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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees

V.P. Vance and Kirk Family Land in Arizona with Charlie Kirk's Casket; Manhunt Still Underway for Kirk Killer; FBI Tip Line for Information on Kirk Shooting: 1-800-CALL-FBI; Officials Release New Images Of Person Of Interest; Law Enforcement To Hold Press Briefing At 9:30 PM ET. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired September 11, 2025 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: ... this moment, likely her mind is not on what comes next. She is a grieving mother, a grieving spouse, and she was someone who was with her kids. We know at yesterday's event where her husband was killed, she is someone that puts faith very front and center. So, of course she likely will be leaning on that through this time.

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: Yes, thanks very much to all of you, of course as we are watching this somber moment of Charlie Kirk's remains arriving back at his home. Let's hand it off now to AC360.

[20:00:35]

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, "ANDERSON COOPER: 360": Good evening. Thanks for joining us.

Just moments ago Air Force Two landed at Sky Harbor International Airport in Phoenix. You see the plane there. On board Vice-President Vance accompanying the casket of Charlie Kirk, along with Kirk's family back to their home.

Earlier today, the Vice President was one of the pallbearers bringing the casket on board for the journey back from Utah, where Kirk was assassinated just yesterday. It caps a day that saw the manhunt for Kirk's killer growing and new evidence emerging as to what happened before, during, and immediately after. A single rifle shot fatally wounded Kirk at Utah Valley University in Orem and killed him. Here's where that now stands.

The FBI has put out two security camera images of the man, it is now calling a person of interest in the assassination. Take a close look at these images. The Bureau is offering up to $100,000.00 for information leading to the killer. In one of these photos, both taken shortly before the shooting, the one on the left there, the man appears to be walking up a stairwell and past a potential witness. You'll see the shoulder of the person in the foreground seems to be walking down the stairs.

You'll remember that police have said they had video of a person who had walked up a stairwell to a rooftop from where the single fatal shot was fired. New video appears to show a person lying down on the same roof, from where authorities believe Kirk was shot. According to CNN's analysis, the video was taken in the hour before the killing. They've also recovered what they believe is the murder weapon, a Mauser bolt-action rifle and scope.

Also today, new video police going door-to-door in neighborhoods around the university shortly after the shooting, asking people if their doorbell cameras like this one may have captured any images of the killer fleeing the scene. U.S. Marshals have also been called in to help in the wider manhunt. FBI Director Kash Patel is also on his way to Utah.

The President today said he plans to posthumously award Kirk the Presidential Medal of Freedom. Later, speaking to reporters, he offered a contrast to the fiery remarks he made last evening.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: How do you want to see your supporters respond to this, Charlie Kirk was a big advocate of nonviolence and free speech on campus. How do you want your supporters to respond, sir?

DONALD TRUMP (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I think that way, he was an advocate of nonviolence. That's the way I'd like to see people respond.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Again, a contrast to last night when the President blamed the "radical left" for inciting Kirk's murder. That said, seconds before saying what you just heard him say there on the south lawn today, he also said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We have a radical left group of lunatics out there, just absolute lunatics. And were going to get that problem solved. I'm only concerned for the country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: So there's a lot to get to in the hour ahead. With a massive manhunt underway still day two. Here's CNN's Nick Watt with more on the investigation.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BEAU MASON, COMMISSIONER, UTAH DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: The suspect blended in well with the college institution.

NICK WATT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Among the 3,000 or so who came to hear Charlie Kirk speak.

ROBERT BOHLS, FBI SALT LAKE CITY SPECIAL AGENT: Investigators have also collected footwear impression, a palm print and forearm imprints for analysis.

WATT (voice over): Investigators say the suspect arrived on campus 11:52 A.M. local time Wednesday, made his way through stairwells across a roof to the shooting location believed to be on top of this building, about a 150-yard shot to where Kirk was sitting.

SKYLER BAIRD, EYEWITNESS: He was well guarded against, you know, someone running up with a knife or trying to fight him personally. He was well guarded from that sense. But security in the general area, it was just a normal campus day.

WATT (voice over): A normal campus day until that one fatal shot rang out fired at around 12:20 local time.

WATT (on camera): Investigators say they have tracked the suspect's movements after he fired the shot. They say he jumped off the roof, that was the shooting location and fled this way, north of campus and in to this neighborhood over here. This is where we have footage of officers searching, looking for the suspect, looking for eyewitnesses, looking for more security video to give them some indication of which way he went. No sign of the suspect.

WATT (voice over): The FBI says they do not know how far he might now have traveled.

WATT (on camera): In a wooded area near the campus. Officers found a weapon they believe was the suspect's weapon, described as a high powered bolt action rifle that was found along with some ammunition. CNN has learned that on that rifle and ammunition were scrawled some -- a range of phrases related to current cultural issues, could they point to a possible motive. Also, initials -- could they point to possible identification.

BOHLS: The FBI laboratory will be analyzing this weapon. We are and will continue to work nonstop until we find the person that has committed this heinous crime and find out why they did it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[20:05:43]

COOPER: And Nick joins me now from Orem, Utah. Is there any indication law enforcement is getting close to finding the suspect?

WATT: I mean, Anderson, if there's an indication of anything, there's an indication of the opposite. You know, you mentioned the U.S. Marshals, the U.S. Marshals offered help yesterday. That offer was rebuffed, today, that offer was accepted, suggesting that officials believe they need more manpower.

You know, this morning they announced they had really good images of the suspect. They were using tech, they were confident they were going to get an identification. They said if it doesn't work, we'll release the photos to the public. A couple of hours later, they released those photos to the public. The FBI is also now offering $100,000.00 reward. And you know, there was supposed to be a press conference around lunchtime that was postponed "for rapid developments."

Hours later, we still haven't heard what those rapid developments are. Listen, Anderson, it's now coming up on 30 hours since Charlie Kirk was shot here. And with every hour that passes, the search does get harder -- Anderson.

COOPER: Yes, Nick Watt, thanks very much.

Joining me now is CNN chief law enforcement intelligence analyst, John Miller, former FBI special agent Bryanna Fox and former FBI Deputy Director John Pistole. I want to put those two photographs of this person of interest back up because, John, I mean, looking at these two photos, I would think somebody must recognize this person.

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: If you didn't know him and you passed him in the street, maybe without the hat and glasses, you probably wouldn't. But if you did know him, there's a pretty good chance you would. And we've seen that in many cases where people familiar with the person just say, I know who that is.

COOPER: I also want to show, I believe we have a photo from the roof which show a footprint, is this the photo that you'd --

MILLER: So, that's a photo of that position. And right there you can see you can see the law enforcement markers at each spot. But what you can see is where it appears somebody was laying down. There's, you know, the impressions of where the foot would have been, where the palms would have been as they extended that rifle out.

COOPER: This could actually an imprint in gravel, essentially of the body position of a shooter.

MILLER: Exactly. And this won't particularly aid in identifying the person. Now, there's always the possibility, you know, that you could extract DNA if he had an ungloved hand off of there but it does help establish the crime, the place where the crime took place when they get a suspect. You know, the measurements may help, but the big deal today is they have a gun. The gun is likely connected to the crime.

The bullet that was fired from that gun came from a shell casing that remained in the chamber. He never, after seeing that shot, ejected the shell casing.

COOPER: I got to just jump in.

MILLER: Sure.

COOPER: I understand we have some new pictures of the person of interest from the Utah Public Safety. These are other images. We'll try to blow those up a little bit more, but were just getting these in now.

MILLER: what you glean from these photos is the rifle isn't in the picture, but now you get a clearer picture of the backpack. And we learned from the Thomas Crooks' attempt to kill Donald Trump in Pennsylvania. You can disassemble the you can disassemble the rifle. You can put the parts in a backpack and assemble it, you know, when you're on site on that roof and take that shot. COOPER: So, John Pistole, joining us as well. The assumption is then that a rifle would be would have been disassembled in that backpack and brought up, if that is in fact the killer.

JOHN PISTOLE, FORMER FBI DEPUTY DIRECTOR: Yes, that's right, Anderson. And the whole idea is what can the FBI do to establish that rifle that was found to the shooter in this case, based on whatever forensic evidence that they have gleaned from that, the palm print, okay next, but what do you compare palm print to? It's not like fingerprints for driver's license or passports or things like that.

They'll also be looking for things any digital evidence. Was there anything clearly on the web or perhaps on the dark web where this individual, whoever he is, indicated plans or plan planning or ideas, aspirational even, about wanting to commit some type of act that would be, noteworthy. And then the question is, after 24 hours, as was mentioned earlier, the odds of finding somebody a suspect like this go down after 24 hours, somewhat dramatically.

And so it becomes more and more of a challenge and to find the gun, that's great to find any physical evidence that's helpful but what ties this individual into whoever he is, how is he identified, And then what can be done to locate him once he is identified.

And so, family and friends, have seen this, and they've got to be thinking, I can't believe this has happened. We've got to notify the authorities. And whether it's for the $100,000.00 reward or not. But right now, person of interest is not helping anybody other than trying to locate this individual.

[20:10:53]

COOPER: Bryanna, what stands out to you so far based on, you know, the statements of investigators, what's out there?

BRYANNA FOX, FORMER FBI SPECIAL AGENT: Yes, well, quite a lot of information actually has been released, shows a flag emblem on the shirt that this suspect is wearing. I think that's pretty interesting, actually either that he was wearing that to be able to fit in with this crowd at the rally, or that shirt was allegedly sourced from a veterans -- wounded veteran foundation. So, it could speak to perhaps his background or maybe even a motive.

Additionally, I think the shell casings are going to be extremely useful in the next few hours and days. They're submitting those into NIBIN. That takes a couple days. It's like matching fingerprints, but with shell casings. That takes a little while. But with that, they're going to be able to see if that weapon was used in any other crimes across the nation and that will hopefully lead police a little closer to that person of interest.

COOPER: John Miller, I mean, as John Pistole was saying, I mean, is time on the side of the investigators here?

MILLER: You know, time floats in these things. And what I mean by that is when we had Cesar Sayoc, the bomber, who was sending pipe bombs, including the CNN across New York City, that went on for a number of days where we had nothing. And then literally at 4:00 in the morning, three leads came together and then we had a name, we had a face, we had an address, we had a vehicle.

With Luigi Mangione, we woke up that day with nothing and then somebody spotted him in a McDonald's, and police came and then we had a name, we had a suspect, and we had a murder weapon in a backpack. These things can turn on a dime. So, the fact that they've put these pictures out and now they put more pictures out is to generate that lead bucket and make sure it's always full with calls coming in, because odds are with this amount of exposure and this amount of resource, one of these is going to pan out.

COOPER: Yes, I mean, given the skill that this person had to make that shot, somebody who knows this person seeing this photo, I mean, that's another piece of --

MILLER: That was not his first time shooting. Somebody's going to know that in his background.

COOPER: Right, and clearly there's probably I mean, John Pistole, there may be a gun range where this person has practiced that that would even identify this person.

PISTOLE: Yes, exactly. It's almost like from the movies or something where lets go to the gun range and obviously tracing the gun, as Bryanna was referring to. Where was that gun acquired? Was it purchased legally? Was it acquired in the black market? And the other thing that they would look at is how they can pursue this identifying this person through all other means.

So, not only the physical evidence, the digital evidence, the dark web, as I mentioned, the neighborhood canvass, has anybody seen this person? But also, is this a trigger for some other person to use as a basis for taking some act that they think, okay, this is a start of what I wanted to do or we wanted to do, whether a formally affiliated or just again, thinking this, okay, this is a start of it. And this guy shot and killed Charlie Kirk, so we're going to -- I'm going to go and do something else, which I think, unfortunately, then leads to what you might get into later in terms of are we going to see more virtual appearances rather than in person appearances. And I imagine that would be the case for people who are wanting to appear in public up until such situations like this.

COOPER: John Pistole, let me ask you, you were the President of Anderson University in Indiana for ten years. I mean, it's a kind of a ridiculous I mean, that question I probably would have asked a couple of days ago, but our outdoor political events, whether on college campuses or elsewhere, are just too difficult to secure unless there is a Presidential level protection.

PISTOLE: Yes, unless the person is bringing their own security package. Whether as a, you know, a top ranking politician, President, V.P. or, you know, speaker or something like that, campus security cannot set up checkpoints. Any campus, however large or wealthy, absent -- amazing undertaking, investment of resources and anything that's specific --

COOPER: Charlie Kirk had had his security, I was looking at the videos. They certainly seem to know what they were doing. They were scanning the crowd. It looked like it was a close protection detail because a lot of them, you know, rushed in right away. They got him into that SUV, they weren't waiting around for an ambulance. They seemed to know, you know, how to keep a close protection detail. But unless and we're told by the university, there were six university police, you know, also assigned to this event, but there were thousands of people there and clearly no one on the roofs.

PISTOLE: Right and so, you don't have like in Butler, P.A., you don't even have the Secret Service and the local police who are not coordinating as well as they should have as the lessons learned. So, here we have a good close package of security, but anything from a distance, obviously just not effective on and fatally so for Charlie Kirk.

COOPER: Yes, Bryanna, I mean, if it is true that words and phrases were scrawled on the rifle and ammunition what does that tell you?

FOX: Well this is a throwback in a way, to what we saw, even just with the Luigi Mangione killing in New York City, where there were notes inscribed on the shell casing. So, all of this leads us to think that this is an ideological shooter and that sort of fits the profile that we're seeing with several shootings, these politically motivated shootings these days, which are increasing frequently, by the day.

So one thing that we notice about ideological shooters, they tend to be younger in age 20s and 30s. They tend to have a lot of experience with weapons. They tend to be loners, and they tend to really premeditate their crimes, not perfectly so. I am confident that law enforcement will catch up with the shooter, but they do put a lot of energy into it, because it's almost like a calling for them. They're fighting for some ideological reason.

COOPER: Bryanna Fox, thanks very much. John Pistole as well, John miller.

Coming up next, more on how this happened. A frame by frame look at the latest act of political violence this year. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:22:00]

COOPER: I want to show you again the new photographs there on the left side of your screen, on the right side of your screen is the airport. Where live images where Vice-President Vance has been -- has landed and is escorting the casket of Charlie Kirk. Charlie Kirk is coming back to his home, escorted only by Vice-President Vance. His wife is on that flight with their small children, three years old and one years old, as well as Usha Vance, the wife of J.D. Vance.

On the left, some of the new images that we have just started to see of the person of interest, let's take a look at how we got here. More on that from our senior investigative correspondent, Kyung Lah.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KYUNG LAH, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Using video and aerial image analysis, CNN pieced together the shooters possible movements in the moments before and after Charlie Kirk was assassinated. The shooter arrived on campus at 11:52 local time say investigators, and went up to the roof of the Losee Center. Video taken shortly before Kirk was shot, shows something on top of the roof, possibly a person.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's somebody on the roof right there? Just saying.

He just ran from, over -- where's my finger -- Whoa from over there -- ran in and was right there.

LAH (voice over): Based on aerial images and 3D analysis of CNN has reviewed, the shooter would have been about here. This photo shows orange evidence markers. You can see indentations in the loose gravel on the building's roof. As if someone had been laying on it.

A CNN analysis shows that precise angle would have a clear line of sight to where Kirk was sitting about 150 yards away at his event down below. Kirk had several security guards lining the fence near the stage as 3,000 people packed into a courtyard. Then, at 12:20 --

CHARLIE KIRK, AMERICAN POLITICAL ACTIVIST AND AUTHOR: Counting or not counting gang violence?

(GUNSHOT)

(SCREAMING)

LAH (voice over): Just after the shooting in this video, you can see someone on the roof running away. This ledge and this ledge appear to be the same. So, if we watch the video again, we can assume the shooter ran in this general direction, Northeast.

BEAU MASON, COMMISSIONER, UTA DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY: After the shooting, we were able to track his movements as he moved to the other side of the building, jumped off of the building and fled. Off of the campus and into a neighborhood.

LAH (voice over): In that neighborhood right next to the school. Law enforcement has been combing through an area partially blocked off by police tape. CNN spotted a forensics team going in and out of this wooded area, taking laser scans of the site. People who live here sent us multiple videos of police activity, and residents tell us law enforcement was there all day long.

The police released this image asking for the public's help to identify a person of interest pictured wearing a long sleeve black t- shirt and jeans, the logo on the shirt appears to be from a disabled veterans group.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[20:25:02]

LAH: Now, audio analysis does capture a signature crack and pop pattern in the video, Anderson, it is a little hard to hear unless you really slow it down, and that, says audio forensics expert, Rob Maher, that it is a single supersonic gunshot.

Now, supersonic rounds are fired from high powered rifles, ruling out the possibility of a small handgun because rounds from small handguns or similar weapons, they fire below the speed of sound. Maher's analysis does find that based on the time between that crack and pop sound and an inferred bullet speed, the firearm would have been located about 150 meters from where Kirk was using that podium -- Anderson.

COOPER: Kyung Lah, thanks very much. I want to talk more about the investigation with CNN law enforcement analyst Jonathan Wackrow, former Secret Service agent. Also, John Miller is with us as well. And there you have the FBI tip line on the bottom of the screen, 1-800- CALL-FBI if you recognize any of the images of this person of interest, that some of which are new, that we've just been showing over the last hour.

Jonathan, what stands out to you? I mean, it's stunning to see the video from 11:52 where you see a black figure on that roof and then 12:20, the shot, and you have a video of somebody running.

JONATHAN WACKROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes, I mean, it would -- all of this is shocking, first of all. But I think you have to really look at these attack dynamics to understand a little bit about this shooter, right. And I think that the selection of the attack location is really important. We heard that this is a courtyard where 3,000 people, but it didn't have perimeter security or event security that was ticketed. So, there was very little access control, allowing people basically you could go from the back of this crowd all the way up to the bike rack that was separating Charlie Kirk from the crowd and launch an attack there with almost certainty.

The selection of the roof location gave the shooter a tactical advantage, gave him a tactical advantage where they could because of the offset, it was sloped down this courtyard. They actually did have a little bit of concealment on that roof. Now, not from other directions, but from the direction of where the security and probably campus security was standing. He would have been out of view until he launched that attack.

The second point of that is because of that location. It gave him a very easy egress. It allowed him to take that one single precision shot, drop the weapon and flee. And the fact that he was up on that roof and was able to get away so fast to me, I would assess that he had some level of familiarity with the location that gave him a jump on law enforcement, and was able to get into that neighborhood quickly.

Again, you have to think about all of these attack dynamics as we start to build that profile of who is the shooter, what was the motivation? And again --

COOPER: Let's look at the photo again from the rooftop of the impression of his body. Essentially, there's a footprint. An arm imprint that would have been the position where he was laying flat on the ground, correct?

WACKROW: Laying prone with the rifle, the rifle had the scope again, waiting for that one singular moment.

COOPER: It is, I mean, if it's 11:52, the shot was 12:20. I mean, that's almost a 30-minute time frame that he would have been on that roof and who knows how long before 11:52 he was on that.

WACKROW: Yes and you know, when we start thinking about assassinations and long range threats, it's really time to discovery. That is a sort of a dangerous element as an attacker to be that exposed so long.

COOPER: A long time to expose yourself.

WACKROW: Exactly, but again, think about the geography and the where he was. He was elevated on a roof. The people that were, engaged in security were below grade. So, they would have, if they're looking up at the building, they probably wouldn't see him until he may have moved forward into his actual shooting position to them.

COOPER: From the side, somebody has been able to take this video and see something --

WACKROW: Exactly.

COOPER: Doesn't report it, but says like, oh, look, there's someone up there.

John Miller, to Jonathan Wackrow's point, he must have scoped this area out before. I mean, he must have been up to that rooftop before.

MILLER: And if I was an investigator on this case, I would be looking at those images that they just captured.

COOPER: How long are like those video cameras? How long do they keep images for about two weeks?

MILLER: I mean, it could be 30 days. It could be two weeks, it could be longer. But I would be going back through those because there's an opportunity for the first time, he went there -- this is the position, for the first time, he went there to do a reconnaissance that he might not have had the hat in the dark glasses and the sweater. He might have come in looking like a student. But you will probably see -- nobody is going to take a shot from that distance without finding that spot first, and not that day.

COOPER: Jonathan Wackrow, thanks very much.

Up next, calls to tamp down the political rhetoric in the wake of Kirk's murder and those doing the opposite. We'll be right back.

[20:30:12]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COOPER: Just want to bring you up to the minute. We've learned CNN that FBI Director Kash Patel has arrived in Orem, Utah, to assist with the Kirk assassination investigation. Authorities have released new photos of a person of interest in the case that we've been showing you over the last 20 or so, 30 minutes. We're showing you the tip line to call if you have any information on who this person may be.

And Charlie Kirk's body has just returned on Air Force Two to Phoenix, Arizona. Kirk's assassination has brought on both bipartisan appeals for bringing down the temperature and also more inflammatory talk.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

ALEX JONES, CONSERVATIVE MEDIA PERSONALITY: We're in a war. The left has been saying, put a bullseye on Trump, a bullseye on his supporters.

[20:35:03]

STEVE BANNON, PODCAST HOST: Charlie Kirk's a casualty of war. We're -- the -- we're in this country. We are.

JESSE WATTERS, FOX NEWS HOST: They are at war with us, whether we want to accept it or not, they are at war with us. And what are we going to do about it?

(END VIDEOCLIP)

COOPER: Whatever that does, the political climate was already under considerable strain after a string of political violence on both sides of a growing divide. In June, a Minnesota Democratic lawmaker, Melissa Hortman, was shot dead in her home along with her husband in what officials called a political assassination.

In April, Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro's residence was set on fire while Shapiro and his family slept inside. The President himself obviously targeted twice by would-be assassins. The first time in Butler, Pennsylvania in July, followed by the attempt on his life in September on a golf course in Florida.

And it's hard to forget the mass shooting in 2017 at the annual congressional baseball game just outside Washington. Four people were wounded, including then House Majority Whip Steve Scalise.

There's more breaking news. New video from the Utah Valley University student who was speaking with Charlie Kirk asking questions about mass shootings. He just posted it on social media and I just want to play part of that.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

HUNTER KOZAK, QUESTIONED CHARLIE KIRK BEFORE HE WAS SHOT: It's a tragedy and I don't -- it's hard to grapple with. And I'm part of a community that's struggling to grapple with it right now. And people have obviously pointed to the irony that I was -- the point that I was trying to make is how peaceful the left was right before he got shot.

And that only makes sense if we stay peaceful. As much as I disagree with Charlie Kirk -- I'm on the record for how much I disagree with Charlie Kirk, but like, man, dude, he is still a human being. Have we forgotten that?

(END VIDEOCLIP)

COOPER: Have we forgotten that.

Joining us now is CNN Senior Political Commentator and former Trump Campaign Adviser, David Urban, and CNN Chief Political Analyst and Former Senior Adviser of President Obama, David Axelrod.

David Urban, we've seen some elected officials, Republicans, Democrats, trying to lower the temperature in the wake of this assassination, a number of them. I'm wondering what you think of the President's response so as far and what you've been hearing.

DAVID URBAN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes, Anderson, obviously, that young man's sentiment is echoed, you know, across America today. I think I really liked what President Trump said this afternoon at the helicopter where, you know, Charlie Kirk was a man of peace, of debate, of dialogue.

He encourages supporters to kind of fall in that vein. I don't think that the rhetoric Alex Jones and others are putting forth is useful or helpful. You know, Charlie was a -- the happy warrior. He was so effective because he was a guy that if you didn't -- even if you didn't agree with him, you kind of liked him. You liked his engagement.

You can't help watch the Gavin Newsom interaction at the beginning. I'm sure Gavin Newsom and Charlie Kirk couldn't be -- they could not be further apart on the ideological spectrum. But yet you could tell there's a real affinity between both of them, that they enjoyed the repartee, they enjoyed the challenge.

This is a marketplace ideas. The United States and democracy is built on the ability to have civil dialogue with one another. If you don't agree, you can, you know, you can continue to debate and try to win people over. That's what our nation is built on.

If people are now fearful to go out and express themselves, whether they'd be commentators, politicians or the like, you know, our country's at real risk of collapsing. You know, David and I disagree on lots of things, Van Jones and I, but I know David Axelrod is a good person. I know Van Jones is a good person.

The more you engage -- just like Charlie Kirk said -- the more you engage, the better. When you stop talking, we, America, fails.

COOPER: By the way, I've just been told that there's going to be a press briefing by law enforcement at 9:30 p.m. Eastern Time. And FBI Director Kash Patel will be there.

David Axelrod, I mean, you know, obviously the country's going through a trauma. What do you make of the rhetoric we're hearing?

DAVID AXELROD, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, first of all, Dave Urban now forces me to acknowledge that I think he's a good person, too, and a great American. And -- but --

COOPER: Anybody who knows David Urban has known that for a long time, so.

AXELROD: But, look, you know, the thing that I heard last night, those clips from Steve Bannon and from Alex Jones. And here's the problem --

COOPER: and Jesse Watters, who I don't know if he actually has ever been to a war zone, but he's talking about war.

AXELROD: Yes, I mean, Dave Urban has, so he knows this. When -- you know, wars have specific meanings. When you say we're in a war after someone has been shot, it's really an invitation to other people to commit acts of violence. And that's a despicable thing.

I was as sickened by what I saw yesterday in Utah as I was by the murder of those legislators in Minnesota. This is not how a free society can work.

[20:40:07]

And we need all our leaders to stand up and say so and say so forcefully to their followers. And as to the President, you know, his -- I agree with David's words this afternoon were good. He went online last night or they released a statement and he said this was -- this is the tragic consequence of demonizing those with whom you disagree day after day, year after year in the most despicable way.

Possible, but then he says it's all about the radical left. And in that way, he is really targeting people who disagree with him. And in a very broad way, we need the President of the United States to reject that kind of language and not use that kind of language.

And let's all be serious about this.

COOPER: David, I just --

AXELROD: This is a standard practice of this.

COOPER: David, I just need to point out to our viewers, you're seeing, this is a hearse that I believe is carrying the casket already that has Charlie Kirk or waiting to take the casket. I'm not sure. It's just brought it. That's in Phoenix.

I'm sorry, David. Go ahead.

AXELROD: No, no, no, that's OK. All I'm saying is that the President of the United States should model that behavior for his followers and for the whole country. That's what we need a president to do, to stand up and say no matter how much we disagree, we should not dehumanize each other. We should not demonize each other, we should not accuse each other of being sick and evil and unpatriotic.

Because when you do those things, you are encouraging people who are easily triggered to heed your words and go out and act on them. And that's what we have to begin to avoid. If you want to honor Charlie Kirk, who should not be -- who should be with his family today and not in that hearse, then take steps to make sure that there isn't another victim down the line.

COOPER: Yes. David Axelrod, David Urban quickly, yes.

URBAN: Yes, Anderson, I was going to say I couldn't agree with Axe more. And, you know, it's dehumanizing. It's not incumbent on just the President alone. It's incumbent on every American.

Don't sit back on social media. Don't gripe about your neighbors. Reach out to people you disagree with. Talk to them. Don't -- it's easy to hide behind, you know, some faceless social media account and throw stones at people. It is not productive.

It's not great for our society, to say the least. People should be talking to people they disagree with. The only way forward is to sit down with those you disagree with, just like Charlie Kirk was doing, and try to convince them otherwise.

COOPER: It's extraordinary to see these images. Charlie Kirk alive --

URBAN: Heartbreaking.

COOPER: -- yesterday. And now his family, his wife, his three-year- old, his one-year-old. In that casket, the body of Charlie Kirk.

URBAN: Yes.

COOPER: Being brought home (ph).

URBAN: Heartbreaking.

COOPER: Yes. David Urban, David Axelrod, thank you.

Up next, more reaction to this moment and this terrible aftermath.

(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)

CHARLIE KIRK, CONSERVATIVE ACTIVIST: All right, we're going to get started, everybody. You know how it works. Question and answer. Thank you, Elaine (ph) from Wyryki. That was great. Really appreciate it.

And we're going to be here for a couple hours.

(END VIDEOCLIP)

COOPER: Charlie Kirk's assassination sending chills across Capitol Hill. Minnesota Senator Amy Klobuchar joins us ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:47:49]

COOPER: If you are just joining us, we've learned that there is a press briefing scheduled in about 45 minutes in Utah on the Charlie Kirk assassination. That image we are showing you, we just saw before the commercial break, the casket with Charlie Kirk inside being taken out of that hearse.

He was flown back to Phoenix, Arizona just within this last hour, accompanied by Vice President JD Vance, his wife, as well as Charlie Kirk's family, his wife, their two young children -- three years old and one years old, who will grow up without their father.

FBI Director Kash Patel is expected to be at this press conference at 9:30 Eastern Time. Also Utah's governor and other law enforcement officials. CNN will obviously bring it to you live.

Meantime, as we were talking about before the break, lawmakers on Capitol Hill visibly shaken by this killing, not just in Washington. Back in June, of course, Minnesota State Representative Melissa Hortman and her husband Mark were shot and killed.

Minnesota Senator Amy Klobuchar was a friend of Melissa Hortman. She joins me now. Senator, I'm wondering what is going through your mind tonight --

SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR (D), MINNESOTA: Hey, Anderson.

COOPER: -- as this manhunt continues for this assassin or?

KLOBUCHAR: Well, it's sobering to see the hearse, to think about someone's life taken that young, someone who had many, many friends and a family that's been left behind. And I think one of the things as these days go by and we try to bring people together, Minnesota suffered not only the shooting of my friend Melissa, her husband Mark at the hands of someone who -- by the way, when you look at his ramblings, I wouldn't even call them a manifesto.

He's now in prison awaiting trial. He was a kind of all-purpose hater. He hated, obviously, Democratic lawmakers were on his list. Planned Parenthood was on his list, but so were businesses and law firms and other people. And then you look at the recent shooting we had of those little children.

And while that wasn't a political assassination in the Catholic Church, Annunciation Church, there was also a manifesto left there where the FBI has rightly said that you could not pinpoint that man's ideology or that woman's ideology because there was so much hate in that shooter's manifesto.

[20:50:08]

That included things against President, President Trump, included things against Hispanics, included things against blacks, included things against anyone you could imagine, Catholics, Jews, Muslims. So I think when you look at this hate that is online, that is in our society, it is unbelievably across the board.

COOPER: Do you think -- I mean, this assassination, you know, will change outdoor political events in this country? I mean, would you speak at an outdoor rally this weekend if there weren't metal detectors and, you know, police on rooftops?

KLOBUCHAR: I think you've got to look at each situation. Oftentimes, we go to events that aren't as publicized as the one you saw in Utah, and I believe those will still most likely go on, political events. But some of these very big planned events, they're just going to have to do much bigger security sweeps on both sides of the aisle.

Everyone should want that. I know we've seen number -- members of Congress, the threats against members of Congress, go from 1,000 to 9,000 in one year, and this is before all of this happened. We've seen the attempted assassination on Donald Trump.

And so, as we await and stand by our law enforcement as they go on this manhunt for this madman, we do have to remember not just what happened here, which was horrific, but that this is going on in other places. And it is time for people to, yes, engage in civil dialogue, as your last guest just talked about, but it's also time to look at what's online and what the triggers are for these people, and in some cases, how they got the guns, should they have gotten the guns.

But in other cases, what are they reading, and why is that stuff all on the platforms, and why is it not a trigger for us to realize that these people are very, very dangerous?

COOPER: Senator Klobuchar, I appreciate your time tonight. Thank you.

KLOBUCHAR: It's great to be on. Thank you.

COOPER: Yes.

We're going to take a short break. A look back coming up at the 1981 assassination attempt on President Ronald Reagan. I'm going to speak to his daughter, Patty Davis, about where we are now.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:55:26]

COOPER: You're looking at live pictures, images of Funeral Chapel in Phoenix tonight. The casket of Charlie Kirk inside. A reminder that the body politic needs healing in the wake of televised violence seen by millions and not for the first time.

It was March 30th, 1981, when President Ronald Reagan was just months into his first term and a would-be assassin shot him outside the Hilton Hotel in Washington, D.C. A bullet narrowly missed Reagan's heart, lodged in his lung. He was rushed to the hospital for surgery and thankfully survived. 12 days later, he was released from that hospital and a grateful nation breathed a sigh of relief.

President Reagan's daughter, Patty Davis, has written and spoken eloquently about the effects of political violence, and she joins me now. Patty, I'm wondering what went through your mind when you heard about Charlie Kirk's assassination?

PATTY DAVIS, DAUGHTER OF FORMER PRES. RONALD REAGAN: You know, it's become so familiar now. I guess my first thought was like, again, we're here again. And then in the aftermath of it, you know, every time this happens, I think back to 1981 and I think about the mood of the country when this happened was there was a suspension of politics and rancor.

And I felt it really viscerally that this country kind of folded itself around us and remembered how to be compassionate and remembered humanity over politics. And we don't have that anymore. And I'm sorry for Charlie Kirk's family that they don't have that because it mattered.

You know, I mean, even many days later when I came back from D.C. and I was back here in Los Angeles, if I went to the store or I walked my dog or something, you know, people would stop me and I don't know what their politics were. I don't know if they agreed with my father or not, but they were shocked and they were sorry and they were concerned and they were very sincere about it. And like I said, it mattered.

COOPER: Well, especially, I mean, everybody will lose somebody in their life at some point in their life and you have experienced grief in many forms. And yet, you know, if you -- I mean, Charlie Kirk has a one-year-old and a three-year-old. It's -- you know, if you can't relate to somebody as a father, it's, you know, where are we as a country?

DAVIS: Well, I mean, that's really the issue, you know? You -- it wasn't very long after this happened that people on the House floor were yelling at each other. I was watching CNN. I heard Elizabeth Warren criticizing President Trump's language. Then President Trump addressed the country and was angry and accusatory.

And there was -- there wasn't that cloak of humanity and compassion that I experienced in '81. I mean, we have strayed so far from that. And, you know, one of the things that I find not helpful is when elected officials go on air and say, well, this is not who we are. This is not what America is about.

Really? Because from where I sit, this is exactly who we are right now. And I don't know how we change that or how we fix that unless you look at it straight on and take ownership of that and admit, yes, this is who we are right now. What are we going to do about it?

I don't know what to do about it. I don't know how to fix it. But I do know that you can't fix anything unless you stand, you know, toe to toe with what the problem is and look at it.

COOPER: Well, I certainly hope, you know, that Charlie Kirk's family and friends, but his wife and -- feels that there are many, many people out there who have been deeply affected by this and moved by this, even people who may not have been fans of Charlie Kirk, but who would certainly want them to feel the love and the concern over their sorrow and their loss.

DAVIS: I'm sure that they do. But there is that other element, too. And now because of social media, which obviously did not exist in '81, I'm sure they hear about that, too.

COOPER: Yes.

DAVIS: You know?

COOPER: Yes.

DAVIS: It's inescapable.

COOPER: Yes. Well, Patty Davis, thank you so much. It's really a pleasure to talk to you.

DAVIS: Thank you for having me. Thanks.

COOPER: There's going to be a press conference at 9:30 p.m. just about 30 minutes from now that obviously CNN will bring you live. That's it for us. We'll see you tomorrow night.

The news continues. The Source with Kaitlan Collins starts now.