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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Scott Peterson Deliberations Continue; Yasser Arafat's Health Worsens; President Bush Addresses Press
Aired November 04, 2004 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, HOST: Good evening from New York. I'm Anderson Cooper.
The president says he's earned political capital, and he's ready to start spending it.
360 starts now.
How sweet it is. Victory in hand, the president talks to the press about cabinet shakeups, what's next in Iraq, and his agenda for the next four years.
Yasser Arafat's health worsens. Tonight, the power struggle begins, and Mideast security forces go on high alert.
An elderly bench and an ailing chief justice. Tonight, what a new Supreme Court could mean for you. We go 360 with Robert Bork and David Boies.
Did the election give you the postpartisan blues? Democrats seeing red but feeling blue. Tonight, how they're coping with their midweek crisis.
A gut-wrenching loss for the Democrats. But what does it mean for Hillary Clinton? Has John Kerry's defeat opened or shut the door on her presidential prospects?
And Scott Peterson's life in the hands of the jury. How did the lawyers do? And how will the jury judge the accused?
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good evening to you.
Now begins a different sort of suspense, not about the election, that's over and done with. Now the question is, what will the second Bush administration look like and feel like? Who is staying? Who is going? And what does the new administration most want to accomplish?
Some hints on that today, the president speaking to reporters.
CNN senior White House correspondent John King has details.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Energized, to say the least, and voicing confidence the election results give him both the mandate and the muscle to push difficult issues through Congress.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let me put it to you this way. I earned capital in the campaign, political capital, and now I intend to spend it.
KING: The president talked optimistically of postelection goodwill, but his major second-term initiatives will trigger bruising debates with Democrats. Keeping a promise to slice the deficit will force spending cuts in popular programs, his Social Security proposal includes private investment accounts for younger Americans, pushing for a flatter tax system that is revenue neutral, meaning no hidden tax increase, and includes incentive for home buying and charitable giving.
BUSH: The people made it clear what they wanted. Now, let's work together.
KING: Confident but careful. Taking questions for nearly 40 minutes, Mr. Bush sidestepped several pressing issues that will test the postelection mood, whether more troops are needed in Iraq, what the war will cost next year, the goals of an imminent offensive against Iraqi insurgents, and what qualities he will look for if Chief Justice William Rehnquist retires.
BUSH: Well, there's no vacancy for the Supreme Court. And I will deal with a vacancy when there is one.
KING: On the world stage, Mr. Bush says he shares Prime Minister Tony Blair's goal of trying to revive the Middle East peace process. And he talked of trying to move past strains with other leaders caused by the Iraq war.
BUSH: Whatever our past disagreements, we share a common enemy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: John King joins us now. John, a lot of rumors out there about possible cabinet...
KING: Anderson, I lost you at the end of the question. I hope you can hear me. White House officials tell us they do expect significant changes. They expect them to be gradual, though. Quite a bit of focus on Attorney General John Ashcroft, although some of his aides today say, Well, wait a minute, not so fast, he's not going anywhere, at least not right away.
Secretary Powell has made clear to friends he wants to leave soon, but some expect him to stay several months, at least, into a new term. Aides tell us Donald Rumsfeld will stay at least through the Iraqi elections, perhaps a little bit longer.
One wild card to watch, national security adviser Condoleezza Rice. Many here at the White House say she wants to go back to California, and she could actually be the first to leave, Anderson.
COOPER: All right, John King, heard you loud and clear. Thanks, John.
The election is over, some numbers still coming in. Here's a quick news note. When all was said and done, almost 120 million Americans went to the polls, 15 million more than four years ago. Now, that means that 60 percent of all those eligible to vote did so. The last time there was a bigger turnout, 62 percent of eligible voters, was in 1968, when Republican Richard Nixon defeated Democrat Hubert Humphrey.
And the wife of defeated Democratic vice-presidential candidate John Edwards certainly did not need any more bad news this week, but, of course, that is not how fate works. It was announced today Elizabeth Edwards has breast cancer.
CNN medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen has details.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): She found out on the campaign trail. She felt the lump, and it was cancer. We don't know enough about the details of Elizabeth Edwards' case to know what her future holds. Will she have the lump removed, or a full mastectomy? Will she need radiation and chemotherapy, or just radiation?
But we do know this, breast cancer is far from the death sentence it used to be. In fact, when breast cancer is caught early, 98 percent of the women survive. There are 2 million breast cancer survivors in the United States.
DR. CARL DORSI, DIRECTOR OF BREAST IMAGING, EMORY UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER: We are very well armed in seeking to control and hopefully prevent breast cancer. Every day, there are new discoveries coming out.
COHEN: Treatments include surgery, chemotherapy, radiation, and hormones, depending upon the type of tumor.
DORSI: Breast cancer is not just one disease. We know that it's a very variable disease, and maybe even different within one tumor itself.
COHEN: And whether a woman lives or dies depends greatly on the kind of breast cancer she has. But for most women, treatment has improved so much over the years that the answer is life.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COHEN: Now, women are more likely to get breast cancer if they start having children later in life. That's not the case with Elizabeth Edwards. She had her first child at age 30, which statistically is considered early.
COOPER: A lot of thoughts and prayers are with her, I'm sure.
COHEN: That's right.
COOPER: Elizabeth Cohen, thanks very much.
COHEN: Thanks.
COOPER: In another medical story now, all day long there have been reports, immediately followed by denials, that ailing Palestinian Authority President Yasser Arafat had died at the Paris hospital he was taken to for treatment some days ago. Now, the latest word is he is still alive, but just barely. But this could be changing minute by minute.
John Vause is standing by live in Ramallah. John?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN VAUSE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, there's been two stories running all day long, the first coming from Palestinian sources and French medical sources, who are saying that Yasser Arafat has slipped into a coma, that his health has deteriorated to the point where he can no longer recover, and that death now is simply a matter of time.
The other version, coming from the Palestinian Authority, insisting that Yasser Arafat has not died, that, yes, he has taken a turn for the worse, but he remains in a critical but stable condition.
It appears that the Palestinian Authority is now playing for time. There's been a flurry of activity, not just here in Ramallah, but also across the West Bank and Gaza, meetings at the highest of levels, we are told by Palestinian sources, possibly to work out where Yasser Arafat will be buried, the funeral arrangements, but perhaps more importantly, the transfer of power. Who will run the Palestinian Authority? Who will run the PLO? And who will take over Yasser Arafat's Fatah Party?
The Israeli media were among the first to report that Yasser Arafat had died. CNN has not confirmed that. But those reports brought an angry response from many Palestinians in Gaza. Thousands turned out on the streets to show their support for the Palestinian leader.
Meantime, the Palestinian prime minister, Ahmed Qorei (ph), and the former Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abbas, who is now effectively in charge of the PLO, will travel to Gaza in the next few hours to meet with the militant groups Hamas and Islamic Jihad.
Meantime, in Jerusalem, Jewish extremists have taken to the streets to celebrate news of Arafat's death. They say if he hasn't died then, they will pray for his death, Anderson.
COOPER: All right, John Vause in Ramallah, thanks very much, John. Back here in the United States, Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger took a swipe at Democrats. That tops our look at what's happening right now cross-country.
In Sacramento, the Republican governor called state Democrats losers in response to a reporter's question about tax increases. The tough talk comes after the worst election defeat for the national Democratic Party, of course. Just moments after the comment, Schwarzenegger tried to smooth things over, saying it was not aimed at Democrats themselves, just the idea of raising taxes. At least he did not say "girlie men" again.
Little Egg Harbor, New Jersey, now, a school hit by gunfire from a F-16 fighter jet. Yes, that's true. Thankfully, the 25 rounds of ammo hit the school at night when it was closed, and no one was hurt. A National Guard commander says the pilot was supposed to hit a target field about four miles away. He's not sure why the school was hit.
Santa Maria, California, now, prosecutor stays on the Michael Jackson case. A judge has denied a defense motion to boot prosecutor Tom Sneddon and his staff from the case. Jackson's legal team accused them of having a personal vendetta that prevented the star from getting a fair trial.
And nationwide obesity is raising airline fuel costs. Get this, a new federal study reveals that America's growing waistlines are hurting the bottom line of airlines. Obviously, heavier flyers means heftier fuel bills. Not sure they needed a federal study for that, but that's what we got.
That's a look at stories cross-country right now.
360 next, the Bush agenda, how will it translate into political muscle? How big will those muscles get? Let's take a look. Paul Begala and Bob Novak weigh in. We go 360 in the "CROSSFIRE" next.
Plus, reshaping the Supreme Court. Find out the president's potential impact on American justice. Two very different perspectives tonight, former Supreme Court nominee Robert Bork, and attorney David Boies join us live.
And in the hands of the jury. We're awaiting a verdict in the Scott Peterson trial.
Lot to talk about ahead. First, let's take a look at your picks, the most popular stories on CNN.com right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: Let me put it to you this way, I earned capital in the campaign, political capital, now I intend to spend it.
(END VIDEO CLIP) COOPER: Well, as John King reported at the top of the show, it was with those words that President Bush made it clear he sees his popular vote and electoral victories as a mandate. And he'll use that when he pushes his agenda before Congress that now is a stronger shade of red, certainly.
Still, the president is looking for some help from the other side. Earlier I asked "CROSSFIRE" co-hosts Paul Begala and Robert Novak exactly what that means.
Paul, the president again talked about reaching across party lines to try to unify the country. Do you buy that?
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": No. He doesn't have -- actually need to, to begin with. I, it would be good for the country. But as a just raw political matter, he has the votes for much of his agenda. He lacks 60 votes in the Senate, though, and I think that may be what's animating this.
But there's very little in the history of the Bush presidency of him honestly reaching across the line and finding common ground. If you can pick off a couple of Democrats to support his agenda, that's fine. But the one time that he mentioned today in the press conference too was the No Child Left Behind Act, where he authentically did, he gave a lot, Senator Kennedy and other liberals worked with him, they found common ground. It was a very impressive piece of bipartisanship.
And then the Democrats believe the president didn't fund it the way he promised. And since then, the Democrats haven't trusted him, and the president hasn't moved an inch off of his partisan agenda since.
COOPER: Bob, what do the Democrats do for the next four years? Do they just become obstructionists?
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": They really don't know what they are going to do. They have a terrific problem. This was a massive defeat. And most of the honest Democrats admit that it was bad. They, it was the worst defeat in a generation for the Democratic Party. Democratic Party is entering their second decade of minority status in Congress.
Now, the, one of the most interesting things, Anderson, is the defeat of Tom Daschle means that Harry Reid of Nevada is going to be the Senate Democratic leader. Harry is a partisan Democrat, though he is not nearly the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) liberal ideologue that Daschle is. I think he is not an admirer of Daschle's tactics.
COOPER: You know, Paul, already, we're hearing Democrats, I mean, some are saying, you know, We need to go more to the left, then there's those who say, you know, sort of do what Clinton did after Dukakis, move the party more to the center. You know, is that a debate that we're just going to be hearing about endlessly for the next year or two until the Democrats figure out what they want to do? BEGALA: I hope so, because the Democrats need to focus on what it is that they are lacking, particularly in those red states with those middle class voters, and especially on culture and social issues.
The other alternative, which is what we did after 2000, was just blame the candidate. Everybody dumped all over Al Gore, just like some are dumping on John Kerry now. And that, you know, the, what did Shakespeare say, The fault does not lie with the stars, it lies in us. And I think the Democrats should not just attack their stars, their candidates, but think about, what, how do we speak to folks who Democrats believe would be, we'd do better for them on their economic issues, but they feel so alienated from us on these social and cultural issues.
I think the president exploits them very cynically, but he still does it very successfully. And Democrats better find a way to deal with that.
COOPER: Bob, are Democrats scared of social and cultural issues, or talking about moral values?
NOVAK: They are terrified of it because, you know, one of the great things that comes out of the exit polls every election is that people who go to church on a regular basis, at least once a week, vote Republican about 62 percent. And there's only about a 38 percent Republican support for people who don't go church. It's a huge dividing line in the country.
But, you see, one of the things, Anderson, that in all the talk on this network, on other networks, you know, words that are seldom ever used are conservative and liberal, because liberals don't like to talk, use those words. But this is a conservative country. And what are, and the Democrats are a liberal party. What do they do? Do they, do they, they don't like to use the word. They claim that's labeling.
But it's a tremendous problem.
COOPER: We'll see what is beared out over the next four years. Paul Begala, Bob Novak, thanks.
BEGALA: Thanks, Anderson.
COOPER: U.S. and Iraqi troops are gearing up for a major assault in Fallujah. That tops our look at global stories in the uplink.
U.S. tanks and planes have pounded parts of the rebel city, destroying several militant fighting positions. An all-out offensive could be days, could be weeks away. The enemy, an unknown number of insurgent fighters and foreign terrorists, it is going to be a tough battle whenever it happens.
Northern Japan, powerful aftershocks now. A mad dash under tables, screaming. The region rumbles once again. Today's two aftershocks follow last month's earthquake which killed 39 people and injured thousands. A lot of scared kids there.
Eastern Iceland now, a volcano eruption burns through a glacier. A spectacular video. Explosions have sent black ash and smoke -- I know it's a little hard to tell what that is, it's black ash and smoke that was, blew up as high as 40,000 feet in the air. Airlines have been forced to divert or cancel flights. Luckily no lives or homes are in danger. The area is sparsely populated.
And Taipei, Taiwan, when a lion attacks -- take a look at this. All right, here's what's going on. This guy leapt into the lions' den at a zoo to try to convert the king of beasts to Christianity. The guy was shouting, "Jesus will save you." Apparently it didn't really translate into Lion.
The zoo used water guns and tranquilizers to drive the lions away. Amazingly, the guy stays calm, even grabbed back his shredded coat, and climbed out of the pen with just bite marks. I know it looks worse than it ends up being. He's getting, also getting treatment for his mental problems, which he obviously seems to have.
That's tonight's uplink for you.
360 next, postpartisan blues. Half the country feeling great, but half the country feeling down as the other half celebrates the election. A little help tonight for the politically down and out.
Also tonight, reshaping American justice. Find out what impact President Bush might have on the Supreme Court. Former nominee Robert Bork and attorney David Boies join us live.
And a little later, fast forward to 2008. Is Hillary Clinton on the horizon, or has the sun now set on her presidential prospects?
Lots to talk about tonight. In a moment, also today's 360 challenge. How closely you been following today's news? We'll test it. We'll see. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, for the majority of Americans who voted for President Bush, today was a good day. Some had a spring in their step, a smile on their faces. For Democrats, not so much. Here in New York, you could see them sulking at Starbuck's or moping at the mall.
For the Democratic Party and its millions of members, losing this bad has brought on a serious midweek crisis.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): This is a Bush supporter's idea of pure bliss. For the Kerry crowd, it was, well, let's just say a more solemn occasion.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a really sad day for America.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think we're all in trouble.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Extremely disappointed. It's -- I'm in disbelief.
COOPER: While the candidates were counseling a more conciliatory approach...
BUSH: When we come together and work together, there is no limit to the greatness of America.
SEN. JOHN KERRY, FORMER DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We are required now to work together for the good of our country.
COOPER: ... it seems some of those on the -- well, how can we say this delicately? -- losing side are just looking for counseling. They are taking their anger to the airwaves.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "LARRY KING LIVE")
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (on phone): Hi, Larry.
LARRY KING, HOST: Hi.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm still in shock about this whole election.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And check out this e-mail from Jasmine, a 360 viewer. "Since Ohio went red, me and my friends are not well. We haven't left my dorm room, haven't even gone to class. We need professional help."
Well, Jasmine, here it is, a professional who says he understands.
ROBERT BUTTERWORTH, PHD, INTERNATIONAL TRAUMA CENTER: Well, you have to understand that a lot of people's hopes and dreams have been really tied up into the candidate.
COOPER: So what's a disheartened Democrat to do?
BUTTERWORTH: Go back to the gyms. Remember what their life was before the campaign. And start thinking about the holidays.
COOPER: And if that doesn't dampen the disappointment...
BUTTERWORTH: Get that proverbial blue Democratic candle out. Light it in that little quiet room and chant to yourself, it's only politics.
COOPER: And remember this. Picking up the pieces after a political loss may not be a piece of cake. On the other hand, hanging onto anger could cause a midweek crisis that's 56 million voters strong and four years long.
(END VIDEOTAPE) COOPER: Earlier, I talked about postpartisan blues with Democratic strategist and CNN contributor Donna Brazile.
You know, we've been getting tons of e-mails from Democrats who really are depressed. I mean, you know, really maudlin. You've been through this, certainly, before. What's your advice to them?
DONNA BRAZILE (D), CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, first of all, go ahead and mourn. It's OK. Lick your wounds and get up and get ready to fight again.
Four years ago was a terrible time, of course. We won that election and then only to see the Supreme Court change the outcome.
This time around, I think we can take the lessons learned from this past engagement and really rebuild the Democratic Party this time, in all 50 states and the District of Columbia.
COOPER: Do you really feel like rebuilding at this point? I mean, you know, so soon after the election, you seem optimistic. But are you putting just a brave face on it?
BRAZILE: Well, no question. I learned one thing from Karl Rove, who four years ago looked at the results and brought his party back together and said, You know what? Next time around we're going to beat the Democrats at turnout. Look at the results. Their expectations on the ground far exceeded our expectations. They won more states, got out more votes, clearly because they never stopped working.
So what I'm saying is that Democrats cannot spend a lot of time mourning. They got to get up and get ready to fight the next battle.
COOPER: I want to show you something Jon Stewart said on his program. Let's play the tape.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "THE DAILY SHOW WITH JON STEWART," THE COMEDY CHANNEL)
JON STEWART, HOST: Here's the final electoral college votes that we know right now. Can we throw that up there? The -- I think it's one -- it hasn't changed -- There it is. It looks very red, and then there's some blue there at the top, where many of us will most likely spend the next four years, I would imagine, huddled together and, in fact, weeping.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: You know, I mean, all joking aside, I mean, the country is really polarized. Do you actually expect Republicans to sort of make an effort? I mean, they were victorious. Why should they make an effort to reach over to Democrats?
BRAZILE: Well, they likely, they will probably not reach out. If anything, they will probably try to build upon their own success. Look, Democrats must go back out there, raise money, recruit candidates, and fight the next battle. I'm not going to lose a lot of sleep worrying about the next two years or the next four years and what Republicans will do to us. I think Democrats need to spend the next two years and four years going back, organizing to put our values into action.
COOPER: Certainly seems like there is a lot of work to do. Donna Brazile, appreciate you joining us. Thanks.
BRAZILE: Thank you.
COOPER: An elderly bench and an ailing chief justice. Tonight, what a new Supreme Court could mean for you. We go 360 with Robert Bork and David Boies.
A gut-wrenching loss for the Democrats. But what does it mean for Hillary Clinton? Has John Kerry's defeat opened or shut the door on her presidential prospects?
And Scott Peterson's life in the hands of the jury. How did the lawyers do? And how will the jury judge the accused?
360 continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it could be argued that the building holding the most power in the country is not the White House, but the Supreme Court. Right now, most legal experts say, the court consists of three conservatives, Justices Rehnquist, Scalia, and Thomas, two moderates, Justices O'Connor and Kennedy, and four liberals, Justices Ginsburg, Souter, Stevens, and Breyer.
But with Chief Justice William Rehnquist in poor health and the possibility that others may leave because of retirement, there's a good chance President Bush may be able to significantly alter the makeup of the Supreme Court. And that could alter the shape of this country for decades to come.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm looking forward to serving this country for four more years.
COOPER (voice-over): And those four years could see a transformation of the Supreme Court. With the exception of Clarence Thomas who is 56, all the justices are older than 65. And there's the possibility at least three may soon step down. Chief Justice William Rehnquist has not returned to the court since it was disclosed he has thyroid cancer. Many court watchers are predicting he won't be back. Justices John Paul Stevens, Sandra Day O'Connor and Ruth Bader Ginsburg have all battled cancer. All are over 70. Stevens is 81 leading to speculation that one and possibly all three may retire soon.
That could leave the president with possibly four vacancies to fill. Today he was asked what kind of justice he wants on the court.
BUSH: I told the people on the campaign trail that I'll pick somebody that knows the difference between personal opinion and the strict interpretation of the law. You might have heard that several times. I meant what I said.
COOPER: That may be telling. Based on their decisions some legal experts believe Rehnquist and Justices Anthony Scalia and Thomas fit the president's mold of strictly interpreting the constitution.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, SR. LEGAL ANALYST: President Bush has said the justices he admires most are Thomas and Scalia. And we can expect his Supreme Court appointments to reflect that admiration.
COOPER: If the president has the opportunity to choose three conservative justices to the bench it could have a profound impact on Roe v. Wade and other divisive issues.
TOOBIN: Depending on which three justices it is, Roe v. Wade, affirmative action, separation of church and state, all those areas could be dramatically transformed.
COOPER: But Republican Senator Arlen Specter who is in line to become chairman of the Senate judiciary committee recalled confirmation problems faced by some of Mr. Bush's judicial picks. And cautioned the president against nominees who are not in his words within the broad range of acceptability.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(on camera): On 360 we like to look at issues from all different angles. So tonight two very different perspectives on where the Supreme Court is now and where it may go. First from Washington I'm pleased to be joined by Robert Bork, former federal appeals court judge and Supreme Court nominee. Judge Bork, thank you very much for being with us.
How hopeful are you that the court will become more conservative in the next four years?
JUDGE ROBERT BORK, FMR. SUPREME COURT NOMINEE: It may be, but I think it's a long shot. Most of the justices in the past have been appointed by Republican presidents and it hasn't turned into a conservative court. It hasn't turned into a court that follows the constitution rather than making up new rights. Bush would have to be quite bold, identify the right people, nominate them and fight for them. Of course, he's got the wild card of Arlen Specter who may be chairman of the judiciary committee.
COOPER: I know he opposed your nomination, obviously. He said today that he thought the overturning of Roe v. Wade unlikely. Do you think it likely at some point whether the next four years or down the road?
BORK: Not in the next four years and I don't see it in the foreseeable future. COOPER: Just because you don't think the court itself will change?
BORK: Well, no, the court may change but I don't think the votes are there, for example, if Chief Justice Rehnquist isn't there, you've got one anti-Roe justice gone. And White was against Roe against Wade. Now what do you have? You have Scalia and Thomas. I don't think there's another vote.
COOPER: A lot of conservatives complain about activist judges, you wrote in your book, "Chorusing Virtue," you wrote quote, "what judges have wrought is a coup d'etat, slow moving and genteel but a coup d'etat nonetheless." Is the Supreme Court in your opinion right now too filled with activist judges?
BORK: I think the Supreme Court is generally kind of out of control. They are making up the constitution. You know, the decisions about Roe against Wade is one. But the decisions about pornography and the decisions about special rights for homosexuals and so forth, have nothing do with the constitution. They may be things that you want to legislate but they are not in the constitution.
COOPER: So obviously you are for a strict interpretation...
BORK: I wouldn't call it strict interpretation. I'd call it a reasonable interpretation.
COOPER: All politicians say they don't have a litmus test for judicial appointments. Whether that's true or not, the president certainly says it. He also says he wants to know whether the Supreme Court nominees will strictly stick to what's in the constitution. Isn't that really a litmus test?
BORK: It is. I think all politicians have a litmus test in a sense.
COOPER: And is that a good thing?
BORK: Yes, if you have the right litmus test it's a good thing. If have a test that says I want a justice who will discern the principles that are actually in the constitution and apply them and not make up new principles, that's a good litmus test.
COOPER: A lot of Democrats take issue with that notion of activist judges. From your perspective explain why you think so many judges have become activists.
BORK: It's a position of enormous power. It's a power that can't be checked by the political branches or by the people. And you give people that kind of power, they begin to use it. We've known that for a long time.
COOPER: So you think they are using their power to do things that they can't do at the ballot box.
BORK: Definitely. We have a culture war in this country. And it's largely the intellectual class or the elites or whatever you want to call them, use the courts to get things they could not get in a legislature, can't the public to vote for.
COOPER: Do you think the Supreme Court today is out of touch with the morality of where America is at right now?
BORK: Well, I don't really -- the Supreme Court shouldn't be in touch with the morality of America at the moment, it should be in touch with the constitution. If the morality is right or left that's not the Supreme Court's business. The Supreme Court's business is to apply the principles that are actually there.
COOPER: Judge Robert Bork, we appreciate you joining us tonight. Thank you very much.
Joining me now from Seattle is well-known attorney Robert Boies who argued before the Supreme Court for Al Gore during the disputed 2000 presidential election. Mr. Boies, thank you for being with us.
Let me ask you some of the same questions. Do you believe the Supreme Court today is too filled with what Judge Bork would refer to as activist judges?
DAVID BOIES, ATTORNEY: I think activism tends to be in the eye of the beholder. Certainly in 2000, I felt it was a pretty activist court that stepped in and ordered the Florida election officials to stop counting the votes in Bush v. Gore. Those five members included the three most conservative members of the court. So I think that when you talk about activism, what you usually mean is you agree or disagree with what's going on. If you disagree with a judge you call it activist. If you agree with what the judge is doing you call it strict constructionism.
COOPER: That's a good point. How -- I asked Judge Bork how hopeful he is there's going to be change the next four years. I guess maybe I'll ask you, how concerned are you that there's going to be a move to a more conservative court over the next four years?
BOIES: I think the court will probably become more conservative. Indeed, I think President Bush won the election. It wasn't exactly a landslide with 51 percent of the vote but he won the election. And as the winner he is entitled to pick judges. Now I agree with Senator Specter though that he's got to pick those judges within the broad range of reasonableness. And if he's outside of that range, then the constitution gives the Senate of the United States the right to reject those nominees. And I would expect that if President Bush steps outside of the range of reasonableness, the Senate would exercise that constitutional power.
COOPER: So something like Roe v. Wade, do you think it is under threat over the next four years?
BOIES: I doubt it over the next four years. I think it will take longer than that to reverse a decision as fundamental as Roe v. Wade. But I think steps could easily be taken in the next four years that would eventually lead to the overruling of Roe v. Wade. That is certainly high on the agenda of some members of the president's party.
COOPER: The process of picking a judge and the review by legislators is becoming a very politicized process whether you agree with that it should be or not. What is interesting to me about it is that often justices are picked and yet they end up being sort of different than what the people pick them kind of thought.
BOIES: Yes. I think that Earl Warren who was one of the most liberal judges, I think people would say in retrospect, was picked by a Republican president. I think that you cannot predict exactly how a judge will act once he or she goes on the bench. That's one of the advantages of lifetime tenure. On the other hand, I think that if you pick judges not because of their judicial abilities, not because of their scholarship, but because you expect them to adhere to a rigid ideological line then I think you can expect them to be predictable. I think for example the two justices that President Bush keeps singling out, Justices Scalia and Thomas were to a large extent picked because of their ideological reliability and I think they've proven that on court.
COOPER: David Boies, interesting perspective. I appreciate you joining us. Thanks, David.
And this story just in now, Mount Hood, Oregon, I want to show you some video that's happening right now. A rescue operation is under way right now in Mount Hood. Two hikers have apparently fallen into a crevice. You see it there. The rescue operation is under way.
A sheriff's office received an emergency cell phone call from one of the hikers. The caller said he and his friend had fallen about 100 feet into this crevice which you are seeing.
These images taken just a short time ago. But this rescue is still under way. We're continuing to monitor this. Apparently one of the hikers had injured his arm. Was able to use his cell phone. He had broken his arm. He used his cell phone. But one of the hikers has a very serious back injury, and that is the person who seems to be getting the most attention at this point. We're going to continue to follow this rescue operation under way right now on Mount Hood in Oregon.
Coming up next on 360, a very different tale, Scott Peterson's fate: it is in the hands of the jury right now. We're going to have some thoughts on what they may be debating and deliberating in "Justice Served" toinight.
Plus, why Kerry's loss may be Hillary Clinton's gain, so say some. Others say, it's not good news for her or northeastern liberals at all. We'll take a look at the "Raw Politics" of 2008 ahead.
Also in a moment, today's 360 challenge. Have you been following today's news pretty closely? We'll put that to the test. We'll see. Find out. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) COOPER: All right. Are you up to today's 360 challenge? Be the first to answer all 3 questions correctly, we'll send you a 360 T- shirt. No. 1, President Bush told world leaders today, we share a common what?
No. 2, How old is Clarence Thomas, the youngest Supreme Court Justice?
And finally, In Taiwan, a man tried to convert a lion to what?
Take take the challenge. Log on to CNN.com/360, click on the answer link, answer first, we'll send you the shirt. Find out last night's challenge leader and tonight's answers coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well in California today, the votes are still being counted. It's about Scott Peterson, you remember, not about the election. The murder trial that lasted 5 months after dropping off the radar screen for awhile. It is in the final phase: jury deliberation. They've been in the jury room for 2 days now. And still no sign of a verdict.
Covering the trial for us in Justice Served, from Redwood City, California is Gloria Allred. The attorney for Amber Frey. Gloria, thanks very much for being with us.
Tonight, we had hoped to be joined by Jayne Weintraub, criminal defense attorney, having some problems with that. We'll try to get to her as soon as we can during our discussion.
You were in the courtroom, Gloria, for the closing arguments. The prosecution bringing the case back to the victims, to Laci Peterson, to her unborn child. How effective was that?
GLORIA ALLRED, AMBER FREY'S ATTORNEY: I think it was very effective, Anderson. I think it was very important. They did start with a video of Laci in her kitchen and happy. You can hear her voice. And there she was. And really, Laci and Conner are what this case is all about. So, I think that was very important to bring that home to the jury.
They have seen autopsy photos of Laci and Conner, may they rest in peace, but to see her alive and well and to know that she's no longer here because someone murdered them, I think the jury needed to see that. It was important.
COOPER: The other dramatic moment, really, one of the many in this trial, was when your client, when the tapes of conversations between your client and Scott Peterson were played out in the court. I want to play some of them for just a second and talk about how you think these impacted the case. Let's listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
AMBER FREY, SCOT PETERSON'S FRM. LOVER: Should I be afraid of my own life?
SCOTT PETERSON, ALLEGEDLY MURDERED WIFE: Not from me, Amber.
FREY: What?
PETERSON: Not from me.
FREY: Not from you? From possibly from whoever too Laci, should I be in fear of them?
PETERSON: I don't think so. I don't se why.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
COOPER: I mean, this is just one of many recordings that was played out in court. What kind of an impact do you think this had on the jury?
ALLRED: Well, I think that all of the tapes that Amber made of conversations that she had with Scott after Laci disappeared, had an enormous impact, I think, on the jury, in the sense they could never look at Scott Peterson the same way again. And I think that it made it really impossible for him to take the witness stand and testify.
Because listening to those tapes, we heard, one, that he seemed to be obsessed with Amber Frey and continuing to have a relationship with her even after Laci disappeared, even calling her 45 minutes before the vigil for his missing wife. In addition, we heard his lies over and over and over again. And the fact that he didn't seem to have any feeling towards Laci.
I think all of that was extremely important. And the idea that he would continue this relationship with her, and that he acknowledged on the tapes that he had said that he had lost his wife, and these would be the first holidays without her before Laci ever went missing, I think that could be very important.
COOPER: Gloria, as I said, we hoped Jayne Weintraub was joining us, a criminal defense attorney in Miami. There was a problem with the trasmission, so she's not, but I can hear her rolling her eyes in Miami as she listens to you speaking right now, because as you know, the defense in their closing argument said, look, all this stuff proves that, you know Scott Peterson is a cad doesn't prove anything about him being a murderer.
ALLRED: Well, that is, Anderson, the defense line. OK, he's a liar. He's, you know, in fact Mark Geragos even said to the jury he got caught with his pands down. Well, I would add he got caught with his pands down and his lies exposed. But he's saying he's an adulterer, but he's not a murderer. Well, that is the defense position.
The prosecutor is saying the following, look, there is a motive for killing. And the motive is not only about Amber, it's bigger than that, it's about Scott Peterson wanting the freedom from the life that he was living with Laci. Yes, maybe he had affairs before or relationships, but that was very different because now he was about to become a father.
Now, perhaps, not only did he not want to be married to laci he didn't want the responsibility of having a child, maybe having to be home every night, maybe having to pay child support. And, also, he was obsessed with Amber. We remember that on the tape he was talking about wanting to have a future with Amber, wanting to be with her forever.
COOPER: Gloria, I want to jump in, because Jayne is now here. We still have a few seconds left. Jayne, I appreciate you joining us. I'm sorry about the technical problems.
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Thanks for filling in for me, Anderson.
COOPER: Well, I heard your eyes rolling there in Miami when Gloria was talking. What is your take on this? Where do things stand now? You heard probably what Gloria said. What do you think?
WEINTRAUB: Here's the bottom line. It doesn't matter what Mark said before or what he promised to deliver. All that matters is that it's up to the state to prove how she died from premeditated design or not.
You know, Anderson not guilty doesn't mean innocent. And that jury is in there in the jury room talking about it and thinking about it. They are saying to themselves, just what Gloria is talking about. For example, maybe he didn't want to be a father. And another jury is going to say Amber had a 3-year-old, so forget that.
Then he's going to say. Well, why didn't he get a divorce? And the answer is well why didn't he get a divorce? He could have gotten a divorce. You know what the bottom line is it's up to the state. They charged with him with first degree murder, sticking the death penalty. They kept him in jail for 2 years. They charged on Christmas Eve in her home, she was killed from a premeditated design. Anderson, not one scintilla of evidence where she died or who killed her. And the fact that he didn't grieve
(CROSSTALK)
WEINTRAUB: doesn't mean he killed her.
COOPER: Wait. I'm sorry to jump in, but we're going to have to go. I'm sorry. We are limited on time. Janye, I wanted to get you. It was short, but it was effective, Jayne.
Gloria Allred, good to talk to you. Jayne Weintraub, thanks very much.
Coming up next on 360: jockying for 2008. Already it's happening. Hillary Clinton for president? Well, that's "Raw Politics." Take a look.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) COOPER: John Kerry supporters may already be looking for another big name Democrat to win back the White House, Clinton, Senator Hillary Clinton that is. Today New York Senator Chuck Schumer said his colleague is the forerunner for the Democratic Parties presidential nomination in 2008. They are already talking about it. While Senator Clinton has been saying so far she's not interested, hey, it's never too early to start speculating about "Raw Politics."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEN. HILLARY CLINTON, NEW YORK: It will be great to have a Democrat back in the White House.
COOPER: OK, so Hillary Clinton said that before Bush won and she meant John Kerry. But Kerry's loss may be Clinton's gain. Some Democrats already have their eyes on her. Standing by her man as a two-term first lady knows, Hillary Clinton, knows her way around the white house. In 2000, she became the only former first lady ever elected to the U.S. Senate. And she's now one of the most powerful elected officials in the Democratic Party.
BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT: If she wanted to present herself and if she got elected she would be magnificent.
COOPER: She has the support of her husband, the parties rock star, and Hillary Clinton is a commanding figure on the national political stage.
SEN. CHARLES SCHUMER (D), NEW YORK: She is totally dedicated to serving the people of New York, and she's a great senator. I also think she's one of the natural leaders for our party.
COOPER: Insiders say Clinton has to focus getting reelected in 2006, admitting you can't run for president with shaky support at home. And there are plenty of questions. Is she mainstream enough?
JUDY WOODRUFF, "INSIDE POLITICS": The biggest obstacle for Hillary Clinton is that she's a liberal from the northeast, from New York State. That's what John Kerry is, and that's a big reason why he was defeated.
COOPER: Plus is Hillary Clinton likable enough? There are plenty of Hillary haters from her husbands years in the White House and there's the female factor.
WOODRUFF: She also would have to deal with I think just the built-in suspicion about a woman and built-in suspicion toward the fact she's a Clinton.
COOPER: British book makers are already pegging Hillary Clinton as the favorite in 2008, a little too early to bet in the world of "Raw Politics."
Certainly is too early. 360 next, Democrats a vanishing breed, is it possible?
We're going to take that to "The Nth Degree."
And the 360 Challenge. Here's another look at tonight's questions, no. 1, President Bush told world leaders today we share a common what?
No. 2, how old is Clarence Thomas, the youngest Supreme Court justice?
Finally in Taiwan a man tries to convert lions to what?
Have you been paying attention. Log on to cnn.com/360. Click on the answer link to play.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: All right, time now for the answer to today's 360 challenge.
No. 1, President Bush told world leaders we share a common what? The answer, enemy.
No. 2, how old is Clarence Thomas, the youngest Supreme Court justice?
The answer, 56. We put the wrong answer up there. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) that is clearly wrong.
And finally in Taiwan a man tried to convert lions to what? The answer, Christianity.
First person to answer all three questions correctly will be sent a 360 T-shirt. Tune in tomorrow, find out if your the lucky one. Last night's winner, Keri Shilington of Bartlett Illinois. Another "360 Challenge" and another chance to win tomorrow.
Tonight taking a modest proposal to "The Nth Degree." We better face facts. The sooner we put Democrats on the endangered species list the better. If we want our children's children to be able to see these magnificent creatures in the wild, there really isn't any time to lose.
Consider, Democrats were once to be found everywhere, from end of the continental U.S. to the other and from north to south, in many different climates and topographies. That was then. This is now. More and more, Democrats are confined to small, widely scattered pockets, mostly around tall builds and within driving distance of three and four-star restaurants. There were reduced to supporting themselves by playing the harmonica, making low documentary budget films and writing accounts of their lives. It's sad really. If we don't want Democrats to go the way of the buffalo or the tall grass prairie over the passenger pigeon, we'd better act now. It's up to each of us. Put a few healthy Democrats aside in a clean dry place, keep them in wine and cheese. Check in on them from time to time. We have at least maintain a breeding stock.
I'm Anderson Cooper, thanks for watching 360. Coming up next, PAULA ZAHN NOW."
TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com
Aired November 4, 2004 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, HOST: Good evening from New York. I'm Anderson Cooper.
The president says he's earned political capital, and he's ready to start spending it.
360 starts now.
How sweet it is. Victory in hand, the president talks to the press about cabinet shakeups, what's next in Iraq, and his agenda for the next four years.
Yasser Arafat's health worsens. Tonight, the power struggle begins, and Mideast security forces go on high alert.
An elderly bench and an ailing chief justice. Tonight, what a new Supreme Court could mean for you. We go 360 with Robert Bork and David Boies.
Did the election give you the postpartisan blues? Democrats seeing red but feeling blue. Tonight, how they're coping with their midweek crisis.
A gut-wrenching loss for the Democrats. But what does it mean for Hillary Clinton? Has John Kerry's defeat opened or shut the door on her presidential prospects?
And Scott Peterson's life in the hands of the jury. How did the lawyers do? And how will the jury judge the accused?
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: And a good evening to you.
Now begins a different sort of suspense, not about the election, that's over and done with. Now the question is, what will the second Bush administration look like and feel like? Who is staying? Who is going? And what does the new administration most want to accomplish?
Some hints on that today, the president speaking to reporters.
CNN senior White House correspondent John King has details.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) JOHN KING, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Energized, to say the least, and voicing confidence the election results give him both the mandate and the muscle to push difficult issues through Congress.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Let me put it to you this way. I earned capital in the campaign, political capital, and now I intend to spend it.
KING: The president talked optimistically of postelection goodwill, but his major second-term initiatives will trigger bruising debates with Democrats. Keeping a promise to slice the deficit will force spending cuts in popular programs, his Social Security proposal includes private investment accounts for younger Americans, pushing for a flatter tax system that is revenue neutral, meaning no hidden tax increase, and includes incentive for home buying and charitable giving.
BUSH: The people made it clear what they wanted. Now, let's work together.
KING: Confident but careful. Taking questions for nearly 40 minutes, Mr. Bush sidestepped several pressing issues that will test the postelection mood, whether more troops are needed in Iraq, what the war will cost next year, the goals of an imminent offensive against Iraqi insurgents, and what qualities he will look for if Chief Justice William Rehnquist retires.
BUSH: Well, there's no vacancy for the Supreme Court. And I will deal with a vacancy when there is one.
KING: On the world stage, Mr. Bush says he shares Prime Minister Tony Blair's goal of trying to revive the Middle East peace process. And he talked of trying to move past strains with other leaders caused by the Iraq war.
BUSH: Whatever our past disagreements, we share a common enemy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: John King joins us now. John, a lot of rumors out there about possible cabinet...
KING: Anderson, I lost you at the end of the question. I hope you can hear me. White House officials tell us they do expect significant changes. They expect them to be gradual, though. Quite a bit of focus on Attorney General John Ashcroft, although some of his aides today say, Well, wait a minute, not so fast, he's not going anywhere, at least not right away.
Secretary Powell has made clear to friends he wants to leave soon, but some expect him to stay several months, at least, into a new term. Aides tell us Donald Rumsfeld will stay at least through the Iraqi elections, perhaps a little bit longer.
One wild card to watch, national security adviser Condoleezza Rice. Many here at the White House say she wants to go back to California, and she could actually be the first to leave, Anderson.
COOPER: All right, John King, heard you loud and clear. Thanks, John.
The election is over, some numbers still coming in. Here's a quick news note. When all was said and done, almost 120 million Americans went to the polls, 15 million more than four years ago. Now, that means that 60 percent of all those eligible to vote did so. The last time there was a bigger turnout, 62 percent of eligible voters, was in 1968, when Republican Richard Nixon defeated Democrat Hubert Humphrey.
And the wife of defeated Democratic vice-presidential candidate John Edwards certainly did not need any more bad news this week, but, of course, that is not how fate works. It was announced today Elizabeth Edwards has breast cancer.
CNN medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen has details.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): She found out on the campaign trail. She felt the lump, and it was cancer. We don't know enough about the details of Elizabeth Edwards' case to know what her future holds. Will she have the lump removed, or a full mastectomy? Will she need radiation and chemotherapy, or just radiation?
But we do know this, breast cancer is far from the death sentence it used to be. In fact, when breast cancer is caught early, 98 percent of the women survive. There are 2 million breast cancer survivors in the United States.
DR. CARL DORSI, DIRECTOR OF BREAST IMAGING, EMORY UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER: We are very well armed in seeking to control and hopefully prevent breast cancer. Every day, there are new discoveries coming out.
COHEN: Treatments include surgery, chemotherapy, radiation, and hormones, depending upon the type of tumor.
DORSI: Breast cancer is not just one disease. We know that it's a very variable disease, and maybe even different within one tumor itself.
COHEN: And whether a woman lives or dies depends greatly on the kind of breast cancer she has. But for most women, treatment has improved so much over the years that the answer is life.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COHEN: Now, women are more likely to get breast cancer if they start having children later in life. That's not the case with Elizabeth Edwards. She had her first child at age 30, which statistically is considered early.
COOPER: A lot of thoughts and prayers are with her, I'm sure.
COHEN: That's right.
COOPER: Elizabeth Cohen, thanks very much.
COHEN: Thanks.
COOPER: In another medical story now, all day long there have been reports, immediately followed by denials, that ailing Palestinian Authority President Yasser Arafat had died at the Paris hospital he was taken to for treatment some days ago. Now, the latest word is he is still alive, but just barely. But this could be changing minute by minute.
John Vause is standing by live in Ramallah. John?
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN VAUSE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, there's been two stories running all day long, the first coming from Palestinian sources and French medical sources, who are saying that Yasser Arafat has slipped into a coma, that his health has deteriorated to the point where he can no longer recover, and that death now is simply a matter of time.
The other version, coming from the Palestinian Authority, insisting that Yasser Arafat has not died, that, yes, he has taken a turn for the worse, but he remains in a critical but stable condition.
It appears that the Palestinian Authority is now playing for time. There's been a flurry of activity, not just here in Ramallah, but also across the West Bank and Gaza, meetings at the highest of levels, we are told by Palestinian sources, possibly to work out where Yasser Arafat will be buried, the funeral arrangements, but perhaps more importantly, the transfer of power. Who will run the Palestinian Authority? Who will run the PLO? And who will take over Yasser Arafat's Fatah Party?
The Israeli media were among the first to report that Yasser Arafat had died. CNN has not confirmed that. But those reports brought an angry response from many Palestinians in Gaza. Thousands turned out on the streets to show their support for the Palestinian leader.
Meantime, the Palestinian prime minister, Ahmed Qorei (ph), and the former Palestinian prime minister, Mahmoud Abbas, who is now effectively in charge of the PLO, will travel to Gaza in the next few hours to meet with the militant groups Hamas and Islamic Jihad.
Meantime, in Jerusalem, Jewish extremists have taken to the streets to celebrate news of Arafat's death. They say if he hasn't died then, they will pray for his death, Anderson.
COOPER: All right, John Vause in Ramallah, thanks very much, John. Back here in the United States, Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger took a swipe at Democrats. That tops our look at what's happening right now cross-country.
In Sacramento, the Republican governor called state Democrats losers in response to a reporter's question about tax increases. The tough talk comes after the worst election defeat for the national Democratic Party, of course. Just moments after the comment, Schwarzenegger tried to smooth things over, saying it was not aimed at Democrats themselves, just the idea of raising taxes. At least he did not say "girlie men" again.
Little Egg Harbor, New Jersey, now, a school hit by gunfire from a F-16 fighter jet. Yes, that's true. Thankfully, the 25 rounds of ammo hit the school at night when it was closed, and no one was hurt. A National Guard commander says the pilot was supposed to hit a target field about four miles away. He's not sure why the school was hit.
Santa Maria, California, now, prosecutor stays on the Michael Jackson case. A judge has denied a defense motion to boot prosecutor Tom Sneddon and his staff from the case. Jackson's legal team accused them of having a personal vendetta that prevented the star from getting a fair trial.
And nationwide obesity is raising airline fuel costs. Get this, a new federal study reveals that America's growing waistlines are hurting the bottom line of airlines. Obviously, heavier flyers means heftier fuel bills. Not sure they needed a federal study for that, but that's what we got.
That's a look at stories cross-country right now.
360 next, the Bush agenda, how will it translate into political muscle? How big will those muscles get? Let's take a look. Paul Begala and Bob Novak weigh in. We go 360 in the "CROSSFIRE" next.
Plus, reshaping the Supreme Court. Find out the president's potential impact on American justice. Two very different perspectives tonight, former Supreme Court nominee Robert Bork, and attorney David Boies join us live.
And in the hands of the jury. We're awaiting a verdict in the Scott Peterson trial.
Lot to talk about ahead. First, let's take a look at your picks, the most popular stories on CNN.com right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: Let me put it to you this way, I earned capital in the campaign, political capital, now I intend to spend it.
(END VIDEO CLIP) COOPER: Well, as John King reported at the top of the show, it was with those words that President Bush made it clear he sees his popular vote and electoral victories as a mandate. And he'll use that when he pushes his agenda before Congress that now is a stronger shade of red, certainly.
Still, the president is looking for some help from the other side. Earlier I asked "CROSSFIRE" co-hosts Paul Begala and Robert Novak exactly what that means.
Paul, the president again talked about reaching across party lines to try to unify the country. Do you buy that?
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": No. He doesn't have -- actually need to, to begin with. I, it would be good for the country. But as a just raw political matter, he has the votes for much of his agenda. He lacks 60 votes in the Senate, though, and I think that may be what's animating this.
But there's very little in the history of the Bush presidency of him honestly reaching across the line and finding common ground. If you can pick off a couple of Democrats to support his agenda, that's fine. But the one time that he mentioned today in the press conference too was the No Child Left Behind Act, where he authentically did, he gave a lot, Senator Kennedy and other liberals worked with him, they found common ground. It was a very impressive piece of bipartisanship.
And then the Democrats believe the president didn't fund it the way he promised. And since then, the Democrats haven't trusted him, and the president hasn't moved an inch off of his partisan agenda since.
COOPER: Bob, what do the Democrats do for the next four years? Do they just become obstructionists?
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST, "CROSSFIRE": They really don't know what they are going to do. They have a terrific problem. This was a massive defeat. And most of the honest Democrats admit that it was bad. They, it was the worst defeat in a generation for the Democratic Party. Democratic Party is entering their second decade of minority status in Congress.
Now, the, one of the most interesting things, Anderson, is the defeat of Tom Daschle means that Harry Reid of Nevada is going to be the Senate Democratic leader. Harry is a partisan Democrat, though he is not nearly the (UNINTELLIGIBLE) liberal ideologue that Daschle is. I think he is not an admirer of Daschle's tactics.
COOPER: You know, Paul, already, we're hearing Democrats, I mean, some are saying, you know, We need to go more to the left, then there's those who say, you know, sort of do what Clinton did after Dukakis, move the party more to the center. You know, is that a debate that we're just going to be hearing about endlessly for the next year or two until the Democrats figure out what they want to do? BEGALA: I hope so, because the Democrats need to focus on what it is that they are lacking, particularly in those red states with those middle class voters, and especially on culture and social issues.
The other alternative, which is what we did after 2000, was just blame the candidate. Everybody dumped all over Al Gore, just like some are dumping on John Kerry now. And that, you know, the, what did Shakespeare say, The fault does not lie with the stars, it lies in us. And I think the Democrats should not just attack their stars, their candidates, but think about, what, how do we speak to folks who Democrats believe would be, we'd do better for them on their economic issues, but they feel so alienated from us on these social and cultural issues.
I think the president exploits them very cynically, but he still does it very successfully. And Democrats better find a way to deal with that.
COOPER: Bob, are Democrats scared of social and cultural issues, or talking about moral values?
NOVAK: They are terrified of it because, you know, one of the great things that comes out of the exit polls every election is that people who go to church on a regular basis, at least once a week, vote Republican about 62 percent. And there's only about a 38 percent Republican support for people who don't go church. It's a huge dividing line in the country.
But, you see, one of the things, Anderson, that in all the talk on this network, on other networks, you know, words that are seldom ever used are conservative and liberal, because liberals don't like to talk, use those words. But this is a conservative country. And what are, and the Democrats are a liberal party. What do they do? Do they, do they, they don't like to use the word. They claim that's labeling.
But it's a tremendous problem.
COOPER: We'll see what is beared out over the next four years. Paul Begala, Bob Novak, thanks.
BEGALA: Thanks, Anderson.
COOPER: U.S. and Iraqi troops are gearing up for a major assault in Fallujah. That tops our look at global stories in the uplink.
U.S. tanks and planes have pounded parts of the rebel city, destroying several militant fighting positions. An all-out offensive could be days, could be weeks away. The enemy, an unknown number of insurgent fighters and foreign terrorists, it is going to be a tough battle whenever it happens.
Northern Japan, powerful aftershocks now. A mad dash under tables, screaming. The region rumbles once again. Today's two aftershocks follow last month's earthquake which killed 39 people and injured thousands. A lot of scared kids there.
Eastern Iceland now, a volcano eruption burns through a glacier. A spectacular video. Explosions have sent black ash and smoke -- I know it's a little hard to tell what that is, it's black ash and smoke that was, blew up as high as 40,000 feet in the air. Airlines have been forced to divert or cancel flights. Luckily no lives or homes are in danger. The area is sparsely populated.
And Taipei, Taiwan, when a lion attacks -- take a look at this. All right, here's what's going on. This guy leapt into the lions' den at a zoo to try to convert the king of beasts to Christianity. The guy was shouting, "Jesus will save you." Apparently it didn't really translate into Lion.
The zoo used water guns and tranquilizers to drive the lions away. Amazingly, the guy stays calm, even grabbed back his shredded coat, and climbed out of the pen with just bite marks. I know it looks worse than it ends up being. He's getting, also getting treatment for his mental problems, which he obviously seems to have.
That's tonight's uplink for you.
360 next, postpartisan blues. Half the country feeling great, but half the country feeling down as the other half celebrates the election. A little help tonight for the politically down and out.
Also tonight, reshaping American justice. Find out what impact President Bush might have on the Supreme Court. Former nominee Robert Bork and attorney David Boies join us live.
And a little later, fast forward to 2008. Is Hillary Clinton on the horizon, or has the sun now set on her presidential prospects?
Lots to talk about tonight. In a moment, also today's 360 challenge. How closely you been following today's news? We'll test it. We'll see. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, for the majority of Americans who voted for President Bush, today was a good day. Some had a spring in their step, a smile on their faces. For Democrats, not so much. Here in New York, you could see them sulking at Starbuck's or moping at the mall.
For the Democratic Party and its millions of members, losing this bad has brought on a serious midweek crisis.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): This is a Bush supporter's idea of pure bliss. For the Kerry crowd, it was, well, let's just say a more solemn occasion.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a really sad day for America.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think we're all in trouble.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Extremely disappointed. It's -- I'm in disbelief.
COOPER: While the candidates were counseling a more conciliatory approach...
BUSH: When we come together and work together, there is no limit to the greatness of America.
SEN. JOHN KERRY, FORMER DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: We are required now to work together for the good of our country.
COOPER: ... it seems some of those on the -- well, how can we say this delicately? -- losing side are just looking for counseling. They are taking their anger to the airwaves.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "LARRY KING LIVE")
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (on phone): Hi, Larry.
LARRY KING, HOST: Hi.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm still in shock about this whole election.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And check out this e-mail from Jasmine, a 360 viewer. "Since Ohio went red, me and my friends are not well. We haven't left my dorm room, haven't even gone to class. We need professional help."
Well, Jasmine, here it is, a professional who says he understands.
ROBERT BUTTERWORTH, PHD, INTERNATIONAL TRAUMA CENTER: Well, you have to understand that a lot of people's hopes and dreams have been really tied up into the candidate.
COOPER: So what's a disheartened Democrat to do?
BUTTERWORTH: Go back to the gyms. Remember what their life was before the campaign. And start thinking about the holidays.
COOPER: And if that doesn't dampen the disappointment...
BUTTERWORTH: Get that proverbial blue Democratic candle out. Light it in that little quiet room and chant to yourself, it's only politics.
COOPER: And remember this. Picking up the pieces after a political loss may not be a piece of cake. On the other hand, hanging onto anger could cause a midweek crisis that's 56 million voters strong and four years long.
(END VIDEOTAPE) COOPER: Earlier, I talked about postpartisan blues with Democratic strategist and CNN contributor Donna Brazile.
You know, we've been getting tons of e-mails from Democrats who really are depressed. I mean, you know, really maudlin. You've been through this, certainly, before. What's your advice to them?
DONNA BRAZILE (D), CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, first of all, go ahead and mourn. It's OK. Lick your wounds and get up and get ready to fight again.
Four years ago was a terrible time, of course. We won that election and then only to see the Supreme Court change the outcome.
This time around, I think we can take the lessons learned from this past engagement and really rebuild the Democratic Party this time, in all 50 states and the District of Columbia.
COOPER: Do you really feel like rebuilding at this point? I mean, you know, so soon after the election, you seem optimistic. But are you putting just a brave face on it?
BRAZILE: Well, no question. I learned one thing from Karl Rove, who four years ago looked at the results and brought his party back together and said, You know what? Next time around we're going to beat the Democrats at turnout. Look at the results. Their expectations on the ground far exceeded our expectations. They won more states, got out more votes, clearly because they never stopped working.
So what I'm saying is that Democrats cannot spend a lot of time mourning. They got to get up and get ready to fight the next battle.
COOPER: I want to show you something Jon Stewart said on his program. Let's play the tape.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "THE DAILY SHOW WITH JON STEWART," THE COMEDY CHANNEL)
JON STEWART, HOST: Here's the final electoral college votes that we know right now. Can we throw that up there? The -- I think it's one -- it hasn't changed -- There it is. It looks very red, and then there's some blue there at the top, where many of us will most likely spend the next four years, I would imagine, huddled together and, in fact, weeping.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: You know, I mean, all joking aside, I mean, the country is really polarized. Do you actually expect Republicans to sort of make an effort? I mean, they were victorious. Why should they make an effort to reach over to Democrats?
BRAZILE: Well, they likely, they will probably not reach out. If anything, they will probably try to build upon their own success. Look, Democrats must go back out there, raise money, recruit candidates, and fight the next battle. I'm not going to lose a lot of sleep worrying about the next two years or the next four years and what Republicans will do to us. I think Democrats need to spend the next two years and four years going back, organizing to put our values into action.
COOPER: Certainly seems like there is a lot of work to do. Donna Brazile, appreciate you joining us. Thanks.
BRAZILE: Thank you.
COOPER: An elderly bench and an ailing chief justice. Tonight, what a new Supreme Court could mean for you. We go 360 with Robert Bork and David Boies.
A gut-wrenching loss for the Democrats. But what does it mean for Hillary Clinton? Has John Kerry's defeat opened or shut the door on her presidential prospects?
And Scott Peterson's life in the hands of the jury. How did the lawyers do? And how will the jury judge the accused?
360 continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it could be argued that the building holding the most power in the country is not the White House, but the Supreme Court. Right now, most legal experts say, the court consists of three conservatives, Justices Rehnquist, Scalia, and Thomas, two moderates, Justices O'Connor and Kennedy, and four liberals, Justices Ginsburg, Souter, Stevens, and Breyer.
But with Chief Justice William Rehnquist in poor health and the possibility that others may leave because of retirement, there's a good chance President Bush may be able to significantly alter the makeup of the Supreme Court. And that could alter the shape of this country for decades to come.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm looking forward to serving this country for four more years.
COOPER (voice-over): And those four years could see a transformation of the Supreme Court. With the exception of Clarence Thomas who is 56, all the justices are older than 65. And there's the possibility at least three may soon step down. Chief Justice William Rehnquist has not returned to the court since it was disclosed he has thyroid cancer. Many court watchers are predicting he won't be back. Justices John Paul Stevens, Sandra Day O'Connor and Ruth Bader Ginsburg have all battled cancer. All are over 70. Stevens is 81 leading to speculation that one and possibly all three may retire soon.
That could leave the president with possibly four vacancies to fill. Today he was asked what kind of justice he wants on the court.
BUSH: I told the people on the campaign trail that I'll pick somebody that knows the difference between personal opinion and the strict interpretation of the law. You might have heard that several times. I meant what I said.
COOPER: That may be telling. Based on their decisions some legal experts believe Rehnquist and Justices Anthony Scalia and Thomas fit the president's mold of strictly interpreting the constitution.
JEFFREY TOOBIN, SR. LEGAL ANALYST: President Bush has said the justices he admires most are Thomas and Scalia. And we can expect his Supreme Court appointments to reflect that admiration.
COOPER: If the president has the opportunity to choose three conservative justices to the bench it could have a profound impact on Roe v. Wade and other divisive issues.
TOOBIN: Depending on which three justices it is, Roe v. Wade, affirmative action, separation of church and state, all those areas could be dramatically transformed.
COOPER: But Republican Senator Arlen Specter who is in line to become chairman of the Senate judiciary committee recalled confirmation problems faced by some of Mr. Bush's judicial picks. And cautioned the president against nominees who are not in his words within the broad range of acceptability.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(on camera): On 360 we like to look at issues from all different angles. So tonight two very different perspectives on where the Supreme Court is now and where it may go. First from Washington I'm pleased to be joined by Robert Bork, former federal appeals court judge and Supreme Court nominee. Judge Bork, thank you very much for being with us.
How hopeful are you that the court will become more conservative in the next four years?
JUDGE ROBERT BORK, FMR. SUPREME COURT NOMINEE: It may be, but I think it's a long shot. Most of the justices in the past have been appointed by Republican presidents and it hasn't turned into a conservative court. It hasn't turned into a court that follows the constitution rather than making up new rights. Bush would have to be quite bold, identify the right people, nominate them and fight for them. Of course, he's got the wild card of Arlen Specter who may be chairman of the judiciary committee.
COOPER: I know he opposed your nomination, obviously. He said today that he thought the overturning of Roe v. Wade unlikely. Do you think it likely at some point whether the next four years or down the road?
BORK: Not in the next four years and I don't see it in the foreseeable future. COOPER: Just because you don't think the court itself will change?
BORK: Well, no, the court may change but I don't think the votes are there, for example, if Chief Justice Rehnquist isn't there, you've got one anti-Roe justice gone. And White was against Roe against Wade. Now what do you have? You have Scalia and Thomas. I don't think there's another vote.
COOPER: A lot of conservatives complain about activist judges, you wrote in your book, "Chorusing Virtue," you wrote quote, "what judges have wrought is a coup d'etat, slow moving and genteel but a coup d'etat nonetheless." Is the Supreme Court in your opinion right now too filled with activist judges?
BORK: I think the Supreme Court is generally kind of out of control. They are making up the constitution. You know, the decisions about Roe against Wade is one. But the decisions about pornography and the decisions about special rights for homosexuals and so forth, have nothing do with the constitution. They may be things that you want to legislate but they are not in the constitution.
COOPER: So obviously you are for a strict interpretation...
BORK: I wouldn't call it strict interpretation. I'd call it a reasonable interpretation.
COOPER: All politicians say they don't have a litmus test for judicial appointments. Whether that's true or not, the president certainly says it. He also says he wants to know whether the Supreme Court nominees will strictly stick to what's in the constitution. Isn't that really a litmus test?
BORK: It is. I think all politicians have a litmus test in a sense.
COOPER: And is that a good thing?
BORK: Yes, if you have the right litmus test it's a good thing. If have a test that says I want a justice who will discern the principles that are actually in the constitution and apply them and not make up new principles, that's a good litmus test.
COOPER: A lot of Democrats take issue with that notion of activist judges. From your perspective explain why you think so many judges have become activists.
BORK: It's a position of enormous power. It's a power that can't be checked by the political branches or by the people. And you give people that kind of power, they begin to use it. We've known that for a long time.
COOPER: So you think they are using their power to do things that they can't do at the ballot box.
BORK: Definitely. We have a culture war in this country. And it's largely the intellectual class or the elites or whatever you want to call them, use the courts to get things they could not get in a legislature, can't the public to vote for.
COOPER: Do you think the Supreme Court today is out of touch with the morality of where America is at right now?
BORK: Well, I don't really -- the Supreme Court shouldn't be in touch with the morality of America at the moment, it should be in touch with the constitution. If the morality is right or left that's not the Supreme Court's business. The Supreme Court's business is to apply the principles that are actually there.
COOPER: Judge Robert Bork, we appreciate you joining us tonight. Thank you very much.
Joining me now from Seattle is well-known attorney Robert Boies who argued before the Supreme Court for Al Gore during the disputed 2000 presidential election. Mr. Boies, thank you for being with us.
Let me ask you some of the same questions. Do you believe the Supreme Court today is too filled with what Judge Bork would refer to as activist judges?
DAVID BOIES, ATTORNEY: I think activism tends to be in the eye of the beholder. Certainly in 2000, I felt it was a pretty activist court that stepped in and ordered the Florida election officials to stop counting the votes in Bush v. Gore. Those five members included the three most conservative members of the court. So I think that when you talk about activism, what you usually mean is you agree or disagree with what's going on. If you disagree with a judge you call it activist. If you agree with what the judge is doing you call it strict constructionism.
COOPER: That's a good point. How -- I asked Judge Bork how hopeful he is there's going to be change the next four years. I guess maybe I'll ask you, how concerned are you that there's going to be a move to a more conservative court over the next four years?
BOIES: I think the court will probably become more conservative. Indeed, I think President Bush won the election. It wasn't exactly a landslide with 51 percent of the vote but he won the election. And as the winner he is entitled to pick judges. Now I agree with Senator Specter though that he's got to pick those judges within the broad range of reasonableness. And if he's outside of that range, then the constitution gives the Senate of the United States the right to reject those nominees. And I would expect that if President Bush steps outside of the range of reasonableness, the Senate would exercise that constitutional power.
COOPER: So something like Roe v. Wade, do you think it is under threat over the next four years?
BOIES: I doubt it over the next four years. I think it will take longer than that to reverse a decision as fundamental as Roe v. Wade. But I think steps could easily be taken in the next four years that would eventually lead to the overruling of Roe v. Wade. That is certainly high on the agenda of some members of the president's party.
COOPER: The process of picking a judge and the review by legislators is becoming a very politicized process whether you agree with that it should be or not. What is interesting to me about it is that often justices are picked and yet they end up being sort of different than what the people pick them kind of thought.
BOIES: Yes. I think that Earl Warren who was one of the most liberal judges, I think people would say in retrospect, was picked by a Republican president. I think that you cannot predict exactly how a judge will act once he or she goes on the bench. That's one of the advantages of lifetime tenure. On the other hand, I think that if you pick judges not because of their judicial abilities, not because of their scholarship, but because you expect them to adhere to a rigid ideological line then I think you can expect them to be predictable. I think for example the two justices that President Bush keeps singling out, Justices Scalia and Thomas were to a large extent picked because of their ideological reliability and I think they've proven that on court.
COOPER: David Boies, interesting perspective. I appreciate you joining us. Thanks, David.
And this story just in now, Mount Hood, Oregon, I want to show you some video that's happening right now. A rescue operation is under way right now in Mount Hood. Two hikers have apparently fallen into a crevice. You see it there. The rescue operation is under way.
A sheriff's office received an emergency cell phone call from one of the hikers. The caller said he and his friend had fallen about 100 feet into this crevice which you are seeing.
These images taken just a short time ago. But this rescue is still under way. We're continuing to monitor this. Apparently one of the hikers had injured his arm. Was able to use his cell phone. He had broken his arm. He used his cell phone. But one of the hikers has a very serious back injury, and that is the person who seems to be getting the most attention at this point. We're going to continue to follow this rescue operation under way right now on Mount Hood in Oregon.
Coming up next on 360, a very different tale, Scott Peterson's fate: it is in the hands of the jury right now. We're going to have some thoughts on what they may be debating and deliberating in "Justice Served" toinight.
Plus, why Kerry's loss may be Hillary Clinton's gain, so say some. Others say, it's not good news for her or northeastern liberals at all. We'll take a look at the "Raw Politics" of 2008 ahead.
Also in a moment, today's 360 challenge. Have you been following today's news pretty closely? We'll put that to the test. We'll see. Find out. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) COOPER: All right. Are you up to today's 360 challenge? Be the first to answer all 3 questions correctly, we'll send you a 360 T- shirt. No. 1, President Bush told world leaders today, we share a common what?
No. 2, How old is Clarence Thomas, the youngest Supreme Court Justice?
And finally, In Taiwan, a man tried to convert a lion to what?
Take take the challenge. Log on to CNN.com/360, click on the answer link, answer first, we'll send you the shirt. Find out last night's challenge leader and tonight's answers coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well in California today, the votes are still being counted. It's about Scott Peterson, you remember, not about the election. The murder trial that lasted 5 months after dropping off the radar screen for awhile. It is in the final phase: jury deliberation. They've been in the jury room for 2 days now. And still no sign of a verdict.
Covering the trial for us in Justice Served, from Redwood City, California is Gloria Allred. The attorney for Amber Frey. Gloria, thanks very much for being with us.
Tonight, we had hoped to be joined by Jayne Weintraub, criminal defense attorney, having some problems with that. We'll try to get to her as soon as we can during our discussion.
You were in the courtroom, Gloria, for the closing arguments. The prosecution bringing the case back to the victims, to Laci Peterson, to her unborn child. How effective was that?
GLORIA ALLRED, AMBER FREY'S ATTORNEY: I think it was very effective, Anderson. I think it was very important. They did start with a video of Laci in her kitchen and happy. You can hear her voice. And there she was. And really, Laci and Conner are what this case is all about. So, I think that was very important to bring that home to the jury.
They have seen autopsy photos of Laci and Conner, may they rest in peace, but to see her alive and well and to know that she's no longer here because someone murdered them, I think the jury needed to see that. It was important.
COOPER: The other dramatic moment, really, one of the many in this trial, was when your client, when the tapes of conversations between your client and Scott Peterson were played out in the court. I want to play some of them for just a second and talk about how you think these impacted the case. Let's listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
AMBER FREY, SCOT PETERSON'S FRM. LOVER: Should I be afraid of my own life?
SCOTT PETERSON, ALLEGEDLY MURDERED WIFE: Not from me, Amber.
FREY: What?
PETERSON: Not from me.
FREY: Not from you? From possibly from whoever too Laci, should I be in fear of them?
PETERSON: I don't think so. I don't se why.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
COOPER: I mean, this is just one of many recordings that was played out in court. What kind of an impact do you think this had on the jury?
ALLRED: Well, I think that all of the tapes that Amber made of conversations that she had with Scott after Laci disappeared, had an enormous impact, I think, on the jury, in the sense they could never look at Scott Peterson the same way again. And I think that it made it really impossible for him to take the witness stand and testify.
Because listening to those tapes, we heard, one, that he seemed to be obsessed with Amber Frey and continuing to have a relationship with her even after Laci disappeared, even calling her 45 minutes before the vigil for his missing wife. In addition, we heard his lies over and over and over again. And the fact that he didn't seem to have any feeling towards Laci.
I think all of that was extremely important. And the idea that he would continue this relationship with her, and that he acknowledged on the tapes that he had said that he had lost his wife, and these would be the first holidays without her before Laci ever went missing, I think that could be very important.
COOPER: Gloria, as I said, we hoped Jayne Weintraub was joining us, a criminal defense attorney in Miami. There was a problem with the trasmission, so she's not, but I can hear her rolling her eyes in Miami as she listens to you speaking right now, because as you know, the defense in their closing argument said, look, all this stuff proves that, you know Scott Peterson is a cad doesn't prove anything about him being a murderer.
ALLRED: Well, that is, Anderson, the defense line. OK, he's a liar. He's, you know, in fact Mark Geragos even said to the jury he got caught with his pands down. Well, I would add he got caught with his pands down and his lies exposed. But he's saying he's an adulterer, but he's not a murderer. Well, that is the defense position.
The prosecutor is saying the following, look, there is a motive for killing. And the motive is not only about Amber, it's bigger than that, it's about Scott Peterson wanting the freedom from the life that he was living with Laci. Yes, maybe he had affairs before or relationships, but that was very different because now he was about to become a father.
Now, perhaps, not only did he not want to be married to laci he didn't want the responsibility of having a child, maybe having to be home every night, maybe having to pay child support. And, also, he was obsessed with Amber. We remember that on the tape he was talking about wanting to have a future with Amber, wanting to be with her forever.
COOPER: Gloria, I want to jump in, because Jayne is now here. We still have a few seconds left. Jayne, I appreciate you joining us. I'm sorry about the technical problems.
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Thanks for filling in for me, Anderson.
COOPER: Well, I heard your eyes rolling there in Miami when Gloria was talking. What is your take on this? Where do things stand now? You heard probably what Gloria said. What do you think?
WEINTRAUB: Here's the bottom line. It doesn't matter what Mark said before or what he promised to deliver. All that matters is that it's up to the state to prove how she died from premeditated design or not.
You know, Anderson not guilty doesn't mean innocent. And that jury is in there in the jury room talking about it and thinking about it. They are saying to themselves, just what Gloria is talking about. For example, maybe he didn't want to be a father. And another jury is going to say Amber had a 3-year-old, so forget that.
Then he's going to say. Well, why didn't he get a divorce? And the answer is well why didn't he get a divorce? He could have gotten a divorce. You know what the bottom line is it's up to the state. They charged with him with first degree murder, sticking the death penalty. They kept him in jail for 2 years. They charged on Christmas Eve in her home, she was killed from a premeditated design. Anderson, not one scintilla of evidence where she died or who killed her. And the fact that he didn't grieve
(CROSSTALK)
WEINTRAUB: doesn't mean he killed her.
COOPER: Wait. I'm sorry to jump in, but we're going to have to go. I'm sorry. We are limited on time. Janye, I wanted to get you. It was short, but it was effective, Jayne.
Gloria Allred, good to talk to you. Jayne Weintraub, thanks very much.
Coming up next on 360: jockying for 2008. Already it's happening. Hillary Clinton for president? Well, that's "Raw Politics." Take a look.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) COOPER: John Kerry supporters may already be looking for another big name Democrat to win back the White House, Clinton, Senator Hillary Clinton that is. Today New York Senator Chuck Schumer said his colleague is the forerunner for the Democratic Parties presidential nomination in 2008. They are already talking about it. While Senator Clinton has been saying so far she's not interested, hey, it's never too early to start speculating about "Raw Politics."
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEN. HILLARY CLINTON, NEW YORK: It will be great to have a Democrat back in the White House.
COOPER: OK, so Hillary Clinton said that before Bush won and she meant John Kerry. But Kerry's loss may be Clinton's gain. Some Democrats already have their eyes on her. Standing by her man as a two-term first lady knows, Hillary Clinton, knows her way around the white house. In 2000, she became the only former first lady ever elected to the U.S. Senate. And she's now one of the most powerful elected officials in the Democratic Party.
BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT: If she wanted to present herself and if she got elected she would be magnificent.
COOPER: She has the support of her husband, the parties rock star, and Hillary Clinton is a commanding figure on the national political stage.
SEN. CHARLES SCHUMER (D), NEW YORK: She is totally dedicated to serving the people of New York, and she's a great senator. I also think she's one of the natural leaders for our party.
COOPER: Insiders say Clinton has to focus getting reelected in 2006, admitting you can't run for president with shaky support at home. And there are plenty of questions. Is she mainstream enough?
JUDY WOODRUFF, "INSIDE POLITICS": The biggest obstacle for Hillary Clinton is that she's a liberal from the northeast, from New York State. That's what John Kerry is, and that's a big reason why he was defeated.
COOPER: Plus is Hillary Clinton likable enough? There are plenty of Hillary haters from her husbands years in the White House and there's the female factor.
WOODRUFF: She also would have to deal with I think just the built-in suspicion about a woman and built-in suspicion toward the fact she's a Clinton.
COOPER: British book makers are already pegging Hillary Clinton as the favorite in 2008, a little too early to bet in the world of "Raw Politics."
Certainly is too early. 360 next, Democrats a vanishing breed, is it possible?
We're going to take that to "The Nth Degree."
And the 360 Challenge. Here's another look at tonight's questions, no. 1, President Bush told world leaders today we share a common what?
No. 2, how old is Clarence Thomas, the youngest Supreme Court justice?
Finally in Taiwan a man tries to convert lions to what?
Have you been paying attention. Log on to cnn.com/360. Click on the answer link to play.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: All right, time now for the answer to today's 360 challenge.
No. 1, President Bush told world leaders we share a common what? The answer, enemy.
No. 2, how old is Clarence Thomas, the youngest Supreme Court justice?
The answer, 56. We put the wrong answer up there. (UNINTELLIGIBLE) that is clearly wrong.
And finally in Taiwan a man tried to convert lions to what? The answer, Christianity.
First person to answer all three questions correctly will be sent a 360 T-shirt. Tune in tomorrow, find out if your the lucky one. Last night's winner, Keri Shilington of Bartlett Illinois. Another "360 Challenge" and another chance to win tomorrow.
Tonight taking a modest proposal to "The Nth Degree." We better face facts. The sooner we put Democrats on the endangered species list the better. If we want our children's children to be able to see these magnificent creatures in the wild, there really isn't any time to lose.
Consider, Democrats were once to be found everywhere, from end of the continental U.S. to the other and from north to south, in many different climates and topographies. That was then. This is now. More and more, Democrats are confined to small, widely scattered pockets, mostly around tall builds and within driving distance of three and four-star restaurants. There were reduced to supporting themselves by playing the harmonica, making low documentary budget films and writing accounts of their lives. It's sad really. If we don't want Democrats to go the way of the buffalo or the tall grass prairie over the passenger pigeon, we'd better act now. It's up to each of us. Put a few healthy Democrats aside in a clean dry place, keep them in wine and cheese. Check in on them from time to time. We have at least maintain a breeding stock.
I'm Anderson Cooper, thanks for watching 360. Coming up next, PAULA ZAHN NOW."
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