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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees

Trump Intel Pick Was Placed On A TSA Watch List For Overseas Travel, Foreign Connections; Trump Plans to Fire Jack Smith's Team, Use DOJ to Probe 2020 Election; Wash. Post: Trump Plans To Assemble DOJ Teams To Hunt For Evidence Of Fraud In 2020 Election; Sources: Trump Intel Pick Gabbard Briefly On TSA Watch List; Putin: Russia Will Keep Testing New Missile Used On Strike In Ukraine; Hawaii Woman Vanishes After Missed Flight, Mysterious Texts. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired November 22, 2024 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: And you were looking into what that meant -- McDonald's has been struggling, but what that has done. So tell me something I don't know.

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yes, all press is good press that's what you should know. Everybody was talking about this. And what do we know is what we saw was the Google searches for McDonald's rose, get this, it rose by over 64 percent compared to the prior week for its highest level in over two years.

BURNETT: You know, you look at this food cold and it doesn't make you go "oohh." But muffin is better when it's warm and toasty.

ENTEN: It's still pretty good.

BURNETT: Thanks for joining us. AC360 starts now.

[20:00:38]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Tonight on 360, breaking news. Why was the president-elect's pick for intelligence chief flagged for a government watch list? New CNN reporting on Tulsi Gabbard's overseas travel.

Also, tonight new reporting from "The Washington Post" what it's saying about Trump's plans for Special Counsel Jack Smith, his entire team, and how the Justice Department will investigate now the 2020 election.

Later, fears of a major escalation in the war after Russia uses an experimental missile to attack Ukraine.

Good evening, I'm Jim Sciutto, in tonight for Anderson, and the breaking news tonight, another embattled Cabinet pick for the president-elect.

This time, it is Tulsi Gabbard, the one-time Democratic Congresswoman who very publicly switched parties at a Trump rally back in October and whom the president-elect picked as his choice for director of National Intelligence to oversee all of America's sprawling intelligence apparatus, as well as handle some of our country's most sensitive national security secrets.

Her choice as DNI had already raised a number of eyebrows and hard questions, in part because of her limited experience in intelligence work, but also and more importantly, she has repeated views on Syria and the war in Ukraine that mirror Russian propaganda, the propaganda of one of the US's chief adversaries.

And there is her public support of people such as Julian Assange and Edward Snowden who have leaked US National Security secrets.

Tonight, we're learning new information about an incident earlier this year when Gabbard was placed on a government watch list. Our National Security reporter, Zachary Cohen, starts us off.

And Zach, what stands out to me is how someone ends up on this list. They get triggered because of overseas travel patterns and foreign connections, and that then triggers an algorithm. Do we know how specifically she triggered that algorithm?

ZACHARY COHEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, Jim, we're looking at a program that is based around an algorithm that as you mentioned, looks at a series of indicators and compares that with a database that includes US intelligence and other information as compiled by government agencies and it compares that to see if there are matches for threat-based behavior. Now, that's a pattern, a specific pattern, a specific criteria that this algorithm is looking for.

And in Gabbard's case, both her overseas travel and things about her foreign connections did match up and did flag and trigger this algorithm. As you mentioned, she did match that pattern that this algorithm is trained to look for.

And look, we don't know specifically what it was about this pattern of overseas travel that got Gabbard flagged, nor the specifics of these foreign connections that were enough of a concern that it triggered this algorithm.

But look, this is unprecedented and highly unusual for somebody who is nominated to be the leader of the US intelligence community, to even be added to a watch list like this, a watch list that we're told is really a security mechanism and a screening mechanism to ensure somebody is safe to get on an airplane before they board. So that's kind of what we're looking at here.

SCIUTTO: I mean, when you look at travel, of course, there was her infamous trip to Syria to meet Bashar al-Assad, but that was a number of years ago, and she was put on this list more recently.

As we mentioned, she posted about her inclusion on the list in September. Do we know how she learned that she was on this list?

COHEN: Jim, we're told by a federal official familiar with this program that just like there are specific criteria to get on this list, there's also specific criteria to be cleared and removed from this list and that it's not -- people are not removed because of public comments that they make. You're referring to when Tulsi Gabbard said that she was added to a, "secret terror watch list."

This is not a secret terror watch list either this is a list that requires additional screening for individual passengers, and passengers are ultimately cleared through a variety of different ways. It's still unclear how Gabbard ultimately was notified about that, but this is something that in normal times, we are told that she would have to explain through the confirmation process and would ultimately be something that would get looked at as part of an FBI background check.

But, Jim, as you know, the Trump transition is bypassing that traditional FBI background check process which is used to give somebody a security clearance, for example. So it'll be interesting to see if Republicans and Democrats in the Senate do raise more questions about this and do ask for an explanation about the underlying foreign travel here that did set off this algorithm.

SCIUTTO: Yes, exactly how and why she was then removed from that list as well.

Zachary Cohen, thanks so much.

[20:05:10]

Let's get some perspective now from former FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe; Carrie Cordero, former counsel to the US assistant attorney general for National Security; Maggie Haberman, senior political correspondent for "The New York Times," author of "Confidence Man: The Making of Donald Trump and the Breaking of America," also CNN political commentator Van Jones and Republican strategist, Joseph Pinion.

Andrew, I do want to begin with you.

Her travel to Syria, which we knew about, that's a number of years ago. She was put on this list only much more recently, since removed, which we should note can you understand -- and again, we don't know what country she went to or what foreign connections she had that triggered the algorithm.

Can you give us a sense of what kind of foreign travel, what kind of foreign connections would be necessary to meet the threshold to be put on this list?

Carrie, I'm going to ask you that question while we fix Andy McCabe's audio there. Any sense of what she would have needed to have done to get on the list?

CARRIE CORDERO, CNN LEGAL AND NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: I think based on the reporting that I'm hearing, is that there was a collection of information that is gathered, I think my sense is that this would go to the types of places that she was traveling to.

So would I think this does is it opens a line of communication for the Senate as they're conducting the confirmation hearing to ask where are these places that she's been going as a private citizen as this reporting pertains to her being on the list, as I understand it, earlier this year.

What types of places was she going, countries? What types of contacts? Was it foreign leaders? Was it in countries that are of National Security concern? That's what I would take from this, is that a particular place that she was traveling where of National Security concern.

So, I do think that this was an algorithm issue where the combination of the places she was going and perhaps the nature of the people that she was meeting with then triggered this particular alert for her, which then just provides a secondary mechanism for TSA and for the Department of Homeland Security to make sure that the people who are getting on planes are doing so safely.

SCIUTTO: Andy, I think we have your voice back, all importantly. I don't want to place too much faith -- I think we've learned a lot of lessons about placing too much faith in any particular algorithm. But these algorithms are built, they're designed to protect the country's National Security and to keep track of things that that perhaps you might not notice otherwise.

Can you give a sense of why someone like her would end up on a list like this?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Sure, so there are a couple of things to really point out here.

This is a program that was designed to help screeners and security folks like TSA Air Marshals be aware of individuals who might present a risk but who are not people who are currently watch listed, right?

The terrorism screening database is the nation's watch list of terror subjects or people who are suspected of involvement in terrorism. One of the "rules" that this system uses to identify people is to first make sure that the person they're thinking about is actually not watch listed.

So, if you were watch listed, you would never be included in the secure flight program. This is designed to find people who are not known by the government, are not thought of as being terrorists, but for whatever reason, the places they traveled, the people they contacted while they were there have raised in some minimal way a level of concern and one that could be addressed by additional screening before you get on the plane.

So, you might have to go through the magnetometer twice or speak to the TSA person for some longer period than you normally would. And it is designed to do, Jim, exactly what we've been told since 9/11, which is connect the dots, right? Find those people who were not even aware of and subject them to some level of scrutiny so we can make sure that we've resolved potential threats.

SCIUTTO: Listen, as I was reading this story, I personally went into this, and I remember when I had a lot of stamps in my passport from countries like Iraq and Afghanistan. I got an extra layer. Just a few more questions, when I was going through, for instance, airport security via London.

Maggie, I wonder, we've seen the president back away from Matt Gaetz when it became clear to him he didn't have the votes in the Senate. And by the way, with quite alarming accusations about his personal behavior here.

Questions about Tulsi Gabbard go beyond this watch list. Let's be frank, I've spoken to people in the intelligence community. You have hard questions about the fact that she has parroted Russian propaganda on issues of National Security to this country. Do you believe the president sticks by her regardless?

[20:10:06]

MAGGIE HABERMAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Look, I think, number one, he's not the president yet. It's sort of remarkable to me, as we were talking about these nominee rollouts. He can't nominate anybody yet, he's not in office yet, number one.

Number two, I do think he feels differently about Tulsi Gabbard than he did about Matt Gaetz. I think Matt Gaetz was done -- Matt Gaetz's name had come up before that plane ride where Trump made up his mind to do this or leaned to doing it to announcing Gaetz and then he pulled back, he was sticking with him but he was pretty clear with people Gaetz had a high bar.

Gabbard has flown under the radar more because of all the attention on Matt Gaetz. She is obviously getting more attention now. Trump is somebody who has also said things that are more in line with how Vladimir Putin looks at the world than US leaders typically do.

So, I don't think that's going to be something that would make him back off. He really likes her. She joined him in debate prep. He has grown very fond of her, a lot of people around him have grown very fond of her. I think it would take a lot for him to back off of her frankly. We'll see what happens as we get closer to the potential for hearings.

SCIUTTO: Yes, to your point, listen, one thing Tulsi Gabbard did is around the time of the Russian invasion of Ukraine. She tweeted, placing blame for that invasion on the Biden administration and on NATO, which, by the way is not too far off with JD Vance, the vice president-elect has said about the war in Ukraine.

Van, I wonder, what you think the political fallout is here? Because there certainly is an appetite for change in Washington. We saw that in the results of this election, and President Trump seems to be serving that with some of these appointments. But let's be frank, in potential Senate confirmation hearings when on national television, Tulsi Gabbard is asked about comments that she has made, American people will hear that.

I mean does that -- does he maintain that political support for someone like her?

VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, look, I know Tulsi Gabbard. I consider her to be a friend. I knew her before she was in Congress. I know her dad, who was a great lawmaker in Hawaii, a pro- environment.

She has a big opportunity and a responsibility here to clear up all this stuff. There's a big cloud over her. I don't care about this algorithm because as you said yourself algorithms are just tripwires. That's not any kind of definitive proof of anything.

But it does create an opportunity for Tulsi Gabbard to get in front of the American people and explain all this stuff.

People don't yet understand why she says stuff she says, why she does the stuff she does and if she would just use this moment, maybe she can clear some of this stuff up.

She's going to have one of the most important jobs on Planet Earth, Because US Intelligence is key to western security. Its key to global security. And so I don't care about this algorithm. I do care about the cloud over her and I hope she takes this opportunity to clear some of this stuff up.

SCIUTTO: Joe, I wonder what your perspective is, because I've spoken to Republicans, sitting Republican lawmakers who have concerns about Tulsi Gabbard, not because of this watch list, the couple of months she spent on that, but because of the views, views that contradict US assessment, bipartisan assessments as to who America's true adversaries and threats are -- Russia, China, Syria, et cetera.

They have concerns, and you can understand those concerns right, because, I mean, it used to be bipartisan that folks look at Russia as a threat to this country or the Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. In your view, should she be the director of National Intelligence?

JOSEPH PINION III, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well again, first and foremost, President Trump has the right as the president-elect to nominate individuals that he believes will further his foreign policy vision.

I do think that we can't have it both ways. We're having the conversation about algorithmic tripwires that have foiled many people that never rise to the level of being in charge of the intelligence for the National Intelligence for the United States of America.

And so, if we understand that, yes oftentimes, Brown people, Black people get caught up in this nonsense, then maybe perhaps we should not be having a national conversation about the fact that she got caught up in this mix. I do think to your further point, is she the right person for the job? I think that just because you might actually have agreements with Russia does not necessarily mean that you are a foil for Russia.

At the end of the day, there are critical arguments to be made about the fact that the president of Ukraine and many people in the United States Senate wanted us to have preemptive sanctions that might have deterred Vladimir Putin from driving those tanks across the border into Ukraine.

And there were people in this country on the political left that prevented us from having those preemptive sanctions. And so, yes there was a robust conversation about foreign policy that can have. I agree with Van, she has the opportunity now to have that critical conversation with the nation and with the senators.

But ultimately, at the end of the day, I think trying to act as if somehow she is not fit for the job is in many ways inconsistent with individuals that have held this post before and other presidents that have been given the purview to nominate who they choose for roles when they might not necessarily have the prototypical profile for a particular position.

[20:15:40]

SCIUTTO: Well, DNI's have typically had quite an extensive experience at the top levels in the US Intelligence community, in contradiction to her background in this case.

So, everyone, please do stay with us, because coming up next, more breaking news.

We have a treasury pick. His income level may not surprise you, but his former employer might.

Also tonight, mystery texts, a missed flight, and the pleas of a missing Maui woman's family for her safe return.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:20:33]

SCIUTTO: More breaking news tonight, after a long and sometimes very public search for a Treasury Secretary that saw even Elon Musk publicly opine on who should make the best pick. We have a name tonight. A billionaire who perhaps surprisingly, once worked for George Soros. But another billionaire nonetheless to join Trump himself and of course, Elon Musk.

Alayna Treene joins me now. Tell us more about Scott Bessent, Trump's pick for Treasury Secretary. Why him? And what does he plan to do?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: Well first of all, I'll just say his selection of Scott Bessent and finally announcing his Treasury pick has really ended what has been one of the biggest two-and-a-half week fights we have seen play out at Mar-a-Lago thus far since Donald Trump won the election.

It reminds you that we had actually been told about a week or two ago that Scott Bessent was going to be his pick to lead the Department of Treasury.

However, after that, we really saw this knife fight take place behind- the-scenes. We were told that Howard Lutnick, Donald Trump's co- transition chair, had actually wielded that knife, wanting the role for himself. But this was something that really had took up a lot of Donald Trump's time, especially because remember Donald Trump, throughout his time on the campaign trail has made a ton of promises regarding his economic agenda, particularly what he wants to do with tariffs.

And so, this is going to be a huge job for Bessent, but it was also one of the ones that Donald Trump was the most focused on behind the scenes and one of the most contentious fights we saw play out.

Now, you mentioned that he is a billionaire hedge funder. You also mentioned his ties to George Soros. That has, of course, come up. I'm told in the conversations behind-the-scenes, but he was really kind of viewed as a Wall Street darling, someone that was a big -- a lot of people in the business world were a big fan of.

I'm also told Lindsey Graham personally lobbied on behalf of Bessent given his ties to South Carolina.

But he was a name that a lot of people thought would hopefully be easily confirmable. We saw that obviously an issue this week with some of, excuse me, Donald Trump's other picks particularly Matt Gaetz.

So, this was a choice that took Donald Trump a long time to come to. It's going to be a huge deal in this next administration, but one that his team is happy with, I'm told and believes will be able to get him through the Senate process.

SCIUTTO: You mentioned terrorism and Bessent wrote that piece for "The Wall Street Journal" after the election. He did not mention tariffs in that piece. Notably, we'll see if he follows through.

TREENE: Right.

SCIUTTO: Alayna Treene, thanks so much.

We do have new reporting tonight from "The Washington Post" about how they say President-elect Trump plans to deal with the special counsel who brought two federal cases against him for attempting to overturn the 2022 election. The headline: Trump plans to fire Jack Smith's team and use DOJ to probe 2020 election.

They write, "President-elect Donald Trump plans to fire the entire team that worked with special counsel Jack Smith to pursue two federal prosecutions against the former president, including career attorneys typically, protected from political retribution. This, according to two individuals close to Trump's transition. Trump is also planning to assemble investigative teams within the Justice Department to hunt for evidence in battleground states that fraud tainted the 2020 election, one of the people said."

According to the report, this is how the Trump team responded: "President Trump campaigned on firing rogue bureaucrats who have engaged in the illegal weaponization of our American justice system and the American people can expect he will deliver on that promise." This is what Trump said when he officially declared his candidacy back in 2022.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R) PRESIDENT-ELECT OF THE UNITED STATES: The gravest threats to our civilization are not from abroad, but from within. None is greater than the weaponization of the justice system, the FBI and the DOJ.

We must conduct a top to bottom overhaul to clean out the festering rot and corruption of Washington, DC.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Yes, I miss him. We've heard that lines a lot.

Back now with our panel, and I want to begin with you, Andrew, because what struck me about this headline is he is then dismantling the investigation, which was based on quite hard evidence. A grand jury has indicted him for it of attempting to overturn the 2020 election, but then using the Justice Department to follow and investigate what there is no evidence of even his own former Attorney General Bill Barr said so of significant fraud in the 2020 election.

What does that tell you about the direction of the Justice Department under Trump?

[20:25:08]

MCCABE: I think it's the direction that we all saw coming with another Trump administration. I mean, let's remember that Donald Trump continues to do exactly what he promised to do from the stump.

And in this case, that is, to seek retribution against the people he thinks did him something, you know, did him dirty, these "rogue" bureaucrats."

But, let's remind ourselves that these rogue bureaucrats conducted an investigation that complied with the law. They collected evidence. They presented that evidence to a grand jury of 23 of Donald Trump's fellow citizens and those people, after reviewing that evidence, decided there was probable cause to believe that Donald Trump had committed a crime, both in DC regarding the election and in Florida regarding the documents. And that is how he got indicted, not out of lawfare, not out of political persecution, not because Joe Biden said so, but because these folks did their jobs.

And now, it appears they're going to pay a pretty significant, professional price which is shameful and it's a state that's sorry to see that that we are sinking to this level where an incoming president just engages in retaliation against people who have the temerity to potentially expose his unlawful activity.

SCIUTTO: Well, to your point, he said quite repeatedly and very publicly this is what he intended to do in his second term.

Carrie, I want to ask you about firing career staffers because there are a number of protections in place including from political retribution. Can he do so? And if he attempts to do so, what happens?

CORDERO: Well, so, he could. I mean, he could direct the attorney general and this is why it's really going to matter whether the attorney general, who is ultimately confirmed steps into that role and really follows that oath as opposed to the allegiance to the political leader.

So, it will depend on whether the attorney general carries out these orders if he gives them. Civil service protections, protections for career prosecutors, career attorneys, career paralegals who may have been assigned to the case, they are supposed to be protected under civil service laws.

If they are fired, they will have lawsuits so this could just create another big mess for the department, in terms of those people, them potentially suing the government. But that's not a place that any of these people would want to be.

Political appointees certainly can be fired as soon as the new administration comes into place, but even in addition, even if the new attorney general comes in and doesn't fire, you know, absolutely fire every single person who was on that team, there are still a lot of things that they could do.

They can make their life really, really difficult. They can order investigations by the Office of Professional Responsibility or by the Office of Inspector General. They can reassign them, including to other locations.

I mean, so they can, even without firing people, if they really want to have this retribution for people who participated in these cases, they can make their lives and their livelihood really difficult.

SCIUTTO: Maggie, I wonder in your conversations and, you know, Trump very well, how far does his enemies list go? And frankly not just in the Justice Department, but to politicians who criticized him, the Liz Cheneys and Adam Kinzingers of the world to journalists who covered him, wrote stories about him that were critical, uncovered things he didn't want uncovered.

Can we expect in a second Trump term that he goes after all those people?

HABERMAN: There's only 40 minutes left in the show, right, to talk about how long this list is. I mean, look, it's a long list. It doesn't mean that he's going to go after everybody with the same intensity, or even everybody at all who has ever written something, said something, done something he didn't liked.

Certainly, the prosecutions are in a different category in his mind, Jim, you know, he has talked about that pretty openly.

Nobody should be surprised that he is talking about going after the prosecutors who investigated him or who prosecuted him. He's been, as you showed a video, quite plain about doing that. And as Carrie said, he doesn't actually -- it's not clear to me that he can do the things that are being talked about in that "Washington Post" story, but he doesn't actually have to make those things happen in order to make people's lives very hard.

And that can be true, Jim, for journalists, that can be true for immigrants, that can be true for wide groups of people that he has talked about on the campaign trail, and that I do expect we will see.

SCIUTTO: Joe, as we mentioned, post reporting, Trump is planning to assemble investigative teams to "hunt" for evidence in battleground states that fraud tainted the 2020 election. There's been recounts, there have been lawsuits, failed lawsuits, investigations and his own attorney general from the first term said there's no evidence of that significant fraud.

He's not giving it up. Clearly, he's not giving up the 2020 election lie. Why? And from your perspective, is that what he should be doing is that what he should be using the Justice Department for in a second term?

PINION: I will simply say that I think that sometimes President Trump says things and then people effectively get hyperbolic about the words that come out of his mouth.

I do believe that part of President Trump's mandate is to root out rot in our institutions. I'm not going to sit here and allow us to pretend that the FBI has been perfect, that the DOJ has been perfect, and in fact, they have done things as an institution. They have done a grave deal of harm to this country.

You have to remember that we're sitting here in the aftermath of a man named Kevin Clinesmith, who inserted, fabricated evidence into an e- mail for the purposes of allowing the FBI to procure a FISA warrant to investigate President Trump and that investigation did not stop until he was already president.

[20:31:03]

We're sitting here in the aftermath of the current Secretary of State, Antony Blinken, who went and picked up the phone and called the deputy director for the CIA. And out of that phone call came a letter signed by 51 members of former U.S. intelligence who said that Hunter Biden's laptop was rushing disinformation, even though we knew that the FBI had authenticated that laptop and its contents 11 months prior.

I am not saying that we are supposed to bend over and allow people to say things that are untrue, but at some point, news organizations should be able to acknowledge the fact that we should have investigations. Claudia Tenney, who is in --

SCIUTTO: Well, we did. I mean, Joe, to be -- we did -- this network did report on the investigations you're talking about.

PINION: I'm not -- look, to be clear, I'm not --

SCIUTTO: And by the way, Kevin Clinesmith was prosecuted by that Justice Department.

PINION: Kevin Clinesmith has not done a single day in jail. And as we sit here today, he currently --

SCIUTTO: Nor is Donald Trump.

PINION: He has the ability to practice law. Look, I'll just say this, and I'll leave you here.

SCIUTTO: No, I do want to cut you off briefly because I want to give Van a chance to respond.

JONES: Look, nobody has said any American institution is perfect, but to take a wrecking ball and run it through our institution is not going to make Americans safer, sometimes we talk over folks' heads.

Look, Donald Trump did a bunch of bad stuff and got in trouble. And now he's not in trouble, but he still wants to go back and hurt little people. Listen, if you -- when we say civil servants, they say deep state. Nobody knows what we're talking about.

These are folks who went to college with, who were smart kids, who took the LSAT, went to law school and wanted to do something to keep us safe and got their dream job, just working folks, got a dream job at the Department of Justice. They've been trying to put people in jail who do bad stuff.

Somebody assigned them to work on this thing. And now Donald Trump wants to ruin their lives, make -- destroy their careers because they did the job that was assigned to them. Those are working folks, good folks. You go to school with them, you go to the gym with them, and they are now trembling. They're afraid because they did their job.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

JONES: If that's wrong, Donald Trump would cut it out, quit picking on little folks, and deal with big problems.

PINION: I'll just say this quickly --

SCIUTTO: And we should --

PINION: -- and Jim, I apologize, but look --

JONES: No, you don't apologize.

PINION: -- the reality is --

JONES: Keep filibustering, brother, but --

PINION: It's not --

JONES: Donald Trump is wrong to jump on those workers.

PINION: It is --

JONES: He's wrong to jump on the workers.

PINION: It is not a filibuster, brother. Look, I love you to death, but you already --

JONES: I love you too.

SCIUTTO: Final word, because we've got to go, gentlemen.

PINION: We've got Claudia Tenney, who sent a criminal referral to the DOJ for those 51 members of -- former U.S. intelligence members to say what they did was wrong. It has been collecting dust on the desk of (INAUDIBLE) --

SCIUTTO: Listen --

PINION: -- attorney general, and I believe it's going to stop collecting dust with the new attorney general --

SCIUTTO: A story I should note that this --

PINION: -- and I think that's why we're having this conversation right now.

SCIUTTO: A story I should note that this network covered. What you didn't answer was my question about investigating false claims of fraud in the 2020 election, but it appears we're going to be going down that rabbit hole as well.

Everyone, thanks so much to all of you for giving me time on your Friday. More on this Washington Post report about Jack Smith and what they say are Trump's plans for the DOJ. We're going to get a reaction from a congressman who also is a former assistant U.S. attorney himself.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:38:33]

SCIUTTO: Back to the new reporting from The Washington Post, the headline reading, "Trump plans to fire Jack Smith's team, use DOJ to probe the 2020 election.

More perspective now from Democratic Congressman Glenn Ivey. He's a former assistant U.S. attorney himself who sits on the House Judiciary Committee, also the Ethics Committee. We're going to get to that.

I want to begin with your past as an assistant U.S. attorney, because what Trump is vowing to do here, according to The Washington Post, is go after the career folks, right?

REP. GLENN IVEY (D-MD): Yes.

SCIUTTO: The folks who signed up for the DOJ, you know, ostensibly in a nonpartisan role. You serve whatever administration is, you go after the bad guys, right?

IVEY: Yes.

SCIUTTO: And he's saying, you're fired.

IVEY: Yes, it's astonishing and it will be terribly destructive at the Department of Justice because you have prosecutors. In fact, you have a whole unit there, public integrity, it's called, that focuses on prosecuting elected officials who cross the line, taking bribes and the like. What he is saying he will do, I guess, essentially could disband that whole unit.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

IVEY: And so the prosecutors, for example, who prosecuted Senator Menendez or who are investigating the New York mayor, Eric Adams --

SCIUTTO: Or Hunter Biden, right?

IVEY: Hunter Biden --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

IVEY: -- I mean, you know, I guess those won't go forward. He's going after the people that went after him. But if you're a prosecutor and you're looking at this, you're like, well, the next guy who gets elected, I don't know who that's going to be, but are they going to try and prosecute me or destroy my life? It's not what we want for the Department of Justice.

SCIUTTO: I mean, there's a dark irony here, right, because he campaigned against the alleged weaponization of the DOJ, and now is quite publicly saying he's going to go after folks who came after him, right?

[20:40:12]

The investigators, and now he has Pam Bondi, who was one of the lawyers who defended Trump during his first impeachment, but also who helped propagate the 2020 election lie.

IVEY: Right.

SCIUTTO: What do you think the Justice Department looks like under her?

IVEY: I mean, I don't really know. I mean, she's got a better profile than Matt Gaetz did. I mean, she has prosecutorial experience. She's been in a courtroom as a lawyer, not as a defendant. And, you know, she's actually got managerial experience.

But this is the bigger test, right? This isn't just those boxes have been checked. This is, do you have the backbone to stand up to your boss --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

IVEY: -- Donald Trump, and say, we can't go there. Now, I'm -- I wasn't a huge Bill Barr fan, but there are points where he drew that line. And that's what you need to --

SCIUTTO: He certainly drew his line after the election in 2020.

IVEY: Yes, he did. He waited a little longer than I would have liked.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

IVEY: But, you know, he got there and that's been true in other -- Bill Clinton, I'm sure he would have loved to have gotten rid of some of the investigations that were going on with him during Janet Reno's era. But he kept his distance and let those things go forward. You have to let them play out.

SCIUTTO: You're a member of the House Homeland Security Committee. What do you make of this few weeks that Tulsi Gabbard was on this watch list? We should be clear, it's not a terror watch list, but it's an algorithm that looks at people's travel and foreign contacts.

And somehow she tripped the wire, as it were, and ended up on this list for a time. How significant is that in your view?

IVEY: You know, I'm not completely sure. I think it's something we want to take a very close look at. Certainly, we can't rely on the Trump transition team to vet these nominees. They're sending up people who probably shouldn't be at the top of these lists, and I think she's one of those.

So, even if, you know, as Van Jones was saying, can she clear her name? Maybe. I guess she'll get a chance to do that. But I got to believe there are better people out there from a qualification standpoint, from an experience standpoint, from a managerial standpoint.

And this isn't just any job where OJT is a -- on the job training is OK. This is the national security of the United States at a very dangerous time for our country.

SCIUTTO: Getting more dangerous. You're also a member of the House Ethics Committee -- news moves quickly --

IVEY: Yes.

SCIUTTO: -- in Washington, and in the span of the last 24 hours, he -- Matt Gaetz withdrew his name as Trump's nominee. Today, he said he's not going to be returning to Congress either, what do you think should happen now to the ethics report relating to him?

IVEY: Well, you know, he said he's not returning to Congress. We'll see. I think he doesn't have to make that final decision until I guess it's January 3rd. But that's issue one. And he could also, you know, if Marco Rubio gets selected for the Cabinet, that Senate seat could come open.

Mr. Gaetz could be appointed to that potentially. He -- I've heard he's thinking about running for governor of Florida. There are also other positions in the Trump administration that he could be appointed to. So, it might make sense to release the information.

So whatever he chooses to do, the public has that information. And we do have the precedent for that --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

IVEY: -- you know, from the House Ethics Committee, releasing information in his reports or investigations for people who have left the Congress. But maybe seeking other office --

SCIUTTO: Right.

IVEY: -- or other issues like that.

SCIUTTO: Which is what the Senate was demanding had he gone through a Senate confirmation hearing or met some senators.

IVEY: Yes.

SCIUTTO: Glenn Ivey, appreciate it. Hope you have a good holiday with your family.

IVEY: Happy Thanksgiving to you.

SCIUTTO: You too.

Coming up, what President Vladimir Putin is saying about the experimental new missile Russia fired to strike Ukraine.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:48:11]

SCIUTTO: President Vladimir Putin says that Russia will continue testing the experimental new missile it fired on Ukraine, Dnipro -- the Dnipro region Thursday. The use of a mid-range ballistic missile on the battlefield marked the latest escalation in a week that many analysts say has transformed the ongoing conflict.

CNN's Nick Paton Walsh is in Kyiv and he joins us now. Nick, we've been learning a lot about this new missile in the last 48 hours or so. And it only looks more threatening over time. What do we know?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean, I think it's fair to say that all the different assessments, including Vladimir Putin's, agree this is a hypersonic missile. And from the video, we saw ourselves one that appears to fire multiple separate warheads from one singular delivery device.

A mechanism normally associated with something that would deliver a nuclear payload, but no sign of this at all. Putin suggested this could fly at 3 kilometers per second. And in comments today, he said that this was indeed successful in its use. And they would continue to test the missile, implying that they continue to test it in combat.

I think most Western assessments, too, agree this is something new. The real question is, how many do they have? And Ukraine defense intelligence assessments suggest this is actually called the Kedr, not the Oreshnik, which Vladimir Putin dubbed it. And indeed, as of October, Russia only had two prototypes. That's their hope. They said, quote, "Thanks, God." Jim?

SCIUTTO: Goodness. Beyond the missile, and that was quite a message itself. Some noted a change in Putin's tone from previous public addresses during this war. What did you take away from his remarks?

PATON WALSH: Yes, I mean, look, this was a speech that essentially almost been trailed in terms of significance by a sort of blundering phone call that the foreign ministry spokesman took in a briefing being told not to talk about the missile.

[20:50:08]

And his tone, I think, was different in that he spoke about essentially the threat of missiles like this towards the West, that these missiles could get through Western air defenses, all of them, he claimed, because of its speed. And from what we saw in that video, the multiple different warheads.

I should point out that some Western military analysts say that the U.S. NATO are in possession of air defenses potentially that could stop something like this. But it's never been tested one against the other. And the ultimate message here was twofold, to say that Russia still has technical prowess that it hasn't reached for yet to potentially remind its adversary, which increasingly views as being Washington, not Kyiv, that it could potentially get round some of its better technology.

And, of course, to here to remind people in Ukraine that even though their air defenses are increasingly advanced week by week from Western help, that they still possess things that could easily get through them. It certainly made people a lot more anxious.

The initial assessment from the Ukrainians, this was an ICBM. And, you know, President Volodymyr Zelenskyy was, I think, correct to note the altitude, the speed, many of the characteristics of that Oreshnik or whatever we choose to call it, the fluid, the neat pro-match that kind of device. It range simply didn't.

And I think we are seeing the Kremlin here after a week in which they feel the Biden administration has rapidly escalated with the use of attack on the U.S. supplied missiles by Ukraine to hit Russia, that they needed to do something back. And this was it, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Listen, and maybe that distinction might be one without a difference, maybe not the same range as an ICBM, but clearly more threatening.

Nick Paton Walsh, thanks so much.

Coming up next, a woman from Hawaii mysteriously vanishes on a trip of a lifetime. Her family alarmed by some text messages they received from her phone. We're going to have the details coming up. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:56:42]

SCIUTTO: The family of a 30-year-old woman from Hawaii is pleading for her safe return after she vanished on vacation. She was expected to fly to New York to see family with a stop in Los Angeles. But she disappeared 11 days ago in L.A. after strange text messages were sent from her phone.

We're going to have more on the story now from CNN's Veronica Miracle.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

LARIE PIDGEON, HANNAH KOBAYASHI'S AUNT: Please, please, please do not stop saying her name.

VERONICA MIRACLE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Worried family and friends of a missing woman are asking anyone for help. Desperate in their search for Hannah Kobayashi.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These little like postcards, these are to hand out to people.

MIRACLE (voice-over): The 30-year-old from Hawaii disappeared November 11th. Surveillance images and bizarre texts are the only clues family members have.

PIDGEON: If someone has her, I want you to look at the pictures that we have posted. I want you to see this family and I want you to know that she is so loved.

MIRACLE: Two weeks ago, Kobayashi flew from Maui to Los Angeles. She was supposed to go on to New York, but never made her connecting flight here at LAX. Family members say they have seen footage of her running to get to her gate, but missed the flight due to a tight 40- minute layover.

MIRACLE (voice-over): For the next three days, family members say they were in touch with Hannah as she kept going back to LAX to try and book a new flight. Family members even spoke to an airline checking agent who spoke with Hannah.

PIDGEON: Basically that she was just frustrated. She was done. She wanted to get a direct flight to JFK. She even talked about, you know, getting a direct flight to Maui. Like -- and they said, unfortunately, you have to book a brand new ticket, which is expensive.

MIRACLE (voice-over): When she wasn't at LAX, family members say she was spotted at a popular outdoor mall in Los Angeles. Two days in a row, she was seen at The Grove, once in a bookstore. And another day she was caught on camera by a vlogger. She also posted a picture on Instagram from an event at the mall.

During the three days her phone was on, in addition to speaking with her family, she was also in touch with friends. Some shared screenshots of texts from Kobayashi before she went silent. Mysterious messages like, "Deep hackers wiped my identity, stole all of my funds, and have had me on a mind -- since Friday", one message said.

"I got tricked pretty much into giving away all my funds," another text read. Followed by one saying, "For someone I thought I loved." Family members say these text messages do not sound like the Hannah that they know and love.

MIRACLE: Do you think that she is behind these text messages, or do you think someone else is writing these texts?

PIDGEON: You know, there's two cases of scenarios. It's that someone has her phone, that's writing the text, someone's forcing her to write these texts. Or she's, you know, she's not OK, and she's writing these texts.

MIRACLE: The last place Hannah was seen was at this train station in downtown Los Angeles. Family members say they've seen footage of her on the train with someone they don't recognize, and leaving the train station with that same person. They've now posted flyers all over the area in hopes that someone recognizes Hannah.

MIRACLE (voice-over): The LAPD now sharing this poster seeking help in their search for Kobayashi.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hannah, you are loved. You're missed, yes. And we're here for you.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

MIRACLE (on-camera): And Jim, family members tell us that after seeing the state of Hannah on that surveillance video from the train station, they're concerned for her well-being. They wouldn't go into any further details because they don't want to jeopardize the investigation.

We did reach out to the LAPD, they couldn't give us an interview. They did say they are investing in this case -- investigating, rather, in this case, and also the FBI is now involved. Jim?

SCIUTTO: Let's hope they find her.

Veronica Miracle, thanks so much.

The news continues now. The Source with Kaitlan Collins.