those in abeyance. We'll continue to do reconnaissance missions, and we have to, because one of the things Muqtada Sadr has said is that he will disband his militia, and have it leave town. The only way for me to know that because of the nature of a militia, which is to say men in civilian clothes putting down their weapons and leaving the city, the only way I can confirm that is by actually moving around the city and to make that determination myself.
COOPER: Major General Dempsey thank you for being on the program.
DEMPSEY: You're very welcome.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, back here at home a stunning new claim by lawyers for Kobe Bryant. Up next, what they say the DNA tested at the prosecution's own lab may reveal about the case.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Hmm, interesting statistic there. His performance on court is one thing, but it's in the courtroom where Kobe Bryant faces his biggest challenge. Today, Bryant accused of rape, listened as his defense tried to undermine the prosecution's case.
Covering all angles in "Justice Served" tonight, Court TV anchor Lisa Bloom, and from Miami, defense attorney Jayne Weintraub. Thanks for both being on the program.
Jayne, lab tests are being redone to try to determine whether or not the accuser had sex with multiple partners in the days before and one day after allegedly being raped by Kobe Bryant.
Why is this so important for the defense?
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: For two reasons. One it has nothing to do with any moral reason or breaking the rape shield law. It has to do very simply with whether or not she lied to investigators when she said that she did not have sex immediately before or immediately after, within 24 hours, of the alleged incident of rape. But more importantly than that, it brings to bear whether or not the injuries could have been caused by somebody else, if she had internal injuries. The biggest question I think, Anderson, will be the D.A. didn't have the courage to stand up to the sheriff when they arrested without being consulted to begin.
Is this going to be another case of celebrity injustice or are they going to have the courage to dismiss the case if it can't be proved that she lied?
COOPER: Nobody says alleged quite like you do.
Let me turn to Lisa Bloom there.
LISA BLOOM, COURT TV: Assuming a lot of facts that are not yet proved, Anderson. You know, not a shred of evidence has been introduced in a trial yet, not a single witness has testified.
COOPER: Credibility is key.
BLOOM: Credibility is key, but Anderson, we don't have any facts yet. What we have is a defense position that's been taken in court in pretrial hearings. That's it. That's not facts.
COOPER: Jayne, facts -- are there facts?
WEINTRAUB: Number one, I disagree. What we do know is that she already -- the police report is out and we already do know that she's denied having any sexual activity immediately after the rape. We also know from...
BLOOM: That's true.
WEINTRAUB: .... our experience, as rape trial lawyers on both sides of the spectrum, no person who is raped goes and has sex.
BLOOM: And we have no proof that she did have sex. What we have is a defense position, and let me add, that she said to the police immediately after the encounter with lobe that she had consensual sex with her boyfriend three days before. Now if there's some DNA in her related to somebody else, it could have been from that encounter.
COOPER: Can the defense really make a case on what is typical behavior for a rape victim?
WEINTRAUB: Absolutely. And I'm sure, Pamela Mackey, will do just that. She'll get an expert from the rape treatment center, from the best hospital in the country. Pamela Mackey will interview the best doctor, who has testified a thousand times for the prosecution in rape treatment cases. And that witness is going to say it would be highly unlikely, and completely inconsistent with a rape victim's actions to have consensual happy sex within 24 hours of being raped.
COOPER: Lisa, they're going to go against -- go after to the police just like in O.J., basicly, including the motives of police and conduct of the police.
BLOOM: There the defense actually has something. Because the police apparently did not photograph the crime scene. Didn't take the chair into evidence where the encounter allegedly occurred. They apparently did make some missteps, but that's a different issue than this issue about the DNA in this woman.
COOPER: We're going to have to leave it there, Lisa Bloom, Jayne Weintraub, thanks for being on the show.
WEINTRAUB: Thank you.
BLOOM: Thank you.
COOPER: Did you know, two out of every three new studies is just downright annoying?
"360" next our study says new studies are pure "Overkill." We're sick of them.
Also a little later the top dog at the park. Look at this. A team player whose talent is finally unleashed. Get it?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Seems like every day on some news program you hear about a new study. Usually the new study contradicts some old study. I hate to be the one to tell you. But there was a new study released today and we think it's a study in overkill.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A new study is a mixed blessing for women...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A new study suggests the wonder drug...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In what one doctor calls a landmark study...
COOPER (voice-over): The study released today wasn't landmark or ground-breaking or even particularly useful. It was published in "AARP, The Magazine" and showed that two-thirds of divorces in couples over 40 are initiated by the wives. Now that wouldn't surprise you if you were paying attention to another study done in 2000 that showed divorced men are more than twice as likely to kill themselves as married men.
So they better not get a Porsche. Another recent study in the German magazine "Men's Car" shows nearly half the men who drive Porsches are likely to have an affair.
Studying sex is a study favorite. A 2003 study by a condom company showed that Hungarians have the most sex, 150 times a year. The U.S. was 25th, just 118 times a year. So Hungarian women must have great skin, because a Scottish study cited by the "Chicago Tribune" says women who have sex three times a week have fewer wrinkles.
Researchers make meals out of drink and diets. A famous 1998 study by a French scientist shows two to three glasses of wine a day can reduce death rates by all natural causes by 30 percent. And a study shows Atkins dieters lose twice as much weight in six months as low-fat dieters. But another study says you'll be hungry and depressed doing it. That study was done by an M.I.T. researcher who's also pushing her own diet plan.
The bottom line is studies are big business. But for those of us who wake up every morning to another new study, they seem like 100 percent overkill.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: And this important note, a new study shows that 360 viewers, the most intelligent in television. But you already knew that, didn't you?
Time to study what's going on in tonight's current. Let's take a look. Sarah Ferguson is appearing in a new ad campaign. The Duchess of York is selling the abdominal toning belt to help lose weight. We hear the royal family is not happy about it at all. Though we suspect that's because Queen Elizabeth is eyeing an endorsement deal with the Thigh Master. Could happen.
The success of "Shrek 2" is promoting more rumors of a sequel and maybe even a TV series. The show would be about a larger than life ogre. We think it sounds great. We even have a name for it, "The Apprentice."
And don't hold your breath for a "Sex and the City" movie. Scheduling conflicts and salary demands may make it years before the film is made. By then instead of "Sex and the City" it will be called "The Golden Girls."
If more wholesome entertainment is your cup of tea, I thought "The Golden Girls" were pretty wholesome, have we got a story for you. We've uncovered or rather unleashed a major talent from the Minor Leagues. And trust us, his ability to fetch is in a league all its own. CNN's Jeanne Moos introduces us to a golden bat-triever. Sorry.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Down, bat boy, down. Here comes the bat dog. Batting averages aside, there's nothing average about having a dog pick up bats.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pretty cool.
MOOS: This is the second full season that Chase...
UNIDENTIFIED CHILDREN: Chase, Chase, Chase!
MOOS: Has served as bat dog for the Trenton Thunder, the Yankees AA farm team.
Trying to impress George Steinbrenner, huh?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, even Derek Jeter.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good boy.
MOOS: Doesn't get his own pool at the stadium to cool off between innings.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Go get the bat. Go get it.
MOOS: You don't have to worry about bike marks on the bats?
RICK BRENNER, GEN. MANAGER, TRENTON THUNDER: Golden retrievers are a very soft-mouthed dog. As a breed, they're used for hunting and retrieving birds. You don't want puncture marks in the birds.
MOOS: Chase lives with general manager Rick Brenner, though a professional dog trainer trained him.
STUMP MERRILL, TRENTON THUNDER MANAGER: We enjoy him in the clubhouse. How he's almost one of us. MOOS: Just like the bat boy, Chase brings water in a basket to the umpires. He only fetches bats in the first inning.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's pretty good at it.
MOOS: Is he?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
MOOS: Better than you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know. We'll see to that.
MOOS: Chase committed no errors though he sometimes moves his mouth to avoid the pine tar players use to grip the bat. He also catches frisbees.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That a boy!
MOOS: And even caters to the press, fetching microphones on cue. The club sells his image on bats and T-shirts. Chase is already a stuffed animal. And they're making a bobblehead of him. What dog wouldn't want to hear...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Play ball!
MOOS: And though he doesn't bite the bats.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A little slobber, maybe.
MOOS: In this game, slobber is a plus. Jeanne Moos, CNN, Trenton, New Jersey.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, all right. Seems like I like to use those words a lot. One of our dedicated viewers, Shannon (ph), isn't shy about telling me so. Coming up we take that to the Nth Degree. First today's buzz. "Should people be able to sue over diets that don't work?" CNN.com/360. Cast your vote there. Results when we come back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Time now for the buzz. Earlier we asked. "Should people be able to sue over diets that don't work?" More than 19,000 of you voted. 9 percent of you said yes, 91 percent of you said no. Not a scientific poll but it is your buzz. Thanks for voting.
Tonight taking statistical analysis to the Nth Degree. It's lovely having viewers hanging on every word, really it is. But Shannon may have gone too far. She sent us this, homemade charts, two of them, detailing the number of times I use the phrase "all right" and the number of times I use the word "well" to begin a sentence on 360 between the 1st of April and the 10th of May. She's got the mean and the median and the mode and all that sort of thing for both, including highest and lowest occurrences. Five is the highest for "all right."
Ten for "well." Well, that's it. Yeah, well. Though in fairness, we found 16 "wells" and 6 "all rights." Where well is concerned in the accompanying letter, Shannon notes that the sooner the word "well" was used in the broadcast, the more often it occurred throughout the show. Shannon says she works the night shift, 7:00 p.m. to 7:00 a.m. So mostly relies on transcripts to keep track of these ticks of mine. Well, all right. Thanks for watching. I'm Anderson Cooper. "PAULA ZAHN NOW" is next.
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