Return to Transcripts main page
Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Rubio Blasts Cruz For "Offensive" Campaign Tactics; Cruz Fires Top Staffer Amid Claims Of Dirty Tricks; Trump: Cruz Is The "Biggest Liar In Politics"; Sanders Sharpens Attacks On Clinton; Trump's Raw Real-Estate Deal?; Apple Vs. FBI; Presidential Candidates Weigh In; Candidate Confusion; Voters Struggling To Name Presidential Contenders. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired February 22, 2016 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:02] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN AC360 ANCHOR: We got more and all of that over the next hour starting with the Republicans and our Jim Acosta.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIM ACOSTA, CNN ANCHOR: Riding high into Nevada, Donald Trump is holding the best hand in the battle for the GOP nomination. For starters, his two main rivals, Marco Rubio and Ted Cruz are busy attacking each other.
SEN. MARCO RUBIO, (R-FL) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Every single day, something comes out of the Cruz campaign that's deceptive and untrue.
ACOSTA: Rubio began the day demanding that Cruz fire somebody over a video distributed by the Texas senator's campaign, that falsely accused the Florida Republican of dismissing the Bible. The video misquotes Rubio is saying about the Bible, "Got a good book there. Not many answers in it.
But actually Rubio says, "All of the answers are in it. A blatant fabrication. Top Cruz spokesman, Rick Tyler who circulated the video apologized Rubio on Facebook, for quote, "Posting an inaccurate story about him. Well Rubio snapped, that's not good enough.
RUBIO: At some point there has to be some level of accountability otherwise your running an operation we're sending the message to people that work for you, go out and do anything you want and if you get caught, we'll just apologize but we'll keep doing it.
ACOSTA: Hours later, Cruz stunned the campaign world, announced he's asked Tyler to step down.
SEN. TED CRUZ, (R-TX) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And this morning I asked for Rick Tyler's resignation. I had made clear in this campaign that we will conduct this campaign with the very highest standards of integrity.
ACOSTA: The bogus attack on Rubio is the latest incident raising questions about how Cruz has conducted his campaign. Trump seized on the flap tweeting, more dirty tricks.
Trump is also getting help in the form of an unforced error from John Kasich whose awkward remark about the women backing his first state senate campaign in the late 1970s annoyed one supporter.
GOV. JOHN KASICH, (R-OH) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We've just got an army of people who -- and many women who left their kitchens to go out and go door to door and put yard signs up for me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: First off, I want to say your comment about the women came out of the kitchen to support you. I'll come to support you but I won't be coming out of the kitchen.
KASICH: I got you, I got you.
ACOSTA: Kasich later explained it was an off the cuff remark.
KASICH: I'm real and maybe sometimes I might say something that isn't artfully said the way it should.
ACOSTA: Trump who also commanding lead in the delegate count and his poised to wrap up another big victory in Nevada, is boasting his support comes in all shapes and sizes.
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So we won with everything. We won with highly educated, pretty well educated and poorly educated. But we won with everything. Tall people, short people, fat people, skinny people. Just won.
ACOSTA: But Rubio who spent part of his childhood in Nevada and his supporters are getting aggressive. A pro-Rubio Super PAC started airing this new attack ad pounding Trump and Cruz.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Trump erratic, unreliable. Cruz, calculated, underhanded.
ACOSTA: And Rubio is attracting more establishment support picking up new GOP endorsements.
TIM PAWLENTLY, FMR MINNESOTA GOVERNOR: This is a three-way race. At the moment it's a practical matters between Rubio, Cruz and Trump. There's some others in the race but I don't think they'll be in the race that much longer.
ACOSTA: Some in the party want Kasich to drop out and funnel his support to Rubio. Kasich laughed off that idea.
KASICH: I think it's funny. I think it's funny, I think it's ridiculous.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Jim, what's the fallout of Cruz firing Rick Tyler?
ACOSTA: Anderson, I think it's pretty damaging to a campaign to have a communications director step down over a dirty trick. As one campaign veteran once told me, you never want the staff to be the story and that's what happened here. In addition to being untrue, it was just plain dumb. Nobody questions Marco Rubio's faith. And now you have Marco Rubio and Donald Trump slamming Cruz as dishonest.
A Rubio spokesperson sent us a statement earlier today saying, "There is a culture in the Cruz campaign from top to bottom that no lie is too big. Trump has been hammering this theme for weeks."
And tonight he can come out to this crowd in Las Vegas and say, I told you so. So this was a tough day for Ted Cruz. Tough day for John Kasich, and the beneficiary primarily was Donald Trump. Anderson?
COOPER: Jim Acosta, thanks.
We update more now on the Cruz shake-up. As you saw video in Jim -- Jim's report his top opponents, their surrogate supporters have been speaking out. Listen to what Idaho Senator James Risch, Rubio supporter said today in "The Situation Room".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JAMES RISCH, (R) IDAHO: Rick Tyler wasn't the problem, isn't the problem. This thing has gone on for some time. Look, I was there in Iowa on the ground when the rumor started flying that Ben Carson was going to drop out and people should consolidate with Cruz. I was astonished. I asked people, where is this coming from? They said it was coming from the Cruz campaign.
So it started then and then there was this apology that came out. Then of course you got the photoshopped picture of Marco Rubio shaking hands with President Obama with their left hands and heads place on the wrong thing. Then the (inaudible). This is a cultural problem within this campaign.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[21:05:07] COOPER: Joining us now is Cruz supporter and former Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli.
Ken, I mean, a rough day obviously for Senator Cruz having to get his Communications Director resignation, although he just called him a staffer. Is this a problem -- a more systemic problem inside the campaign?
KEN CUCCINELLI, FMR VIRGINIA ATTORNEY GENERAL: No, we've run a campaign in the highest integrity from the beginning. And when something like this happens, the Senator acted with decisive action, asked Rick to resign. And, in fact, Rick did resign. And this is -- we're never going to be a campaign that questions the faith of other candidates. That's not going to happen. And Senator Cruz made that exceptionally clear in the clearest way he could today by asking for the resignation of the Communications Director.
And so, we're trying to turn back to the things that actually matter to Americans lives like getting a flat tax, to wipe out the special interest groups, benefits and to improve our economy. And to address the concerns that people in Nevada and the Super Tuesday states are talking about. And that's, you know, how do we get our economy going again and Ted's plan to do that. As well as fighting ISIS at the border and ...
(CROSSTALK)
COOPER: So you don't think voters care if a candidate is doing dirty tricks or putting -- photoshopping a candidate's head on someone else's body and putting out flyers or spreading rumors?
CUCCINELLI: I think what Republican voters care most about is finding a candidate who's got a track record of fighting against Washington, going down to the Senate floor, telling the truth about what's going on, even among Republican senators.
COOPER: So how do you explain ...
CUCCINELLI: Including our leadership, when they're wrong? Pardon me?
COOPER: How do you explain the photoshopped flyer?
CUCCINELLI: You know, that's just graphics. It's making a visual point. It's not a substantive point. Substance is what's your plan to get the economy going again? What is your record in voting and leading in Washington to defeat the establishment?
COOPER: So if a news organization put a picture ...
CUCCINELLI: Ted Cruz is the only candidate in the history of the world has gone to Iowa and told the good people of Iowa that big corn and ethanol has to go and won Iowa.
COOPER: So, if a news organization ...
CUCCINELLI: And that's what we need.
COOPER: ... superimposed your head on somebody else's body shaking President Obama's hand you'd have no problem with that as long as you thought people knew it was some sort of dramatic representation?
CUCCINELLI: My first concern is always going to be, is what they're saying there correct or not. And the substance of what we've been saying is absolutely correct.
COOPER: Interesting. So if Cruz's rivals, especially Trump and Rubio, they've obvious been trying to paint your candidate as untrustworthy and response today's news, Trump tweeted, "Wow. Ted Cruz falsely suggested Marco Rubio mocked the Bible was just forced to fire his Communications Director. More dirty tricks."
Obviously, for accuracy, it wasn't Cruz himself saying this, it was Rick Tyler in a tweet.
CUCCINELLI: Right.
COOPER: I mean, are you concerned that the trust question, though, could hurt him tomorrow and beyond?
CUCCINELLI: Well, trust is always a big deal. I mean, Americans don't trust anything in politics. They don't trust you all in the media. They don't trust people in Washington. And you need to overcome that, you need a track record.
And Ted's track record goes all the way back to when he was a teenager memorizing the constitution and making his way around Texas teaching people about it through being the solicitor general, winning awards as the Texas solicitor general that Democrats supported him getting for what a good job he did defending the constitution. And then moving on to the Senate and continuing that as the only consistent conservative in this race.
COOPER: If, you know, if your candidate doesn't win Texas, is that it for him?
CUCCINELLI: Obviously, a home state is absolutely critical. We're not going to make any bones about that. You have to win your home state, really, to have a viable path forward. And right now, with Ted's popularity in Texas, we see him heading to -- cruising in his case, with a see to a victory there. And we expect to do well in Super Tuesday.
He's invested, I think, more time than any other candidate in the Super Tuesday states. And we have more cash on hand than all the other campaigns combined.
So we're prepared for that next week's worth of battles in all of the states as the race goes from one state at a time to national.
COOPER: Ken Cuccinelli, appreciate it. We'll be covering it all. Thanks very much from Las Vegas.
More now on tomorrow's caucuses. They re joining us is Adam Khan, chairman of the Washoe County Republican Party, also CNN political commentator and former senior Mitt Romney advisor, Kevin Madden and CNN chief political analyst, Gloria Borger.
Gloria, I mean, the shake-up at the Cruz campaign, Rick Tyler and we've had him on this program a lot, you know, on the heels of this -- the photoshopped picture and the other things, how do you see it playing out in Nevada and beyond?
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, first of all, you know, Trump, according to recent polls is the prohibited favorite in Nevada. It's a caucus. So who really knows what's going to happen? Because, you know, the ground game really matters in a caucus.
[21:10:12] Trump has spend a bunch of time in Vegas and his name is on the top of a hotel there. So he's well known.
I think what this whole Cruz Brouhaha does, is it reinforces a pre- existing condition which is the story line that Cruz is a liar, which, like many things in this campaign, the tempo was set by Donald Trump who originally called Cruz a liar. Then Rubio sort of picked it up and ran with the same theme. And Cruz found himself on the defensive to the point where today he had to fire someone and I think as a result, he may have sort of stoked the flames of the story line rather than extinguishing it.
COOPER: Adam, what do you think about this? I mean because you just heard from Ken Cuccinelli said "This isn't what Republicans care about."
ADAM KHAN, CHAIRMAN WASHOE COUNTY REPUBLICAN PARTY: You know, it really is then I here in Nevada, Gloria brought it up, you know it's all about the ground limits about the issues that matters in Nevada voters.
I saw just recently Ted Cruz put on that saying that he wants to return federal lands. You know, anyone who's from Nevada knows 85 percent of Nevada's lands are owned by the federal government.
So the things it's smart for candidate like Ted Cruz and even Marco Rubio said at a rally earlier up today that we want to return those lands to the, you know, to the Nevadans. So it's going to be interesting to see what plays out tomorrow.
But one thing that needs to be said is, you know, Donald Trump's popularity, you know, maybe he's got a tower in the south but he's not as popular as people might think. And in a state where the ground game is crucial, I tell you someone is being working on the ground here.
The Rubio and Cruz campaign are much more organized and they've been here for months doing the work that's Trump should have been doing back in October.
COOPER: Kevin, do you think Trump is vulnerable in terms of ground demo?
KEVIN MADDEN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah, certainly vulnerability. I think that's the -- I think Donald Trump is trying to continue in many of these contest the old model with his new model.
The idea that you can go in there and dominate earned media, that you can dominate the local television coverage that the momentum at a critical time like this is probably more important than whether or not you have people out knocking on doors.
So it's, you know, if that, when he tried to test that approach in Iowa, he didn't win. But now that he's got the momentum with big wins in New Hampshire, big wins in South Carolina, I think he does have a certain advantage. He has the wind at his back as he goes into Nevada.
COOPER: And Adam you're expecting the record turnout?
KHAN: Yeah, we know, we go to the rallies. You see the candidates, their events. We're going to have an all-time high. What's interesting though is I think that Cruz and Rubio are going to be the reason why we have that high turnout.
Even organizing they've been clung their voters, getting their support together. And I just don't see -- and, you know, Kevin is talked about the wind at the back of Donald Trump. I don't see as he won South Carolina with, you know, with 30 some percent. I see that 65 percent of South Carolina did not vote for Donald Trump.
And I think that, you know, you looked around the country. He's really hit a ceiling. So I think he's going to have an issue going into Super Tuesday. And he starts losing some of the southern states, I think there's a big issue in the Trump campaign.
COOPER: And yet Gloria, as long as there are multiple other candidates out there, that vote that's not going to Trump is divided.
BORGER: Right. And you know, conversely, Rubio has to start winning somewhere. Trump may lose somewhere but Rubio has to start winning. And that's, you know, that's really his issue. And Rubio has kind of coalesced or the beginnings of the so-called establishment coalescing around Rubio. Some of the Jeb Bush money. Former donors for Jeb may go to Rubio, and that's, you know, that's good for him.
He's organized but he's still in this tight race with Cruz over second place. And at some point, you have to win somewhere. And Rubio hasn't won anywhere yet. And, you know, he's somebody who spent his childhood in Nevada, right?
So he has a story to tell in that state which he's been telling about growing up there to a degree. So maybe the voters of Nevada will see him in a way of kind os a favorite son to a degree. We just -- we don't know.
COOPER: And Kevin, Kasich says, look, he laughed about the idea of him getting out. How big a problem does he oppose for Rubio?
MADDEN: What -- I think it depends on the state. If you look at a place like Nevada, you know, John Kasich and Adam could probably attest to this. He's not as well organized there. He's got limited organizations in some of these March 1 states.
But the simple fact that he has, you know, 8 or 9 percent in some of those states that Marco Rubio would love to have in order to try and take on Donald Trump, you know, he is an important factor. I think he's going to continue to look at March 15th, John Kasich is, March 15th and his prospects in Ohio.
And that is a crucial window where Marco Rubio really has to consolidate some of that anti-Trump or the alternative to Trump vote if he's going to start to pick up the momentum he's going to need to start overcoming -- overtaking Donald Trump in the delicate fight.
[21:15:05] COOPER: Adam, I got to ask you this one. Are you officially endorsing a candidate?
KHAN: Well, I'm going to officially endorse the Republican nominee. And I think that Nevadans are sophisticated voters that need to realize that, when they go to the caucus tomorrow, they need to vote for the person that's actually conservative and someone who's going to unite this country instead of perpetuate the divisions that we've seen over the past seven years.
COOPER: And this your personal -- go ahead.
KHAN: I'll attest to what Kevin said about Kasich. You know, every candidates, you know, in Reno today or tomorrow and they've been in yesterday. The only candidate that has not come to Nevada this past week is John Kasich.
So I think he's not really too worried about Nevada and he's looking at those Super Tuesday states and hoping his donors can keep him well until mid-February or mid-March can get those midwest states.
COOPER: And I understand your entire family is Muslim. What do you make of Donald Trump's comments about temporarily banning Muslims from entering the United States?
KHAN: Well, I think it shows that he has a rudimentary knowledge of the constitution. I think anyone who studied history knows that the people came to this country. They came here for religious freedoms. So the most un-American thing that you can do is persecute someone for who they believing.
You know, that's no better than the country that my father came from. They're hanging people on the streets for, you know, they're worshiping your god that's not theirs. So we can be like them and, you know, I support those type of that type of rhetoric or we can decide that, hey, we're going to stick to the constitution and we're not going to do those things. So I think voters have a lot to look at tomorrow.
COOPER: So if Trump is the nominee, I hate to put him in spot, but if he's the nominee, would you support him?
KHAN: I will support the Republican nominee. And I think that what's more important and I think is making sure that the Clintons aren't allowed to move back from the White House. There's nothing that can be worse for American prosperity than a Clinton administration. And I think the American voters realize that. And I think that the Republican nominee will be a true conservative that's willing to lead this nation.
COOPER: Adam Khan, is good to have you in the program, Kevin Medden, Gloria Borger, thank you again.
A reminder, Thursday night, CNN Republican Debate from Houston. Wolf Blitzer moderates. Begins 8:30 Eastern time on CNN.
And just ahead tonight, the Democrats going into tomorrow's South Carolina, CNN Town Hall and Saturday's Primary there, including Bernie Sanders who umped up his attacks in Hillary Clinton's campaign financing.
And later, what's in a name, namely Donald Trump's name. It's on buildings and properties around the world. The question is how much if he does really own? Drew Griffin tonight looks at that his business ahead on Thursday.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:20:50] COOPER: Big day for Republicans in Nevada, tomorrow it's going to be followed tomorrow night, big night for Democrats in South Carolina. And Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders facing voters in a CNN Town Hall. Today they're facing off against each other after their Nevada caucuses with Senator Sanders sharpening one of his main lines of attack.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When the campaign began, as I recall, Secretary Clinton and her people were saying, well, yes, we have Super PACs, but that money is going to be used against Republicans.
Well, guess what. Turns out not to be the case. Millions of dollars in Super PAC money is now being used against me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Now that's was not all, though. More now from CNN's Brianna Keilar.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR REPUBLICAN CORRESPONDENT: Bernie Sanders is trying to regain his momentum fresh off a loss to Hillary Clinton in the Nevada caucuses.
SANDERS: I am delighted that Secretary Clinton month after month after month seems to be adopting more and more of the positions that we have advocated. That's good.
And, in fact, is beginning to use a lot of the language and phraseology that we have used. In fact, I think I saw a TV ad, I thought it was me.
KEILAR: Sanders is going on the offensive today tweeting about the lack of transcripts for Clinton's paid speeches saying it's been 17 days, 16 hours and 32 minutes since Hillary Clinton said she was look into releasing her paid speeches to Wall Street.
Hillary Clinton is riding high after her rebound win in Nevada and hoping for another victory in Saturday's South Carolina Primary. Clinton has an 18-point lead over Sanders in the Palmetto State buoyed by her 37 point lead among black voters. And she's getting a little star power in her bid for support with a new television ad voiced by actor Morgan Freeman.
MORGAN FREEMAN, HOLLYWOOD CELEBRITY: She says their names. Trayvon Martin, Dontre Hamilton, Sandra Bland. And makes their mothers' fight for justice, her own. She speaks for a city poisoned by indifference. HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We need action now.
KEILAR: Even as Clinton rebounds from her New Hampshire loss. Questions lingered about perceptions from some voters that she's honest and trustworthy. And area she acknowledged she needed to improve upon during an appearance on "State Of The Union" this weekend.
CLINTON: Because I think there's an underlying questions that maybe is really in the back of people's minds. And that is, you know, and she in it for us or if she in it for herself? I think that's, you know, a question that people are trying to sort through.
KEILAR: Sanders and Clinton also have their eyes on Super Tuesday next week when 11 states will hold Democratic nominating contests.
SANDERS: Please do not come to me state by state and say, is this the end of the world? We are in this campaign to the end. We have gone much faster, much further than any -- or many people would have believed possible. And with organizations like the ones behind me, we are going to do just great in this campaign.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Brianna joins us now. So, Clinton was fund-raising in California today. She's heading back to South Carolina tomorrow? Correct?
KEILAR: Yeah. That's right, she's having a forum tomorrow in South Carolina, Anderson. And it's going to feature a lineup of mothers of young African-American men and women who have died. Many of them in police custody.
She'll be joined by the mothers of Trayvon Martin, of Eric Garner, Sandra Bland, Dontre Hamilton and Jordan Davis. And, she's really trying to send a message with this lineup that she understands the concerns of the African-American community that is so key to a Democratic win in South Carolina. And specifically that she understands their concerns about criminal justice reform.
COOPER: And she'll, obviously, be in the evening with Senator Sanders at our CNN Town Hall hosted by Chris Cuomo. But, what is he planning for tomorrow?
KEILAR: Yeah. He is actually in Norfolk, Virginia, which is pretty interesting because he's not going to be in South Carolina which obviously, this reflects I think the realistic approach that his campaign is taking that he really is facing steep odds there.
He was in Massachusetts today. Massachusetts and Virginia, both of them are Super Tuesday States. So right now, he's kind of looking more toward Super Tuesday and past South Carolina because he's facing a 20-point deficit almost in the polls there to Hillary Clinton.
[21:25:07] COOPER: All right, Brianna thanks. Digging deeper now and where the race goes, I'm here with our Political Commentator and Senior Democratic Party official, Donna Brazile.
So Donna, as you heard in the wake of the Nevada results, Sanders says the Clinton is starting to sound more like him. Basically adopting his position, his language, is that fair?
DONNA BRAZILE, DEMOCRACTIC STATEGIST: Look, there is no question that these candidates will find each other reading from the same music of the same script. She is adopting some of the language in terms of income inequality. And perhaps he's going to adopt some of her message as it relates to racial equality. So, I think that they are singing from the same hymn book but often as you well know the person who made the record first would like to get the credit.
COOPER: Yeah. With the latest poll of polls shows South Carolina voters, shows Clinton support among likely voters there, 25 points higher than Sanders. Do you believe that she has that much of an advantage there?
BRAZILE: I think it's going to be a close race. Look, there is no question that Secretary Clinton understands what's at stick. South Carolina is a whole New Ball Game. They are both looking for momentum going into Super Tuesday.
She's campaigning in a familiar territory, the Deep South. She knows not just the issues, but this is a woman who understands how to go to church and can read from the same hymn book. So, I'm not surprised that she has a slight lead but I think the race will tighten.
COOPER: How important do you think winning in South Carolina for both of them?
BRAZILE: Very, very important because Super Tuesday is right around the corner. And as you well know starting next month, we're going into what I called the Biggest Delegate Prize of all, the states that will be held on Super Tuesday as well as the remaining states. 28 states total, over 1,000 delegates at stake.
So, this is a key moment for both Secretary Clinton as well as Senator Sanders to try to get so much-needed momentum into Super Tuesday.
COOPER: And obviously, we're having a Town Hall Forum for the candidates, for Democratic candidates in South Carolina tomorrow night. Chris Cuomo is hosting it at 8:00. What do you think each of the candidates needs to accomplished?
BRAZILE: Well, you know, seven is like a good story. So, there's no question that tomorrow night Secretary Clinton has the opportunity to try to narrow the gap with young voters. So far, they're not supporting her. They are supporting her opponent.
And Senator Sanders has an opportunity to begin to sing from that hymn book so that he can diversify his support and begin to attract the kind of delegates he needs to become the nominee. COOPER: And even if he's not winning, Sanders has raised an awful lot of money from -- as we all know from -- in small donations. He's focused on getting Super Tuesday votes, clearly planning to stay the course well after South Carolina.
BRAZILE: His message has resonated with so many new voters, so many new Democratic voters that I do believe that he is -- he still has a shot at winning the nomination.
But as you know with Jeb Bush, it's not just money, its message. And his message has to resonate to a more diverse electorate that he will face in South Carolina and beyond.
COOPER: So, that's the key for him? I mean, in order for him to actually have a path to victory over Clinton, he's got to diversify.
BRAZILE: He has to diversify. Look, Anderson, the Democratic coalition mirrors the American public over 60 percent of our voters are white, and the 40 percent are people of color black, Hispanic, Asian-Pacific Colonies, so you have to have a diversified message in order to win the nomination.
COOPER: All right, Donna thanks very much. Donna Brazile.
BRAZILE: Thank you.
COOPER: Again, a quick remainder tune in tomorrow night with Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton take questions from voters in the South Carolina. The South Carolina Democratic Presidential Town hall airs tomorrow night, 8:00 p.m. Eastern here on CNN.
And ahead, Donald Trump constantly talks about how good he is at making deals. But there are those who say, they got a raw deal buying into Trump properties that turn out to not actually be owned by Donald Trump, Drew Griffin tonight takes a look.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:32:38] COOPER: Donald Trump is a billionaire, successful real estate mogul, this we know.
Some question though just how real some of that real estate is. There are buildings that bear the Trump name, but actually are not owned by Donald Trump and that surprises some buyers.
Our Senior Investigator Correspondent, Drew Griffin tonight reports.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We're going to start winning so much that you're going to be sick and tired of winning. You're going to get bored with winning.
DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATOR CORRESPONDENT: Donald Trump isn't short on Bravado which one thing that's help make him into a multi-billionaire.
Whether you're planning to vote for him ...
TRUMP: Wow.
GRIFFIN: ... or buy from him, there's some fine print you may want to read.
MICHAEL GOODSON, REAL ESTATE BUYER: We were given a brochure that said that, you know, this was the best property he had ever developed.
GRIFFIN: Donald Trump?
GOODSON: Yes.
GRIFFIN: So that clearly in your mind was a Donald Trump property, Donald Trump involved, Donald Trump building.
GOODSON: No question, and whatsoever.
GRIFFIN: That's Jay Michael Goodson who is suing Donald Trump. Trump condo project he bought into failed.
Goodson lost his money, and Trump, well, Trump was able to walk away because it turns out all things Trump are not the same.
South Florida Developer, Daniel Lebensohon ought to know. He helped finish this, Trump Hollywood. A super luxurious sold-out Trump named condo project just south of Fort Lauderdale.
DANIEL LEBENSOHN, REAL ESTATE DEVELOPER, BH3 MANAGEMENT: Particularly in the luxury residential sector, there are very few brands that compete.
GRIFFIN: Lebensohn took over this project when it wasn't doing so well. He licensed Donald Trump's name and used the Trump family input which he says was instrumental to almost every detail.
And when it was time to actually sell the units, well, he used Trump himself.
LEBENSOHN: Donald Trump came to the re-launch. And I believed Ivanka attended an event.
GRIFFIN: Do people believe that they are buying a Trump-developed property?
LEBENSOHN: I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder, they say. I don't know what each of the buyers is thinking, but I imagine there's an association tied to it that Trump is involved and they are.
GRIFFIN: Involved, yes, but in development after development, buyers are learning their Trump property isn't actually a Trump-owned building.
[21:35:06] Lebensohn just licensed the name, which means even if things go south, Donald Trump makes money.
He keeps the licensing fees and if the development goes well, he makes even more money.
LEBENSOHN: They made millions of dollars on the project by having the name associated with. So they every time that there was a transaction, a condominium closed, they got paid as well.
GRIFFIN: Pretty smart.
LEBENSOHN: I think it's brilliant, yeah.
GRIFFIN: Brilliant when it all works which brings us back to J. Michael Goodson and the Fort Lauderdale Condo, he says he thought he was buying from Donald Trump.
And, what does the first page say? A signature development by Donald J. Trump.
It's been a decade since Goodson lost a $345,000 deposit on a nearly $2 million condo at the Trump International Tower in Fort Lauderdale.
Did you tell me you were up on this side on pool level?
GOODSON: Exactly. Right there.
GRIFFIN: The project failed. It went on to be built by a new developer under a different name. Trump who had licensed his name removed it and kept the fee.
Goodson, a hugely successful businessman himself, sued saying he had no idea Trump could just walk away from a building that, after all, was sold to him as a Trump Tower. At issue in the court battle that ensued, what was a Trump property and what was a Trump licensed property?
Details found on page 14 of the prospectus which Donald Trump had to borrow the judge's glasses to read.
TRUMP: Can I use your glasses again, your honor? Is it possible. I hate to do this too.
ALAN GARTEN, GENERAL COUNSEL,TRUMP ORGANIZATION: I remember that. I remember it was pretty fine print.
GARTEN: Well, it's not fine print.
GRIFFIN: Alan Garten is Donald Trump's attorney.
GARTEN: The disclosure of the roles of the parties was very clear to anyone who would actually read them. Unfortunately a lot of people, probably Mr. Goodson himself, got so caught up in the frenzy of the real estate market, they thought that they were, you know, too good for the contracts.
GRIFFIN: This is how Donald Trump explained his role in a deposition.
TRUMP: But the word developing, it doesn't mean that we're the developer. We are -- the word developing, I mean, we worked as I told you we worked on the documents. We worked on the room sizes and the things that we didn't give out the contracts. We didn't get into financing. We weren't the developer, but we did work with the developer.
GARTEN: Developing doesn't mean developer?
GARTEN: Developing is a -- developer is a specific person or entity who is designated and who was the party ultimately responsible for the project. In case Fort Lauderdale, Donald Trump and the Trump Organization was not the developer.
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: We the jury find that is follows for the defendant.
GRIFFIN: Goodson lost the lawsuit, badly. Even forced to pay Trump's attorney's fees. He's appealing.
GRIFFIN: Why are you pursuing this?
GOODSON: I think somebody needs to pursue it. It was a major rip- off, and I think a lot of the investors don't have a legal background. They don't know what's involved. And maybe it's been more involved than I anticipated. But I don't work away from fight. I mean he said he's going to build a fence in Mexico but he couldn't handle a hotel in Fort Lauderdale, Florida.
TRUMP: And who should pay for the law.
GRIFFIN: We hear this time and time again from people who feel like, you know, I went to a cocktail party. Donald Trump was there. He was telling me this is going to be a great development. That they were truly under the spell that Donald Trump was developing this property. I mean, honestly, you don't think that there isn't some kind of a bait and switch here?
GARTEN: There's no bait and switch and people have to be accountable for their own decisions.
GRIFFIN: Daniel Lebensohn successfully finished his licensed project with Donald Trump, sold out and walked away with millions.
LEBENSOHN: Some Trump product is Trump product that his team is developing. Some they are the branding and licensing arm.
GRIFFIN: All of it disclosed in the contracts, he says, whether the super rich bother to read them or not.
LEBENSOHN: Caveat emptor, let the buyer beware.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: So, how common is that the people buying into Trump properties are finding out they're not necessarily buying a Trump from property. I mean, as long as if they read the contract, they would find this out? Right? GRIFFIN: Yeah. You really have to do read those contracts deeply., Anderson, they're have been similar lawsuits like this though in Tampa, Hawaii, Baja Mexico, Toronto in all the suits the buyers claim they were let to believe Donald Trump was the developer until of course they found out he wasn't.
And if you go to the Trump organization website, his list of these properties, there's a little tab for a disclaimer that you can open up and that is where you find out the property is actually not being developed by Donald Trump just named after him.
COOPER: Is there a fear this campaign is going to hurt his brand, his image in these high-end developments?
[21:40:04] GRIFFIN: You known, honestly I don't think anyone really knows. The people who love him, the developers who worked with him we talk too. They think any publicity is going to be good publicity for the business. Then you have people who really despise him and may be hoping that he fails and, of course should he win, he turns that business over to his kids and they run it, Anderson, but, you know, forecasting what's going to happen to his business is like forecasting this campaign. That is tough to do.
COOPER: All right. Drew Griffin, thanks very much.
Just ahead a battle between Apple and the government. The FBI wants the company to help them break into the iPhone of the deceased San Bernardino shooter. Why Apple says this is about more than just one phone, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: This next story has become part of the 2016 campaign. It also is implication that is potentially transcended, the legal battle over the San Bernardino shooter's iPhone. Apple CEO Tim Cook says if he goes along with the government's wishes to break into it, it would threaten everyone's civil liberties.
The FBI says it's about victim and justice. Apple says it's about privacy and safety. Donald Trump has called for a boycott Apple products now the candidates have weighed in as well. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[21:45:01] KASICH: We can't have data that can tell us about an attack on our families and someone is like, oh, I have a business model and that won't work. OK. I got that will working out.
RUBIO: It will take a partnership between the technology industry and the government to confront and solve this.
DR. BEN CARSON, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think that Apple, and probably, a lot of other people don't necessarily trust the government.
SANDERS: I am very fearful in America about big brother. On the other hand, what I also worry about is the possibility of another terrorist attack against our country.
TRUMP: What I think you ought to do is boycott Apple until such time as they give that security number.
How do you like that? I just thought of that. Boycott Apple.
CRUZ: I believe that Apple, nobody has the right to defy a legal search warrant.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: CNN Justice Reporter, Evan Perez joins me now with the latest.
Apple, Evan, is saying that it's not just this one phone. Essentially, they have to create new software that would allow a back door that would make everybody's phone potentially vulnerable to hackers if it got out.
EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE REPORTER: That's right, Anderson. And they are also pointing out it really won't stop at this phone. The fact that the FBI says it's only about this one cellphone. We know that other law enforcement agencies are going to come knocking on the door of Apple to also help them unlock on that phones.
You're already seeing that in some places, especially in Manhattan. The Manhattan DA, but the two sides today are fighting over whether this entire dispute could have been avoided if someone hadn't meddled with the government-owned cell phone that Sahid was one, Farook carried.
The phone routinely was backing up data to the iCloud for -- until just over a month now before the San Bernardino terrorist attacks.
And Apple officials say that the FBI could have gotten the missing phone data that they are looking for by simply, restarting the backups to the cloud, but that option failed because in the hours after the attacks, San Bernardino county officials, working with the FBI, changed the Apple I.D. password on the phone.
If you remember, Farook was a county employee and the county owned the phone, Anderson.
COOPER: So, that was a mistake, clearly. Did that change things in this case?
PEREZ: Well, Apple said yes. The FBI says that even with the data from the cloud, investigators would still need to get to the phone itself.
An FBI spokesperson said, "Even if the password had not been changed and Apple could have turned on the auto backup and loaded it to the cloud, there might be information on the phone that would not be accessible without Apple's assistance.
Obviously, we know, Anderson that this is going to be a part of Apple's court filing challenging this order from a judge to help the FBI.
We expect that filing to come any day now. And, obviously, this is a big issue that we expect is going to end up being fought all the way to the Supreme Court.
COOPER: All right. Evan, thanks very much. Just ahead, they've been campaigning, debating for months now. But how much attention are voters actually paying? Randi Kaye put the voters to the test.
Do they know the candidate's names and recognize their names and recognize their faces at this point?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[21:51:42] COOPER: With presidential candidates attending town halls, holding rallies, running ads, e-mailing and tweeting, all by delivering your mail, you might think that everyone would now will be tired of seeing and hearing from there. They would at least know their names. Well, you would be wrong as our Randi Kaye discover.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: At the Black Bear Diner in Las Vegas, its pancakes, served up with a side of politics.
OK. Are you ready to play candidate trivia?
TONY CERVERO, NEVADA VOTER: Yeah.
KAYE: OK. Let's do it.
We put voters to the test to see how much they know about the candidates, just a day before the Nevada Republican caucus.
Tony Cervero started off strong.
CERVERO: That's the one and only Mr. Trump.
KAYE: But when I showed him a picture of Ted Cruz, he didn't know his name. And watch what happened when I showed him a photo of this candidate.
Who is this?
CERVERO: That looks like Elliott Spitzer. Is that him?
KAYE: No. It's definitely be no.
CERVERO: The love bug they call him.
KAYE: The love.
With this candidate, I got a blank stare.
Do you want to ask your pal over here?
CERVERO: Yeah. What is his.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: John Kasich. I don't know ...
KAYE: You don't even know the name. Now, you have the answer and you don't know.
Ohio Governor, John Kasich's photo stumped nearly everyone we asked. Who is this?
DAVE KENNEDY, NEVADA VOTER: I do not -- is that John from Ohio?
KAYE: John from Ohio. I like that. Do you know his last name?
KENNEDY: I do not.
LANCE MORALES, NEVADA VOTER: Dennis Kucinich?
KAYE: Kucinich?
MORALES: Yeah.
KAYE: Nope.
MORALES: Nope.
KAYE: You want to try again?
MORALES: No, no, not that one.
KAYE: His initials are J.K. Does that help you at all?
MORALES: Jack Kemp?
KAYE: Jack Kemp? Oh, my goodness.
This first time voter clearly has to study up.
Who's this?
WHITNEY NACCARATO, VOTER: Marco Rubio?
KAYE: No.
W. NACCARATO: Teddy Cruz.
KAYE: Teddy Cruz. 18-year-old Whitney Naccarato also had a whole lot of trouble with Kasich.
W. NACCARATO: I think he's a movie star.
KAYE: What move was he in, do you know?
W. NACCARATO: No, I don't know.
KAYE: He's a governor of a state and he's actually running for president. W. NACCARATO: Oh wow, I did not know that.
KAYE: But she does know movie stars.
Who's that?
W. NACCARATO: George Clooney.
KAYE: You know George Clooney but you don't know John Kasich.
W. NACCARATO: No.
KAYE: Her dad didn't do much better.
KYLE NACCARATO, VOTER: I'm not sure about that guy. He's not currently running, right?
KAYE: What if I told you he was? How would you feel?
K. NACCARATO: I would be embarrassed.
KAYE: Some voters couldn't recall which candidates were in which party and if they were even still running.
This guy got Bernie Sanders and Jeb Bush confused.
You think that's Jeb Bush.
JAMES STEFFANIC, VOTER: As far as ...
KAYE: Yeah.
STEFFANIC: ... the face?
KAYE: Yeah.
STEFFANIC: I have ...
KAYE: No clue.
STEFFANIC: ... no clue as to the faces.
KAYE: OK. The initials are B.S. Does that help you?
STEFFANIC: Is he (inaudible). No? Isn't that what most politicians are?
KAYE: Considering this group's track record, it's no surprise even this photo threw them off.
Who is it?
W. NACCARATO: I know he's on CNN too, but I don't know his name.
[21:55:03] KAYE: He's on CNN. What show does he do? Do you know? What time he's on? W. NACCARATO: Is in -- isn't it like at the night? Isn't it nighttime?
KAYE: That's actually our vice president.
W. NACCARATO: No, it isn't.
KAYE: Who's that?
K. NACCARATO: Biden.
KAYE: OK. Your daughter thought he had a show on CNN.
K. NACCARATO: He kind of looks like Anderson Cooper.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: What? Wow. OK.
KAYE: I don't know, I didn't see the resemblance.
COOPER: Well, no, that's fine. It's an honor.
Randi, I mean, it sounds like a few of these GOP candidates that are still fighting really to get traction with voters, where just at least in terms of their identities.
KAYE: Absolutely. I mean, everybody, Anderson, knew Donald Trump and Ben Carson. But Carly Fiorina, even though she's out of the race, many people didn't realize that she had suspended her campaign. They also didn't remember her last name.
Clearly John Kasich has an uphill battle here, not a single person in that diner knew who he was. And then there's the Cruz-Rubio situation, were not only are they battling it out for second place but they're also battling it out to be recognized.
As I play this candidate trivia around the country, so many people think that Ted Cruz is Marco Rubio and vice versa. So clearly, Anderson, one of them has to break through.
COOPER: All right. Randi, thanks very much.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: As you saw in the last report by Randi, some voters are still getting to know the candidates.
Thursday, they'll get another chance in the CNN Republican debate in Houston. Wolf Blitzer is the moderator.
[22:00:01] That begins at 8:30 p.m. Eastern Time. We'll be on right before of course.
That does it for us tonight. Thanks for watching. We'll see you again 11:00 p.m. Eastern tonight for another edition of "360."
"CNN Tonight" with Don Lemon, starts now.
