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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Trump: Iran Has to Cry Uncle; Hegseth, Democrats Clash in First Hearing Since Start of Iran War; Interview with Rep. Adam Smith (D- WA): Comey Makes Brief Federal Court Appearance After New Indictment; DOJ Charges Comey With Threatening Trump in Seashell Post; Supreme Court Limits Reach of the Voting Rights Act; King Charles & Queen Camilla Pay Respects at NYC 9/11 Memorial. Aired 8-9p ET
Aired April 29, 2026 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
M.J. LEE, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL ENTERPRISE CORRESPONDENT: And Erin, representatives for David Blaine, David Copperfield and ABC did not respond to CNN's request for comment for this story, and a spokesperson for MGM Grand declined to comment on Copperfield's final performances at the hotel --Erin.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: All right, M.J., thanks very much and guess final performance is supposed to be tomorrow. Thanks so much for joining us. AC360 with Anderson begins right now.
[20:00:34]
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, "ANDERSON COOPER: 360": Good evening from the Newsroom, breaking news in the war with Iran in an Oval Office Event late today, the President said the Trump administration is currently having talks telephonically, in his words, with Iran and that they have to cry uncle. He also spoke about a 90-minute phone call he had today with Russian President Vladimir Putin.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: What involvement does he want to have in the Iran situation?
DONALD TRUMP (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: He told me he'd like to be involved with the enrichment. If we -- if he can help us get it. I said, I'd much rather have you be involved with ending the war with Ukraine.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: While Russia did play a role in storing Iran's uranium under the 2015 agreement, the Obama administration made with Iran, which President Trump backed out of. It should be noted that Russia, presumably under orders from Vladimir Putin, has provided Iran with Intelligence about the location and movements of American troops and ships and aircraft. Now, that's according to multiple people familiar with U.S. Intelligence reporting on the issue.
Additionally, Russia has helped Iran with advanced drone tactics to actually hit U.S. and Gulf nation targets in the Middle East, according to a western Intelligence official and Americans have been killed and wounded in Iranian drone strikes, we should point out.
With the Iran war now past it's two-month mark, the President was pressed on the timeline for the conflict.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN'S CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT AND THE ANCHOR OF "THE SOURCE": Do you think the war in Iran ends first, or the war in Ukraine?
TRUMP: Well, we talked about more about the war in Ukraine, but he would like to be of help. I said before you help me, I want to end your war.
COLLINS: But which war do you think ends first?
TRUMP: That's an interesting question. You know, coming from you, that's very interesting. Which war would end first, I don't know, maybe they're on a similar timetable.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: I should note that the President had previously forecast the Iran war to last four to six weeks. He also repeatedly indicated the war is all but over. The President also said that talks with Iran are ongoing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We have talks, we're having talks with them now and we're not flying anymore with 18-hour flights every time we want to see a piece of paper, we're doing it telephonically. They've come a long way. The question is whether or not they're going to go far enough. So, at this moment, there will never be a deal unless they agree that there will be no nuclear weapons.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: A little bit later in the program, we'll take you live to Russia for a report from Moscow. Meantime, on Capitol Hill today, the Defense Secretary, Pete Hegseth, sparred with Democratic lawmakers on the House Armed Services Committee and his first testimony since the war began. He was combative, at times defensive as well and in his opening remarks came out swinging. Not at the Iranians or the Russians, but at American lawmakers themselves.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: The biggest challenge, the biggest adversary we face at this point are the reckless, feckless and defeatist words of Congressional Democrats and some Republicans. Two months in, I remind you, two months in to a conflict, lest I remind you, and my generation understands how long we were in Iraq, how long we were in Afghanistan, how long we were in Vietnam.
(END VIDEO CLIP) COOPER: That is the greatest threat, he is saying, Democrats in
Congress and some Republicans.
Since the beginning of the war, the President and his administration have given a number of different and sometimes contradictory justifications for it. Congressman Adam Smith, the ranking Democrat on the committee, pointed out a number of those contradictions.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HEGSETH: Their nuclear facilities have been obliterated underground, they're buried, and we're watching them 24/7. So, we know where any nuclear material, reclaiming the--
REP. ADAM SMITH, (D-WA): Reclaiming my time for a second here. We had to start this war. You just said 60 days ago, because the nuclear weapon was an imminent threat. Now, you're saying that it was completely obliterated.
HEGSETH: They had not given up their nuclear ambitions, and they had a conventional shield of thousands of --
SMITH: So, Operation Midnight Hammer aha-moment nothing of substance.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: I'll be talking to Adam Smith in just a few minutes. Today, Hegseth was also asked about the financial cost of the war to Americans.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. RO KHANNA (D-CA): Do you know how much it will cost Americans in terms of their increased cost in gas and food over the next year because of the Iran war?
HEGSETH: I would simply ask you what the cost of a nuclear bomb
KHANNA: I'm going to give you that
HEGSETH: I am simply asking -- playing gotcha questions about domestic things.
KHANNA: Sir, no it's not, you're saying it's a gotcha question to ask what it's going to be in terms of the increased --
HEGSETH: Why won't you ask what it costs to prevent Iran from getting a nuclear bomb?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[20:05:12]
COOPER: Well, he never answered that question. But as to the actual cost of prosecuting the war, another defense official today testified that so far, the Pentagon has spent $25 billion. Now apparently that was a lowball figure.
CNN's Natasha Bertrand now has new reporting on this. Three sources tell CNN that $25 billion does not include the cost of repairing extensive damage suffered by U.S. bases in the region. One of the sources said that the real cost estimate is closer to $40 to $50 billion when accounting for the cost of rebuilding U.S. military installations and replacing destroyed assets.
We're starting off tonight with CNN chief White House correspondent anchor of "The Source" Kaitlan Collins, who was at that Oval Office Event today with the President. Is it clear exactly what Putin said on that phone call that led Trump to suggest to you that the wars in Iraq and Ukraine could, end, "on a similar timetable?"
COLLINS: That was really the first readout that we had gotten from the President of his call with President Putin, in terms of what that looked like. And he suggested that there could be a potential cease fire in Ukraine coming up. But he seemed to indicate that it would be a temporary, short lived one. Weve seen that in periods before where maybe it's for a day or two, but not a full-on cease fire, like what we're seeing in Iran right now, for example.
And so, that remains to be seen. We'll see what that looks like. But the President made clear that Putin was offering to help with things like getting the enriched uranium out of Iran, the President obviously says he wants to do. But he told Putin he wants to focus on ending that war first.
But I think what you just laid out there, Anderson, in terms of the cost of the Iran war right now and how much this actually is, given our reporting, that it's much higher than the figure that the Pentagon offered today, when it comes to exactly the cost that are related to the bases and whatnot, that shows why there are real questions about when this war with Iran could end and the questions about what the exit and what that timetable is going to look like.
And so, there are two ways to look at his answer, Anderson, about a similar timetable. I mean, the Iran war has gone on, or the war in Ukraine has gone on for years now, and still, there's no end in sight. Despite the Presidents desire to try to end it on his first day in office. And so, the questions that Republicans and Democrats alike have both raised on Capitol Hill and the President's supporters, given the cost of gas here in the United States, only going up is how long it will be before this war ends?
So, saying there's a similar timetable, I mean, the President could be potentially optimistic that that could be soon for both. But the other question is whether or not they continue to drag on. And if the Iran war could be could go on and be incredibly lengthier than the President had initially estimated.
COOPER: Yes, and of course, he has repeatedly said it's all but over a number of times over the last few weeks. Kaitlan, thanks very much. Kaitlan is going to be back at the top of the hour for "The Source".
More on that testimony from Defense Secretary Hegseth with the House Armed Services Committee today. In a moment, I'll talk to ranking Democrat Adam Smith. He had some pointed exchanges with Secretary Hegseth.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SMITH: What is the plan to actually turn all of this lethal kinetic action into an improvement in the nuclear situation? Because we haven't gotten there yet. Play it out for us. How does that happen? How does it actually lead to that result?
HEGSETH: Well, I would take issue with the premise of the question that nothing was done and Operation Midnight Hammer was a very effective.
SMITH: I didn't say nothing was done. I said in this war --
HEGSETH: Ultimately, well, this is -- this under this administration, unlike other administrations, which cut bad deals and pallets of cash with no ability to oversee whether Iran is actually pursuing a nuclear program where we want to litigate JCPOA or the Iran deal. Our view, the President's view is that was a very bad deal. That gave them a bunch of money up front.
SMITH: --the future--
HEGSETH: The fund, you talked about negotiated deals, funded, allowed them to fund their proxies and spread Hamas and Hezbollah all around the region, build up nuclear capability.
SMITH: What are we going to do now?
HEGSETH: President --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Congressman Smith joins me now. He didn't seem to really want to answer that question. He seemed to have something prepared that he wanted to say. Sources tell CNN that, first of all, the $25 billion cost estimate that you got today from the Pentagon comptroller is low, doesn't include rebuilding U.S. bases. The real estimate may be closer to $40 billion to $50 billion. What do you think? What are your thoughts on that?
SMITH: Yes, they just gave us that number. I think interesting things we've been asking for that number for weeks. And they've been saying they don't provide it. I asked the comptroller and just gave it to us. So, I don't know why they didn't offer that earlier. But my staff tells me that is way low, for exactly the reasons that you stated. It doesn't take into account all the equipment that has been destroyed.
COOPER: We showed your exchange, several of your exchanges with Hegseth. Did the Secretary's answer make sense to you that the U.S. is fighting this war to eliminate Iran's nuclear ambition, the ambition to because, as you pointed out, they had claimed before that it was obliterated. SMITH: Yeah, look, the logic problem here is Pete Hegseth thinks he
can just say Iran having a nuclear weapon is bad therefore, whatever we do is good. There's actually quite a few steps between those two things that he keeps wanting to paper over. And mostly he wants to talk about the past, you know, and what he didn't like about Joe Biden. I did point out that every single President prior to President Trump has been able to live in a world where on didn't have a nuclear weapon without going to war.
[20:10:12]
So, this notion that we absolutely had to do it, the logic doesn't follow. And also, we know in this war that's been going on for 60 days, we have not done anything to attack their nuclear program. Whatever strength they had at the start of this war they have now. And so, what I really want to know is what are we going to do either through negotiations, through the blockade, through military action that's going to change that. Because if his position is as long as it's possible for Iran to build a nuclear weapon, it's an unacceptable threat, then think about that. That's regime change.
I mean, that means we got to go in there and take out this regime, because you can't unwring the bell of being able to develop nuclear technology. If that's his standard, then regime change is the only answer. And if it's not his standard, then what is an acceptable level of protection? And the fact that he doesn't know that 60 days into the war, with all of the cost of this war, the economic chaos, the lives lost, you know, we don't seem to know, sorry -- the Trump administration doesn't seem to know where they're going. And they think they can just shout nuclear weapons, nuclear weapons, they're bad. Therefore, that proves me right. It doesn't, we seem to be stuck. And they don't want to explain how they're going to get us unstuck.
COOPER: I don't know what Secretary Hegseth is running for, other than keeping his job with the President and keeping, you know, in good graces with the President. But for him to say to you and everybody else there that the biggest adversary of the war at this point for the United States are Democrats in Congress and a few Republicans, I'm sure he would add in journalists who ask questions as well into that if he gave it more thought.
It's pretty stunning that the Secretary of Defense would make that argument. I mean, that's not his --
SMITH: Yes.
COOPER: Does that make sense to you that this guy is giving that line to you?
SMITH: Well, I'm going to say this and probably get some blowback from it. Let's just say that that's vaguely fascist, okay? Basically, I'm the President, you know, our Secretary of Defense in this case, we get to do what we want. And our elected representatives, they cannot question us, okay.
I mean, that is directly against what our representative democracy is supposed to be about. That's our job, to represent the people, to question them. Now, if they have answers, okay, fine. But Hegseth was basically saying, you don't have the right to question this administration in the war.
And so that goes beyond just all the stuff we've talked about. And you and Kaitlan covered quite well in terms of the problematic place that were at in the war. That gets to a fundamental belief of the Trump administration. And we've seen it everywhere. I mean, they're now prosecuting James Comey again for absolutely nothing. They've sued the media. They've sued law firms. They're trying to prosecute four members of the House Armed Services Committee for simply saying that service members shouldn't follow illegal orders.
This appears to be an authoritarian regime, not a constitutional, not a democratically elected leadership of a constitutional republic. And so, yes, that is a deeply troubling take. And keep in mind, that was in his opening statement. That wasn't after he got pressed and got into an argument, that was in his opening statement. How dare you question us? That's your job as members of Congress.
COOPER: He clearly wants to be taken seriously. Do you think he is a serious Secretary of Defense?
SMITH: Yes, I don't know. I won't walk down that road of you're not a serious person. I don't know. He started a war. So, he's a serious person, whether that's good or bad. You know, we can debate. I think it's bad. But no, I think he is, he wants to be a partisan. It's all part of the Trump Administration.
They're right and they want to eliminate any impediment to their power. I mean remember he kicked the press corps out of the Pentagon. He fired all the inspector generals. He fired a whole lot of the lawyers, the JAGs who were supposed to keep him in check. I think Trump and Hegseth are in total agreement on the fact that they should have absolute power and shouldn't be checked or questioned, and that's not the way our constitutional republic is supposed to work.
COOPER: Congressman Adam Smith, I appreciate your time, thank you.
SMITH: Thank you.
COOPER: Up next, more on the President's phone call with Vladimir Putin. CNN's Fred Pleitgen joins us live from Moscow with the Kremlin's take on their discussion.
And later, former FBI Director James Comey surrendering and appearing in federal court as he faces charges in connection to that social media post with seashells that he took down.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:18:38]
COOPER: More on our breaking news. President Trump and his Russian counterpart, Vladimir Putin, talking on the phone today about the Iran ceasefire and other topics for 90 minutes. We mentioned earlier, Mr. Trump told reporters Putin said he'd, "like
to be involved in helping settle the issue of Iranian nuclear enrichment."
CNN's Fred Pleitgen joins us now from Moscow with more. So, what does the Kremlin believe it got from that call with President Trump today?
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Anderson. Well, essentially two things. On the one hand, they've really come out as a major player in the effort to try and end the Iran-U.S. War. You'll recall that the Iranian foreign minister, Abbas Araghchi, was actually here in Russia a couple of days ago to brief Vladimir Putin. And now this one-and-a-half-hour call with President Trump, the Russians saying they approve, as the Russians put it, of President Trump extending the ceasefire with Iran, at the same time warning that it would have devastating consequences globally if this went back to a shooting war.
But the thing that's actually playing the biggest here in Russian media and in Russia in general, is the fact that Vladimir Putin has offered up a cease fire for a single day on victory day, which of course, is May 9th.
However, that's also something that's pretty important to the Russians as well, as they've already had to scale back their victory day military parade in the face of a Ukrainian drone campaign that's been hitting a lot of infrastructure here in Russia and the Russians are clearly saying they're having a lot of trouble enforcing and securing that victory day parade. So, offering that ceasefire, certainly something that could be a back door out of that for them.
At the same time, the Russians are continuing to say, Anderson, that they want to continue the war in Ukraine, of course, what they call their special military operation until all of its goals are achieved -- Anderson.
[20:20:21]
COOPER: Fred Pleitgen, appreciate it, thank you.
U.S. officials tell CNN they're waiting to hear back from Iran on a modified proposal. That is the blessing of the current Supreme Leader. The last offer was to open the Strait in exchange for the U.S. lifting the blockade. President Trump has rejected that, reportedly holding out for a deal that halts Iran's nuclear ambitions.
Joining me now, CNN global affairs analyst and senior fellow at the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, Karim Sadjadpour and Edward Fishman, he's the director of the Center for Geoeconomics at the Council on Foreign Relations. He previously served as sanctions lead for the U.S. State department under the Obama administration. When the U.S. put oil sanctions on Iran. He's also the author of "Choke Points: American Power in The Age of Economic Warfare".
so, Karim, Iran's Parliament Speaker, who was the lead negotiator in the previous round, continues to basically troll the President on social media. He posted, next stop, 140 meaning $140.00 a barrel for oil. How do you think Iran is now going to respond to this continuous continuation of the blockade?
KARIM SADJADPOUR, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: I think first of all, Anderson, that he is not writing his own tweets. There's probably someone in Los Angeles who is writing those tweets.
COOPER: Really?
SADJADPOUR: Yes, one of his former aides, it turns out, is writing those tweets for him.
COOPER: In Los Angeles.
SADJADPOUR: In Los. Angeles, it turns out. But I think the regime publicly is maintaining their defiance in this idea that they have prevailed. But when you talk to people in Tehran, it is a country which is which is economy has been totally decimated and you don't hear that a lot because it's essentially imposed a blockade. And internet censorship on its own population. So, you're not hearing the voices of Iranians who want this war to stop.
COOPER: But, I mean, Iran has had economic woes before in the Iran- Iraq war, and they continue that war for eight years. Do you think the economic woes that you're hearing of are a threat to the regime?
SADJADPOUR: Not yet and this is obviously what we've been talking about the last two months, is that President Trump needs the American economy to thrive. All the Islamic Republic needs is for their regime to survive. And at the moment, it's a regime which, you know, has a monopoly of violence. And they're not yet feeling that their population is about to rise up against them.
COOPER: Yes, I mean, you know, all about the economics of this. Do you think their willingness to, you know, have their people feel pain is greater than the U.S.'s willingness?
EDWARD FISHMAN, AUTHOR, AUTHOR "CHOKE POINTS: AMERICAN POWER IN THE AGE OF ECONOMIC WARFARE": I do, I mean, I think the Iranians. Feel like they've discovered the U.S.'s Achilles heel, which is our low tolerance for economic pain. I think, as Karim put it, the Iranian regime is playing for survival, right?
Trump this is a war of choice. He started trying to get regime change. He's now been sort of floundering, looking for some other objective, going from do denuclearizing Iran to reopening the Strait. I think it's very clear that the Iranians have sort of the upper hand in terms of who has more endurance in this conflict.
COOPER: Which is kind of stunning, given the military superiority of the United States. But just in terms of their willingness to have their people suffer and to withstand pain, that's what gives them the edge.
FISHMAN: Yes, and by the way, this is a lesson I think, that Iran took from what happened last year, right? You look at TACO. You know, Trump imposed tariffs on China and then China retaliated by cutting off the U.S. access to rare earths, Ford idled one of its factories within two weeks, and Trump backed down, right?
We've now been backpedaling on our policy toward China because we showed that we aren't willing to take a stock market correction. I think the Iranian's saw that. And by the way, other countries have signed that. And they've decided that the best way to fight back against the United States is try to inflict economic pain.
COOPER: So, Karim in Iran, who is managing the economy and does, you know, whoever is doing that does the IRGC and the people who are in charge, do they care?
SADJADPOUR: So, there is that disconnect between the men who are managing the war, which is the Islamic Revolutionary Guards, and then the men who need to make Iran's budget work. And that's the presidency and the parliament and those people who are mindful of the country's economic woes, they're very eager for this war to end. But the military men, you know, they're kind of distracted by the war. And they're also concerned that once the war ends, then people's focus is going to be on internal woes and internal mismanagement and lack of political and social freedoms.
COOPER: It seems, it seems, because the President is saying the bottom line is now less so, the Strait is now the nuclear ambitions, the nuclear capabilities of Iran. That's a long-term negotiation. That's not something that is going to be solved in a matter of days.
FISHMAN: Yes, it took us years to negotiate the JCPOA. We got an interim deal in November of 2013. We didn't get the final deal until the summer of 2015, didn't implement it until January 2016. It was two-and-a-half years, really, this entire process. So, I don't think that the Trump administration will be able to get a deal like the JCPOA in a matter of weeks. And frankly, Trump doesn't have time.
[20:25:10]
We're seeing oil prices already go over $120.00 a barrel. And, Anderson, if this stays in place like this for another month, we're going to see oil go $150.00, $200.00 a barrel, clearly going to break records if this doesn't change very quickly.
COOPER: The President says they're now doing this telephonically. Does that work with Iran? Does anything stand out to you about that?
SADJADPOUR: So, it's very difficult to communicate with this regime, but that said, you know, there has been a taboo that's been broken in that J.D. Vance and Iran's speaker of parliament, Ghalibaf, spent 20 hours together. That didn't happen when Ayatollah Khamenei was living. So that taboo has seemingly been broken inside Tehran about direct talks with the United States.
And now it's just a question of, okay, what are the terms of a deal going to be? And I totally agree with Edward that we're very far away from that. But I think we're seeing what the basic contours of a deal might be. COOPER: Which would be what?
SADJADPOUR: There will be a, there will need to be a deal on getting out this highly enriched uranium, as much as a thousand pounds of that. And then the question of whether Iran will suspend its enrichment of uranium and for how long.
COOPER: Do you think they will?
FISHMAN: I think they'd be willing to suspend enrichment for maybe five years or so. I'd add one other point, because there's something beyond the nuclear program, which is the Strait of Hormuz. Is Iran actually going to give up control over the world's most important energy chokepoint? I'm not so sure.
COOPER: Yes, Edward Fishman, thank you, Karim Sadjadpour, as well, always.
Up next, Former FBI Director James Comey surrenders and appears in court over an alleged threat against President Trump and the White House. The President lashes out about that.
Also later, our John King with the new "All Over the Map" report, this time from Ohio with a check on the President's support in the state that could be crucial to midterms.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For eight years, there were Trump signs on every corner. There were flags. You couldn't go to a grocery store without seeing those red MAGA hats. I challenge you to find one.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:31:00]
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST OF "ANDERSON COOPER 360": That is former FBI Director, James Comey leaving federal court today after he turned himself in. He's facing criminal charges over his social media post last May that was deleted. It showed shells on a beach that read 86- 47. 86 is slang for getting rid of or tossing something out.
President Trump is the 47th president. Prosecutors say that it's a threat against the president. This afternoon, our Kaitlan Collins asked the president about the case.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: If anybody knows anything about crime, they know 86, you know what 86 is? It's a mob term for kill him. You know? You ever see the movies? "86 him," the mobster says to one of his wonderful associates, 86 him, that means kill him.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR & CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: But do you really think your life is in danger? Because that's --
(CROSSTALK)
TRUMP: Probably. I don't know. You know, based on -- based on what I'm seeing out there, yeah, the people like Comey have created tremendous danger, I think, for politicians and others. He -- you know, Comey is a dirty cop. He's a very dirty cop.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: The former FBI director says he is innocent. Joining me now is former Federal Prosecutor, Berit Berger and former Chief of DOJ Counterintelligence Section, David Laufman.
Berit, where do you see this case heading? Do you think this actually will head anywhere?
BERIT BERGER, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: I think it's unlikely that it'll go to trial. Again, we don't know all the evidence that the government has at this point. We don't know what they've gathered during their investigation.
COOPER: They say that they have been investigating this for the year, Secret Service, FBI.
BERGER: Right. Now, as someone who's done a lot of investigations, it actually is hard for me to understand how this investigation would take a year. I'm just not sure there's that much to investigate here.
However, assuming they have done searches of his social media, perhaps searched his devices, talked to other witnesses, I still can't really --
COOPER: Combed the beach?
BERGER: -- combed the beach to see what other seashell formations they might find. It's still really hard for me to think that this would go to trial. There's some pretty strong defense motions here that we had talked about in the context of his first indictment. Vindictive prosecution, selective prosecution, those would apply. I think they'd apply even stronger in this case.
So there's some pretty big legal hurdles that they're going to have to get through before this case would ever see a jury.
COOPER: David, does this indictment make sense to you?
DAVID LAUFMAN, FORMER CHIEF OF DOJ COUNTERINTELLIGENCE SECTION: No, it makes no sense. This is something that brings stain and dishonor on the department, on its leadership, on the line prosecutors, and their supervisory officials. This case has zero merit. It's contrary to applicable law. It is contrary to department policy, which governs all prosecutors across this country and every U.S. attorney's office.
No prosecutor is allowed to bring a case unless they believe the admissible evidence is sufficient to probably result in a conviction and to sustain that on appeal. And although there could be some additional evidence out there that they didn't include in the indictment, it seems improbable. And on its face, I think, as has been said just a moment ago, I think the case for a vindictive prosecution motion, which almost never succeeds, has a really strong chance of prevailing here.
And if this case were to get to trial, it's likely almost certainly to result in an acquittal or at least a hung jury.
COOPER: Berit, I mean, the Secret Service interviewed Mr. Comey the day after this post was taken down, I believe it was, or the day after it was posted, or I think it was the day after it was taken down, probably the same thing. If they had actually believed that he was a threat to the president of the United States, it's kind of inconceivable that they would have allowed him to just for the last year be out on his own.
BERGER: Right, which is exactly the right argument that he would make about why there was no credible investigation taking place over the last year. There's no chance that the government and the law enforcement would let somebody who was a real threat exist in the world, have a public platform, have the opportunity to potentially make other threats for a year. That doesn't happen, and it just goes to show that, you know, you have to say that there's an actual credible threat here, that it's not just words that, oh, maybe somebody, that a reasonable person would take as a threat.
[20:35:00]
If even the Secret Service wasn't thinking that this rang of a true threat, how can we convince 12 jurors that this was really a true threat?
COOPER: I mean, David, It's going to be fascinating to see what sort of resources actually were put into this allegedly year-long Investigation, where those people, what cases they were taken off of in order to follow this. The Deputy Attorney General, Todd Blanche was asked about the case today, and I just want to play part of that for our viewers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is the Justice Department's position that anybody who posts the numbers "8647" is subject to potential investigation and potential criminal charges?
TODD BLANCHE, ACTING ATTORNEY GENERAL: Look, every case is different. Every threats case is different. You know that every time that's posted, that that number is posted, you know that every time there is a threat against the president, it doesn't necessarily lead to an indictment. It depends -- it depends on the investigation. It depends on all kinds of factors, and so it's not -- people should be very wary of threatening the life of President Trump because that is a crime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: David, you said the vindictive prosecutions, it's rarely something you can prove. This case might be provable, why?
LAUFMAN: I mean it's not uncommon for defense Attorneys to make the motion, but they rarely succeed. Here the applicable standard, I'm just going to read, as that reasonable person would have to interpret Mr. Comey's post as a serious expression of an intent to do harm. Now what reasonable person would construe an array of seashells on a beach, seemingly expressing a message mostly associated with, you know, cooks in the back room of a restaurant trying to get rid of a dish, as a threat to the president United States? It's just inane.
So I think this motion which Pat Fitzgerald, Mr. Comey's attorney said, he will make again in this case, as he did in the previous case, which was never ruled upon is likely to have real legs. And every time the president opens his mouth like he did today, it just adds fodder and more bullet points to the impending defense motion.
COOPER: Yeah. David Laufman, Berit Berger, thanks so much. Appreciate it.
Up next, John King joins us with a new stop on his "All Over the Map" series in Ohio to find out the Trump coalition is cracking. And later, King Charles and Queen Camilla came here to New York City to pay their respects at Ground Zero. More on their trip, coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:41:42]
COOPER: As we mentioned earlier, the U.S. military has spent roughly $25 billion on the war with Iran since it began. According to sources, this does not include the cost of rebuilding U.S. bases. The real estimate is between $40 billion to $50 billion when including destroyed assets.
While Pentagon officials can estimate a cost of the munitions and equipment, there's also the impact of war here at home with rising fuel prices, for one. For John King's latest installment of his "All Over the Map" series, he went to Ohio, which is a state that voted for Trump three times in the last presidential elections, to see what voters think of his policies there now.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TRUMP: And I love Ohio. Will never let you down, I swear, I promise.
JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Four days. They're all heading off to vote.
(LAUGH)
J. KING (voice-over): 900 miles.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There you go, that's much better.
J. KING: Red Sox might need a backup catcher.
(LAUGH)
J. KING (voice-over): And one giant question. Is Donald Trump's MAGA coalition cracking?
Entering Ohio, the Mahoning Valley. Gritty, blue-collar, union, reliably Democratic for decades. No more.
J. KING: People like this, places like this, are part of how Trump has changed America. Ohio changed from a competitive purple state to a Trump-red state because of the magic of his coalition here. But as we head into the midterms, the jobs he promised are not here. The revival in American manufacturing he promised is not here.
J. KING (voice-over): Chris Anderson is the Mahoning County Democratic Chairman. His midterm bet? Enough Trump voters will be part of electing Ohio's first Democratic governor in 15 years, and part of flipping a critical Senate seat from red to blue.
CHRIS ANDERSON, MAHONING COUNTY DEMOCRATIC CHAIRMAN: They got conned by a con man.
J. KING: You're the Democrat, so you're supposed to say that. What do you see that tells you that things are different?
ANDERSON: I mean, drive around Mahoning County. For -- you know, for eight years, there were Trump signs on every corner. There were flags. You couldn't go to a grocery store without seeing those red MAGA hats. I'd challenge you to find one.
J. KING (voice-over): It's true, these are hard to find now. Maybe a clue, but hardly enough to answer the 'is MAGA cracking' question. This is Local 1112 United Auto Workers, Lordstown, Ohio. Ground zero in the local debate about trusting Trump.
General Motors made cars here for five decades. Thousands of good union jobs. But the Lordstown plant closed in 2019, despite a first- term Trump promise it would stay open.
Foxconn built this new factory on the GM site, but its workforce is non-union, and the factory is mostly idle now as the company decides what's next. Nearby, another new factory sold as Lordstown's new hope. Ultium Cells, a joint E.V. battery venture between General Motors and South Korea's LG Electronics.
J. KING: How many guys are working in that factory now?
ROB SWAUGER, OHIO VOTER: Right now, all of production is shut down. 1,460 of us, I think there were, were all laid off on January 5th, officially.
J. KING: And you don't know until when?
SWAUGER: Don't know until when.
J. KING: Bob Swauger leads the campaign committee at Local 1112.
[20:45:00]
Everyone here remembers when Trump told them not to sell their homes, and later when he said new jobs would replace the GM jobs. The Union endorsed Kamala Harris, but a big chunk of its voters voted Trump. And then the UAW endorsed Trump's tariffs.
SWAUGER: They were hopeful that they were going to bring more jobs back to the United States.
J. KING: Has that happened?
SWAUGER: Not that I'm aware of.
J. KING (voice-over): Manufacturing employment is up a bit of late, but down 80,000 jobs overall since Trump returned to the White House. American auto manufacturing, down 25,000 jobs in Trump's second term.
J. KING: Do you believe, in 2026, the Democrats can actually win statewide for the Senate and win statewide for governor in Ohio?
SWAUGER: Yes.
J. KING (voice-over): Mark Skonieczny served overseas in Kosovo, Iraq, and Afghanistan, was drawn to the Tea Party and then Trump after leaving the Army.
MARK SKONIECZNY, OHIO VOTER: I let myself, I don't want to say get radicalized or anything, but I was very right-wing.
J. KING (voice-over): Skonieczny had a change of heart in 2020, calls himself an independent, and is backing Democrats this year because he now views Trump and MAGA as dangerous to democracy.
SKONIECZNY: I've talked to a lot of people whose views are changing, even in my own family. So I am hopeful that that is starting to fracture.
J. KING (VOICE-OVER): Yet Skonieczny concedes many Trump supporter friends will not budge.
SKONIECZNY: And it's a lot harder -- it's a lot harder than I thought.
(LAUGH)
J. KING (voice-over): Most of Ohio is rural, and rural America is Trump country. But rural also means you drive a lot, high gas prices hurt. Farms dot the rolling hills of Albany in southeast Ohio. This one is unique.
J. KING: The chickens are your supervisors?
(LAUGH)
BILL KRUSLING, OHIO VOTER: Yeah. J. KING (voice-over): 400 or so sheep on 100 grassy acres. Lambing season, these sheep are pregnant. 200 to 250 more little lambs due any day.
KRUSLING: Stay, stay, stay.
J. KING (voice-over): Bill Krusling doesn't need much diesel or any fertilizer, so he's shielded from the Iran war cost spikes hitting many other farmers. He does OK, but is saddled by huge medical debts. His biggest complaints about Washington are corruption and deficit spending.
J. KING: Trump promised to change the health care system, and he hasn't. He promised to reduce the debt, and he hasn't.
KRUSLING: Well, it takes time. He had four years, but he was new to Washington. I don't blame Trump. I blame the Congress.
J. KING: Where am I riding?
KRUSLING: Right here.
J. KING: I'm going to take the dog's seat?
KRUSLING: Yeah. She's coming no matter what.
(LAUGH)
J. KING (voice-over): Krusling says no politician understands this life, and he's mad at both parties for not solving problems. But he will vote Republican in November because he's conservative and because he loves Trump for the very reason so many people can't stand Trump.
J. KING: He seems to like the fights.
KRUSLING: Oh, he loves a fight. He loves a fight. And that's great. That's why I voted for him. This world's got way too many pearl clutchers.
(LAUGH)
KRUSLING: It's like, come on, people. Give me a break.
J. KING (voice-over): Back on the road heading south, Portsmouth is in Scioto County along the Ohio River across from Kentucky. Trump won 74 percent here last time.
Dale King was already wavering on Trump. The Iran war, the last straw. King opened his Portsmouth gym 16 years ago after returning home from two tours in Iraq.
DALE KING, OHIO VOTER: It's crazy because that's, like, 20 years ago.
J. KING (voice-over): His office is full of military mementos, and showing it to a visitor stirs emotion.
D. KING: Like, it's weird. I don't know. 20 years, and then we're dealing with Iran. So it's like, what the [expletive] is this?
(LAUGH)
D. KING: It's just a unique timing thing. Guys are trying to navigate their own healing journey, and now it's like, OK, it's scratching that scab again.
J. KING (voice-over): King voted for Trump in 2016, again in 2024. But he's voting for Democrats in 2026 because he believes the country needs to send Trump a midterm message.
D. KING: I am pro-military. And I am -- I am -- we have a strong need to protect this country. I know there are threats, and I know there are enemies that want to see the downfall of this country. But you can't -- you can't be flippant about war. You can't -- you cannot.
J. KING (voice-over): Conversations with friends here and fellow veterans across the country convince him big change is coming.
D. KING: The shine is kind of coming off the Trump presidency, really kind of see through the true core of who he is versus what he campaigned on.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
[20:50:00]
COOPER: John, what other issues besides the war do Democrats think could help them in Ohio?
J. KING (on camera): Anderson, as you saw at the top of the piece, and here's the map from 2024, look, Donald Trump won 81 of 88 counties, 81 of 88 in Ohio, so be skeptical about the Democratic chances. But the war in Iran may be taking some people like Dale King away.
The manufacturing jobs the President promised, there are some, but there's no big renaissance like he promised. But you see the 81 of 88, this is the map Democrats think gives them hope, Anderson, like it gives them hope across the country. As you come through here, let me just find this and pull this up for you -- sorry, here we go. This doesn't want to cooperate with me today.
It's the affordability issue. The affordability issue is where they see the biggest issue as they come through this year. It was working for me a minute ago, but it's not at the moment, but I will get it for you.
As you come through, the affordability issue, and half of these counties -- half of these counties right now, there we go, half of the counties in Ohio, more than half of them, your costs, the cost of your energy, the cost of your housing, the cost of your groceries are running ahead of your wages. So of the 88 counties, more than half, that's what the Democrats think, not just in Ohio, but across the country. But the fact that this state is in play after 10 years of being out of play, just that in and of itself tells you this is a very different midterm year.
COOPER: I also want to ask you about the Supreme Court ruling today, very significant. The decision will make it harder for voters of color nationwide to challenge redistricting plans under the landmark Voting Rights Act.
Justice Alito, writing for the conservative supermajority, said that Louisiana lawmakers had violated the Constitution by using race in drawing new congressional districts. What could the impact of that be this year's midterms and beyond?
J. KING (on camera): The beyond, I think, is more important, but let's start with this year. There are some states that are going to say, OK, the Supreme Court has given us this green light. Let's do this now. The question is, some of these states have already had their primaries or some have already had early voting. So can they do it, including Louisiana?
What you're looking at here are districts that are majority minority districts, where more than half of the population are members of minorities. I just want to focus here in the states that have been covered mostly by the Voting Rights Act. You see the Louisiana district here. How quickly can they do that? If they don't do it this year, Anderson, that will carry over into 2028.
There are two here in Alabama that are likely, again, will they get that done this year? Probably not, but that will come up in 2028. You have another one over here in Mississippi. This is a huge civil rights decision, but when it comes to the raw politics of it, you've seen redistricting fights all throughout this year.
We've talked about them many times. You have a district here in South Carolina where Republicans say, let's try to redraw this one. This is James Clyburn's district. Can we get that?
Marsha Blackburn is the candidate, Republican candidate for governor in Tennessee. She says, let's go after this one in Memphis. She wants to do that this year.
So you will see some efforts this year. How many of them can get to the finish line, I'm not sure, but this guarantees, this conversation, the whole redistricting fight, and then everything the Republicans do, the Democrats try to counter it. We've watched it this year.
Guess what? We'll watch more this year, Florida, some of these states, and then on to 2028, we're going to do it again.
COOPER: Yeah. John King, thanks very much.
Coming up, King Charles, Queen Camilla, wrapping a busy day here in New York City, which included a visit to the 9/11 Memorial. More on that ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:57:11]
COOPER: King Charles and Queen Camilla are heading back to Washington tonight after a day trip to New York. The royal couple began their visit, paying their respects to the 9/11 Memorial in Lower Manhattan ahead of the 25th anniversary of the terror attacks.
The king later headed uptown to speak to young people at an urban farm in Harlem. It's part of an organization that seeks to bring sustainable agriculture, which is something the king has long focused on to abandon city lots.
For her part, the queen, who has sought to encourage literacy, spoke at a star-studded event at the New York Public Library in Midtown. Joining me now is CNN Royal Correspondent, Max Foster. So what stood out to you about the day, Max?
MAX FOSTER, CNN ROYAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it has to be the 9/11 Memorial, really. No British royal has made a formal visit there. Many British lives were lost. And you know, it was a very poignant moment, I think, for Brits to see that image because I think, you know, actually, if you remember the speech from yesterday that the king gave to Congress, there are echoes of that here.
He talked about how Britain stood with America after 9/11 and went into war in Afghanistan, and many lives were lost there as well. This trip was nearly cancelled because of something Donald Trump had said previously, which was that British troops held back in Afghanistan. They didn't contribute properly. And that caused so much offence in the British Parliament that there was real pressure on the king to cancel this trip. And it was delayed, in fact, because of that.
So I think all of that speaks to, you know, what happened in 9/11, what happened after 9/11, and you know, how that speaks to the speech that he was giving yesterday.
COOPER: Tomorrow is the last day of the royal visit. What's on the agenda?
FOSTER: Well, so the king was very keen not just to be in the cities, but wanted to go out to, you know, outside the cities, go to Main Street, if you like. So he's heading out to Virginia. He'll, of course, be doing an environmental project there, like he always does.
But he's also going to go into a high street of a small town and meet people. So I think what's going to be interesting there is really getting the public's response to this, because we haven't really felt it. There wasn't really a chance for that in New York because of security.
But seeing how he's been received by the American people, because a big part of this was to show that Britain's people have a connection with American people. It's not just about the leaders here. And to see how that speech was received in America, actually, because it was quite pointed in places. But I have to say, Anderson, speaking to people across Europe today, because I wanted to get a sense, really, of how it's being seen from the outside. I think there's a real sense that there's been in the emergence of a champion of the Transatlantic Alliance, the importance of America -- of Europe to America, someone defending those post-war institutions, liberal democracy, if you like, an unlikely champion really.
[21:00:00]
He really came out swinging yesterday and someone who crucially has the president's ear. So I think we've got an interesting figure emerging on the global stage right now.
COOPER: A jolly good show.
(LAUGH)
COOPER: Max, thank you very much. Appreciate it.
That's it for us. The news continues. I'll see you tomorrow. "The Source with Kaitlan Collins" starts now. Have a good night.
