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CNN Newsnight Aaron Brown
Bush Prepares State of the Union; Journalist Kidnapped in Kandahar
Aired January 28, 2002 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: And good evening again everyone. We are in Washington tonight. Tomorrow, the President's State of the Union Address to Congress and the country, and what a difference a year makes.
Last year, after winning a disputed election, one decided by the Supreme Court, the President came to the Hill on the 27th of February. It wasn't even a State of the Union speech. It was technically his budget proposal.
The White House, in those days before the 27, spent plenty of time lowering expectations. No point in that this time, and no desire to, as best we can tell.
Mr. Bush seemed to find his voice on about the 20th of September, his speech to Congress in those long and difficult days after the terrorist attack. At he sits in the White House tonight, he has an approval rating at about 80 percent, an unheard of number.
And while the country is divided on many things still, difficult and important issues, like energy and the environment and health care, it stands absolutely united where the war and the domestic battle against terrorism are concerned, and the President deserves a lot of credit for that.
But whether the President is able to translate his success as Commander-in-Chief to his domestic vision, and to do so in an election year, is anything but certain. There are political battles ahead, dangerous traps for both the President and the Democrats, and it all starts here in Washington tomorrow night.
A lot of what we'll do tonight will center around that speech and the President, so we begin our whip tonight at the White House, and our Senior White House Correspondent, John King. John, a headline, please.
JOHN KING, SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, George W. Bush ran for President as a balanced budget conservative. Tomorrow night, he will tell the American people their government is running a deficit and will be in the red for several years to come.
He'll also propose a major spending increase, all necessary the President will say, to win the War on Terrorism overseas and here at home. He will not mention the word Enron. Aaron.
BROWN: John, thank you, back to you shortly. To the State Department next, Andrea Koppel with a troubling story of a missing journalist in Pakistan, Andrea, a headline, please.
ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, his name is Daniel Pearl. He's a 38-year-old American journalist with the Wall Street Journal, who was taken into captivity last week by a Pakistani military group. The problem is, no one in this country or in Pakistan has ever heard of the group.
BROWN: Andrea, thank you. To Kandahar next, a dramatic showdown waiting to happen in a hospital there. It finally did happen, involving al Qaeda holdouts. Martin Savidge covering the story, Marty, the headline, please.
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you from Afghanistan, the sun just rising over the mountains. It was a showdown, one that had been boiling for several weeks. Special forces and Afghan forces in operation in downtown Kandahar, going up against al Qaeda forces. When it was over, we'll tell you who lost that battle.
Plus, also last night a helicopter out of this particular air base went down, with a number of soldiers on board in a hard landing. We'll give you the details on that too, Aaron. We'll show you around the mushroom here.
BROWN: Thank you. You got a full report coming up. Back with all of you shortly. A lot of ground to cover tonight. As Andrea said, we're looking at the case of the journalist who's apparently kidnapped in Pakistan. Tonight we'll talk with someone who knows all too well what the terror of that can be like, Terry Anderson, so long held hostage in Beirut.
And another remarkable story, a survivor's story about terror too, a man who escaped the World Trade Center and then lived through yesterday's suicide bombing in Israel as well.
And a woman who lost a brother on the 11th of September, finds some peace by sharing her story with the people of Afghanistan, innocent victims themselves.
All of that coming up in the hour ahead. We begin with the speech. The President will walk into the House Chamber tomorrow and answer the question, what is the state of the union?
The answer is never as simple as a President makes it seem. This time, perhaps, it is even tougher. September 11 not only claimed 3,000 lives, it shattered a national sense of security, and the economy is shaky, and the surplus is gone.
On the other hand, no President has ever been more popular, and if you're going to begin defining the next phase of your Presidency, 80 percent approval ratings are a nice place to start.
Now, under the message itself, and again our Senior White House Correspondent John King. John, good evening.
KING: Good evening to you, Aaron. If the President is on schedule, at this time tomorrow night he will be making his way out of the United States Capitol. The speech, we are told, runs about 45 minutes. In it, the President tries to address three challenges: the war on terrorism overseas, the war on terrorism here at home, homeland security he calls it; and as you noted, the struggling U.S. economy/
The challenge for Mr. Bush, can he translate that wartime popularity into support for a controversial domestic agenda in this, a Congressional year. Democrats have very different views. They blame this President, most notably his tax cut, for the return of deficit spending, one challenge the President will try to address in his speech.
He will try to make the case that that is not so. That yes, the government is back in the red. Yes, it will be for several years to come, but as the Vice President tried to make the case in an interview with us at CNN earlier today, the President will make the case, it's not the tax cut that caused the deficit.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DICK CHENEY, VICE-PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The biggest change has been the events of 9/11. We're in a war. We've had to conduct major military operations halfway around the globe in Afghanistan since September 11. We're running worldwide intelligence operations, trying to wrap up this al Qaeda terrorist network that is some 65 or 70 countries.
We've just gotten a good start. It's a good start. It's a good start, but it is only a beginning. And so, we badly need to spend whatever it takes to win the war. I think that's our top national priority.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KING: And Mr. Bush will propose doubling the amount the government spends on Homeland Security, a big increase, almost $50 billion for the Pentagon. He will ask the Congress to work with him on a short-term economic stimulus plan, on a patient's bill of rights, HMO reform, on a prescription drug care benefit for senior citizens.
Can all that be done in an election year? That is the big question in Washington, the big challenge for the President. As you noted, Aaron, sky high popularity right now to reinforce that message.
Up in the President's box tomorrow night, members of the United States special forces and the new interim chairman of the interim government in Afghanistan. Aaron.
BROWN: Well, let's go back to something you said in the whip. No mention of Enron directly or indirectly?
KING: He will not speak the word Enron, we are told. He's on about Draft 25 right now. There is a section, though, where the President indirectly addresses all this.
He says, because of recent events, it is imperative that the administration and the Congress work to strengthen the laws about corporate disclosure, forcing corporations to say more about their finances, and critical that the government, the Congress and the administration work together on 401 (k) and other pension reforms, to make sure that what we have seen unfold in the case of Enron over the past several months, never happens again.
But, the President will not, we are told actually speak the word Enron.
BROWN: And you talked to the Vice President today about Enron, among other things, anything out of there jump out at you, you want to throw in while we're on the subject?
KING: He knows Republicans in Congress are a bit nervous about this. The Vice President and the President holding fast. They will not release the secret records of the Vice President's Energy Task Force, some meetings with Enron there.
Democrats think they have an issue here, that they can make this a big business, big energy, White House in an election year. Some Republicans are nervous about that. They support the President's point, that he should be able to have private conversations, but the Vice President is taking this to court.
I asked him today about the nervousness in the party. He shrugged and said it was a principle worth fighting for. He didn't care about the politics.
BROWN: John, thank you. John King, we'll see you tomorrow night at 8:00 when our coverage begins on the President's State of the Union speech. Senior White House Correspondent John King.
There is evidence in the polls that the popularity the President enjoys is more than just personal, that the country trusts his ideas more than it used to on a variety of issues. Now polls can be a bit dangerous to rely on, ask the President's father. But you'd rather they be good than bad, and for Mr. Bush, they are very good indeed. Here's CNN's Candy Crowley.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Dinnertime talk at the Scaff household in Irinda, California is of carrots and swimming lessons, anything but the "P" word.
LIZA SCAFF: We try not to talk about politics a whole lot in our house sometimes, especially with the children around.
CROWLEY: He's a business exec who voted for George Bush.
ERIC SCAFF, BUSINESS EXECUTIVE: He's running the government like a business, and that is important.
CROWLEY: She's a self-described old hippie, a tie-dye kind of liberal.
LIZA SCAFF: I didn't vote for President Bush, but I do think in light of the tragedies that we've been dealing with, that so far, I mean I think he's done a pretty good job addressing those issues.
CROWLEY: That feeling echoes loudly in the latest CNN/USA Today Gallup Poll. Eighty-three percent of those questioned, rated the first year of the Bush Administration a success. The poll numbers paint the picture of a President whose handling of the war has given him a powerful hand to play in the domestic arena.
Respondents were asked whether they had more confidence in President Bush or Congressional Democrats to handle 13 different issues. On 11 of those issues, the advantage goes to the Oval Office.
The President's biggest vote of confidence came on the subject of terrorism, where he outpolls Democrats by 65 points. The numbers are not a stratospheric, but still hearty on the home front.
Education, the President 58 percent, Democrats 31; the economy, the President 55 percent, Democrats 36; and Social Security, the President 45 percent to Democrats 40.
Mr. Bush has wrestled Democrats to a tie on health care, and while Democrats do hold an eight-point edge on the environment, it's paltry compared to numbers past.
In Toto, 71 percent of those polled said George Bush agrees with them on the issues that matter most. And as September 11 moves deeper into the past and if the war continues to go well, what matters begins to move back home.
LIZA SCAFF: As much as I am, you know, I am enormously relieved that the question of national security is being addressed, I have a concern that a lot of people are going to fall through the cracks during this recession.
ERIC SCAFF: It looks like we're going to have some deficits coming in the next couple of years, and that's disappointing for me.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CROWLEY: During the campaign, then Governor Bush, told audiences with enough votes he could go to Washington and spend that political capital on pushing through his agenda. What may have eluded him then, he has now in spades, 73 percent of those polled said they believe the policies President Bush is pursuing are taking the country in the right direction. Candy Crowley, CNN, Washington.
BROWN: Time to kick this around some with a couple of people who kick around pretty well, Haley Barbour, the former Chairman of the Republican National Committee and Joe Lockhart, President Clinton's former Press Secretary, one of them. Welcome to you both.
Mr. Barbour, you got the high poll numbers today, so I guess you get first go here. If you're sitting at 80 percent, what do you worry about if you're the President?
HALEY BARBOUR, FORMER RNC CHAIRMAN: Well, I don't think the President is going to be worrying about that. He won't be worrying about popularity and I think he'll be incredibly well received, that the Democrat members of Congress will be like the Republicans. Their welcome will reflect their constituents.
The only thing that Bush worries about is when we get further into the deal, is partisanship, is he worries about not the War on Terrorism, which is receiving his support, but does the economic package to other issues receive support or do the Democrats go to a partisan mode. And I think that's a real challenge for the President.
BROWN: Because only Democrats could go to a partisan mode, is that right Joe?
JOE LOCKHART, FORMER CLINTON PRESS SECRETARY: Well, I don't think. I think one of the things that's been a little misunderstood until now is, you know, we talked about partisanship going away, and somehow the President's received the lion's share of the credit for that, and I think he deserves some of the credit.
But the people who have stood forward and said, let's put politics aside, is the party opposite, the Democrats. And you'll remember, if you go back one administration, in times of war, Kosovo, there was not solid support from the Republicans. So I think the Democrats deserve a lot of credit.
I think the hard part for Bush will be, Democrats and Republicans have lined up behind him on the war. He's, as previous stories have indicated, he wants that to translate into domestic policy. But he can't do that in a way that tries to take advantage, political advantage of the war.
You know, we saw Mr. Rove's comments. They didn't come off so well a couple weeks ago, and he's got to let, I think, the war stand on its own and make his case separately. And if he tries to, you know, play some politics with that, he'll end up as the loser because I think he's got the country behind him now.
BROWN: Is there a gentle way to make the President's performance over the last four and a half months in the way translate to his domestic agenda without causing a backlash, a sort of distasteful backlash?
BARBOUR: Well, I don't think the President should be worried about that. I mean, the American people are behind him. They respect him. They're proud of him. They're proud of what he's done. And I think what you'll see him do tomorrow night is to offer his agenda in a non-partisan way.
There are going to be Republicans, conservative Republicans like me who are going to think, well golly, he's not doing enough. He's not going far enough. But I think it's because you'll see George Bush say, I want to offer a non-partisan agenda, an agenda where the Republicans don't get everything they want, but an agenda to get things done.
Bush believes we can't take the risk that this recession's over. When he talks about economic security, he's going to say, let's do things to make sure this recession's over. Let's don't take the risk of doing nothing.
BROWN: But some of these issues, if you take the bad connotation out of the word "partisan" and just the parties have differences here, some of these issues are, in fact, partisan.
The Democrats see economic planning differently than the Republicans do, period.
BARBOUR: Well, sure. The Democrats believe more government, more government spending, more government powers the better. The Republicans think more individual freedom and more personal responsibility is better.
But look, what you're going to see Bush do tomorrow night is say to the Republicans, if we're going to be non-partisan, we're not going to ask for everything we want. And I think to some degree, Bush will have Republicans, not grousing, but wishing that wasn't the case. The question is what will the response be from the Democrats?
BROWN: You're good. You turn every pitch into a hanging curve, I must say. You're very good.
LOCKHART: I agree. Haley's good. That's where I think a lot of our agreeing stops. But listen, the speech tomorrow night is the easy part. It's very easy to rhetorically bring people together and say that we can, let's work together. The hard part is what happens when the budget comes and these things all have to start adding up?
I mean, some of the things that weren't in the poll, that have been in recent polls, is you know, 25 percent of the country, only 25 percent believes that the tax cut helped them. That was in the New York Times. About 32 percent believes that the Bush economic stimulus plan, or the Bush plan in general isn't doing anything for the economy. Those are numbers that should worry him.
There are differences. I personally hope he goes and makes a big speech and goes around the country talking about his economic plan, because it's a plan the public hasn't gotten behind.
If you look at the stimulus plan he put forward, the public I think saw right through it, which was a bunch - it was a cobbled together bunch of big business tax breaks, which you know, the public believes is not going to stimulate the economy. It is not going to help them.
And I think once we get past what will, you know, I think will be a wonderful speech. It will be a moment where he can bring people together. That's the point where the hard stuff begins, and you know, I think we talk about the poll numbers. I think if you look at the poll numbers, you worry about, well what happens when we start talking about issues that aren't so popular? And what happens when the numbers start falling?
You know, I think it's something that they shouldn't be overly concerned about, but you know, I think the issues as we get deeper and deeper into the year, more into health care and the economy, those will favor the Democrats.
BROWN: About a half a minute, OK. Enron, does he need to make some reference to Enron, either directly or indirectly?
BARBOUR: I don't think so. But I think he does need to make plain to the American people that this government, this administration, is determined that our accounting system report, not only accurately, but reports the information that the investing public, if you will, needs to have in order to be able to make wise decisions. There's a real concern by everybody as to whether that happened.
BROWN: Now, that would be an indirect reference.
BARBOUR: Well why, there's no reason for him to make a direct reference.
BROWN: And, Joe, do you think that at this point, Enron taints Democrats almost or as badly as it does Republicans?
LOCKHART: No, I don't think so, because I think what Enron does at this point, we don't know all the story yet and we will find out over time, but at this point, it's much more of a problem I think for the Bush Administration because it reinforces this nagging doubt with the American public that when push comes to shove, he's going to side with big business and the special interests, not the average working family.
Whether that's a fair charge or not on Enron, time will tell. Whether that's a fair charge or not on his economic policies, I think it's absolutely fair.
BROWN: Nice to see you both. Thanks for coming in.
BARBOUR: Thank you.
BROWN: This is fun. You guys are awfully good. When we come back, the hazards of helicopters in the war zone, some injuries in a heavy landing today. We'll go to Kandahar. Also, the standoff of those armed al Qaeda fighters in the hospital there, not a pretty ending to that either. All that, as NEWSNIGHT continues on Monday, from Washington.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: It's a military fact that in peacetime or war, accidents happen and two happened today, one in the war zone. An Army transport chopper made a hard landing near the town of Khowst. Fourteen soldiers from the 101st Airborne were hurt, four seriously, the rest suffering cuts and bruises and broken bones. No word if the enemy played any part in what happened to the helicopter. The Pentagon saying only the chopper was on a tactical mission.
The other incident happened in the Arabian Sea. An attack sub, the Greenville, hit a support vessel. It tore a gash in the ship's fuel tank. No damage to the Greenville, and yes, it is the same Greenville that ran the Japanese fishing boat off the Hawaiian coast last year.
On to Kandahar and the hospital. For more than a month now, you knew if you were following the story, this would not end well. Wounded al Qaeda terrorists, many of them with grenades strapped to their bodies in a hospital in Kandahar, demanding treatment and threatening the doctors and the nurses and everyone else, that if anyone tried to harm them, they would kill themselves and everyone in sight. No one doubted them.
Today, the standoff finally ended. Back to CNN's Martin Savidge, who is in Kandahar this morning, for him. Marty, good morning.
SAVIDGE: Good evening to you, Aaron. We are at the Kandahar Airport. The situation in Kandahar itself is located about, a little less than 10 miles away, immediately over the mountains in the background.
It began at dawn yesterday, and it was when U.S. special forces, working in cooperation with Afghan forces, sealed off the streets around the Kandahar Hospital. We knew then that some sort of operation was underway.
As you say, those al Qaeda fighters had been holed up for a number of weeks. We could hear sporadic gunfire. Occasionally, you would see the U.S. special forces as they were maneuvering, as well as Afghan soldiers, in and around the hospital itself. From time to time, there were muffled explosions.
This whole operation went on throughout the morning hours, and eventually it was around midday when we were finally notified here that the operation had come to a conclusion. It did not end well. They had hoped to capture those al Qaeda fighters. Instead, all six of the fighters were killed. There is no report, though, of any casualties among the U.S. forces.
Now to back to where we are. This is described as the mushroom. We spent the night here last night. A mushroom is essentially a bulge in the perimeter that extends outwards and allows for a good clear line of fire. Let's give you a little demonstration, a little walkabout here. Watch your feet as you go.
All of this land here, because it looks like a moonscape, means it was flailed. This used to be a minefield. The flailer is a huge machine that comes in and just pounds the daylights out of the earth, hopefully triggering all the mines.
This, by the way, is where we spent the night last night, plywood not essentially the most comfortable thing to sleep on, but it does get very chilly out here. That's my sleeping bag there, by the way. Up on the big .50 caliber machine gun, that is Duke Elder, one of the humvees that they have out here. This is a very heavily defended position. That's the whole idea. Because we jut out beyond the perimeter here, the idea is they want to have a good clear field of fire.
The Kandahar Airport is maybe about 800, 900 meters away, so it makes for a very good defensive position. Here's the other humvee that you see here. On top of that is Fabian Gonzalez with the Mark 19 automatic grenade launcher.
They have been seeing activity out here. In fact, a lot of these guys have been on patrol, have noted that they found caches of weapons, and also tunnels out here, Aaron.
One of the things that would concern them is if anyone who wanted to do harm to the airport could launch perhaps a mortar attack from inside one of those tunnels, fire off a few rounds and be gone. These guys work very hard to make sure that is not going to happen out here on the mushroom. Aaron.
BROWN: I think everybody's working pretty hard, Martin. Thank you very much. Martin Savidge in Kandahar for us today. The Afghan flag is flying once again in the capitol in Washington, and not just at the White House where President Bush was hosting Hamid Kazai, Afghanistan's interim leader.
It went up this morning at the Afghan Embassy, an embassy again, after more than four years. Karzai called the flag raising a symbol of his country's new partnership with the west. It's a theme he picked up on the White House this afternoon.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
HAMID KARZAI, AFGHANISTAN'S INTERIM LEADER: I assure you, Mr. President, that Afghanistan with your help and the help of other countries, friends, will be strong and will stand eventually on its own feet and it will be a country that will defend its borders and now allow terrorism to return to it.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: For his part, President Bush promised U.S. aid in training a police force and creating a new Afghan army. He'll underline those commitments and more tomorrow night. Chairman Karzai in the audience when the President gives his State of the Union speech.
That flag you just saw, by the way, wasn't just pulled out of some drawer here in Washington and dusted off, it was made by some Afghan Americans, a rush job indeed. This was the diplomatic version of a night to remember.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
FAIZ BEHGOMAN: We just got the word that we need the flag and it was late at the evening, and all the stores were close so, and we needed this flag within a 24-hour window. And, we started calling the fabric stores, starting patching ideas together, how are we going to go about getting this done. And I called my aunts, I said "this is the situation, and we need this flag for tomorrow. Is there something you guys can do for us."
RAZIA MOANDIN: This is Afghanistan. We are making for Afghanistan, for peacemaker. WE have to.
MINA OFOGH: But it took a little time because it was on a short notice, and they brought the fabric. We came and we all worked after midnight.
BEHGOMAN: Three different colors, the dark stands for darkness, suppression. You could say the air of Taliban, if you apply it to the situation that we had. And the red is for bloodshed, war, and the green stands for peace.
MOANDIN: I was crying all day and I'm about to cry now, and it's a very joy. I'm very honored that we present our flag to all America and the whole nation. This is the beginning. It's not over but this is our hope for the beginning of a new Afghanistan and a new life for the people, especially for the women, and young men, everybody. We are very excited. We are very happy.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: The flag. In a moment, the story of a kidnapped American journalist. This is NEWSNIGHT from Washington.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: The pictures we saw today really brought this story home for us. So we didn't need the pictures to know trouble. A Wall Street Journal reporter named Daniel Pearl missing in Pakistan since last week, then the pictures, shackled and gun to his head. We'll show them to you in a moment if you haven't seen it.
But just who is this man, Daniel Pearl? Tonight on LARRY KING LIVE, we heard a bit from his boss, Journal Managing Editor Paul Steiger.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
PAUL STEIGER, MANAGING EDITOR, WALL STREET JOURNAL: Danny is not what some folks call a cowboy. He's a very experienced, careful journalist. He has been with us for a dozen years, started in our Atlanta bureau, worked in Washington covering business and regulatory topics, then moved to our London bureau. He's worked in Paris and most recently in Bombay. He's covered the Middle East for a number of years. He knows his way around. He is known as a cautious, careful reporter but a terrific reporter.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: He is also known as missing tonight. And more on Daniel Pearl's disappearance from the beginning to where things stand tonight. Here's CNN's Andrea Koppel.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANDREA KOPPEL, CNN STATE DEPARTMENT CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The saga began last Wednesday in the bustling streets of Karachi, Pakistan. That's where Daniel Pearl, a 38-year-old American journalist with the "Wall Street Journal" was digging into the case of Richard Reid, the man best known as the alleged shoe bomber.
RICHARD MURPHY, COMMITTEE TO PROJECT JOURNALISTS: According to his wife, he had gotten a tip that some sources with one of the Islamic militant groups right in Kashmir was willing to speak to him.
KOPPEL: Pakistani police say the last time anyone heard from Pearl, he was on his way to interview a member of a well known militant Islamic group. He was alone without a translator. By Friday, Pakistani authorities had launched an interagency investigation and a team of FBI agents joined the hunt.
BRIG. MUKHTAR AHMED, PAKISTANI OFFICIAL: We're trying to establish contacts with as many people as we have come to know.
KOPPEL: Suddenly, on Sunday a previously unknown group calling itself the National Movement for the Restoration of Pakistani Sovereignty sends an e-mail addressed to a number of Pakistani and U.S. newspapers. The group claimed Pearl was an American CIA officer and provided these photos, including one with a revolver pointed at his head, as proof they had Pearl in custody.
Pearl was being held in very inhumane circumstances, the e-mail said: "similar to the way that Pakistanis and nationals of other sovereign countries are being kept in Cuba by the United States."
Instead of ransom, the group made a series of political demands: Pakistani prisoners in Guantanamo, Cuba must be returned to Pakistan; Pakistanis illegally detained by the FBI and the U.S. must be given access to lawyers and family members; and that the former Taliban ambassador to Pakistan, now in U.S. custody, be released.
In an unusual move, the CIA publicly denied that Pearl has or had ever worked for the agency. By Monday, the state department issue a travel warning to Pakistan for all U.S. citizens and Secretary Powell calls Pakistan's president for an update.
RICHARD ARMITAGE, DEPUTY SECRETARY OF STATE: Well, we have been very closely involved with the authorities in Pakistan. Their intelligence authorities, their law enforcement people and their army are looking everywhere, trying to resolve the fate of this missing reporter.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KOPPEL (on camera): And if nothing else, that what's Pearl's employer, the "Wall Street Journal", hopes to convey, Aaron, to whomever is holding Pearl captive, that he is not a spy, just a journalist who was trying to do his job -- Aaron.
BROWN: Andrea, thank you. Andrea Koppel at the state department working that story for us tonight.
We're joined now by a reporter who perhaps more than anyone that we can think of knows what Daniel Pearl is probably going through. He lived with it for more than six years. In 1985, Terry Anderson had been covering Lebanon's civil war for three years. He was kidnapped by Islamic extremists, held for more than six years.
Terry Anderson joins us now on a videophone from the Virgin Islands. Terry, it's nice to have you with us tonight.
TERRY ANDERSON, HELD HOSTAGE IN LEBANON, 1985-1991: It's my pleasure.
BROWN: What would you think is going you through Daniel Pearl's mind right now?
ANDERSON: Well, I'm sure he is scared. I don't know what conditions he is being held under. When they say inhumane conditions, it may be as mild as in a cell by himself. There was no indication that he had been severely abused in the pictures. I hope he hasn't been.
But I know that he is -- you know, this is a severe trauma. He has been kidnapped. He is helpless. He is scared. He has to believe these people when they make threats, and as do we all. It's a tough situation. It's hard.
BROWN: I think hard. I think awful. In those first days when you were taken captive, did you think this well, will end today, this will end tomorrow, this won't go on indefinitely?
ANDERSON: Well, you always hope it will end quickly. In my situation, I think we were fairly realistic from the beginning. We knew it was going to be a long, hard situation. These people, if they have any intelligence at all, they have to know that the demands they have made initially are unrealistic. They are not going to happen. The U.S. government is not going to negotiate with them. They are not going to be able to affect the situation in Cuba with the Pakistani prisoners there. It is just not going to happen.
We learned that 10 years ago -- or 15 years ago with the people who were kidnapped in Lebanon. They have to understand that they have made a mistake. Daniel is not a spy. He is just a journalist and kidnapping journalists doesn't do anybody any good. It's not going to serve their political purposes. It's not going to gain them anything. It's a mistake. They made a mistake.
BROWN: It does gain them -- what it does seem to me that it gains them is an awful lot of attention, which may be...
ANDERSON: They would have gotten that attention if they'd simply given Daniel the interview he was after. BROWN: Fair enough. Although I don't mean to belabor this, I don't think it's an enormous point, but it is unlikely that the whole world or at least the entire country would be talking about it, that Daniel would become someone known by everyone and that his captors, therefore, would be known. I assume, perhaps I'm wrong, that that is part of their plan. They want to be heard in some way.
ANDERSON: OK, they want to be heard. They want to be paid attention to. How long is this going to last? What it is really going to gain them? They haven't articulated any goal that makes any sense. They haven't put forward anything that can be accomplished. They've simply said, OK, we have this American journalist and we are going to use him and you have to pay attention.
OK, we are paying attention. What is it that you think you can do here? It's not going to work. It hasn't worked in decades. It hasn't gained anybody anything. When I was kidnapped, my captors released me telling me this was not an useful tactic. It didn't work. We didn't gain what we had hoped to gain. And I hope that the people holding Daniel will come to understand that fairly quickly, that they are not going to gain what they hope they are.
BROWN: I hope you are right. Is there anything you have heard about this so far, whether that they describe him as a CIA agent or the list of demands or anything else that makes you especially nervous for his safety right now?
ANDERSON: Well, I'm very nervous for his safety. It's a dangerous situation. People who are willing to kidnap are dangerous people. We have to believe that they are capable of carrying out the threats that make or they imply. Daniel knew that.
Being a foreign correspondent in a war-torn country is a dangerous job. It's a difficult job. It's a dangerous job. He is an intelligent man. He is an experienced correspondent. He is not there because it's thrilling. He is there because he thinks it's important and I'm sure he weighed the risks as he did every day as every correspondent does. You weigh the risks of what you are doing against what you hope to gain. He took a risk. And unfortunately, it didn't work out the way he wanted.
But he did it not -- he did it not because he wanted some kind of thrill. He did it because it's important. It's a really important job.
BROWN: Half a minute, Terry. Is there much the U.S. government can do here?
ANDERSON: No. The U.S. government will not negotiate with these people and I have to say I don't believe they should. This is not a matter of negotiations. It is a matter of communications. We have to talk to them. We don't have enough information about who they are or what they exactly they want. We have to be able to talk to them. And I hope that they are willing to set up a contact where that can happen. But there is not going to be any negotiation. There is not going to be anything that we can give them to gain Daniel's release. What we have to do is convince them that they've made a mistake, they got the wrong guy. It's not going to serve their purposes. The best thing you can do now is let him go.
BROWN: Terry, thanks. It's nice to talk to you again. Terry Anderson joining us from the Virgin Islands tonight on the Daniel Pearl situation in Pakistan. Thank you.
Ahead on NEWSNIGHT tonight, a tale of survival. Two different ones, in fact, though they involve the same man. This is NEWSNIGHT from Washington.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: It's easy to dismiss each suicide bombing, each terrorist attack in Israel as just more of the same without looking at the details, but when you look at the details you find stories. Yesterday's suicide bombing in Israel had a few unexpected elements to it; one is that police think it may have been carried out by a Palestinian woman, another is that one of the survivors of yesterday's attack faced terror just four months before on the 38 floor of tower two.
This story is from CNN's Mike Hanna.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MIKE HANNA, CNN JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF (voice-over): Shocked and dazed, but hanging on to his camera, American Mark Sokolow was one of the many injured in Israel's latest terror bomb attack.
MARK SOKOLOW, BOMB ATTACK SURVIVOR: I felt and heard the whoosh of the blast, and the first thing on my mind was to find my wife and daughters.
HANNA: His wife and two daughters were also injured in the blast detonated, police believe, by a Palestinian woman. She died, along with an 81-year-old Israeli bystander. More than 100 people were injured.
SOKOLOW: Right now, I feel very lucky that my injuries were for the most part superficial, and my children and my wife, a little bit more serious with her leg, and she'll be okay. And so, I feel very fortunate that someone, God, is looking over us, to make sure that we're okay.
HANNA: Despite the experience, Mark Sokolow has no regrets about bringing his family to Israel for a holiday.
SOKOLOW: I think it's critical now that Jews from all over, American Jews and Jews from all over the world, to show their support of Israel, come to Israel, visit Israel. We spent nine days of touring in different areas, and you can't let events like this deter people from coming to our land. HANNA: Remarkably, this is the second terror attack that the 43- year-old lawyer from Woodmere, New York, has survived. On September the 11th last year, Mark Sokolow escaped from the World Trade Center before the twin towers collapsed.
SOKOLOW: In retrospect, I was a lot luckier then than we were now. On the other hand -- I am also very lucky to have gone through this, and everyone is safe.
HANNA: Mike Hanna, CNN, Jerusalem.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Coming up next on NEWSNIGHT, back here in Washington, an insider's take on tomorrow night's speech and other things about Washington. Lloyd Grove, of "Reliable Source: The Buzz" at the "Washington post" joins us when NEWSNIGHT continues.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Let's be honest, we all have some guilty pleasure reading. Sometimes you need a break from the really fine print in foreign affairs or the "Economist." You read those, don't you? When the "Washington Post" arrives each day we skim the front page and set it aside and go straight to the style section, open the page, and check out "Reliable Source," the Capitol's version of a gossip column.
It is written each day by Lloyd Grove, who, ten years ago, promised to write a piece on a program we were doing, only to conclude, as so many others have, we weren't that interesting. Mr. Grove joins us now. It's nice to see you.
LLOYD GROVE, "WASHINGTON POST": It's nice to see you. And that's not true. You were just too big a subject at time.
BROWN: Thank you now you are out of it. Bush is more interesting, less interesting for a gossip columnist than the Clintons?
GROVE: Bush is torture for a gossip columnist. When you consider Monica Lewinsky versus a killer pretzel, the killer pretzel is a one-day story. It's like getting blood out of a pretzel, basically.
BROWN: It's never just a the president, it's the whole administration, the people around him. Are they all pretty buttoned down, not out there making the kind of trouble you need to make a living with?
GROVE: I'm afraid, a lot of the Clinton people were larger than life and the Bush people seem to be normal everyday people who just happen to be serving in high positions in government. And there is not a lot of eccentricity there, I have to say.
BROWN: I'm sure they are pleased to hear that. Do people want to be in the column or not want to be in the column, or both? GROVE: I think people are conflicted, many of them. I think -- I got a lot of calls every day from people who are touting some project of theirs or just want to see their name in the paper. But other people, frankly, are legitimately wary of being in the column because they know it's a risk because I might write something they don't like.
BROWN: No, you wouldn't do that. You know the Ashcroft story that is making the rounds about the statue?
GROVE: Well, indeed, that is the lead story of tomorrow's Reliable Source column.
BROWN: There you are. This is a great story.
GROVE: Basically, behind John Ashcroft, when he making his terrorism alert was this huge statue of a bare naked lady. This was annoying him, because, reportedly, because he didn't want this bare breast in back of him, and so they got a huge blue curtain that is more television friendly and is not distracting.
BROWN: That statue has been there for like 70 years, so it's not like it came in with the Clintons.
GROVE: It was commissioned in 1933 and was considered quite an important piece of Art Deco art in the Justice Department.
BROWN: And after all these months, that's pretty good scoop to have I guess, something going on.
GROVE: That's right. There is that. We have had, in recent weeks, the John Dingell episode...
BROWN: At the airport?
GROVE: At the airport, this very important Congressman who had to drop his trousers to go through airport security. We have had a little Monica buzz. Monica is always good for an item.
She had to ask for an extension because she is do darn busy with all her parties and documentaries about her life and she had to ask for an extension to file her response to the last independent council's report.
BROWN: When you are busy, you are busy.
What do you write on your income tax where it says, "occupation?" Do you write "gossip columnist?"
GROVE: No, I write journalist...
BROWN: Journalist, OK.
GROVE: ... and Tupperware salesmen. Wherever I have been making income. BROWN: Is it fun? It can be fun. It has it's day's where it is tremendous fun. I remember one day where I asked Al Gore -- had an interview with Al Gore about his hair, at the same time and had an interview with Jay Leno about why he hated Alan Keyes's press secretary.
But those days are few and far between.
BROWN: Do you have a network of people who are calling you all the time and saying Senator so and so was here and he was drooling, or whatever?
GROVE: Not enough. And I try and stay away from drooling senators.
BROWN: At some point it's not news.
GROVE: Exactly.
BROWN: Go ahead.
GROVE: I'm just saying that I would like to use this opportunity to get more people to call me, not only in Washington but around the country. I'm interested in hearing their dish.
BROWN: And the phone number would be?
GROVE: (202) 334-7556.
BROWN: You may live to regret that.
GROVE: I think I already do.
BROWN: It's nice to see you, Lloyd Grove. Who writes -- are you uncomfortable with the term gossip columnist?
GROVE: Not at all. It is a proud profession.
BROWN: "Washington Post." It's an interesting society town Washington, and it's an interesting job to have. Thank you.
Coming up next on NEWSNIGHT, Segment 7. One woman honors the memory of her brother by reaching out to the people of Afghanistan. It's our wrapup story tonight from Washington.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Finally from us, tonight, the story of a woman who lost a brother in the World Trade Center, one of those supposedly ordinary people who became a hero that morning. His sister's way of grieving or perhaps celebrating his life was to reach out to some other victims, innocent victims of September 11, ordinary Afghans. Here is Maria Hinojosa.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARIA HINOJOSA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): So many of us were moved by the incredible story of Abraham Zelmanowitz (ph).
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Inside the World Trade Center one man who could have saved himself stayed until the end at the side of his quadriplegic friend.
HINOJOSA: The man at the World Trade Center who didn't have to die.
And this is Abraham's 70-year-old sister Rita, who now has a moving story of her own. About how the pain of losing her hero brother took her to Afghanistan to meet with people she says are just like her, victims of this so-called collateral damage of war and terrorism.
A boy in shock who now acts like a baby since the bombs fell.
A woman who lost eight members of her family, Rita, now strong enough to give comfort herself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have to go home kicking and screaming and just shouting from every rooftop.
HINOJOSA: She returned to New York and immediately began demanding Americans aid these other victims, the same way they helped her.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm going to focus on how I was treated after my brother died, as opposed to how the people in Afghanistan are treated.
HINOJOSA: Her Afghan memories push her forward on this quest.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This man looks profoundly sad.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not only did he lose his leg, but he lost several members of his family in the U.S. bombing.
HINOJOSA: Their is a sadness in their eyes, she says, she will never forget, the size of a bomb crater stuck in her psyche forever.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I saw two bomb craters. The one would have been big enough to shock anybody next to one that was four times its size.
HINOJOSA: Months ago, burkahs made Rita, a lifelong feminist, angry. Now she has one of her own.
(on camera): When you put this on for the first time...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I understood immediately why they wear it.
HINOJOSA: Because?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because you feel safe.
HINOJOSA (voice-over): Nor could she believe that a country so distant, could offer such solace.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Abe's death and their deaths are parallel and related so that they are more family to me than people here because we share this thing.
HINOJOSA: But first there is money to raise to the Afghan victims.
Her new calling, from mourning to movement.
(on camera): Is there a part of you that feels more confused by your trip to Afghanistan? More kind of (UNINTELLIGIBLE)?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, I'm more focused. I found the answer to what a country looks like when it has been at war for 23 years and the last part of the war is done in my brother's name, and I found a mission. So that's not confused, that's focused.
HINOJOSA: Focused on the sadness that draws us all together.
Maria Hinojosa, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: There's our report for tonight. Our coverage of the president's State of the Union Speech begins tomorrow night at 8:00 Eastern. We hope you will join us. Good night from all of us at NEWSNIGHT.
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