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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Trump Accuses U.N. Of Funding "Uncontrolled Migration"; Trump Says Ukraine, With E.U. Support Is In Position To Fight And Win All Of Ukraine Back In Its Original Form; Tylenol, Vaccines, Autism And The President; "Jimmy Kimmel Live!" Set To Tape New Episode This Hour; Secret Service Uncovers 300 Servers While Tracing Swatting Threats; Trump & Epstein Statues On National Mall. Aired 8-9p ET
Aired September 23, 2025 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
HARRY ENTEN, CNN CHIEF DATA ANALYST: Look at this, it's about 2.8 miles per hour. How about walking? If you're walking, the average person can go 3.3 miles per hour. So, you know what, Emmanuel Macron was not just getting his heart beat up and doing some good exercise. He was, in fact, going faster than he would be by car.
KATE BOLDUAN, CNN HOST: This is one of those moments when my father living in Indiana just starts laughing at us. He's like, what are you guys doing, honestly? It's great to see you, Harry.
ENTEN: Nice to see you.
BOLDUAN: Thank you. Thank you all so much for joining us. I'm Kate Bolduan. AC360 starts now.
[20:00:32]
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, "ANDERSON COOPER: 360": Tonight on 360, President Trump at the U.N. the speech that seemed to stun the gathering of world leaders and his remarks about Ukraine which may or may not mean he's rethinking the war there.
Also tonight, new fallout from the President's remarks on autism and Tylenol. And Dr. Oz, his own top health official, now seems to be walking back his comments from yesterday.
And later, Jimmy Kimmel goes back on air, but far fewer stations are broadcasting him.
Good evening, thanks for joining us. We begin tonight with the President's address, the U.N. general assembly, and something a senior European diplomat said to POLITICO about it. None of this is amusing anymore. This official said, adding nor do the other leaders still believe they can manage Trump. And we should say those words were spoken not after, but before the President has made his remarks, which lasted about 50 minutes or so.
Afterwards, and remarks in a social media post, he seems to have a change of heart or position on the war in Ukraine whether that's real or not is not clear. We'll get to exactly what he said on that. But I want to play you some of the key moments from the President's address today. It began with what he said was a teleprompter malfunction.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: And I don't mind making this speech without a teleprompter, because the teleprompter is not working. I feel very happy to be up here with you, nevertheless. And that way you speak more from the heart. I can only say that whoever is operating this teleprompter is in big trouble.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Well, from there, he spent the next several minutes recounting his second term accomplishments as he sees them, including deporting migrants to third party countries like El Salvador.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Our message is very simple, if you come illegally into the United States, you're going to jail or you're going back to where you came from, or perhaps even further than that. You know what that means.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: He thanked El Salvador, then added, on the world stage, America is respected again, like it's never been respected before. He said the country was a laughingstock, his words before he took office, restated his claim, he's ended seven wars. None of it, he said, with the U.N.'s help. And then he got laughs for this adding to his teleprompter complaint from several moments before.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: All I got from the United Nations was an escalator that, on the way up, stopped right in the middle. If the First Lady wasn't in great shape, she would have fallen. But she's in great shape. We're both in good shape, we both stood and then a teleprompter that didn't work. These are the two things I got from the United Nations. A bad escalator and a bad teleprompter. Thank you very much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: In case you're wondering, this is the escalator moment he was referring to, which happened as he and the First Lady were on their way into the assembly. They ended up walking. The White House is calling for an immediate investigation.
Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt saying on social media, "If someone at the U.N. intentionally stopped the escalators, the President and First Lady were stepping on. They need to be fired and investigated immediately." It was not at all that the President said, though, about the facilities or himself.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Many years ago, a very successful real estate developer in New York known as Donald J. Trump. I bid on the renovation and rebuilding of this very United Nations Complex. I remember it so well. I said at the time that I would do it for $500 million, rebuilding everything, it would be beautiful.
I used to talk about, I'm going to give you marble floors, they're going to give you terrazzo. I'm going to give you the best of everything. You're going to have mahogany walls, they're going to give you plastic. But they decided to go in another direction, which was much more expensive at the time and which actually produced a far inferior product.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: In case you're wondering, terrazzo is a composite flooring material made from chips or marble or glass or granite even. It's mixed into a cement or epoxy, and then its ground down and polished, it's very durable, but it's no marble.
The President continued on with that story but you get the point. This would not be the last time he called out what he sees as failures by the U.N.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Not only is the U.N. not solving the problems, it should, too often, it's actually creating new problems for us to solve. The best example is the number one political issue of our time, the crisis of uncontrolled migration, it's uncontrolled.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[20:05:15]
COOPER: In addition to confronting the U.N., he also took aim at London its mayor, who's Muslim.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: And I have to say, I look at London, where you have a terrible mayor, terrible, terrible mayor, and it's been so changed, so changed. Now, they want to go to Sharia law but you're in a different country. You can't do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: For the record, it's not true London wants to go to Sharia law. He also had this and more to say about climate change.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: It's the greatest con job ever perpetrated on the world, in my opinion. Climate change, no matter what happens, you're involved in that. No more global warming. No more global cooling, all of these predictions made by the United Nations and many others, often for bad reasons, were wrong. They were made by stupid people that have cost their country's fortunes and given those same countries no chance for success.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: He called sources of renewable energy, in his words, a joke, said China uses wind power at home. He advocated greater use of oil and coal, telling countries, "If you don't get away from this green scam, your country is going to fail." Then in the very next breath, he added, this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I'm really good at predicting things, you know, they actually said during the campaign that a hat, the best-selling hat, "Trump was right about everything." And I don't say that in a braggadocious way, but it's true.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: The President also talked about, again, about the Nobel Peace Prize, saying everyone says he should get it. And though he said he loves Europe and the people of Europe, this is the remark about the continent which seems to have drawn a headline.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: When your prisons are filled with so-called asylum seekers who repay kindness and that's what they did. They repaid kindness with crime. It's time to end the failed experiment of open borders, you have to end it now. I can tell you. I'm really good at this stuff. Your countries are going to hell.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Also making headlines, the President did lay out a positive vision for international cooperation with the U.N.'s help on biological weapons.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: To prevent potential disasters, I'm announcing today that my administration will lead an international effort to enforce biological weapons convention, which is going to be meeting with the top leaders of the world by pioneering an A.I. verification system that everyone can trust. Hopefully, the U.N. can play a constructive role, and it will also go and be one of the early projects under A.I. let's see how good it is, because a lot of people are saying it could be one of the great things ever, but it also can be dangerous, but it can be put to tremendous use and tremendous good. And this would be an example of that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And finally, there appeared to be a shift in tone about Russia to some degree. He said its war in Ukraine is making Moscow, in his words, look bad. Then at a meeting afterwards with Ukraine's President Zelenskyy, listen to his answer to this question about recent Russian incursions into NATO airspace.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Mr. President, do you think that NATO countries should shoot down Russian aircraft if they enter their airspace?
TRUMP: Yes, I do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: And regarding the war itself, here's what the President posted this afternoon on social media.
"After getting to know and fully understand the Ukraine-Russia military and economic situation, and after seeing the economic trouble it is causing Russia, I think Ukraine, with the support of the European Union is in a position to fight and win all of Ukraine back in its original form."
He also pledged to continue supplying weapons to NATO, to, "do what they want with."
Joining me now for more on all of this is CNN chief political analyst and former senior adviser to President Obama, David Axelrod; former Trump White House communications director and founder of Skybridge Capital, Anthony Scaramucci; and CNN senior political commentator and former trump campaign adviser, David Urban.
So, David Axelrod, how do you think this speech to the U.N. is going to be received by delegates? What did you make of it?
DAVID AXELROD, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, I don't think well, Anderson, I don't think that was his goal. I don't think he came there to engender goodwill with anyone in the room. I think he was speaking to his base, here in the U.S., his MAGA base. And to some degree, he was he was speaking to a base, overseas. He was speaking to Nigel Farage's base in Britain and to Marine Le Pen's base in France and Alice Weigel's base in Germany -- these far right leaders, because that is their message that that migration is killing their countries. It is an anti-green message and he was giving it amplification.
So, I think that the people who received his message well were not the people in the room. The odd thing about the message was his big -- the two things he stressed the most were this issue of climate change being a hoax and mass migration being the death knell for countries. And there's actually a relationship between the two. I mean, one of the main causes of mass migration is climate change, which isn't a hoax.
And so, there are sort of internal contradictions there, but there's no doubt that there's an audience for this message. It certainly wasn't in that room.
COOPER: David Urban.
[20:10:40] DAVID URBAN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes, listen, I think
the most important messaging of the day, which is should overshadow everything else the President did, is about seven minutes of tape in that Zelenskyy meeting. You know, if we had four, seven minutes to run it, I would yield my time and just listen to President Trump talk about how he thinks that the war now is winnable for Ukraine, that Ukrainians can, you know, force the Russians out of Crimea and the Donbas. And it was very incredibly encouraging, proof to how much that wasn't speaking to his base.
If you look at Steve Bannon and other conservative media, they're losing their mind about what Trump said. It is a complete 180 from where he's been?
COOPER: Do you think it's a real shift?
URBAN: I believe its 100 percent real shift. I do believe that he is he is listened to President Zelenskyy on so many occasions, and other world leaders there. I do believe that the U.N. serves a great function in that. It gets our President, other folks together in one meeting space to do a lot of pull asides, a lot of one off meetings where you get to hear firsthand again from these key world leaders. And I think they really persuaded him.
And listen, I don't ever underestimate the power of Melania Trump. She is very -- she's been very forceful in her, you know, in her opinions about the Russians. And she's meeting with the Ukrainian First Lady there. I believe that she has a big impact and I believe the President's eyes are open on this. And the White House retweeted his true statement. He put it out, it's being pushed out by all the President's closest advisors. So, that's not by accident. That's by design, as Anthony Scaramucci, the former White House Press Secretary, will tell you.
COOPER: Well, Anthony, let me ask you, do you do you think it is an actual change in, you know, I mean, certainly a change in tone, isn't a change in position because he said, you know, the U.S. will continue, getting weapons to NATO. Essentially, we're selling weapons to NATO under this administration.
ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, FORMER TRUMP WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Well, listen, I think it is a big change, but I think one of the problems is I'm going to sort of split the baby between the two Davids. When you're coming and giving a speech like that and you're using this bellicosity of rhetoric you're not engendering the type of comity that you need in Europe to help defeat Vladimir Putin.
And David Urban knows this for sure, the President is getting intelligence reports from his people that Russia has been severely damaged economically and severely damaged in the war and there's a chance here to really repel Russia. And he doesn't want to be on the losing side of anything. And so, trust me, there's some inkling there.
So he's telling you Putin's in a lot more trouble than we've been suggesting in the media prior to the President's remarks. So, synthesizing everything, I just wish the President had gotten up today and said, okay, were in it together. There's 5.7 billion people living in authoritarian regimes around the world, but we're the West and we're here to promote liberal democracies and to reject this forcible power in this European nation.
COOPER: Yes, I mean, David Axelrod --
URBAN: That's why, Anthony, that's why Anthony lasted 11 days --
COOPER: But David Axelrod, I mean, if this is a change in administration policy and I mean to Anthony's point, you know, this is kind of the speech to have gotten up and said, you know, we're Team NATO. We are going forward, you know, they should shoot down aircraft. They should, you know, Were behind Ukraine.
AXELROD: Sure, yes, yes, and that's not what he did. Listen, I really hope that he has made a change in position because I think this is a -- this is a place where the United States has to show leadership. But, you know, we've heard so many twists and turns in his positioning over the last nine months on this war. You know, it's funny he said in his speech about the U.N., in his litany of complaints about the U.N., he said, all they do is write an empty letter and empty letters don't end wars.
How many times have we heard this President in the last several months say, if they don't -- if Russia doesn't act in two weeks to pull back, we're going to apply these sanctions. How many times have we heard that? And so this, you know, he's the one who's been sending empty letters. So, I hope that he has changed his position. I really -- I really, really fervently hope that. But experience is a harsh teacher here -- not to get your hopes too high.
COOPER: David Urban, I mean, it was just like a couple of weeks ago. He was talking about land swaps.
[20:15:22]
URBAN: Yes, listen, Anderson, that's why I think it's so significant, I really do. As Anthony said, I believe that he heard firsthand from Zelenskyy some really influential intelligence as well as from newly confirmed Ambassador Waltz at the U.N. and others. I know he speaks to Matt Whitaker and NATO, our NATO ambassador and others in Europe, and I know the President is hearing this Intel, which is showing that war is shifting and I do believe that he wants to see this come to conclusion, as everybody does.
No one wants to keep seeing the Ukrainian Countryside and the Cities being bombed every night by the Russians. And so, I hope that the President steps up and does what he says he's going to do. But at the same time, look, I do believe that our NATO allies, if you know Europeans, if the Germans and the Turks and others keep buying natural gas and funding the Russians, I think it's, you know, cut your nose off to spite your face. Everybody needs to tighten their belt and move forward here.
COOPER: Anthony, do you think in a couple of days we're going to see continued on this language used? SCARAMUCCI: I actually do because the President is a momentum trader
not to use a Wall Street phrase, but he's caught the change in momentum and he doesn't want to be on the wrong side of this.
COOPER: Anthony Scaramucci, David Axelrod, David Urban, thank you.
Coming up next, Dr. Oz, today, walking back, the President's repeated statements yesterday that pregnant women should not take Tylenol. And we look into the President's statement about virtually no autism in Cuba, putting that claim to the test with a live report from Havana.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: There's a rumor, and I don't know if it's so or not, that Cuba, they don't have Tylenol because they don't have the money to for Tylenol. And they have virtually no autism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Later, how the Secret Service broke up a vast network. This is really disturbing, just outside New York of electronic equipment capable, they say, of shutting down cell phone communications and emergency services citywide.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:21:34]
COOPER: Keeping them honest, tonight, one of the administration's own top health officials, former T.V. Dr. Oz, is now walking back, remarks the President made to pregnant women just yesterday about not taking Tylenol.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I just want to say -- I want to say it like it is, don't take Tylenol. Don't take it. If you just can't -- I mean, it's -- fight like hell not to take it.
But with Tylenol, don't take it, don't take it. And if you can't live, if your fever is so bad, you have to take one because there's no alternative to that. And I just say it again, don't take Tylenol. Don't take it and don't give it to your child after your child is born. So, ideally you don't take it at all. But if you have to -- if you can't tough it out, or if there's a problem, you're going to end up doing it. But with Tylenol, don't take it, don't take it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: That's the President yesterday at his press conference unveiling new warnings by health officials about Tylenol and autism.
Here's how Arthur Caplan of the Division of Medical Ethics at NYU's Grossman School of Medicine, characterized that event in a statement that says, in part, "The announcement on autism was the saddest display of a lack of evidence, rumors, recycling old myths, lousy advice, outright lies, and dangerous advice I've ever witnessed by anyone in authority in the world claiming to know anything about science."
As you just saw, though, the President virtually sold his Tylenol warning as gospel again and again. Today, though, here's how Dr. Oz put it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. MEHMET OZ, ADMINISTRATOR FOR THE CENTERS FOR MEDICARE & MEDICAID SERVICES: So the message is -- don't -- is not never take Tylenol. It's take Tylenol judiciously take it by talking with your doctor. Make sure there's an important reason to take it. Don't take it willy- nilly because you think it's so safe you couldn't possibly cause a problem because those assumptions appear to be erroneous.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Again, the President offered no such qualifications, nor did he limit himself to known facts.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: There's a rumor, and I don't know if it's so or not, that Cuba, they don't have Tylenol because they don't have the money to for Tylenol, and they have virtually no autism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: As we'll hear from CNN's Patrick Oppmann in Havana shortly, Cuba does, in fact, have a significant number of people living with autism. But it wasn't just Cuba. The President cited as evidence, nor was it just Tylenol he talked about. The President also brought in vaccines and their frequency and dosages, none of which is tied to autism according to the best scientific consensus.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: But you have certain groups, the Amish, as an example, they have essentially no autism. The MMR, I think, should be taken separately. This is based on what I feel the mumps, measles, and the three should be taken separately, aceta -- well, let's see how we say that, acetaminophen -- is that okay -- which is basically commonly known as Tylenol during pregnancy can be associated with a very increased risk of autism. Don't take it. Don't take it. There's no downside in not taking it. Don't give Tylenol to the baby when the baby is born. They throw it at you. Here, throw it -- give him a couple of Tylenol. They give him a shot, they give him a vaccine.
And every time they give him a vaccine, they're throwing Tylenol. You have a little child, a little fragile child, and you get a vat of 80 different vaccines, I guess, 80 different blends and they pump it in. There's no downside to doing other than a mother will have to as I say, tough it out a little bit. There's no downside to doing this.
(END VIDEO CLIP) [20:25:27]
COOPER: As our doctor, Sanjay Gupta, and vaccine researcher, Dr. Peter Hotez said last night in the broadcast, there actually are downsides to slowing down vaccination and not taking Tylenol in pregnancy if you have a fever. And as the President suggesting that both are the reason for what he says is a rise in autism from one in 20,000 18 years ago, he says, to one in 12 today, Dr. Hotez, who has a daughter with autism, gave a simpler explanation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. PETER HOTEZ, CO-DIRECTOR OF THE CENTER FOR VACCINE DEVELOPMENT AT TEXAS CHILDREN'S HOSPITAL: And it doesn't mean that there's no environmental effects. But I think most of the so-called rise in autism is due to how we've dramatically changed our diagnostic criteria over the years. We no longer call it autism, we call it autism spectrum disorder. And we've been so much more inclusive. And by the way, it's about to go up again because we're getting better at diagnosing autism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: CNN's Patrick Oppmann joins us now from Havana, Cuba. So, Patrick, first of all, this rumor that the President cited yesterday that Cuba has virtually no autism because they don't have Tylenol, because they can't afford Tylenol. What have you found?
PATRICK OPPMANN, CNN HAVANA BUREAU CHIEF: Well, neither of those statements are true. Actually, autism, like anywhere else, the world is fairly common here. It's not mysterious, people talk about it. The government talks about it they have campaigns about it. They have clinics just set aside for children, people with autism. It's not at all unusual to hear about people in your neighborhood with autism.
Cuba has a lower official rate, but that, according to the Cuban government's own scientists, is just a factor of the fact that it's, underreported and undiagnosed or limitations to the health care system here. But certainly the government has never claimed they don't have autism, they've said the exact opposite.
And then the Cuban government has long produced its own version of Tylenol, a drug called paracetamol, and that has acetaminophen in it. And there are shortages of that drug in recent years, so not going back farther than a couple of years ago. And it's still fairly easy to find and also, so many Cuban-Americans come here, they tend to bring Tylenol.
When I travel a lot, I always bring back a couple bottles with me. So this idea that were in some kind of this magical bubble where there's no Tylenol and there's no autism, both of those are just incorrect and left Cubans scratching their heads today asking me what this was all about.
You know, I talked to my kids' physician today, and he said, it just sounds like an urban legend. We have clinics, hundreds of physicians set aside in a country with severe shortages for people with autism. And have the President coming out and talking about this, doesn't help our system either. But they're really surprised that this kind of urban legend is being used to set policy in the United States.
COOPER: All right. Patrick Oppmann from Havana, thank you very much.
As we mentioned during Yesterday's press conference, the President suggested there's no downside to avoiding Tylenol while pregnant other than a mother having to tough it out.
Joining me now is OB GYN at Stanford University School of Medicine professor, Dr. Jen Conti. Dr. Conti, what have you been hearing, first of all, from your patients about the Presidents recommendation to avoid Tylenol while pregnant and just tough it you if you can.
DR. JEN CONTI, OBGYN, STANFORD UNIVERSITY SCHOOL OF MEDICINE: Thank you, Anderson, yes, we have been hearing a lot from patients in this last couple of days. It's a very scary and confusing bit of messaging. I mean, pregnancy is such a vulnerable time already and everyone wants to do their best. But I want to be very clear. Acetaminophen is safe in pregnancy. We have decades of research looking into the safe use of acetaminophen during all trimesters of pregnancy, and not one reputable study has linked any kind of neurodevelopmental disorders with children -- from mothers who've used acetaminophen. So it's just -- it is ludicrous and it's scaring many people.
COOPER: And would it be harmful for pregnant women to avoid Tylenol if they have a fever or pain during pregnancy? I mean, what is the potential impact? He's saying there's no downside.
CONTI: I mean, I love watching the President play doctor. It's, you know, comedic relief at the very least. It's absolutely not true. If you have a high fever in early pregnancy especially, we know that that's linked with heart and spinal defects in the fetus. So, not treating it is not an option -- it's not a viable option. And the thing to remember too is that Tylenol is essentially the only safe option people have.
So, you know, can you use ibuprofen or Motrin? No, that's been linked with fetal defects. And I want to assume he's not suggesting that every pregnant person in pain or with a fever should be using narcotics. This nation has a narcotics problem.
COOPER: Dr. Jen Conti, appreciate your time. Thank you very much.
Up next, breaking news. Jimmy Kimmel, just moments away from taking the stage once again in Los Angeles for the taping of his late night talk show. We're live outside his studio.
Also ahead, the Secret Service uncovering a vast electronic network with the ability to cripple cell phone service.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MATT MCCOOL, SPECIAL AGENT IN CHARGE, SECRET SERVICE NEW YORK FIELD OFFICE: This network is capable of sending 30 million text messages in one minute, so theoretically, they could text message anonymously and encrypted with whatever they want to the entire country in 12 minutes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[20:30:37]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:35:16]
COOPER: Just moments from now in Los Angeles, Jimmy Kimmel is expected to resume taping his late-night talk show. As you know, Disney announced they were suspending Kimmel indefinitely last week after comments he made following the assassination of Charlie Kirk.
Yesterday, however, they announced he was returning to the air tonight. Sinclair and Nexstar, which owns some 20 percent or so of ABC-affiliated TV stations, say they'll continue to preempt Kimmel indefinitely.
Today, Kimmel posted on Instagram a photo of himself and the late Norman Lear with the caption, "Missing this guy today." Lear, in case you don't know, produced many landmark TV shows which were humorous, but also addressed incredibly difficult, controversial issues. Shows like "All in the Family," "Maud," and "The Jeffersons." Lear was a fierce defender of free speech.
Jimmy Kimmel is getting a big welcome back from his fellow late night hosts.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our long, national, late nightmare is over. Because Disney announced that "Jimmy Kimmel Live!" will return to air. Once more, I am the only martyr in late nights.
(APPLAUSE & CHEERING)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That campaign that you all launched, pretending that you were going to cancel Hulu --
(LAUGHTER)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- while secretly racing through four seasons of "Only Murders in the Building," that really worked.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
COOPER: CNN's Stephanie Elam is outside Hollywood's El Capitan Theater, where the show is taped. So what are viewers expecting tonight, or can they expect?
STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, what we understand, Anderson, is that people expect to see some mention of this from Jimmy Kimmel in his monologue. They are in taping the show right now. We saw people out here supporting Jimmy Kimmel earlier today.
And we were also able to catch up with some of the audience members as they were going in. Take a listen to what they told us.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
NAINA GREWAL, AUDIENCE MEMBER: I'm so excited to see Jimmy back in action. I wonder if he's going to be really excited and saying whatever he wants, or if he's going to be filtered. I'm just hoping to hear the truth from Jimmy's mouth, whatever that truth is.
ALEXANDER HERRERA, AUDIENCE MEMBER: We're all human at the end of the day, and nobody should be canceled for expressing their views.
DOMINIC LERMA, AUDIENCE MEMBER: As a comic, freedom of speech is like our biggest outlet, you know? And as an artist, we shouldn't be silenced for speaking our truth. Even if we're making fun of things that people are too sensitive to talk about, that's our job.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
ELAM: And earlier today while we were out here on Hollywood Boulevard, we caught up with one man from Northern California and a woman from Tennessee, both of them saying that they believe in free speech and so they were welcoming Jimmy Kimmel back to the airwaves. Anderson?
COOPER: All right. Stephanie, thanks very much.
Joining me now for more on Kimmel's return, CNN Media Analyst Sara Fischer. She's also a Senior Media Reporter for Axios, Los Angeles Times TV and Media Reporter Stephen Battaglio and CNN Senior Political Commentator Ana Navarro who is also a co-host of ABC's "The View" program, the FCC Chairman Brendan Carr suggested could be his next target.
Stephen, why do you think it was ABC/Disney finally made this decision?
STEPHEN BATTAGLIO, THE LOS ANGELES TIMES: Clearly, they were talking about this for a long time, basically a conversation about whether we really still want to be in the Jimmy Kimmel business altogether. And it evolved and -- but as we talked about last night, it became a free -- it became a point of taking a stand on the First Amendment.
And I think that Disney -- and I think Bob Iger wanted to be on the right side of that. And that brought -- and that brings us to today. Now we'll see if he says anything that will satisfy the two station groups that are not going to carry the program. That's the big question.
COOPER: I mean, Ana, it's incomprehensible that he won't be talking about this in some way.
BATTAGLIO: I think he'll approach it in a humorous fashion. I don't think he'll do anything that will be seen as capitulation.
COOPER: Yes. Ana, what do you think, though?
ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Look, I think Jimmy Kimmel has to be Jimmy Kimmel. Anybody that's on TV that's been on TV for a long time knows that authenticity matters. People who've been on TV for a long time, like you, know that your viewers, your loyal viewers, know who you are. And you have got to be true to that person and be respectful of those viewers.
To tell you the truth, I am delighted that this seems to be moving forward and resolving. I hope that the country does the same, that it somehow moves forward. I think this is very important, Anderson, because as you know better than anybody, Jimmy Kimmel's going to be all right.
Jimmy Kimmel's not going to have to worry about paying his mortgage or his kids' college probably for the rest of his life. But each of these shows has hundreds and hundreds of families, like this show does, like "The View" does, over 200 families that depend on those paychecks. And these are industry workers who are just now recovering from the financial disaster that was COVID for many in the media industry.
COOPER: And the L.A. fires.
NAVARRO: And the --
BATTAGLIO: The writer's strike as well.
NAVARRO: -- and the writer's strike.
BATTAGLIO: Yes.
[20:40:09]
NAVARRO: So this is really important. I'm happy for those people, for the family of the Jimmy Kimmel, and I'm happy for America that we have gotten a reminder about the importance and significance of the First Amendment and freedom of speech. It's not just words on a paper. It's real, and we're living it.
COOPER: Sara, you've done a lot of reporting around this story. What more do you know about why Disney ultimately made the decision to put Kimmel back?
SARA FISCHER, CNN MEDIA ANALYST: I think one of the reasons, Anderson, is because the climate around how Conservatives and Republicans were talking about this changed drastically in the past week. When Chairman Carr first put pressure on Disney and the affiliates to do something about Kimmel, it sort of felt like Disney was being isolated.
And what happened in the following days was very interesting. You had Senator Rand Paul, you had Senator Ted Cruz all coming out against Carr, saying you're abusing, essentially, your power in office, that this is a violation of free speech. I think that gave Disney confidence that if they were to bring Kimmel back, they could do it without totally isolating themselves for Conservatives.
And for Disney, remember what these past few years have been like. You had the Ron DeSantis fight over the Don't Say Gay bill. Now you have this. The one thing they want to make sure that they don't do is get in Donald Trump's crosshairs.
Remember, they still have a bunch of their own deals pending. The ESPN-NFL deals is under DOJ review. ESPN's deal with a smaller sports TV provider, Fubo, is under DOJ review. So ABC has to be really careful not to get in those crosshairs. And I think they feel much more confident now than they did a week ago.
COOPER: Stephen, you mentioned last night something which I hadn't realized, that the affiliate agreements, which I'm always confused about what exactly affiliates are, but the affiliate agreements dictate how many programs they can decide not to run.
BATTAGLIO: When you decide to be an ABC affiliate, you get -- you sign an agreement, a contract, stipulating that you are going to run all of their programming. You can make some exceptions, but just to a certain threshold. Once you get beyond that threshold, you could be in breach of the agreement.
The test will now be, will Disney push that issue? Will they go to Nexstar and say, you know what? You're not carrying the show. You're over the number of hours that you can preempt. We're going to take our affiliation and to another station in Market A, B, or C, or wherever these stations are.
Will they push it that far over this? Not sure. We'll see how much Disney really cares about the TV station business, because this is a test.
COOPER: I want to play -- and Ana, this is for you -- I want to play something that the FCC Chairman Brendan Carr said last week on Scott Jennings' podcast.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
BRENDAN CARR, FCC CHAIRMAN: And I think it's worthwhile to have the FCC look into whether "The View" and some of these other programs that you have still qualify as bona fide news programs and therefore exempt from the equal opportunity regime that Congress has put in place."
(END VIDEOCLIP)
COOPER: I'm just, personally, what was that like?
NAVARRO: Look, I'm not going to respond to that. That's not my job. It's above my pay grade. All I can tell you is that I think for 29 seasons now, we go out there and we give the country our opinion on a variety of subjects. Sometimes there's been great disagreement amongst ourselves.
For me, Anderson, this is incredibly personal. And last week I saw you had a guest on who I think was a defector from the Soviet Union. I fled Nicaragua, like Ted Cruz's father fled Cuba. So I have lived under dictatorship. I've lived under Somoza, the right-wing dictator. I've lived under Ortega, left-wing dictator.
So when you talk to me about freedom of speech, I don't take it lightly, and I realize it's something we have to fight for and we have to defend, because it doesn't defend itself. And I think all the people that have made their opinions know on this issue are expressing freedom of speech.
I think -- you know, and I would say this, you know, we saw this weekend at the Charlie Kirk memorial, his widow, with incredible grace, incredible compassion, say that she forgave the killer of Charlie Kirk, of her husband, of the father of her two babies. That's an extraordinary moment.
And so to me, I look at that and I think to myself, if that woman can bring herself to have that level of compassion, can we not as a country move forward and show grace to a comedian who's leading to a joke you disagreed with? Can we not? If you are somebody that admired Charlie Kirk, can you not bring yourself to do what he did, which is defend freedom of speech?
[20:45:05]
I disagreed vehemently with many of the things that Charlie Kirk said, but that's not the point. The point is, he felt I had the right to say my opinion, and I feel -- I felt he had the right to say his opinion.
COOPER: Sara, just -- I mean, how critical is Jimmy Kimmel to Disney's portfolio? I mean, he does the Oscars, he does the, you know, who wants to be a millionaire?
FISCHER: He's very important to their portfolio. And you know how you know that, Anderson? Every year, every major network does a massive presentation in front of advertisers. It's the most critical week for every network. It's called the upfront.
And Jimmy Kimmel every year delivers the big closing monologue, the big roast. It goes viral. It's the most important part of Disney's entire presentation. And Jimmy Kimmel every single year delivers. And so, and I'm hearing what Ana is saying about how you have to have compassion for people. I think about the compassion that Disney executives should be having for Kimmel.
Kimmel has not always wanted to host the Oscars, but he has done it. He does these business side presentations for the network. He's been a loyal employee of this network for more than 10 years. So you would hope that he can deliver a monologue.
Maybe it gets some flack from consumers and that his employer is going to back him. I expect him to show a lot of grace to Disney tonight for everything that they have put him through for the past week. And yet he still agreed to return.
In fact, I almost thought that he was going to hire a lawyer, try to get paid out on his contract and bail. The fact that he's coming back is really significant.
COOPER: Yes. Thanks, everybody. Appreciate it.
Up next, uncovering a vast electronic network capable of doing catastrophic damage. We learned about that today. And statues of President Trump and Jeffrey Epstein holding hands appeared on the National Mall. Where they came from? That is coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:51:28]
COOPER: Tonight we're learning that an investigation into a phone swatting scheme has turned up something much more dangerous. The story from CNN's John Miller.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: 911, where is your emergency?
JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST (voice-over): More than a dozen swatting calls over a year, targeting key Trump administration officials, instilling fear and causing a drain on law enforcement resources, is what led to the Secret Service investigation that uncovered an electronic maze of burner phones, changing phone numbers and SIM cards, hidden in a series of rented locations outside New York City.
They were all empty, unoccupied, except for the servers.
MCCOOL: We found 300 SIM servers and 100,000 SIM cards. So, essentially, each one of those SIM cards represents a cell phone.
MLLER (voice-over): The servers could be commanded remotely to create massive amounts of phone traffic.
MCCOOL: This network is capable of sending 30 million text messages in one minute. So theoretically, they could text message anonymously and encrypted with whatever they want to to the entire country in 12 minutes.
MLLER (voice-over): The system had the capability to simultaneously launch a deluge of phone calls, more calls than could be blocked. Officials briefed on the investigation say these electronic safe houses were found in places like Armonk, New York, Greenwich, Connecticut, even New York City in Queens and across the river in New Jersey. Nine locations in total, essentially forming a circle around New York City's cellular network.
MCCOOL: It could disrupt the cell service in New York City. It can deny service.
MLLER: Toppling the communications network --
MCCOOL: Yes.
MLLER: -- in a city like New York --
MCCOOL: Yes.
MLLER: -- or any American city. MCCOOL: Right.
MLLER: -- is a disaster in its own right. But doing that in tandem with a different kind of attack, a terrorist attack, an active shooter, a bombing.
MCCOOL: Catastrophic. Right. And we can't understate that. They could cripple the cell network in conjunction with the terrorist attack, as you mentioned, or something else, and people would not be able to communicate. And I think that would be a really bad day for New York City.
MLLER (voice-over): To investigators, this appears to be built for far more than just a way to mask swatting calls based on who they discovered using it.
MCCOOL: Foreign governments and criminals located in the United States are using this network to run their organizations. That includes cartels, that includes human traffickers, that includes terrorists, are on this network.
MLLER (voice-over): The investigation into these abandoned servers now involves a number of other agencies, including Homeland Security Investigations, the Department of Justice and the Director of National Intelligence.
MILLER: What is to say that there isn't four of these in Chicago, five of these in L.A.? Are they all over the country?
MCCOOL: It would be unwise to think that there's not other networks across the country. If there are others in other cities, we're going to be finding them.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
MLLER (on-camera): Authorities still don't know who's behind this. One thing to bear in mind is this is not something that hasn't occurred to authorities in New York City. They have been to the IBM Practice Range, and they have fought off a number of simulated attacks on critical infrastructure. So, it is something that they are prepared for while this investigation continues.
COOPER: It's incredible. Just amazing.
John, thank you so much. John Miller.
[20:55:02]
Coming up, the statues of President Trump and Jeffrey Epstein showed up on the National Mall this morning. He was behind them, and how they get there? That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
COOPER: You're looking at the newest addition to the National Mall in Washington, D.C. Statues of President Trump and the late convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein holding hands. They appeared this morning, and an anonymous group called The Secret Handshake is claiming credit for them.
A plaque on the statue read in part, "In Honor of Friendship Month." Now, believe it or not, the National Park Service issued a permit for the sculptures that allowed them to remain there until 08: 00 p.m. this Sunday. According to The Washington Post, the permit application says the purpose of the statues is to, quote, "demonstrate freedom of speech and artistic expression using political imagery."
We'll see if it lasts that long.
The news continues. The Source with Kaitlan Collins starts now. See you tomorrow.
