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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt
Zohran Mamdani Publicly Sworn In As New York City Mayor; Swiss Police: "About 40" People Killed In Fire At NYE Party; Trump Withdraws National Guard From L.A., Chicago, Portland. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired January 01, 2026 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
MIKE VALERIO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): -- and through their music, they hope fans worldwide will find the same courage, daring to dream.
[16:00:07]
HYUK, 1VERSE MEMBER: When those people see that we came from tough circumstances and managed to grow and share something with fans, I think that process itself can be meaningful and give others the ee that we came from tough circumstances ee that we came from tough circumstances and managed to grow and share something with fans, I think that process itself can be meaningful and give others the courage to try.
VALERIO (voice-over): Mike Valerio, CNN, Seoul.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Thank you so much for being with us. Happy New Year!
THE ARENA WITH KASIE HUNT starts after this short break.
(MUSIC)
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Hello, everyone. Welcome to THE ARENA. Kasie Hunt off again today. I'm Jim Sciutto.
A very happy New Year to you. Thanks so much for joining us on January 1st.
Well, New York has a new mayor now. Just moments ago, Zohran Mamdani made history publicly sworn in on the steps of city hall outlining his vision for unabashedly a big city government.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK: Beginning today, we will govern expansively and audaciously. We may not always succeed, but never will we be accused of lacking the courage to try. To those who insist that the era of big government is over, hear me when I say this no longer will city hall hesitate to use its power to improve New Yorkers' lives.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: At just 34 years old, Mamdani is New York's youngest mayor in generations. Also, its first Muslim mayor.
He's also New York's first Democratic socialist mayor, a fact that Mamdani today embraced proudly. He was sworn in by independent senator and fellow Democratic socialist Bernie Sanders, progressive star Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez also addressed the crowd, and in his own remarks, Mamdani made it clear that Democratic socialism would be at the heart of his administration.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAMDANI: We will govern without shame and insecurity, making no apology for what we believe. I was elected as a Democratic socialist, and I will govern as a Democratic socialist.
I will not abandon my principles for fear of being deemed radical. The work my friends, has only just begun. Thank you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Big smiles there. Let's get off the sidelines and head into THE ARENA. My panel here, along with CNN correspondent Gloria Pazmino, who is just outside city hall in New York.
And, you know, Gloria, listening to the speech there, certainly, he's expressing no embarrassment about embracing his left wing agenda. But at the same time, he quite deliberately reached out to those who didn't vote for him.
GLORIA PAZMINO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. And I think that was actually something really important and necessary that Zohran Mamdani needed to do in this speech, because he got a little bit of criticism after his victory last November, after he made that speech, some people felt that it had been too divisive and certainly today's address. He made a point of reaching out to people who he said did not support him. He talked about being a mayor for every New Yorker, and he acknowledged that not everyone in the city of New York was happy about his election.
But what you said at the beginning, Jim, is also very important. This was an unapologetically progressive, unapologetically left speech. He talked about being elected as a Democratic socialist and planning to govern as a Democratic socialist.
And so much has been made of that label, right? Socialism. Some people have said that his agenda is, in fact communism, and they have said that the proposals that he has made are unrealistic. He talked about that during his speech today, but he said that it was actually a lack of imagination on the part of government. And he promised that he would actually try and take that on.
Zohran Mamdani is setting the bar very high for himself. He talked about not being willing to compromise, but the reality -- reality, Jim, is that in politics and government, sometimes you do have to compromise, and that's going to be the story of this administration going forward. How does Zohran Mamdani balance his political ideology, his identity as a Democratic socialist with governing a place like New York City, which is a very complicated and doing the things that he has proposed creating universal child care, making busses fast and free, raising the rent for rent stabilized tenants.
He wants to do all of that by taxing the rich something that is, not something that the governor doesn't want to do. And I also thought one of the important moments of this speech was his mention of President Trump talking about the one thing that the two have in common, and that is some voters.
Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAMDANI: Few of these 8-1/2 million will fit into neat and easy boxes. Some will be voters from Hillside Avenue or Fordham road who supported President Trump a year before they voted for me. Tired of being failed by their party's establishment. But in our administration, their needs will be met, their hopes and dreams and interests will be reflected transparently in government. They will shape our future.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAZMINO: So, affordability is the name of this administration. That is certainly what Zohran Mamdani has tried to focus on. And there was a lot of, you know, New York pride. Throughout his speech, Zohran Mamdani talked about his own experience growing up as a child here in New York City. He talked about eating slices of pizza and pastrami sandwiches and powdered donuts and riding the subway and taking yellow cabs.
There was a lot of love for the city of New York in his speech, but he also made the point that the people who keep this place running, working class people, it's becoming harder and harder for them, making, of course, the point about the affordability crisis during his message today -- Jim.
SCIUTTO: Yeah. No question. Well, as a fellow New Yorker, I mean, you got to name what your favorite pizza slice is. And he got that in there as well as your favorite bagel.
Gloria Pazmino, thanks so much.
My panel is here in THE ARENA. Journalist and former "Wall Street Journal" senior political correspondent Molly Ball; Toluse Olorunnipa, staff writer for "The Atlantic"; Democratic strategist Meghan Hays; and Republican strategist John Feehery.
I do want to begin, though, with a former mayor of New York himself and key Mamdani supporter, we should note, Bill de Blasio, who was right there out in the cold at the swearing in.
I wonder if you could tell us what the energy was like as you listened to him and the crowd listened to him there? Does he have -- is he speaking the voice of New York right now?
BILL DE BLASIO (D), FORMER NEW YORK CITY MAYOR: Let me tell you, Jim, I mean, everyone was frozen, but it was electric nonetheless. It was a really beautiful, beautiful ceremony. I think this was in many ways a love song to New York from Mamdani. It was actually quite poetic, the way he talked about the city and our people. And I think that's something that should not be underestimated.
He has a unifying voice in terms of love of the city and the neighborhoods, but a very distinct focus on working class New Yorkers and celebrating them and what they've achieved. Even though people hear about the big famous names in New York, he really focuses on working people.
And I thought he did an incredibly effective job of saying, I'm going to shoot for the stars here. I'm going to really try and make big changes. But he didn't say, look, were going to succeed every time. He said, the only way we're going to find out what's possible is to be audacious. And I respect that.
When we did pre-K for all in New York City, right after I was sworn in 12 years ago, you couldn't imagine the number of people who said, you know, it wasn't realistic. It wasn't possible.
The only reason we got to it was aiming high and trying to inspire the people to come along and to move all the rest of the political world in our favor. He learned that lesson, and he's applying it very powerfully. So, I think he's going to go up to Albany for universal childcare. He's going to go up there for support for fast and free buses from our state legislature. And I think he's going to have a real grassroots sort of swell helping him achieve these goals.
And today's speech, I think, helped him a lot in terms of like really consolidating that support and that energy from the people.
SCIUTTO: Can he move the state legislature, though, on those issues? I mean, for instance, taxing, taxing the wealthy? I mean, this is going to be I mean, he would need the state on his side.
DE BLASIO: Jim, you know, I had the exact same situation 12 years ago. I called for a tax on the wealthy to pay for pre-K for all. Then Governor Cuomo opposed that. But what was interesting is we got really tremendous popular support, that affected the legislators. And they came up with an alternative, a different way of funding the initiative.
I wouldn't be surprised if you see something like that here. I think the bottom line also is, Jim, people forget Mamdani spent five years as a legislator in Albany. He knows how the place works, and I think he's going to have a leg up because of that.
SCIUTTO: With the panel now, too -- affordability, I didn't count every time he mentioned the word "affordability", but I want to play one moment here where he got to the core of what appears to be not just his campaign pitch, right? But now his policy pitch as mayor. Have a listen. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAMDANI: City hall will deliver an agenda of safety, affordability and abundance where government looks and lives like the people it represents never flinches in the fight against corporate greed and refuses to cower before challenges that others have deemed too complicated.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Meghan Hays, I wonder if you could hear other Democratic candidates in the midterms, and perhaps going up to 2028 who might say or attempt to say exactly that, those things.
MEGHAN HAYS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I think everyone will talk about affordability. I think you saw that in New Jersey and in Virginia. And I'd like to remind everyone that New Jersey and Virginia also represent the exact same amount of people. And they were also -- are going to be -- are sworn in, I think, and take over governing their state today.
So, you know, I do think that, but I also think campaigning is a lot easier than governing. And he has a long way to try to figure out how to make some of these policies work. As the former mayor was saying, he had to go to Albany, and he had to figure out a fix. So, this is not something that's going to happen overnight. So he's been the mayor for 15 or 16 hours here. So, we have a long way to go.
So yes, I do think Democrats will talk about affordability. I'm not sure their solutions will be the same as his.
SCIUTTO: John, we had a sort of bromance like moment with President Trump a couple of weeks ago that surprised many. In Mamdani's address here, he mentioned Donald Trump again, but not in as friendly terms. Have a listen. I want to get your thoughts.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAMDANI: Every person who makes the choice day after day, even when it feels important --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Yeah. We -- well, I'll quote him if we don't have the sound. If anyone can show a nation betrayed by Donald Trump how to defeat him, it is the city that gave rise to him. How we stop Trump, it's how we stop the next one. So, Donald Trump, since I know you\re watching words for you, turn up the volume. Quite a direct challenge.
How do you expect President Trump to take that that challenge?
JOHN FEEHERY, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: He doesn't take criticism well, President Trump. So, I think we could see him slap back a little bit. You know, obviously they do represent aggrieved voters. And I think that they both are trying to address it from different perspectives. President wants to deregulate and get rid of taxes. That would be
actually a good idea for Mister -- Mayor Mamdani, because it is the most taxed and most regulated city in the country. And that's what's really causing this affordability crisis specifically for New York. I don't think raising taxes and getting more regulations are going to help. I think President Trump is going to try to -- I mean, he -- Mamdani is a great foil for Trump. He is the anti-Trump in so many ways. And for his supporters, the Trump supporters, he's like a guy, great guy to hate.
What Trump did in the Oval Office, though, was fascinating because he basically said, I can get along with this guy. I love New York, just like he loves New York. Let's make New York work together. So, I think it's actually very a very interesting political debate that's going to happen for the next year.
SCIUTTO: Listen, I -- but I wonder if it's that clean cut on taxes, right? Because what he's talking about is taxing the extremely wealthy, right, for quite basic things, like, for instance, subsidized bus service. You know, it's not -- do you think, Molly Ball, that perhaps it has more appeal particularly in a city like New York or a state like New York?
MOLLY BALL, FORMER SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, THE WALL STREET JOURNAL: Well, I mean, there's broad public support for taxing the rich in general. But, you know, this whole speech was about that tension between ideology and practicality. And you can see that the new mayor is speaking as someone who realizes that much more than simply his own political career is resting on his shoulders, it is the fate of a whole movement.
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
BALL: And this whole left wing, Democratic socialist movement is going to rise or fall based on whether he is perceived as doing anything resembling a good job in New York City, which is really hard to do, right? It's notoriously a job, kind of like being president, that puts people through a meat grinder and choose them up and spits them out.
So, he is going to be, I think, to Meghan's point, you know, Democratic candidates all over the country are going to be asked about Zohran Mamdani for the for the next year and what their answers signify is going to be.
Do they see that as a question about he's a scary socialist that I want to run as far away from as possible? Or is Zohran or is Mayor Mamdani able to actually convince the country that he does represent something to aspire to?
SCIUTTO: And to a point you made actually, during the break, David Dinkins was the first New York mayor to be a member of the Democratic socialists of America prior. So there's -- there's some history there.
Toluse, listen, every politician who comes into office will retreat to some degree, right? You know, make big promises during the campaign. Do you see that? Mamdani will do, will do the same. Pick a handful of issues that he thinks he can deliver on quickly.
TOLUSE OLORUNNIPA, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: It sounds like that's what he's starting to do. He's made a very clear campaign about a handful of issues that he wants to deliver on fast and free buses, free childcare and other ancillary issues like grocery stores run by the government are some things that he may try to work on, but I think he's going to be judged on whether he can deliver his major campaign promises, and he's going to be judged not only by New Yorkers, but he's going to be judged on a national platform.
There are going to be Republicans that are calling questioning whether or not he can deliver fast and free busses, whether or not this idea of taxing the rich actually works, or whether or not it drives millionaires away from New York. And so he's under a lot of pressure, not only within his party and within his city, but nationally and especially among Republicans that want to use him as the face of Democratic failure.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
OLORUNNIPA: Obviously, he knows that, and he is trying to set the bar in a way that -- and also hiring a lot of people that have a lot of government experience to try to deliver on these various promises.
SCIUTTO: Listen, and, of course, AOC, she was there and she has been a similar target or attempted target for Republicans as they try to tar the party.
[16:15:04]
Bill de Blasio, thanks so much to you for joining, given you were there.
Panel, please do stay with me.
Coming up on THE ARENA, the Affordable Care Act's enhanced subsidies expired last night, which means that millions of Americans could soon see their health insurance premiums skyrocket. Congresswoman Debbie Dingell, she's going to be here to discuss.
Plus, Donald Trump opens up about his own health, a little bit. Ahead, new details on the president's daily aspirin regimen and a new explanation for the imaging he received back in October.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I did. I did.
I got an MRI. It was perfect. I mean, I gave you -- I gave you the full results. We had an MRI, and in the machine, you know, the whole thing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:20:13]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAMDANI: Thank you to the man whose leadership I seek most to emulate, who I am so grateful to be sworn in by today -- Senator Bernie Sanders.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: While the spotlight, of course, was on Mayor Mamdani today, it was not hard to notice the other Democrats who flanked him -- Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez, Bernie Sanders, and interestingly, Senator Schumer, who did not endorse Mayor Mamdani in the race.
A lot has been said about what lessons Democrats can take from Mamdani's long shot campaign win. So how will his time as mayor impact this year's midterms and beyond?
Joining me in THE ARENA, Democratic Congresswoman Debbie Dingell from the great state of Michigan.
Thanks so much for joining.
REP. DEBBIE DINGELL (D-MI): Great to be with you. Happy New Year.
SCIUTTO: You as well.
You've been saying for a long time that Democrats need a project 2028 to lay out their agenda. Did you hear elements of that in Mamdani speech?
DINGELL: I did, and I think what we have to. It's not enough for us to be anti-President Trump. People want to know what we're for and how we're going to deliver. So I think it's very important we've got to start articulating what we're for as we go into the congressional elections for 26 and presidential candidates are going to have to be very strong on that.
SCIUTTO: His positions are going to be attacked by Republicans and caricatured to some degree. Do you think they risk making a mistake because some of the issues, beyond just that buzzword of "affordability", things that he's talking about controlling the cost of rent, impacting a lot of Americans taxing the rich to benefit working class Americans, there's a lot of appeal for that among populists on the right as well.
DINGELL: I hate labels. What's the populist? What does that mean?
I'm going to tell you how people feel across the country, and they can't afford the cost of living. I think affordability is becoming a buzz word, and I want to talk about the people I represent have come up to me in the grocery store on Sunday mornings and show me what, how much something costs and how they can't afford it.
And I think a lot of people are going to try to label the mayor and a lot with, you know, socialism, whatever. I'm going to remind you of something. These problems are not isolated to the city of New York.
Caregiving is a major issue across this country, and most people don't know this. But my father-in-law was one of the authors of Social Security, and nobody can -- and why did he introduce Social Security? Why did he fight for it so hard? Because seniors were living on the street.
SCIUTTO: Yeah.
DINGELL: They didn't have any health care. He was called a communist.
Do we think of Social Security as socialism or communism?
SCIUTTO: Well, I hear you. I mean, listen, Medicare -- Medicare, all these things were caricatured, and now people hold them very dear, Republicans and Democrats.
As you know, the former speaker of the House, Nancy Pelosi, is very bullish on Democrats chances in the midterms. I want to play her comments and get your thoughts on the other side.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JONATHAN KARL, ABC NEWS HOST: So if the Democrats win the House back --
REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA): Yeah. No, no. When -- when the Democrats win the House back, then they will.
KARL: So how does the next Democratic speaker of the house deal with Donald Trump? What would be your advice? You've been there yourself.
PELOSI: Be yourself. Just do your own thing. Just be yourself.
Hakeem Jeffries is ready. He's eloquent. He's respected by the members. He's unifier, and he will have --
KARL: You have no doubt that it will be Hakeem Jeffries.
PELOSI: None.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Do you agree that Democrats both have the momentum and the right leadership to win in the fall?
DINGELL: So we have the momentum. But you know, this is Debbie Downer you're talking to. Although, Debbie Downer predicted all the elections correctly.
We can't take anything for granted. We have got to be. You -- look, Hakeem Jeffries brought us together as we were fighting for health care for every American, which, as millions of Americans today are starting the New Year without health care or not knowing if they can afford it. We as Democrats are unified in the fall. People knew what we were fighting for and knew that we were going to do everything we can to deliver. That is what he is going to do as we go into the election cycle. But we as Democrats have to not do our normal thing and become Democrats divided again.
SCIUTTO: Right.
DINGELL: We can take nothing for granted. We are going to have to work our hearts and souls out and show people how we're going to deliver until election day.
SCIUTTO: So, you bring up the health care premiums. House set to vote on a Democratic plan this month. As you know, faces tough hurdles in the Senate. Will Democrats hold the line on that issue? Right?
Because as you know, Democrats got criticism for ultimately folding during the government shutdown. And here we are. Those subsidies are expiring.
DINGELL: So, what's your definition of holding the line? I think we got to make sure that millions of Americans can go to the doctor.
[16:25:02]
When -- I'm somebody that believes that when you are sick, you should be able to go to the doctor and get the medicine that you need and get the treatment that you need. Period. We spend twice as much on health care in this country than any other industrialized nation, have worst outcomes.
So, it will pass. I will -- it will pass in the House, the three-year extension. I've told Hakeem very pointedly, we would have Republicans supporting that. Now we got to work with the Senate.
So, is compromise a dirty word? No, but my job is not to wait until November. And is that -- our job is to take care of those millions of Americans right now that don't know whether they can go to the doctor.
SCIUTTO: But if they -- if you don't get the Senate to act, and if it becomes clear that the subsidies are just going to disappear, do you shut the government down again to use that language?
DINGELL: I don't know what's going to happen because I refuse to have that kind of attitude. I believe that people are home, they're talking to many of the same people, the kinds of people that I'm talking to. I mean, I have some stories that would just make you cry.
We've got a responsibility to the people that elect us that we need to deliver for them. And so I'm just not going to take that negative attitude. We got to work together. I've talked to Republicans and Democratic senators. They are talking to each other.
We got to get something done because that's why people send us to Washington to deliver for them. SCIUTTO: So let me ask you this. Beyond affordability questions and
health care questions, if Democrats were to win in the fall, given how many Democrats have accused the president and members of his administration of illegal acts, what a Democratic-led House seek to impeach?
DINGELL: Look, I'm somebody -- the last time we had to vote, I couldn't vote to table. But I think we need to be focused on delivering for the American people, for the people that elect us and the issues that impact them every single day. And we'll have to see where we are, what more outrageous things have done? Have we gone to war without coming to the Congress?
Who -- I'm scared about some of the things that can happen, but I'm not going to stop fighting. I'm not going to stop trying to deliver for the people that I represent. And I think Democrats are going to be united in ensuring that we do that.
SCIUTTO: Okay. We'll see how it goes over the next ten months. Congresswoman Debbie Dingell, thanks so much for joining us and happy New Year.
DINGELL: Happy New Year.
SCIUTTO: Coming up in THE ARENA, President Trump says he is removing national guard troops from three cities. However, that is leaving the door open for something more. Not quite clear what. We'll explain.
Plus, new details on that horrific fire that has left dozens dead at a New Year's party in Switzerland. What authorities are ruling out and what they say might have started the blaze.
That's ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:32:05]
SCIUTTO: Breaking news: some 40 people are dead following a fire during a New Year's party at a ski resort in Switzerland, 115 other people were injured, with authorities saying that a significant number of those injured are in critical condition.
In this video taken at the scene last night, you can see flames grow there as those inside attempted to flee. Police are investigating, witnesses told a CNN affiliate that the fire began when sparklers attached to champagne bottles were held too close to the bar's ceiling.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There were people screaming and then people lying on the ground, probably dead. They had jackets over their faces. Well, that's what I saw. Nothing more.
Then I received videos where people were trying to get out, but they were trampling over each other. So, it was hard to get out through the exit. And there were people shouting, saying, "Help me, please help us."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Good Lord.
CNN's Nic Robertson is live on the ground in Crans-Montana, Switzerland.
Nic, just an awful, awful tragedy here. What is the latest on the investigation of the cause? And also, just that enormous death toll.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: The latest is many, many unanswered questions. And obviously, a lot of interest and pressure, particularly from those families of the deceased and those who are lying injured in hospital to find out such things as how could the fire take and catch, hold and burn so rapidly? Questions about the capacity, the numbers of people that were in this downstairs underground bar. These are all questions that the prosecutor says he just does not have answers for at the moment.
But the most pressing thing for authorities at the moment is identifying not just the dead to inform their families, but the commander of the police here has said that there are still people in hospital whose identities they don't know, which really gives you a sense of the gravity of the speed and the voracious nature of the fire and the injuries people have suffered. And the police say the priority, therefore, is to is to get the information to inform their families about the loved ones. And it could take days.
But to give you an idea, I'm going to ask Clayton here to zoom in over my shoulder a bit here down the street you can see some colored lights. Behind those colored lights is a white fence. Now, earlier on, there was a light behind that white fence. That's where the bar is.
The forensic -- police forensic teams were working in that lit area. They've -- they've since over the past hour or so, stopped working in that area. It's gone dark. We can assume, perhaps, that that part of their investigation has paused.
But those questions that are being posed about the numbers and about the exits and about the reason that the fire spread so quickly, that's what's going to occupy more time in the coming days. But just to give you a sense of this very elite, if you will Swiss resort Crans- Montana, a resort that that has international standing, a resort issues for conferences, a resort that's so popular with the Swiss in the wintertime. Just over there, a small candle vigil. Has been set this evening.
A few flowers laid there. The area itself is still in a lockdown by. That investigation goes on -- Jim.
SCIUTTO: Yeah, well, a lot of the victims, young people. Nic Robertson, thanks so much. Well, turning now to another story we've been following closely.
President Trump announced on New Year's Eve that he is now removing the National Guard from Chicago, Los Angeles and Portland, claiming that crime in those cities has been greatly reduced. Though the president notably left open the possibility of future deployments, writing in part, quote, "We will come back, perhaps in a much different and stronger form when crime begins to soar again. Only a question of time," end quote.
Trump's decision follows a series of legal setbacks, chief among them the Supreme Court's decision last week, which rejected his request to send National Guard troops to Chicago, presumably or arguably to protect ICE agents.
My panel is back now and we're joined by Elizabeth Goitein. She's the senior director of the liberty and national security program at NYU's Brennan Center.
Liza, I want to begin with you, if I can, because should we read the president's comment -- comments in his social -- Truth Social post about coming back stronger in a different, much different form as in effect, a threat or a promise to at some point invoke the insurrection act.
ELIZABETH GOITEIN, SENIOR DIRECTOR, LIBERTY & NATIONAL SECUREITY PROGRAM AT NYU'S BRENNAN CENTER: I'm not sure we can read it that way. It might just be face-saving, but I think he certainly wants to reserve the option to try once again to deploy the military in U.S. citizens -- in U.S. cities, notwithstanding the Supreme Court's decision.
However, I think that the Supreme Court's decision really bodes ill for his ability to do that, even if he invokes the Insurrection Act, which is really the biggest gun in his legal arsenal when it comes to domestic deployment.
SCIUTTO: On that point, it was notable that Justice Brett Kavanaugh, who of course, sided with the majority. He did say the following. In his concurrence, he says, as I read it, the court's opinion does not address the president's authority under the Insurrection Act, when a ramification of the court's opinion is that it could cause the president to use the U.S. military more than the national guard to protect federal personnel and property in the United States.
Is he creating something of a roadmap for the president to press his case if he were to choose to do so on the Insurrection Act or other deployments of federal -- of military forces?
GOITEIN: That may be what he's trying to do. And you can see where he gets that, because the majority of the Supreme Court essentially held that under the law that the president was relying on, he would first have to -- first have some legal authority to deploy active duty armed forces. And then he would have to show that deploying them just wouldn't solve the problem for some reason.
And in some ways, that might look like an invitation for him to invoke the Insurrection Act to try to deploy active duty armed troops or to federalize the national guard under that separate law.
But again, I think it is quite remarkable that we had a six to three ruling against the administration from a Supreme Court that has bent over backwards to rule for the administration in cases where the law seemed to be very clearly against, the administration.
So, I think what this signals is that there is a profound level of discomfort among the majority of justices with the way that President Trump is trying to use the military domestically. And I think that that would most likely carry over if the president were to try to invoke the Insurrection Act.
SCIUTTO: John Feehery, I wonder, is this politically something that the president wants to push further? There's a Reuters/Ipsos poll found -- this from October, found that 58 percent of Americans don't want troops deployed without an external threat. Should Trump stay away from this?
FEEHERY: Well, it kind of sounds to me like Arnold Schwarzenegger. I'll be back, you know?
But you know, the crime has been a good issue for Trump, and I think that he can go and say, right now, listen, we are now at the largest decrease in homicides in history, thanks to my leadership. He could say that.
SCIUTTO: I mean, you could say that although local officials say it's actually their cooperation -- it's the police and its cooperation with the FBI, et cetera.
FEEHERY: Well, most local officials would say that because most of them are Democrats.
[16:40:01]
But the president will say that this is -- this is because of his policies, and he said that. If crime gets out of control again, he reserves the right to go back in.
And I think, you know, he can now say, as he's going into the next year, going into the midterms, trying to get momentum for him and the economy is up for 4.3 percent growth. Crime is down. Those are things that you can run on.
And, you know, keeping the National Guard for some areas where Republican governors are in New Orleans and places like that, he can say that this is helping. And for a lot of local citizens, they feel comfort that the National Guard is there. So, listen, I think that, this is one of -- one of those things that he can say that he's been successful at and has an arrow in his quiver and he should declare victory.
SCIUTTO: And just declare.
Meghan, do you buy that line of argument? HAYS: This is a total loss and he's trying to save face. This is a check on his power, which was rightfully needed. Normalizing military on American streets without a foreign threat is an unacceptable use of our military. And I think that the American people feel that way. And these governors pushed back and fought him, and now they're not in their states.
And I applaud the governors for pushing back so hard. And Pritzker and Newsom really were forceful in it. And because we are not trying to normalize military walking our streets, that's not the use of our military. They need to be ready to fight foreign adversaries.
SCIUTTO: Toluse, on that point, did Pritzker and Newsom give themselves some political ammunition to run on this? You know, you Democrats have been saying to us, your lawmakers stand up to the president here. We did and we won.
OLORUNNIPA: I mean, it is rare to see the president back down from a policy that he really feels strongly about. And this is a case in which he's doing that. And so, for the Democrats that played a role in that, they can go to their voters and say, look, I can stand up to the president.
That's what the base of the Democratic Party wants right now. We saw it in New York with the victory of Mayor Mamdani. We've seen it elsewhere. People who have said that they can focus on affordability, but also showing that they can take the fight to President Trump. That gets the base excited. And that is what you're hearing from Newsom.
That's part of the reason he has some momentum, what he did with redistricting, what he's done on this National Guard deployment. He is using this as a platform to increase his political, visibility and really show voters that he's willing to fight against President Trump. I think a lot of Democrats are taking note of that.
SCIUTTO: Molly, to John's point, do Democrats risk underestimating Americans' openness to having some presence, some uniformed presence, whether its National Guard on their streets and make a connection, even if local law enforcement will, will dispute the connection between that and safety?
BALL: Well, I think it's going to be fascinating to see how the politics of this were going to really understand the politics when we see whether Trump decides to try to test this again, to try to send the National Guard in again, because if because as you read from that poll, these deployments are not popular, they're not popular in those Democratic cities, but they're not popular nationally -- excuse me -- with people far from these urban cores as well.
And the problem with the politics of crime is it's very difficult to declare victory for -- people, if you look at some of those same polls, people don't believe that crime is down. Crime has been -- particularly violent crime -- has been plummeting for the past few years. People think that crime is rising. So, for the president to say crime is solved, everybody should be happy. That may be a difficult political message. I agree that it has been a winning issue for him, but to try to convince people that the that the problem is solved may be more tricky.
SCIUTTO: No question. Elizabeth Goitein, thanks so much for walking us through the law of it all.
Panel, please do stay with me. I've got a few more questions for you.
Ahead in THE ARENA, President Trump revealed just how much aspirin he takes daily. It's a fair amount. How could it impact the bruising on his hand, which the White House says is purely from shaking hands?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The president is literally constantly shaking hands. The Oval Office is like Grand Central Terminal. He is meeting with more people than any of you even know about on a daily basis
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:48:22]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I did. I got an MRI. That was perfect. Yeah, I mean, I gave you -- I gave you the full results. We had an MRI, and in the machine, you know, the whole thing. And it was perfect.
And an MRI. The doctor said it was the best result he has ever seen as a doctor. That's it. But I had an MRI as part of my standard yearly or every -- I think they do it every two years, but I have the physical every year and the result was outstanding.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Well, months after President Trump claimed he had gone -- undergone an MRI, he's now actually correcting the rector record. In an interview with "The Wall Street Journal", both Trump and his doctor confirmed it was actually a CT scan. Trump also revealed he takes more aspirin than a doctors recommend, and is superstitious about using aspirin to lower or considering lowering that dosage, saying, quote, "They say aspirin is good for thinning out the blood, and I don't want thick blood pouring through my heart. I want nice thin blood pouring through my heart. Does that make sense?"
The president's physician told "The Journal", Trump takes 325 milligrams of aspirin per day for cardiac prevention. According to the mayo clinic, a low dose of aspirin, which, quote, can help prevent heart attack or stroke, ranges from 75 to 100 milligrams, and the daily dose for aspirin therapy is usually between 75 and 325 milligrams.
Dr. Jeremy Faust joins us now. He's an assistant professor of emergency medicine at Harvard Medical School.
Dr. Faust, thanks so much for joining.
DR. JEREMY FAUST, ASSISTANT PROFESSOR OF EMERGENCY MEDICINE, HARVARD MEDICAL SCHOOL: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: So I read "The Journal" piece, and actually, as I read it, I said, well, nothing here seems to be particularly alarming.
[16:50:03]
Some signs of aging, but generally a fairly healthy picture for a 79- year-old?
FAUST: I would agree with that. I think that most of what we saw was a fleshing out of much of what we already knew. With these corrections about the CAT scan, as opposed to the MRI. But I agree that the interesting piece of information, especially as an emergency clinician, was that this gentleman is taking 325 milligrams of aspirin per day in an event -- in an effort to prevent a heart attack. That is a dose that we treat actually, for patients who are having a heart attack and some very, very high risk, high risk patients might be maintained on that after a stroke or a heart attack. But it's pretty unusual.
And the reason for that is that the lower dose, the standard dose of 81 milligram, does confer all of the benefit for the patients who are at risk of a stroke or heart attack while minimizing the serious risk of bleeding.
SCIUTTO: So let me ask you a question then. You know, does the combination of things. I mean, you give a CT scan, it seems for his overall heart -- cardiovascular health, but he's got a very high dose. He's got these other issues with bruising, et cetera.
Does that add up to -- from your perspective? And I know you're not his doctor. So you\re reading from afar. But does that add up to you a sign that perhaps his heart condition is more serious than he's letting on?
FAUST: That I could not say. What I can say is that the dose of aspirin that he acknowledges that he takes does credibly explain the bruising. I would say the bleeding risk is real. He's also a guy who has a history of what's called diverticulosis, which are outpouchings in the colon, which are prone to bleed. So, another reason to be careful there.
And the CAT scan results that we got from July seem to indicate that his heart function was okay. I don't think this was part of anything standard. Theres not an executive physical that they claim that would have all of this. So it's kind of troubling just in terms of the medical decision making.
Again, when we talk about people of his age, actually, the United States Preventive Services Task Force is talking about when should people stop taking aspirin. And after 75 years of age, especially in patients with a bleed risk, that's a time when people start having that conversation, because the long-term benefits of the cardiovascular and stroke prevention start to get a little lower, and it's kind of subsumed by that bleeding risk.
SCIUTTO: Yeah, yeah, it kind of sounds like the president is dosing himself. I'm supposed to listen to your doctor, I thought.
Back to the panel.
Molly Ball -- I just wonder, you know, I'm not going to ask you to diagnose the president here, but in terms of how the president has been talking about this, dialing up "The Wall Street Journal" to give him an interview as they do this reporting, has he taken away or inadvertently added to questions about his state of health?
BALL: I think it helps him politically to take this all on head on. I think, you know, it's impossible not to compare the situation to President Biden. And I was at "The Journal" when we did some very hard hitting reporting on Biden's age and capacity as well. And the White House's response was not only to deny it was an issue, but to basically accuse us of concocting a conspiracy theory and say anyone who even noticed that Biden was slowing down a tiny bit was a part -- was a rabid partisan actor.
SCIUTTO: Right.
BALL: And none of this was real.
So I think, you know, and Trump, having been part of that chorus of haters, you know, certainly helped fuel the fire. But this White House has, just from a communications perspective, taken the opposite tack of saying were going to have the president be out there as much as possible to show people exactly how robust he is, and they can make their own judgment. Plenty of people have made plenty of judgments about President Trump, but it's not based on something they can't see.
SCIUTTO: Sure. I mean, listen, John, I mean, the other questions in these -- we've seen play out with our own eyes. Right? Closing his eyes, seeming to doze off in meetings. I mean, you can imagine how right-wing media might respond to similar situations. They wouldn't let those be explained away so easily as, oh, I was just closing my eyes because I enjoyed a quiet moment.
FEEHERY: Well, I'm fascinated by this new MAGA agenda. Make aspirin great again.
You know, listen, if I was in that meeting at 3:00, 3:00 in the afternoon, I probably would doze off, too.
You know, I watch his golf game, and I'm very impressed. He's got a nice swing. He hits the ball pretty far.
He's 78 years old. He's got -- every time I talk to members of Congress, they are just amazed by how much energy this guy has, mostly giving them a hard time calling them all the time, all hours of the night. I mean, for 78-year-old old guy, I mean, he's in great shape from my perspective. And, you know, maybe I should start taking more aspirin. SCIUTTO: But apparently not walk on a treadmill because Trump, Trump
says to walk on a treadmill or run on a treadmill for hours and hours, like some people do. That's not for me.
By the way, it is what doctors recommend, right? For cardiovascular health. Do you have questions and do you think the White House being forthright and being forthright and forthcoming about the president's health?
HAYS: No. They're rolling around in circles in every day. It's like a different thing. Or every time it comes up, it's a different excuse.
[16:55:02]
And there seems to be excuses. So being transparent is great. Telling lies in the course of transparency, that's not actual transparency. So you can be in front of the president or the press as much as you want, but that doesn't mean you're actually transparent. So they should take a lesson from the Biden administration and be more transparent, and then he should stay awake.
SCIUTTO: Well, as many folks noted, while hand-shaking could explain bruising on your right hand, he's got it on both hands. And not a lot of folks shake hands with both hands.
Dr. Jeremy Faust, thanks so much for joining.
And we will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: Thanks so much to my panel. Happy New Year to all of you and to all of you watching.
Phil Mattingly standing by for "THE LEAD".
Thanks, Phil. Show us what you got.
