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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt

LAPD: Nick Reiner "Responsible" For Rob & Michele Reiner's Deaths; Now: Manhunt Underway For Brown University Mass Shooter; Australian PM: Shooting Was "An Act Of Antisemitism Driven By Ideology". Aired 4-5p ET

Aired December 15, 2025 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:21]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Hi, everyone. I'm Kasie Hunt. Welcome to THE ARENA. It's wonderful to have you with us on this Monday.

Although as we come on the air, we are following a number of difficult major breaking news stories following a weekend of senseless violence.

We begin with the investigation into the deaths of Hollywood icon Rob Reiner and his wife, the film producer Michele Singer Reiner. The couple, who have been married for more than 30 years, were found dead in their L.A. home on Sunday. A source telling CNN that their own daughter found their bodies.

This afternoon, the LAPD said that their son, Nick Reiner, is responsible for their deaths. He is being held now without bail.

Our panel will be here to talk about all of this, but we're going to start with CNN correspondent Stephanie Elam. She is outside the Reiners' home.

Stephanie, what more are we learning about this investigation? And of course, the arrest of the couple's son, Nick?

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Kasie, this is all giving -- we're getting a little bit more of a timeline here. We know that the police responded in the 3:00 p.m. hour yesterday to a call about potential homicide. They responded to that. And then we learned today that it was after 9:00 p.m. local time that they arrested their son, Nick Reiner, in -- for this -- for these murders.

And I just want to take a look at what the Los Angeles Police Department put out in their most recent press release, they said as a result of the initial investigation, it was determined that the Reiners were the victims of homicide and that the investigation further revealed that Nick Reiner, the 32-year-old son of Robert and Michele Reiner, was responsible for their deaths.

I'm reading directly from the press release. That is language you don't normally see inside of a press release. So just give us a little bit more context. And then also the other bit of information that were learning now that

CNN has just learned is that Nick Reiner was seen having an argument with Rob Reiner at a event at Conan O'Brien's house Saturday night.

So just a little bit more context here. We had already known that Nick Reiner has been very open about his drug addiction at times, and that he had lived. He was homeless for some period, even co-wrote a screenplay, that his father then directed the film that dealt with that. And in discussing that, Rob Reiner said that they had had difficult conversations and they definitely fought some, but it made for a better production.

So, more details here. We also know that mom Michele was also at that party on Saturday night, just giving us a little bit more of a timeline here on how this could happen, but still not clear on why -- if this is the case, why Nick Reiner may have killed his parents. That question mark is still a very big one that we do not have as a community here in Hollywood, overall, Kasie, are trying to digest such a seismic loss here.

HUNT: It is really a seismic loss on so many levels. Stephanie Elam, thanks very much for that updated reporting.

All right. Our panel is here in THE ARENA. CNN legal analyst Elliot Williams; CNN's special correspondent Jamie Gangel; former communications director for the DNC, Mo Elleithee; and former RNC communications director and Republican strategist Doug Heye.

We're also joined by the Emmy Award-winning entertainment journalist Segun Oduolowu.

Thank you all for being here very much.

And, Segun, let me -- let me start with you. Just because I do want to touch on -- and we're going to do this later in the show as well. But I want to touch on Rob Reiner, what he meant to Hollywood, to American culture, the arc that he had from actor to director to very much involved in in the political universe, which were also going to talk about here with the panel. This is a tragedy on so many levels.

SEGUN ODUOLOWU, EMMY AWARD WINNING JOURNALIST & MEDIA PERSONALITY: Kasie, you said it perfectly. It's a tragedy on so many levels because Rob's entry point into entertainment at every moment is memorable, whether it was on "All in the Family", where he won an Emmy and was on a sitcom that really not only was groundbreaking but set the blueprint for what many situation comedies would later try to copy, right, when you think of the Jeffersons and Sanford and son and things that followed "All in the Family".

But then with "This is Spinal Tap" and that whole idea of improv and not having a complete script and shooting that style, introducing us to Christopher Guest and then his run in the '80s to the '90s with "Stand by Me", working with a young River Phoenix and Wil Wheaton, to "When Harry Met Sally" with Billy Crystal and Meg Ryan redefining romcoms to a "Princess Bride", where we still quote many of the lines from that movie, and then "A Few Good Men" with Jack Nicholson and Tom Cruise.

[16:05:13]

Everywhere you saw Rob Reiner put his hands on Hollywood or entertainment, it spoke for generations. And so, his loss, I don't think, can be calculated because his voice is intergenerational.

HUNT: And let's touch briefly on Michele as well, because honestly, the end of one of the most, if not the most iconic romcom out there, "When Harry Met Sally", the end of that movie is different for all of us because of the two of them. And she left her own mark on Hollywood history.

ODUOLOWU: She did. She -- they found each other on the set. And because of that meeting, that pairing, that union, Rob changed the end. Harry and -- when Harry and Sally were never supposed to get together, but because he did with his wife, a very accomplished photographer in her own right who would work with Rob in other movies, the whole ending of that movie changed and we are the better for it.

So again, his tragedy, Rob passing, his wife's tragedy is an incalculable loss.

HUNT: This, of course, a part of the iconic film "When Harry Met Sally".

I want to bring my panel into this conversation.

Jamie Gangel, for Hollywood -- I mean, the Reiners were at the center of so much of the social and cultural life of the place, right?

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: It seems funny to call them Hollywood royalty because they were so down to earth. But Rob Reiner's father was Carl Reiner. They just, you know, generations -- I grew up watching Rob Reiner on "All in the Family" as Meathead. They were -- they were just had a very large presence, the entire family did.

I don't think we can understate this tragedy, not just for all these people who knew and loved them. I mean, there's been such an outpouring of condolences. But just imagine their son is being held, for allegedly, you know, on suspicion of the murder of his parents. And we have now this reporting that the night before, they were at a holiday party and that Nick was in a very public argument with his father that people observed.

And we now have reporting, according to a source familiar with the circumstances, that his sister, their daughter Romy found her parents in the house.

I just, you know, the father and son made a movie together that was loosely based on Nick's struggle with addiction and depression. And at that time, they did a lot of public interviews. He suffered from addiction, homelessness.

And Nick talked about how there were, quote, "a lot of dark years" at the time and what one source said to me was that the family was very concerned that Nick was going through a dark time again right now.

HUNT: Let's watch a little bit of Rob and Nick Reiner together, actually talking about exactly what Jamie is talking about here. This this film was called on being -- called "Being Charlie". Here they are talking about it together.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROB REINER, ACTOR & FILMMAKER: The fact that we were dealing with, you know, things that Nick had gone through and how I had related to it and how his mother had related to it, it forced us to have to -- it forced me to have to see more clearly and understand more deeply what Nick had gone through. And I think it forced him to see things that I had experienced during this process, and it definitely brought us closer together.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So that, of course, next to each other. We didn't hear from Nick.

But -- I mean, Jamie, this paints a portrait of a father that was deeply involved with a troubled son.

GANGEL: Absolutely. And if you go back to the time I think actually, Maria Shriver, who is a very close friend of theirs, posted today that they were great parents and they really cared about their children. But when you're talking about someone who went through addiction and homelessness from the time he was about 14 or 15 years old, we're talking about mental illness here and struggles.

And no matter how hard you try, you know, I know other families like this, when this comes up, it's -- you can love someone completely and not -- still not be able to deal with this.

HUNT: So this conversation is already, because of the current president of the United States about more than just this tragedy. It's also already become about politics.

But before we get to what the president just had to say about this, I want to play a little bit of "All in the Family", the sitcom that Jamie Gangel just referenced, and which I -- it's -- I'm a little too young for it to be the main point of reference for me, for Rob Reiner.

[16:10:13]

But in so many ways, the show was very much ahead of its time, and in some ways kind of presaged the moment that we're all living through. So here is the character, Meathead, that Rob Reiner played, arguing, you guessed it, with his father in law, Archie Bunker.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REINER: I mean, with or without protesters, this country would still have the same problems.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What problems?

REINER: Well, it's the war, the racial problem, the economic problem, the pollution problem.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, come on, if you want to nitpick.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: If you want to nitpick.

Mo Elleithee, I don't know if you watched this show contemporaneously but -- and, you know, I was having a conversation with my parents actually early earlier this morning, and they were pointing out this was a show that addressed all of those problems that he ticked through before it was really socially acceptable to do so.

MO ELLEITHEE, FORMER DNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Oh, 100 percent. I mean, not just social problems, but a lot of really hard issues that we didn't talk about back in those days. I was a kid when that show came out.

I feel like I learned so much of the world from -- from "All in the Family". They did tackle race head on in the 1970s, when that was not something people talked about openly, often. There was one famous episode where the matriarch of that family was sexually assaulted, which was incredibly taboo. I mean, that show and Rob Reiner was such a big part of it.

I mean, I feel -- I didn't know Rob Reiner, but boy, did I feel like I did.

HUNT: Yeah.

ELLEITHEE: You know, he was there at every stage of my life in a different way with some piece of Americana that influenced us all. And as I grew into adulthood and became politically active, he was there, too. And so, every stage of life, he's had a huge impact.

HUNT: I mean, I was -- I was privileged to get to know Rob Reiner a little bit in the course of covering politics and being on television with him. He joined us here on this show.

I do want to -- before I show a little bit of what he said here on the show, because I think its relevant for where we are today. I do want to mention that President Trump has already come under criticism for what he has said on his Truth Social platform about Rob Reiner. He accused him of having Trump derangement syndrome. He said he was known to have driven people crazy by his raging obsession with Donald Trump. He called him tortured and struggling, but once very talented.

This is what he had to say, of course, upon learning that Rob Reiner and his wife Michele had passed away, Trump then just a few moments ago had this to say in a Q&A with reporters. Let's take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, I wasn't a fan of his at all. He was a deranged person as far as Trump is concerned. He said -- he liked -- he knew it was false. In fact, it's the exact opposite that I was a friend of Russia controlled by Russia. You know, the Russia hoax. He was one of the people behind it.

I think he hurt himself in career wise. He became like a deranged person, Trump derangement syndrome.

So, I was not a fan of Rob Reiner at all in any way, shape or form. I thought he was very bad for our country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So I had the honor of speaking with Rob Reiner here on this program, and our interview actually was a couple weeks after Charlie Kirk was assassinated. It was as Jimmy Kimmel was off the air at ABC, and Rob Reiner and I had a chance to talk about that, but I wanted to kind of come back to what he had said about political violence, political rhetoric, and what the imperatives are from our leaders in the times that we are now living in.

And if you think about the arc of Rob Reiner's career from being, you know, Meathead to the Archie Bunker in the 1970s in that sitcom to where he has landed in our politics today, that that's what the president of the United States is saying the day after he passes away. Here was rob Reiner in September, right here.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REINER: Violence is never the answer. And if you want to persuade somebody to come to your way of thinking, killing somebody is not the way to do it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: And, Doug Heye, I mean, it's very difficult to hear him say that, considering, obviously, the family tragedy that has now befallen him. I mean, really, really, really difficult things. But, you know, I think it -- I think it's important to underscore that, you know, for those of us who are able to get up every day and continue to do this kind of work, the way that we talk matters -- the way that we interact with each other matters.

DOUG HEYE, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Yeah. And you and I -- and I think all of us -- talked about the problem with political violence and political rhetoric with that a lot.

[16:15:02]

And unfortunately, it happens too often. And there are ways that you should handle this and should respond to this. And Donald Trump never meets that moment.

I've talked to you, Kasie, about working at the Republican National Committee on that Saturday morning that Gabby Giffords was shot, and me and colleagues got together on a conference call and talked about, how do we address this responsibly?

We didn't point fingers. We didn't use names. We didn't do the things that now happen. All too common.

And Rob Reiner didn't do that. He said, this is not the answer, as did so many. Donald Trump never goes in that direction. And I think this also comes in a different kind of context when we ask ourselves, is this the kind of person that we want to be the president of United States?

Last weekend, we were all focused on the Kennedy Center honors, and KISS was in town. And that was exciting. And Sylvester Stallone was in town, and that was exciting. It's an annual event that happens every year.

Is this the kind of man who says that about a beloved filmmaker that we want as the head of an arts association? I sure don't think so.

HUNT: All right. Segun Oduolowu, thank you very much for your time, sir. I want to say I really appreciate you being here today and offering your thoughts.

The rest of our panel is going to stand by.

Coming up next here in THE ARENA, a desperate manhunt underway in Rhode Island for the person who killed two students at Brown. Ahead, what police are asking residents to do now?

Plus, more on the life and immense legacy of rob Reiner, a true Hollywood icon. He directed some of the most memorable moments in film's history, including this famous scene from 1989 "When Harry Met Sally".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, yes, oh, oh, oh, oh God, oh.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'll have what she's having.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSEPH ODURO, BROWN UNIVERSITY TEACHING ASSISTANT: The first couple gunshots went straight to the chalkboard exactly where I was standing. So who knows if I didn't duck, maybe I'm not here today. There was actually a girl who was sitting right next to me. She had two bullets in the -- in her legs. As much training as you could possibly get when there's an active shooter, you're never going to be prepared when it actually takes place.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HUNT: Right now, a manhunt is underway in Rhode Island after a deadly shooting at Brown University.

Providence police have released this new footage which they say shows a person of interest.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

POLICE OFFICER: Police, police!

POLICE OFFICER: Providence police.

POLICE OFFICER: Hands, hands. Hands. Stand up! Hands. Hands, please.

POLICE OFFICER: Everybody's hands. Hands. Hands. Hands. Hands, hands, hands.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: This dramatic footage shows the moments that police found students hiding in a library as the shooting unfolded. Nearby, two students were killed and nine others were wounded, and the shooter remains at large.

The Rhode Island attorney general warns that he should be considered armed and dangerous.

CNN anchor John Berman joins us now from Brown University.

John, right now, you're on the same street. The suspect was seen walking down in surveillance video. What is the latest on this manhunt?

JOHN BERMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, I have to tell you, we've seen renewed urgent police work right around where I'm standing right now. You can actually see the building, the engineering building where the shooting took place behind me. That's where the principles of economics class was going on.

In just in these few blocks over the last several hours. You know, Brian Todd saw dogs, K-9 units go back in the engineering building.

Michael Yoshida, another CNN correspondent, saw the FBI going into yards on these various blocks, looking at walls, looking perhaps for evidence on the ground. I saw a staties, state police, staties is what we call them in New England, state police walking down the street, almost going door to door. Law enforcement asking for the locals here to turn over any videos, any photos, anything that they might have that can contribute to this investigation.

And that new video that you showed, which is really tough to make much out. I do have to say it came out late today after the only piece of evidence that the public had seen was that first piece of 10 second video, a little clearer than the one released today of the person they believe connected to the shooting. Walking down Hope Street where I am now. I had a chance to talk to the mayor of Providence, Brett Smiley, about the evidence that they released so far and what else they might have. It sort of explains why we may be seeing this new video now. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR BRETT SMILEY (D), PROVIDENCE, RHODE ISLAND: The video that we released is the clearest picture we have of the individual we believe to be responsible. But that doesn't mean that there isn't other evidence. We're talking about trying to get a clear shot of an individual with identifiable features that can help advance the investigation. But there was still a lot of evidence collected at the crime scene.

I want to be clear that while we certainly were focused on processing evidence for the person of interest who was detained, that didn't mean that the other pieces of the investigation were stopped or in any way paused.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: And we do expect to hear more from officials shortly at a news conference, which will begin in just a few minutes.

I should say the atmosphere, Kasie, is radically different than it was yesterday. Classes have been canceled. Finals have been canceled.

But today, with news that the manhunt is still on and the killer is on the loose, students really have begun to get out as quickly as they can, with many of them telling me they just don't feel safe at this point -- Kasie.

[16:25:03]

HUNT: Yeah. All right. John Berman, thanks very much for that reporting, sir. Really appreciate you being here.

Our law enforcement panel joins us now in THE ARENA.

CNN chief law enforcement intelligence analyst John Miller, former senior FBI official, active shooter expert Katherine Schweit, and CNN's senior law enforcement analyst, Chief Charles Ramsey, who has led the both Washington, D.C., and Philadelphia Police Departments.

John miller, let me start with you. Can you give us a sense of what happened here? Because clearly, you know, they thought they had the suspect. Then all of a sudden, they did not. Now this -- there's been some back and forth just in the last 24 hours, about just how dangerous the current situation on the ground is. What -- what do you make of it all?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, I mean, you're looking at, at the screen here between Katie Schweit, who's been involved in any number of active shooter cases, Chuck Ramsey, who was a significant leader in the Washington sniper case. I had an individual shoot ten people in the subway one morning. And what you learn in these cases is the nature of the beast, which is

a lead will light up and it will be a bright light, and you can go at that lead and either direction, which is we've got to gather the evidence that solidifies this lead so we can prosecute this person, or we need to go through the evidence so we can exonerate or eliminate this person. Both of those things happened yesterday.

So, they had an individual who they thought was a promising person of interest. They had him for about 19 hours, but they used that time and were able to rule him out based on forensics, alibis, a number of other things. And now, they're taking a different direction. What you're looking at here is a reset. They're back out on the street trying to find more video, different video, better video.

They're back on the street brushing the snow away, saying, did somebody drop a magazine of bullets or toss a gun? They are back to -- we're starting with a much wider net and they're going through other leads and tips they have, some of which appear to be very promising as well. That's what we're looking at right now.

HUNT: Katherine Schweit, what do you think stands out the most here in in terms of -- especially these 19 hours? How much is that time just wasted time. Does it make it that much harder to figure out who actually did this?

KATHERINE SCHWEIT, ACTIVE SHOOTER EXPERT: You know, a lot of ways, every investigation, every minute makes it a lot harder, right? The subject is moving further and further away from the crime scene. So, it's always going to be harder.

You know, in our mobile world, though, that we've seen people, you know, get on trains and planes and busses and cars and take off and it's a matter of a lot of gumshoe work just to track them down. I don't think that by focusing on one person, there might have been a lot of news coverage about that person. There might have been officials saying, oh, this is the person. We think this is the person.

From a law enforcement perspective, you don't have it until you have it. And as a former prosecutor, I can tell you, we all know that until you know that you have all the evidence, you're just going to keep digging through every single thing. Which is why those FBI ERT members are out there on the lawn looking for something that might be as simple as a cigarette butt that was tossed on the lawn yesterday. And because of the temperature and everything might still be there, and might have gone out and they might have a chance to pick up DNA.

So, they're just going to continue to follow through on all those leads.

HUNT: Chief Ramsey, did you sense any discord among the various law enforcement agencies that are on the scene here? The FBI, the locals? John Berman mentioned the state police just as this has unfolded it. I'm curious if you've seen or sensed any tension in that regard

CHARLES RAMSEY, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: No, I haven't sensed any tension. I mean, they're just, you know, back at it now, trying to, you know, figure out who it is that's responsible for the shooting.

You know, when I was in the Chicago police department, I was commander of the violent crimes unit, which included homicide. And it wasn't uncommon that detectives would bring somebody in. Right. A suspect, you call them a person of interest or whatever, and you interrogate them.

You take a look at the evidence you had, and many times that's not your person. You let them go. You may have a limitation in terms of how long you can hold the person without charging them, and the D.A. or the state attorneys not satisfied because you have insufficient evidence.

So, there are a lot of things that go on. The difference here is this is a high-profile case. So everybody's paying attention to it. Right? We used to call them heater cases.

And when you have something like that then it's -- it just -- it changes dramatically. When I saw the last press conference last night, I had the opinion I -- that they had the right person because, you know, everybody was kind of saying those things to make you think that charges were pretty much imminent.

[16:30:02]

But it's -- you don't have it till you have it, until you have sufficient evidence to establish the probable cause you need for charging. Guess what? That person is just -- he's a person of interest and nothing more than that. And they may bring somebody else in. That is a person of interest.

You know, as long as you have fresh leads, you're going to just continue. You're going to work it and work it and work it. Like John said, some will pan out, some will not pan out. But this is under intense scrutiny. So, you know, people are paying a lot, a -- very, very close attention to what's taking place as they should.

But people should be alert because whoever it is, is still out there. And so people should be alert and not let their guard down, not just in Providence but elsewhere, because you don't know the motive of this guy. If he had a beef against Brown, or if this was something just in general, you know, around universities or any other locations. So, you just have to be careful.

HUNT: Yeah. So, speaking of all of that attention and scrutiny that you mentioned, the president was asked about this just a couple of minutes ago because the -- his director of the FBI has come under some criticism for a range of, of things. But he was asked specifically about the FBI director's role in this investigation. Let's watch that moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Has Kash Patel told you why it's been so difficult for the FBI to identify who the shooter is? TRUMP: Well, it's always difficult. So far, we've done a very good job

of doing it with Charlie, with, you know, the various times this has happened. They've done it in pretty much record time.

But, you really have to ask the school a little bit more about that because, you know, this was a school problem. They had their own guards, they had their own police, they had their own everything. But you'd have to ask that question really to the school, not to the FBI. We came in after the fact.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Very briefly, John Miller, do you sense tension between the FBI and the locals? Because there do seem to be a couple of moments here where that's a threat.

MILLER: So, I mean, there is some tension between the FBI and the locals about how this last piece of the case was handled. You will note that the FBI was very much present at the initial press conference after the shooting, saying they were bringing all their resources. You will notice that the FBI was not there yesterday, but I have been in those rooms where those tensions have come up and you've got to resolve that because the next day you all have to be out there together.

And what do we see today? We know that the attorney general spoke to the FBI director with the chief of police yesterday and that they said, you know, we'll all be back tomorrow. We see the FBI ERT out there kicking the snow and looking for cameras today. These are the things that you've got to get past.

And as far as the president of the United States we have this terrible habit of looking for people to blame for different things in the middle of this. Keep your eye on the ball. There's one bad guy here.

He's that guy on that video. He's the guy who did the shooting. They need to figure out who he is. This other stuff is just distraction.

HUNT: Appreciate you, John Miller, very much. Thank you. Katherine Schweit, Chief Charles Ramsey, very grateful to you as well. Thank you all for being here.

Coming up next here in THE ARENA, we're going to take you live to Australia, where the Jewish community is reeling from a mass shooting on the first night of Hanukkah. What we're learning about the attack that officials are calling, quote, an act of pure evil.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: As the Jewish people, we will not be silenced. As a Jewish people, our light will not be dimmed. And the holiday of Hanukkah will remind us and the world that a little bit of light dispels a lot of darkness. And what we need to do is add in our light.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:38:12]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY ALBANESE, AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER: Hannukah in part is about the victory of light over dark. Well, this was a very dark day in Australian history, but together, we will emerge into the light.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Australians continue to gather at Sydney's famous Bondi Beach to mourn the victims of Sunday's horrific antisemitic terrorist attack. A night meant for celebrating Hanukkah quickly turned into the country's deadliest mass shooting in almost 30 years, when a father son duo opened fire on the crowd. At least 15 people were killed. Among the victims, a 10-year-old girl, a rabbi and a Holocaust survivor who died while shielding his wife from the gunfire.

At least 27 people are in the hospital, including this man, Ahmed al Ahmed, who was shot in the shoulder after this dramatic confrontation with one of the gunmen. After crouching behind a parked car, he tackled and pried away a gun from the attacker. Just unbelievable.

CNN's Angus Watson is live for us in Sydney.

Angus, what a hero.

ANGUS WATSON, CNN PRODUCER: Extraordinary video there. Seen tens of millions of times around the world now of this heroic man, Ahmed al Ahmed, a 43-year-old father, the son of Syrian refugees who risked his life to save other people, as we just saw there, prizing the gun away from one of the attackers and actually having the presence of mind not to fire on the perpetrator, instead to use that weapon to defend his community, to shield other people.

Now, I'm pleased to say I can give you an update as to his health. He's still in hospital. He took four to five gunshot wounds to the shoulder and has had one successful surgery.

[16:40:04]

But it will take more surgeries before he can be discharged from hospital. A GoFundMe page has been set up for Mr. Al Ahmed that's actually raised over 1 million USD so far. That is the positive side of this story.

The tragic side comes with the list of victims. These 15 people, some of whom you just mentioned there, Matilda, a 10-year-old girl who lost her life at a Hanukkah party, on the first night of Hanukkah. She was there playing with her family. There was a petting zoo. There was face painting, and she was shot. And later that night, she died in hospital.

An 87-year-old man, Alex Kleytman, left Ukraine after the Second World War. He's a holocaust survivor. He came to Australia for a better life and he died in a terror incident.

Now we are getting a little bit more information from police about the investigation. It will focus on two men. Sajid Akram, a 50-year-old man, and his son Naveed Akram. Sajid had a license to hold firearms.

HUNT: All right. Angus Watson, thank you very much for that reporting. Really appreciate it.

Joining our panel now in THE ARENA, rabbi Steve Leder. He's the senior rabbi at Wilshire Boulevard Temple in Los Angeles.

And, Rabbi, I do want to start with you, because this incident, of course, one of a horrific one, one of many of just an incredibly disturbing increase in antisemitic incidents around the world here in the United States and Australia, in western Europe. What -- what is your message to the world today as we reflect on yet another incredibly tragic incident like this one?

RABBI STEVE LEDER, SENIOR RABBI, WILSHIRE BOULEVARD TEMPLE: I appreciate the opportunity and I appreciate the question. What I'd like to say to the world is wake up. The world has a metastatic disease that will destroy us from within.

Now is not the time for nuance. Now is the time for truth telling, and now is the time to globalize, not the intifada, but to globalize the kind of courage that Ahmed al Ahmed showed in standing up to this metastatic fanaticism and reclaiming decency and kindness. And that's the message.

This is dangerous. And I want to also stress that I -- a long time ago, Kasie, I was -- I was expressing some frustration about something. And a friend of mine who's a minister said to me, Steve, do you know what most people think about Jews? They don't.

And I am urging all of us, the entire world, to start thinking about what is happening to Jews. This business about anti-Zionism is not antisemitism is nonsense. Those shooters were not distinguishing between Zionist and non-Zionist Jews on that beach. They just wanted dead Jews.

And we look away at this metastatic disease. We look away from it at our peril. And when I say our -- I mean western civilization.

HUNT: When we think about it that way, we obviously have had other points in our history, in our history as a -- our global history where hatred of Jewish people has had just incredibly devastating consequences. Obviously, most of all for jews, but also for many others in the world.

Do you see where we are now as a harbinger of things to come?

LEDER: If we don't wake up, it certainly could be. Look, I'm not the kind of person who thinks all roads lead to Auschwitz. That's not the case here. But we are clearly on a dangerous road heading in the wrong direction, and we need to. We need to act. Hate speech needs to be severely curbed and or punished, and we really need to understand that were all in this together.

We're all in this boat of civilization together. And we are capable -- if the enemy is capable of globalizing the intifada, we are capable -- capable of globalizing a response and globalizing tolerance, civility, peace. And as any Jew would know this time of year, we are fully capable of bringing light to this darkness. But we need to wake up and get serious.

[16:45:01]

HUNT: Yeah, the message of Hanukkah, particularly salient at this moment. And, you know, I think my final question to you is for anyone out there, whether Jewish, whether not Jewish, whatever their background, what can we do every day to try to make a difference, to try and help make sure things like this don't happen? To be like -- be light in the darkness?

LEDER: Well, first, we -- we ought not -- yes, we ought not look away at the darkness. We need to know each other. But again, I want to say that nuance is not our friend right now. When we see it, we know it, and we have to speak out. And even subtle things like a headline that says 15 Jews were killed. They weren't killed. They weren't killed. They were murdered. They were massacred.

We the thing we can avoid, the thing we can work on every day, is not normalizing intolerance, extremism and hatred and not accepting it as normal. And of course, when it comes to bringing light into the world, you know, I'm going to say this as quickly as I can. I appreciate the time.

Why do we use pure olive oil in our menorahs? We use pure olive oil in our menorahs, the rabbis tell us, because it's when the olive is crushed and pressed, it gives forth its most beautiful light. This is a crushing time for Jews and this is a crushing time for western civilization, and let's use that as the opportunity to bring forth the best within us. And demonstrate some light and love for each other, and not be afraid to call out this metastatic disease.

HUNT: Rabbi Steve Leder, very grateful to have you on the show. I really appreciate the message you brought to everyone.

LEDER: Thank you. Honored to be with you.

HUNT: I appreciate it.

All right. Coming up next here in THE ARENA, we're going to take another look back at the life and legacy of the filmmaker, Rob Reiner, the man who brought us iconic moments like this from the 1992 movie. I don't have to tell you what it is. It's "A Few Good Men".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You want answers?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think I'm entitled.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You want answers?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want the truth.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can't handle the truth

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:51:37]

HUNT: All right. Welcome back.

Hollywood, really all of America is mourning today. The tragic loss of the filmmaker Rob Reiner and his wife, producer Michele Reiner. The two met, if you can believe it, on the set of "When Harry Met Sally". It's one of the many unforgettable movies that Reiner directed, and there are so many more movies he brought us that we all know and love. I bet you can quote directly from at least one, if not many of them.

CNN's Stephanie Elam takes us through Rob's life and legacy in Hollywood.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ROB REINER, AMERICAN FILM ACTOR AND DIRECTOR: I've often said, you know, no matter what happens to me, I'll always be, you know, I could win the Nobel Prize. They'll say Meathead wins Nobel.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Rob Reiner needn't have worried. Yes, he was known for playing Meathead on "All in the Family", but his career had a remarkable second act as a successful and versatile film director.

From the mid-'80s to the early '90s, Reiner had a phenomenal run directing a diverse range of films. He practically invented the mockumentary with his musical comedy, "This Is Spinal Tap".

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you can see.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The numbers all go to a 11.

ELAM (voice-over): There was the Stephen King coming of age story, "Stand By Me", and the modern fairy tale, "The Princess Bride".

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father prepared to die.

ELAM (voice-over): And the classic romantic comedy "When Harry Met Sally", which had that famous line delivered by his mom, Estelle.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'll have what she's having.

ELAM (voice-over): Another Stephen King adaptation, "Misery" earned an Oscar for leading lady Kathy Bates.

While his military courtroom drama, "A Few Good Men" had this famous exchange between Tom Cruise and Jack Nicholson.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want the truth.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can't handle the truth.

ELAM (voice-over): Rob, son of TV comedy pioneer Carl Reiner, found it a challenge to step out from his father's shadow.

REINER: Getting in the door is important but having staying power and being able to sustain a career, at least on the level of or exceed your famous father and mother, is very, very difficult. I mean, you're under an enormous pressure and scrutiny.

ELAM (voice-over): He first earned fame in his own right as the liberal Mike Stivic on the groundbreaking 1970s TV sitcom, "All in the Family".

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They just don't like the idea of America fighting an illegal and immoral war.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, if they don't like it, they can lump it.

ELAM (voice-over): Stivic's arguments with his conservative, bigoted father-in-law, Archie Bunker, were a hallmark of the show as they debated politics, social and cultural issues through comedy.

The show earned Reiner two Emmy Awards.

CHRIS WALLACE, TV HOST: The subjects you took on and the way that you approached them, and we're talking the '70s, were unheard of in television at the time.

REINER: Yeah, right.

WALLACE: How much resistance did you all get from CBS?

REINER: Tremendous resistance. At first, when the first, the show first came on, they had a huge disclaimer that preceded the show. It was basically the show doesn't reflect the views of the network, blah, blah. Basically, it was saying, we don't know how the show got on.

ELAM (voice-over): Like his "All in the Family" character, Reiner was passionate about progressive candidates and causes. He supported Democratic presidential candidates and was an advocate for free preschool education.

Reiner would occasionally step back in front of the camera for small roles in films like "Sleepless in Seattle".

[16:55:00]

REINER: Tiramisu?

TOM HANKS, ACTOR: What is tiramisu?

REINER: You'll find out.

ELAM (voice-over): Rob Reiner was a character in his own right with an enduring body of work that reflects his generation's humor and passion.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HUNT: Just absolutely amazing. I mean, Elliot, we kept looking at the screen saying, oh, that was Rob Reiner, too.

WILLIAMS: Yeah. I mean, and on another level it's, you know, my parents are immigrants that came here in '67 and a show like "All in the Family" really was about politics in the '70s in America. And just influential for all of us.

HUNT: All right. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HUNT: All right. Thanks to my panel.

Thanks to all of you for watching.

Jake Tapper is standing by for "THE LEAD".

Hi, Jake.