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Amanpour
Pope Pulls No Punches in U.N. Speech; Pope Francis Calls for End to Social Exclusion; Pope Addresses 70th Session of UNGA; Imagine a World. Aired 2-2:30p ET
Aired September 25, 2015 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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POPE FRANCIS (through translator): The Christians, together with the other monotheistic religions, believe that the universe is the fruit of a loving
decision by the creator, who permits man respectfully to use creation for the good of his fellow man and for the glory of the creator. But he is not
authorized to abuse it and much less is he authorized to destroy it.
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CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN HOST (voice-over): Strong applause from the group and we get reaction from the U.N. climate chief.
And later, the U.S. ambassador to the Vatican will join me.
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AMANPOUR: Good evening, everyone and welcome to the program. I'm Christiane Amanpour at the United Nations in New York. And another day,
another dramatic speech from Pope Francis, saying the appeal to the moral conscience of mankind has never been as necessary as it is today,
addressing a major gathering of prime ministers and presidents.
This will be on the 70th anniversary of the United Nations the biggest gathering of world leaders ever as the Holy See's flag flew at the U.N. for
the first time.
Francis was welcomed with an arousing reception before blasting world leaders with an urgent call to unity and determination to use their power
to fix the world's most urgent problems, war and, as he said, the blood- drenched arms trade.
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POPE FRANCIS (through translator): Not only in cases of religious or cultural persecution but in every situation of conflict as in Ukraine,
Syria, Iraq, Libya, South Sudan and the Great Lakes region, real human beings take precedence over partisan interests, however legitimate the
latter may be.
In wars and conflicts, there are individual persons, brothers and sisters, men and women, young and old, boys and girls who weep, suffer and die.
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AMANPOUR: And the pope also said the world must strive for a nonnuclear reality and put his support firmly behind the new Iran nuclear deal.
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POPE FRANCIS (through translator): The recent agreement reached on the nuclear question in a sensitive region of Asia and the Middle East is proof
of the potential of political goodwill and of law, exercised with sincerity, patience and constancy.
I express my hope that this agreement will be lasting and efficacious and bring forth the desired fruits with the cooperation of all the parties
involved.
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AMANPOUR: And for the third time in three speeches, the pope built on his major theme, the protection of our environment, saying that the world had a
duty because the environment has its own intrinsic rights.
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POPE FRANCIS (through translator): In all religions the environment is a fundamental good. The misuse and destruction of the environment are also
accompanied by a relentless process of exclusion; in effect, a selfish and boundless thirst for power and material prosperity leads both to the misuse
of available natural resources and to the exclusion of the weak.
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AMANPOUR: Now perhaps no one was looking more closely at the pope's environmental message than the head of the U.N.'s environmental effort,
Christiana Figueres. And she spoke to me and my colleague, Wolf Blitzer, about the dramatic impact that the pope could bring to this issue.
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AMANPOUR: Christiana, thank you for joining us today as we watched the pope being moved around those grounds in his Popemobile. For your issue,
for climate and the environment, what does his presence and his words and his address to the world do to advance the cause?
CHRISTIANA FIGUERES, U.N. CLIMATE CHIEF: Well, actually it's a very, very exciting day and a very exciting week actually for the United Nations but
for the world because the message of the pope is bringing us a very, very clear one. We do need to look into ourselves and find that space in
ourselves in which we want to take care of each other.
And that is the message that he is bringing loud and clear. It's probably the most eloquent message --
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-- of the moral imperative to act on climate challenge, which, of course, if coupled with the economic imperative that we've been hearing for a long
time, this actually makes this really a non-brainer.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Is it going to have an impact, though?
I guess that's the key question.
Is it really going to have an impact on the United States, indeed, people all over the world?
FIGUERES: I think it's already had an impact. His papal encyclical has truly made people rethink their decisions, their actions, their behavior.
And here in the United States I'm actually quite heartened that, because of the visit of the pope and because of his call to our moral fiber, as I
understand it, there are some Republicans that are already rethinking and wondering should they also change their stand on climate change, which is a
good thing, because climate change should not be a partisan issue.
It is a human challenge and we should all stand above partisan politics and be together on this challenge.
AMANPOUR: Right now the president of China, Xi Jinping, is coming to the White House. He's coming to Washington. He's in the U.S. And there are
reports that he's going to announce some major advances in what China will do to cap emissions and he's already stated that there's going to be
progress by 2030.
How important is that? Because in the end it's about political will of the world leaders, particularly China and India and the others, to get together
on this issue.
FIGUERES: Absolutely. And the announcement that will be made by China and the United States, it would not surprise me if what they bring forward are
details about how they will individually but also collectively implement the very wonderful leadership position that they already took with their
announcement last year of what they are -- how they're going to contribute to the solution.
And I think this second chapter that is coming is not just about setting targets and setting a vision, but actually already going into the nuts and
bolts of what they're going to implement.
China is a fantastic story on what they're doing on climate change. To use one small example, they will be, because of the choking air in so many
cities in China, they're investing in really top-of-the-line urban rail, which is going to produce more than 400,000 jobs this year already.
So, you know, China's really understanding that this is not just about saving the planet. This is about Chinese interests. And more and more
countries -- and that's why we have an upswell of political will because the true change that we've had over the past five years is every country is
increasingly understanding that they can pursue their national interest.
They must pursue their national interests. And by the way, they can also help the global pursuit. Well, that is really playing to the strengths of
every single country when they're actually pursuing their own self- enlightened interests.
BLITZER: I hear you saying you're upbeat that the U.S. and China are now going to announce a major step forward in dealing with this problem, is
that right?
FIGUERES: Yes, yes. That is what we understand.
You know, it's very interesting how climate change has actually acted as a bridge between the United States and China. They have many difficulties.
They have different positions, different views on so many issues.
But on climate change we have seen over the past few years how these two large economies are coming together to understand that they have a shared
responsibility here and that they have a shared interest and that they can act individually within their own boundaries but, that actually by acting
together and bilaterally and bringing the rest of the countries with them, they can even go beyond what they can do within their own boundaries.
So it's a very, very interesting bridge where they truly are showing that this is not a partisan issue. This is not a national issue. This truly is
the global interest.
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AMANPOUR: So, Christiana Figueres talking about the pope effect when it comes to pushing the climate agenda. And among those who are also
listening very closely to the pontiff's address was the U.S. ambassador to the Vatican, Ken Hackett. And he joins me right now outside.
KENNETH HACKETT, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE VATICAN: Thank you, Christiane.
AMANPOUR: So it must have been electrifying for you because it's not just the pope but it was a special transformative moment and these amazingly
huge issues.
Well, it is -- first of all, it's been a long haul, this has been two years in the making. And the issues just kept adding and adding.
And as I've gone through the White House, gone through the shrine, come up here, he's ticked off all the important issues, you know.
Earlier when people asked, I would say, well, he's definitely going to do climate change and meet the poorest of the poor. He went through
everything, including arms trade.
AMANPOUR: Exactly, even the drug trade.
HACKETT: Yes.
AMANPOUR: Financial inequality --
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AMANPOUR: -- the rights of girls and women, the economic inequality, as I said, et cetera, et cetera. So a lot was covered.
Tell me a bit because, look, this is now -- he's here while Xi Jinping, the president of China, is at the White House. The President of the United
States, who appointed you to the Vatican in fact, who made you welcome but very connected because it looks like China is going to step forward in a
major way to push the climate agenda.
HACKETT: No, and this will all culminate of course in Paris and the pope talked about that today and encouraged the nations of the world to kind of
step up to the challenge of climate change. There are climate deniers and all this kind of thing but the rest of the world feels that it must do
something for our future and the future of our children.
AMANPOUR: And he also talked about other international issues which he's close to. Obviously we know and we talked in the United States about Cuba
and the rapprochement that he helped engineer. But he spoke here today about a nuclear-free world and about welcoming the Iran nuclear deal.
Give me an idea --
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HACKETT: That was big. That was big.
AMANPOUR: -- that was big and he got a big applause --
HACKETT: Yes.
AMANPOUR: -- but you, I think, brought sort of the Vatican into at least some of those discussions.
HACKETT: Well, I won't take credit, but continually over the last two years, we've had a series of visitors come in to brief the Vatican and to
engage with them and to hear what they had to say about these very, very important issues -- Iran being only one of them.
The pope also talked about the troubles in Syria and the Middle East, in Sudan and parts of Africa. These things move him and he instructs his team
to, let's do something about this.
AMANPOUR: And he did stand there in the United Nations, obviously the next-door chamber, the Security Council. He alluded to the divisions that
brought a paralysis when it came to dealing with the issues you just talked about.
This terrible five-year nearly war in Syria that's now shown all these refugees all across Europe. He's talked about that.
But he appealed to the conscience of international policy makers, to not just sit around and talk but to do something.
HACKETT: Absolutely. He had a great phrase. I didn't catch it exactly; about dialogue forever and ever. Let's talk about unity and action and
don't just talk and don't just make pronouncements. But let's deliver and we can deliver it in a unified way. And he challenged the U.N. body as
well as welcomed it.
AMANPOUR: He's obviously been at Ground Zero, he's going through Central Park, he's going up to Spanish Harlem. He's touching on all the major New
York landmarks during this visit.
In a word, were you worried about this trip? Did you worry about how he would be received?
How is it going so far?
HACKETT: I never worried about how he would be received. I knew people would love him. I worried about the trip, and the security issues and the
logistic issues and everything that went on. It's come together in a beautiful, beautiful way.
AMANPOUR: Ambassador Kenneth Hackett, thank you so much for joining us.
HACKETT: Thank you, Christiane.
AMANPOUR: And inside that chamber today, the pope talked about getting over partisanship and political division, he talked about political leaders
coming together to serve the best interests of those who elect them and, to that end, incredibly the drama in Washington today as the pope was
speaking, this powerful Speaker of the House of Representatives, John Boehner, announced that he would be resigning, partly because of so much
divisiveness in the U.S. Congress over so many key, key issues.
But, so importantly, it was John Boehner who had engineered and invited the pope to address a historic joint meeting of the U.S. Congress.
John Boehner, himself, a practicing Catholic, moved many times over and over again to tears throughout the pope's meeting in the Congress yesterday
and he announced to his people that he would resign after sleeping on it overnight.
Nobody knew he was going to do it. He recited the Prayer of St. Francis before saying that he was going to resign.
Again, the papal effect, seen here on the streets of this nation and in the halls of power.
And when we come back, we get the reflections of a veteran Vatican watcher. Marco Politi up next.
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AMANPOUR: Welcome back to the program. I'm Christiane Amanpour in New York, where Pope Francis has made his first address to the United Nations.
Now he is the fourth pope but it's the fifth papal address to the General Assembly and it's the 75th anniversary of the U.N. this year. The pontiff
praised the U.N. for its decades of achievements but also said it was high time for reform and he singled out the Security Council and big financial
institutions, saying that unless they give developing countries and their people more influence, they'll continue to be exploited and abused.
So to discuss the pope's trip so far is Marco Politi. He is a veteran Vatican watcher. He's the author of "Pope Francis amongst the Wolves" and
a longtime friend of this show.
Marco, thank you for joining me over there in our studios at CNN headquarters.
Your initial reaction to how he's being welcomed here.
MARCO POLITI, VATICAN EXPERT: Well, he has been welcomed in an extraordinary way and what is astonishing me is that so many people who are
not Catholics and even who are not Christians, maybe they are non- believers, are attracted by the words of this pope.
And this pope actually has a very down-to-earth language. He can speak at the same time to political leaders but is perfectly understood by the
simple people because he speaks always of people as flesh and blood.
As he has said to the United Nations, political leaders never must forget that they are speaking about real lives, suffering people, striving people,
people in poverty, people who are trying to live better. And this is a message which everybody understands.
AMANPOUR: So you are not just a papal watcher, but you're right in the heart of Vatican politics.
Did it surprise you, were you as amazed as everybody here in the United States that, the day after the triumph of inviting the pope to address a
joint meeting of Congress for the first-ever time, the powerful speaker of the U.S. House, John Boehner, announced his resignation and quoted the
prayer of St. Francis as he did it?
POLITI: For me, I have no doubt that the words of Pope Francis resounded in the conscience of Speaker Boehner. Of course, we don't know when and
why and how he decided it, but, for me, it's the first time that I see such a high-ranked political leader, who resigns and quotes the prayer of St.
Francis.
And it is clear that, when he listens, Pope Francis speaking about the fundamentalism, not only in the international scene but also within the
countries, about the risk of political ideological fundamentalism, about the risk to find always or search always enemies within one nation, these
words certainly have impressed Speaker Boehner.
AMANPOUR: Indeed.
And what do you expect finally tonight, how he'll be received at the Families Festival, which is really meant to be the highlight of his trip
and that will be the last visit that's in Philadelphia this weekend?
POLITI: I was yesterday in Philadelphia and I've seen that there is a tremendous expectation for this pope and especially for his message of
love, compassion and hope.
And I think also that the images people sees here in the United States of this interreligious service at the Ground Zero Memorial shows how this pope
is really speaking to humanity beyond the boundaries of religious denominations, because to see the pope together with Muslims, with Jews,
with Hindus, also with Native American religions means that this is really a pope who speaks to the mankind.
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POLITI: And when he speaks about family, he doesn't speak only about the Catholic issue. He speaks about a fundamental institution which exists in
all the cultures and which needs to be enforced today in a very difficult and fragmentary world, as he has said also to the U.N. Assembly.
AMANPOUR: Marco Politi, always valuable reflections. Thank you so much.
And as Marco said, the pope did go to Ground Zero, of course, such a trauma for the people of the United States and the world after 9/11 And he'll see
many other landmark New York sites before heading off to Philadelphia.
Now he's also famously a football fan. He's a supporter of his hometown club, San Lorenzo in Argentina.
So the other major international story that developed and broke during his speech may interest him.
The Swiss attorney general has announced that Sepp Blatter, the outgoing head of football's governing body, FIFA, will face criminal proceedings.
The controversial boss is being investigated for mismanagement and misappropriation, according to the authorities who announced this news
today.
When we come back, from the beautiful game to a beautiful spectacle, this papal visit to the United States has been a riot of color and pomp. We
take a look and we listen to some of the sights and sounds of this historic trip. That's after a break.
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AMANPOUR: And finally tonight, imagine a world in thrall to Pope Francis. It has been a seamless visit so far, first in the nation's capital and now
in the Big Apple. Few are immune to Popemania and we're going to just look back at some of the highlights of this trip so far.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just to get an actual blessing from him was just so amazing.
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POPE FRANCIS (through translator): In the name of the father, of the son and of the holy spirit. Peace be with you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The pope of the holy see.
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POPE FRANCIS: We must move forward together as one in a renewed spirit of fraternity and solidarity.
POPE FRANCIS (through translator): Government leaders must do everything possible to ensure that all can have the minimum spiritual and material
means needed to live in dignity.
POPE FRANCIS: Thank you very much and God bless America.
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AMANPOUR: And that's it for our program tonight. The pope will be in Philadelphia all weekend. Remember, you can always see all our interviews
at amanpour.com and you can follow me on Facebook and Twitter. Thank you for watching and goodbye from New York and the United Nations.
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