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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt

Has Trump Met His Match In Pope Leo?; Pope Warns Of World Ravaged By "Tyrants" Amid Trump Feud; Sources: Trump Asking People How They'd Rank Vance's Performance In Iran Talks, How He Compares To Rubio; Analysis: Cost Of Raising A Child In U.S. Averages More Than $300,000, Up Nearly 30 Percent Just Since 2023. $300,000 To Raise A Kid: Is Parenthood Becoming A Luxury?; Dem Eric Swalwell & GOP's Tony Gonzales Resigns From House Just Before Start Of Bipartisan Expulsion Push; Grandma Delivers Trump's McDonald's To Oval Office. Aired 12-1p ET

Aired April 18, 2026 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:00:00]

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN ANCHOR: -- bombardment in Odesa after more than four years of war. These men and women donned their beautifully tailored suits, they reclaim their humanity, and perhaps even look in a mirror and envision a different future.

That's all we have time for. Don't forget, you can find all of our shows online as podcasts at CNN.com/audio and on all other major platforms. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London, thank you for watching and I'll see you again next week.

KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: Hi everyone, I'm Kasie Hunt. Welcome to The Arena Saturday.

Donald Trump may have finally met his match, but in lighting it, will he get burned?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The Pope has to understand that, very simple, I have nothing against the Pope. His brother's MAGA all the way. I like his brother, Louis.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you fighting with him?

TRUMP: I'm not fighting with him. The Pope made a statement. He says Iran can have a nuclear weapon. I say Iran --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He didn't say that.

TRUMP: -- cannot have a nuclear weapon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So a couple things here. Pope Leo has never said that Iran can have a nuclear weapon. On the second point, the President said that he is not fighting with the Pope. That is a little less cut and dry. There has been quite a bit of back and forth. But let's narrow it down to this, OK.

The start of the week, the President said online in a lengthy post that the Pope was, quote, "weak on crime" and that he should, quote, "get his act together." After that, the President posted this AI image depicting himself as Jesus Christ. The President now says that this depicts him as a doctor. You decide.

It all stems from the Pope's public view expressed this week that war is never a good thing. A view that's not sitting well with the President or with the highest ranking Catholic in the U.S. government.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JD VANCE (R), VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I've never been one of these people who say that you should never have, you know, Christian leadership not talking about politics or, frankly, political leaders not talking about their Christian faith. But I do think that we have to remember that, you know, each of us has our own role. I think it's very, very important for the Pope to be careful when he talks about matters of theology.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: His advice to the Pope is to be careful when he talks about matters of theology. He is -- he's the Pope. He's the Pope. Anyway, here's the Pope on Thursday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

POPE LEO XIV, HEAD OF THE CATHOLIC CHURCH: Jesus told us blessed are the peacemakers, but woe to those who manipulate religion in the very name of God for their own military, economic or political gain, dragging that which is sacred into darkness and filth.

Those who rob your land of its resources generally invest much of the profit in weapons, thus perpetuating an endless cycle of destabilization and death. The world is being ravaged by (technical difficult) together by a multitude of supportive brothers and sisters.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right. With that, my panel is here in The Arena. Congressional Correspondent for The New York Times, Annie Karni, CNN Washington Bureau Chief and Political Director David Chalian, Former Communications Director for the DNC and a CNN Political Commentator Xochitl Hinojosa. And also we're joined by former Republican Congressman and Speaker Pro Tem Patrick McHenry.

Welcome to all of you. Thank you so much for being here.

Congressman, I think you have the distinction of both being a Republican and a Catholic. Correct me if I'm wrong.

PATRICK MCHENRY (R), FORMER SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE: That's fair. That's fair.

HUNT: Whose side are you on in the Pope versus Donald Trump?

MCHENRY: So this is the most predictable thing ever, by the way. This is the most predictable thing ever. It is. Both the Pope and the President are in their lanes, right? So the Pope is speaking in favor of peace like all modern popes have. And President Trump is speaking in favor of eventual peace through a number of different means.

So this is not new, but it is so completely within the Trump era that everything, not just the United States, is dictated by the President's view and opinion and in people's response to it. But everywhere in the globe, people are responding to President Trump's tweets or memes or anything like that.

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN CHIEF & POLITICAL DIRECTOR: But what's new is like Donald Trump, because it's just him, right, is to watch 60 Minutes, get so angry about a 60 Minutes segment with the Cardinals, with the American Cardinals on it, and then fire off that long tweet that you said without thinking about what fight he's actually picking here. Because he picked a fight, and I think his trajectory that you walked us through all week long, Kasie, kind of gets at this.

He realized it was a fight, I think by the end of the week when he was on the South Lawn, that it wasn't one that he necessarily wanted to like have for a second week.

[12:05:06]

He's picking a fight with a more popular figure than he is. He's picking a fight from the head of the Catholic Church who represents a swath of voters in America in terms of their faith that Donald Trump made huge gains with recently and doesn't want to like lose all of that work that he did.

And I just think he -- you can see throughout the week, he went from that angry Trump after 60 Minutes to be like, I'm not picking a fight. He can say what he can say, and I can say what I can say.

XOCHITL HINOJOSA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. I mean, I think that's right. Well, and also Donald Trump just -- he doesn't really know how to be told no. He believes that he is, you know, the person above everybody. He hasn't -- the courts have told him no in some instances. He doesn't always listen to the courts.

He believes that he can do no wrong. And so when something like this and when the Pope comes out, I think the only person who was surprised is Donald Trump. I mean, Donald Trump, the fact that Presidents have had to deal with criticisms from the Pope before, not direct criticisms by name, but they're not outgoing and picking these fights.

And so it just seems like Donald Trump doesn't understand that, you know, the teachings of the Catholic faith, they talk about war, they talk about poverty, they talk about loving thy neighbor. And I'm not sure if Donald Trump just didn't realize that or what it was. I think what crossed the line, and I don't think see anyone defending him, not even Republicans, are these, you know, Jesus photos. And I think that is what has sort of like, what is completely crossed the line.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: With Americans.

ANNIE KARNI, CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT, THE NEW YORK TIMES: I would push back a little bit on all of you saying this is not surprising. Let's just remember, this is Pope Leo. This is not Pope Francis. Pope Francis was more outspoken. This is a Pope who has tried to be not political, not comment on world affairs.

So I think his comments, while actually mild compared to like the most of the rhetoric we hear today, was significant. And I think it's significant that Trump pushed back, especially because he and his administration, Hegseth, in particular, tried to position this as a moral war with God on their side.

And this is the leader of the Catholic Church who, as David said, is more, very popular, more popular than Trump, saying no.

HUNT: And who, by the way, is an American.

KARNI: Right.

HUNT: And that's to me --

KARNI: Right.

HUNT: -- what also seems to make this different --

KARNI: Yes.

HUNT: --and less predictable than what --

KARNI: Yes.

HUNT: -- you seem to suggest.

KARNI: So I think he's in hot water. And I think that just this was not a fight necessarily that we saw with this Pope. This is kind of this Pope's first real foray into taking on Donald Trump like this.

HUNT: What would you say, Congressman, has been your interpretation of the reaction to the AI photo depicting the President as Jesus Christ? Because, I mean, look, this is not a President who backs down, right? Often he does things that people -- great swaths of people tell him is extraordinarily offensive and he kind of barrels through.

He didn't. He took it down in this case in the face of pretty withering criticism. Why?

MCHENRY: This is a rare movement -- moment where this is taken down. But President Trump knows that -- and his team knows -- that memes have driven our politics. I mean, this is -- I mean, look at the Marco Rubio memes, of sitting on the couch dressed as whatever fixer of the week.

CHALIAN (?): Right.

MCHENRY: -- completely (INAUDIBLE). But the President will take at bats and swing and mess and be OK with it. And so he takes -- he looks at the margin and says everybody holds back from that line. And he will occasionally step over the line to see if he can redefine rules of engagement. That's what happened here.

And so, yes, the key constituencies that are Trump supporters responded and responded in a way that the President could understand. And therefore he made a change.

HINOJOSA: Yes. Is he actively trying to lose the midterms at this point? I mean, I would say that picking a fight with the Pope, if you're just looking at the week, higher gas prices, a war that the majority of Americans do not agree with.

I mean, we're not, I mean, that was just this week. Before that, there was like the, you know, the true socialing on Easter Sunday, all of these things. I have not seen one instance in this last week where Donald Trump did something helpful for Republicans to win back the midterms. Not one.

And he can't say a message either when it comes to the economy. And so if I'm a Republican right now, I'd be like, OK, are we on the same page? Are we like actively trying to lose the midterms here? Like, what's going on.

HUNT: Congressman?

HINOJOSA (?): He got views (ph).

MCHENRY: Good question.

MCHENRY: No, the couple of things. So they took a target of opportunity in Iran, had a devastating impact on the initial go of it. Now everybody's responding after we've decimated their Navy, their Air Force, the technology from China and Russia that was used in Iran.

We are the global leader in defense and everybody's saying, well, they haven't surrendered. Who's left to surrender to? We have a historic meeting between JD -- Vice President Vance and the speaker of the Iranian parliament. The first time we've had direct diplomatic relations in 47 years, historic stuff.

[12:10:08]

So there's a lot going on here. And it's where we end up in September and October, the older term of the midterms, not where we sit in really what has been a rough couple of months for Republicans, admittedly.

HUNT: A rough couple of months. I mean, the way that Peggy Noonan put what the President did this week, she said of the President, "How odd it is to go to war while already in other wars with the head of vast and ancient institution, with a man whose job titles include vicar of Christ, head of the Holy See and Bishop of Rome, and who is a spiritual leader -- the spiritual leader of 1.4 billion Catholics and the biggest Christian denomination in America."

Now she notes the President's comments speak of something disordered in the administration's relationship to faith. I think that the conversation we've been having shows that it also is a bit disordered in terms of politics, electorally, if you would like to win elections here in America.

All right, coming up next here in The Arena, the jaw dropping new numbers out this week on what it costs to raise a child in America. If you're trying to do it, I don't have to tell you. You already know it's not cheap.

But first, the 2028 shadow campaign going on all the way up to the president, our CNN reporting on why Donald Trump is taking the temperature of his own Vice President as JD Vance continues to take heat for his past and present views on foreign wars.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VANCE: And I think that one of these issues here is that there has been -- is, again, hey, random dude screaming, I told you I'd respond to your point. I just want to respond to this question first.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: So if it doesn't happen, I'm blaming JD Vance. If it does happen, I'm taking full credit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[12:16:13]

HUNT: That's classic dynamic, let's be honest, for any president and vice president. But suffice to say, it has still been a whirlwind few weeks for the current sitting Vice President JD Vance, who, despite initially advising President Trump against the Iran war, has now been dispatched to try to end it.

Vance is attempting to do so alongside a potential rival for the 2028 Republican Presidential Nomination, Marco Rubio. It's a dynamic that Trump himself is apparently paying close attention to. And this is classic Donald Trump, for the record.

According to sources, the President has been asking friends and advisers what they think of Vance's performance and how he compares to Rubio. The Vice President, who is a longtime proponent of MAGA's America First agenda, took to defending the administration's Middle East policy after he was heckled at that Turning Point USA event. It brings us to our quote of the week, JD Vance's message to MAGA voters who may feel let down by the prospect of another foreign war. He says, quote, "Don't get disengaged."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VANCE: I recognize that a lot of young voters don't love the policy that we have in the Middle East. I'm not saying you have to agree with me on every issue. What I'm saying is don't get disengaged because you disagree with the administration on one topic. Get more involved.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: There are so many political layers to this. Congressman, what's your assessment of -- this is pretty classic for Donald Trump. It's kind of how he talks to things. David's nodding and jump in on this if you want.

CHALIAN: I was going to say not only the -- it's not even the first round of the question about Trump versus Vance. He's done this but -- I mean, Rubio versus Vance, he's done this before, too.

HUNT: Right. And he's constantly kind of asking because he seems to care -- part of what dictates what he thinks is what other people think and he's, you know, trying to figure out who's up, who's down. What is your kind of assessment of how the Vance-Rubio shadow competition, where it stands right now and how the war has impacted it?

MCHENRY: So let me just say, first, my experience with the President is it's not uncommon for him to ask you five questions about five different people. What do you think of this person? How did she treat you? What's the response here?

What do people think of them? What was the response to the speech? What was the -- did you hear the applause? She got more applause than he got, right? He's always writing these things, calculating these things.

Members of Congress would come back to me from meetings and say, oh, he really agrees with me. I was like, no, no, no. He's sounding everybody out to figure out what he should believe. And that's what he's always doing is working through that.

So on Vance versus Rubio, he loves the competition, number one. Number two, he has complete mastery and control of the Republican Party. So his say is not nine-tenths of the primary, but probably close for a successor.

Vance wants to make Trumpism, MAGA into an ideology. Rubio is far more flexible. So that means that Rubio can negotiate week by week, month by month into whatever the response is that's necessary to get through the month. While Vance is trying to make Trumpism a -- for him to be the successor to the ideology that they want MAGA to be.

The President, however, does not believe that MAGA is an ideology. He believes it's his governing function and his power. And that will change from week to week based off the best needs to get through that week and get through that month. So we've got a really interesting thing here between more ideological with Vance and more practical with Rubio.

And the memes, too, like I mentioned before, are driving a lot of this popularity with both Vance and Rubio embracing the Internet memes as a source of their potential political power.

HUNT: That's, honestly, a fascinating assessment of all of this. How do you think Trump's popularity or lack thereof impacts when you say he's nine-tenths of, you know, law when it comes to who's going to be the Republican nominee? Does his increasing unpopularity lower that number or does it not really have an impact?

[12:20:15]

MCHENRY: So you're saying a president with CNN polling is the least popular president in modern history under -- for CNN polling. That same CNN polling says that he is the most popular president within his own party ever. So that is his power. That is his power on Capitol Hill. That is his power with party activists across the country.

That strength is not waning, and it will maintain through the end of his term and much longer thereafter. He is the most popular Republican President ever, and that gives him the power and strength to determine his successor.

HINOJOSA: And I think the hardest part -- the situation that JD Vance is in, is over the last week or so, his team obviously seems like they laid out that he disagreed with President Trump on the war. And I think that there is this general view with the American people that Rubio seems to be a steady hand in the administration.

He is seen as someone who could, you know, is behind a lot of foreign policy decisions, et cetera. What JD Vance --

HUNT: Kind of the corner of the room. Yes.

HINOJOSA: In the room, sorry. With JD Vance is struggling with is that he doesn't have that sort of view. People see him as a Trump defender, and he's trying to find those instances where he distances himself from Donald Trump.

So is that going to end up hurting his chances with Donald Trump moving forward? Because he will. In order to win a general election, he cannot be Trump 2.0. He -- there's no way, there aren't enough votes for him to necessarily win. So I'm not sure how that's going to play out moving forward.

KARNI: Vance is in the worst box --

HINOJOSA: Yes.

KARNI: -- of any of the people we're talking about that would run as a Republican for president in the next, after Trump. And that's always the case with the Vice President. He has to own all the unpopular things that Trump is doing.

And in this case, as Congressman McHenry said, you can't really get distance from the guy who's going to anoint the next person. It's not going to be a regular Republican primary, it's going to be like the bachelor with the rose.

And so, like, how does Vance do this? I do think that distancing -- that it's now part of the understanding of this war, that Vance was the strongest voice against it, is actually a big win for him. That is -- and we believe it to be true to him. Like, we don't believe -- like I believe that's true. And then he fell in line because that's his job to do.

But I think that was an important moment for him, that he could re-up later, say like, I was always against this, and you knew it in real time.

CHALIAN: Also, while the President has given him sort of a test here about how to bring it to a conclusion and how much of JD Vance is going to be the face of that and own that, is a potential upside for him if it comes to a successful --

MCHENRY: Absolutely.

CHALIAN: -- conclusion. To your point about anointing, this is one of my biggest questions. You said Trump loves the competition, and there's no doubt that he does. I just wonder, in the 2028 primary process, like, how long does Donald Trump want to see that competition go on? Does he want to anoint, you know, early and shut down this process?

KARNI: No, no.

CHALIAN: Does he -- you know, that -- yes. That's my big question I was going to approach.

KARNI: It will go on until the day before the Republican National Convention.

HINOJOSA: We created --

MCHENRY: Agreed.

KARNI: Right?

HUNT: Oh, man, we are in for it.

All right, coming up next here in The Arena, is having kids in the U.S. becoming a luxury that fewer and fewer people can afford. What new numbers show about the costs of raising a child?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:28:00]

GOV. MICHELLE LUJAN GRISHAM (D), NEW MEXICO: You'll never get it to go. You'll never be able to just add kids. You don't have supply. The providers will never be able to catch up.

Well, since November 1st, with very few, if any at all, hiccups, you have added 16,743 kiddos to a free child care system.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Last month, New Mexico became the first, and so far it's the only, state to offer free child care to all families. And today, there are new headlines that the cost of raising a child gets higher than it's ever been before.

For the first time since it started doing the math, a new analysis from LendingTree found that it costs, on average, more than $300,000 to raise a child in the U.S. from the time they're born until they turn 18.

If you can believe it, and most of us can, that is up nearly 30 percent just since 2023. That number accounts for things like housing, food, clothing, and the single biggest expense for any parent, child care.

Infant daycare, yes, it'll run you about $17,000 a year on average. That cost is actually down a little bit, 3 percent from last year. And of course, the issue of daycare, something the President commented on just earlier this month.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I actually said to them, I said to Russell, don't send any money for daycare. Because the United States can't take care of daycare. That has to be up to a state. We can't take care of daycare.

We're a big country. We have 50 states. We have all these other people. We're fighting wars. We can't take care of daycare.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: OK, there's a lot here. I think, for the parents at this table, actually, I think we're all parents at this table. Those numbers feel very personal to me, you know, I mean when -- and I think to all of us, right? I mean, it's just such an enormous hill to climb. And of course, it comes as fertility rates, birth rates are declining. I mean, it dropped a full 1 percent from 2024 to 2025.

[12:30:15]

Annie Karni, of course, there are a lot of layers in terms of how we do policy here that, you know, date back to this, a lot of which are cultural, and kind of difficult to pull apart. But what does it say about kind of where we are as birth rates are declining, this cost is getting prohibitively expensive.

It seems to add to the pile of things that make people feel like, I just can't do the normal things that I would have expected to be able to do in my life. ANNIE KARNI, CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT, THE NEW YORK TIMES: Yes, I think we're of a generation where the, you know, the idea that your kids will be better off than you were, is not necessarily true anymore. And we can't promise that we don't feel that, that we can promise that they are going to, we're going to be able to give them more, or they're going to be more successful and set up for life than we were.

And that's a little bit scary. And I think that is the reality for a lot of people as costs go up across the board, that it's like the death of the American dream across the board, that if you work hard, you can raise your family, you can own a house, you can send your kids to college like that all feels really fragile right now for a lot of Americans.

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF: And I think if you look at recent polling of young people, a real -- we've seen significant deprioritization of having children and starting a family. And it's no doubt, it's directly tied to their increased anxiety about the economic crunch they are facing in this ever-changing economy. And so you just add on the stats that you're saying about what it will cost in childcare. And I think it sort of confirms why we see that notion of young people thinking, starting a family can't be my highest priority because I don't know if I'm going to be able to actually support that.

XOCHITL HINOJOSA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes, this is also one of these things where our childcare system, our school system is also outdated, outdated. If you think about it, if your kid goes to school at 8:30 a.m. or 9:00 a.m. and they're getting out at 3:00 p.m., what working parent can actually handle a 9:00 to 3:00 p.m. work schedule? Many of them need to be in the office by 8:00 a.m. They can't get out until 5:00 p.m. There's also things like people rely, used to rely on their members. They used to live close by their family members to handle things like childcare and stuff like that.

And so they didn't have to rely to send their kids to an aftercare program or childcare program. That is no longer the case. People are having kids later. There are, as we have mentioned, I am certainly someone that had kids close to 40. The parents are older. And so the way that our system is currently now is it does not meet the needs of today.

And also, if you look at the studies, I'm actually surprised that Donald Trump said that because things like universal pre-K have known to be great help and beneficial to our kids. And so it's not about keeping your kid home anymore with your parent or whatever. They actually need to be in a school setting very early on. And so I think we need to look at the entire system and modernize it to today's working environment because it's completely outdated.

PATRICK MCHENRY (R), FORMER SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE: But most of this is being driven at the state level. And that's where it can best be done, where you can see this incubation of new ideas taking hold. This is where welfare reform came from Wisconsin in the 80s and 90s and became national politics 10 years later. Likewise, for childcare, it is -- the incentives are -- and the implementation is done at the local level. There are tax incentives.

And the interesting thing about what President Trump said is his administration, the first administration, had a major change in tax policy that raised the amount of deductibility for childcare. That is something to talk about. Trump accounts, something to talk about so you can actually save not just for college, but get your children on the process of having ownership in America, right, in the growth of the economy.

There are winning things that this administration should be talking about that they have done. And likewise, where we are today is markedly better than where we were before COVID because both Biden policies and Trump policies together have actually made things better for parents. No one knows that because we are experiencing an affordability challenge.

Everything is going up and the price of everything is going up and wages are not keeping pace with that, which adds this other layer of a lack of optimism about what we can do for the next generation. We need people more optimistic so they have more kids and actually help improve society.

HUNT: Last word.

KARNI: I think that Donald Trump's comment that we can't afford daycare or health care, Democrats definitely viewed that as a midterm gift. Like we're -- like -- just play that on repeat across the country because those are the issues that people care about. And paired with the war in Iran, it's costing us billions.

[12:34:59]

HUNT: Right. Well, and we haven't even gotten to the cost of -- if you want to send your kids to college, what that costs now and whether or not they can even get a job out of college because A.I. is basically taking all the entry level jobs. We'll have that conversation maybe next Saturday, we'll have that conversation.

Ahead here in The Arena, the stunning resignations in Congress this week and what it means nearly a decade after the start of the MeToo movement. Plus, Donald Trump has used a lot of words to describe himself. This might be a first. What he's talking about when he admitted this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It was a little bit of a, you know, I mean, to be honest, a little tacky.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[12:40:00] JODI KANTOR, REPORTER, THE NEW YORK TIMES: Even at a time when everything seems so stuck, even at a time when it feels like the very notion of truth is collapsing, facts can cause social change. Carefully documented facts can really trigger empathy and compassion and action.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Eight years ago this week, "New York Times" reporters Megan Twohey and Jodi Kantor won a Pulitzer Prize for their bombshell reporting on Hollywood producer Harvey Weinstein's decades-long history of sexual harassment and abuse. The story triggered a global reckoning around sexual misconduct and amplified the MeToo movement with thousands of women coming forward with their own harrowing experiences.

Now, nearly a decade after the Weinstein piece, two congressmen, Democratic Congressman Eric Swalwell and Republican Congressman Tony Gonzalez, resigned this week following a wave of sexual misconduct allegations. Their departures coming after the pair faced bipartisan threats of expulsion from Congress. All this raising a critical question. Have we gone far enough with accountability?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R), FORMER GEORGIA CONGRESSWOMAN: Both of these men, these members of Congress, it was right for them to resign because they're guilty of some of the very type things that we found in the Epstein files. And this is -- Congress has no place for that type of behavior, but I have to tell you it's a lot more prevalent. I think there's more members of Congress that are guilty of things similar to Congressman Swalwell and Congressman Gonzalez, and we just haven't seen them basically get caught.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: We haven't seen them basically get caught is the way that Marjorie Taylor Greene puts it. And I do think it's important to consider these resignations. The Swalwell accusations came fast and furious in the context of the California governor's race.

The allegations against Tony Gonzalez, who also resigned, had been around for quite some time, and Republicans in leadership had stood behind him because of the margin in the House of Representatives. And having a Democrat in Swalwell and a Republican in Gonzalez allowed them to get rid of both of these guys at the same time without changing the numbers in the House. Here's what Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez had to say about the nature of the political calculation that was clearly on display in this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY): The only reason that this is changing in terms of a resignation today is because the Speaker of the House, Speaker of the House feels like he can play politics with the vote numbers. I'm just calling it how I see it. And the fact that we have victims of abuse and these things are being handled in that kind of calculation is disgusting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Annie Karni, you cover Congress every day. It's not a popular institution in America. Is this part of why?

KARNI: Yes. I mean, there's a lot of reasons why. From members trading stock is one reason people don't trust them. But yes, this is -- there's a -- as we've seen, 10 years later, there's still a silence around these issues on the Hill. We have lawmakers who have not changed their behavior post-MeToo. I think Ocasio-Cortez there is saying something that is true. I don't know that it would be different if Democrats were in control.

Like the bottom line of how Congress works is you need to maintain control of the House. So like for instance, when the first Swalwell allegations came out, Hakeem Jeffries and Democratic leadership called for him to resign from the governor's race. They didn't immediately call for him to resign from Congress, which was the same stance that Johnson took on Gonzalez.

They called for him to end his reelection campaign, not to step down from Congress. Once it was going to maintain the balance of power, they could both go. But yes, I mean, I think that when it's a tight margin, they have different incentives.

HUNT: Yes. And congressman, what is your sense of, I mean, one of the things about the Swalwell allegations is many of them, and we should note that Swalwell has denied the assault allegations. He's denied the allegations against him. But the allegation is that they occurred essentially simultaneously to the MeToo movement. And there -- you've heard Marjorie Taylor Greene there too, as well, say, well, there's just other people who haven't gotten caught. I think one of the things people are trying to grapple with is the idea that some of what Swalwell was doing, perhaps not the assault and the violence piece, but certainly the idea that he was a womanizer and conducted himself in certain ways in personal situations, was an open secret in Washington. Nobody did anything about it.

MCHENRY: I was unaware of the assault allegations, having served in Congress, but there are plenty of rumors around Congress. It's a question of whether or not you have substance on it. This is a question for party leaders, though, frankly. And he hits on the key dynamic here, which is the leaders of both parties have shown no profiles in courage in removing the worst actors within their party. And that's where we are.

[12:45:16]

HUNT: That wasn't always true. I mean --

MCHENRY: It was not true. Speaker Boehner had multiple meetings with members where he said, you have two options here. One is you resign, or I will have an expulsion vote on you this afternoon. I'll give you an hour to decide. And he had this with some terrible actors, but less terrible than this. Speaker Ryan had similar challenges. HUNT: I remember some of those. Yes.

MCHENRY: So we've been through this, and Congress had to change our rules as a result of that. Clearly not enough. But you have to have party leaders just discipline their members and say, you got to be out of here. It's not good for the body of politics. It's not good for America.

KARNI: One thing that I find interesting on the dynamic on the Hill right now is the party leaders are not doing that. The people who are doing that are the women. Lauren Boebert and Anna Paulina Luna have basically --

HUNT: Bipartisan, by the way.

KARNI: These are two MAGA women who have basically said, my office is open. Come to me if you have a complaint. We're going to push this stuff out. And they're willing to break with their party on these matters. They've shown they break on Epstein and on matters of harassment on the Hill. Donald Trump has also been accused of rape, assault, lots of things. And they, of course, they won't go there, these Republican women.

But they are trying in their little pool on the Hill to go after their colleagues. They don't go after Trump, but they go after their colleagues. And the women have been somewhat effective in pushing this forward. I mean, Luna was threatening to move a motion to expel. Well, I think that that pushed them to resign. I mean, they did get action on that.

HINOJOSA: There is a major moment that we were in. And it's, yes, it's evolution of the MeToo movement, where powerful men have been caught with sexual assault and rape and over decades, whether that's Cesar Chavez over the last few weeks, Epstein, et cetera. And I think there is a big question about why there are about 24 allegations of rape or assault on Trump.

And the Republican Party is completely silent on it. And when you ask them, they say, you know, we don't believe it. Well, why do you believe everybody else, but you do not believe the allegations against Trump?

HUNT: All right. Coming up next here, something totally different, special delivery to the Oval Office.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[12:52:07]

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nice to meet you. I have your DoorDash one for you, Mr. President.

TRUMP: That's very nice. Look at this. This doesn't look staged, does it? UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They're all your favorites.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And are the White House good tippers? Do you know?

TRUMP: Wait.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Potentially. Yes, very.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. President, can I ask you something else?

TRUMP: That's -- thank you. You reminded me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: This week, an Arkansas grandmother, she walked right up to the Oval Office. She hand-delivered the president his DoorDash order. You, of course, heard the President joke about the moment looking staged. And, of course, that's because it was. You cannot walk up to that door unless somebody knows you're coming, OK.

The White House using the so-called DoorDash grandmother to promote their no tax on tips initiative. And before we get to the really I'm sorry what of all of this, let's play a bit more of the president's reaction to this PR stunt, I guess. Yes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Sharon delivered McDonald's to the Oval Office. It was a little bit of a, you know, I mean, to be honest, it was a little tacky. They're a little embarrassing. They're a little tiny embarrassing, but we do them and you win by landslides. That's the first maybe in the history of the Oval Office. And it was a very beautiful woman standing there with two big bags of McDonald's hamburgers. And I say, is this really believable?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So tacky, even Trump called it tacky. Now, we all know that's not how the President feels about the contents of the DoorDash delivery. Remember when he worked as a fry cook briefly at a Pennsylvania McDonald's and half joked about knowing the menu better than the employees? Turns out not every American feels the same way.

In a new YouGov study, Americans ranked McDonald's fifth on the list of best fast food burger chains. Number one, Five Guys. That was followed by Burger King, In-N-Out, Wendy's, and then McDonald's. And so here's where we pause and we get to the heart of the segment. The number one ranked fast food burger costs $8.25, $8 for a Five Guys little hamburger. I'm sorry, what? The President's likely pick for best fast food burger costs just $2.59.

So what do we what do we think about? I mean, first of all, the President acknowledging something was tacky. I never thought I'd hear I'd never thought I'd see the day, David.

CHALIAN: No, but it was and he was right to identify it. I clearly the team you played that moment from the 24 campaign in Pennsylvania, which was an enormously successful campaign for him. Really, it broke through everywhere. And it just like it hit the message they were on. Contrast that with like, you can't actually recreate that kind of moment at the door of the Oval Office, which Trump acknowledged, never mind the fact he went on to hold a press conference, like about the Pope and Iran or whatever, and was totally off message about tax on tips that didn't really cut through that day.

[12:55:16]

So I don't think this got him necessarily what the White House was envisioning, never mind his own critique of it. I can't speak to the ranking of Americans in their burgers, though.

MCHENRY: No, but the President's sense of humor about all this stuff, even when the White House team wants him to do something that he's not really comfortable with. He may do it, but he will then make fun of it. So I think that's an endearing quality.

The other -- the second thing I would rate is if we're going to rate fries, French fries. I mean, I have a lot of opinions about that, and I would disagree with the ranking of the fast food chain.

HUNT: I actually, I would -- actually I love McDonald's fries. I mean, I've spent too much of my life covering campaigns and eating fast food. And I got to tell you, I don't find much wrong with if there's a McDonald's, a cheese, a small cheeseburger and fries. We'll get the job done anytime.

All right, guys, thank you. Really appreciate you being here. Thanks to all of you at home for watching. Don't forget, you can see The Arena every weekday right here on CNN at 4:00 p.m. Eastern. You can also catch up by listening to The Arena's podcast. You can follow us on X and Instagram. We're at TheArenaCNN. Enjoy the rest of your weekend, but don't go anywhere. The news continues next on CNN.

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