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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Idaho Manhunt Continues; Kansas Bank Robbery Ends in Shootout; Pakistani Politician Dismisses War on Terror
Aired May 19, 2005 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, HOST: A bank heist gone bad, the bank robber gunned down. But why did he make his hostages strip? And where was he planning to go once he hijacked a plane?
A government official caught on tape, gambling on illegal cockfights. Tonight, 360 takes you inside the cockfighting pit, a multimillion-dollar business thriving in the shadows of the law.
Is this pill safe, or not? Some say it's a dieter's dream. Others call it a pill of death. Tonight, should the diet drug ephedra go back on the shelves?
An undercover agent on the most dangerous assignment of his life. Tonight, meet a real-life Donnie Brasco. He infiltrated one of the country's most brutal motorcycle gangs and helped put dozens behind bars.
And up close and personal, maybe too personal, with Britney Spears and Mr. Britney Spears. Why their sex talk on her new reality show has got viewers blushing inside the box.
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is a two-hour special edition of ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: Good evening.
We begin tonight with developments in the desperate search for two children in Idaho who vanished after a triple murder in Coeur d'Alene. A so-called person of interest is no longer of interest, so now it's back to square one. The only thing right now that we're sure of in this case, a killer is on the loose, and two kids are missing.
Sean Callebs joins me live from Coeur d'Alene, where he's been following the investigation.
Sean, is there any progress at this point?
SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Really, the investigation has been going very slowly. That's one thing authorities have been saying. And you're exactly right when you say either a killer or killers remain on the loose. Authorities really have very few answers tonight.
One thing we do know for sure. We've heard from one of the family members involved in this case of the two missing children, as well as the triple murder. The biological father of the two missing children and one of the dead found in the home on Monday made an emotional plea this afternoon, begging for his children to be released safely.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE GROENE, FATHER OF MISSING CHILDREN: I'd like to address my children's abductors or abductor. Please, please release my children safely. They had nothing to do with any of this. Release them in a safe area where the law enforcement can find them. Call the help line. Let them know where they can be found. Please, we need the safe return of those children. Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CALLEBS: Boy, an emotional Steve Groene, the biological father of the children. He is someone that investigators cleared very early on. They spoke with him, said he is not a suspect in this case, simply someone who is emotionally devastated after the events that unfolded here in the northern part of Idaho either late Sunday or sometime on Monday.
Meanwhile, the investigation goes on. The person who had been called a person of interest, a somewhat nebulous title, authorities wouldn't say if he was a material witness or someone involved in the case. They have interviewed Robert Roy Lutner -- he's 33 years old -- for something like seven hours, the FBI as well as sheriff's officers here with the Kootenai County Sheriff's Office. They say he is not involved in the crime. He voluntarily took a lie detector test and passed.
About the only significant information we know he did pass on to authorities, there was some kind of gathering here Sunday night at the home, Sunday afternoon. And the sheriff's officers are asking anyone who may have been at that gathering to come forward.
They've been going through the house with forensics teams. They culled a number of fingerprints off. They're trying to determine who was here, if they knew anything, any information about this crime.
What we do know, 40-year-old Brenda Groene, her 13-year-old son, Slade, and 37-year-old Mark McKenzie were found murdered in the home sometime Monday around 6:00 p.m. They had been bound, and the crime was considered very, very grisly.
Now, authorities continue to try and glean what information they can. There have been autopsies performed on the two adults. They should wrap up the autopsy on the child sometime today.
Now, the search in the wooded area around this home had been called off much of the morning. But it has really ramped up this afternoon. There are cadaver dogs as well as search and rescue dogs out here. Divers have been in ponds and creeks bear near the area. We also know that a septic pond near the home was drained yesterday. Nothing was found.
And the Amber Alert continues to flash on the highways. Still no sign of these two missing children, Anderson, once again, nine-year- old Dylan, he is 60 pounds, four foot tall, blonde hair, crew cut and blue eyes, and eight-year-old Shasta, his younger sister, very slight in build, less than 40 pounds, four feet -- less than 4 feet tall. She has long auburn hair and hazel eyes.
And authorities are just asking for any kind of information at this point. They are simply stumped.
COOPER: All right. Sean Callebs, thanks very much for that report.
This is bizarre triple murder, as he said, the bodies were found Monday at 6:00 p.m. There seem to have been some sort of gathering Sunday night in the home. Obviously, police are trying to find out as many people who were in that home as possible, trying to get whatever information they can.
Joining us now from Coeur d'Alene is the man in charge of the search for Dylan and Shasta, Captain Ben Wolfinger of the Kootenai County Sheriff's Department.
Appreciate you being with us very much, Captain Wolfinger, thanks, thank you.
Yesterday around this time, you know, we've been talking about this person of interest, Robert Roy Lutner. You talked to him. You decided he had nothing to do with the murders and the disappearance of the children. Why was that? I mean, what it, what it, was it something he said? Was it simply that he took the lie detector?
CAPT. BEN WOLFINGER, KOOTENAI COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT: Well, as you know, as Sean said, Mr. Lutner was interviewed for nearly seven hours. And through that interview, that whole interview process, the investigators told me, they believed him. They actually believed him.
They -- he -- they actually caught him in a lie, a very minor lie. He was concerned about a probation violation. They challenged him on it. And he was truthful from that point forward. And then he volunteered to take the lie detector test. That just confirmed with them what they believed was those well-trained investigators, those well-trained interviewers, believed he was telling the truth.
COOPER: Do you know what happened in that house on Sunday night? I mean, I, the bodies were found Monday, I'm told, at 6:00 p.m., according to Sean. He said there was some sort of a gathering Sunday night. Do you know, do you know what the gathering was about?
WOLFINGER: Well, it's been described as a barbecue, Sunday afternoon, early-evening barbecue with some friends. Folks were in the house just having a good time. And much like any of us would have an afternoon barbecue. That's, that was the gathering here.
COOPER: Do you, do you have any other suspects at this point?
WOLFINGER: We don't have any other suspects at this point. But the forensic teams are continuing to work in the house, very meticulously, treating each drop of blood as a new piece of evidence, checking the entire house for fingerprints. And hopefully, that information that they glean, after it goes to Quantico for analysis, one of the FBI labs, will give us a suspect in this incident.
COOPER: What was the crime scene like? I mean, I, we've heard that they, these people were bound, that it was very violent. Are there any -- I mean, just from looking at the crime scene, is there any sense of, I mean, was there overkill? Did it seem an unusual crime scene in any way?
WOLFINGER: Well, I think any time you have a triple murder, it's an unusual crime scene. That's for sure. The coroner released late this afternoon that the cause of death was death by blunt-force trauma to the head on all three victims. That -- obviously, you know, head wounds bleed. And we recognize that. That's made the crime scene a lot more intense and a lot harder for investigators to investigate.
COOPER: So each was killed with blunt-force trauma, one by one, while they were bound?
WOLFINGER: Well, all I can tell you is what the coroner's report said. I was just shown it just moments ago. And he sent that report out to the media.
COOPER: Do you think these kids are alive, these missing kids?
WOLFINGER: You know, that's been the question we've had since Tuesday morning. And I have to tell you, it just makes no sense to me to kill three members of a family and take two somewhere else. I have to believe those children are alive, and we'll find them.
COOPER: I hope so. Captain Ben Wolfinger, appreciate you taking the time to speak with us. Thanks very much, Captain.
WOLFINGER: Thank...
COOPER: Coming up next in this special edition of 360, a superstar athlete turned politician. He's blamed for sparking some deadly anti-American riots. Does he think he went too far? Find out in just a moment.
Also ahead tonight, fair fight, or animal cruelty? We take you inside the shadowy world of cockfighting -- a multimillion-dollar business, illegal in a lot of states, legal in some. The question is, should it be legal or illegal everywhere? We're covering all the angles on that.
And a little later, we'll introduce you to a motorcycle cop. Meet a man who risked everything -- and I'm talking everything -- to infiltrate a ruthless, violent gang.
All that ahead. First your picks, the most popular stories on CNN.com right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) COOPER: Well, feel like we've seen that an awful lot lately. An angry scene in Afghanistan last week, deadly riots after "Newsweek" reported that American interrogators at Guantanamo Bay flushed the Muslim holy book, the Koran, down a toilet. Now, "Newsweek" has since retracted that article.
As you know, we've been following the story closely, trying to get all the angles. And tonight, we want to introduce you to a man named Imran Khan. He's the Pakistani politician who "Newsweek" says sparked the uprising by pointing out its report during a news conference.
My interview with him in a moment.
But first, some background on who Imran Khan really is.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): Since the days after September 11, Pakistan has been one of the United States' most important allies in the war on terror. And like many Pakistanis, Imran Khan isn't happy about it. The difference is, when he talks, people listen.
Imran Khan was a world-class cricket player who became a high- profile politician, marrying and divorcing a British billionaire's daughter, Jemima Goldsmith, along the way. Khan's a member of Pakistan's parliament and has been called a valuable bridge between East and West.
But when "Newsweek" published its now-retracted allegation of Korans being desecrated at Gauntanamo, Imran Khan called a press conference to denounce the United States and the war on terror.
IMRAN KAHN, PAKISTANI POLITICIAN: It is self-defeating, this war on terrorism.
(subtitled) On one hand, they demand we help them. On the other hand, they take our book, which the whole world knows, even Americans know, how sacred it is for us. Our whole religion is based on it, and they are treating it this way.
COOPER: Khan also blasted Pakistan's pro-U.S. government.
KAHN: If our government has become a frontline state, isn't it its responsibility to take up the issue, take up the issue with the American Embassy, call the American ambassador and demand an apology? We should say there should be an inquiry, and if such a thing is happening in Gauntanamo Bay, it should be punished.
COOPER: Khan's May 6 news conference got a lot of press and a lot of radio play in the Muslim world. A few days later, anti-U.S. rioting broke out in neighboring Afghanistan.
By last weekend, Muslims in Pakistan and around the world were demonstrating, rioting, even killing each other in the streets.
Now that "Newsweek" says it got the story wrong, the question is, what does Imran Khan say?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, earlier today I got a response from Imran Khan in an exclusive interview. Here's what he had to say.
Mr. Khan, in the current "Newsweek" issue, reporter Evan Thomas talks about the events that led up to the violence recently and the rioting, and he writes, and I quote, "The spark was apparently lit at a press conference held on Friday, May 6, by Imran Khan. Brandishing a copy of that week's "Newsweek," Khan exclaimed, 'This is what the U.S. is doing, desecrating the Koran.'"
Do you think that's an accurate statement? And do you feel responsibility in any way for the bloodshed that ensued?
KHAN: I do not think that's an accurate statement. Firstly, the news item would have come out anyway, because once something got into the "Newsweek," it was only a matter of time before other papers would have picked up.
Secondly, my party was -- is called Movement for Justice. We came into being to protect human rights, to have rule of law in our country, independent judicial system. Now, we always have stood up for human rights, whether abused by the Pakistani government, human rights abuse of our own citizens, or, in this case, which, for a Muslim, is the ultimate humiliation, to use the Holy Koran as a way of extracting information out of prisoners.
COOPER: There, I mean, your critics would say, I mean, would equate that to yelling "Fire" in a crowded theater, knowing the incendiary nature of the charges, holding a press conference in a time of -- you know, that we live in now, is tantamount to encouraging violence.
KHAN: Well, what does that mean? That if there's a fear of writing or reaction, one does not speak out against human rights abuse? I mean, do we just keep quiet about something like what happened in Gauntanamo Bay?
And now there's more evidence coming out. The prisoners who were in Gauntanamo Bay are speaking out against specifically this issue, about the desecration of the Holy Koran.
COOPER: In a "Los Angeles Times" editorial, Irshad Manji, author of "The Trouble with Islam Today," criticized you for trying to, what she said was incite Muslims. She wrote that you "rallied his countrymen to express rage based on one paragraph in 'Newsweek' and knew his comments about 'Newsweek' would feed the most reflexive of Muslim impulses, to treat the Quran with uncritical veneration."
KHAN: People like us who are not religious, belong to the religious right, if we, the mainstream political parties, or who are considered moderate in our country, if we don't speak about it, then these issues are picked up by the religious right. And they are being strengthened in the Muslim world. The -- what the U.S. needs to do is to address this problem, not try and push it under the carpet. Investigate the issue. Put the culprits behind bars. And that is how you can start winning the hearts and minds of the Muslim world.
COOPER: I want to play you something Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice had to say after this controversy erupted. Let's play that clip.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONDOLEEZZA RICE, SECRETARY OF STATE: Respect for the religious freedom of all individuals is one of the founding principles of the United States. The protection of a person's right to worship freely and without harassment is a principle that the government and the people of the United States take very seriously.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Do you believe her? And do you think people in Pakistan believe her?
KHAN: Well, I think that's why there has to be a proper investigation into specifically the desecration of the Holy Koran, because that goes against what Mrs. Condoleezza Rice said. I think it needs to be pointed out that this is not a war against Islam, and that action would be taken against those people who have offended Muslim public opinion.
COOPER: Mr. Khan, we appreciate your perspective, and we appreciate you being on the program tonight. Thank you very much.
KHAN: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: We are following a number of other stories right now. Erica Hill from HEADLINE NEWS joins us with the latest at about 19 past the hour. Hey, Erica.
ERICA HILL, HEADLINE NEWS: Hey, Anderson.
We're actually going to stay in the Middle East for our first story. That's where First Lady Laura Bush is headed tonight. Mrs. Bush's first stop will be Jordan, where she'll speak Saturday at the World Economic Forum. The first lady will also visit Israel and Egypt. The goals of her five-day trip, to promote education and women's issue.
Seismologist say the earthquake that triggered the killer tsunami in Asia back in December shook every inch of the Earth's surface. And not only that, it was the longest quake ever recorded, with the biggest fault rupture, up to 800 miles, which spread for 10 minutes. The earthquake and the tsunami killed at least 170,000 people in seven countries.
Miami, Florida: the U.S. files charges against a Cuban militant. Luis Posada Carriles is accused of entering the country illegally. He's being held at a detention center in El Paso, Texas. The former CIA operative is hailed as a freedom fighter to some, but to others, he's a terrorist responsible for a series of deadly bombings.
Little Canada, Minnesota: check this out. Ow. A sheriff's deputy lucky to be alive after being hit by a pickup truck. He was actually trying to help a woman whose car was stuck -- ouch, again -- in a ditch. The deputy did survive. That's the good news. And a little later on 360, I understand, we'll be hearing from the deputy and the woman who witnessed the accident.
COOPER: Ay!
HILL: That's just insane.
COOPER: Yi, yi, yi, yi, yi.
HILL: Exactly. You took the words right out of my mouth.
COOPER: Yes, you know, I've seen that a bunch of times. So I did, I talked to the deputy a little bit, a little while ago. We're going to play that a little bit later on 360. (INAUDIBLE), I mean, and he knows he is just lucky to be alive, and he...
HILL: He's amazing.
COOPER: Yes, incredible. He doesn't have whiplash or anything. It's amazing.
HILL: A broken rib, nothing?
COOPER: Nothing, nothing.
HILL: My gosh.
COOPER: He's got a few cuts and scrapes. I mean, the guy was tossed like a rag doll. It just, it's an amazing (INAUDIBLE).
HILL: If there's ever a disaster, I want to stand next to him.
COOPER: Yes, I know, exactly. We'll have that interview a little bit later on on tonight's program.
Erica, thanks very much. See you again in about 30 minutes.
Coming up next on 360...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am your father.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: "Star Wars" politics. The battle of good versus evil. Is George Lucas taking on the president? Going behind the scenes on that. Also tonight, cockfighting. Is it a fair fight, as some say, in a couple of states where it's legal, or animal cruelty? Going to hear from all sides.
Plus, meet a small-town mayor who was busted for betting on cockfighting.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: So here's a pop quiz for you tonight. Tonight, you're watching a scene right now from, A, "Return of the Jedi," B, "Revenge of the Sith," or, C, a political convention.
The answer, it seems, may depend on your view of the world. See, the battle between good and evil in the "Star Wars" saga is crossing over from a galaxy far, far away to the universe of raw, raw politics.
Judy Woodruff explains.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JUDY WOODRUFF, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A few days ago, in a land not so far away, the Cannes crowd looked at Darth Vader and saw George Bush.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is where the fun begins.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: When Anakin Skywalker, the young Vader, said, "If you're not with me, you're my enemy," some moviegoers heard this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: And in the epic clash of galactic powers, they saw the war in Iraq.
Were they right? George Lucas says the original "Star Wars" movie sprung from the ashes of Vietnam, making Vader a little less Bush and a little more Nixon, though Lucas is quick to draw connections.
GEORGE LUCAS, DIRECTOR, "REVENGE OF THE SITH": The parallels between what we did in Vietnam and what we're doing in Iraq now are unbelievable.
WOODRUFF: At its heart, "Star Wars" has always been a political parable. Why do you think Ronald Reagan called the Soviet Union...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RONALD WILSON REAGAN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: ... (INAUDIBLE) an evil empire...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: ... the language of Lucas, spoken across the political galaxy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I favor cuts in the Defense budget and carrier groups and troops in Europe, in Star Wars in any number of other areas.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: Even in these dark days with an earthly Senate torn asunder...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, MOVEON.ORG AD)
ANNOUNCER: One senator, seduced by a dark vision of absolute power, seeks to destroy this fabled order, replacing fair judges with far-right clones. To do this, he's ready to use a nightmare weapon known as the nuclear option.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: Yes, that's Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist. The liberal group MoveOn.org is spending $150,000 to run that ad.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don't make me destroy you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: "Revenge of the Sith" will surely make 10 times that sum by next week, with or without the Force.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I hope right you are.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: Judy Woodruff, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well we can't say good-bye to "Star Wars" tonight without paying tribute to the Internet's number-one Jedi master. Have you seen this young man before? Take a look. Oh, yes. I love him. He's 15 years old, he's a "Star Wars" fan from Quebec. He made himself this video on his computer. It's been an Internet classic since it was first posted a couple years ago.
The video really has taken on a life of its own. Millions of Web surfers have appreciated his sweet skills. But his Internet fans decided he needed some help, some special effects. So, thanks to computer graphics and sound cards, the boy with what looks to be a golf-ball retriever is transformed into the "Star Wars" Kid. Watch.
Don't you miss being a kid? "Star Wars" Kid, I am your father.
A government official, caught on tape gambling on illegal cockfights. Tonight, 360 takes you inside the cockfighting pit, a multimillion-dollar business thriving in the shadows of the law.
Is this pill safe, or not? Some say it's a dieter's dream. Others call it a pill of death. Tonight, should the diet drug ephedra go back on the shelves?
An undercover agent on the most dangerous assignment of his life. Tonight, meet a real-life Donnie Brasco. He infiltrated one of the country's most brutal motorcycle gangs and helped put dozens behind bars.
This two-hour edition of 360 continues in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, somewhere tonight in the United States, somewhere possibly right now, dozens of people, maybe even a few hundred, are watching a battle that'll end in certain death for one of the fighters, if not for both of them. It's the centuries-old blood sport of cockfighting. Now, many states ban it, and soon President Bush may sign a bill into law that will make it illegal nationwide. For now, in some states, like Louisiana and New Mexico, cockfighting is a legal and lucrative way of life for business owners and gamblers, who vow to continue the killing.
CNN's Rich Sanchez investigates.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): What you are looking at is illegal, secretly recorded by the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. It's a cockfight, not uncommon in the U.S., where, despite laws against it, enthusiasts seem unable to control the urge. As it is, on this night, in this particular town, nestled in the corner of Georgia, where more than 300 people are congregated around a fighting pit, ready to watch, gamble, or both. For them and thousands of others, cockfighting has become a complex game of hide-and-seek played out in cities all over the country by police and "cockers," as they're called.
(on camera): So what is it, then, that makes this bust here in the mountains of northeast Georgia different from any of those others? The answer? One man.
(voice-over): And here he is on tape. The man entrusted by the citizens of Blue Ridge to uphold the law is, according to the GBI, showing little regard for the laws pertaining to gambling and cockfighting. We called the mayor for comment, but he chose not to talk to us.
But in Louisiana, we found a mayor who would talk. Danny Louviere is not only a mayor but a prosecutor, as well. As a Cajun, he's right at home here in the bayou country, where the alligator, the crawfish and etouffe, are always fresh. It's also a place where fighting roosters is as much a part of the tradition as the Cajun cooking.
MAYOR DANNY LOUVIERE, SUNSET, LOUISIANA: To those people who say that this is a heinous thing and this is not the thing to be doing, I would simply say, Look in your own backyard first before you come look in our backyard.
SANCHEZ: Right about now, you may be asking yourself why it is the mayor in northeast Georgia won't talk to us but the mayor in Louisiana will, why one mayor appears in a police raid while the other talks openly with his police officers about cockfighting. Here's why. Here in Louisiana, cockfighting is legal. What's more, it's a multi- million-dollar business, one that may soon evaporate if the president signs a new farm bill that would make it illegal to transport game fowl across state lines.
It's a measure that would have a national impact on people like Gerald and Stanlina (ph) Allen of North Carolina, who sell feed, vitamins and medicine. They say they'd be devastated.
GERALD ALLEN, SUPPLY STORE OWNER: The mail order we do, the game fowl people we work with, that would be 85 percent of our business. We would have to disemploy some people. You know, we couldn't keep them on the payroll.
SANCHEZ: So who are these men and women who spend up to $15,000 a year in feed and up to $25,000 a year in travel to fight roosters? Here is how their action is characterized by animal rights activists.
WAYNE PACELLE, HUMANE SOCIETY: By society's standards, does this measure up? Is this conduct that we think is civil and decent and humane? And I don't think, by any test, you could say that these actions are appropriate.
GEORGE O'BRIEN, COCKFIGHTER: They don't understand it. We're basically sportsmen. People are urbanized today, and they don't really know where eggs come from. They don't know where the meat comes from. They think it comes out of a machine.
SANCHEZ (on camera): How does it make you feel, knowing that once that bill is signed, all four of you will be felons overnight?
LARRY WHITEHEAD, COCKFIGHTER: There's brick masons here. There's dairy people. There's lawyers. There's ever walk of life, people into this. And overnight, with one signature, they will be a felon because people aren't -- they're not going to stop. JERRY WALLACE, COCKFIGHTER: I farmed for 38 years, and I've got everything wrong (INAUDIBLE) That's all I've got to do now, enjoy my chickens. And now they want to take what little I've got going to keep me alive, and they want to take it away from us.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): It's a bitter and emotional issue, one these men feel so strongly about, they eagerly demonstrate what they say these animals do naturally.
O'BRIEN: We just show them each other.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Well, next on this two-hour edition of 360...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: People would say you're engaging them to kill themselves or to kill each other. Is that what they'd say?
DALE, CHICKEN BREEDER: Oh, they'd say a lot worse than that. They call me a bloodthirsty, drug-dealing -- you know, I mean, we've been called all kinds of names.
SANCHEZ: How does it make you feel?
DALE: Not good because it's a lie.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Part two of Rich Sanchez's report, "Inside the Secret Society of Cockfighting.
And a little later: An undercover agent penetrates one of America's most brutal outlaw gangs, part of our special report, "Justice Undercover."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LOUVIERE: Most people who say that this is a heinous thing and this is not the thing to be doing, I would simply say, Look in your own backyard first before you come look in our backyard.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: What they're talking about is cockfighting. Before the break, we gave you a look at the blood sport, cockfighting, a violent form of gambling that is allowed in some states, banned in others. And the people who raise the roosters to kill and the gamblers who bet on the fights insist cockfighting is not cruel. They insist it's humane, and tonight, they want to prove it to you. Let's return now to Rick Sanchez, who picks up the story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) O'BRIEN: It's impossible to force an animal to fight. Impossible.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): It's a candid conversation that provides a rare glimpse into a world that has increasingly become a secret society.
(on camera): Do you love animals? Do you love animals?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
SANCHEZ: Love animals. Then why do you let them fight to the death?
WALLACE: It's their heritage.
SANCHEZ: Their what?
WALLACE: Their heritage. That's all they know to do.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): In fact, these men are so convinced what they do is natural, God's way, as they like to say, they willingly demonstrate what they call the animals' combative nature.
O'BRIEN: Well, what we're going to do now is just turn them loose and show everybody that you don't make them fight. We only let them fight. So I'll show you what they'll do. We'll just show them each other. This will continue until one is dead.
SANCHEZ: Is it natural? Are the men right to say they're just watching something that would happen anyway? We asked the game fowl industry's most prominent critic, animal rights activist Wayne Pacelle.
PACELLE: Yes, they're fighting on their own, at some level. But they've been placed in a circumstance and a situation, and they've been bred for specific aggression.
SANCHEZ (on camera): People would say you're engaging them to kill themselves or to kill each other. Is that what they say?
DALE, CHICKEN BREEDER: Oh, they'd say a lot worse than that. They call me a blood-thirsty, drug-dealing -- you know, I mean, we've been called all kinds of names.
SANCHEZ: How does it make you feel?
DALE: Not good because it's a lie.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): Dale, who prefers we don't use his last name, says his birds are actually pampered.
DALE: Got a little bit of applesauce on his mouth here.
SANCHEZ (on camera): You feed them applesauce?
DALE: Oh, I -- yes, I grind apples for them. They get -- you know, we don't -- I...
SANCHEZ: That's it right there, what we're looking at (INAUDIBLE) ?
DALE: This is the applesauce. This is just part of the apple.
SANCHEZ: That's like what a baby eats. And you individually feed each one.
DALE: Yes. Yes.
SANCHEZ: It seems crazy. I mean...
DALE: Well, it's just -- you know, it's a matter of keeping them really healthy. You know, the animal rights people say we use drugs. I'm not saying there aren't people that don't. You know, it's just like in horse racing or anything else, there's bad people. I never give my chickens drugs.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): What makes Dale unique is he's raised both game fowl for fighting and poultry for restaurants. He says there's no comparison as to which bird he'd rather be.
DALE: I want to live for 42 days in a crowded house, where if anything goes wrong -- a spot of blood -- you know, those chickens are cannibalized in those houses. There's all kinds of things that go on in chicken houses that don't go on in game fowl ranches.
SANCHEZ: We checked with USDA and Agriculture officials and found his statement to be accurate. Chickens raised for fast food consumption are often slaughtered after just six weeks. And their short lives are lived in conditions so cramped, many actually cannibalize each other.
(on camera): How big is this? How big is this?
DALE: It's 4 by 12 by.
SANCHEZ: It's 4 by 12?
DALE: It's 4 by 12 by 8 foot high.
SANCHEZ: That's pretty big.
DALE: Yes.
SANCHEZ: I mean, that's -- that's a pretty good size living space for one tiny little animal, isn't it?
DALE: Right, especially when you consider that commercial poultry are given less than one square foot per bird. Less than one square foot. SANCHEZ (on camera): It's a comparison that has not gone unnoticed by animal rights activists, who say they've set their sights on commercial breeders, as well.
PACELLE: We at the Humane Society of the United States have long criticized the industrialization of agriculture, and we want to have animals in more extensive systems and we want them to have a decent life if they're going to be slaughtered for food.
SANCHEZ: With Hollywood stars like Pamela Anderson and Rue McClanahan fighting to end cockfighting in New Mexico, Louisiana may soon become the battleground state.
PACELLE: It is Louisiana. The few people who believe in this, are they representing the right view and the rest of the nation is wrong?
BUTCH LAWSON, PIT MANAGER: Tens of thousands to a hundred thousand people in the game fowl industry.
SANCHEZ: Butch Lawson, who manages the pit considered the Kentucky Derby of cockfighting, says it's an honest business.
(on camera): How's it work, people pay to get in?
LAWSON: Yes.
SANCHEZ: So you got to pay for admission.
LAWSON: You pay -- you pay for your seat admission. And the contestants, they put up pot money that they participate for. The pit has nothing to do with any -- anything other than the seat concession.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): As for the people who'd like to put him out of business?
(on camera): They love animals.
LAWSON: They do.
SANCHEZ: And they don't want to see animals get hurt.
LAWSON: And so do I.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): For this determined, some might argue stubborn, lot of game fowl enthusiasts, who trace the origin of their sport back to ancient rulers and U.S. presidents, wars and conquests, the last battle is about to be waged, and this time the odds are not on their side.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: A couple of different factors that come into play here. These men are convinced that this is an urban argument versus a rural argument, which is the world that they come from. And it's also a bit of a paradox, isn't it. You see them, as we did, taking such incredible care of these animals from the moment they're born to two or three years old, only to eventually let them kill each other.
In the end, they say what they're doing is perfectly natural. Folks on the animal rights activist side say it's perfectly brutal. I'm Rick Sanchez -- Anderson.
COOPER: Fascinating report. I had no idea, actually, it was even legal in any state. Interesting to know. And we'll see how long it lasts in Louisiana and New Mexico. Rick, thanks very much. Good report.
SANCHEZ: Thank you.
COOPER: Erica Hill from HEADLINE LINES joins us with the latest at about 13 to the hour.
Hey, Erica.
HILL: Hey, Anderson.
Former Chilean dictator Augusto Pinochet was rushed to the hospital today. The Chilean Army says Pinochet had a mini stroke and is in the intensive care unit. The 8nine-year-old has had health problems in the past. Pinochet has been accused of human rights abuses during his reign, but was never convicted.
On to San Salvador, El Salvador: hurricane a-comin.' Hurricane Adrian, the first of the season, has already killed at least two people and forced thousands from their homes. People in Central America have been preparing for the storm. Forecasters are concerned it could cause flashflooding and devastating mudslides.
Here in the U.S., bigger and stronger: that's what US Airways and America West are hoping for, anyway. The two airlines -- both with a history of financial problems -- are now planning to merge. The new airline would be called US Airways but will be controlled by America West's management.
And above the Earth: no solicitors, please. The FAA has proposed to amend its regulations so it could enforce a law that bans what it calls "obtrusive advertising in space." The ads, flown in low orbit, would be big enough to appear as large as the moon. And right now, if a company chooses to launch an ad like that, the FAA has no power to stop it.
And that's the latest from HEADLINE NEWS right now. Anderson, back to you.
COOPER: Erica, thanks very much. I'll see you again in about thirty minutes. Coming up next in this special edition of 360, a controversial herbal supplement. Remember ephedra? Will it make a comeback? 360 M.D. Sanjay Gupta reports.
Also ahead tonight, an undercover federal agent risking his life to bring down members of an outlawed motorcycle gang. And insurance fraud, this man under fire, thinking no one's watching him, looks like he has trouble walking, doesn't it? But investigators are tracking his every move. They're saying he's faking it, part of our special report, "Justice Undercover" and a little later.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it's an ancient but controversial herbal supplement that could be making a comeback. We're talking about ephedra. Used as a quick fix for weight loss, it was banned by the FDA more than a year ago after it was linked to dozens of deaths. But just last month, a federal judge in Utah struck down parts of the ban, saying the FDA did not prove that ephedra is unsafe in small doses, which means the supplement may now be on the road to return. 360 M.D. Sanjay Gupta takes a look at what that might mean.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As a single mom nearing 40, former fashion model Dawn Ellison longs for the slim figure she once had.
DAWN ELLISON, EPHEDRA FAN: I'd always been very small, and I guess after I had my children, I put on a lot of weight. I was very depressed. I was very frustrated with myself.
GUPTA: A couple of years ago, she got closer to looking like her former self-.
ELLISON: I lost about 40 pounds in a period of one year. And I went from a size 14 to a 6. And it was really amazing, especially after having two children.
GUPTA: She did it with the help of the dietary supplement ephedra, a stimulant that gave her more energy and helped her shed pounds without dieting and without any side effects. Also known as ma huang, at least 12 million Americans relied on the herbal supplement as an all-natural solution to weight loss and increased metabolism. That was until reports of negative side effects started to surface. In 2001, 21-year-old April Easterling died from a blood hemorrhage that was believed to be associated with her ephedra use.
PAT GIVENS, APRIL EASTERLING'S MOTHER: My daughter was looking to lose five pounds, you know, and instead of losing five pounds, she lost her life.
GUPTA: In 2003, the sudden death of 23-year-old Orioles pitcher Steve Bechtler also was linked to the supplement.
(on camera): Unfortunately for so many unsuspecting ephedra users, this is where they found themselves, fighting for their lives in the ER. Overall, the FDA received reports of 1,600 complications linked to the supplement, including heart attacks, seizures and strokes, and a total of 164 deaths.
(voice-over): In April, 2004, the FDA banned ephedra, concluding that dietary supplements containing ephedrine and ephedra did present an unreasonable risk of illness or injury. Dawn heard the warnings, but wasn't particularly worried about herself. ELLISON: I had some concerns, like everyone did, but it didn't affect me in that way. So I figured, I'm not feeling any of these side effects. Luckily, I've always had good blood pressure, even when I'm stressed out. It doesn't affect my blood pressure, so that could be one of the reasons.
GUPTA: And being relatively young and healthy, Dawn didn't fall into one of the highest-risk groups. Still, the ban had taken her ephedra away, and Dawn gained almost the entire 40 pounds back in just one year.
There are many who thought the ban was unnecessary and the risks were being overblown.
DR. ERIC BRAVERMAN, INTEGRATIVE MEDICINE SPECIALIST: Ephedra's been used in China for over 2,000 years, in the West at least close to a hundred years. It's been around a long time. Ideally, everyone should have access to ephedra under physician supervision. Those who complained about it, maybe they should have been more careful and should have had more doctor supervision.
GUPTA: Dr. Eric Braverman, a physician who combines conventional and alternative therapies, believes there are valid arguments for putting it back on the market.
BRAVERMAN: We don't want the FDA overregulating, as a general rule, natural supplements because access to those supplements may be reduced. I have no confidence that the government is necessarily right about ephedra.
GUPTA: Almost exactly a year after the ban, a federal judge in Utah struck it down, opening up the possibility of ephedra's return to the market. For Dawn, who has tried the ephedra-free supplements without any success, the ruling offered a glimmer of hope.
ELLISON: If ephedra were to come back on the market, I would absolutely be the first in line and know that I will have the confidence back that I lost over the last several months.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, Sanjay, Now that the judge has overruled the ban, what's the FDA's response.
GUPTA: Well, the FDA's still weighing its options right now. A couple things to keep in mind here. When it comes to herbal supplements, the FDA has to prove that it's unsafe, so it puts the onus of responsibility on the FDA. And also, when we're talking about dosages here, they're really important. They talk about the 10- milligram dosage or lower as being safe. Both sides agree that once you get into the higher doses, there could be safety issues, Anderson.
COOPER: All right, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thanks. Coming up...
GUPTA: Thank you.
COOPER: Appreciate it.
Next on this two-hour edition of 360, a motorcycle police officer. You're going to meet a man who risked everything to infiltrate a ruthless, violent gang.
Also tonight, a grown man talking like a baby? Investigators say it is all a scam for insurance money, part of our special report "Justice Undercover."
Also ahead tonight, the Michael Jackson trial. Find out what the judge had to say about Larry King's testimony today. Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: This is one of those stories you might find yourself having to hear two or three times in a row to make sure your ears aren't playing tricks on you. Bank robber takes six people hostage, orders them to strip to their underwear, then drives them to an airport where he's shot by police as he apparently tries to get away in a small plane.
See what I mean? Makes you think the headline writers may be having a little fun with you, except it is all true. It played out yesterday in Kansas. CNN's Ed Lavandera reports on the bizarre case.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Wearing a t-shirt with the words "Show Me the Money," Bennie Herring walked into Capital Federal Savings fully armed and with a plan. Hostage Monica Carter says Herring was calm from the moment he walked in the front door, even when police surrounded the bank.
MONICA CARTER, HOSTAGE: In my eyes it looked like he knew the police were there the entire time and he was taking his time.
LAVANDERA: There were 10 employees and one customer inside the bank. Investigators say Herring ordered everyone to undress, probably as a way to show he was in control and then he tied them all together. That's when he noticed a minivan just outside the bank door.
CARTER: He was in the bank chaining everyone together. He asked whose van that was. And I said that it was mine. He asked for my keys and told me to give them to one of my co-workers. And then he led them outside.
LAVANDERA: The scene outside was intensifying, SWAT teams and snipers surrounded the area. An armored vehicle rolled on to the scene to keep the masked gunman from getting away.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Possibly been the weirdest 24 hours in my life.
LAVANDERA: Shane Keyser, a photographer with the "Kansas City Star," arrived just in time to capture some of the most bizarre scenes of the foiled bank robbery. The suspect moving six half naked hostages into the van.
SHANE KEYSER, "KANSAS CITY STAR" PHOTOGRAPHER: It was part terror, part fear and just not really knowing what in the world is going to happen next.
LAVANDERA: About 40 minutes after walking in, the alleged robber and his hostages were driving away with a squadron of police cars in pursuit. This made officers nervous.
SERGEANT MIKE BUTAUD, OLATHE P.D.: Anytime you have a bank robbery or robbery of any type in a structure, we want to try it confine them into that area because it is a lot easier to work that way. Anytime someone takes hostages and leaves into another area, we have a lot less control of what happens and it is very dangerous for the hostages.
LAVANDERA: The van drove almost two miles down the road where officers were about to encounter the next surprise. Lieutenant Shawn Reynolds was in the chase when he saw the van speed on to the runway of a small airport.
Did you immediately think does this guy have a getaway plane?
LIEUTENANT SHAWN REYNOLDS, OLATHE P.D.: That's what went through my mind. Is that there is a plane sitting on a runway and has two subjects inside of it and the plane is running. And they drove immediately right to that area. That's exactly what i thought.
LAVANDERA: Inside the plane was Matt Miller, a veteran flight instructor, oblivious he and a student were finishing preflight tests and about to take off when the suspect holding a hostage approached the plane and police quickly surrounded them as well.
MATT MILLER, FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR: The next thing I hear is get out, get out! They're shouting for me to get out. And I raise up and look at the guy with a gun pointed at me. I realize he wants me to get out.
LAVANDERA: At first police thought Matt Miller was part of the getaway plan.
REYNOLDS: At that point we didn't know what was going on. We didn't know if the plane was part of some type of elaborate plan or what the deal was. So we had to treat them as possible suspects as well.
LAVANDERA: Police say they weren't going to let the alleged robber, who was also a licensed pilot, fly away. So they shot him as he opened the plane's door. Miller and the flight student jumped out of the plane, police then handcuffed the two men.
MILLER: I said, hey, man, I'm a good guy here. I'm a flight instructor. He said flight instructors rob banks too. At that point, I went bank robbery? Dummy.
LAVANDERA: And that was the ending to what some here are describing as the most bizarre bank robbery this part of Kansas has ever seen. Ed Lavandera, CNN, Olathe, Kansas.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Joining us now live from Phoenix, Arizona, is Troy Evans who advises banks on robbery prevention which is a good position to do because he served seven-and-a-half years on a bank robbery conviction some time ago. Troy, appreciate you being here. You were convicted of five armed bank robberies. The FBI says about 75 percent of all bank robbers get caught. Did you think you would get away with it when you were robbing banks?
TROY EVANS, FORMER BANKROBBER: At the time that I was committing those crimes, I was in a drug-induced stupor and very much felt that I was invincible. And to be honest with you, I was either going to get enough money to feed my habit for another 30 or 60 days or the police would show up and I was going to make them do something that I didn't have the guts do myself.
COOPER: You weren't thinking far ahead. You robbed a bank, you wore a hat and sunglasses. You pretty much tried to blend in. This guy in Kansas goes in wearing a black hood, a shirt that says "Show Me the Money." What does this tell you about the guy?
EVANS: Well, it is definitely out of the norm. Having met and interviewed over 300 convicted bank robbers, most of them are either strung out on drugs, got a gambling habit to pay, they've got a house that is about to be foreclosed on. It is very much an act of desperation. This guy, I would say, probably something in his personal life triggered him over the edge. I don't know, a divorce, a -- losing a house, losing a job, the death of a loved one. That is only speculation but something definitely pushed him over the edge. But that's not the norm.
COOPER: You say it is an act of desperation for a lot of these guys. This guy went in with chains, plastic handcuffs, walkie- talkies, even gave a walkie-talkie to police so he could communicate with them. Is that kind of planning typical?
EVANS: That is not typical. This guy, obviously, he was a licensed pilot. We can assume he was pretty smart. I'm guessing that it was probably something that was planned out over some course of time. He just didn't pick this bank randomly. I would also guess and again this is just speculation it is probably something -- he may have had some issues with some banks in the past.
For him to ask the individuals to undress and to chain together that's very unusual. It is almost a humiliation type of thing. And it just makes me wonder if he doesn't have an issue with the bank or banks, maybe a foreclosure in his past, something like that.
COOPER: What is the biggest deterrent to a robber? You counsel banks now. What do you tell them?
EVANS: Number one, the first and foremost prevention weapon they have at their disposal is their employees. Their employees alone can keep a would-be robber from coming into their institution. They're on the frontlines; they see the people every day that are coming in and out. And if they just are aware of suspicious activities, anything out of the ordinary, great customer service, somebody you don't recognize, walk up, extend a hand to them and ask them what you can do for them today. Last thing a would-be robber wants is somebody looking them in the eye and at the same time for legitimate customers, it is fantastic customer service. So the front line people very important.
COOPER: Good advice there. Troy Evans, appreciate you joining us. Thank you very much.
EVANS: Thanks, Anderson, my pleasure.
COOPER: Here are a few fast facts on the subject of bank robberies, gleaned from the FBI. Friday is actually the biggest day for bank heists. And mornings between 9:00 and 11:00 are when they mostly happen. Perhaps because it is payday. Somewhat surprisingly, better than half of all bank robberies do not involve the use of a firearm. And very, very few, less than one percent, lead to a homicide or hostage taking.
We're talking about crime this week and tonight we focus on "Justice Undercover." Sometimes it is the only way to catch criminals. We start tonight with one of the country's most lawless and feared motorcycle gangs, the Mongols claimed 350 members. They dealt in illegal drugs and any criminal activity you can imagine, including murder. We know all this thanks to an undercover agent's incredible, almost foolhardy courage. He joined the gang, won their trust and brought dozens of them to justice.
Paula Zahn has his story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILLY QUEEN, RETIRED ATF AGENT: I was out there by myself. If the crap went bad, I would have been in serious trouble.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Forget the way he looks, this man was a top undercover agent, who for two years was assigned to penetrate one of the country's most brutal outlaw gangs, the Mongols.
QUEEN: Certainly not as big as the Hell's Angels, but although not as big, probably the most feared outlaw motorcycle gang out there.
ZAHN: Billy Queen worked for ATF -- the Federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. And he discovered that while the Mongols used ruthless violence to enforce their criminal rule, they also enjoyed the violence for its own sake.
QUEEN: The guy with all the tattoos on him is Rick Slayton. He's a Mongol. This guy in the hat right here is the guy that threw the stuff. What is happening is they're surrounding him now. He's got no place to go. They're going beat the crap out of him and they are going to beat the crap out of all of his buddies. The knives are going to come out. People are going to be stabbed. And over here, they're stabbing a guy. After the Mongols get through what they're doing, the guy with the hat, he's still hanging on to his hat, hitting him with the chair. Now it is over. And now what happens is the Mongols just disappear.
ZAHN: When the night was over, five people were hospitalized and none arrested. This is the violent gang world that Billy Queen infiltrated. Starting out as a prospect ...
QUEEN: When you first come in the club ...
ZAHN: Like a fraternity pledge, Billy progressed through the ranks of the gang, earning special patches, or rockers, along the way.
QUEEN: After a certain period of time, a month, maybe two months, they'll vote on whether you should go to the next step and give you your center rocker.
ZAHN: After more than year with the Mongols, Billy was voted treasurer of California's San Fernando Valley chapter.
QUEEN: This patch here is an officer patch.
ZAHN: But unknown to the president and other Mongol officers, Billy Queen and his ATF colleagues were secretly recording the illegal drug deals, thefts, gunfights, stabbings and murders. And along the way he often had to prove his loyalty to this vicious brotherhood.
QUEEN: Rocky pulls out his knife, slits that plastic bag and he lined out two lines of meth out on the table. But he turned around at me and put the knife at my face and said is that line too much for you? I looked down at it and said, no Rock, that's fine with me, you snow I'll get my dollar bill and we'll take care of business.
I think to myself what you going do? What are you going to do? My face was getting red, my ears were getting ready and I stepped between Rocky and the dope and I bent over with it like I was snorting it and went -- and wiped it off in my hand. I raised up and Rocky looked around and saw the dope gone. He looked at me, yeah. He did it. Cops don't do dope.
ZAHN: But he was a cop. And he was touched by the chilling advice Rocky later gave him.
QUEEN: And he said, this is not a club. We're outlaws. And you need to know that. You need to know what you're getting into. I sat there for a little bit thinking to myself, I wonder if I do know what I'm getting into here.
ZAHN: Some gang members remain suspicious of the new Mongol they knew as Billy St. John. And Billy Queen learned to live with fear.
QUEEN: When fear becomes a part of you, you start feeling it, then you slow down. Fear is a good thing in a situation like that where you use it for survival.
ZAHN: And one of the most fearsome Mongols was a prison-hardened leader known as Red Dog.
QUEEN: He suspected me practically the entire time I was in. They took me out in the middle of nowhere in an abandoned orange grove and when I got out there, there is six or eight of these guys standing around. They all got guns. So Red looks at me and says, so if I put a bullet in the back of your head, nobody is going to know where to start looking for you. I said, that's right, Red. And he looked at me and said turn around and go out there in the field and set some targets up.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, when we come back, Billy Queen faces a life and death moment of truth.
QUEEN (video clip): I thought, they've made me, this is it. They're going all shoot me in the back right here.
COOPER: Undercover and alone, the rest of Billy Queen's story in a minute.
Also ahead tonight, a grown man acting like a baby. Is this guy for real? Meet the man who went deep undercover to find out and find out what this guy is really doing.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Federal Agent Billy Queen knows he is lucky to be alive. He infiltrated and actually became a member of a vicious outlaw motorcycle gang, the Mongols. That's when his worst fears came true. The gang's leader, a guy named Red Dog, accused him of being a cop. Billy Queen still shakes when he remembers the day. As we continue our look at "Justice Undercover" tonight, once again, here's Paula Zahn.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ZAHN: Red Dog looks at me and starts saying how long was your academy Billy? He kept getting louder and kept getting louder, and kept closer to my face and pointing his finger at my face. How long was your (EXPLETIVE DELETED) academy? Police academy! And I try to shake him off, shake him off. Who did you tell you were coming up here. Who knows you with the Mongols today? Who knows you up here.
Nobody, Red. Nobody. So I put a bullet in your head, nobody will know where to start looking for you, is that right, Billy. That's right, Red Dog. And he said, turn around and go set up the targets out there.
And I turned around and I started walking out in the field and said if they made me this is it. They're going to all shoot me in the back. There was nothing I could do. I didn't have a gun. I bluffed them as far as I could bluff them.
ZAHN: It turned out it was Red Dog who was bluffing. QUEEN: I turned around and looked while I was sitting the cans up and they're all joking with each other and stuff like that. And so I get my heart going again and I pull myself back together so I can play the game for the rest of the night.
ZAHN: For most federal agents, the line between enforcing the law and breaking it is clear. But for undercover agents, in as deep as Billy Queen, that line sometimes disappears. It happened when the Mongols accidentally ran into a rival gang in a bar. It didn't take long for the fight to start. And a brother Mongol, the chapter president, was in the middle of it.
QUEEN: Right when we went in, there was a guy that was leaning up against an ice machine and he had a beer in one hand, and finally the president looked at him and said what the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) are you looking at? And this guy looked back at the president and said you. And when he did, the president just decked him, just bam. Beer went up in the air. He took one swipe and hit me in the side of the head. I hung on to him and I swung back and when I did, he reached in behind him and he came out with this knife.
And I let go of him and I was -- he swiped the knife across my jacket, slit the front of my jacket. I'm afraid he's going to kill me. I'm righteously afraid this guy is going to kill me. I hollered for Rocky, the chapter sergeant of arms to shoot him. And I'm hollering, shoot him, Rocky, shoot him. I'm going around in a circle with this guy. As far as I was concerned, the case was over with at that time.
So is it always clear? No, it is not clear. When a fight breaks out in the bar, and the clubs come out and the knives come out, stuff like that, and you're slugging it out in the bar, you hit somebody, that's an assault or is it an assault? Are you protecting yourself? What are you doing?
ZAHN: That question first began for Billy Queen when his mother died, suddenly, during the investigation.
QUEEN: I didn't ask anybody anything. I told the Mongols, hey, look, my mom died and I told ATF, I'm taking a break. I gotta go home, my mom died.
ZAHN: When he got back to his undercover life, as outlaw biker, to the people who knew him as Billy St. John, he began to see things in a new light.
QUEEN: And I rode over to Evil's house. And when I walked up to the door Evil and I put my hand out for that handshake and he grabbed me around the neck and said, Billy, I'm sorry about your mom, buddy. I love you, brother. And I almost -- I almost cried. I almost dropped to my knees and cried. ATF hadn't said a word to me. Not when I left, not when I came back. Not the case agent, not anybody in the office, nobody said, sorry about your mom. But that first Mongol I saw grabbed me around the neck and said he loved me and was sorry about my mom. And the next one that I saw did the same thing. And the next one did the same thing. And I told myself, this is where I belong. I wanted to be a Mongol at that time. I didn't want to be Billy Queen. I wanted to be Billy St. John. And I wanted to get on that bike and ride off with them.
ZAHN: In the end, after two long years riding with the gang, Billy finally did leave.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His undercover activities, which were at great risk to and sacrifice from the agent ...
ZAHN: As a direct result of his undercover work, 54 Mongols were arrested. And 53 went to jail for crimes that included murder, illegal drug dealing, and weapons violations.
QUEEN: It was hard for me to sit there on the witness stand and look those guys in the face and them looking at me them call me brother and told me they loved me. They did love me. They loved Billy St. John. And it was hard.
ZAHN: He knows the Mongols will never forget that. And he is haunted by a deadly threat. That one day the Mongols will take revenge.
QUEEN: I know that I'm always going to be looking over my shoulder. I would be foolish not to. I don't go anywhere today without a gun. And when I go to bed at nighttime, I sleep with a double barrel shotgun right by my bed.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Paula Zahn with that report. Retired ATF Agent Billy Queen has written a book about his adventures with the Mongols, it's called "Under and Alone." Mel Gibson is making it into a movie in which he will play Billy Queen.
Still ahead, Larry King usually asks the questions. Today he came to answer them at the Michael Jackson trial. We'll tell you what happened in a moment. First, though, Erica Hill from HEADLINE NEWS joins with us the latest at about 20 past the hour. Hey, Erica.
HILL: Hey, Anderson.
And another violent day in Iraq with several assassinations and two more deaths of American military members. One of them when a roadside bomb ripped a U.S. convoy southeast of Baghdad. That brings the American death toll in Iraq to 1627. More than a dozen Iraqis were killed. The prime minister has called on Syria to stop foreign fighters from coming into Iraq to help insurgents.
On the CNN "Security Watch," one week after an Air France flight was diverted to Bangor, Maine, originally supposed to land in Boston, the homeland security chief says the no-fly list that checks names for possible terrorist connections is, quote, "primitive." He says he would like to streamline the system by creating a database of trusted travelers who don't have to be checked at every point.
A big step for stem cell research. Scientists in South Korea say they've create new batches of embryonic stem cells from nine injured patients. Senior administration officials tell CNN President Bush will veto any expansion of stem cell funding.
A high profile merger is creating some controversy on Wall Street. Valerie Morris has a closer look in tonight's "Market Mover" report.
VALERIE MORRIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (video clip): There is a fight for the floor of the New York Stock Exchange. The 200-year-old trading institution recently announced plans to go public and merge with Archipelago, an electronic trading company. The stealth transaction driven by exchange Chairman John Thane took investors and NYSE insiders by surprise. The deal faces lots of opposition and there are questions about the conflict of interest between the two exchanges and Goldman Sachs, which brokered the deal.
The NYSE is the world's largest stock exchange with more than 1.5 billion shares changing hands every day.
HILL: And that, again, was Valerie Morris. And Anderson, that's the latest from HEADLINE NEWS.
COOPER: Erica, thanks. We'll see you again in 30 minutes.
Does this man look injured to you? Or is he just faking it so he can get a bundle of cash? Tonight catching insurance cheats and how their lies are costing you money.
And up close and personal -- maybe too personal -- with Britney Spears and Mr. Britney Spears. Why their sex talk on her new reality show has got viewers blushing "Inside the Box." This two-hour edition of 360 continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Welcome back to this special two-hour edition of 360. We're talking about Justice Undercover tonight. Now take a look at this number. The Insurance Information Institute says that fraud cost insurers up to $120 billion a year. And their losses become yours when your premiums go up. Randi Kaye shows us how some people are trying to catch insurance cheater on tape.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Does this man look injured to you? Too sick to work? In such pain his insurance company needed to cover costly home improvements like a wheelchair ramp? That's what Randall Williams (ph) told his doctors. Watch as the Florida man hobbles out of the doctor's office, relying heavily on a four pronged walker. But William's luck runs out down the road. His car breaks down while insurance fraud investigators are on his tail. Thinking no one is watching, he climbed up under the hood of his truck to fix it. RICHIE TAFFET, PRESIDENT, OMEGA INSURANCE SERVICES: And just look at this fella. I mean, 30 minutes ago this guy was at a doctor's office. He had a four pronged walker.
KAYE: Williams had been collecting disability for 12 years. Richie Taffet and his team of investigators put an end to that scam.
TAFFET: In the end his free ride was over. He was charged with workers' compensation fraud.
KAYE: Richie Taffet runs Omega Insurance Services, which employs more than 150 private investigators. Their job is to crack insurance fraud cases. The job requires long hours, lots of homework and even more legwork. Sometimes they'll spend years collecting data on alleged insurance scammers.
(on camera): According to industry estimates, workers' compensation fraud totals more than $6 billion annually. Insurance companies aren't the only victims. Fraud means higher premiums for honest citizens too.
(on camera): This man in Florida had been collecting payments for back and neck pain. But here he is on tape lifting big pieces of lumber, even a glass panel into his truck.
TAFFET: He's apparently getting ready to go home and do some work. That's some great close-up video.
KAYE: Much of Taffet's success is due to innovative technology. Recording the evidence on videotape is key. And these days the camera could be anywhere.
TAFFET: This phone is bored out and inside is a little chip cam -- and when you take it a look here in the tie, there is a nice chipboard camera in this pin hole lens and this one is black and white so you're not really getting that full color video. But nonetheless, you're still getting some great film.
KAYE: Great video is what helped Taffet and his team bust one of the most notorious scam artists in insurance fraud history, the so- called baby-talker. This former bus-driver, Bruce Gilbert, claimed a bad fall in 1987 caused him to regress back to infancy. In this sworn deposition, Gilbert talks baby talk for the camera, appearing unable to answer the most basic questions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you take a shower or a bath?
BRUCE GILBERT, COMMITTED WORKERS' COMP. FRAUD: I don't know. Just water come out of the thing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are standing up and water comes out of something and splashes on you?
GILBERT: Yes. Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You do that by yourself? GILBERT: Yes.
KAYE: But Gilbert didn't appear very baby-like when the Taffet P.I.s caught up with him. They recorded Gilbert behind the wheel.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Claimant says he acts like a five-year-old. How many five-year-olds do you know that are out there driving a car?
KAYE: And talking with their wives, or going hunting? Cameras caught Gilbert with a rifle and hunting gear.
TAFFET: That is just, what we call in the investigative world, the money shot.
KAYE: Taffet turned over his findings to the state of Florida.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get out of the golf cart. You're under arrest for workers' compensation fraud.
KAYE: But Gilbert still didn't give up the act when police approached him on a golf course where he was playing a very adult game of golf. As they made the arrest, Gilbert tried to resort to baby talk.
GILBERT: My mommy. Where mommy?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's up there in the car. She's under arrest too.
KAYE: Game over. Gilbert's now repaying hundreds of thousands of dollars in claims he never should have received.
TAFFET: The reality of it is, you never know when you're being watched and you never know when somebody might be out there catching you doing something you're not supposed to be doing.
KAYE: That's good advice from the guy with a tiny camera who may just be recording your every move.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAYE: Now, Richie Taffet uses a lot of toys in his job. He uses the camera that you saw in that tie, the camera that is in the phone. He also has a camera in a beeper. And a camera, Anderson, in a pack of cigarettes. He also investigates about 25,000 cases like these a year. He has 2,000 active cases right now.
COOPER: I love it when the guy is getting arrested and says, where's mommy, and the police officer says, she's in the car. She's been arrested as well.
KAYE: Absolutely.
COOPER: How do they know who to investigate?
KAYE: Well, actually, they take a look at cases that have to do with soft tissue, when you're talking about neck strain or back strain -- things that you can't really see on an MRI or things you can't really disprove. They also look at people who aren't home when they come calling and people who miss a lot of doctors' appointments.
So, the job takes a lot of time and as you see, these people go to great lengths to get this money and make a false insurance claim. I mean, that baby talk guy, come on, you know? So, it is a pretty good business for Richie Taffet right now.
COOPER: Yes, amazing to see the lengths some people are going to go to. Randi Kaye, appreciate it. Great report. Thanks very much.
KAYE: Thank you.
COOPER: Coming up next, star power, the Michael Jackson trial. What's the defense trying to accomplish with all of the parade of celebrities we've been seeing? Jeffrey Toobin looks into that.
Also ahead tonight, routine police work along a highway, suddenly things go horribly -- oh, man -- things go horribly wrong. It is all caught on tape. The guy lives, though, and is fine, and we're going to talk to him just ahead. You're not going to believe this story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: A familiar face in an unfamiliar place today, Larry King leaving the courthouse where Michael Jackson's on trial. Jackson's defense called King to testify about a conversation he had with a lawyer for the accuser's family. Got that? But, the judge decided not to allow King to take the stand.
Still, if you're looking for celebrity testimony, the Jackson case is certainly the place to go. With a look at why, senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SR LEGAL ANALYST: Jurors listened intently as Macaulay Culkin recounted the details of his unusual friendship with the King of Pop. "Home Alone" had just hit theaters when Jackson took the child star under his wing and into his bed. But Culkin insists that nothing untoward happened, calling the allegations against Michael Jackson absolutely ridiculous. It is a statement he's made before.
MACAULAY CULKIN, ACTOR: Nothing happened. You know, I mean, nothing really. We played video games, you know. We played it -- we played at the amusement park.
KING: (INAUDIBLE) in the bed?
CULKIN: Well, the thing is -- the thing is, with that whole thing, is that they've, oh, you slept in the same bedroom as him. It's like, I don't think you understand. Michael Jackson's bedroom is two stories and has, like, three bathrooms and this and that, so, when I slept in his bedroom, yes, but you need to understand the whole scenario.
TOOBIN: Culkin was the first celebrity Jackson's defense team called to the stand, but he won't be the last.
JAY LENO, HOST "TONIGHT SHOW WITH JAY LENO": As you may have seen on the news, next Tuesday I'm being called to testify in the Michael Jackson, so I have to go up there -- I do, I have to testify next Tuesday.
TOOBIN: When Jay Leno takes the stand, he's expected to describe a telephone conversation in which the alleged victim asked for money to pay for his cancer treatments. The defense says the comedian hung up, sensing something was amiss, and that he later told police the family was looking for a mark. Leno seems an unlikely ally for the defense. He fought the gag order that the judge imposed, so he could continue to make jokes about Jackson on "The Tonight Show."
LENO: Hey, Kevin, you know what Michael Jackson calls the Boy Scout uniform?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's that?
LENO: Lingerie.
TOOBIN: The defense is supposed to put another comedian on the stand, Chris Tucker, who was once friendly with the accuser and his family.
One celebrity the jury won't be hearing from is CNN's Larry King. He was supposed to tell them about a conversation he had a former lawyer for the accuser's mother. King says the lawyer described her as wacko, erratic, and going after Jackson just for his money.
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think was a blow to the defense that Larry King won't be able to testify. Unfortunately Judge Melville decided today it was hearsay, no exception coming in, and he would not be allowed to testify before the jury.
TOOBIN: Kobe Bryant, Liz Taylor, Diana Ross, and Stevie Wonder all made the witness list. Whether or not they'll actually testify remains to be seen.
Jeffrey Toobin, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Yes, that witness list has been drastically reduced by the defense. Joining me now from outside the courthouse in Santa Maria, California, Court TV Chief Investigative Editor Diane Dimond.
Diane, good to see you. Do you think the defense's strategy, calling all these celebrities to testify, actually could back fire on them?
DIANE DIMOND, COURT TV: Well, you know, it could, I suppose. This is an agricultural community. It's blue collar. It's 60 percent Hispanic. This is California, but it sure ain't L.A. Still, in all, I tell you, I think I saw a couple of the jury members come into court today looking to see if Larry King was in the room. Of course, he'd already come and gone. So never underestimate celebrity and the power of it.
COOPER: That's certainly true. We heard Chris Tucker may testify. His former girlfriend, Aja Pryor, who has a child with him, testified today. What was her relationship, exactly, to the accuser and to his family?
DIMOND: Well, Chris Tucker met the boy, the cancer patient, before he got cancer, at the Laugh Factory, at the comedy club where all the kids went, and he just was so taken with this boy and his brother and sister that he started doing things for them, and brought his girlfriend and his son into it. They went to Raiders games. They went to Knott's Berry Farm. They just truly liked these children. Later, they met the father. But later, they met the mother. The father was out of the picture and Aja Pryor, in discussing her relationship with the mother and the children today, began to weep. She's a very beautiful woman, and very -- she made a great witness, I thought. She made some points for the defense when she said, you know, I talked to her all the time on the phone during that February- March 2003 period, and she didn't tell me she needed help. She didn't need -- tell me she needed to escape from Neverland, or that she was being held against her will.
But for the other side, for the state, she said, no, this woman never asked me for money. She never asked me to give her anything. My boyfriend Chris was going give her the car, but this was a family that she really truly had deep affection for.
COOPER: So if they were simply out for money, it wouldn't seem to make much sense she would be friends with them.
DIMOND: Right. Right. And, again, she went -- she had them come it a family weddings with her. She went to graduation ceremonies for the kids. When the mother had to have that meeting with Child Protective Services, it was Aja Pryor who came to support her.
I got the impression today, Anderson, that she would really like to know where the kids are so she can strike up a relationship with them again.
COOPER: So, what was Larry King called in to testify about? And why did the judge rule he wouldn't allow the testimony?
DIMOND: Well, he was called in to rule -- he was called in to talk about a conversation he had with Larry Feldman, another attorney who got that big $20 million settlement last time. And who's talked to the mother in this case. And at that breakfast meeting, allegedly, Larry Feldman said the mother's wacko and I think she's in it for money.
But that was apparently -- when they really got down to the knitty gritty with Larry King that was Feldman's opinion and so therefore it's hearsay. And it is just not allowed. Now, I've got to tell you, Larry Feldman was here a lot earlier. He knew this was coming up. And he has roundly denied he ever said anything like that.
COOPER: All right, well, the defense expected to rest perhaps the beginning of June. Their list of witnesses is way down. Diane Dimond, appreciate you joining us, thanks.
DIMOND: My pleasure.
COOPER: In just a minute tonight, horror on the highway. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEP. GLEN POTHEN, SURVIVED HIT BY RUNAWAY TRUCK: It is a miracle that neither one nor both of us were seriously injured or killed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: That's what I'm talking about here. Despite the way this looks, nobody was badly hurt. That's actually the man who was hit by the vehicle. An exclusive interview with the deputy who got hit, the woman who was standing next to him. We'll talk to both of them, find out how he is.
Also a little later, have we seen enough of Britney Spears lately? Believe me, you ain't seen nothing yet.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Officer down. Officer down!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER; It looks worse than it actually was. You're going to find this hard to believe. The deputy you just saw in the tape being mowed down by a pickup truck survived. Not only did he survive, he walked away, basically without a scratch. We're going to show you the tape again in a moment.
It happened in Minnesota where Deputy Glen Pothen had stopped to help a driver in need. Now, earlier I had an exclusive interview with the deputy and the driver who was right there with him when it all happened. Tiffany Whitlow.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Deputy Pothen, you know, when you look at this videotape, anyone seeing this would think you were a goner. What do you remember happening?
POTHEN: I remember, basically, hearing what sounded like some tires sliding on the pavement. And as I started to turn around, the next thing I know I'm looking up at the sky. And next thing I know I'm down in the -- on my back in the grass. And remember hearing Tiffany screaming.
COOPER: Did you see the vehicle coming?
TIFFANY WHITLOW, WITNESS: Yes, I did. I saw a black flash. And then somehow by God's will I was able to get out of the situation, back up. And the only part that of me that got injured was my hand that hit the truck. I saw an officer flying in the air. And I saw the truck following soon after.
COOPER: Did you think he had been killed?
WHITLOW: To be honest, yes. If he was still alive, he was in a lot of serious danger.
COOPER: Deputy Pothen, have you heard the pickup driver's explanation of what happened?
POTHEN: From what I understand, as he claims, that the roads were wet and he was -- had hit a slippery spot.
COOPER: You know, we looked up some fatality rates. And according to the National Highway Traffic Administration, the fatality rate for a pedestrian struck by a car running 20 miles an hour is 5 percent, fatality rate rises to about 80 percent when the speed is raised to 40 miles per hour. I understand this vehicle was going, I think, about 35 miles an hour. I mean, you realize how lucky you are, don't you?
POTHEN: It is a miracle that neither one or both of us were seriously injured or killed. And God was certainly watching over both of us. And certainly decided that it wasn't any of our time.
COOPER: You know, when you see this video, you're tossed, basically like a rag doll. You don't have any whiplash or anything like that?
POTHEN: No, I don't, Anderson. I have some soreness and stiffness of my neck, but I was not knocked unconscious. I did sustain some scrapes and bruises on my right side around my waist area. And up on my shoulder area, that's the extent of it.
COOPER: Is there something that you take away from this? Or that you want other drivers to take away from this?
POTHEN: The reason why this video was released early when our state patrol is still conducting an investigation was to make people aware of the fact that we need to slow down on our highways no matter where we are. And if we see emergency vehicles that we need to reduce our speeds and be more aware of our surroundings.
COOPER: Do you get any time off? Are you taking a day off, at least?
POTHEN: I am taking some time off right now. I have to go in for an evaluation to see if I can return to active duty in the next couple of days. Our sheriff has said to me if I need more time than that, certainly take as much time as I need. But I think it is a miracle of God that I'm even sitting here today talking to you.
COOPER: Deputy Glen Pothen, we appreciate you being with us. And Tiffany Whitlow as well. It is nice to have you both here safe and sound and good luck to you.
POTHEN: Thank you.
WHITLOW: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: I still can't get over that he's OK.
In just a minute, a coming-out party for some little kitties. Sure, they're cute now, but believe me they'll get a lot bigger.
Later, Britney Spears branches out into reality TV. And maybe she should stick to singing.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Let's take a check of the headlines with Erica Hill from HEADLINE NEWS -- Erica.
HILL: Hi, Anderson.
Today, the International Committee of the Red Cross says it warned the Pentagon several times about documented abuse of the Koran, the Muslim holy book, at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. The administration had blamed a similar report in "Newsweek" for spurring anti-American demonstrations in Afghanistan and elsewhere. The military says it found no evidence of Koran abuse.
CNN confirms there could be a deal in the works to diffuse the battle raging over the president's judicial nominees. It would allow final votes on five of the president's seven picks, while preserving the filibuster.
The archbishop of Baltimore is refusing to attend tomorrow's commencement at Loyola College because the keynote speaker is former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani, who supports abortion rights. Giuliani will also receive an honorary degree at the ceremony.
And Calcutta's zoo is celebrating the birth of two striped bundles of joy -- a couple of baby tigers. One of the rare cubs, the one on the right, is a very rare white tiger.
And we'll leave you with that. Anderson, back to you.
COOPER: Erica, thanks very much.
Just when you thought reality television couldn't get any tackier, I guess, she's doing it again. Oops, that's right, Britney Spears and her husband Kevin, their assault on the senses. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it seems the less you want to know of the intimate details of some celebrities' lives, the more anxious they are to tell you about them. The latest example, Britney Spears and her somewhat less celebrated husband, Kevin Federline. Their new reality show has the crazy kids turning the cameras on themselves, and it's not a pretty picture.
But then, what could be pretty about crying out for attention by showing, well, nearly all of yourself "Inside the Box?"
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: It's called "Chaotic," a look inside the life -- emphasis on love life -- of Britney Spears and her new hubby, Kevin Federline.
Shot on shaky cam, mostly by the pop tart turned director, we see Britney in extreme, sometimes frightening close-up.
First, she's looking for love.
BRITNEY SPEARS, ENTERTAINER: But I realized that there was this huge void.
COOPER: And when she can't find it the old-fashioned way, she asks, as only a celebrity of her caliber can, some guy she met in an L.A. club to join her in London for her Onyx Hotel tour.
SPEARS: Pack your bags, get your passport, and get on the damn plane.
COOPER: It's when he arrives that the flow of information gets a little, well, gagging.
SPEARS: God, our sex is so good. Why couldn't I come in here? (INAUDIBLE).
I had sex three times today.
COOPER: Now, lest you think this is only about Britney and Kevin's sex life, she engages in a little Madonna-esque naval gazing.
SPEARS: Can you handle my truth?
COOPER: And takes the time to pose peppy and important questions to her entourage. Like...
SPEARS: What is your favorite sex position? What is your favorite sex position? What is your favorite sex position?
COOPER: In the real world, rather than the reality world, wouldn't that be called sexual harassment?
TOURE, CNN POP CULTURE CORRESPONDENT: This show reminded me most of "Truth or Dare," the Madonna movie, where you know, it's sort of reality show, but she is in control of it. And you know, it's very sort of narcissistic. Everything I do and say is important and valuable.
COOPER: Whatever. It's when she poses this question to her new love that reality turns surreal.
SPEARS: How do you feel about marriage and commitment?
COOPER: Thankfully, subtitles are provided for Kev's somewhat unclear response.
KEVIN FEDERLINE, MARRIED TO SPEARS: Love has -- love is a commitment.
COOPER: Love is commitment? This from the man who left his pregnant fiancee and baby behind to join the sexually fixated starlet on the road? OK.
There are five more episodes of "Chaotic" to come, with a look at the couple's engagement, their wedding, and this -- still, props to the pop tart for this. She certainly learned the lesson that keeping her celebrity means staying in the spotlight, and who needs hit records when you can do that by exposing it all "Inside the Box?"
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Yeah. I'm Anderson Cooper. Thanks very much for watching this two-hour edition of 360. CNN's prime-time coverage continues right now with "LARRY KING LIVE." Larry's guest tonight, Joyce Meyer, sexually abused as a child, now she's one of America's most influential evangelicals.
END
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Aired May 19, 2005 - 19:00 Â ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANDERSON COOPER, HOST: A bank heist gone bad, the bank robber gunned down. But why did he make his hostages strip? And where was he planning to go once he hijacked a plane?
A government official caught on tape, gambling on illegal cockfights. Tonight, 360 takes you inside the cockfighting pit, a multimillion-dollar business thriving in the shadows of the law.
Is this pill safe, or not? Some say it's a dieter's dream. Others call it a pill of death. Tonight, should the diet drug ephedra go back on the shelves?
An undercover agent on the most dangerous assignment of his life. Tonight, meet a real-life Donnie Brasco. He infiltrated one of the country's most brutal motorcycle gangs and helped put dozens behind bars.
And up close and personal, maybe too personal, with Britney Spears and Mr. Britney Spears. Why their sex talk on her new reality show has got viewers blushing inside the box.
ANNOUNCER: Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York, this is a two-hour special edition of ANDERSON COOPER 360.
COOPER: Good evening.
We begin tonight with developments in the desperate search for two children in Idaho who vanished after a triple murder in Coeur d'Alene. A so-called person of interest is no longer of interest, so now it's back to square one. The only thing right now that we're sure of in this case, a killer is on the loose, and two kids are missing.
Sean Callebs joins me live from Coeur d'Alene, where he's been following the investigation.
Sean, is there any progress at this point?
SEAN CALLEBS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Really, the investigation has been going very slowly. That's one thing authorities have been saying. And you're exactly right when you say either a killer or killers remain on the loose. Authorities really have very few answers tonight.
One thing we do know for sure. We've heard from one of the family members involved in this case of the two missing children, as well as the triple murder. The biological father of the two missing children and one of the dead found in the home on Monday made an emotional plea this afternoon, begging for his children to be released safely.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE GROENE, FATHER OF MISSING CHILDREN: I'd like to address my children's abductors or abductor. Please, please release my children safely. They had nothing to do with any of this. Release them in a safe area where the law enforcement can find them. Call the help line. Let them know where they can be found. Please, we need the safe return of those children. Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CALLEBS: Boy, an emotional Steve Groene, the biological father of the children. He is someone that investigators cleared very early on. They spoke with him, said he is not a suspect in this case, simply someone who is emotionally devastated after the events that unfolded here in the northern part of Idaho either late Sunday or sometime on Monday.
Meanwhile, the investigation goes on. The person who had been called a person of interest, a somewhat nebulous title, authorities wouldn't say if he was a material witness or someone involved in the case. They have interviewed Robert Roy Lutner -- he's 33 years old -- for something like seven hours, the FBI as well as sheriff's officers here with the Kootenai County Sheriff's Office. They say he is not involved in the crime. He voluntarily took a lie detector test and passed.
About the only significant information we know he did pass on to authorities, there was some kind of gathering here Sunday night at the home, Sunday afternoon. And the sheriff's officers are asking anyone who may have been at that gathering to come forward.
They've been going through the house with forensics teams. They culled a number of fingerprints off. They're trying to determine who was here, if they knew anything, any information about this crime.
What we do know, 40-year-old Brenda Groene, her 13-year-old son, Slade, and 37-year-old Mark McKenzie were found murdered in the home sometime Monday around 6:00 p.m. They had been bound, and the crime was considered very, very grisly.
Now, authorities continue to try and glean what information they can. There have been autopsies performed on the two adults. They should wrap up the autopsy on the child sometime today.
Now, the search in the wooded area around this home had been called off much of the morning. But it has really ramped up this afternoon. There are cadaver dogs as well as search and rescue dogs out here. Divers have been in ponds and creeks bear near the area. We also know that a septic pond near the home was drained yesterday. Nothing was found.
And the Amber Alert continues to flash on the highways. Still no sign of these two missing children, Anderson, once again, nine-year- old Dylan, he is 60 pounds, four foot tall, blonde hair, crew cut and blue eyes, and eight-year-old Shasta, his younger sister, very slight in build, less than 40 pounds, four feet -- less than 4 feet tall. She has long auburn hair and hazel eyes.
And authorities are just asking for any kind of information at this point. They are simply stumped.
COOPER: All right. Sean Callebs, thanks very much for that report.
This is bizarre triple murder, as he said, the bodies were found Monday at 6:00 p.m. There seem to have been some sort of gathering Sunday night in the home. Obviously, police are trying to find out as many people who were in that home as possible, trying to get whatever information they can.
Joining us now from Coeur d'Alene is the man in charge of the search for Dylan and Shasta, Captain Ben Wolfinger of the Kootenai County Sheriff's Department.
Appreciate you being with us very much, Captain Wolfinger, thanks, thank you.
Yesterday around this time, you know, we've been talking about this person of interest, Robert Roy Lutner. You talked to him. You decided he had nothing to do with the murders and the disappearance of the children. Why was that? I mean, what it, what it, was it something he said? Was it simply that he took the lie detector?
CAPT. BEN WOLFINGER, KOOTENAI COUNTY SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT: Well, as you know, as Sean said, Mr. Lutner was interviewed for nearly seven hours. And through that interview, that whole interview process, the investigators told me, they believed him. They actually believed him.
They -- he -- they actually caught him in a lie, a very minor lie. He was concerned about a probation violation. They challenged him on it. And he was truthful from that point forward. And then he volunteered to take the lie detector test. That just confirmed with them what they believed was those well-trained investigators, those well-trained interviewers, believed he was telling the truth.
COOPER: Do you know what happened in that house on Sunday night? I mean, I, the bodies were found Monday, I'm told, at 6:00 p.m., according to Sean. He said there was some sort of a gathering Sunday night. Do you know, do you know what the gathering was about?
WOLFINGER: Well, it's been described as a barbecue, Sunday afternoon, early-evening barbecue with some friends. Folks were in the house just having a good time. And much like any of us would have an afternoon barbecue. That's, that was the gathering here.
COOPER: Do you, do you have any other suspects at this point?
WOLFINGER: We don't have any other suspects at this point. But the forensic teams are continuing to work in the house, very meticulously, treating each drop of blood as a new piece of evidence, checking the entire house for fingerprints. And hopefully, that information that they glean, after it goes to Quantico for analysis, one of the FBI labs, will give us a suspect in this incident.
COOPER: What was the crime scene like? I mean, I, we've heard that they, these people were bound, that it was very violent. Are there any -- I mean, just from looking at the crime scene, is there any sense of, I mean, was there overkill? Did it seem an unusual crime scene in any way?
WOLFINGER: Well, I think any time you have a triple murder, it's an unusual crime scene. That's for sure. The coroner released late this afternoon that the cause of death was death by blunt-force trauma to the head on all three victims. That -- obviously, you know, head wounds bleed. And we recognize that. That's made the crime scene a lot more intense and a lot harder for investigators to investigate.
COOPER: So each was killed with blunt-force trauma, one by one, while they were bound?
WOLFINGER: Well, all I can tell you is what the coroner's report said. I was just shown it just moments ago. And he sent that report out to the media.
COOPER: Do you think these kids are alive, these missing kids?
WOLFINGER: You know, that's been the question we've had since Tuesday morning. And I have to tell you, it just makes no sense to me to kill three members of a family and take two somewhere else. I have to believe those children are alive, and we'll find them.
COOPER: I hope so. Captain Ben Wolfinger, appreciate you taking the time to speak with us. Thanks very much, Captain.
WOLFINGER: Thank...
COOPER: Coming up next in this special edition of 360, a superstar athlete turned politician. He's blamed for sparking some deadly anti-American riots. Does he think he went too far? Find out in just a moment.
Also ahead tonight, fair fight, or animal cruelty? We take you inside the shadowy world of cockfighting -- a multimillion-dollar business, illegal in a lot of states, legal in some. The question is, should it be legal or illegal everywhere? We're covering all the angles on that.
And a little later, we'll introduce you to a motorcycle cop. Meet a man who risked everything -- and I'm talking everything -- to infiltrate a ruthless, violent gang.
All that ahead. First your picks, the most popular stories on CNN.com right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) COOPER: Well, feel like we've seen that an awful lot lately. An angry scene in Afghanistan last week, deadly riots after "Newsweek" reported that American interrogators at Guantanamo Bay flushed the Muslim holy book, the Koran, down a toilet. Now, "Newsweek" has since retracted that article.
As you know, we've been following the story closely, trying to get all the angles. And tonight, we want to introduce you to a man named Imran Khan. He's the Pakistani politician who "Newsweek" says sparked the uprising by pointing out its report during a news conference.
My interview with him in a moment.
But first, some background on who Imran Khan really is.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER (voice-over): Since the days after September 11, Pakistan has been one of the United States' most important allies in the war on terror. And like many Pakistanis, Imran Khan isn't happy about it. The difference is, when he talks, people listen.
Imran Khan was a world-class cricket player who became a high- profile politician, marrying and divorcing a British billionaire's daughter, Jemima Goldsmith, along the way. Khan's a member of Pakistan's parliament and has been called a valuable bridge between East and West.
But when "Newsweek" published its now-retracted allegation of Korans being desecrated at Gauntanamo, Imran Khan called a press conference to denounce the United States and the war on terror.
IMRAN KAHN, PAKISTANI POLITICIAN: It is self-defeating, this war on terrorism.
(subtitled) On one hand, they demand we help them. On the other hand, they take our book, which the whole world knows, even Americans know, how sacred it is for us. Our whole religion is based on it, and they are treating it this way.
COOPER: Khan also blasted Pakistan's pro-U.S. government.
KAHN: If our government has become a frontline state, isn't it its responsibility to take up the issue, take up the issue with the American Embassy, call the American ambassador and demand an apology? We should say there should be an inquiry, and if such a thing is happening in Gauntanamo Bay, it should be punished.
COOPER: Khan's May 6 news conference got a lot of press and a lot of radio play in the Muslim world. A few days later, anti-U.S. rioting broke out in neighboring Afghanistan.
By last weekend, Muslims in Pakistan and around the world were demonstrating, rioting, even killing each other in the streets.
Now that "Newsweek" says it got the story wrong, the question is, what does Imran Khan say?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, earlier today I got a response from Imran Khan in an exclusive interview. Here's what he had to say.
Mr. Khan, in the current "Newsweek" issue, reporter Evan Thomas talks about the events that led up to the violence recently and the rioting, and he writes, and I quote, "The spark was apparently lit at a press conference held on Friday, May 6, by Imran Khan. Brandishing a copy of that week's "Newsweek," Khan exclaimed, 'This is what the U.S. is doing, desecrating the Koran.'"
Do you think that's an accurate statement? And do you feel responsibility in any way for the bloodshed that ensued?
KHAN: I do not think that's an accurate statement. Firstly, the news item would have come out anyway, because once something got into the "Newsweek," it was only a matter of time before other papers would have picked up.
Secondly, my party was -- is called Movement for Justice. We came into being to protect human rights, to have rule of law in our country, independent judicial system. Now, we always have stood up for human rights, whether abused by the Pakistani government, human rights abuse of our own citizens, or, in this case, which, for a Muslim, is the ultimate humiliation, to use the Holy Koran as a way of extracting information out of prisoners.
COOPER: There, I mean, your critics would say, I mean, would equate that to yelling "Fire" in a crowded theater, knowing the incendiary nature of the charges, holding a press conference in a time of -- you know, that we live in now, is tantamount to encouraging violence.
KHAN: Well, what does that mean? That if there's a fear of writing or reaction, one does not speak out against human rights abuse? I mean, do we just keep quiet about something like what happened in Gauntanamo Bay?
And now there's more evidence coming out. The prisoners who were in Gauntanamo Bay are speaking out against specifically this issue, about the desecration of the Holy Koran.
COOPER: In a "Los Angeles Times" editorial, Irshad Manji, author of "The Trouble with Islam Today," criticized you for trying to, what she said was incite Muslims. She wrote that you "rallied his countrymen to express rage based on one paragraph in 'Newsweek' and knew his comments about 'Newsweek' would feed the most reflexive of Muslim impulses, to treat the Quran with uncritical veneration."
KHAN: People like us who are not religious, belong to the religious right, if we, the mainstream political parties, or who are considered moderate in our country, if we don't speak about it, then these issues are picked up by the religious right. And they are being strengthened in the Muslim world. The -- what the U.S. needs to do is to address this problem, not try and push it under the carpet. Investigate the issue. Put the culprits behind bars. And that is how you can start winning the hearts and minds of the Muslim world.
COOPER: I want to play you something Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice had to say after this controversy erupted. Let's play that clip.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CONDOLEEZZA RICE, SECRETARY OF STATE: Respect for the religious freedom of all individuals is one of the founding principles of the United States. The protection of a person's right to worship freely and without harassment is a principle that the government and the people of the United States take very seriously.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Do you believe her? And do you think people in Pakistan believe her?
KHAN: Well, I think that's why there has to be a proper investigation into specifically the desecration of the Holy Koran, because that goes against what Mrs. Condoleezza Rice said. I think it needs to be pointed out that this is not a war against Islam, and that action would be taken against those people who have offended Muslim public opinion.
COOPER: Mr. Khan, we appreciate your perspective, and we appreciate you being on the program tonight. Thank you very much.
KHAN: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: We are following a number of other stories right now. Erica Hill from HEADLINE NEWS joins us with the latest at about 19 past the hour. Hey, Erica.
ERICA HILL, HEADLINE NEWS: Hey, Anderson.
We're actually going to stay in the Middle East for our first story. That's where First Lady Laura Bush is headed tonight. Mrs. Bush's first stop will be Jordan, where she'll speak Saturday at the World Economic Forum. The first lady will also visit Israel and Egypt. The goals of her five-day trip, to promote education and women's issue.
Seismologist say the earthquake that triggered the killer tsunami in Asia back in December shook every inch of the Earth's surface. And not only that, it was the longest quake ever recorded, with the biggest fault rupture, up to 800 miles, which spread for 10 minutes. The earthquake and the tsunami killed at least 170,000 people in seven countries.
Miami, Florida: the U.S. files charges against a Cuban militant. Luis Posada Carriles is accused of entering the country illegally. He's being held at a detention center in El Paso, Texas. The former CIA operative is hailed as a freedom fighter to some, but to others, he's a terrorist responsible for a series of deadly bombings.
Little Canada, Minnesota: check this out. Ow. A sheriff's deputy lucky to be alive after being hit by a pickup truck. He was actually trying to help a woman whose car was stuck -- ouch, again -- in a ditch. The deputy did survive. That's the good news. And a little later on 360, I understand, we'll be hearing from the deputy and the woman who witnessed the accident.
COOPER: Ay!
HILL: That's just insane.
COOPER: Yi, yi, yi, yi, yi.
HILL: Exactly. You took the words right out of my mouth.
COOPER: Yes, you know, I've seen that a bunch of times. So I did, I talked to the deputy a little bit, a little while ago. We're going to play that a little bit later on 360. (INAUDIBLE), I mean, and he knows he is just lucky to be alive, and he...
HILL: He's amazing.
COOPER: Yes, incredible. He doesn't have whiplash or anything. It's amazing.
HILL: A broken rib, nothing?
COOPER: Nothing, nothing.
HILL: My gosh.
COOPER: He's got a few cuts and scrapes. I mean, the guy was tossed like a rag doll. It just, it's an amazing (INAUDIBLE).
HILL: If there's ever a disaster, I want to stand next to him.
COOPER: Yes, I know, exactly. We'll have that interview a little bit later on on tonight's program.
Erica, thanks very much. See you again in about 30 minutes.
Coming up next on 360...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am your father.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: "Star Wars" politics. The battle of good versus evil. Is George Lucas taking on the president? Going behind the scenes on that. Also tonight, cockfighting. Is it a fair fight, as some say, in a couple of states where it's legal, or animal cruelty? Going to hear from all sides.
Plus, meet a small-town mayor who was busted for betting on cockfighting.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: So here's a pop quiz for you tonight. Tonight, you're watching a scene right now from, A, "Return of the Jedi," B, "Revenge of the Sith," or, C, a political convention.
The answer, it seems, may depend on your view of the world. See, the battle between good and evil in the "Star Wars" saga is crossing over from a galaxy far, far away to the universe of raw, raw politics.
Judy Woodruff explains.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JUDY WOODRUFF, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A few days ago, in a land not so far away, the Cannes crowd looked at Darth Vader and saw George Bush.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is where the fun begins.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: When Anakin Skywalker, the young Vader, said, "If you're not with me, you're my enemy," some moviegoers heard this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Either you are with us, or you are with the terrorists.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: And in the epic clash of galactic powers, they saw the war in Iraq.
Were they right? George Lucas says the original "Star Wars" movie sprung from the ashes of Vietnam, making Vader a little less Bush and a little more Nixon, though Lucas is quick to draw connections.
GEORGE LUCAS, DIRECTOR, "REVENGE OF THE SITH": The parallels between what we did in Vietnam and what we're doing in Iraq now are unbelievable.
WOODRUFF: At its heart, "Star Wars" has always been a political parable. Why do you think Ronald Reagan called the Soviet Union...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RONALD WILSON REAGAN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: ... (INAUDIBLE) an evil empire...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: ... the language of Lucas, spoken across the political galaxy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I favor cuts in the Defense budget and carrier groups and troops in Europe, in Star Wars in any number of other areas.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: Even in these dark days with an earthly Senate torn asunder...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, MOVEON.ORG AD)
ANNOUNCER: One senator, seduced by a dark vision of absolute power, seeks to destroy this fabled order, replacing fair judges with far-right clones. To do this, he's ready to use a nightmare weapon known as the nuclear option.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: Yes, that's Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist. The liberal group MoveOn.org is spending $150,000 to run that ad.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don't make me destroy you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: "Revenge of the Sith" will surely make 10 times that sum by next week, with or without the Force.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, "REVENGE OF THE SITH")
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I hope right you are.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WOODRUFF: Judy Woodruff, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well we can't say good-bye to "Star Wars" tonight without paying tribute to the Internet's number-one Jedi master. Have you seen this young man before? Take a look. Oh, yes. I love him. He's 15 years old, he's a "Star Wars" fan from Quebec. He made himself this video on his computer. It's been an Internet classic since it was first posted a couple years ago.
The video really has taken on a life of its own. Millions of Web surfers have appreciated his sweet skills. But his Internet fans decided he needed some help, some special effects. So, thanks to computer graphics and sound cards, the boy with what looks to be a golf-ball retriever is transformed into the "Star Wars" Kid. Watch.
Don't you miss being a kid? "Star Wars" Kid, I am your father.
A government official, caught on tape gambling on illegal cockfights. Tonight, 360 takes you inside the cockfighting pit, a multimillion-dollar business thriving in the shadows of the law.
Is this pill safe, or not? Some say it's a dieter's dream. Others call it a pill of death. Tonight, should the diet drug ephedra go back on the shelves?
An undercover agent on the most dangerous assignment of his life. Tonight, meet a real-life Donnie Brasco. He infiltrated one of the country's most brutal motorcycle gangs and helped put dozens behind bars.
This two-hour edition of 360 continues in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, somewhere tonight in the United States, somewhere possibly right now, dozens of people, maybe even a few hundred, are watching a battle that'll end in certain death for one of the fighters, if not for both of them. It's the centuries-old blood sport of cockfighting. Now, many states ban it, and soon President Bush may sign a bill into law that will make it illegal nationwide. For now, in some states, like Louisiana and New Mexico, cockfighting is a legal and lucrative way of life for business owners and gamblers, who vow to continue the killing.
CNN's Rich Sanchez investigates.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RICK SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): What you are looking at is illegal, secretly recorded by the Georgia Bureau of Investigation. It's a cockfight, not uncommon in the U.S., where, despite laws against it, enthusiasts seem unable to control the urge. As it is, on this night, in this particular town, nestled in the corner of Georgia, where more than 300 people are congregated around a fighting pit, ready to watch, gamble, or both. For them and thousands of others, cockfighting has become a complex game of hide-and-seek played out in cities all over the country by police and "cockers," as they're called.
(on camera): So what is it, then, that makes this bust here in the mountains of northeast Georgia different from any of those others? The answer? One man.
(voice-over): And here he is on tape. The man entrusted by the citizens of Blue Ridge to uphold the law is, according to the GBI, showing little regard for the laws pertaining to gambling and cockfighting. We called the mayor for comment, but he chose not to talk to us.
But in Louisiana, we found a mayor who would talk. Danny Louviere is not only a mayor but a prosecutor, as well. As a Cajun, he's right at home here in the bayou country, where the alligator, the crawfish and etouffe, are always fresh. It's also a place where fighting roosters is as much a part of the tradition as the Cajun cooking.
MAYOR DANNY LOUVIERE, SUNSET, LOUISIANA: To those people who say that this is a heinous thing and this is not the thing to be doing, I would simply say, Look in your own backyard first before you come look in our backyard.
SANCHEZ: Right about now, you may be asking yourself why it is the mayor in northeast Georgia won't talk to us but the mayor in Louisiana will, why one mayor appears in a police raid while the other talks openly with his police officers about cockfighting. Here's why. Here in Louisiana, cockfighting is legal. What's more, it's a multi- million-dollar business, one that may soon evaporate if the president signs a new farm bill that would make it illegal to transport game fowl across state lines.
It's a measure that would have a national impact on people like Gerald and Stanlina (ph) Allen of North Carolina, who sell feed, vitamins and medicine. They say they'd be devastated.
GERALD ALLEN, SUPPLY STORE OWNER: The mail order we do, the game fowl people we work with, that would be 85 percent of our business. We would have to disemploy some people. You know, we couldn't keep them on the payroll.
SANCHEZ: So who are these men and women who spend up to $15,000 a year in feed and up to $25,000 a year in travel to fight roosters? Here is how their action is characterized by animal rights activists.
WAYNE PACELLE, HUMANE SOCIETY: By society's standards, does this measure up? Is this conduct that we think is civil and decent and humane? And I don't think, by any test, you could say that these actions are appropriate.
GEORGE O'BRIEN, COCKFIGHTER: They don't understand it. We're basically sportsmen. People are urbanized today, and they don't really know where eggs come from. They don't know where the meat comes from. They think it comes out of a machine.
SANCHEZ (on camera): How does it make you feel, knowing that once that bill is signed, all four of you will be felons overnight?
LARRY WHITEHEAD, COCKFIGHTER: There's brick masons here. There's dairy people. There's lawyers. There's ever walk of life, people into this. And overnight, with one signature, they will be a felon because people aren't -- they're not going to stop. JERRY WALLACE, COCKFIGHTER: I farmed for 38 years, and I've got everything wrong (INAUDIBLE) That's all I've got to do now, enjoy my chickens. And now they want to take what little I've got going to keep me alive, and they want to take it away from us.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): It's a bitter and emotional issue, one these men feel so strongly about, they eagerly demonstrate what they say these animals do naturally.
O'BRIEN: We just show them each other.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Well, next on this two-hour edition of 360...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANCHEZ: People would say you're engaging them to kill themselves or to kill each other. Is that what they'd say?
DALE, CHICKEN BREEDER: Oh, they'd say a lot worse than that. They call me a bloodthirsty, drug-dealing -- you know, I mean, we've been called all kinds of names.
SANCHEZ: How does it make you feel?
DALE: Not good because it's a lie.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Part two of Rich Sanchez's report, "Inside the Secret Society of Cockfighting.
And a little later: An undercover agent penetrates one of America's most brutal outlaw gangs, part of our special report, "Justice Undercover."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LOUVIERE: Most people who say that this is a heinous thing and this is not the thing to be doing, I would simply say, Look in your own backyard first before you come look in our backyard.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: What they're talking about is cockfighting. Before the break, we gave you a look at the blood sport, cockfighting, a violent form of gambling that is allowed in some states, banned in others. And the people who raise the roosters to kill and the gamblers who bet on the fights insist cockfighting is not cruel. They insist it's humane, and tonight, they want to prove it to you. Let's return now to Rick Sanchez, who picks up the story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) O'BRIEN: It's impossible to force an animal to fight. Impossible.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): It's a candid conversation that provides a rare glimpse into a world that has increasingly become a secret society.
(on camera): Do you love animals? Do you love animals?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
SANCHEZ: Love animals. Then why do you let them fight to the death?
WALLACE: It's their heritage.
SANCHEZ: Their what?
WALLACE: Their heritage. That's all they know to do.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): In fact, these men are so convinced what they do is natural, God's way, as they like to say, they willingly demonstrate what they call the animals' combative nature.
O'BRIEN: Well, what we're going to do now is just turn them loose and show everybody that you don't make them fight. We only let them fight. So I'll show you what they'll do. We'll just show them each other. This will continue until one is dead.
SANCHEZ: Is it natural? Are the men right to say they're just watching something that would happen anyway? We asked the game fowl industry's most prominent critic, animal rights activist Wayne Pacelle.
PACELLE: Yes, they're fighting on their own, at some level. But they've been placed in a circumstance and a situation, and they've been bred for specific aggression.
SANCHEZ (on camera): People would say you're engaging them to kill themselves or to kill each other. Is that what they say?
DALE, CHICKEN BREEDER: Oh, they'd say a lot worse than that. They call me a blood-thirsty, drug-dealing -- you know, I mean, we've been called all kinds of names.
SANCHEZ: How does it make you feel?
DALE: Not good because it's a lie.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): Dale, who prefers we don't use his last name, says his birds are actually pampered.
DALE: Got a little bit of applesauce on his mouth here.
SANCHEZ (on camera): You feed them applesauce?
DALE: Oh, I -- yes, I grind apples for them. They get -- you know, we don't -- I...
SANCHEZ: That's it right there, what we're looking at (INAUDIBLE) ?
DALE: This is the applesauce. This is just part of the apple.
SANCHEZ: That's like what a baby eats. And you individually feed each one.
DALE: Yes. Yes.
SANCHEZ: It seems crazy. I mean...
DALE: Well, it's just -- you know, it's a matter of keeping them really healthy. You know, the animal rights people say we use drugs. I'm not saying there aren't people that don't. You know, it's just like in horse racing or anything else, there's bad people. I never give my chickens drugs.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): What makes Dale unique is he's raised both game fowl for fighting and poultry for restaurants. He says there's no comparison as to which bird he'd rather be.
DALE: I want to live for 42 days in a crowded house, where if anything goes wrong -- a spot of blood -- you know, those chickens are cannibalized in those houses. There's all kinds of things that go on in chicken houses that don't go on in game fowl ranches.
SANCHEZ: We checked with USDA and Agriculture officials and found his statement to be accurate. Chickens raised for fast food consumption are often slaughtered after just six weeks. And their short lives are lived in conditions so cramped, many actually cannibalize each other.
(on camera): How big is this? How big is this?
DALE: It's 4 by 12 by.
SANCHEZ: It's 4 by 12?
DALE: It's 4 by 12 by 8 foot high.
SANCHEZ: That's pretty big.
DALE: Yes.
SANCHEZ: I mean, that's -- that's a pretty good size living space for one tiny little animal, isn't it?
DALE: Right, especially when you consider that commercial poultry are given less than one square foot per bird. Less than one square foot. SANCHEZ (on camera): It's a comparison that has not gone unnoticed by animal rights activists, who say they've set their sights on commercial breeders, as well.
PACELLE: We at the Humane Society of the United States have long criticized the industrialization of agriculture, and we want to have animals in more extensive systems and we want them to have a decent life if they're going to be slaughtered for food.
SANCHEZ: With Hollywood stars like Pamela Anderson and Rue McClanahan fighting to end cockfighting in New Mexico, Louisiana may soon become the battleground state.
PACELLE: It is Louisiana. The few people who believe in this, are they representing the right view and the rest of the nation is wrong?
BUTCH LAWSON, PIT MANAGER: Tens of thousands to a hundred thousand people in the game fowl industry.
SANCHEZ: Butch Lawson, who manages the pit considered the Kentucky Derby of cockfighting, says it's an honest business.
(on camera): How's it work, people pay to get in?
LAWSON: Yes.
SANCHEZ: So you got to pay for admission.
LAWSON: You pay -- you pay for your seat admission. And the contestants, they put up pot money that they participate for. The pit has nothing to do with any -- anything other than the seat concession.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): As for the people who'd like to put him out of business?
(on camera): They love animals.
LAWSON: They do.
SANCHEZ: And they don't want to see animals get hurt.
LAWSON: And so do I.
SANCHEZ (voice-over): For this determined, some might argue stubborn, lot of game fowl enthusiasts, who trace the origin of their sport back to ancient rulers and U.S. presidents, wars and conquests, the last battle is about to be waged, and this time the odds are not on their side.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SANCHEZ: A couple of different factors that come into play here. These men are convinced that this is an urban argument versus a rural argument, which is the world that they come from. And it's also a bit of a paradox, isn't it. You see them, as we did, taking such incredible care of these animals from the moment they're born to two or three years old, only to eventually let them kill each other.
In the end, they say what they're doing is perfectly natural. Folks on the animal rights activist side say it's perfectly brutal. I'm Rick Sanchez -- Anderson.
COOPER: Fascinating report. I had no idea, actually, it was even legal in any state. Interesting to know. And we'll see how long it lasts in Louisiana and New Mexico. Rick, thanks very much. Good report.
SANCHEZ: Thank you.
COOPER: Erica Hill from HEADLINE LINES joins us with the latest at about 13 to the hour.
Hey, Erica.
HILL: Hey, Anderson.
Former Chilean dictator Augusto Pinochet was rushed to the hospital today. The Chilean Army says Pinochet had a mini stroke and is in the intensive care unit. The 8nine-year-old has had health problems in the past. Pinochet has been accused of human rights abuses during his reign, but was never convicted.
On to San Salvador, El Salvador: hurricane a-comin.' Hurricane Adrian, the first of the season, has already killed at least two people and forced thousands from their homes. People in Central America have been preparing for the storm. Forecasters are concerned it could cause flashflooding and devastating mudslides.
Here in the U.S., bigger and stronger: that's what US Airways and America West are hoping for, anyway. The two airlines -- both with a history of financial problems -- are now planning to merge. The new airline would be called US Airways but will be controlled by America West's management.
And above the Earth: no solicitors, please. The FAA has proposed to amend its regulations so it could enforce a law that bans what it calls "obtrusive advertising in space." The ads, flown in low orbit, would be big enough to appear as large as the moon. And right now, if a company chooses to launch an ad like that, the FAA has no power to stop it.
And that's the latest from HEADLINE NEWS right now. Anderson, back to you.
COOPER: Erica, thanks very much. I'll see you again in about thirty minutes. Coming up next in this special edition of 360, a controversial herbal supplement. Remember ephedra? Will it make a comeback? 360 M.D. Sanjay Gupta reports.
Also ahead tonight, an undercover federal agent risking his life to bring down members of an outlawed motorcycle gang. And insurance fraud, this man under fire, thinking no one's watching him, looks like he has trouble walking, doesn't it? But investigators are tracking his every move. They're saying he's faking it, part of our special report, "Justice Undercover" and a little later.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it's an ancient but controversial herbal supplement that could be making a comeback. We're talking about ephedra. Used as a quick fix for weight loss, it was banned by the FDA more than a year ago after it was linked to dozens of deaths. But just last month, a federal judge in Utah struck down parts of the ban, saying the FDA did not prove that ephedra is unsafe in small doses, which means the supplement may now be on the road to return. 360 M.D. Sanjay Gupta takes a look at what that might mean.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As a single mom nearing 40, former fashion model Dawn Ellison longs for the slim figure she once had.
DAWN ELLISON, EPHEDRA FAN: I'd always been very small, and I guess after I had my children, I put on a lot of weight. I was very depressed. I was very frustrated with myself.
GUPTA: A couple of years ago, she got closer to looking like her former self-.
ELLISON: I lost about 40 pounds in a period of one year. And I went from a size 14 to a 6. And it was really amazing, especially after having two children.
GUPTA: She did it with the help of the dietary supplement ephedra, a stimulant that gave her more energy and helped her shed pounds without dieting and without any side effects. Also known as ma huang, at least 12 million Americans relied on the herbal supplement as an all-natural solution to weight loss and increased metabolism. That was until reports of negative side effects started to surface. In 2001, 21-year-old April Easterling died from a blood hemorrhage that was believed to be associated with her ephedra use.
PAT GIVENS, APRIL EASTERLING'S MOTHER: My daughter was looking to lose five pounds, you know, and instead of losing five pounds, she lost her life.
GUPTA: In 2003, the sudden death of 23-year-old Orioles pitcher Steve Bechtler also was linked to the supplement.
(on camera): Unfortunately for so many unsuspecting ephedra users, this is where they found themselves, fighting for their lives in the ER. Overall, the FDA received reports of 1,600 complications linked to the supplement, including heart attacks, seizures and strokes, and a total of 164 deaths.
(voice-over): In April, 2004, the FDA banned ephedra, concluding that dietary supplements containing ephedrine and ephedra did present an unreasonable risk of illness or injury. Dawn heard the warnings, but wasn't particularly worried about herself. ELLISON: I had some concerns, like everyone did, but it didn't affect me in that way. So I figured, I'm not feeling any of these side effects. Luckily, I've always had good blood pressure, even when I'm stressed out. It doesn't affect my blood pressure, so that could be one of the reasons.
GUPTA: And being relatively young and healthy, Dawn didn't fall into one of the highest-risk groups. Still, the ban had taken her ephedra away, and Dawn gained almost the entire 40 pounds back in just one year.
There are many who thought the ban was unnecessary and the risks were being overblown.
DR. ERIC BRAVERMAN, INTEGRATIVE MEDICINE SPECIALIST: Ephedra's been used in China for over 2,000 years, in the West at least close to a hundred years. It's been around a long time. Ideally, everyone should have access to ephedra under physician supervision. Those who complained about it, maybe they should have been more careful and should have had more doctor supervision.
GUPTA: Dr. Eric Braverman, a physician who combines conventional and alternative therapies, believes there are valid arguments for putting it back on the market.
BRAVERMAN: We don't want the FDA overregulating, as a general rule, natural supplements because access to those supplements may be reduced. I have no confidence that the government is necessarily right about ephedra.
GUPTA: Almost exactly a year after the ban, a federal judge in Utah struck it down, opening up the possibility of ephedra's return to the market. For Dawn, who has tried the ephedra-free supplements without any success, the ruling offered a glimmer of hope.
ELLISON: If ephedra were to come back on the market, I would absolutely be the first in line and know that I will have the confidence back that I lost over the last several months.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, Sanjay, Now that the judge has overruled the ban, what's the FDA's response.
GUPTA: Well, the FDA's still weighing its options right now. A couple things to keep in mind here. When it comes to herbal supplements, the FDA has to prove that it's unsafe, so it puts the onus of responsibility on the FDA. And also, when we're talking about dosages here, they're really important. They talk about the 10- milligram dosage or lower as being safe. Both sides agree that once you get into the higher doses, there could be safety issues, Anderson.
COOPER: All right, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thanks. Coming up...
GUPTA: Thank you.
COOPER: Appreciate it.
Next on this two-hour edition of 360, a motorcycle police officer. You're going to meet a man who risked everything to infiltrate a ruthless, violent gang.
Also tonight, a grown man talking like a baby? Investigators say it is all a scam for insurance money, part of our special report "Justice Undercover."
Also ahead tonight, the Michael Jackson trial. Find out what the judge had to say about Larry King's testimony today. Be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: This is one of those stories you might find yourself having to hear two or three times in a row to make sure your ears aren't playing tricks on you. Bank robber takes six people hostage, orders them to strip to their underwear, then drives them to an airport where he's shot by police as he apparently tries to get away in a small plane.
See what I mean? Makes you think the headline writers may be having a little fun with you, except it is all true. It played out yesterday in Kansas. CNN's Ed Lavandera reports on the bizarre case.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Wearing a t-shirt with the words "Show Me the Money," Bennie Herring walked into Capital Federal Savings fully armed and with a plan. Hostage Monica Carter says Herring was calm from the moment he walked in the front door, even when police surrounded the bank.
MONICA CARTER, HOSTAGE: In my eyes it looked like he knew the police were there the entire time and he was taking his time.
LAVANDERA: There were 10 employees and one customer inside the bank. Investigators say Herring ordered everyone to undress, probably as a way to show he was in control and then he tied them all together. That's when he noticed a minivan just outside the bank door.
CARTER: He was in the bank chaining everyone together. He asked whose van that was. And I said that it was mine. He asked for my keys and told me to give them to one of my co-workers. And then he led them outside.
LAVANDERA: The scene outside was intensifying, SWAT teams and snipers surrounded the area. An armored vehicle rolled on to the scene to keep the masked gunman from getting away.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Possibly been the weirdest 24 hours in my life.
LAVANDERA: Shane Keyser, a photographer with the "Kansas City Star," arrived just in time to capture some of the most bizarre scenes of the foiled bank robbery. The suspect moving six half naked hostages into the van.
SHANE KEYSER, "KANSAS CITY STAR" PHOTOGRAPHER: It was part terror, part fear and just not really knowing what in the world is going to happen next.
LAVANDERA: About 40 minutes after walking in, the alleged robber and his hostages were driving away with a squadron of police cars in pursuit. This made officers nervous.
SERGEANT MIKE BUTAUD, OLATHE P.D.: Anytime you have a bank robbery or robbery of any type in a structure, we want to try it confine them into that area because it is a lot easier to work that way. Anytime someone takes hostages and leaves into another area, we have a lot less control of what happens and it is very dangerous for the hostages.
LAVANDERA: The van drove almost two miles down the road where officers were about to encounter the next surprise. Lieutenant Shawn Reynolds was in the chase when he saw the van speed on to the runway of a small airport.
Did you immediately think does this guy have a getaway plane?
LIEUTENANT SHAWN REYNOLDS, OLATHE P.D.: That's what went through my mind. Is that there is a plane sitting on a runway and has two subjects inside of it and the plane is running. And they drove immediately right to that area. That's exactly what i thought.
LAVANDERA: Inside the plane was Matt Miller, a veteran flight instructor, oblivious he and a student were finishing preflight tests and about to take off when the suspect holding a hostage approached the plane and police quickly surrounded them as well.
MATT MILLER, FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR: The next thing I hear is get out, get out! They're shouting for me to get out. And I raise up and look at the guy with a gun pointed at me. I realize he wants me to get out.
LAVANDERA: At first police thought Matt Miller was part of the getaway plan.
REYNOLDS: At that point we didn't know what was going on. We didn't know if the plane was part of some type of elaborate plan or what the deal was. So we had to treat them as possible suspects as well.
LAVANDERA: Police say they weren't going to let the alleged robber, who was also a licensed pilot, fly away. So they shot him as he opened the plane's door. Miller and the flight student jumped out of the plane, police then handcuffed the two men.
MILLER: I said, hey, man, I'm a good guy here. I'm a flight instructor. He said flight instructors rob banks too. At that point, I went bank robbery? Dummy.
LAVANDERA: And that was the ending to what some here are describing as the most bizarre bank robbery this part of Kansas has ever seen. Ed Lavandera, CNN, Olathe, Kansas.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Joining us now live from Phoenix, Arizona, is Troy Evans who advises banks on robbery prevention which is a good position to do because he served seven-and-a-half years on a bank robbery conviction some time ago. Troy, appreciate you being here. You were convicted of five armed bank robberies. The FBI says about 75 percent of all bank robbers get caught. Did you think you would get away with it when you were robbing banks?
TROY EVANS, FORMER BANKROBBER: At the time that I was committing those crimes, I was in a drug-induced stupor and very much felt that I was invincible. And to be honest with you, I was either going to get enough money to feed my habit for another 30 or 60 days or the police would show up and I was going to make them do something that I didn't have the guts do myself.
COOPER: You weren't thinking far ahead. You robbed a bank, you wore a hat and sunglasses. You pretty much tried to blend in. This guy in Kansas goes in wearing a black hood, a shirt that says "Show Me the Money." What does this tell you about the guy?
EVANS: Well, it is definitely out of the norm. Having met and interviewed over 300 convicted bank robbers, most of them are either strung out on drugs, got a gambling habit to pay, they've got a house that is about to be foreclosed on. It is very much an act of desperation. This guy, I would say, probably something in his personal life triggered him over the edge. I don't know, a divorce, a -- losing a house, losing a job, the death of a loved one. That is only speculation but something definitely pushed him over the edge. But that's not the norm.
COOPER: You say it is an act of desperation for a lot of these guys. This guy went in with chains, plastic handcuffs, walkie- talkies, even gave a walkie-talkie to police so he could communicate with them. Is that kind of planning typical?
EVANS: That is not typical. This guy, obviously, he was a licensed pilot. We can assume he was pretty smart. I'm guessing that it was probably something that was planned out over some course of time. He just didn't pick this bank randomly. I would also guess and again this is just speculation it is probably something -- he may have had some issues with some banks in the past.
For him to ask the individuals to undress and to chain together that's very unusual. It is almost a humiliation type of thing. And it just makes me wonder if he doesn't have an issue with the bank or banks, maybe a foreclosure in his past, something like that.
COOPER: What is the biggest deterrent to a robber? You counsel banks now. What do you tell them?
EVANS: Number one, the first and foremost prevention weapon they have at their disposal is their employees. Their employees alone can keep a would-be robber from coming into their institution. They're on the frontlines; they see the people every day that are coming in and out. And if they just are aware of suspicious activities, anything out of the ordinary, great customer service, somebody you don't recognize, walk up, extend a hand to them and ask them what you can do for them today. Last thing a would-be robber wants is somebody looking them in the eye and at the same time for legitimate customers, it is fantastic customer service. So the front line people very important.
COOPER: Good advice there. Troy Evans, appreciate you joining us. Thank you very much.
EVANS: Thanks, Anderson, my pleasure.
COOPER: Here are a few fast facts on the subject of bank robberies, gleaned from the FBI. Friday is actually the biggest day for bank heists. And mornings between 9:00 and 11:00 are when they mostly happen. Perhaps because it is payday. Somewhat surprisingly, better than half of all bank robberies do not involve the use of a firearm. And very, very few, less than one percent, lead to a homicide or hostage taking.
We're talking about crime this week and tonight we focus on "Justice Undercover." Sometimes it is the only way to catch criminals. We start tonight with one of the country's most lawless and feared motorcycle gangs, the Mongols claimed 350 members. They dealt in illegal drugs and any criminal activity you can imagine, including murder. We know all this thanks to an undercover agent's incredible, almost foolhardy courage. He joined the gang, won their trust and brought dozens of them to justice.
Paula Zahn has his story.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BILLY QUEEN, RETIRED ATF AGENT: I was out there by myself. If the crap went bad, I would have been in serious trouble.
PAULA ZAHN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Forget the way he looks, this man was a top undercover agent, who for two years was assigned to penetrate one of the country's most brutal outlaw gangs, the Mongols.
QUEEN: Certainly not as big as the Hell's Angels, but although not as big, probably the most feared outlaw motorcycle gang out there.
ZAHN: Billy Queen worked for ATF -- the Federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms. And he discovered that while the Mongols used ruthless violence to enforce their criminal rule, they also enjoyed the violence for its own sake.
QUEEN: The guy with all the tattoos on him is Rick Slayton. He's a Mongol. This guy in the hat right here is the guy that threw the stuff. What is happening is they're surrounding him now. He's got no place to go. They're going beat the crap out of him and they are going to beat the crap out of all of his buddies. The knives are going to come out. People are going to be stabbed. And over here, they're stabbing a guy. After the Mongols get through what they're doing, the guy with the hat, he's still hanging on to his hat, hitting him with the chair. Now it is over. And now what happens is the Mongols just disappear.
ZAHN: When the night was over, five people were hospitalized and none arrested. This is the violent gang world that Billy Queen infiltrated. Starting out as a prospect ...
QUEEN: When you first come in the club ...
ZAHN: Like a fraternity pledge, Billy progressed through the ranks of the gang, earning special patches, or rockers, along the way.
QUEEN: After a certain period of time, a month, maybe two months, they'll vote on whether you should go to the next step and give you your center rocker.
ZAHN: After more than year with the Mongols, Billy was voted treasurer of California's San Fernando Valley chapter.
QUEEN: This patch here is an officer patch.
ZAHN: But unknown to the president and other Mongol officers, Billy Queen and his ATF colleagues were secretly recording the illegal drug deals, thefts, gunfights, stabbings and murders. And along the way he often had to prove his loyalty to this vicious brotherhood.
QUEEN: Rocky pulls out his knife, slits that plastic bag and he lined out two lines of meth out on the table. But he turned around at me and put the knife at my face and said is that line too much for you? I looked down at it and said, no Rock, that's fine with me, you snow I'll get my dollar bill and we'll take care of business.
I think to myself what you going do? What are you going to do? My face was getting red, my ears were getting ready and I stepped between Rocky and the dope and I bent over with it like I was snorting it and went -- and wiped it off in my hand. I raised up and Rocky looked around and saw the dope gone. He looked at me, yeah. He did it. Cops don't do dope.
ZAHN: But he was a cop. And he was touched by the chilling advice Rocky later gave him.
QUEEN: And he said, this is not a club. We're outlaws. And you need to know that. You need to know what you're getting into. I sat there for a little bit thinking to myself, I wonder if I do know what I'm getting into here.
ZAHN: Some gang members remain suspicious of the new Mongol they knew as Billy St. John. And Billy Queen learned to live with fear.
QUEEN: When fear becomes a part of you, you start feeling it, then you slow down. Fear is a good thing in a situation like that where you use it for survival.
ZAHN: And one of the most fearsome Mongols was a prison-hardened leader known as Red Dog.
QUEEN: He suspected me practically the entire time I was in. They took me out in the middle of nowhere in an abandoned orange grove and when I got out there, there is six or eight of these guys standing around. They all got guns. So Red looks at me and says, so if I put a bullet in the back of your head, nobody is going to know where to start looking for you. I said, that's right, Red. And he looked at me and said turn around and go out there in the field and set some targets up.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Well, when we come back, Billy Queen faces a life and death moment of truth.
QUEEN (video clip): I thought, they've made me, this is it. They're going all shoot me in the back right here.
COOPER: Undercover and alone, the rest of Billy Queen's story in a minute.
Also ahead tonight, a grown man acting like a baby. Is this guy for real? Meet the man who went deep undercover to find out and find out what this guy is really doing.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Federal Agent Billy Queen knows he is lucky to be alive. He infiltrated and actually became a member of a vicious outlaw motorcycle gang, the Mongols. That's when his worst fears came true. The gang's leader, a guy named Red Dog, accused him of being a cop. Billy Queen still shakes when he remembers the day. As we continue our look at "Justice Undercover" tonight, once again, here's Paula Zahn.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ZAHN: Red Dog looks at me and starts saying how long was your academy Billy? He kept getting louder and kept getting louder, and kept closer to my face and pointing his finger at my face. How long was your (EXPLETIVE DELETED) academy? Police academy! And I try to shake him off, shake him off. Who did you tell you were coming up here. Who knows you with the Mongols today? Who knows you up here.
Nobody, Red. Nobody. So I put a bullet in your head, nobody will know where to start looking for you, is that right, Billy. That's right, Red Dog. And he said, turn around and go set up the targets out there.
And I turned around and I started walking out in the field and said if they made me this is it. They're going to all shoot me in the back. There was nothing I could do. I didn't have a gun. I bluffed them as far as I could bluff them.
ZAHN: It turned out it was Red Dog who was bluffing. QUEEN: I turned around and looked while I was sitting the cans up and they're all joking with each other and stuff like that. And so I get my heart going again and I pull myself back together so I can play the game for the rest of the night.
ZAHN: For most federal agents, the line between enforcing the law and breaking it is clear. But for undercover agents, in as deep as Billy Queen, that line sometimes disappears. It happened when the Mongols accidentally ran into a rival gang in a bar. It didn't take long for the fight to start. And a brother Mongol, the chapter president, was in the middle of it.
QUEEN: Right when we went in, there was a guy that was leaning up against an ice machine and he had a beer in one hand, and finally the president looked at him and said what the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) are you looking at? And this guy looked back at the president and said you. And when he did, the president just decked him, just bam. Beer went up in the air. He took one swipe and hit me in the side of the head. I hung on to him and I swung back and when I did, he reached in behind him and he came out with this knife.
And I let go of him and I was -- he swiped the knife across my jacket, slit the front of my jacket. I'm afraid he's going to kill me. I'm righteously afraid this guy is going to kill me. I hollered for Rocky, the chapter sergeant of arms to shoot him. And I'm hollering, shoot him, Rocky, shoot him. I'm going around in a circle with this guy. As far as I was concerned, the case was over with at that time.
So is it always clear? No, it is not clear. When a fight breaks out in the bar, and the clubs come out and the knives come out, stuff like that, and you're slugging it out in the bar, you hit somebody, that's an assault or is it an assault? Are you protecting yourself? What are you doing?
ZAHN: That question first began for Billy Queen when his mother died, suddenly, during the investigation.
QUEEN: I didn't ask anybody anything. I told the Mongols, hey, look, my mom died and I told ATF, I'm taking a break. I gotta go home, my mom died.
ZAHN: When he got back to his undercover life, as outlaw biker, to the people who knew him as Billy St. John, he began to see things in a new light.
QUEEN: And I rode over to Evil's house. And when I walked up to the door Evil and I put my hand out for that handshake and he grabbed me around the neck and said, Billy, I'm sorry about your mom, buddy. I love you, brother. And I almost -- I almost cried. I almost dropped to my knees and cried. ATF hadn't said a word to me. Not when I left, not when I came back. Not the case agent, not anybody in the office, nobody said, sorry about your mom. But that first Mongol I saw grabbed me around the neck and said he loved me and was sorry about my mom. And the next one that I saw did the same thing. And the next one did the same thing. And I told myself, this is where I belong. I wanted to be a Mongol at that time. I didn't want to be Billy Queen. I wanted to be Billy St. John. And I wanted to get on that bike and ride off with them.
ZAHN: In the end, after two long years riding with the gang, Billy finally did leave.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His undercover activities, which were at great risk to and sacrifice from the agent ...
ZAHN: As a direct result of his undercover work, 54 Mongols were arrested. And 53 went to jail for crimes that included murder, illegal drug dealing, and weapons violations.
QUEEN: It was hard for me to sit there on the witness stand and look those guys in the face and them looking at me them call me brother and told me they loved me. They did love me. They loved Billy St. John. And it was hard.
ZAHN: He knows the Mongols will never forget that. And he is haunted by a deadly threat. That one day the Mongols will take revenge.
QUEEN: I know that I'm always going to be looking over my shoulder. I would be foolish not to. I don't go anywhere today without a gun. And when I go to bed at nighttime, I sleep with a double barrel shotgun right by my bed.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Paula Zahn with that report. Retired ATF Agent Billy Queen has written a book about his adventures with the Mongols, it's called "Under and Alone." Mel Gibson is making it into a movie in which he will play Billy Queen.
Still ahead, Larry King usually asks the questions. Today he came to answer them at the Michael Jackson trial. We'll tell you what happened in a moment. First, though, Erica Hill from HEADLINE NEWS joins with us the latest at about 20 past the hour. Hey, Erica.
HILL: Hey, Anderson.
And another violent day in Iraq with several assassinations and two more deaths of American military members. One of them when a roadside bomb ripped a U.S. convoy southeast of Baghdad. That brings the American death toll in Iraq to 1627. More than a dozen Iraqis were killed. The prime minister has called on Syria to stop foreign fighters from coming into Iraq to help insurgents.
On the CNN "Security Watch," one week after an Air France flight was diverted to Bangor, Maine, originally supposed to land in Boston, the homeland security chief says the no-fly list that checks names for possible terrorist connections is, quote, "primitive." He says he would like to streamline the system by creating a database of trusted travelers who don't have to be checked at every point.
A big step for stem cell research. Scientists in South Korea say they've create new batches of embryonic stem cells from nine injured patients. Senior administration officials tell CNN President Bush will veto any expansion of stem cell funding.
A high profile merger is creating some controversy on Wall Street. Valerie Morris has a closer look in tonight's "Market Mover" report.
VALERIE MORRIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (video clip): There is a fight for the floor of the New York Stock Exchange. The 200-year-old trading institution recently announced plans to go public and merge with Archipelago, an electronic trading company. The stealth transaction driven by exchange Chairman John Thane took investors and NYSE insiders by surprise. The deal faces lots of opposition and there are questions about the conflict of interest between the two exchanges and Goldman Sachs, which brokered the deal.
The NYSE is the world's largest stock exchange with more than 1.5 billion shares changing hands every day.
HILL: And that, again, was Valerie Morris. And Anderson, that's the latest from HEADLINE NEWS.
COOPER: Erica, thanks. We'll see you again in 30 minutes.
Does this man look injured to you? Or is he just faking it so he can get a bundle of cash? Tonight catching insurance cheats and how their lies are costing you money.
And up close and personal -- maybe too personal -- with Britney Spears and Mr. Britney Spears. Why their sex talk on her new reality show has got viewers blushing "Inside the Box." This two-hour edition of 360 continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Welcome back to this special two-hour edition of 360. We're talking about Justice Undercover tonight. Now take a look at this number. The Insurance Information Institute says that fraud cost insurers up to $120 billion a year. And their losses become yours when your premiums go up. Randi Kaye shows us how some people are trying to catch insurance cheater on tape.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Does this man look injured to you? Too sick to work? In such pain his insurance company needed to cover costly home improvements like a wheelchair ramp? That's what Randall Williams (ph) told his doctors. Watch as the Florida man hobbles out of the doctor's office, relying heavily on a four pronged walker. But William's luck runs out down the road. His car breaks down while insurance fraud investigators are on his tail. Thinking no one is watching, he climbed up under the hood of his truck to fix it. RICHIE TAFFET, PRESIDENT, OMEGA INSURANCE SERVICES: And just look at this fella. I mean, 30 minutes ago this guy was at a doctor's office. He had a four pronged walker.
KAYE: Williams had been collecting disability for 12 years. Richie Taffet and his team of investigators put an end to that scam.
TAFFET: In the end his free ride was over. He was charged with workers' compensation fraud.
KAYE: Richie Taffet runs Omega Insurance Services, which employs more than 150 private investigators. Their job is to crack insurance fraud cases. The job requires long hours, lots of homework and even more legwork. Sometimes they'll spend years collecting data on alleged insurance scammers.
(on camera): According to industry estimates, workers' compensation fraud totals more than $6 billion annually. Insurance companies aren't the only victims. Fraud means higher premiums for honest citizens too.
(on camera): This man in Florida had been collecting payments for back and neck pain. But here he is on tape lifting big pieces of lumber, even a glass panel into his truck.
TAFFET: He's apparently getting ready to go home and do some work. That's some great close-up video.
KAYE: Much of Taffet's success is due to innovative technology. Recording the evidence on videotape is key. And these days the camera could be anywhere.
TAFFET: This phone is bored out and inside is a little chip cam -- and when you take it a look here in the tie, there is a nice chipboard camera in this pin hole lens and this one is black and white so you're not really getting that full color video. But nonetheless, you're still getting some great film.
KAYE: Great video is what helped Taffet and his team bust one of the most notorious scam artists in insurance fraud history, the so- called baby-talker. This former bus-driver, Bruce Gilbert, claimed a bad fall in 1987 caused him to regress back to infancy. In this sworn deposition, Gilbert talks baby talk for the camera, appearing unable to answer the most basic questions.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you take a shower or a bath?
BRUCE GILBERT, COMMITTED WORKERS' COMP. FRAUD: I don't know. Just water come out of the thing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You are standing up and water comes out of something and splashes on you?
GILBERT: Yes. Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You do that by yourself? GILBERT: Yes.
KAYE: But Gilbert didn't appear very baby-like when the Taffet P.I.s caught up with him. They recorded Gilbert behind the wheel.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Claimant says he acts like a five-year-old. How many five-year-olds do you know that are out there driving a car?
KAYE: And talking with their wives, or going hunting? Cameras caught Gilbert with a rifle and hunting gear.
TAFFET: That is just, what we call in the investigative world, the money shot.
KAYE: Taffet turned over his findings to the state of Florida.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get out of the golf cart. You're under arrest for workers' compensation fraud.
KAYE: But Gilbert still didn't give up the act when police approached him on a golf course where he was playing a very adult game of golf. As they made the arrest, Gilbert tried to resort to baby talk.
GILBERT: My mommy. Where mommy?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's up there in the car. She's under arrest too.
KAYE: Game over. Gilbert's now repaying hundreds of thousands of dollars in claims he never should have received.
TAFFET: The reality of it is, you never know when you're being watched and you never know when somebody might be out there catching you doing something you're not supposed to be doing.
KAYE: That's good advice from the guy with a tiny camera who may just be recording your every move.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KAYE: Now, Richie Taffet uses a lot of toys in his job. He uses the camera that you saw in that tie, the camera that is in the phone. He also has a camera in a beeper. And a camera, Anderson, in a pack of cigarettes. He also investigates about 25,000 cases like these a year. He has 2,000 active cases right now.
COOPER: I love it when the guy is getting arrested and says, where's mommy, and the police officer says, she's in the car. She's been arrested as well.
KAYE: Absolutely.
COOPER: How do they know who to investigate?
KAYE: Well, actually, they take a look at cases that have to do with soft tissue, when you're talking about neck strain or back strain -- things that you can't really see on an MRI or things you can't really disprove. They also look at people who aren't home when they come calling and people who miss a lot of doctors' appointments.
So, the job takes a lot of time and as you see, these people go to great lengths to get this money and make a false insurance claim. I mean, that baby talk guy, come on, you know? So, it is a pretty good business for Richie Taffet right now.
COOPER: Yes, amazing to see the lengths some people are going to go to. Randi Kaye, appreciate it. Great report. Thanks very much.
KAYE: Thank you.
COOPER: Coming up next, star power, the Michael Jackson trial. What's the defense trying to accomplish with all of the parade of celebrities we've been seeing? Jeffrey Toobin looks into that.
Also ahead tonight, routine police work along a highway, suddenly things go horribly -- oh, man -- things go horribly wrong. It is all caught on tape. The guy lives, though, and is fine, and we're going to talk to him just ahead. You're not going to believe this story.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: A familiar face in an unfamiliar place today, Larry King leaving the courthouse where Michael Jackson's on trial. Jackson's defense called King to testify about a conversation he had with a lawyer for the accuser's family. Got that? But, the judge decided not to allow King to take the stand.
Still, if you're looking for celebrity testimony, the Jackson case is certainly the place to go. With a look at why, senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SR LEGAL ANALYST: Jurors listened intently as Macaulay Culkin recounted the details of his unusual friendship with the King of Pop. "Home Alone" had just hit theaters when Jackson took the child star under his wing and into his bed. But Culkin insists that nothing untoward happened, calling the allegations against Michael Jackson absolutely ridiculous. It is a statement he's made before.
MACAULAY CULKIN, ACTOR: Nothing happened. You know, I mean, nothing really. We played video games, you know. We played it -- we played at the amusement park.
KING: (INAUDIBLE) in the bed?
CULKIN: Well, the thing is -- the thing is, with that whole thing, is that they've, oh, you slept in the same bedroom as him. It's like, I don't think you understand. Michael Jackson's bedroom is two stories and has, like, three bathrooms and this and that, so, when I slept in his bedroom, yes, but you need to understand the whole scenario.
TOOBIN: Culkin was the first celebrity Jackson's defense team called to the stand, but he won't be the last.
JAY LENO, HOST "TONIGHT SHOW WITH JAY LENO": As you may have seen on the news, next Tuesday I'm being called to testify in the Michael Jackson, so I have to go up there -- I do, I have to testify next Tuesday.
TOOBIN: When Jay Leno takes the stand, he's expected to describe a telephone conversation in which the alleged victim asked for money to pay for his cancer treatments. The defense says the comedian hung up, sensing something was amiss, and that he later told police the family was looking for a mark. Leno seems an unlikely ally for the defense. He fought the gag order that the judge imposed, so he could continue to make jokes about Jackson on "The Tonight Show."
LENO: Hey, Kevin, you know what Michael Jackson calls the Boy Scout uniform?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's that?
LENO: Lingerie.
TOOBIN: The defense is supposed to put another comedian on the stand, Chris Tucker, who was once friendly with the accuser and his family.
One celebrity the jury won't be hearing from is CNN's Larry King. He was supposed to tell them about a conversation he had a former lawyer for the accuser's mother. King says the lawyer described her as wacko, erratic, and going after Jackson just for his money.
JAYNE WEINTRAUB, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I think was a blow to the defense that Larry King won't be able to testify. Unfortunately Judge Melville decided today it was hearsay, no exception coming in, and he would not be allowed to testify before the jury.
TOOBIN: Kobe Bryant, Liz Taylor, Diana Ross, and Stevie Wonder all made the witness list. Whether or not they'll actually testify remains to be seen.
Jeffrey Toobin, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Yes, that witness list has been drastically reduced by the defense. Joining me now from outside the courthouse in Santa Maria, California, Court TV Chief Investigative Editor Diane Dimond.
Diane, good to see you. Do you think the defense's strategy, calling all these celebrities to testify, actually could back fire on them?
DIANE DIMOND, COURT TV: Well, you know, it could, I suppose. This is an agricultural community. It's blue collar. It's 60 percent Hispanic. This is California, but it sure ain't L.A. Still, in all, I tell you, I think I saw a couple of the jury members come into court today looking to see if Larry King was in the room. Of course, he'd already come and gone. So never underestimate celebrity and the power of it.
COOPER: That's certainly true. We heard Chris Tucker may testify. His former girlfriend, Aja Pryor, who has a child with him, testified today. What was her relationship, exactly, to the accuser and to his family?
DIMOND: Well, Chris Tucker met the boy, the cancer patient, before he got cancer, at the Laugh Factory, at the comedy club where all the kids went, and he just was so taken with this boy and his brother and sister that he started doing things for them, and brought his girlfriend and his son into it. They went to Raiders games. They went to Knott's Berry Farm. They just truly liked these children. Later, they met the father. But later, they met the mother. The father was out of the picture and Aja Pryor, in discussing her relationship with the mother and the children today, began to weep. She's a very beautiful woman, and very -- she made a great witness, I thought. She made some points for the defense when she said, you know, I talked to her all the time on the phone during that February- March 2003 period, and she didn't tell me she needed help. She didn't need -- tell me she needed to escape from Neverland, or that she was being held against her will.
But for the other side, for the state, she said, no, this woman never asked me for money. She never asked me to give her anything. My boyfriend Chris was going give her the car, but this was a family that she really truly had deep affection for.
COOPER: So if they were simply out for money, it wouldn't seem to make much sense she would be friends with them.
DIMOND: Right. Right. And, again, she went -- she had them come it a family weddings with her. She went to graduation ceremonies for the kids. When the mother had to have that meeting with Child Protective Services, it was Aja Pryor who came to support her.
I got the impression today, Anderson, that she would really like to know where the kids are so she can strike up a relationship with them again.
COOPER: So, what was Larry King called in to testify about? And why did the judge rule he wouldn't allow the testimony?
DIMOND: Well, he was called in to rule -- he was called in to talk about a conversation he had with Larry Feldman, another attorney who got that big $20 million settlement last time. And who's talked to the mother in this case. And at that breakfast meeting, allegedly, Larry Feldman said the mother's wacko and I think she's in it for money.
But that was apparently -- when they really got down to the knitty gritty with Larry King that was Feldman's opinion and so therefore it's hearsay. And it is just not allowed. Now, I've got to tell you, Larry Feldman was here a lot earlier. He knew this was coming up. And he has roundly denied he ever said anything like that.
COOPER: All right, well, the defense expected to rest perhaps the beginning of June. Their list of witnesses is way down. Diane Dimond, appreciate you joining us, thanks.
DIMOND: My pleasure.
COOPER: In just a minute tonight, horror on the highway. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEP. GLEN POTHEN, SURVIVED HIT BY RUNAWAY TRUCK: It is a miracle that neither one nor both of us were seriously injured or killed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: That's what I'm talking about here. Despite the way this looks, nobody was badly hurt. That's actually the man who was hit by the vehicle. An exclusive interview with the deputy who got hit, the woman who was standing next to him. We'll talk to both of them, find out how he is.
Also a little later, have we seen enough of Britney Spears lately? Believe me, you ain't seen nothing yet.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Officer down. Officer down!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER; It looks worse than it actually was. You're going to find this hard to believe. The deputy you just saw in the tape being mowed down by a pickup truck survived. Not only did he survive, he walked away, basically without a scratch. We're going to show you the tape again in a moment.
It happened in Minnesota where Deputy Glen Pothen had stopped to help a driver in need. Now, earlier I had an exclusive interview with the deputy and the driver who was right there with him when it all happened. Tiffany Whitlow.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Deputy Pothen, you know, when you look at this videotape, anyone seeing this would think you were a goner. What do you remember happening?
POTHEN: I remember, basically, hearing what sounded like some tires sliding on the pavement. And as I started to turn around, the next thing I know I'm looking up at the sky. And next thing I know I'm down in the -- on my back in the grass. And remember hearing Tiffany screaming.
COOPER: Did you see the vehicle coming?
TIFFANY WHITLOW, WITNESS: Yes, I did. I saw a black flash. And then somehow by God's will I was able to get out of the situation, back up. And the only part that of me that got injured was my hand that hit the truck. I saw an officer flying in the air. And I saw the truck following soon after.
COOPER: Did you think he had been killed?
WHITLOW: To be honest, yes. If he was still alive, he was in a lot of serious danger.
COOPER: Deputy Pothen, have you heard the pickup driver's explanation of what happened?
POTHEN: From what I understand, as he claims, that the roads were wet and he was -- had hit a slippery spot.
COOPER: You know, we looked up some fatality rates. And according to the National Highway Traffic Administration, the fatality rate for a pedestrian struck by a car running 20 miles an hour is 5 percent, fatality rate rises to about 80 percent when the speed is raised to 40 miles per hour. I understand this vehicle was going, I think, about 35 miles an hour. I mean, you realize how lucky you are, don't you?
POTHEN: It is a miracle that neither one or both of us were seriously injured or killed. And God was certainly watching over both of us. And certainly decided that it wasn't any of our time.
COOPER: You know, when you see this video, you're tossed, basically like a rag doll. You don't have any whiplash or anything like that?
POTHEN: No, I don't, Anderson. I have some soreness and stiffness of my neck, but I was not knocked unconscious. I did sustain some scrapes and bruises on my right side around my waist area. And up on my shoulder area, that's the extent of it.
COOPER: Is there something that you take away from this? Or that you want other drivers to take away from this?
POTHEN: The reason why this video was released early when our state patrol is still conducting an investigation was to make people aware of the fact that we need to slow down on our highways no matter where we are. And if we see emergency vehicles that we need to reduce our speeds and be more aware of our surroundings.
COOPER: Do you get any time off? Are you taking a day off, at least?
POTHEN: I am taking some time off right now. I have to go in for an evaluation to see if I can return to active duty in the next couple of days. Our sheriff has said to me if I need more time than that, certainly take as much time as I need. But I think it is a miracle of God that I'm even sitting here today talking to you.
COOPER: Deputy Glen Pothen, we appreciate you being with us. And Tiffany Whitlow as well. It is nice to have you both here safe and sound and good luck to you.
POTHEN: Thank you.
WHITLOW: Thank you.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: I still can't get over that he's OK.
In just a minute, a coming-out party for some little kitties. Sure, they're cute now, but believe me they'll get a lot bigger.
Later, Britney Spears branches out into reality TV. And maybe she should stick to singing.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Let's take a check of the headlines with Erica Hill from HEADLINE NEWS -- Erica.
HILL: Hi, Anderson.
Today, the International Committee of the Red Cross says it warned the Pentagon several times about documented abuse of the Koran, the Muslim holy book, at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. The administration had blamed a similar report in "Newsweek" for spurring anti-American demonstrations in Afghanistan and elsewhere. The military says it found no evidence of Koran abuse.
CNN confirms there could be a deal in the works to diffuse the battle raging over the president's judicial nominees. It would allow final votes on five of the president's seven picks, while preserving the filibuster.
The archbishop of Baltimore is refusing to attend tomorrow's commencement at Loyola College because the keynote speaker is former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani, who supports abortion rights. Giuliani will also receive an honorary degree at the ceremony.
And Calcutta's zoo is celebrating the birth of two striped bundles of joy -- a couple of baby tigers. One of the rare cubs, the one on the right, is a very rare white tiger.
And we'll leave you with that. Anderson, back to you.
COOPER: Erica, thanks very much.
Just when you thought reality television couldn't get any tackier, I guess, she's doing it again. Oops, that's right, Britney Spears and her husband Kevin, their assault on the senses. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: Well, it seems the less you want to know of the intimate details of some celebrities' lives, the more anxious they are to tell you about them. The latest example, Britney Spears and her somewhat less celebrated husband, Kevin Federline. Their new reality show has the crazy kids turning the cameras on themselves, and it's not a pretty picture.
But then, what could be pretty about crying out for attention by showing, well, nearly all of yourself "Inside the Box?"
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: It's called "Chaotic," a look inside the life -- emphasis on love life -- of Britney Spears and her new hubby, Kevin Federline.
Shot on shaky cam, mostly by the pop tart turned director, we see Britney in extreme, sometimes frightening close-up.
First, she's looking for love.
BRITNEY SPEARS, ENTERTAINER: But I realized that there was this huge void.
COOPER: And when she can't find it the old-fashioned way, she asks, as only a celebrity of her caliber can, some guy she met in an L.A. club to join her in London for her Onyx Hotel tour.
SPEARS: Pack your bags, get your passport, and get on the damn plane.
COOPER: It's when he arrives that the flow of information gets a little, well, gagging.
SPEARS: God, our sex is so good. Why couldn't I come in here? (INAUDIBLE).
I had sex three times today.
COOPER: Now, lest you think this is only about Britney and Kevin's sex life, she engages in a little Madonna-esque naval gazing.
SPEARS: Can you handle my truth?
COOPER: And takes the time to pose peppy and important questions to her entourage. Like...
SPEARS: What is your favorite sex position? What is your favorite sex position? What is your favorite sex position?
COOPER: In the real world, rather than the reality world, wouldn't that be called sexual harassment?
TOURE, CNN POP CULTURE CORRESPONDENT: This show reminded me most of "Truth or Dare," the Madonna movie, where you know, it's sort of reality show, but she is in control of it. And you know, it's very sort of narcissistic. Everything I do and say is important and valuable.
COOPER: Whatever. It's when she poses this question to her new love that reality turns surreal.
SPEARS: How do you feel about marriage and commitment?
COOPER: Thankfully, subtitles are provided for Kev's somewhat unclear response.
KEVIN FEDERLINE, MARRIED TO SPEARS: Love has -- love is a commitment.
COOPER: Love is commitment? This from the man who left his pregnant fiancee and baby behind to join the sexually fixated starlet on the road? OK.
There are five more episodes of "Chaotic" to come, with a look at the couple's engagement, their wedding, and this -- still, props to the pop tart for this. She certainly learned the lesson that keeping her celebrity means staying in the spotlight, and who needs hit records when you can do that by exposing it all "Inside the Box?"
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COOPER: Yeah. I'm Anderson Cooper. Thanks very much for watching this two-hour edition of 360. CNN's prime-time coverage continues right now with "LARRY KING LIVE." Larry's guest tonight, Joyce Meyer, sexually abused as a child, now she's one of America's most influential evangelicals.
END
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