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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt
Trump Warns Iran U.S. Assault Will Resume If No Deal Reached; Soon: Artemis II Mission Returns To Earth; Kamala Harris On 2028 Presidential Run: "I'm Thinking About It". Aired 4-5p ET
Aired April 10, 2026 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
EVA LONGORIA, CNN HOST, "EVA LONGORIA SEARCHING FOR FRANCE: And the crust. And all of that custard and whipped cream, well -- that is incredible.
[16:00:12]
This is extraterrestrial, like your brain is on another level to create something like this.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN HOST: What I just saw was beautiful. The back-to- back premiere of "EVA LONGORIA SEARCHING FOR FRANCE" airs Sunday at 9:00 p.m. on CNN.
Thanks for hanging with us, everyone.
THE ARENA WITH KASIE HUNT starts right now.
KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Hi, everyone. I'm Kasie Hunt. Welcome to THE ARENA. It's great to have you with us on this Friday. Happy Friday.
As we come on the air, the United States and Iran are set to meet at the negotiating table. And President Donald Trump clearly expects some big concessions. He posted this afternoon, quote, "The Iranians don't seem to realize they have no cards other than a short-term extortion of the world by using international waterways. The only reason they are alive today is to negotiate," end quote.
Right now, Vice President J.D. Vance is on his way to Pakistan to lead the U.S. delegation, along with Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner, with a fragile ceasefire seeming at this hour to be holding, the stakes are high. The clock is ticking.
When asked if he thought the talks would be successful, President Trump told "The New York Post" this, quote, "We're going to find out in about 24 hours. We're going to know soon. We're loading up the ships with the best ammunition, the best weapons ever made, even better than what we did previously. And we blew them apart. And if we don't have a deal, we will be using them and we will be using them very effectively," end quote.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: If the Iranians are willing to negotiate in good faith, we're certainly willing to extend the open hand. If they're going to try to play us, then they're going to find that the negotiating team is not that receptive. So we're going to try to have a positive negotiation. The president has gave us some pretty clear guidelines, and we're going to see.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: All right. Let's get off the sidelines. Head into THE ARENA. My panel will be here.
But we're going to get started with CNN international diplomatic editor Nic Robertson, who is on the ground for us in Islamabad, Pakistan.
So, Nic, what are you hearing there ahead of these high stakes talks?
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah, the Iranians just landed about an hour ago. J.D. Vance, his negotiating team landing in a few hours time. The scene set at a major hotel in the center of the city here. It's on high security lockdown. I was driving around there earlier on behind the security perimeter. No one on the streets, high level of secrecy.
What we do know, however, is that the talks are most likely going to be proximity talks, not the Iranian delegation in the same room as the U.S. delegation, rather, the Pakistani interlocutors shuttling between the two sides. A lot of praise, I've got to say, coming from the Pakistan side for J.D. Vance. It's a make or break moment the Pakistan prime minister said in a televised address to the nation just a few hours ago.
So there is a real sense of history potentially in the making. But the Iranians come into this with some very hard line demands that it's not clear that they're going to sit well with the United States. They want, as we've been hearing the past couple of days, they want a ceasefire in Lebanon. They want Israel to stop hitting Iran's proxy, Hezbollah in Lebanon, and they want that tied into the tied into the deal.
Of course, opening the Strait of Hormuz is going to be key on J.D. Vance's agenda with the Iranians. And I've been talking to people here, officials, to try to figure out what is kind of the format, even when you get in the room or these separate rooms, however, it shakes out. The Iranians are saying they're coming in with a 10-point plan. And what I'm being told is, look, if you want to get somewhere and kind of lock in the ceasefire and make real progress, you need to kind of get some of those points ticked off and agreed five, six, seven points, maybe ticked off.
So my question was, well, that's going to take time. And as the U.S. side and J.D. Vance is saying, we're going to kind of figure out pretty quickly if the Iranians are playing ball, the Iranians negotiating style, totally different, they don't feel that they don't have cards to play here. They still clearly feel like they do with their demands.
So, it's all to play for a sense of history building here. But of course, if it works, yeah, maybe gas prices can start falling back towards where they, where they took off from over a month ago.
HUNT: Some pretty big ifs there, but points well taken.
Nic Robertson in Islamabad, Pakistan for us -- Nic, thank you very much.
My panel is here in THE ARENA. CNN legal analyst, former federal prosecutor Elliot Williams; CNN political commentator, Republican strategist and pollster, Kristen Soltis Anderson; former Democratic congressman from South Carolina, Joe Cunningham; and former Trump administration official Matt Mowers.
We are also joined by former NATO supreme allied commander, the retired General Wesley Clark.
Thank you all so much for being here. And, General Clark, let me start with you. Just picking up where we left off there in terms of the stakes here and the incentives for each side.
I mean, the Iranians are not exactly known for being fast moving, negotiators, but there are a lot of things that are pushing President Trump to resolve this quickly. How do you think this weekend is set to go?
GENERAL WESLEY CLARK (RET.), FORMER NATO SUPREME ALLIED COMMANDER: I think its going to be very tough start. Hopefully, there will be some traction enough to continue. But you know, negotiations like this, they start with leverage. And so if you're the party that wants the quickest resolution, you're the party that's going to get the worst deal and although President Trump says he's ready to resort to force quickly, I think the Iranians don't believe it because during the run up for this, it was the United States that was pressing for the ceasefire and so forth.
And they know by just the way the United States always operates, we like a quick war. We don't want ground troops. We don't want casualties. But let's get in, let's get it over with. And, there've been a lot of articles that have come out about how the administration made the decision and what the expectations were.
And so I think the Iranians, they read the same press. They're very smart about us. And so, they're going to hang tough. They're going to give us just enough rope to keep the negotiations going.
It's in their interest to stall this. They don't -- are not going to accept that the United States is willing to go back to the air campaign right away. So I think its going to be a gold.
HUNT: Where do you see NATO, our historic NATO allies, in all of this? Obviously, the secretary general was here in Washington this week, but we're seeing some unprecedented in many ways, things happen in the Strait of Hormuz, which is important for them as well, including paying tolls potentially to the Iranians.
CLARK: Well, we haven't heard this officially, at least I haven't. But hopefully the United States is right now talking to our NATO allies and saying we're going to need help to do the Strait of Hormuz.
It could be a simple escort mission. Okay, you've got ships you're bringing. It may be using force to get in there. In that case, were going to need more than we've got.
So in any case, this is in your interest. Let's get the ships. Let's get some marines down there from France and Britain. Some of those great Special Forces the Brits have.
We need all that support and we should be lining up just in case and to give us leverage what we have to do if the negotiations fail, if the Iranians insist on charging tolls and restricting access, we've got to have an alternative. And that's where NATO is logically able to play.
HUNT: So, Matt Mowers, I mean, this is a critical moment for J.D. Vance, the vice president. You know, we've known, but we learned a little bit more this week in "The New York Times" around the texture of where he stood as the president was trying to make this decision to go in. And suffice to say, he was against it, but just, you know, told the president, according to "The Times", that he would be on board if he went forward.
It is not Marco Rubio leading this delegation. Now, that may be protocol based, but can you sort of set the scene in terms of the stakes for the vice president here and what this weekend could mean for him for?
MATT MOWERS, FORMER TRUMP ADMINISTRATION OFFICIAL: Well, I think it shows a lot of confidence that the president has in the vice president that he is sending them there, along with Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner, of course, who are part of the initial negotiations, said as well. And I think the key thing is going to be looking at the expectations of what comes out of this weekend. And I think tangible commitments from this weekend are unlikely.
What they're going to do is instead move from escalation to some form of structured diplomacy, figure out the guardrails of what these discussions look like, like in the future, they're also going to have to agree to the actual set of what they're discussing. There is disagreement right now about whether Lebanon is part of this ceasefire and whether the attacks in the region on our Gulf allies is part of it. We've already seen Iran continue to saber-rattle in that case. And so they've got to come up with that agreement.
They've also ultimately got to decide to is what form of sanctions relief would be the carrot they can offer. At the end of the day, a lot of the sanctions in place right now, include some of the toughest ones on banking and energy are congressionally mandated sanctions. So there's going to have to be some back channeling to Congress here as well. HUNT: Yeah. Well, I mean, Congressman, Congress not so. I mean,
Republicans in congress not thrilled with the president on this. By and large, some of them are willing to say it out loud in public, others less so. Democrats, obviously, trying to court them for a potential vote on war powers.
I mean, big picture, how do you see this all as its set right now?
JOE CUNNINGHAM (D), FORMER SOUTH CAROLINA CONGRESSMAN: I mean, it looks like the administration is learning in real time that you don't just dabble your toe in the Middle East with the conflicts over there because it's multi-layered right now. You have Israel, you have Lebanon. And so, where that exit ramp is and what that ultimate negotiation, ultimate deal looks like compared to the one that Obama secured years ago is going to be interesting. And then you take that and compare it against the backdrop of what we've already lost with lifting sanctions on Russia and all the things that have slipped through the cracks over the last several weeks.
[16:10:07]
So it's going to be interesting to watch unfold. I'm hoping that it continues to de-escalate and that the strait is open, but well see.
ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: You know, it's really interesting. There was an exchange in the text thread a moment ago between Kristen Holmes and David Goldman, about the urgency that the administration has to have this happen because of the inflation report that happened today. Prices are up and one can draw a direct line and nexus right to how tankers not being able to move through the Strait of Hormuz actually can drive prices up across the United States.
And so, there's this added pressure. Forget all the -- oh, don't forget the geopolitics. But you know, there's a big --
HUNT: Set them aside for the purpose of your comments.
WILLIAMS: Of course, there's a profound human element. Of course.
HUNT: Of course. Yeah.
WILLIAMS: But in real terms, the United States people have to pay a lot of money for things. It's an election year. And I think the administrations feeling that.
HUNT: Well, I mean, to that point, Kristen, I mean, you spend all of your time figuring out where people are, how they're feeling about their leaders, about the issues facing things. And I mean, before all this happened, like, I think I remember that the Republicans wanted to shift to affordability as a message. Like, wasn't that like a thing? Because if there was any way to, you know, create a situation that was worse than the situation they were already facing, where Americans didn't believe that their lives were getting more comfortable. It's this, based on this inflation data.
KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: When CNN's own polling shows that Donald Trump's job approval on the economy is 31 percent, that is four alarm fire territory. I mean, that's -- that's very bad for a president who really built his brand on being the guy who's good on the economy and who won election on a message of, I'm going to make things more affordable, I think, especially because its gas prices and that has been such a consistent part of the White House's messaging over the last year, yeah, you know, tariffs, et cetera, but your gas prices are so low. And to sort of lose that message is a big deal.
But what I'll also say is that just because its a four alarm fire doesn't mean it's a fire that can't be put out, or that the situation can't ultimately accrue to the president's political advantage. Public opinion polling on foreign policy issues is much more nimble than on other issues. It's much more responsive to events. And so, if these negotiations actually go well, and this ultimately resolves with an Iran that is not nuclear, with a Strait of Hormuz that is open, and Donald Trump and his administration looking like they got a win, that will be a very big deal for J.D. Vance, but it'll also be a much needed victory for the White House politically.
HUNT: Yeah. General Clark, "The Wall Street Journal" editorial board this week was pretty honestly skeptical. They kind of raised an eyebrow at these negotiations and at where things stand.
They wrote this on Wednesday, quote, "If the regime," meaning the Iranians, "behaves as it always has, it will claim to want to reach a deal, but never will. The talks will stretch through two weeks, then three, then months. The next test for Mr. Trump will be whether he takes his two week ceasefire deadline seriously. If he does, and Iran plays its usual games, then he really will have to finish the job."
What do you think is in the best interests of the United States of America, given that frame?
CLARK: I think you have to have leverage in this. And the leverage can't just be our financial system and the willingness to invest post- war in Iran, as I've heard some people suggest. I think you still need the military leverage out there. And that means you have to be able not only to resume the air campaign, but you've got to have a military answer for the Strait of Hormuz.
And then if they try to play us and try to stall this thing, you, you set a deadline and then you may initiate something for another 48 hours, let's say. They'll come back and say, oh, no, no, no, it was a mistake. It was a mistake.
They want this to drag on until the Strait of Hormuz is recognized legitimately as theirs, or at least de facto is theirs. And so, there's nothing to do. But I guess we just have to pay Iran and that's part of the game. They'll make $90 billion a year at some point if the strait opens, everybody that goes through it now is paying them $2 million a ship. It's a lot of money. And they'll use it to strengthen their military.
Iran has been single-minded ever since this regime came in. They know what their objectives are, survive, regional dominance, eliminate Israel, do what you can to get the United States out of the region so they can dominate it.
And they built the force structure to do it. And they have the negotiations as part of that strategy. So they're very connected. They're very smart. You just can't underestimate them.
I don't want to say they're 10 feet tall. We have the leverage. We got smart people, too. But you can't go in there thinking, well, we got aircraft carrier offshore and we got our marines and you guys, its all over for you.
They do have a lot of cards to play. And especially going after the infrastructure of our friends and allies in the Gulf, they've already done billions of dollars worth of damage for these states.
[16:15:07]
And we rely on these states there. They invest in us. They are part of the American economic system. The petrodollars that support the American economy are generated largely out of the gulf.
So we have a vital interest in what happens there. And that's the way we structured our security and our economy for 50 years. So we have to be realistic about this. This is a vital interest of the United States, and therefore, we need to really be serious about a military option in Hormuz. And you can't do it with just a few minesweepers going through there.
It's going to be a big battle if we have to do it until we convince the Iranians that they're going to lose. Problem we have right now with Iran is they don't think they've lost. They think it's unfolding on their timeline. Just the way they planned it. They want to suck us in, cause casualties, and then have us withdraw from the region.
HUNT: That is a stark way to paint it on this Friday, but really appreciate your insights. Retired General Wesley Clark, thank you very much for your time today.
The rest of our panel is going to stand by. Coming up next here in THE ARENA, I'm going to speak with Congressman Robert Garcia. He is the top Democrat on the House Oversight Committee. What's he make of First Lady Melania Trump's call for new congressional hearings on Jeffrey Epstein?
Plus, this is a live picture from the Orion spacecraft as it returns the Artemis II crew back here to earth. Splashdown set for just a few hours from now. We'll go live to mission control ahead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRISTINA KOCH, NASA ASTRONAUT: I recently found some photos of myself on a family vacation at Kennedy Space Center, and we were posing in front of the Saturn V rocket with me, with my siblings and my parents. And if I could have told that little girl who took home a picture of earthrise and hung it in her room, that she would eventually launch from that same place to see that same view, I'm pretty sure she would not believe it. (END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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HUNT: All right. Welcome back.
Vice President J.D. Vance is expected to touch down in Pakistan soon, where hell be leading the U.S. delegation for peace talks with Iran. Those negotiations coming as president Trump posted this, quote, "The only reason they," the Iranians, "are alive today is to negotiate".
Joining me now is the top Democrat on the House Oversight Committee.
Congressman Robert Garcia of California.
Congressman, thank you very much for being here. I want to -- I do want to talk to you about what we saw from the first lady in just a moment, but I first just want to get you to weigh in on the stakes here for the vice president. And what does it say to you that the person who has been perhaps most vocally, at least behind the scenes, opposed to what we've been doing in Iran, is now leading these talks in J.D. Vance, the vice president?
REP. ROBERT GARCIA (D-CA): Well, first, I think just the comments that the president has been making and the one you just referenced are honestly first, disgraceful. So let's be really clear. I think leading up to this, the presidents comments about the Iranian people, about wiping out an entire civilization gives should give none of us any confidence that they're actually approaching this with a sense of responsibility and trying to actually lead the world to a conclusion here.
This war should have never happened in the way that it was conducted. There is still no mission. We still unclear what the actual end goal is. And that doesn't change because Vice President Vance is actually on the ground.
We already know that the ceasefire that's been put in place is incredibly shaky. Hundreds, hundreds and hundreds of people of innocent civilians are dying in Lebanon. And so were trying to get an end to what is now a regional war. So if the vice president can advance that, then great.
But this should never -- we should never be here right now. And right now were seeing gas prices skyrocket in my home state and across the country. Prices are going up. Americans do not want this war, and the vice president should work to end it.
HUNT: Let's talk a little bit about the first lady, Melania Trump, who, of course, turned headlines from this war in Iran back to Jeffrey Epstein, which has been a topic that her husband and her husbands administration have worked pretty hard to keep out of the news, or at least preferred when that has happened. And I wanted to show you something that the chairman of your House Oversight Committee said about Melania's call. She, of course, called for the victims of Jeffrey Epstein to testify before Congress.
Let's watch what he said. We'll talk about it on the other side
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. JAMES COMER (R-KY): I've always planned on having hearings with the victims. My attorneys on the oversight committee have been communicating on a constant basis for months, with the attorneys representing Epstein victims. There are some victims who are willing to come in. Most victims aren't. And I completely understand that. But we have always planned on having a hearing with Epstein victims once the depositions have been completed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Had that previously been your expectation, having such a hearing?
GARCIA: No, that's -- that's been news to everyone. When I heard those comments, it was surprising because Democrats have actually been working with survivors. We've actually asked Republicans to host these hearings forums with survivors. Of course, those that that would like to do so, and they have all been turned away.
I mean, there's been no opportunity to have these hearings. In fact, Republicans have been dug in about not giving the survivors these opportunities. And so, now, that the first lady has stepped right into this Epstein investigation has made her comments, I'm glad that Chairman Comer is responding.
But I think its interesting that all of this is happening, because now the first lady, Melania Trump, is making it very clear that there's Epstein investigation is continuing, is not a hoax and is, quite frankly, putting a lot of distance between the president and her -- and the attorney -- the acting attorney general, Todd Blanche, and her position.
I mean, Todd Blanche said just two days ago, to be very clear that the investigation was over. He said the DOJ was not going to be involved in the future with the Epstein investigation. And I think that the first lady obviously has a very different opinion.
HUNT: So has the committee reached out to Melania Trump? I mean, do you want her to come testify? Have you asked her to?
GARCIA: Look, we, of course, would be more than happy to have the first lady testify. There is -- we have a long list of folks that we're going to be coming into the committee that we have under subpoena. We're getting through those.
But there's no question that I think that the first lady's comments were honestly bizarre. What does she know? What information is going to come out that we may not be aware of? Why is she putting also all of the responsibility on the survivors?
If the first lady actually wants to be helpful in this investigation, she should ask her husband to release the 50 percent of the files that have not been released to the public. Let's actually release the Epstein files. The DOJ has half of them in their possession they have not sent to Congress.
If she really wants to help, let's ensure that Pam Bondi actually testifies to the Congress about this cover up and why they botched this investigation. So there are ways that Melania Trump can be of assistance. But let's start with those two.
HUNT: You, of course, have had, as a member of Congress, an opportunity to view the files without some of the redactions. You also have seen material -- you've had material inside the committee. What is your understanding of Melania Trump's ties or lack thereof, to Jeffrey Epstein and his accomplice, Ghislaine Maxwell?
GARCIA: Well, I'll begin by saying that we obviously don't have access to all the files, so I'm giving you a -- what we know from just our limited access to the files. And, of course, information that we've received from other sources.
I'll say this, I mean, there's no question in our opinion that there was a relationship between Melania and Ghislaine Maxwell. I mean, they were very friendly in the actual documents that are accessible to the public. They're obviously talking in ways that appear to be close, that appear to be friendly. And I think the first lady's assessment that somehow it was just casual conversation is not reflective in the actual documents.
And so as far as what that relationship was actually like, who the first lady actually knew, what her ties may have been to Jeffrey Epstein. Those are questions that are important, but that also might be in the 50 percent of the documents that we don't have access to.
And so, look, I'm glad that the first lady is calling for transparency. I'm glad that she has come out and said that this is not a hoax, but there's a real investigation here, which is basically the opposite of what her husband has said.
But again, if she wants to move forward, this investigation, let's release the files and help us with that effort. And the one person that can do that is her husband.
HUNT: All right. Congressman Robert Garcia, thank you as always, sir, for your time. I really hope you'll come back and join us again soon.
All right. Right now, this is a live look of planet Earth, as seen from the spacecraft that is carrying the Artemis astronauts home. And this a live feed from the U.S. Navy ship that will pick them up when they splashdown in just a few hours.
Plus, third times a charm? Ahead, how Kamala Harris answered the one question everyone wants to ask about her political future.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AL SHARPTON, NATIONAL ACTION NETWORK: So are you going to run again in '28?
KAMALA HARRIS, FORMER U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: So -- okay. In all -- in all --
SHARPTON: I tried to be subtle, but I just figured I'd go right at it.
HARRIS: That's as subtle as Reverend Al Sharpton could ever be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:33:47]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VICTOR GLOVER, ARTEMIS II PILOT: I'll be honest and say, I've actually been thinking about entry since April 3rd, 2023, when we got assigned to this mission. And one of the first press conferences, we were asked, what are we looking forward to? And I said, splashdown. And it's kind of humorous, but its literal as well that we have to get back. There's so much data that you've seen already, but all the good stuff is coming back with us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: The countdown is on. In just a couple of hours, Artemis II is set to splashdown off the coast of San Diego. You are looking at live pictures from the Orion spacecraft. This is their stunning view of our shared home, the Planet Earth.
And this is a live shot from the USS John P. Murtha, the Navy ship that will pick up the astronauts after their splashdown. At 7:53 p.m. Eastern Time, the crew will hit the top of Earth's atmosphere at an altitude of 400,000 feet, traveling about 30 times the speed of sound. Fourteen minutes later, at 8:07 p.m. Eastern, they should be splashing down here on Earth.
CNN's Randi Kaye is at mission control in Houston.
Randi, what's it like where you are?
[16:35:00]
RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's pretty tense, Kasie.
There's a lot of excitement, but it is -- it's a high anxiety day here at mission control at Johnson Space Center because really of those, not only because of the reentry, which is supposed to happen at 7:53 Eastern, as you said. But really those 13 minutes. That is the time when mission control expects to lose contact for six minutes during that 13 minute window, before they splashed down with the astronauts. So that is a tricky time. There's also lingering questions about the heat shield on the capsule
and how that will hold up, if it will protect the astronauts and the capsule from that extreme heat. They're expecting about 5,000 degrees outside that capsule. There were problems with the heat shield in Artemis I. This is a similar heat shield though. So there's a lot of questions about how that's going to do.
But NASA is remaining confident and expressing confidence as well. Take a listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AMIT KSHATRIYA, ASSOCIATE ADMINISTRATOR, NASA: We have high confidence in the system in the heat shield and parachutes and the recovery systems we put together. The engineering supports it. The Artemis I flight data supports it. All of our ground test supports it. Our analysis supports it. And tomorrow, the crew is going to put their lives behind that confidence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KAYE: And they are confident in the parachutes as well. There are 11 parachutes, Kasie. When those deployed about 24,000 feet, that's when they'll start deploying. And if all of them work, they'll come in at about 17 miles per hour when they hit the Pacific Ocean. If only four of them don't work, that's still okay. I'm told by the aerospace engineer here. He said they'll come in at about 25 miles an hour, so a little bit rougher for them.
And the families, Kasie, by the way, will be here, at least some of them at mission control in the observation area where we visited this week. And they'll be able to watch the flight controllers as they guide that Orion capsule and their loved ones back home.
HUNT: Of course, a tense but hopefully joyful journey, of course.
Randi Kaye, thank you very much for that report. Really appreciate it.
Joining me now in THE ARENA, former NASA astronaut, the retired Colonel Ron Garan, and CNN aerospace analyst Miles O'Brien.
Welcome to both of you.
Colonel, let me start with you. Just because you know, you've done stuff like this before, can you just tell us a little bit about what these astronauts might be feeling as they're heading for this critical moment?
COL. RON GARAN (RET.), FORMER NASA ASTRONAUT: Well, it's going to be a wild ride, but I can tell you from experience, it's always more nerve wracking to be outside to be one of us, you know, watching this unfold than to be in the capsule. Because they -- they know what's going on, as we heard it's going to be a six minute blackout, so well lose contact with the crew.
They can't transmit, they can't receive any messages, any communications, but it's going to be a lot of G-force. They're going to see fire going by the window. They're going to see sparks going by the window. It's a very dynamic ride through the atmosphere. But hopefully everything goes well and we'll have a safe splashdown here at 5:07 p.m. Pacific.
HUNT: Hopefully indeed.
Miles O'Brien, can you walk us through what happened with the heat shield in Artemis I, and why and how NASA is feeling confident about it this time around?
MILES O'BRIEN, CNN AEROSPACE ANALYST: Yeah, that heat shield is derived from the Apollo capsules, which last flew 53 years ago. And the basic design, it's kind of a one-use capsule. So, a one-use heat shield. It's ablative. It's designed to burn and char and shed away from the craft as it comes in through that searing heat, thus dissipating the heat to the capsule, and the folks inside.
It was -- during the Apollo era, put on in a different fashion and they tried to make it a little easier and faster. And apparently in the way they applied it, it caused some gases to kind of get underneath it and it burned unevenly, causing these unusual and unexpected charring events, sort of hot spots, if you will.
So what NASA has done, they've changed the way they applied this so- called Avcoat and they've changed their flight plan. This is the most important thing, Kasie. We keep talking about 13 minutes of searing heat.
For Artemis I, it was 20 minutes of searing heat. So the trade off was do you do it longer and cooler, relatively speaking, or shorter and hotter? Sort of the difference between, you know, 500 degrees broiling for two minutes in your oven as opposed to 3.50 for 20 minutes.
The shorter duration turns out to be safer because this particular heat shield material can handle that peak temperature. It's the duration that got them in trouble. So that's the hope that instead of 20 minutes, 13 minutes will make this heat shield do the job properly for the astronauts.
HUNT: Colonel. And I should just warn you, you're cutting a little bit in and out for your audiences. So forgive me if I do have to interrupt you, but I want to make sure we can continue to have your perspective if we can.
[16:40:00]
You were talking about a little bit -- a little bit about what it's like to be on the inside. In terms of mission control and those minutes that go by where there are no communications with the astronauts, can you kind of explain a little bit about what that is like in mission control and also what its like if you're in space to lose contact with the ground?
GARAN: Yeah. I mean, this -- this six minute blackout is expected. So, there wont be any really, you know, nervousness until that six minutes has elapsed. On my last reentry, we did lose communications for longer than expected, so significantly longer than expected. And I can tell you that's a -- that's a whole another story. When that clock ticks down to zero, when you should have acquisition of signal, and you don't have -- you don't hear the crew.
But that doesn't mean everything is bad. It just means that our predictions were not as accurate as we had hoped. But it's always a good -- it's always a good thing when you have that acquisition of signal and you hear the voice of the crew and its going to be a very exciting time when we hear that.
HUNT: And, sir, and I want to put this, this question to both of you, but colonel, to you first, I mean, when you look at the pictures that we have seen, just these unbelievable, remarkable images, you think about what they have done. They've gone farther from earth than any humans have ever gone before.
What does this mean in the -- in the history of spaceflight and the history of mankind, honestly, to you?
GARAN: Well, what it means for spaceflight is this is a huge step in turning the idea of going back to the moon, into the reality of going back to the moon this time to stay. But I think it also serves as kind of a wake up call for all of us here on the planet. You know, back in 1968, Christmas Eve, 1968, we had that famous earthrise photograph by the crew of Apollo 8. Now we have what I hope will be the famous Earth set photo.
And back in 1968, the world rallied around that image. The image of earthrise, the world for a brief moment was one. And we have an opportunity now to have that be a unifying force for us in this day and age. And I think that's really important.
Victor Glover on Easter talked about how when we look at the planet from that vantage point, we see one thing and we have to remember who we are and where we are, that were all the same. And we get through all these problems that we face together. That's what this brings to us here on the surface.
HUNT: Yeah. All right. Retired Colonel Ron Garan, Miles O'Brien, thank you both very much for being with us today. I really appreciate it.
And please do be sure to watch CNN's special live coverage of Artemis II's return to earth. It all begins tonight at 7:00 p.m. Eastern Time.
All right. Ahead here in THE ARENA, will they? Won't they? The not so subtle hints from the potential presidential hopefuls on their plans for 2028.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHARPTON: When you ran for president, you met me and we went up well publicized lunch at Sylvia's restaurant in Harlem. Just so my calendar is clear. Should I be reserving a table at Sylvia's? Are you -- are you going to run again?
PETE BUTTIGIEG, FORMER TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: You saved me a seat. I'll be there.
SHARPTON: All right.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:47:49]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHARPTON: So are you going to run again in '28?
HARRIS: Listen, I might, I might. I'm thinking about it. I'm thinking about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: She might.
Former Vice President Kamala Harris just made her most public remarks to date about her political future. The 2024 Democratic nominee for president, admitting she is weighing another White House bid, telling the Reverend Al Sharpton there, quote, "I know what the job is and I know what it requires."
Harris made those comments in New York City today at Sharpton's National Action Network Convention, the biggest gathering of Democratic 2020 hopefuls to date. None of them so far have really ruled out running.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHARPTON: Are you going to run again?
BUTTIGIEG: You saved me a seat. I'll be there.
GOV. JOSH SHAPIRO (D), PENNSYLVANIA: What I can tell you for sure is that I want to be a part of that debate.
GOV. WES MOORE (D), MARYLAND: I'm hungry, but I'm not thirsty.
REP. RO KHANNA (D-CA): Maybe I have something to offer and contribute with humility to our nation, at this moment.
GOV. J.B. PRITZKER (D), ILLINOIS: I can tell you this. I'm going to fight like hell to elect a Democrat in 2028.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Right. My panel is back to discuss further.
Congressman Joe Cunningham, you heard there, Kamala Harris, of course, the nominee, Biden's former vice president. I want to play a little bit of how the crowd. And again, this is the National Action Network, the Reverend Al Sharpton's, you know, hometown crowd, responding to this idea. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHARPTON: How do you rebuild a global kind of, of image of where the United States was that he's torn up in a year and a half?
HARRIS: You're right. One, we're going to have to -- it's going to take -- I think it's going to take more than one election to do --
CROWD: Run again! Run again!
(CHEERING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: That crowd wants her to run again. But not all Democrats do. What say you?
CUNNINGHAM: I actually agree with her when she says that it's going to take more than one election cycle. And I don't think anybody would pin their hopes or expectations to a few people in the crowd, like, you know, of that magnitude.
[16:50:03]
But, you got to get South Carolina, you got to get to other states and get -- put some feet on the ground and talk to voters as to what they want and what they expect. And then you got to be honest about what happened in 2024 and how poorly things went, what Democratic Party can do to repair the credibility.
But I think the most important thing is bringing about new ideas and new visions, and they got to be bold ideas, and they got the Democratic Party has to be, you know, for something other than just being against President Trump.
WILLIAMS: You know, I think the big fight that Democrats are going to have, and I think Republicans have this fight in 2012 and 2016 is the standard bearer of the party, the burn it all down type to sort of reject what the country saw over the last decade or so, or more of a party insider who wants to fix things in an institutionalist and so on. And I think that's going to be a real tension that in all of those primaries you're going to see.
And whether it's -- I mean, I think, I think everybody in the country wants solutions, but I think there's a big divide among this party that's out of power over what they think is the path forward.
ANDERSON: I think there's also going to be a big question about to what extent do Democratic voters try to vote with their hearts, who they love, or to what extent do they try to be strategic and say, well, my preferred candidate might be too far to the left. So I want somebody who's more centrist. Do they like really put their pundits hats on and think strategically?
I don't know that voters typically behave that way. We in this world like to think of voters all making those kinds of calculations. But what was the line, Republican -- Democrats fall in love, Republicans fall in line? For a little while, that got inverted.
HUNT: Definitely reversed.
WILLIAMS: Well, and also and also voters, but particularly primary voters, which is only Democratic, you know, sort of only the most liberal voters within the party.
HUNT: Well, and I think I would actually argue that, black women in South Carolina are some of the most pragmatic voters in the party.
MOWERS: This is all going to come down to what the Democratic National Committee does for the early state primary.
HUNT: Which they're in the process of doing right now.
MOWERS: Right now. And so, because when you look at voters in New Hampshire right now, Pete Buttigieg is leading in all the polls from anywhere from eight to 15 points. You go down and your friends in South Carolina vote first. I think it's a different type of electorate down there. And Pete Buttigieg doesn't find the support. That's why you're hearing those types of chants and cheers for the vice president in that crowd.
CUNNINGHAM: I don't think the same playbook that Democrats ran in 2020 or 2024 is going to resonate this time around. It's just not.
HUNT: Elissa Slotkin who, of course, senator from Michigan with the national security background, she actually was in Iowa this week, and I want to play a little bit of what she said about what this primary is likely to be about. Let's just remember like I was not really on the way anywhere else, right? Like you got to go to Iowa on purpose. So anyone that's going to Iowa at this stage in the game is doing it for a reason. Let's watch her.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: It sounds like you're seriously thinking about 2028.
SEN. ELISSA SLOTKIN (D-MI): You know, I know the minute you step foot in the state of Iowa, this is my first time ever being here, that that becomes the chatter. I'm not so arrogant as to think it has to be me, but I want to be a part of that next generation, without a doubt.
The debate is not between progressive and moderate. It's fight or flight. There are plenty of people that I serve with who are on team flight, and I will tell you that I am a good Midwestern Democrat. I fall more on the pragmatic, pragmatic and moderate side of the house. But I am on team fight 100 percent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Kristen, do you think she has that right that what Democratic voters want is somebody that's going to fight above all else? ANDERSON: Yes. So when we ask Democratic primary voters in my polling,
do you want the party to move to the center or move to the left? Is it about good where it is? There's really not a big constituency for Democratic primary voters wanting the party to move to the left. It's a very different conversation than what Republicans went through in 2012 where they said, you know, we need somebody more conservative. We've got to stop being so moderate.
But temperamentally, when you say, do you want someone who's going to be more conciliatory, try to find bipartisan opportunities to get things done? Or do you want someone who's going to stick it to Donald Trump temperamentally? That's absolutely what they want.
HUNT: Yeah. Matt Mowers, who would Republicans most like to see Democrats nominate?
MOWERS: I'm hoping that my good friend here signs up to be a chair of Kamala Harris's campaign. We've run that playbook before. We can run it again.
Look, I think she would be a representation of everything that the American people rejected in 2024. She's going to have all the baggage of Joe Biden. And based on what were seeing so far, she's not saying a lot that's new and different. She's just rehashing a lot of the old.
I'd love to run against her every single day of the week. I think if South Carolina votes first, she probably might be the nominee and I might get my wish.
CUNNINGHAM: I don't know.
(LAUGHTER)
HUNT: Entirely possible.
All right. Thank you, guys.
We'll be right back.
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[16:59:33]
HUNT: All right. Thanks very much to my panel. I really appreciate you being here. Enjoy your weekend.
Thanks to you at home for watching as well. Don't forget, you can enjoy more of THE ARENA this weekend. Tomorrow THE ARENA SATURDAY airs at noon and again at 4:00 p.m. Eastern Time. It is right here on CNN. I hope that you will join us.
Don't forget, you can also stream THE ARENA live or you can catch up whenever you want to in the CNN app. That QR code is below on your screen. If you want another QR code, don't forget you can also catch up by listening to our podcast. That's that QR code right there. You can also follow the show on X and Instagram @TheArenaCNN. And with all that said, John king is standing by for "THE LEAD".
Hi, John.
