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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees

Protests Erupt in Minneapolis, Police; Two Shot By Feds in Portland; DHS, Local Officials Have Conflicting Accounts of Deadly ICE Shooting; Minnesota officials say FBI Blocked them from ICE Shooting Probe; Neighbors Remember Woman Killed In ICE Shooting; Deadly Minneapolis ICE Shooting Follows Other Incidents Involving Federal Agents; MN Officials Says FBI Blocked Them From ICE Shooting Probe; Rock Legend Patti Smith On Love & Loss. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired January 08, 2026 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

REP. DON BACON (R-NE): We also want to be fair to the cop. So --

ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, well, I think, I think everyone should want the truth. Of course, the problem is there is so very, very little trust right now in this country.

Congressman Bacon, I appreciate your time and thank you very much.

BACON: Thank you.

BURNETT: All right, and earlier, when we said President Trump called the woman killed in Minneapolis a professional agitator, I want us to be clear, he was referring to what he called a woman screaming at the scene. The President has said that Renee Nicole Good "behaved horribly, violently, willfully and viciously ran over the ICE officer."

Thanks so much for joining us. AC 360 starts now.

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, "ANDERSON COOPER: 360": Good evening. Thanks for joining us. Two related and breaking stories tonight, demonstrations in Minneapolis and new video in the fatal shooting of a 37-year-old mom killed in her car by an ICE officer.

Just moments ago, we learned of another shooting in Portland, Oregon, two people wounded by a federal Border agent. CNN's Priscilla Alvarez joins us now with the latest on that.

So what more do we know?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, we just received a statement from the Department of Homeland Security over this incident that occurred in Portland, and they describe a little bit about what unfolded here. So let me read some of this statement to you.

They say that at 2:19 Pacific Time, U.S. Border Patrol agents were conducting a targeted vehicle stop in Portland. According to the statement, the target was a suspected Tren de Aragua gang member and involved in a recent shooting in Portland, there was also a passenger in the vehicle.

The statement goes on to say that when agents identified themselves to the vehicle occupants, the driver weaponized his vehicle and attempted to run over the law enforcement agents. I'm quoting here. It goes on to say that "... fearing for his life and safety, an agent fired a defensive shot, and the driver drove off with the passenger fleeing the scene."

Now, Anderson, I will tell you that prior to the statement, law enforcement sources had told CNN that it was a husband and wife that were in the vehicle. The husband was shot in the arm, the wife in the chest, and that the two were shot at one location and then drove away. They are now hospitalized, according to the Portland Police Bureau.

But of course, as you mentioned there at the top, all of this comes against the backdrop of what unfolded in Minneapolis this week, and what is the situation that is currently happening there now.

The Police Chief referenced the situation in Minneapolis, as did the mayor, who used this to call for an end to the immigration crackdown. Now, of course, it is still early stages of what happened here. We're still working to collect information.

The Department of Homeland Security is calling this an evolving situation, and they said that, "more information is forthcoming."

COOPER: All right, Priscilla Alvarez, thanks very much.

Now to Minneapolis, and as we said, new video tonight. This is some of it. It is grainy, difficult to see. It could provide -- it certainly provides another angle on what happened before a 37-year-old Minneapolis mom was shot and killed by an ICE officer shortly after dropping her six-year-old off at school.

Now it comes on what has been a tense day there with more federal agents surging to the city. Minnesota's Governor putting the state National Guard on standby to support local law enforcement if necessary.

These are the live images of a protest, a demonstration gathering in the streets there. This is what it looks like right now, downtown Minneapolis, demonstrators have also gathered at the shooting scene, which itself is just blocks away from where police killed George Floyd five-and-a-half years ago.

Now, earlier today, armed agents at a federal building near the airport pushed back protesters, deploying some kind of crowd repellent gas, and making at least one arrest after someone, according to CNN's Omar Jimenez, apparently threw a water bottle.

Throughout the day, the Trump administration has first doubled and then tripled down on its claim that the shooting was the result of an act of domestic terrorism and that the killing of Renee Good was, in the words of Vice President Vance today, a "tragedy of her own making."

He said that that was certainty, and said this as if it was an established fact.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J.D. VANCE (R), VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: The Department of Homeland Security is already investigating this. But the simple fact is, what you see is what you get in this case. You have a woman who is trying to obstruct a legitimate law enforcement operation. Nobody debates that. You have a woman who aimed her car at a law enforcement officer and pressed on the accelerator. Nobody debates that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Well, keeping him honest, people are debating that. Just to remind you, here it is slowed down. This is from one of the camera angles that we have. You see one officer walk over to the car. He told her, get the eff out of the vehicle, put his hand into the window. The car -- she backs up the car's reverse lights go on.

The officer pulls on the door handle with his right hand, eventually reaching inside the open window with his left. The other officer is now in front of her car, and her reverse lights go out when the car begins to move forward, the officer unholsters his weapon. He fires it once -- once it appears towards her windshield. Second time, what appears to be her open window, and then a third shot immediately afterwards, and the car goes careening down the street. The officer re-holsters his weapon.

[20:05:06]

Now take a look at it again. This shooting in real time from two different angles, which we've seen side by side.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

COOPER: I mentioned, CNN has obtained some new video. Again, it's grainy and distant, but it shows four full minutes leading up to the shooting, it shows Renee Good's maroon Honda Pilot entering from the right there. Then 20 seconds later, someone gets out on the passenger's side. We don't know who or why this person leaves the car.

We then see her turn and pull perpendicular across the street, seeming to block the way, but as you see here, leaving room for vehicles to pass by her on either side.

Finally, there is this new angle of the Federal officer who shot her. He arrives. Another federal SUV pulls up. As the ICE officer briefly goes back to his car, then he returns, and with another agent grabbing at her door, she starts to move forward. Again, it is hard to see from this angle, followed by three gunshots in quick succession.

Four minutes in all, from start to finish. But for all the video that may reveal, it says nothing about why Renee Good was where she was, or what she was doing there. And it's not all we don't know. Somehow the administration, without offering any evidence, seems terribly certain about who this woman is and what motivated her.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VANCE: What young mother shows up and decides they're going to throw their car in front of ICE officers who are enforcing legitimate law? You've got to be a little brainwashed to get to that point to where you're willing not just to protest, that's fine, not peacefully protest, but throw your vehicle in front of legitimate law enforcement officers and drive your car into them. To get to that point, you have to be, I think, radicalized in a very, very sad way.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: The Vice President also called her, "a deranged leftist" and a member of a "broader left wing network," though, when pressed for evidence, here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Who do you think is behind this broader left-wing network?

VANCE: Well, it's one of the things we're going to have to figure out.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: So he's not the only one who did not have an answer when pressed, so did the President. Reporters from "The New York Times" interviewed him yesterday and showed him or talked to him, confronted him on the disparity between what the shooting video showed and what the administration was claiming about the incident, including that the ICE officer had been run over.

The headline of "The Times" reads: Here's what Trump said on the ICE shooting when we pressed him. The reporters told the President the tapes were unclear. His aide brought a laptop over the Resolute Desk to play one of them, it did not say what he said it did that the ICE officer had been run over, and when confronted about it, the President did not address the discrepancy.

He's also not changed his version of the events. His top officials are echoing that approach, something Minnesota Governor Tim Walz underscored today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN): It's beyond me that apparently, from the federal government, from the Homeland Security Director herself, has already determined who this person was, what their motive was, and they hadn't even been taken out of the vehicle. This is -- we're not living in a normal world.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Joining me now is video forensic expert, Frank Piazza. He's previously been called upon as an expert witness in high profile trials in the Southern District of New York, including the recent trial of Sean Combs.

Also joining us, former Secret Service agent, Jonathan Wackrow, former federal prosecutor for the Southern District of New York, Elie Honig, former NYPD Deputy Commissioner of Intelligence and Counterterrorism, John Miller.

Frank, I want to start with you, because I know you've done your own analysis of two of the videos, starting with one that's filmed from further away but seems to show contact between the car and the officer.

According to your analysis, because there were questions last night of were the shots fired before? Were any shots fired before the officer made contact, or once the officer had made contact with the vehicle? I just want to play your -- you've enhanced a version of the video, which you slowed down, and I want to ask you about it afterwards. So let's look at this.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

COOPER: So from your experience, what does that show? What does that slowed down version tell you?

FRANK PIAZZA, FORENSIC DIGITAL EXPERT: Well, the slowed down version is showing me that when this the SUV pulls forward, they make contact with the agent in the street, and then immediately following that contact, you hear three gunshots follow.

[20:10:07]

COOPER: So there's -- according to you, you do not hear a shot before contact.

PIAZZA: I do not, not in this particular video, absolutely not.

COOPER: And, , let's just listen to this again.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

COOPER: And just from an -- I mean, how accurate can you be? It is grainy video. You know, in a courtroom, I assume you have to answer these sorts of questions. You know, this camera angle is from far away. How accurate? What certainty do you have?

PIAZZA: Well, I'm working again with this copy, this version of the video which was taken down from social media. So we know, when we work with social media files, there can be some errors or some syncing issues with audio and video.

This particular video seems fine, and there's enough error, even if there was an issue with it. But you know, just doing the frame by frame of watching the video, and then you are synced with the audio that is actually taking place, you can see clearly that the audio happens after the actual contact. COOPER: And on the other video, I know you enhanced the audio and say that you can hear the driver of the SUV, Renee Good, say to the approaching agents at one point, "go around." So I want to play your enhanced version of that video. And before we do, I just want to let viewers know you can hear profanity from people on the ground. You do not bleep any of that out in the version of the video. So let's just play your enhanced version and we'll talk about it.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

COOPER: So what do you hear in that?

PIAZZA: So I just want to start off with the visual first. I see the woman in the SUV waving her arm, as if she's waving cars to go past her and then --

COOPER: And a car does go past her on -- correct?

PIAZZA: Yes, right, there it goes, right there, and then the second truck pulls up, and prior to the agent saying, you know, get the eff out of the car, you can hear her say the words, "go around." I don't know what the full phrasing is. It could be, you know, please go around. Or you can just go around. It's hard sometimes, you know, certain words can get buried in the environment that's in the background.

But I do hear "go around." And again, I'm not here to say that it makes sense, because she's waving her arms, but it seems to be that she's conducting, you know, come around my car here. I don't know if she's saying let me go around or let them go around.

COOPER: How do you know the go around is from her and not one of the other you know, pedestrians who are filming this, or, you know, you hear later people yelling in the background?

PIAZZA: Yes, that's a great question. It is very difficult, because there seem to be a lot of people in the area, although we don't see, you know as many that might be there.

But you can -- her -- again with her arm and her waving the car around. It does disappear when she says, go around, but at that moment, it comes back, and you can see she's in the middle of her -- of what she's saying to the officer. It appears to me, I'm sure more analysis can either confirm that or not.

COOPER: I want to bring in our other guests.

John Miller, what stands out to you about, you know, the other -- the new video we've seen as you've looked at the older videos we have as well?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, it tells us some things, it raises some questions. So she's in that spot for between three and four minutes. It appears the person who gets out of the car is her wife, who is also the person who we hear yelling in the background of the video, who is also the person after the shooting is seen running towards where the car crashed.

But this video shows us that that second vehicle, now that's a law enforcement vehicle that backs in next to her, blocking the street, almost at the same angle. So what it suggests, and we don't know this, but what it suggests is, if she has been one of the cars following agents from location to location.

Is her position there to block them, or to be in the position to follow their caravan to the next location? And if that's the case, has that car been placed there to block her from following them again?

[20:15:10]

Officials said today that she had been following them throughout the day. We understand she dropped her kid at school around 8:00. The shooting happens at 10:37. That's not much of the day, but they say she'd been following them throughout the day.

When pressed for details on well, where had they encountered her and what had she done at those places? They said, you know, that's part of the investigation, and you know, we can't tell you yet. You know, you'll learn that later. So we still have a lot of gaps and a lot of things that we are just surmising through looking at new video.

COOPER: And Jonathan Wackrow, I mean, yesterday you had talked about you as a Secret Service agent had been in a similar position you chose not to fire in an incident in New York not related to this. And you also raised questions about the angle which the officer was firing, essentially firing toward the other officers, and also, John Miller, you mentioned, you know, DHS policy, which is not to fire into vehicles.

Jonathan, today, 24 hours later, what stands out to you?

JONATHAN WACKROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well what stands out --

COOPER: What questions remain for you?

WACKROW: Well, you know, what stands out to me is just the moment that we're in, Anderson, and what we're seeing, and we're witnessing this real time, is this structural gap that is emerging between public safety and how they're being operationalized.

And what I mean by that is, in essence, law enforcement works best when federal, state and local entities work in parallel and in coordination with each other, and let's take yesterday's event as an example. Two things could happen at the same time. You can have law enforcement protecting the public's right to free expression under the First Amendment, and protect law enforcement activity unencumbered by protesters.

But the way that you're going to get there, Anderson is by that coordination between federal, state and local entities working in unison in these very dynamic situations.

Those operational planning, the safety concerns, the officer safety concerns, the public safety concerns, all of that could be worked out in advance, but what we're seeing is this disengagement of municipalities from federal law enforcement --

COOPER: And not just here in Minneapolis, but --

WACKROW: Across the country, and I think that you know that is leading -- you know the politicians are going to be fine. What's not fine is the public, and they're the ones that have to suffer the consequences.

COOPER: Also, on the legal aspect to talk about it, I want to talk to Elie about that in a moment, we're going to take a quick break.

I want to thank Frank Piazza for joining us as well.

Next, more on the background of the officer who shot and killed Renee Good, including a similar incident he was involved in that landed him in the hospital.

Later, what we're learning about the woman at the center of tonight's protest for children and her life leading up to her fatal encounter with ICE.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:21:51]

COOPER: Back with our breaking news tonight. A top Homeland Security official tells CNN that the ICE officer involved in yesterday's deadly shooting has 10 years of experience with the agency. He's a member of the Special Response Team, which requires him to meet certain qualifications.

CNN can also report that multiple current and former Homeland Security officials are privately questioning the officer's conduct, but stress that an investigation is necessary.

We'll talk more about the new developments with former ICE Acting Director John Sandweg, who joins me now along with the panel.

So John, what are your thoughts so far, given everything we know and everything we don't importantly about the incident?

JOHN SANDWEG, FORMER ACTING DIRECTOR, U.S. IMMIGRATION AND CUSTOMS ENFORCEMENT: Well, I think that's exactly right. Anderson, it's about what we don't know.

At this point, what's clear to me is we need a thorough investigation. Remember, the standard here is look at the totality of the circumstances. That's what we need to do in order to make judgments about exactly what happened.

Obviously, we've seen the Secretary, the Vice President, and others, I think, in a rush to judgment, disturbing, probably irresponsible at this point, probably threatens the credibility of any investigation later. But the bottom line is, you've got to reserve that judgment until you know all the facts, and investigators have an opportunity to look at this from every angle, interview the parties involved and take all the other necessary steps.

COOPER: Elie, on the investigation front, the state, the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension says today, the FBI has excluded them from investigating this incident. And obviously the Vice President has come forward. The President, I mean, everybody, Kristi Noem, head of DHS, has already declared what they believe happened.

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: This is a huge problem, because now we've had the three most powerful officials in the Executive Branch essentially on this matter, the President, Vice President, and DHS Secretary, based on no investigation, this investigation is brand new, come out and publicly and definitively declare all clear here, it's the fault of the woman. Nothing to do wrong by the DHS agent.

How is there supposed to be an independent investigation at this point? And how is the public supposed to see any investigation as independent? And let's think about the two scenarios here. The FBI is investigating this, let's say six weeks from now, whenever they're done, they come out and say, nothing to see here. Shooting was clear. No problem. Are people going to accept that, given that the President has already announced that would be the outcome?

But let's also consider the alternative. What if the FBI does its investigation and concludes this was a bad shooting, this was criminal, and there should be an indictment? Does anyone believe that that finding would ever see the light of day? Will this President and Justice Department allow a case to proceed against these cops, if that's what the FBI's conclusion is?

So by making these public statements, the President, Vice President and Kristi Noem have put this investigation in an impossible situation.

COOPER: John, I mean, you used to be with the FBI. It's a difficult situation, I would imagine.

MILLER: It is.

COOPER: For these -- for the FBI -- you know, career FBI people.

MILLER: Well, it is and -- know, the optics are bad, which is, you announced one day we're going to do this joint investigation. You have Kash Patel, early and often saying, our job is to share more information with local and state law enforcement, to be more transparent, to enhance these partnerships and. And then say, no, we've got this, and we don't need any help, and we're not going to share evidence with you.

[20:25:07]

As Elie pointed out, if they determined that there's no no criminality on the part of the agent, whether or not the shooting was tactically or in policy, if it wasn't criminal, and they don't have that state agency hand in hand with them at that determination, it's going to look like they circled the wagons.

COOPER: John Sandweg, DHS says that the ICE officer in Minneapolis has more than 10 years' experience on the job, which is a lot, and that he would not have been recruited under ICE's recently loosened standards.

Do you think the agency has been emboldened more broadly, in the past year? Do you worry about the kind of reduction in training?

SANDWEG: Yes, of course. Anderson, writ large, I do. Now, this particular agent was a member of the SRT team. He's going to be an elite agent who goes through extensive training, has to go through a specialized academy to join that SRT team.

So again, we don't know any of the facts here. There's a lot more work that needs to be done, but it doesn't look initially like training is going to be the issue here.

But writ large, of course, we've seen DHS lower the hiring standards and shorten the basic academy in an effort to push officers out.

Anderson, at the same time, we've really required ICE to shift their tactics over the last six months trying to do this mass deportation. ICE historically makes the majority of its arrest by people arrested by the U.S. Border Patrol at the border, ICE will take them into custody, or individuals arrested by other state and local law enforcement agencies who are already in prisons and jails.

ICE will do at large operations, but they do those more surgically, where they select the targets in advance and then do a very kind of discreet, quick operation to go get them at their home, or you know, in some other location, but highly planned.

What we've seen instead, as we've shifted where we put these ICE agents on the street, flooding the zone with ICE and Border Patrol agents, we pulled up off the border and then publicly announcing it. All of that is just -- it puts these agents out of their element, creates a super charged environment where protesters now go on the scene, and in my opinion, really puts the agents in harm's way as well as the public.

COOPER: John Sandweg, I appreciate your expertise tonight. Thank you. It's important.

Up next, what we know about Renee Good, the 37-year-old mom who just dropped her son off at school, some of her neighbors are sharing their stories.

Also how this factors into what's been a string of similar incidents. Back in October, this woman was shot five times by a Border Patrol agent, survived to see federal prosecutors dropping the case against her. I'll talk to her attorney.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:31:24]

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: More now on the woman who's killing by an ICE officer yesterday has set off two nights of protests in Minneapolis. We're learning more about Renee Good. Our Omar Jimenez is near one of the demonstrations in her memory tonight. He joins us now.

So, what more have you heard about her?

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN ANCHOR & CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Anderson. We've been in her neighborhood throughout the day today talking to folks in this particular neighborhood about what they remember about Renee Good but also about some of the feelings they've had about the shooting that happened. We are really in her neighborhood right now, but the shooting happened a little bit more than a block from where I'm standing.

And you can see some of the anger reflected here over the course. It's been pretty similar to what we've seen over the course of the day as they remember someone that was killed so quickly, a day removed from that shooting.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JIMENEZ (voice-over): A mother of three, a partner, and a poet. 37- year-old Renee Nicole Good, as described by those who knew her. Her neighbors now mourning their loss.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If we can help, we're going to help you. You know, it's -- that's the community.

JIMENEZ (voice-over): She was shot and killed near the site of an immigration enforcement operation Wednesday after dropping off her 6- year-old son at school, according to the Associated Press. Multiple videos obtained by CNN show the moments before she was shot at about 9:30 a.m. that morning. Video shows her car driving up to the scene about three minutes before the deadly confrontation with ICE agents.

JIMENEZ: This is the South Minneapolis neighborhood where Renee Good lived. It was just a few blocks from where the shooting happened. And a day removed from the shooting, it's quiet. We get the sense that some in this neighborhood are on edge, heartbroken over what happened so close to them here.

One of the neighbors we spoke to who didn't want to appear on camera describes Renee Good's family as a really sweet family, that her children would ask to pet the dogs, that the neighbors would walk here in the community. And we get the sense that Renee Good wasn't in this community that long, but clearly already made an impression on many here.

JIMENEZ (voice-over): While Clark Hoeischer didn't know Good personally, they live a few houses down and would see her kids' sidewalk drawings during the summer.

JIMENEZ: When we were talking earlier, you know, about Renee and about her kids, you were getting emotional. CLARK HOEISCHER, NEIGHBORHOOD RESIDENT: Yes.

JIMENEZ: What was going through your mind?

HOEISCHER: Oh, I mean, I just -- I'm a parent. I've helped raise five children. I have two, you know, kiddos that are my own. And just -- I can't imagine, like, that they, you know, came home and their mom, you know, isn't going to be there for them anymore and --

JIMENEZ (voice-over): Good was a Colorado native who moved to Minnesota last year, living in the Twin Cities with her partner. Of her three children, according to the AP, a 6-year-old boy whose father, a military veteran, died about three years ago, according to The Washington Post. And two other children, 15 and 12-year-olds from her first marriage, her ex-husband told the AP. He said she was a devoted Christian who took part in youth mission trips when she was younger.

And she briefly lived in Kansas City before moving last year. Her former neighbor there says she wasn't a terrorist nor an extremist, as she's been described.

JOAN ROSE, FORMER NEIGHBOR OF VICTIM: That was just a mom who loved her kids, loved her spouse.

JIMENEZ (voice-over): She graduated from Old Dominion University in December 2020 with a degree in English. A growing memorial near the site of the shooting now bearing posters with her image. Candles and flowers left in the snow where she died.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[20:35:07]

JIMENEZ: And the protests that we've seen over the course of today, yes, have been directing anger towards federal immigration law enforcement, but also trying to honor Renee Good. I mean, even Justice Board says protect the living and honor the dead, and said Renee Good's name in that corner as well.

And then you just look at how this has gotten really over the course of the past hour or so. They marched through the streets of Minneapolis south of downtown, obviously chanting to get ICE out, but again, trying to get people to remember Renee Good's name over the course of this.

And, by the way, we've seen this pop up in multiple locations throughout the city. This isn't even --

COOPER: Yes.

JIMENEZ (voice-over): -- in the face of law enforcement in any way. This is just a group marching through, and we're back in her neighborhood here.

COOPER: Omar Jimenez, thanks very much. This ICE shooting is not an isolated incident. On October 5th of last year, Marimar Martinez was shot five times by a border patrol agent in Chicago. She was accused of ramming the agent's car, charged with forcibly assaulting a border agent. After Martinez's attorney viewed body camera footage of the incident, claimed the government's version of events was false, prosecutors dropped the case against Martinez.

Joining our panel now is Marimar Martinez's attorney, Chris Parente. He's a former federal prosecutor. Chris, thanks for being with us.

What went through your mind when you saw the shooting in Minneapolis, particularly given what happened to your client, Ms. Martinez, in Chicago?

CHRIS PARENTE, ATTORNEY FOR MARIMAR MARTINEZ: Anderson, what went through my mind is I've seen this movie, and the sequel is equally as bad and even more tragic. And, you know, I spoke to Marimar yesterday. This obviously has been very triggering for her. She sends her thoughts and prayers to the good family there in Minneapolis.

But we both knew this was coming. This is no surprise to either Marimar nor myself because, again, I had the chance to cross-examine the border patrol agent who shot Marimar, and I got to see his private text messages with other border patrol agents, and it was frightening. They --

COOPER: In what way?

PARENTE: -- no remorse for shooting -- in a way of there's no remorse for what he did in Marimar's case, which was shoot a U.S. citizen over nothing more than a minor traffic incident. Instead, he's bragging to these other agents. And then when they were told that they were going out to the next city, he says in his private text message, cool, looking forward to the next round of FAFO, which I think your viewers know what that means.

I mean, and think about that. So these agents are out there in the streets of Minneapolis, in the streets of Memphis, in the streets of Chicago, in the streets of Portland, with the mentality, at least some of them, that they're looking forward to this and bragging about shooting U.S. citizens over nothing more than minor traffic incidents at best.

And here in Minneapolis, they've now implemented the death penalty on the spot for that minor traffic incident. And, unfortunately, Anderson, is not going to stop until this administration starts holding these agents accountable for violating their own use-of-force policies.

COOPER: Do you -- I mean, given your experience, do you believe statements coming out of, you know, DHS, these different agencies?

PARENTE: Absolutely not. And, again, I've just -- I mean, I just went through this, and I can assure you and your viewers -- I don't know about this, the Minneapolis case right now, but I can tell you having read the statements that came out against Marimar the moment that this happened from Tricia McLaughlin, the deputy secretary of DHS, those statements contained false information, right?

They immediately, first of all, they've turned the word protester, which we used to celebrate in this country, and they've changed it into this word domestic terrorist, from the jump, no investigation. That's unacceptable. But what they put out against Marimar, what they're starting to do against Mrs. Good now, was they said that Marimar was in a CBP bulletin, and they quoted language that they said Marimar said about causing -- calling for violence against ICE agents.

I sat with Marimar for hours and said this has to be true. You know, Tricia McLaughlin is a high-up official with our government. She wouldn't quote you as saying something that's not true. And after hours of Marimar in tears saying, you know, I didn't ever write this, I called the federal prosecutors and was told it doesn't exist, right? But that press release is still out there.

So I would caution all viewers, all this information that's coming out from the government, this is not the government that I used to work for. This is scary that they are putting out information, at least in Marimar's case, that was objectively false. And --

COOPER: Right.

PARENTE: -- they've never retracted it even to this date. And that's how you turn a Montessori schoolteacher -- I'm sorry, Anderson, but that's how you turn a Montessori schoolteacher or a mom into a domestic terrorist.

COOPER: Yes. Chris Parente, I appreciate you coming on to talk about your experience. Thank you very much.

We're back now with the panel. John, I want to show this video, which was after the shooting of somebody on the scene trying to render aid. Let's show this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No! Back up, now!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm a physician.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't care.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Listen, we understand. We got EMS coming. And I get it. Just give us a second.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have medics on the scene. We have our own medics.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Where are they?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[20:40:03]

COOPER: I mean, a guy says he's a physician on scene. Should he have been allowed to help?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, DHS policy is if they're involved in a shooting, once the scene is safe, you know, they're supposed to render whatever life-saving measures they can. This guy's a physician. He's there before other medical professionals.

It's certainly something that they should have considered. He's a doctor. He's there. Now, they say we have medics on the way, and that's true. Two teams of TAC medics who were part of the ICE teams in the area responded and examined her in the vehicle, took her out of the vehicle.

We don't know this, but it appears that they were able to determine that she was no longer alive. Then the ambulance comes, and they do their checks. But the question remains, had some competent medical person gotten to her beforehand?

COOPER: Right, the seconds matter, John. Yes.

MILLER: You know? And then the other question is, some guy says, I'm a doctor. Let me go examine her. You don't trust that.

JONATHAN WACKROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Anderson, look at how chaotic this scene is. We just had a, you know, an officer-involved shooting. We have a victim that's, you know, probably 20, 30 feet away from these officers. You have cars going through, you know, what could potentially be a crime scene.

There's no scene safety. There's no officer safety, and there's no public safety going on here. This goes back to the -- we're seeing this fracturing of law enforcement and public safety right before our eyes. This should have been avoidable.

COOPER: Thanks, everybody. Much more ahead tonight on our breaking coverage. We'll be joined by Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O'Hara. Minnesota Senator Tina Smith is also going to be joining us. And we're monitoring protests on the streets in Minneapolis.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:45:42]

COOPER: Crowds out on the streets of Minneapolis for a second night protesting the shooting death of Renee Good by an ICE officer. Protesters are not mincing words. They are angry. They want ICE officers to leave their city.

Tonight, they're not the only people making their voices heard while battling January cold. The night is wet with a light rain. Protesters seem undeterred.

Joining us now is Minnesota Senator Tina Smith. Senator, where do things go from here, given the Trump administration is blocking state authorities from investigating the shooting, arguing they don't have jurisdiction? SEN. TINA SMITH (D), MINNESOTA: Well, we can't accept that. What happened yesterday when Secretary Noem came right out and basically said exactly what she thought happened without any investigation, branding Renee Good as a domestic terrorist when she didn't even know her name, these folks have no credibility for doing any investigation into this killing.

And so I refuse to accept this. I called the FBI today and insisted that they rethink this, that they reopen the investigation to the state investigators, and I don't think that we can accept it. It will never have credibility, not only in Minnesota, but around the country when they so clearly have already reached a conclusion about this terrible tragedy and what happened here.

COOPER: We heard the vice president today, J.D. Vance, calling Renee Good's death a, quote, "tragedy of her own making and a tragedy of the making of the far left." I'm wondering what you thought when you heard that.

T. SMITH: Well, you know, J.D. Vance, they must know that they have a big problem here because yesterday we had the president and Secretary Noem spouting these, you know, lies about what actually happened, certainly setting the stage for some sort of a conclusion that I don't think is warranted by the evidence. And then they send, you know, Vance out there today to say it even louder.

And I don't think it's working. I don't think that people who have seen and listened to the multiple eyewitness accounts of what happened in this neighborhood, which is only a couple of miles from where I sit right now in my own home in Minneapolis, I don't think it has credibility.

What they should do is understand that they need to bring accountability to this ICE army that is invading American cities. And the way to do that is to have some consequence when this kind of, you know, reckless behavior results in the death of a woman who is just simply trying to keep her neighborhood safe.

There's obviously been a lot of discussion about ICE loosening its recruitment standards in recent months, even the amount of training that these officers get. The officer who shot Renee Good had more than 10 years on the job, according to DHS. I'm wondering what you have seen of how these ICE officers behave on the streets, their situational awareness, their professionalism.

We've had a number of law enforcement personnel question, you know, see things in this video about --

T. SMITH: Yes.

COOPER: -- you know, the officer firing the gun even toward the officer, other officers.

T. SMITH: Yes, yes. Well, you know, I mean, I know a little bit about this, having worked for the city of Minneapolis as chief of staff and then as, you know, at the state level. And there is a level of training that professional law enforcement goes through. And the training is about avoiding danger and it is about de-escalating situations of conflict.

And what we see in these videos and what we've seen of these ICE agents around the country is that they seem to be doing, in some ways, the opposite of that. I mean, even in the case of this tragedy, the ICE agent who, you know, wouldn't, you know -- you don't step in front of a car, you move away from the car. You're not trying to put yourself in danger. You're trying to avoid danger.

What I wonder about all of this is not only the question of training, and we know that there is far less training for new agents coming in than there was even a couple of years ago, but also sort of what is the culture and the sense of invincibility and the feeling that they can pretty much do whatever they want and no one is going to hold them accountable.

And, I mean, of course, you saw that yesterday, right? Because immediately, their big boss is saying, nope, this is what happened. I stand with you. There's no accountability. I'm going to cover for you.

COOPER: Yes.

T. SMITH: And that contributes, right?

COOPER: Senator Tina Smith, I appreciate you being with us. Thank you.

[20:50:00]

I want to bring in Minneapolis Police Chief Brian O'Hara. Chief, do you have any more clarity tonight about the circumstances of the shooting? What-- yes.

CHIEF BRIAN O'HARA, MINNEAPOLIS POLICE: Good evening. Unfortunately, I do not. I still have just the same basic information that I had earlier today. And, you know, earlier yesterday, I guess it is at this point. But I would echo a lot of what our senator just mentioned.

You know, I think -- I just spoke on the phone with the Portland Police Chief. The day before this happened, I had said, as I had said repeatedly, that these are -- it's very obvious that there's questionable methods, bad tactics being employed. And I have said, I am afraid of a tragedy happening in our city.

That's exactly what happened yesterday in Minneapolis. It's entirely predictable. It's also entirely preventable. And as the senator was just saying, we train our people very intensely, very purposefully to try and deescalate situations. I think what we're seeing now very, very clearly is leadership placing law enforcement officers who are not properly prepared into situations, you know, without the level of training or experience that's necessary for it.

COOPER: You see that with what you have seen from ICE on the streets in Minneapolis, bad tactics, not -- I mean, do they even know exactly where they are at any given time? Jonathan Wackrow, a former Secret Service, raised the question, did those ICE officers even know where the nearest hospital was? You know --

O'HARA: Right.

COOPER: Is there -- there's a good chance they may not have.

O'HARA: Yes, I mean, that's a problem that we've seen repeatedly. You know, it was a U.S. citizen that was arrested here a couple of weeks ago, and they drove him around in circles because they, you know, they couldn't find the entrance to the highway to get back.

So, I mean, I think it's obvious that people coming from different parts of the country are unfamiliar, you know, not just with the roadways, they're unfamiliar with the conditions in the neighborhoods that they're going into. And then, clearly, they're just not as prepared as city police officers are in this day and age for the type of urban law enforcement and the things that our cops deal with every day.

COOPER: And so, what are your marching orders now in terms of, in the days ahead, do you help them, you know, in situation -- how does this work?

O'HARA: This has been a situation that has been escalating for several weeks here. And I have been adjusting, changing policies, changing our practices as time has gone on. And as of right now, I've canceled all days off for all of our police officers. We called everyone to duty because I am concerned for the potential for --

COOPER: Yes.

O'HARA: -- civil unrest. I'm concerned for another tragedy happening. So what we do is, you know, we try and -- we've had a dramatic increase in 911 calls related to all of this stuff. We try and field them and triage them as best we can.

COOPER: Yes.

O'HARA: But our goal is to only respond when there is a threat to life, when there's property damage happening. Because every time we wind up injecting our officers into those situations, a lot of times, we become the object of people's anger and frustration.

COOPER: Yes.

Chief Brian O'Hara, I appreciate you being on tonight. Thank you. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:57:23]

COOPER: A new episode of my podcast, All There Is, just released. My guest is the legendary writer, musician, Patti Smith, who's experienced a lot of loss, including her husband, Fred Sonic Smith, and her brother and closest friend. Here's part of the conversation.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PATTI SMITH, LEGENDARY WRITER AND MUSICIAN: Grief does not mean crying and sobbing. That's art of it. It could be wailing. I mean, I feel like I've done it all, but it's not required. Nothing is required because grief isn't just like the person dies and you grieve and you go to the funeral and then it's over. It's going to last your whole lifetime. It's going to come and go in waves.

COOPER: I just talked to Ken Burns, the documentary filmmaker, and he said the half-life of grief is endless.

P. SMITH: That's beautiful, and I completely, I can comprehend that. And it is. The real thing is people should not feel that it's wrong to feel joy in the center of grief. We have to be able to go through the whole spectrum. It's part of being alive. We have to find a balance for all of that.

COOPER: I've muted my life by not allowing myself to feel grief and feel sad, to feel a deep, deep sadness.

P. SMITH: If you're muting one part of yourself, it's going to also mute somewhat of the other. I think it's important to feel everything. To feel guilt, to feel anger. It's important to know what all these things taste like.

COOPER: Is there something you've learned in your grief that would be helpful for others?

P. SMITH: Well, the main thing I would just tell people is allow yourself all the different things that you feel in losing somebody. You do crazy things when you lose somebody. Don't judge yourself. Let yourself be angry or let yourself not feel anything. Don't feel guilty.

Just allow your -- all your cells and all of your being to go through its process. I mean, I cried more for Fred years after he died. It was like I was in such shock losing him, and I had so much responsibility, and I had two young children, and financially we were at an all-time low.

And then my brother died a month later. So a lot of the things that I felt, you know, were more intense years later. Just --

COOPER: And that's OK?

P. SMITH: Yes. There's no rules. There's -- and there shouldn't be any rules. And there's all of these phrases like time heals all wounds. It doesn't. Don't look to be healed.

You have a sacred wound. Take care of it. Don't let it get infected. But it's not necessarily going to heal. You just learn to live with it.

COOPER: There's no rules in grief.

P. SMITH: No, I don't think there should be. (END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Full podcast available wherever you get your podcasts. You can watch the entire episode on video at CNN.com/AllThereIs.

The news continues. The Source with Kaitlan Collins starts now.