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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt

Just In: FBI Raids Business Tied To Key Dem In Virginia State Senate; Trump Gets Electoral Revenge On Republicans Who Rebuffed Him; Obama On State Of The Presidency: "The Bar Has Changed"; Trump: "Very Good" Talks With Iran Over Past 24 Hours; Remembering CNN Founder Ted Turner. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired May 06, 2026 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: -- in the race because it's so grueling.

[16:00:04]

You're asking a lot of a horse.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: It was intense. I never watched this. It's like, not my thing, but I put it on when I saw on social media that it was coming on. Whoa.

So, I was enthralled, right, from all the way in the back to the front. It was --

KEILAR: Unbelievable.

SANCHEZ: Yeah.

KEILAR: THE ARENA WITH KASIE HUNT starts right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news

KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Hi, everyone. Welcome to THE ARENA. I'm Kasie Hunt. It's wonderful to have you with us on this Wednesday.

As we come on the air, we have breaking news, the FBI is executing search warrants against the president pro tempore of the Virginia state senate. Sources say that federal agents have raided multiple locations associated with Democrat L. Louise Lucas. A source close to the state senator tells CNN that federal agents seized electronics and other items from Lucas's personal office.

CNN has reached out to Lucas for comment. She told Fox News, quote, "I don't know what's going on," end quote.

This comes just weeks after Lucas championed a successful effort to convince Virginia voters to approve a redrawing of the state's congressional map. As all that unfolds, the president, Donald Trump, is celebrating a big win against his own party. Overnight, at least five Republican Indiana state senators lost their primaries to MAGA opponents. The crime for which their own voters fired them, refusing the president's demand to redraw Indiana's congressional map and eliminate seats held by Democrats.

Here's what one targeted Republican whose race is still too close to call, told CNN as the results started coming in.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SPENCER DEERY (R), INDIANA STATE SENATOR: The truth is, I know that Trump doesn't really have any idea who I am or any idea who my opponent is. This is all just designed to try to show that Washington, D.C. can control Indiana. And that's really what this race has been about. You know, Trump is perhaps not as popular in my district as he once was, but he is still overwhelmingly popular.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right. Let's get off the sidelines, head into THE ARENA. My panel is here.

But we're going to start with CNN Washington correspondent Sunlen Serfaty.

Sunlen, what more are we learning about this raid or these raids, apparently, around the Virginia state senator?

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, raids is right, Kasie. We know, according to sources that Louise Lucas is not only her personal office in her hometown of Portsmouth, Virginia, but also her businesses. She owns multiple businesses, multiple businesses were also the subject of a search warrant today and were searched by the FBI, including one just across the street from her personal office called the Cannabis Outlet. That is a business that sells marijuana products.

A source familiar with the probe confirming that the FBI did indeed execute a search warrant that was signed by a federal judge. Now, it is unclear at this time what the target or the scope of the investigation actually is. I spoke with a person very close to the senator and confirmed all of this action, confirmed that the state senator arrived in the parking lot outside of her office this morning. It is then where she was pulled to the side by three FBI agents, told them her about the search, and they confirmed that multiple electronics and other items were taken from her personal office and seized by the FBI.

Now, Lucas is a very outspoken senator at times, and she is most notably recently been in the press because she led the Democrats' successful redistricting efforts in the state that potentially could lead to major pickups by Democrats in the in the midterm elections. And Democrats in Virginia are really, Kasie, making this connection and calling into question the timing of this raid, given her prominent role in that effort.

U.S. Representative Bobby Scott, who is a Virginia Democrat, he says that the searches -- he noted that the s searches are coming just two weeks after that successful effort, saying, quote, while we await the full facts of the investigation, it must be acknowledged that this FBI raid occurs in the broader context of President Trump's repeated abuse of the department of justice to target his perceived political opponents. And Don Scott, who serves with her in the Virginia house of delegates, a Democrat, also said in a statement, quote, people should take this with a grain of salt and allow the facts to come out before jumping to conclusions, given the politicization of this administration.

Now, Lucas, when reached out by CNN, did not respond for comment. But a source close to her tells me, quote, "She is a fighter," Kasie.

HUNT: All right. Sunlen Serfaty, thank you so much for that report.

My panel is here in THE ARENA. CNN special correspondent Jamie Gangel; CNN chief national correspondent John King; Democratic strategist, former senior adviser to the Biden and Harris campaigns, Adrienne Elrod; and former Republican speaker pro tempore Patrick McHenry. We're also joined by CNN political commentator, former Trump White House communications director Alyssa Farah Griffin.

Thank you all so much for being here today.

John King, let me start with you.

I think it was good to start off with Sunlen's great reporting. There's still some unanswered questions about the origins of that, but what we saw play out in Indiana -- I mean, it proved both that the president still has what it takes in a -- in a primary setting.

[16:05:10]

And also that he's still pretty focused on how people are crossing him, no matter how high or low their profile may be.

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Both of those things are very, very, very true. If you look at the core, the solid core, think of a baseball and the core in the middle of a baseball of the Trump base. It is strong and the president can direct it. And they spent a ton of money here, a remarkable amount of money. Republican on Republican money to do this.

There's no question the president still has control over the hard core MAGA base of the Republican Party, even more so in a very conservative state like Indiana. I think you look at the same time, look at other results yesterday and results in 2025 and 2026 up to this point, and make the argument that the outer ball is fraying a little bit. The strings on the baseball, the core of the baseball is still MAGA Trump, but the strings on the baseball are starting to fray.

How much? We'll learn in November. But there is evidence.

HUNT: What was your most significant piece of evidence in that direction last night that you would point us to?

KING: Well, number one, the margins in Michigan in a bellwether state local race, it's a 50/50 district that the Democrats are winning big again. But I don't even just look at last night. And plus, also, if you talk about -- well, I'll give you one from last night, the Mahoning County Democratic chairman in Ohio, that's Youngstown, Lordstown, blue collar --

HUNT: Hardly Trump country, right?

KING: Trump won it. Trump won that in 19 -- Trump won that the second time, 2020 for the first time since Richard Nixon. Then he won it again in 2024.

That was a Jim Traficant blue collar union district. More Democrats turned out in the primary yesterday in Mahoning County. The Democrats didn't have any contested contests. Democrats just want to vote.

HUNT: There were no Democratic primaries available to vote in, basically, and they showed up anyway.

KING: Democrats want to vote.

(LAUGHTER)

HUNT: Love it.

Okay, so Congressman McHenry, I mean, what would -- what would you point to here? I mean, the president did have wins across the board in these races that he played in. But, I mean, as John pointed out, they spent an enormous amount of money considering what kind of money is normally spent in races like this.

PATRICK MCHENRY (R), FORMER SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE: Yeah, but a small amount nationally, these are -- it's a pittance. And given how much money the Republicans have and MAGA Inc has, frankly.

HUNT: Right.

MCHENRY: And a very small amount, considering they want to show that the president still owns the Republican Party. He still remains, at this moment, the most popular president within his own party ever. And that gives him power here on Capitol Hill. You still see Senate candidates seeking his endorsement to win the primary. Andy Barr, in particular, Congressman Barr in Kentucky gets the nom -- gets the Trump nod. He's going to be the nominee in two weeks.

Then you see on the Democratic side, no countervailing force like that. You see the weakness of Schumer having lost his chosen candidate. You now have as the de facto Democratic nominee in Maine, somebody who has a Nazi tattoo on their chest, still highly touted because he apologized for having a Nazi tattoo.

Michigan, complete mess for Democrats. Otherwise, you've seen some successes with Democratic recruitment with Senate candidates, but substantially fraying in key states where they need to need to have a better outcome.

ADRIENNE ELROD, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: But we've also seen a lot of success in some of the special elections. In fact, nearly every single special election that has taken place since the 2024 presidential campaign up until now, Democrats have either flipped the seats or they've significantly shortened the margins in a lot of these districts. So, I mean, sure, we don't have, you know, an heir apparent who's definitely going to be the president or be the Democratic nominee in 2028.

But we've got a lot of things going for us because prices are still too high. Trump has failed on his promises to the American people. We're out of self-imposed war that he created. There's a lot of concerns the American people have, and their pocketbooks are not any better than they were a couple of years ago.

So, I think Democrats are actually doing a little bit better than you give us credit for.

MCHENRY: Well, frankly, the benefit in a midterm is being on the out. It is such a great benefit. My party has won a number of midterms --

ELROD: That's true. That is true.

MCHENRY: -- by offering nothing and just not being in power.

ELROD: That is true. That is true.

HUNT: Jamie?

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: There's no question the candidate matters. You can see that in all these different states. But what I took away from last night is, yes, defy Donald Trump at your peril. And let's just remember for context, the reason he went after them was because these Indiana Republicans stood up to him on redistricting.

But there's the primary and there's the general and his candidates have made it through the primary. Let's see what happens in the general.

HUNT: Well, Alyssa Farah Griffin, let me put this to you because this is, of course, been really the central question for any Republican in the Trump era who has wanted to push back on him on anything in any way, which is that for many of them in a general election contest, if you actually are in a swing district -- and this is true for members of the House of Representatives that are in such a scenario -- it's a diminishing number of them, but they still exist. They can't win with Trump because his approval rating is in the tank. Gas prices are where they are.

But they can't win without him because of what John King was talking about. The core of the baseball, right, the core of the Republican base. Where does that leave Republicans heading into this midterm election

[16:10:04]

ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It's a complicated place to be, and I want to point something out. I mean, there are careers of politicians that have been ruined, Republican politicians, for simply breaking with Trump on minor issues. They may vote with him 95 percent of the time.

But from Mark Sanford to Tom Rice to Peter Meijer, to anyone who voted for his first impeachment, to these Indiana state senators, Donald Trump has made clear he will go after you. He will spend money against you. And he's got a very good scorecard of being able to take people out electorally who have gone against him.

So that strikes fear in people who oftentimes need to, in a tough midterm race or a tough off-year election, be able to run with some distance from him. I also think what's notable, and we should never forget, is sort of the historic talent of Republicans that we lost because they just decided not to run again in the Trump era, from Chris Sununu to Charlie Baker to Paul Ryan onward, there is this fear factor that if Trump comes after you, your political career is over. And look at the Liz Cheneys of the world.

That really is kind of a reality that many folks are facing. And so they have to make this decision full loyalty to him or go the Thomas Massie route that we're going to see in the weeks ahead and see if you can somehow squeak through when running against Trump.

HUNT: Yeah. Really interesting.

And actually, that brings us to the second kind of big topic of conversation I've been thinking about and wrestling with the last day or so.

And, John King, I want to start -- I want to put this to you. And that is, of course, the shadow primary that's already going on between Marco Rubio and J.D. Vance. And, you know, Rubio had a -- what I think we'll look back on as maybe not a critical, but certainly a key day in the narrative arc of wherever he's going.

When he went to the White House podium yesterday after having been kind of on the sidelines in terms of the Iran debate, what did you make of his performance and his performance there came as J.D. Vance, of course, was on the road bringing you know, they're showcasing two different potential ways of taking the Trump era into a new Republican era.

KING: Look, the two of them would deny a competition. Let's put that out there. The two of them would say, no, all is good here. Anytime. If you do have aspirations, anytime you can get the White House podium and a big national or international platform, that's good for you. It's a good test run for you.

The secretary of state certainly seemed to be doing what he wanted to do. There are a lot of people out there who don't agree with what he's saying maybe, but he thought he was there.

I would posit this -- the Trump voters I have in my All Over the Map group tend to talk more about Rubio right now than they do about Vance. They find him more -- they find him interesting in the sense that he was not a Trumper. They're Trumpy Trump voters. And here's this guy who's been brought into the fold, and they're kind of impressed that he's navigated it. And they even give him credit sometimes for nudging Trump a little bit. We'll see how that plays out.

I will posit this though. We can watch this play out now in May of the midterm election year. It really doesn't matter until we know what happens in the midterms. If the Republican Party gets shellacked and Donald Trump gets repudiated by the American people, that hurts them both. They serve in his administration.

The price of gas is still going up because of the Iran war. Whether J.D. Vance opposed it in private, you know, he's on the team now, and they both will suffer from that as it goes up.

I would tell you right now in both parties that if you are not of Washington, I would give you a better chance in 2028 today than I would anybody in Washington. That's not to criticize his performance. It's not even about their performance.

HUNT: Yeah.

KING: It's about the mood of the American people, who, on both parties, from my both -- my most -- Bernie/AOC voters to the most Trumpy voters, they don't think the solutions are in this town right now.

HUNT: Congressman, what do you think?

MCHENRY: Well, the primary still goes through President Trump's nom -- through his nod. I'm sorry.

KING: Do you still believe that, though, in 2020 -- I ask it as a serious question. If he if they get shellacked in 2026, more non-Trump Republicans are going to think, okay, maybe there's an opening out there. I don't know if -- are you sure about that? Does it last?

MCHENRY: Yes. If President Biden can effectively control the Democratic Party, get the nomination, and yet not really be there, President Trump can for sure, give the mantle of leadership to someone in the Republican Party, granted his overall popularity, whatever it may be. The internal control is there.

The competition, the interesting part is going to see who actually emerges, who's willing to do that, and whether or not any of those governors across the country, somebody not of Washington is willing to get in. That's going to be the complicated piece. That's going to be the interesting dance we're going to see over the next year or year and a half.

HUNT: Jamie Gangel, one interesting number, too, is if you -- if you look at the approval for J.D. Vance and Marco Rubio, it is -- it's interesting because Vance is tracking very close to President Trump, right? Rubio has this edge, right?

And when you talk to when I talk to Democrats, they'll say privately that they're a little bit more nervous about maybe -- it's not Rubio himself. You know, to John's point, we are -- we're a long way out, but we're not. I kind of disagree with you, John. I got to be honest. But anyway, but he has a little bit of -- of this, you know, Democrats

will say he may have an appeal that's broader, that's a little different than in a general election anyway. Yes, you have to survive the primary, but in a general election might cut against Democrats and in Rubio's favor.

[16:15:07]

GANGEL: So, two things. We were talking just a moment ago about likable. Who is more likable, and that does play a role in this. And I think what we saw from Marco Rubio yesterday in the briefing room, he was funny. He was relaxed, very different. He presents very differently from J.D. Vance.

He may also -- we've seen him on the sidelines, you know, why isn't he in Islamabad negotiating? Why did J.D. Vance go? Maybe that ends up being better for Marco Rubio. Yeah.

HUNT: In his favor. Maybe so.

Alyssa Farah Griffin, let me give you a very brief last word as we wrap up here on this, since I think, you know, both of these men, where do you sit?

GRIFFIN: I think Marco Rubio is a political heavyweight, and I think he benefits from the fact that he's now accepted by MAGA world in America first, but also by those who are still skeptical of President Trump.

The really interesting thing is going to be, what does he do after the midterms? If it goes the way we think and Republicans get shellacked, does he step aside, say, I want to spend some time with my family to create some distance from the administration heading into 2028, or does he stick around through the final stretch of the Trump administration and kind of hope for the best?

But he's an incredibly formidable candidate that has broad appeal. And I think in a general election goes much further than a J.D. Vance would.

HUNT: Really interesting.

All right. Alyssa Farah Griffin, thank you so much for spending some time with us. Come back soon.

The rest of our panel is going to stand by.

Coming up next here in THE ARENA, we're going to look back at someone who was always looking ahead, and well remember the life and legacy of CNN founder Ted Turner.

But first, the Democrat who former President Obama is calling an extraordinary talent and what fellow Democrats should learn from that person when it comes to communicating with voters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) STEPHEN COLBERT, LATE NIGHT HOST: Not only does he talk like a normal person, but he lives a normal life, but he also he names what is obviously wrong.

BARACK OBAMA, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: Yes.

COLBERT: And he goes, we should change that thing.

OBAMA: That doesn't make any sense and not have a bunch of gobbledygook around it. And so, what I'm looking for --

COLBERT: Is there a strict no gobbledygook?

OBAMA: No gobbledygook

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:21:35]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLBERT: How dumb do you think it is for people to say that I should run for president?

OBAMA: Well, you know, the bar has changed. Let me put it this way. I think that you could perform significantly better than some folks that we've seen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: You've got to, got to enjoy President Obama not being able to keep himself from laughing in that interview with Stephen Colbert that took place at Obama's presidential center, which opens in Chicago next month. And while President Obama never mentioned President Trump by name, he did make what seemed to be a series of critiques about his successor and about his concerns with the current administration.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: There's a bunch of stuff that, you know, we can overcome. We can't overcome the politicization of the criminal justice system, the awesome power of the state. You can't have a situation in which whoever's in charge of the government starts using that to go after their political enemies, or reward their friends, right?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right. John King, we don't hear -- we haven't heard a lot from President Obama in the Trump era. He's been relatively judicious in terms of when he's chosen to engage on certain things. But this obviously a significant moment for him.

What stood out to you and what message do you think he is wanting to send and present at this period of time? KING: The mix in the two clips you play is what stands out to me in

the sense of you often figure out what's going to work in the moment, right? And that is a very serious case. Talking about, remember, it was the Trump people constantly complaining about Biden alleging the Biden administration was politicizing the Justice Department. And now, what we've seen during the Trump administration, and I think you could get 100 law school kids and not ask them their politics and let them take a vote and say, which justice department has been more political. I think the answer would be pretty obvious, and that would be the Trump Justice Department.

So that's a -- it's a -- that's a policy argument that Democrats want to hear from their candidates that they think the Trump administration has gone way overboard. But I actually think the humor is kind of effective in the idea that, you know, you know, he didn't mention Trump there, but it's pretty clear he's saying, well, maybe you could perform even better than some people out there.

Humor can play a huge role in politics, especially when people hate politics, as to try to get people to laugh a little bit.

HUNT: Yeah. Well, and, you know, it sort of struck me that he seemed to be laughing about was like, oh, Stephen, like, you think -- you think you could do what I did? It was a little bit of the vibe I got there.

And, Jamie, the interesting thing -- I mean, he so he said this to the New Yorker in a piece that was published earlier this week. This is Obama talking about himself, his role in the m media environment. He says, "For me to function like Jon Stewart even once a week, just going off, ripping what was happening, which, by the way, I'm glad Jon's doing, that I'm not a political leader. I'm a commentator, Obama said. In fact, he insisted, he's doing more than people realize. The media environment is so difficult that people don't even know all the stuff I'm doing, right?"

Which also speaks to his conception of his own celebrity in the way that he should be able to punch through. But it's pretty telling.

GANGEL: So there have been times where he's, you know, he's come out the radio city music hall moment with the other presidents. He does a lot on social media, which is very different from sitting down. But reaches a wide audience. I do think that I'm just wondering, as we get to the midterm elections, are we going to see more and more of Obama out there?

ELROD: I think the answer is yes.

[16:25:01]

I hope so. And I -- and I think the answer is yes. I mean, look, I've been on the last three presidential campaigns. Four, if you want to count Biden and Harris being two separate ones, up for debate.

He is by far our most important and most effective surrogate. He was in 2016 for Hillary Clinton. He was in 2020 for President Biden. He was in 2024 for President Biden. And then Vice President Harris.

So, I think you will see more from him. And look, I mean, I think this team is trying to find different ways to use his voice effectively and to break through and get out there. And I think a conversation with somebody like Stephen Colbert where there's, you know, Obama does very well with humor. You don't always see that because he tends to be very serious and give very serious speeches.

But we just saw that he's got a great sense of humor. But in order to break through in this current moment, you want to sit down with somebody who can have that sense of humor with you, but who can also have very serious discussions about some of the major challenges we're facing.

MCHENRY: I think you learned the lesson from the first Trump administration that when he did punch, it got -- it got blown up in a substantial way. And he was pretty humorless about it, frankly. So he's I think he's adapted to that.

But the other -- the thing I would say as -- say as in submit here as a Republican, is that my Democratic friends, their best person was last on the ballot 14 years ago and left office 10 years ago. That is a markedly different Democratic Party, different coalition, different electoral math here. And yet he is still the best attribute they have for the Democratic Party.

HUNT: Well, so here I'm glad that you put it that way, because it speaks exactly to the next point that I wanted to talk about, which is who Obama identified in this interview as someone who is the next up and coming voice for the Democratic Party. Here he was talking about Zohran Mamdani, the mayor of New York, talking about how he cuts through the gobbledygook was Obamas word, not mine. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: What I'm more interested in for Democrats is, do you know how to just talk to regular people? Like we're not in a college seminar, right? You know, can you talk plain English to folks? And so, what I'm looking for --

COLBERT: Is there a strict no gobbledygook --

OBAMA: No gobbledygook.

COLBERT: -- here? You should carve that into the wall somewhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Carve that into the wall somewhere. Gobbledygook turns out to be Stephen Colbert's word.

I mean, is he right about that?

ELROD: Yeah. So. is that for me or no?

Yes, he's absolutely right about that. I mean, we have to talk to people in a normal way. I mean, some of the best messengers, not only in the Democratic Party, but in the Republican Party too, who are just running for office. We've got to be able to talk to people, you know, in plain English.

And, you know, you can criticize President Biden for all you want. But that was something he was very adamant about. He would go through his speeches and he would take out complicated words or words that maybe a third or fifth grader didn't understand. And he would put plain language in there.

MCHENRY: Like malarkey

ELROD: Well, like people, people understand malarkey.

So, look at the bottom line is this people want to be communicated to, not like they're in a college seminar, but they want to be spoken to in ways that they can actually understand. Those that breaks through. That's the beer test model. And I -- you know, I think that those are the people who tend to --

MCHENRY: What Jamie said was likability, sincerity has broken through. And that is a post-Obama era. Obama is way too polished. He made the teleprompter sing. That was what he got. We got as a hangover of that.

Trump saying exactly what he thought in that moment, what could -- which could be directly outrageous and very specific to a moment which would drive the media cycle. It's a very different environment now, how politicians talk, including significant Democratic elected officials that think the four-letter F word is the most powerful political language they can use in order to get into the media cycle. It's very different today.

HUNT: John?

KING: I agree with you. I think right now people put authenticity. Many people put authenticity ahead of partisan label because they don't trust any politicians. And again, they don't trust this town -- to listen to them, to do things relevant to them.

So Mamdani broke through by talking about affordability in a way that the people of New York City got. Now, can you sell those ideas in North Carolina? Can you sell those ideas in Indiana, you know, about, you know, free buses or subsidized housing? Maybe not.

But he was talking to his voters about an issue -- you know, high rents, high costs, high affordability that broke through, that broke through. I just had a Trump voter in a conversation the other day. We were talking about affordability, and I said, what should people do?

This is a Christian conservative pastor in Texas who said subsidized housing and subsidized food for families who need help. A conservative saying because he sees the affordability crisis up close so people are willing to go way outside their boxes to solve problems. It's the politicians who aren't willing to meet them where they are. HUNT: I mean, honestly, even the word affordability, I've thought

about this. When we say affordability crisis, what does that even mean, right?

ELROD: Right.

HUNT: It means like, people don't have enough money to pay to live, right? Like, how is it? Why is it that we're still using that kind of language? Even when we talk about this, it's such a real --

[16:30:01]

ELROD: And to your point, Governor Beshear, who I think everyone believes may run in 2028 for president, he says things like don't say food insecurity, say I'm going hungry. Like talk to people, meet them where they are, talk to people like normal human beings. It's going to take you pretty far.

MCHENRY: But this is the rise of populism, which is what is your lived experience? Do you like it? And what we've seen for 20 years in America, actually a little bit longer, is that people are very unhappy with their situation.

You can call this tech, you can call that with tech overlay that -- Kasie, you've spent a lot of time talking about the concern that parents have, or actually manufacturing where the manufacturing jobs actually are surprisingly here. But the rhetoric around job losses and people's lived experience has changed peoples psyche about whether or not we should be optimistic about America and our future.

HUNT: John King, do you find when you talk to these voters, too, because, I mean, you bring up manufacturing, right? And we think a lot about the hollowed-out towns in places like Youngstown, Mahoning County, Western Pennsylvania.

And that driving the Trump era. But we are barreling into a situation where it's going to happen on a white-collar scale. Also, for kids that are coming out of college. I mean, it's already starting to happen to people I know who have kids who are graduating on a scale and in a, in a set of communities. That's totally different. Are you picking that up already from voters you talk to?

KING: Oh, yeah. People look backwards. You know, grandpa used to work in that factory. Dad worked in that factory. I thought I was going to work in that factory. That factory is gone.

So, people look backwards at the manufacturing part and they think, what? No one's here to help my town. No one's talking in a way to help my town. Where's the economy? And then they look forward.

And you look -- as a parent, as a high school -- of a high school freshman, I have two older kids who are out in the world doing just great. A parent of a high school freshman. What is A.I. going to do to the next three years of his life in high school, then the four years in college, and then what jobs are out there? People are out there asking this all the time because they're seeing

it. They see these data centers pop up in their communities. They think its thousands of jobs. It's a lot of construction jobs at the beginning. But then once the thing is built, its mostly an HVAC team to keep it cool and some programmers.

And so they're asking these questions on a daily basis. Again, if they don't see many people, some would say any people, whether it's their governor's office, their state legislature, or especially here, giving them a North Star, this is where we're going.

It's going to be bumpy. It's going to be a lot of curves. That's what they're missing. They're lost in this economy.

HUNT: Right.

All right. Coming up next here in THE ARENA, we're going to talk with an Armed Services Committee member, Seth Moulton, about the new reporting on the latest proposal to end the war in Iran. The big caveat just coming in from President Trump.

Plus, remembering a legend and a visionary, CNN founder Ted Turner.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TED TURNER, CNN FOUNDER: I wish God had made us just a little bit smarter. You know, but smart enough to where we didn't go to war with each other and practice cruelty on each other. If we were nice to each other, that's kind of world that -- that I envision and the world that I've been working for.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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[16:37:20]

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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We've had very good talks over the last 24 hours, and it's very possible that we'll make a deal. We've had some good talks before, as you know, and all of a sudden, the next day, they're like, they forgot what happened.

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HUNT: All right. So cautious optimism from President Trump today about the state of Iran talks. As a regional source tells CNN that the U.S. and Iran are moving closer to an agreement on a memo to end the war. Iran is still reviewing that latest U.S. proposal.

Earlier today, the president once again warned that the U.S. will restart its bombing, quote, at a much higher level and intensity than it was before. If Iran doesn't agree to a deal.

Joining me is Democratic congressman from Massachusetts, Seth Moulton. He's a marine corps veteran and sits on the Armed Services Committee.

Congressman, thank you so much for being here. Really appreciate it.

REP. SETH MOULTON (D-MA): Yeah.

HUNT: So, this agreement were moving towards this one page memo. According to our reporting.

Are you optimistic that this could put us in a better place?

MOULTON: No. We're in a decidedly worse place because Trump started this war. Iran has way more leverage than they had at the beginning, when we were just trying to negotiate a nuclear deal with them. Now Trump's trying to reopen the strait as well. And I don't think that either is going to come on great terms for the United States.

This is a loss for us. And that's how dangerous this war has been.

HUNT: This is -- as in we have lost this war?

MOULTON: We're certainly losing it right now on almost every measure. You know, regime change has gotten us a more hardline regime. Weve destroyed some of their ballistic missiles, but given them billions and billions of dollars by lifting oil sanctions so they can buy more.

We clearly have not obliterated their nuclear program, and we're in a far worse position than Obama was with the Iran nuclear deal.

And on top of that, the Islamic regime has run Iran for 50 years under multiple U.S. presidents. And we've had all sorts of misadventures in the U.S., including Bush's wars, Jimmy Carter's hostage crisis. But they never closed the Strait of Hormuz.

It took Hegseth and Trump, the most incompetent people imaginable, for our national security to actually get the Islamic republic to close the Strait of Hormuz. And now he's begging -- we're the ones making proposals to them. Trump is going to them saying, please negotiate with us so we can reopen the strait.

It's pathetic. It's not a good position to be in for our national security.

HUNT: Congressman, what do you say to the argument that the Iranian regime should not have a nuclear weapon, and that it was worth doing what we have done so far to try to prevent that -- considering that even in the presence of the JCPOA, which then President Trump ultimately did tear up, the Iranians were much farther down a path of enriching uranium and moving toward something like that, toward nuclear weapons capability than they had been in the past?

MOULTON: No, no, no. They were not farther along the JCPOA. The very first line of it said, Iran will never have a nuclear weapon. And they were further away from enriching enough uranium to actually produce one than they are today.

On top of that, the Trump administration, the very first Trump administration, including a whole bunch of Iran deal critics, certified that Iran was following the deal and that wasn't out of trust. That's because we had intrusive inspections, constant electronic monitoring.

Trump is now just trying to get back to that, and it's patently obvious that this bombing campaign from last summer did not obliterate their nuclear weapons program. That's why Trump can't go 12 hours without talking about how important it is to eliminate their nuclear weapons program.

So, we're in a worse position today. They're closer to having a bomb. They have more enriched nuclear material. We do not have inspections. We do not know where everything is. Some of its under rubble, but we're not quite sure.

That's why Trump is now going back and begging for a deal that he'll be lucky if it's as good as the one that Obama had and that he tore up.

HUNT: And what is your view of the role that Israel has played here? Did Israel play too large a role in convincing the American leadership to go to war with Iran?

MOULTON: I mean, I certainly never imagined that our own secretary of state would tell the American public, oh, well, Trump had to do this because Netanyahu made it, that Netanyahu was going to conduct the attacks. The only thing that that America could do was follow along.

I mean, I don't know, another time in history when that's been the case. I mean, when the British got attacked by the Germans in World War Two, they asked for U.S. help, but Roosevelt didn't say, oh, well, the British made me do it. You know?

I mean, this is absurd. And so, on the one hand, you kind of got to give credit to Netanyahu for succeeding in in turning Trump to his interests and just making Trump do what he wanted. But the fact that American president would be so weak that he cannot even stand up to a close ally like Israel and say, no, this is not actually right now in our national security interests. We should keep negotiating because we'd like to get a nuclear deal, not have to negotiate to reopen the strait as well.

I mean, this just shows how weak Trump and Hegseth truly are.

HUNT: What is your position on how the United States should be providing or selling arms to Israel at this point in time?

MOULTON: We've got to have the same rules and restrictions that we have for every other country in the world, but we actually have to enforce them. And when Israel is using arms illegally, like bulldozing homes, we should not be sending them bulldozers. Now, on the other hand, if we send them defensive weapons, that not only preserves lives in Israel, it preserves lives in every country that's shooting at Israel because they don't have to shoot back.

I mean, when we didn't have missiles to shoot down incoming mortar and rocket fire in Iraq, the only thing we could do is use what's called counter-battery fire and return fire on those positions. Sometimes they were in civilian areas. So defensive weapons are good for everybody.

But I don't think we should be giving bulldozers to them for the West Bank.

HUNT: At this point in time, would you consider yourself a Zionist?

MOULTON: I mean, I'm not -- I don't know exactly what that means. I mean, I -- the fact that the state of Israel should exist. Absolutely.

But the fact that they should be allowed to oppress the Palestinians and they shouldn't allow a Palestinian to exist, a Palestinian state, to exist -- absolutely not. I mean, I might want to be one of the few holdouts who still believes in a two-state solution, because I think that at the end of the day, Israelis and Palestinians deserve the same basic rights and freedoms, including the freedom to not die in a terrorist attack or die from a bomb falling from 30,000 feet in the air.

HUNT: All right. Congressman Seth Moulton, thanks very much for the conversation today. I really appreciate it. I hope you come back soon.

MOULTON: Good to see you.

HUNT: All right. Ahead here in THE ARENA, our panel shares their memories of Ted Turner and his impact spreads far and wide beyond the world of cable news.

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TURNER: I really don't think about myself that much in my past. I think about the future of humanity mostly, and what we're doing wrong and what we can do to correct what we're doing and how I can influence that so that my children and grandchildren and yours will have a wonderful life, the opportunity to have a wonderful life, the way -- the way we had.

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[16:49:05]

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TURNER: To act upon one's convictions, while others wait, to create a positive force. In a world where cynics abound, to provide information to people when it wasn't available before. I dedicate the news channel for America, the Cable News Network.

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HUNT: That was then, this is now. And today we lost a titan and a true visionary. Ted Turner, our network's founder, passed away at 87. When he created CNN and with it 24/7 news, history unfolded live in our living rooms, from the fall of the Berlin Wall to the Space Shuttle Challenger disaster, and perhaps most notably, the Gulf War.

But his legacy extends far beyond us here at CNN. He was a philanthropist who started the United Nations Foundation.

[16:50:03]

He was an activist for the elimination of nuclear weapons and a conservationist who played a crucial role in saving the American bison.

Our panel is back to reflect on his life and his legacy. John King, what do you remember most?

KING: So, I came here at a very interesting time. I started here in the spring of 1997. Ted had sold CNN to AOL Time Warner in late 1996. So, the merger was just happening, and Ted was around for a little bit, but he was segueing out.

And so, my memory is of watching sort of the cowboy cable network, you know, the rebel cowboy cable network become more corporate in some ways for the better.

And my few conversations with Ted, I don't pretend to know Ted well. He sent me a few nice notes when I broke stories at the White House. He would send a note or pick up the phone and call you, which was very gracious.

In my few conversations with him, he would grumble that he often didn't like some of the things that were happening to his company. As it became more corporate, because he was someone who would walk into the newsroom in Atlanta in his bathrobe and --

HUNT: Think you can do that now? Okay.

KING: So, culturally, culturally, very, very different. As a journalist, I covered the first Gulf War for "The AP", "The Associated Press", and that's when I met Christiane Amanpour, found out we went to the same college. I didn't know that when she was there, but that as a journalist, you could see the power of CNN. I was an "AP" wire guy, and I was like, whoa, you know, I didn't know these guys were going to have such a global impact. And boom.

HUNT: The wire on TV revolution.

Jamie?

GANGEL: I worked for NBC for 32 years. And so that's where I was when that happened. And I was actually sitting in the pentagon for NBC in the Gulf War. And I will tell you, we were jealous.

I mean, watching the war live. You know, we talk about the CNN effect, but it had never happened like that before that you could watch it in in real time, 24 hours a day. One quick story. You know, Bernie Shaw, when he came back from the

coverage, President Bush 41 had him come over to the White House because President Bush was really worried about the CNN reporters who were over there. And he said to Bernie, you know, I was really worried about you.

And Bernie said, I was really worried about me, too. But on a serious note, President Bush 41 told me that watching the war on TV, watching it on CNN had an impact on decisions he made along the way.

MCHENRY: Well, had a decision on somebody like me as a kid. I would come home and watch what was happening in the Gulf War. I would see global events in my living room. This was the democratization of media.

And we see this long run. CNN's a part of this long run that is the culmination of this is effectively citizen journalism, accessing the Internet. But CNN was an integral part of this.

I got the advantage and the political education I got was coming home from school. You might be shocked by this, but I came home to watch the 4:00 p.m. show on CNN about what was happening daily in Washington. And it's a -- it's an honor to be on the 4:00 p.m. show.

HUNT: Hey, you know, I feel the same way, actually, as someone who, you know, came to it. I mean, we're showing were all showing --

GANGEL: Our age

HUNT: Our respective ages.

GANGEL: Asking anyone what grade you were in.

HUNT: As we tell these stories, but I remember living in Palm Beach County during hanging chads. And sorry, John, I know you were well into your career as a working journalist at this point. I was in high school, but coming home and turning on CNN just to see what was happening, kind of right around the corner from me.

I want to play just because they're kind of my favorite things. Some of my favorite things to do on TV is to play some of this history, and CNN does have it, and it's been touched on here.

Let's watch a little bit of Bernie Shaw covering the Gulf War just because, you know, John just gave voice to him. And again, Ted, the person who put together the network, put Bernie Shaw on the air at a time, frankly, when in many ways that was groundbreaking all by itself. Watch.

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BERNARD SHAW, CNN ANCHOR: This is -- something is happening outside. Peter Arnett joined me here. What? Let's describe to our viewers what we're seeing. The skies over Baghdad have been illuminated. We're seeing bright flashes going off all over the sky.

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HUNT: So that's 1991. And then fast forward a few years, here was Ted Turner reflecting with Larry King, who, of course, is an icon again, because of Ted Turner, about CNN's success. Watch.

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LARRY KING, FORMER CNN HOST: What has about it has surprised you the most?

SHAW: Hmm. Well, there've been a lot of surprises, but I would just say that it worked out as well as it -- as well as it did. You know, a lot of times --

KING: Did you envision this growth?

SHAW: Well, I didn't have any upper limits to how far we could go. So, I thought it would be a big success. But I guess I couldn't have figured it would have been this big a success

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[16:55:02]

HUNT: Well, and of course, we are still here at today. And as we close our reflections, this is from Ted's memoir. He wrote it in 2008.

He said this, quote, "I've often considered and joked about what I might want written on my tombstone. At one point, when I felt like I couldn't get out of the way of the press, 'You can't interview me here' was a leading candidate. In the middle of my career, I considered, 'Here lies Ted Turner. He never owned a broadcast network.' These days, I'm leaning toward 'I have nothing more to say'."

We remember him fondly.

We'll be right back.

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HUNT: Thanks for joining us in THE ARENA.

Jake Tapper standing by for "THE LEAD".

Hi, Jake.