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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt
Officials: Two National Guardsmen In Critical Condition After Shooting; Sources: National Guardsmen Shot In D.C. Appeared To Be Targeted, Suspect Is In Custody, Is Not Cooperating. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired November 26, 2025 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news
MANU RAJU, CNN HOST: I'm Manu Raju in Washington. Welcome to THE ARENA. Kasie Hunt is off today.
Right now, fast moving developments in a breaking story here in the nation's capital. Just moments ago, the governor of West Virginia confirming that two members of the National Guard have died after being shot here in Washington, just blocks from the White House. This shooting happening about two hours ago.
President Trump posting online that the suspected shooting is -- shooter is in custody. The president describes that person as, quote, severely wounded.
Let's get right to our team of reporters who are following this story. Brian Todd is near the scene in Washington. Kristen Holmes is traveling with the president in Florida. And also here, our chief law enforcement and intelligence analyst, John Miller.
Brian, first to you. Tell us what you're seeing on the ground and what have you learned in the past hour?
BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right. Manu, we are at 18th and Eighth Streets northwest, about a block and a half from the White House. I'll have our photojournalist, Joe Merkel (ph), kind of train this camera past me and down Eighth Street.
Eighth Street now closed off, you can see there's a huge swarm of police activity. We believe the shooting just occurred just down this block. According to the joint task force, which oversees the National Guard, the shooting occurred at the Farragut -- near Farragut West Metro Station, which is just down the block here. These are Secret Service police officers directing traffic, trying to get traffic cleared from this area.
I just heard this one officer tell people that unless you are parked down here or you're staying at one of the hotels down in that -- in this area of eighth street, even foot traffic not allowed down on that street, the latest that we have been told by West Virginia Governor Patrick Morrisey is that the two National Guardsmen who were shot, have died of their injuries, according to two law enforcement sources who spoke to CNN. The two guardsmen engaged in gunfire with the suspected shooter just before being shot, and the sources tell us that the suspected -- the suspect was detained and then transported away on a stretcher.
In addition, according to the FAA, Reagan National Airport briefly halted flights to the airport as they had to deal with a medevac helicopter activity at the at the airport activity that was, of course, related to the shooting. But we're told that normal operations have resumed.
Manu, what we can also tell you is that we did speak to a witness. Our team spoke to a witness to the shooting. She actually heard the gunshots, didn't physically see them, but heard the gunshots, then turned around and said she saw, quote, a bunch of people administering CPR to people who were on the ground. So very disturbing and kind of a chaotic scene here, were told, near the Farragut West Metro Station, which again, is just down here.
You're looking east on H Street, just down this way. Traffic shut off down here. You can see all the police activity down there. We're told the scene is secure. Suspect is in custody -- Manu.
RAJU: Brian, do we expect a news conference at all from the authorities?
TODD: We're trying to get word of that, Manu. We have not been told anything about that just yet. We're pursuing some information on that. We just don't know yet when they're going to brief us further on this incident. But we;re after it.
RAJU: Okay. All right. We'll be with you back -- back with you.
And, John Miller, what are you hearing from your sources about the nature of the shooting?
JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, there's still obviously piecing it together, but if you listen to what Brian Todd told us, the eyewitness hearing the shots and then seeing people immediately go into CPR, the fact that at least one of the two guardsmen sustained a shot to the head, the gunman who was on scene long enough to be taken into custody, apparently with a handgun, also taken to the hospital for injuries that we do not know the extent of. It is emerging as a possibility that the guardsmen may have been the sole target of this shooting. We have not heard from any of the witnesses or law enforcement authorities was that there was some other incident that they were intervening in.
Of course, all of this is preliminary because there are still more questions than answers because of the speed with which this unfolded. Very quickly, because they patrol that area as part of their normal perimeter duties from the White House, the U.S. Secret Service Uniformed Division was on the scene. I've reviewed some of the photographs where you can see Secret Service Uniformed Division officers actually working on one of the guardsmen, who is down on the sidewalk at that point, trying to apply immediate medical aid as they wait for the ambulance to arrive. What we are also told is that this incident, a couple of blocks from
the White House, and within that patrol zone so far, and again, were early in the investigation, hasn't revealed that there's any White House interest involved in the shooting.
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Right now, it is beginning to appear that the National Guardsmen may have been the sole target of this shooting, but again, still a lot of investigative work to go.
RAJU: And, John, Trump says the suspect is in custody and is severely wounded. Does that tell you that there was some caution that he was shot, that he or she, the -- we don't know this who the suspect is yet, but do we think this person might have been shot in retaliation for shooting these guardsmen?
MILLER: So that is a possibility. I've seen also photographs of that suspect being put into the ambulance. And the wound from the pictures is an apparent as to what it is, but -- but he was removed to the hospital from the scene, and we are aware of the president's statement of him being severely wounded.
Now, those National Guardsmen, because mono they are believed to be part of the D.C. Safe and Beautiful Task Force that was created on orders from the president of the United States. Their rules of engagement are different from many of the National Guardsmen that have been deployed in other cities. They are deputized as special deputy U.S. marshals. So, they go from being National Guardsmen to actual law enforcement officers with those powers and authority in the streets of Washington, D.C., which is they can be armed with loaded weapons. They can use deadly force under the rules of engagement.
So, one -- one of them or both of them may have had a chance to shoot back. But law enforcement was there very quickly and took the gunman into custody. So, still a couple of blank spots in the chain of events there.
RAJU: So, Kristen Holmes, who's traveling with the president in Florida.
Kristen, the president has been briefed. He's posted about this. He did mention that this suspect has been severely wounded. What has he been saying? And what are you hearing from the White House?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: What I'm hearing from the White House is that they're monitoring this very closely.
We also just heard from Vice President J.D. Vance. He was at an event. He was previously scheduled to make remarks. It was a Thanksgiving event. He was talking to troops.
And he did address this at the very top. Now, it did seem as though he wasn't given the breaking news that these National Guardsmen had died when he got up there. But one thing he said that was very interesting and something I know the White House is watching closely, is that there was no known motive at this time.
It goes to show you what they are focusing on, and there still are a lot of details, as John said, as Brian said, you know, they've been talking to a lot of these law enforcement officials, as have I, as to what exactly the larger picture is here. And that's what they're still trying to sort out. And I can tell you, just in the span of five minutes, I was talking to people on the ground who were telling me conflicting information as they were trying to figure out what exactly happened. How did this happen? Why were the shots fired?
And eventually this will change into what was the motive here? Was there any kind of political motive? Was there any motive, given that it was so close to the White House? Now, one of the things that President Trump did when he posted that the suspect was critically injured is he also essentially vowed retribution for the injuring. At that point, we had not confirmed that they had died of these National Guardsmen. So again, you're seeing in real time just how seriously the White House is taking this and just how closely they are watching this.
President Trump really using his platform, as we've seen in a lot of these kind of emergency situations in which he is somewhat adjacent to this shooting happening in D.C. with National Guardsmen who were ordered to be there as part of his crackdown on crime near the White House.
Now, almost breaking news to the public about what exactly had happened. He was the one who said that the two National Guardsmen were in critical condition. He also said that the suspect had been in critical condition, so we can likely expect more updates from him as well as he is briefed.
And one thing, Manu, just to, you know, kind of close the loop on this, it's not just that the White House is focused on this. We are seeing almost every federal agency, law enforcement agency on the ground working with the local -- the local police in Washington, D.C., to try and get a handle on what happened, which just goes to show you this is a huge presence on the ground, just how seriously the administration as a whole is taking what happened today.
RAJU: Yeah. And just to fill you in, if you're just tuning in to this breaking news that happened just a couple hours ago, shooting about northwest of the White House, very close to the White House, two National Guardsmen have been killed in the shooting. The suspect is injured and is in custody.
The governor of West Virginia, Patrick Morrissey, posting on X: "It is with great sorrow that we can confirm both members of the West Virginia National Guard were shot earlier today in Washington, D.C. have passed away from their injuries."
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He goes on to say, "These brave West Virginians lost their lives in the service of their country."
I want to bring back Brian Todd, who is on the ground in our just out -- just near the scene there.
And, Brian, there's been a lot of discussion about Trump's deployment of the National Guard. There are about 2,000 National Guard troops that are in D.C. right now. A federal judge a few days ago, last week had struck down, said that it was not legal to send these National Guards into the streets of D.C., but had given some time for the administration to appeal that ruling. So that's why we're still seeing these guardsmen in D.C.
What do you, as you go around D.C., as you cover what's happening in the streets of the district, how widespread are these troops deployed? How -- where do you see them deployed? And how active are they in engaging in crime in the streets in D.C.?
TODD: Well, Manu, that's been a point of some controversy since the National Guardsmen were deployed here in August. They came from states like West Virginia. You heard the governor saying that the two members of the West Virginia National Guard were the two guardsmen who were killed today.
They came from Mississippi. They came from Ohio, South Carolina, and other states as well. It has been controversial ever since they got here. Mostly, they've been patrolling near the monuments. They've been patrolling near a metro stations. As a matter of fact, the joint task force said this shooting happened just outside the Farragut West Metro Station, which is just down this way.
And during in my covering of the of the law enforcement surge in August and in September, my teams and I noticed that a lot of people would kind of crowd around the National Guardsmen. The vast majority of people were friendly. They wanted to take selfies with them. They wanted to take pictures of them and didn't bother them.
But we did witness protests, several protests against the National Guard deployment. We did witness people who were coming up to them and jeering at them and yelling angrily at them to go back home. So, their deployment here, of course, was not without some controversy.
Another aspect of their deployment, I can tell you, was that in the initial days that they were here they were not authorized to carry firearms, and then they were later allowed to carry firearms in some instances.
But mostly they have been deployed in areas like, again, popular areas for nightclubs and restaurants. Weve seen them in those areas. Weve seen them down near this area, near the White House, of course. And this is where this shooting took place. We've seen them near the monuments and again near metro stations.
And most of the National Guardsmen are very young people. They come from, all sorts of places in rural areas of Louisiana, West Virginia, areas like that. Weve talked to them on occasion. And you know, you just get a sense that they're here to do a job. They wanted to do that job and then go home as soon as possible.
But you know, again, it's been pretty much controversial since the moment they set foot in the city.
RAJU: Brian, your team has been talking to people on the ground near the scene. What are you hearing from people as they're walking by, as they're reacting to this news and from anyone who may have witnessed at least the response to this heinous act.
TODD: Well, we did talk to one witness, a lady who said that she heard the gunshots and then turned around and saw several people. She -- the quote was a whole bunch of people administering CPR to someone who was on the ground. That's one witness account that we got.
Other people who have been walking around this area have actually been asking us questions about what happened. There's a lot of confusion, as there always is in situations like this. And again, I'll just kind of take you past me here.
As you can see, the law enforcement presence, they are directing traffic. They just told people over here who are trying to go down H Street -- on east on H Street here, that unless you're parked down here or staying in a hotel down here, they were not even allowing foot traffic down here.
Now, they did just open this portion of H Street over here to my right. Your left. You can see some buses and other vehicles going through. This was closed until a moment ago. And you see these are Secret Service police who are directing traffic.
They're just trying to eliminate some of the snarl in this area that comes with so many streets being closed down. My team and I again had to park several blocks away and walk several blocks just to get to this location.
A lot of streets in the downtown area in Washington, D.C. shut down as a result of this incident. They will probably be shut down for hours to come.
RAJU: John Miller, talk to me about how the investigation is expected to play out here, particularly with so many law enforcement agencies involved in this.
MILLER: Well, you have the entire alphabet soup of the federal law enforcement community there because its Washington, D.C., and this was an attack on two federal officers, not just members of the National Guard, but we believe that they would have been part of the deputized law enforcement group that's been deployed there, which means this is not just a D.C. homicide case, which, of course, is enormously important. If somebody is -- two people are gunned down and killed blocks from the White House and the nation's capital.
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But when those two people are there as government employees serving their country on their mission, and they are targeted, apparently, and a law enforcement source has just confirmed to me that based on what they know so far, it appears the gunman walked up and targeted the two guard members outside of any other incident going on. So, it is starting to emerge a picture of what could be an ambush because they were there in their National Guard uniforms.
That makes it an assault on federal officers. So you'll have the D.C. homicide case running in parallel with an FBI investigation led by the Joint Terrorism Task Force because of where we are and who was targeted. And both of those are going to merge together.
RAJU: And I'm just want to read a news statement we have gotten from the governor of West Virginia, Patrick Morrissey, who is saying this now? He said, we are now receiving conflicting reports about the condition of our two guard members and will provide additional updates once we receive more complete information. Our prayers are with these brave service members, their families in the entire guard community.
That was at 4:04 p.m. so just moments ago, remember, that was just -- just before he had just after he had posted that the two members were shot and they had died from their injuries.
So, John Miller, what are you -- what's your -- I mean, hopefully, this is good news that these members are still alive and they're fighting for their life and can make it through these injuries and these gunshot wounds. What's your reaction to the governor now saying that these conflicting reports about their condition and they're going to wait to give additional updates until they get more complete information?
MILLER: Well, it's -- it's one of the things that you see when you have politicians and elected officials who jump into these things and, and get into that news cycle.
One of the things that you experience when you get used to showing up to these things as a commander, as an investigator, as I have many times, is that the first story is never right and that the details don't come together all at once. It is a series of pixels that, you know, you have to develop and get a richer picture as you go. So, I'm not surprised at the sudden reversal, but we can only pray that it's correct and that it stays correct. That one or more of them has survived.
This is part of the fog of war, and it's why, even as I describe these things as does Chuck Ramsey and Andy McCabe, we always start off with this is preliminary and it's still coming together. So that could be a glimmer of better news. But again, we're going to have to wait until we get the official word from medical people where they're being cared for because they're the only ones who are going to really know.
RAJU: Yeah. So just again, if you're just tuning in, the shooting near the White House a couple hours ago, two National Guardsmen shot initially, the governor of West Virginia said that they had died from the shooting that occurred. But now the governor is saying that there's conflicting information out there, and they'll provide additional updates once they receive more complete information. So well try to learn more about their condition as the shooter is also in custody and also injured as well.
John, stay with us, because joining me now is former senior FBI official and active shooter expert Katherine Schweit, and former Washington, D.C., police chief, Charles Ramsey. He's a CNN senior law enforcement analyst. And we're also joined by phone by Steve Moore. He's a CNN law enforcement contributor and a retired FBI agent.
So, Charles, first to you, you. This is a city which you, of course, ran this police department for some time. Walk us through what you're -- what you expect is happening behind the scenes right now among law enforcement.
CHIEF CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, behind the scenes, since this individual who committed the crime is in custody, they've no doubt already ID'd him. They're now, taking steps to go through his social media footprint. Probably executing search warrants at a at a residence, a vehicle, if he had a vehicle in the area, they're trying to get as much information as possible to try to determine the motive.
I mean, John is coming up with a lot of information from the scene right now, but there's also an awful lot of questions that are unanswered. He's absolutely right. There'd be a parallel investigation going on with D.C. homicide as well as the JTFF, because these people were -- these individuals were, guardsmen.
Hopefully, the second post that we got from the governor is good news.
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But it also points out a problem with social media and people wanting to be the first to get information out and information that is not always accurate. And, you know, these people have families and they watch television and to think that your loved one has been murdered and if it turns out not to be true, think about the trauma that causes.
So, you need to have facts. And John was also right when he said the first story is usually not right. The late John Timoney said that all the time. And, he was absolutely right. Until you have some real investigation taking place and you start to find out the facts that as you know them to be based on, you know, some evidence or statements or whatever that's -- that information will be -- will be made public at some point in time.
But you always have people that want to jump the gun and want to put too much information out there, not really having access to all the information. I hope these individuals are still alive, fighting for their lives. I truly do hope that's the case.
But right now, police are focused on the investigation. And trying to get to the bottom of the why this took place.
RAJU: Yeah. And, Katherine, this is one of your areas of expertise. So, tell us what investigators are doing now with the suspect who is in custody
KATHERINE SCHWEIT, ACTIVE SHOOTER EXPERT: You know, I think the idea behind -- well, this guy's in custody right now, it's all -- what the chief just mentioned. The idea that despite the frustration and the anger that the -- that the whole rest of the team has in D.C. police and the rest of the National Guard, all the law enforcement, they have to do their jobs, so they have to dig in and, and collect the evidence they can and, and try to find out what do they know about the suspect and try to be able to answer the questions that really the public wants answered more than anything else? The people who are the family members and the friends of the guardsmen.
And it's kind of reminiscent of, you know, just we just passed the 21st anniversary of the loss of Martha Dixon Martinez, Michael Miller, as the chief knows, Hank Daly from MPD, killed right in their office right here in downtown in the -- November 22nd, 21 years ago. And we just passed that anniversary and saw how it traumatized the city and law enforcement then. And they're going through that kind of trauma again, but they still have to do their jobs.
RAJU: And, you know, Katherine, when we do get a chance to hear publicly from the police, what are you going to be listening for? And also, when do we expect them to actually reveal the identity of the suspect, given that this person is in custody right now?
SCHWEIT: You know, I spend a lot of time and all I work on, it seems like, is these kinds of targeted acts of violence that we see right now. And they'll -- they'll release the information as soon as they are valid. As soon as it's valid, they're going to release it because social media, everybody is a citizen journalist now with phones, and there'll be pictures out there that eventually will be circulating.
And the law enforcements job, as we have learned, especially over the last few, maybe 15 or 20 years, is to get the best and most accurate information out there as fast as you can in order to quell rumors and the social media stuff that's out there, we want to make sure that we end the conspiracy theories that are constantly out there.
So, you know, as we advise everybody in law enforcement and they are well-aware, getting the information out, and so they are, as John said, getting the information gathered as fast as they can, as accurately as they can to answer all the questions that we know they're going to, that the law enforcement is going to have.
You know, one thing I will add, too, is that, you know, one of the questions, one of the concerns that I have is that this is -- this is -- I work in this area. This is an increasing we have seen in the last 15 years, an increasing effort to target law enforcement, specifically around the United States. So, although this is happening here in Washington, D.C., where we are, we know that this is happening across the country.
RAJU: Yeah. Steve Moore, you're also former FBI. I want to get your sense to respond to that. I mean, do you think this was a premeditated attack against these guardsmen?
STEVE MOORE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CONTRIBUTOR (via telephone): Well, it seems circumstantially again, I don't want to get into speculating here, but it's circumstantially it seems very possible that this was a targeted attack against the -- against the National Guardsmen. And the only reason you would do that, the only, only statistically relevant reason you would do that is for political reasons, for basically domestic terrorism or international terrorism, whoever would be responsible.
So, the JTTF now, besides the murder of a federal officer or potential murder of a federal officer investigation, you also have to have a concurrent terrorism investigation.
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And what you need to know right now is, is, first of all, is it over? I mean, you got to get on the -- on his web pages, on the suspect's social media, interview friends and find out. Is this a lone wolf? Or are we to expect other attacks?
RAJU: And, Steve, Kash Patel, the FBI director, posted on social media that the agency is also involved here. Is that what you would expect at this point of the investigation?
MOORE: Yeah, yeah, I would expect, in fact, that -- well, the JTTF is led by the FBI to begin with. So, I would assume that the JTTF is working out there and leading the investigation on this because it is in a federal state. These were federal victims, and it seems to be a very strong circumstantial case that this was targeted violence for political purposes, which is the definition of terrorism.
RAJU: And, Charles Ramsey, back to you, because, you know, these National Guard troops have been deployed for a couple of months now, at least. There have been about 2,000 or so that have been in the district. From what you've understood, how have they worked with the local police department, the Metropolitan Police Department in the Washington, in the District of Columbia? How -- what have you heard about their ability to work together? Have there been any challenges in having these troops deployed or in how they resolved those?
RAMSEY: Well, from people inside of MPD that I'm still in touch with? I mean, they're still not as strong a coordination as perhaps it should be in terms of the activities of the National Guard, but primarily they're around federal monuments, Union Station, they're pretty much in the downtown D.C. area, patrolling. I was just in D.C. last week, and as I was walking to union station and came across four guardsmen walking together and exchanged pleasantries and so forth.
So, there is better coordination now than it was initially. Initially, there was zero coordination with the Metropolitan Police Department. My understanding is it's improved, since then.
RAJU: And, Charles, what about this? The way D.C. is secured, how challenging it is to secure a city like D.C. with, of course, the president and leaders of Congress and all the monuments and the like. What -- what is it about D.C. that makes it uniquely challenging compared to other major cities?
RAMSEY: Well, I mean, it's the nation's capital. You know, I came up through the Chicago Police Department and I later served in the Philadelphia Police Department, and there's very little comparison in terms of the challenges that you face in in Washington, especially post-9/11 you know, I mean, the amount of protection it takes when you have heads of state, certain heads of state, and president, vice president and so forth.
I mean, it's a challenge. But having said that, there are a lot of law enforcement agencies in D.C. and one thing that I have found with the national capital region is unlike the other places where I have worked, the level of cooperation between federal and local is incredibly strong. Just on a -- just on a regular daily basis, the way in which they work together, it's pretty seamless. And so, you know, it makes the job a lot easier.
RAJU: All right. I want you all to stand by because we have some new reporting from our colleague Evan Perez, who's here in Washington.
Evan, what are you learning?
EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Manu, what we've learned is that there's video of this shooting happening there in Washington, downtown Washington. This happened near Farragut square. Theres a couple of metro stations right there.
And according to sources that we've talked to, the shooting went down like this gunman walks up at a very fast pace. The guardsmen, there were at least two, perhaps three guardsmen who were standing there appeared not to have seen him approach. And he opens fire mere feet away from one of them, strikes at least one of the guardsmen. One of the guardsmen runs from behind, tries to -- appears to try to shelter behind a bus shelter that was right nearby, and the gunman managed to get three shots off before someone appears to have returned fire.
Now, there's still a lot of this scene that we are still trying to get to the bottom of. It's not clear who fired that shot. It might have been the guardsmen who was able to return fire, but what is being described here -- certainly what plays out on that video is an ambush situation where you have these guardsmen, you've seen them around Washington.
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You passed them on the streets. They tend to be in high traffic areas near metro stations, especially where there's a lot of foot traffic. And, you know, sometimes, they're very friendly. They're talking to people who are passing by. In this case, they appear to not have seen the assailant approach them and he opens fire.
So that's the scene of what happens there again, shortly after around 2:00 or so this afternoon in downtown Washington. Now, the suspect appears to have been either -- either injured, either by a gunshot or by some of the breaking glass from that -- from that, bus shelter. At this point, or at least the sources we've talked to said he was not cooperating, initially with law enforcement. Didn't have any identification.
So, the work of trying to figure out who he is, what motivated this? You know, what precipitated any of this is, of course, now going to be a little bit more complicated. While the fact is that he is still alive. So, there is the chance that they can try to get some information out of him eventually, but at least at the outset, he was not cooperating with police, with law enforcement.
And you see there the scene, you know, the FBI is there, based on the fact that these were National Guardsmen and the way this played out, it appears this is likely going to become something that the FBI will have to handle more, you know, in the lead. Right now, though, it's still the metropolitan police, at least for the time being -- Manu.
RAJU: Evan, I just want to make clear. So, three shots -- this is -- appears to be an ambush from this assailant who fired three shots at these two guards members. And we don't -- it's not clear if the any either of these guardsmen or if someone else fired back at the assailant. Is that right?
PEREZ: That's right. There appeared to have been an exchange of gunfire at some point. They believe, again, law enforcement believes that the assailant has been injured either by a gunshot or perhaps by that -- by that breaking glass. Again, this is early information, and the investigation is still very at the early stage -- at the very early stages.
But it appears someone managed to get a return shot at the assailant. It might have been that third guardsman that was standing nearby. But certainly, before those three shots are fired, it's not clear that any of them saw what was happening -- Manu.
RAJU: All right. CNN's Evan Perez -- we'll be back with you with any new information as well.
Let me bring back Katherine Schweit, Charles Ramsey and Steve Moore.
So, Katherine, what do you take away from that news right there about how this played out? And there's apparently -- appears to be video surveillance of this and that appear to be an ambush that this assailant carried out against these guardsmen.
SCHWEIT: You know, looking at all the, looking at all the incidents over the years, it doesn't -- it kind of doesn't surprise me because the increased, assaults on law enforcement, they -- although the incidents of deaths, have has gone down over the last 15 years for law enforcement officers and these kinds of situations, the incidents where they have been the target has gone up significantly, especially in the last 15 years.
And what we have now, which is great, is the things that will give us the answers right away to know that it was targeted, that will help the investigators hone down. But the idea that law enforcement, in the broad sense, including military, anybody in a uniform, is a much higher target now than they were before, changes the way law enforcement is having to -- having to, you know, function day to day and approach their lives day to day and how they do their jobs, walking up to somebody can get them killed in a different way than it could get them killed in years past.
RAJU: And, Steve Moore, what did -- what's your takeaway from that breaking news, involving how this shooting may have happened? And what do you think the investigators are using trying to learn from that piece of information from their videotape?
MOORE: Well, it kind of strengthens the circumstantial evidence for a -- for a targeted attack, a terrorist attack, basically, against these officers. And the location where they were -- next to the -- next to the underground there makes it almost certain that there are at least one, possibly multiple camera angles. Plus, what they will do now is they will go back and find the direction from which the assailant walked, where he came from.
And in Washington, you almost get radiation burns from all the cameras that are on you. So, they could probably follow him back all the way to where he started his -- started his beeline towards where the officers were. They'll probably also see some pre-surveillance to make sure the targets were there.
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And there might even be people assisting him, at that location. So there's so much -- you're looking for. It could be a lone wolf, but you could have had several people at that location providing surveillance updates for him. So, he right now is cameras.
RAJU: Yeah. No question about it.
And, Charles, how does this investigation change based on this reporting that these guardsmen were targeted, Charles?
RAMSEY: Well, I mean, if they -- if they classify this as some form of terrorism, then FBI would take over. But the D.C. police will still be conducting a homicide investigation.
So, again, as Miller said earlier, it'll be a parallel track. But this does really, you know, put it right in the lap of the FBI Joint Terrorism Task Force, as well. So, a lot of things are still unanswered. A lot of questions unanswered. But it's beginning to lean in that direction.
Steve mentioned the videos. They'll be able to go back if he came to that location using a metro, they'll be able to track all the way back to where he first got on the metro and so forth. So that's going to be critical piece of evidence right now is that video.
So, there are a lot of behind the scene things going on. They've fingerprinted this guy no doubt and got his ID pretty quickly. You know, checking social media, locking that down -- all this stuff will be done before a name comes out.
Because once a name comes out, you get, you know, a private people that you know, think they're super sleuths. You got to deal with media going to certain locations and all that sort of thing. So, you want to get as much done as possible before that person's name is released, so that you can maintain the integrity of the investigation best you can.
RAJU: And, Charles, we're just learning that President Trump is now requesting 500 additional National Guard troops to be sent to D.C. That's according to Secretary Pete Hegseth.
What is your reaction to that? The president now plans to deploy an additional 500 National Guard troops. Remember, this is all coming in the backdrop that there's this legal fight carrying out right now about whether he's actually allowed to send these troops into the District of Columbia.
One judge said that it is a violation of the law. The administration is fighting that right now. But now the president is saying 500 more troops in the wake of the shooting. What's your reaction?
RAMSEY: Well, listen, 500 more troops. I mean, if he chooses to send them, but it's not going to change what took place today. And, you know, it's just not going to do anything for that.
So, I mean, you got politics, you got all this sort of thing going on right now. But the reality is that, you know, they're acting, in a capacity of a law enforcement officer. That's what they're there for.
And that puts them at risk automatically. I mean, you know, right, in Washington, you have the memorial for police officers, more than 24,000 names on it. I mean, being a cop is a dangerous job. And if you are going to be part of that -- these are certain risks that are inherent in all that.
But sending 500 more guards, it's not going to do a damn thing to change what just happened today.
RAJU: Yeah, it certainly won't change what happened today.
For folks who are just tuning in, of course, this is a shooting that occurred a couple of hours ago, two National Guardsmen. We don't know their condition. They have been shot. We were told initially there were some reports, according to the West Virginia governor who said that they were killed.
Now, we don't know their condition. He has walked back that statement. The president Trump has been in Florida right now. He has been briefed on this. He is sending 500 additional National Guard troops into D.C. That is according to the secretary of defense.
Steven Moore, who is still with us here, what do you think the impact of sending 500 additional National Guard troops will be into the District of Columbia?
Oh, I think we have lost Steve.
So, Katherine, if you're still with me, I'm going to ask you the same question. What do you think the impact is going to be, if any of these additional National Guardsmen being sent into D.C.?
SCHWEIT: Yeah, I am still with you. And as we as I always will be, as we always will be, Manu. But, I think what the chief said is accurate. It's not going to make a bit of difference.
D.C. is a proper -- is not a huge area. It is. You cannot walk a block without running into somebody who's in law enforcement in D.C. anyway.
I was -- I was actually down by the White House right after this, right before this occurred. There's law enforcement, National Guard everywhere. There are a bunch of agencies there.
And sending -- sending 500 more National Guards who are not trained to be patrol officers and don't necessarily have the knowledge of the neighborhoods and how to get around in a -- in a -- in a reactionary way, sending them all there is really for people who want to do this kind of targeted violence.
[16:40:12]
You're in, you're just creating more targets for them. So, I don't think that that's really a smart or safe thing to do. Obviously, I'm not in charge. And it's, of course, there may be more and other factors that I'm not aware of.
And I certainly -- I respect that, but I'd love to see us not overreact at this moment, even though frustration and anger are there right now. We need to get some facts. But more law enforcement officers on the street, as the chief said, would not have prevented this from happening. If it was, as it appears, a targeted attack.
RAJU: Yeah, a targeted attack. Our reporting is that these people were -- these guardsmen were ambushed and that the suspect is wounded and is in custody.
But, Katherine, we are also now reporting that the suspect is not cooperating. So how do you, as an investigator, change that? And what kind of impact will that have on this investigation?
SCHWEIT: Actually, very -- very little is certainly, in the beginning. Targeted violence is a planned attack. They plan and they prepare. And every action that that subject takes to plan and prepare, all of his or her movements, in this case, a gentleman is all, I understand is a gentleman that all the planning and preparation.
There's a record of, whether it's their internet activity, the surveillance activity that they might have seen with their phones, allows us to track where they -- where they did, how they walked, where they went, what was in their vehicle if they had a vehicle. This person very oftentimes we see somebody who does this kind of targeted attack drives into the town where they do it, rents a hotel room or lives out of their car for a night, that all of that evidence will be there, whether the subject cooperates or not.
Plus, in addition to that, of course, law enforcement is going to speak to family members, find out where this person last lived, currently lives, lived previously, going to get search warrants for every place they lived, every vehicle they might have had access to an office, things like that. And look through those things.
Look at the pocket litter that's on their person. That's going to give us more information. So, the words out of this person, I think what we want to hear is I did it because of this. And that's really motivation. And motivation is the last thing that we have to actually worry about when it comes to proving a case.
RAJU: And we have Steve Moore back with us.
So, Steve, as former FBI who knows how to handle cases like this, wondering if you see, we're learning that this suspect is not cooperating with authorities. What is your reaction to that? And what's the impact of that?
MOORE: Well, the fact that he's not cooperating again, goes to the circumstantial evidence for an intentional attack. As far as what it's going to do to the case, it's not going to hurt the case all that much because we know what he did. He's on video. We're going to know exactly from all of his planning, from his friends, from his social media, exactly what he intended to do.
And the case will be made whether he keeps his mouth shut or not. But we will be able to. They will be able to make the case. And establish the motive. I predict by the information they find on social media.
RAJU: And, Steve, were also told that the suspect had no identification on him at the time of the arrest. What does that tell you? Is that normal?
MOORE: Well, that this is all falling into -- into line. I mean, this is a person who, did not expect to get away because, you know, he didn't want to be identified when he was captured. That's why he didn't have the ID on him. So, this is not somebody who is just going to the store here without ID, without any kind of information. So, yeah, it really strengthens you know, kind of the growing my growing belief that this was nothing but targeted violence.
And it also -- it also shows a little bit of planning. He's just not some guy who goes out there buys a gun and thinks this guy planned it to the point of his route to the location. He knew that they were going to be there. He had his weapon. He didn't bring ID.
This shows some prior planning, and that's concerning because then you make -- you want to know whether he made this all up himself or he had some training -- excuse me -- training in it.
RAJU: I want to go back to south Florida, where Kristen Holmes is traveling with the president, who's been getting reaction from the White House.
Kristen, what are you learning right now about how the president is reacting to this? And what are people inside the White House telling you as this news continues to develop?
[16:45:03]
HOLMES: Yeah, well, we just have now heard from the secretary of defense, Pete Hegseth, who says that they are sending 500 more troops to Washington, D.C. in response to this horrific shooting earlier today.
And I will tell you, Manu, earlier in the day, right as this was happening, I was speaking to people who worked for the D.C. government, people who were part of the D.C. first responders, who, kind of assumed that this is where this was going to go after the shooting happened, that President Trump was going to deploy more troops to the city of Washington.
And now, of course, we see President Trump has, in fact, done that. One of the things I've been hearing from the White House, from various officials, not just in the White House, but also the surrounding administration, is there are still a lot of questions about motive.
Obviously, now, we've seen this video. Now we have this information about the suspect not having ID on him, seemingly being premeditated. And one of the things I know that you've been talking to folks about today is just how the National Guard has somehow, in this process, become incredibly politicized. It's become almost a political flashpoint.
So, as they're figuring out the actual logistics of the shooting, how this happened, how this played out, they're also really looking into the motive here. Was this political? Was the fact that these two guardsmen being near the White House, part of some sort of message that the shooter was trying to send.
Right now, President Trump, this is his reaction other than his Truth Social post is sending more troops to be on the ground in Washington, D.C. They say -- they being the press -- excuse me, the secretary of defense, that this is about making sure the city of D.C. is beautiful and safe.
But this is also likely to heighten some of the political tension here when you have people already stopping some of these National Guardsmen on the street and insulting them or saying they shouldn't be there. Also, now having even more of them, on the ground in Washington, D.C.
RAJU: I just want -- Kristen, I just want to jump in because I want to direct our viewers what they're seeing on the screen here. We're expecting an update here from both D.C. and federal officials.
You're seeing the FBI director, Kash Patel. You're seeing the D.C. mayor, Muriel Bowser. Other law enforcement officials --
KASH PATEL, FBI DIRECTOR: Good afternoon, everybody. My name is Kash Patel, FBI director.
We're here to brief you on the tragic events that happened today at approximately 215 local time in Washington, D.C., where two of our brave members of the National Guard and the Department of War were brazenly attacked in a horrendous act of violence. They were shot. They're in critical condition.
As you can see behind me, we have assembled the full force of both the federal and state and local law enforcement agencies to bring to bear all of our resources, to make sure we find the perpetrators responsible for this heinous act. And make no mistake, they will be brought to justice. Since this is an assault on a federal law enforcement officer, this
will be treated at the federal level as an assault on a federal officer, law enforcement officer. The FBI will lead out on that mission with our interagency partners to include the Department of Homeland Security, Secret Service, ATF, DEA.
And we're thankful for the mayor's assistance in this matter. The Metropolitan Police Department and their skills in investigating homicides and gun shootings in this city is exceptional. We will work together collaboratively because this is a matter of national security, because it's a matter of pride.
President Trump has been informed. We've been in contact with the White House. We will -- we will shortchange the American public with no resources to make sure we find and safeguard our nation's capital right here in Washington, D.C., and bring anyone responsible for this heinous act of violence to justice.
I would lastly like to add to the American public and the world, please send your prayers to those brave warriors who are in critical condition and their families. They are here serving our country. They are here protecting everyday Americans and citizens around the world, in our nation's capital. They are the heroes of this day, and we must remember them on this day and every day, and their families and the sacrifice they have made.
I will now turn it over to Chief Carroll, the Metropolitan Police Department. Thank you.
JEFF CARROLL, EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT CHIEF, METROPOLITAN POLICE DEPARTMENT: Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Jeff Carroll. I'm the executive assistant chief here at the metropolitan police department.
At approximately, 2:15 this afternoon, members of the D.C. National Guard were on high visibility patrols in the area of 17th and I Street Northwest when a suspect came around the corner, raised his arm with a firearm and discharged at the National Guard members. The National Guard members, there were other members that were in the area, they were able to after -- some back and forth, able to subdue the individual and bring them into custody.
Within moments, members of law enforcement in the area were also able to assist and bring that individual into custody. At this time, as the director mentioned, the National Guard members are being treated at a local hospital. D.C. Fire and EMS responded to the scene to provide first aid for those individuals and transport them to a local hospital.
[16:50:00]
The suspect in this case was also transported for treatment at a local hospital.
Madam Mayor?
MAYOR MURIEL BOWSER, WASHINGTON, D.C.: Thank you.
I'm Muriel Bowser. I'm the mayor of Washington, D.C. and I too want to send my thoughts and prayers to the families of the guardsmen and to the guardsmen who are in critical condition in a local hospital.
I am joined by members and leadership from the D.C. National Guard from the West Virginia National Guard, United States Secret Service, Deputy Mayor Appiah, Fire Chief Donnelly and Metro's general manager Randy Clarke.
And we join with the FBI director in insuring that MPD investigates, the U.S. attorney prosecutes this case to the fullest extent of the law. I've had the opportunity to brief U.S. Attorney General Pam Bondi who was speaking to the president when I called, as well as the United States Attorney Pirro, who assured me that this case will have her office's complete attention.
REPORTER: Mayor, was there any other suspect?
BOWSER: Chief?
CARROLL: Sure. So, no. At this time, there is no indication there was any other suspect. The one suspect that was involved in this incident. They were shot during the interaction, and they were transported to the hospital for treatment.
REPORTER: Mayor, does this validate the need for the National Guard here in D.C.?
BOWSER: What we know, Andrea, is that this is a targeted shooting. One individual who appeared to target these guardsmen, that individual has been taken into custody.
REPORTER: Mayor, can you tell us any more details on the condition of the two National Guardsmen and whether or not anyone else was injured?
And a quick question. Follow up for the FBI director. You said that we'll make sure we find the perpetrators for this act. So just to clarify, the person believed to be responsible is in custody, and there are no other suspects.
CARROLL: Sure. So I can start out again. Chief Carroll from MPD.
So, both the individuals, the guard members, they are in critical condition at local hospital at this time, being treated. At this point, we have no other suspects. We have reviewed video from the area.
It appears, like I said, to be a lone gunman that raised the firearm and ambushed these members of the National Guard, and he was quickly taken into custody by other National Guard members and law enforcement members.
REPORTER: Any sense of motive?
REPORTER: Motive? CARROLL: No. At this time, obviously, we're very in the preliminary
stages, investigation. You know, there's a lot of things, a lot of agents that are here from various federal agencies, law enforcement agencies. We have the full power of the FBI and our federal partners here, the task force. So we're looking at all those different aspects, but we don't have any motive.
REPORTER: The National Guardsmen were armed, sir?
CARROLL: The National Guardsmen that were shot, I'm told they were armed.
REPORTER: Did they get off shots?
CARROLL: At this time, that's part of the preliminary investigation.
REPORTER: Can you explain how the suspect was apprehended?
CARROLL: Sure. So how the suspect was apprehended? As I said, the individual the suspect came around the corner. He immediately started firing a firearm at the two National Guard members.
So, at that time, there were other National Guard members that were in the area. They heard the gunfire. They actually were able to intervene and to kind of hold down the suspect after he had been shot on the ground. So, law enforcement got there within moments.
REPORTER: He was shot by National Guardsmen.
CARROLL: At this point, were still investigating exactly who shot the individual. It's not clear at this time.
REPORTER: Chief, do you know what kind of weapon was used?
CARROLL: We don't know what kind of weapon. There was D.C. police. It happened right in front of the metro. Although there is no indication that the perpetrator was on the metro. So there's metro transit police in the area. And obviously being on 17th Street by the White House, uniformed division of the Secret Service were in the immediate area as well.
REPORTER: What kind of weapon the alleged perpetrator used?
CARROLL: We do not know at this time, still under investigation.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're going to be able to take a couple.
REPORTER: -- has been able to question the suspect or is his condition so severe that you haven't been able to have a conversation?
CARROLL: Sure. So, as I said, we're very preliminary in the investigation. So we're looking into all aspects of who the individual is. His connections at this time. He's still in the hospital receiving treatment.
PATEL: And I would just like to hang on. I would just like to add the reason that this suspect is the reason that this suspect is in custody is because of the bravery of the men and women of the National Guard who responded due to their extensive training to secure American lives. Today, there was not any further injury and any further shootings.
We should highlight the fact that the men and women of law enforcement, the interagency, the Department of War and the National Guard executed their training with great precision today and prevented an even greater tragedy from befalling us.
These National Guardsmen are heroes, and we must pray for their safety and their speedy recovery. And as the chief said, we are in the preliminary stages of this investigation. We will run down every single lead, every piece of evidence.
This is the power of the U.S. government at its best, at the state, local and federal level. That is why this interagency group is standing behind us to assure America and the world that we will continue to keep D.C. safe. And thankfully, we have Metropolitan Police Department, the National Guardsmen and federal agents, and the Department of Justice and attorney general willing to prosecute the mission to keep Americans safe.
[16:55:02]
And President Trump has rightly stated that this heinous act will be investigated. And he has thanked the National Guardsmen and women and the men and women of law enforcement.
(CROSSTALK)
REPORTER: Did the suspect say anything at the time?
REPORTER: Why did the West Virginia governor say that the --
RAJU: All right. That was FBI Director Kash Patel, Washington, D.C. Mayor Muriel Bowser and other officials giving an update on the shooting that occurred today near the White House. Kash Patel and the mayor saying the two National Guardsmen that were shot are in critical condition and in the hospital.
Police confirming a suspect is in custody and also in the hospital. And at this time, there is no indication that any other suspect was involved in this shooting.
I want to bring back our chief law enforcement intelligence analyst, John Miller.
So, John, you were listening to that press conference. What stood out to you?
MILLER: Well, some of the gaps that we've been talking about have been filled, which is this did not stem from some other crime or incident unfolding on the street from Kash Patel, the FBI director. We got a description of the gunman walking around the corner, walking straight in the direction of the two National Guardsmen, raising his arm with a handgun and opening fire in what was a deliberate attack, targeted attack against these National Guard officers.
Executive assistant police chief of Washington, D.C. Metro Police, Jeff Carroll, told us that he raised his arm with the handgun, opened fire. One of those guardsmen was shot in the head. At least there was what Carroll described as some back and forth. Presumably that may be an exchange of gunfire, but that the suspect was wounded with -- by a gunshot and was taken to the hospital. He's still unidentified.
We learned that there is no other suspect being sought. And we also know that they still have not identified him, which is going to be really the first step on getting towards motive. Why would the National Guard be the target of a lone gunman in an unprovoked attack in the streets of Washington, D.C.?
You know, as Kristen talked about a little while ago, the National Guard has become a lightning rod across the country because of the engagements that they have been put into by this administration, which are fairly unusual for the National Guards mission, law enforcement missions in the streets of cities helping ICE with migrant raids and to chase people who are here illegally and bring them into custody.
The Washington, D.C., presence, as a crime fighting entity. But we also know, separate from that, that terrorist groups like ISIS., both on November 7th and November 20th, came out with new calls both in the U.S. and Europe, asking their followers to conduct lone wolf attacks against government targets in in the United States.
So, there are a number of things this could emerge from, could be connected to, could explain a motive. But until law enforcement identifies who that gunman is and gets deeper into his communications, his associations, his travel, his background, right now, it's all just speculation and motive is going to end up being very important here.
RAJU: Yeah. And, Charles Ramsey, the former D.C. police chief, is also with us to that point, to what John was just saying about not revealing the identity of the suspect. Were you surprised by that? And why don't you think that they revealed the suspect's name?
RAMSEY: No, I'm not surprised at all. In fact, you know, I would be surprised if they had released any real information about the suspect. At this point in time, there's a lot of background work that has to be done. I mean, the social media footprint, they probably executing search warrants that are residence, maybe a vehicle, trying to get their hands on associates, friends and so forth that, to interview them about the suspect and so forth.
Once that name is out there, they lose control of all that. And so, you don't want to put the name out until you've done all you can do, at least as much as you need to do in order to do the background properly on the suspect. I mean, there is going to be a trial. This guy's still alive, so there's going to be a trial.
So, you know, the collection of evidence is going to be very, very important.
RAJU: Yeah. And, Katherine, and then our final 30 seconds here. What was your takeaway from that news conference about what they revealed and what they did not reveal about this investigation?
SCHWEIT: It was a quick, quick news conference with only so many questions because they knew they had to be out in front of the press and give some answers if they had them. But there's just a lot of information they just don't know yet.
RAJU: Yeah, there's a lot that we do know that there is a lone gunman. They said one suspect who is now in custody. That's what the police just said in this news conference. And that there is a lot more to learn, including the motive and who the suspect is.
Stay with CNN. There is a lot more in this breaking news. Thanks for joining us this hour on CNN. I'm Manu Raju.
"THE LEAD" starts right now.
