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CNN Newsnight Aaron Brown

Florida Paper Finds Missing Kids; Hatfill Rebuffs Anthrax Allegations

Aired August 12, 2002 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening again, I'm Aaron Brown. We've been thinking about missing kids today. And it some of those people who's devotion the job helped figure out what happened to some of them. Our heroes in this did not hold a press conference today. They didn't show up on "LARRY KING" tonight. They don't have a badge or a gun or anything like that. What they do have is a byline, and an instinct to fight right where they can find wrong and root it out.
Their names are Sally Kestin, Diana Marrero and Megan O'Matz. We'll talk with Megan a little bit later in the program. They are reporters for the "South Florida Sun-Sentinel," and their headline yesterday was sad and devastating at the same time.

The headline read "Lost Kids Easily Found."

There are more than 500 kids that the State of Florida cannot find, lost within the child welfare system, thought to be either runaways from foster homes or kids who were kidnapped by relatives who do not have legal custody.

These three reporters tracked down nine of them with some simple, good old fashioned leg work. Two kids were found in less than three hours.

We are in a perfect business, journalists are, a point we've not been afraid - or unwilling to make on this program from time to time. But when we are good, we can be very good indeed, and the work of these reporters is a shining example of that.

It is an example of something else, as well. Reporters are no smarter, no more enterprising than anyone else. The fact that these reporters and their paper so easily found these kids when the State of Florida did not, suggests something you'd rather not think about in Florida or anywhere else tonight.

The state may say it cares, and we assume many people in Florida do. But pretty clearly, the state does not care enough, or we'd be reporting on the state's success, and not the paper's.

If this doesn't make you angry, we don't know what will, but perhaps this might. Rilya Wilson, the missing five-year-old, whose neglect by the state and her caregiver first revealed the Florida mess, was not among the children found.

On to the day's news and the whip we go. The anthrax investigation begins the program tonight. Jeanne Meserve is on that for us. Jeanne, a headline from you, please.

JEANNE MESERVE, CNNfn CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, a mailbox tests positive for anthrax. Could it eventually lead investigators to the individual or individuals responsible for the attacks that killed five last October - Aaron.

BROWN: Jeanne, thank you. Back with you in a moment.

Baseball up next, the possibility of a strike. Josie Karp is in Chicago for us tonight. Josie, first time in the whip. Welcome, and a headline, please.

JOSIE KARP, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, for the second time in five weeks, baseball players did meet here and decided not to set a strike date. But there is still pressure on both sides to come to a work agreement soon, because another deadline now looms at the end of the week - Aaron.

BROWN: Thank you very much. Back to you, too, in a bit.

Florida next. And as we mentioned, the latest black eye to the state's child welfare system. As she has been doing for months, now, Susan Candiotti is working the story for us. Susan, your headline tonight.

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Aaron. Yes, you teased us at the top of the show. Reporters without subpoenas, but armed with a lot of common sense, set out to see whether they could track down some of Florida's hundreds of missing children in the state's care.

Turns out they could, leaving Florida officials a little red in the face.

BROWN: Again, Susan, thank you very much.

And, what some celebrities are saying and selling at the same time. This story from Garrick Utley tonight. So, Garrick, a headline, please.

GARRICK UTLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Aaron, it's a story about hidden advertising, if you will. We know all the celebrities who appear on television talk shows to talk about their illnesses and about how others who have that affliction can seek help from drug companies or medical companies.

What they're not telling you or us, viewers in general, is that many of them are being paid to do it. We'll see and find out how it works - Aaron.

BROWN: Oh, you're going to turn me into a cynic yet. Back with all of you shortly.

Also coming up on the program as we start another week, an insider trading scandal surrounding ImClone. Sam Waksal, the former CEO and friend of Martha Stewart, today said he didn't do anything wrong.

We'll talk with someone who went to jail for insider trading, former "Wall Street Journal" reporter Foster Winans on the program.

Perilous times for a relationship that's always been a tricky one between the United States and Saudi Arabia. We'll talk with Adel Al- Jubeir, the foreign policy advisor to the Saudi Crown Prince, as well.

So we have a lot to do in the hour ahead. We begin with the anthrax investigation.

Investigators have a found a clue, one of those clues that may lead to others, which may lead to an arrest, which someday may lead to a conviction - maybe.

Tonight, it's just a clue. A mailbox in Princeton, New Jersey tested just days ago has shown signs of anthrax. So is that where the letters were mailed from? And were any of the potential suspects nearby back last fall?

The story tonight from CNN's Jeanne Meserve.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE (voice-over): In an effort to determine where the anthrax letters were mailed, 600 samples were pulled from mailboxes in New Jersey. One from a mailbox that stood on this block in Princeton could give investigators a new lead.

UNIDENTIFIED U.S. POSTAL INSPECTION SERVICE SPOKESMAN: Environmental laboratories tested one sample out of the 600 samples positive for anthrax on the evening of August 8th, 2002.

MESERVE: A U.S. postal inspection service spokesman says, because preliminary tests are not reliable, the mailbox is undergoing further testing at the Army's Aberdeen Proving Ground.

The four anthrax letters all had Trenton, New Jersey postmarks, and are believed to have gone through and contaminated a processing facility in Hamilton, New Jersey.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mailboxes reported part of the inflow to the Hamilton postal facility, not part of the outflow. Its contents, therefore, would not have been contaminated by the high-speed mail sorting equipment that was believed to be the primary cause of the release of the anthrax spores that contaminated the Hamilton facility.

MESERVE: Scientists working with the FBI are doing genetic testing and fingerprinting, to try to find other clues about the anthrax and where it came from, mindful, experts say, of the looking one year anniversary of the attacks.

ARMANDO LARA, FORMER FBI AGENT: There's a lot of pressure both externally and internally to solve this case, to indict, to prosecute and successfully convict the person or persons responsible for this anthrax.

MESERVE: Dr. Steven Hatfill, a former U.S. Army scientist and bioweapons expert, says that pressure has made him the fall guy for the FBI.

STEVEN HATFILL, FORMER U.S. ARMY SCIENTIST: I have had nothing to do in any way, shape or form with the mailing of these anthrax letters. And it is extremely wrong for anyone to contend or suggest that I have.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MESERVE: Government sources say Hatfill is one of about 20 people being looked at in connection with the anthrax probe. They deny that the FBI is working under any artificial deadline and say arrests are imminent - Aaron.

BROWN: Well, since Dr. Hatfill's name came out a couple of weeks ago, is he any more or less a possible or potential person of interest than he was then?

MESERVE: He is still a person of interest, one of about 20, as I mentioned. He has not been classified as a suspect. No one at the FBI is making any public comment about this case at all - Aaron.

BROWN: And then, back to the mailbox and the anthrax. Presumably, if it is the anthrax that was used in the attacks, back last fall, it's been sitting there for a long time. I gather it does not lose its potency, or at least not quickly.

MESERVE: Apparently not. One interesting facet of this is that these mailboxes, many of them were swabbed shortly after the New Jersey connection was found to the anthrax attacks.

But authorities belatedly found out that they weren't swabbing the right part of the mailbox, where a letter is likely to have come in contact and left a trace of the anthrax. And so they've had to go back, re-swab them, do the retesting.

And by the way, they're not done. They still have about 50 mailboxes they have to take a look at.

BROWN: And so that's why on August 8th, I think the date was, we're just getting the results on a test of a mailbox in Princeton, New Jersey.

MESERVE: That's (ph) right (ph).

BROWN: Jeanne, thank you. Jeanne Meserve.

One more quick point on this. Dr. Hatfill had a lot to say when he talked to reporters yesterday. He was not happy, obviously, with how he's been treated in the press. And what he had to say for purposes of fairness, if nothing less, deserves more than a quick sound bite. So we'll listen to a large portion of his statement, about 30 minutes from now here on NEWSNIGHT. We want to deal with some of the other news of the day first. And an insider trading case is next.

ImClone's former CEO, Sam Waksal, and his good friend Martha Stewart at the center of this. Dr. Waksal today pleaded not guilty to insider trading, and Miss Stewart is facing a subpoena threat from the Congress.

Some defenders have pointed out that in terms of business shenanigans, there are much bigger fish to fry out there than Martha Stewart. But this story does go to the heart of the corporate controversies we've seen over the past few months.

Do the rich and powerful live by a different set of rules?

We can't answer that in terms of ImClone yet, but investigators seem determined to find out. Here's CNN's Allan Chernoff.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALLAN CHERNOFF, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sam Waksal was known as a self-promoter when he was CEO of ImClone Systems. On the day he plead not guilty to insider trading and bank fraud charges, Waksal again promoted his cause.

SAMUEL WAKSAL, FORMER CEO, IMCLONE SYSTEMS: First I believe the drug Erbitux, which I have worked to bring to the public for over 10 years, has the potential to help millions of cancer patients.

My attorneys and I look forward to addressing these charges in the appropriate forum - the courts.

CHERNOFF: As Waksal prepares his defense, the House Energy and Commerce Committee is threatening to subpoena his friend, Martha Stewart, suspecting she's misled them about her sale of ImClone stock last December 27 - the day before ImClone revealed the Food and Drug Administration had rejected its cancer drug.

Martha said she and her broker had agreed to sell if the stock dropped below $60, that she had no inside information.

But records obtained by Congress raise questions about her explanation. Phone logs show her broker, Peter Bacanovic, who also serves the Waksal family, repeatedly trying to reach her the morning of December 27th - before the stock fell under $60.

And e-mail between the broker and his assistant before Martha's sale has investigators wondering if the two had advance word of the drug rejection.

"Has news come out yet? Let me know." Fax, Pete. The response from assistant Doug Faneuil, "Nothing yet. I'll let you know. No call from Martha, either."

Merrill Lynch told Congress the two were put on leave because their stories about the Stewart sale conflicted. Congressman James Greenwood says he has grave suspicions about Martha's story.

REP. JAMES GREENWOOD (R), PENNSYLVANIA: We want information about her phone call records, her e-mail records, and then we want that by the 20th of August.

If she provides that information to us voluntarily, we will review it. If she does not provide the information to us voluntarily, then we will subpoena that information.

Then we'll make a decision as to whether we need to call her forward under subpoena, and we may have to do that.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHERNOFF: Stewart's lawyers today told investigators they will comply. And tonight, more trouble for Martha. The "Financial Times," quoting unnamed sources, is reporting that Martha's broker claims his assistant told Martha about insider sales of ImClone stock.

Broker Peter Bacanovic, according to the "FT," claims he was unaware his assistant was sharing the information. The assistant, Doug Faneuil, believed to be cooperating with prosecutors, claims he was acting under orders from Mr. Bacanovic, according to the "Financial Times" - Aaron.

BROWN: It's a little hard to know where to go with this.

But, if what Ms. Stewart knew was that the Waksals were selling, the family is selling, which is one of the e-mails, does that necessarily constitute insider trading?

CHERNOFF: It is non-public information. And in this case, it would be ...

BROWN: Well, but the question is - yes, it is non-public, but is it material?

CHERNOFF: Well, if it's ...

BROWN: I don't know.

CHERNOFF: ... his (ph) daughter (ph), if it's Sam Waksal trying to selling, or if it's the daughter, Aliza Waksal, actually selling all of her stock, it could be considered to be material, non-public information.

BROWN: That's why I'm not a lawyer. Thank you.

Coming up on NEWSNIGHT, an insider's view of insider trading. Can't get more insider than this, in fact. A former "Wall Street Journal" reporter, Foster Winans joins us. He went to jail for his part in a Wall Street scandal. We'll talk more about that a little bit later in the hour.

On to Major League Baseball and the question of a strike. Tonight the facts of tonight's story. The facts of tonight's story are easier to explain and understand than the meaning - and perhaps that sentence, too.

The Players Association, the most powerful and successful union in the country today, decided not to set a strike date. That's the fact.

It is a fact the negotiations will continue tomorrow. It is also a fact that these talks have been making some progress in mood less poisonous than is the custom.

Oh, one more fact. The players and the owners have never reached a deal without a work stoppage. Don't you just hate the facts?

Here again is CNN's Josie Karp.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARP (voice-over): Major League Baseball players left a four- hour union meeting in Chicago with their main weapon in contract negotiations unused but at the ready. No strike date was set. A conference call of executive board members is scheduled for Friday, and the issue could be revisited then.

TOM GLAVINE, NATIONAL LEAGUE PLAYER REPRESENTATIVE: I don't think anybody will argue that setting a strike date will throw a wrench into the whole process.

I think we all understand what happens if a date is set, the rhetoric that starts with that.

MIKE REMLINGER, BRAVES RELIEF PITCHER: At this point in the negotiations, I don't feel that that's something that's going to help. When you're as close to maybe having a deal that we are, why not give it a few more days and just let the process continue unhindered with any strike dates, lockout dates, without anything, and just let them get back to New York, get back to work, and hopefully we can get a deal.

KARP: Behind closed doors, players who worried not setting a date would be interpreted as a sign of weakness, had to be convinced the caution was necessary.

Now owners and players enter a critical three-day period, with the core economic issues still unresolved. The two sides haven't come to terms on how much revenue will be shared, how they'll split the money, and whether there will be a tax on the payrolls of the teams spending the most.

DONALD FEHR, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL PLAYERS ASSOCIATION: We are hopeful that over the next several days, we'll be able to work through those issues and be done with the business of negotiating for this bargaining round.

(END VIDEOTAPE) KARP: Coincidentally, today marks the eighth anniversary of the start of the last strike back in 1994, so it's hard not to kind of compare then and now.

And what most people will tell you who have been involved in both negotiations, is the fact that it's much different now because of the tone of the negotiations. There's a lot less anger, a lot less rancor.

And you saw an example of it this morning. Donald Fehr said that he actually spoke on the phone to baseball commissioner Bud Selig before his meeting began in Chicago.

That type of communication on that level is something that wouldn't have happened back in 1994. It is the source of optimism. But optimism, as you know, Aaron, can change very quickly when you get back to the bargaining table. And that is going to happen tomorrow morning.

BROWN: They worked over the weekend and say almost nothing about what they accomplished or didn't. They go back at it tomorrow.

Beyond a less poisonous atmosphere, where - what is the pressure here to do a deal? What is the pressure on each side now to do a deal?

KARP: Well, I think the fact that they didn't set this strike date, it doesn't alleviate the fact that there is still the possibility that they could. And both sides say that they remember how damaging everything was back in 1994.

They say that they remember the fact that attendance was down 30 percent when they did come back.

And the other thing that players and the owners have also said is they understand the climate of this country is different because of September 11th, and they're going to do everything they can to contribute to the well-being of the United States, and to -- not to detract from what this country is trying to do.

BROWN: Josie, thank you. Josie Karp in Chicago tonight on the baseball story. I suspect we'll be seeing you again soon.

Later in the program, missing children in California. How hard is it -- how hard, rather, is the state really trying to find them?

That and much more as NEWSNIGHT continues from New York.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: The war on terror now. Tonight 16 more al Qaeda fighters are in custody, that we know of at least.

Authorities in Iran picked them up. They fled to Iran from Afghanistan. The Iranians turned them over to the Saudis, and the Saudis have them now. The Saudi government revealed the existence of these prisoners yesterday. They are presently being interrogated. And according to the Saudi government, anything learned will be passed on to the United States.

What's less clear at this point is what access U.S. investigators will have to the men, or whether eventually they could face trial to the United States, whether they'll be extradited here.

That's among the things we can talk with -- talk to about with -- man, it's Monday.

Adel Al-Jubeir is the foreign policy advisor to Saudi Arabia's Crown Prince. And no matter how you introduce him, we are very pleased to him on the program.

Thank you.

ADEL AL-JUBEIR, FOREIGN POLICY ADVISOR TO SAUDI CROWN PRINCE ABDULLAH: Thank you.

BROWN: Why not turn these 16 over to the United States? Clearly, the United States government wants them. And they can do a pretty good job of interrogating them, I would think.

AL-JUBEIR: Well, Aaron, to begin with, these are Saudi citizens that were handed over to us by Iran. We believe that they are part of the Al Qaeda, but we're not sure, so we have to establish that fact.

They were part of a group of a larger number of people from various Arab countries that the Iranians handed over to those countries. If they committed a crime, they will be put on trial, and they will be punished very severely for it.

I do not believe that there has been a request by the U.S. government for extradition, because we frankly don't know who these people are and how involved they are with this effort.

Everything ...

BROWN: Are they suspected of a crime in Saudi Arabia?

AL-JUBEIR: Well, if they have been - if they are evildoers, and they are part of Al Qaeda, and they were responsible for the killing of people, if they had anything to do with September 11, then, yes, that would be a very great crime.

BROWN: As you know, as you know probably better than almost anyone on the planet these days, lately in the United States there's been a lot of criticism about the - directed towards the Saudi government, and a lot of questions raised about the relationship.

And the arguments very briefly go that the Saud - it's sort of like a bad marriage, that the Saudi citizens, not the government, fund terrorism in some way, shape or form, that they support the most difficult elements, the most radical elements in the Middle East, in some way, shape or form, and that in fact, they're really not a very good friend of the United States.

I assume you think otherwise.

AL-JUBEIR: Oh, we absolutely think otherwise, because we know otherwise, as does your government.

The charges against Saudi Arabia come from a very small number of people. They keep repeating themselves, and people assume that by repeating them often enough, they will become fact.

That's not the case.

Saudi Arabia has been a longstanding friend and ally of the United States for over 60 years. We share many common objectives, and we have shared many common objectives.

We have gone through many enterprises together. We have fought many battles together, and we expect to do so going forward.

BROWN: But one battle, apparently, you don't want to be much part of is, if there is a war against Iraq, the government said last week there'd be no American bases there.

I mean, were willing to base Americans there 10 years ago in preparation for the first Gulf War. Why not now?

AL-JUBEIR: Because, Aaron, this whole debate about Iraq has been overblown and vastly exaggerated. The rhetoric is way ahead of where the policy actually is.

President Bush was very clear about being deliberate, about consulting with Congress, about consulting with allies, about looking at all the options, about looking at all the positives and the negatives before making a decision. And frankly, I don't - we don't believe the decision has been made.

Now, with regard to your question on Iraq, we share the objective of the United States that Saddam Hussein has to be brought into compliance with the U.N. resolutions. We share the objective that Saddam Hussein has to give up his weapons of mass destruction program.

We believe that he is dragging his feet. We believe the inspectors must be allowed to return into Iraq and have unfettered access.

What we are merely saying, which is no different from what almost every other country in the world is saying, is that there's a process we go through. We have to let diplomacy work.

It appears that there is progress being made in the negotiations between the U.N. and the Iraqis. Let's pursue it. Let's not rush into something that would have catastrophic consequences in terms of financial costs and the lives of many young Americans in uniform.

BROWN: Mr. Al-Jubeir, it's always good to talk to you. It's been too long. We hope we'll see you again soon. Thank you.

AL-JUBEIR: Thank you.

BROWN: Thank you, sir.

A quick look at a number of items making world - making news around the world today.

Flooding today in Prague. But it could have been any place, honestly, in Central Europe. There is rain and flooding all across the continent. Seven died in the Czech Republic. At least 74 dead throughout Europe.

Officials have ordered the evacuation of about 35,000 people in Prague. Bridges swept away in Austria. Landslides in Switzerland.

In Russia, 4,000 tourists are still trapped by rising waters in a village along the Black Sea.

And we're in the middle of a drought.

On to Africa. A standoff continuing between Zimbabwe's president and several thousand white farmers there. Today, President Mugabe said there would be no reprieve. White farmers have to give up their land or face criminal charges.

And the U.N. study out today says the smog in South Asia may be bad enough to change the weather. This, by the way, is Kuala Lumpur in Malaysia.

The problems stems from all the industrial growth in the region. Smog leading to monsoon rain in places, drought in others, and making a lot of people sick all over.

Coming up on NEWSNIGHT, we'll get an insider's view of insider trading. And next, newspaper reporters who found some of the Florida missing children. Why didn't the state?

This is NEWSNIGHT from New York on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: When the Rilya Wilson case began making news in the spring, it seemed to us to be one of those stories that was so outrageous, the reason the word bureaucrat is often said with a sneer, and example of why people don't trust government, that it would force immediate change.

We really believe that while a broken system can't be fixed overnight, the State of Florida would at the very least do everything in its considerable power to find every child lost in the city - in the state's child welfare system.

And Florida could have. That is clear tonight based, as we said earlier, on the work of a South Florida newspaper, and three very enterprising reporters.

Some background first from CNN's Susan Candiotti.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, again, under the heading ...

CANDIOTTI (voice-over): Embarrassed Florida officials, including Governor Jeb Bush, had to admit yet another glaring failure of its embattled child welfare agency.

GOV. JEB BUSH, (R), FLORIDA: It is not acceptable to have kids that have been absconded, in some cases, allegedly for more than a year, be found by a newspaper.

CANDIOTTI: Five-year-old Rilya Wilson is still missing, but reporters at the "Sun-Sentinel" newspaper set out to see whether it could find 24 of Florida's other 500-plus children in the state's care, listed as unaccounted for.

A banner headline shouts the news - "Lost Kids Easily Found." How did they do it? Shoe leather.

SALLY KESTIN, REPORTER, "SOUTH FLORIDA SUN-SENTINEL": We don't have subpoena powers. We don't have many of the tools available to law enforcement. And yet we were able to just go knock on doors and use public records and talk to relatives and neighbors. And we tracked them down relatively easy.

CANDIOTTI: In the case of Richard DeLeon (ph), the paper says Florida records had him listed as missing since 1994, eight years ago. Reporters tracked him and his mother to the Dominican Republic.

KESTIN: The child who was missing for eight years we found by talking to two relatives and a friend, and calling directory assistance. And we found that child in a little more than a day.

CANDIOTTI: Child advocates shaking their heads.

KAREN GIEVERS, CHILD ADVOCATE ATTORNEY: The management have not pointed out they need to use their brains and common sense, and such things as telephone directories.

CANDIOTTI: But while the Governor endorsed the reporters' work, he criticized the paper for not turning over all its information to the Department of Children and Families.

BUSH: If children are imperiled, they have a duty to provide the information. We've asked for it, and I hope that they'll give it up.

(END VIDEO)

CANDIOTTI: Well, the paper did share some specific information about specific questions that the Governor had, while insisting that they have no indication that any of the children that it found are in any danger. And, Aaron, we might add that in this Florida child welfare agency, the DCF, there are about 700 job vacancies right now involving social workers. And, let's see, if there are more than 500 missing children, perhaps new hires could each be assigned one missing child file each - Aaron.

BROWN: Oh, my, that would be an easy solution, wouldn't it, Susan. Thank you. I betray my disgust here. Thank you. Not that you didn't know before, right?

Joining us now one of the reporters behind the work of the "South Florida Sun Sentinel," Megan O'Matz. She joins from us Fort Lauderdale, which is I gather where the paper is based, right? in Fort Lauderdale?

MEGAN O'MATZ, "SOUTH FLORIDA SUN-SENTINAL" REPORTER: That's right.

BROWN: Well, as I said to you off the air, congratulations. Nice piece of reporting. Where did you start? Do you remember the first call you made on this?

O'MATZ: We started with a list of missing children from the Florida Department of Law Enforcement's Web site and we looked at those children that were under the supervision of DCF care. And from those reports on the Web site we were able to determine detailed information about how long the children had been missing, what law enforcement department they had been reported to, even in some cases what the mother's name was of the child. And so from there we just started using basic reporting tools to find these children. As you mentioned before, one mother we found listed in the phone book in Wisconsin.

BROWN: Well, I can see why the state missed that one. Did you pick the easy ones? You didn't find 500. Did you just take the easy ones and cherry pick those?

O'MATZ: Well, we started out looking only at the 24 children that we were able to glean some basic information from: FDLE's Web site from Broward, Palm Beach and Miami-Dade County. And some might think these were easy cases but some weren't. I mean, clearly the child in the Dominican Republic was not easy to find, not even in our country any more.

BROWN: Give me a sense of what it was like in the - this is a little inside baseball, but when you found one, did the three of you give each other high-fives and go "bingo?"

O'MATZ: We did, yes. I mean, we were very pleased that we were able to find them and we were very pleased that nothing seemingly tragic had happened to these children, although, I mean, clearly it's the department's responsibility to find out what their circumstances are now. Some of the children we found were not in school for half the year. Some of the children there's a question about exactly who they are staying with. They moved from familiar to family or relatives. And how well they are being supervised, we found a family of four brothers that seemed to be hanging out a lot in the very rough neighborhood in Miami, pretty much unsupervised a lot of the time.

BROWN: Were these people, in the cases that you found, were they actively hiding or were they just kind of living their lives not really thinking one way or another about the state?

O'MATZ: No, they were just living their lives. Many of the mothers we interviewed said that they had no idea that DCF was still looking for them. It had been in many cases years ago that the child - children were listed as missing, and years before the department even managed or bothered to report them to police.

BROWN: Going back a second, some of these kids are living in circumstances that perhaps are not ideal. In any of the cases that you looked at were the children in any sort of physical peril as best you could tell?

O'MATZ: No. They were not. Although there are a pair of young girls living in Wisconsin who formerly were from Miami whose - there's evidence of some problems of domestic abuse in that home. The father had been arrested for throwing coffee at the mother and I think the mother had had some drunken driving arrests, including an arrest in which a child was in the car with the mother at the time. So clearly those are possible risk factors for the children, although an aunt and neighbor said that the children were doing fine.

BROWN: About 20 seconds. Do you think the state feels embarrassed by the work you and your colleagues did?

O'MATZ: I believe they are very embarrassed, yes.

BROWN: I believe they are too. Megan, congratulations again. Nice piece of work.

O'MATZ: Thank you, I appreciate it.

BROWN: Thank you.

Megan O'Matz, one of the three reporters from the "South Florida Sun-Sentinel" in Fort Lauderdale, who did what the state could not, found some missing children. Still to come on NEWSNIGHT, celebrity interviews with a hidden agenda. And up next, more from the scientist caught up in the anthrax investigation.

This is NEWSNIGHT on Monday from New York.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: More now on Dr. Steven Hatfill, the former government scientist who is now at the center of media attention in the anthrax investigation, which of course, is different from being at the center of the government's case. That we do not know. But we do know back on August 1 NEWSNIGHT ran a long piece on Mr. Hatfill's background and why investigators are looking so closely at him. We said then that we asked Dr. Hatfill for his comments. We'd ask directly and through his attorney. And our requests, number of them, were ignored, which of course is anyone's right. Now dr. Hatfill has decided to speak, a carefully worded statement, no questions allowed, delivered over the weekend. Here's an extended excerpt.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVEN HATFILL, SCIENTIST: My name is Steve Hatfill. I'm a medical doctor. And a biomedical scientist. I am a loyal American and I love my country. I have had nothing to do in any way shape or form with the mailing of these anthrax letters. And it is extremely wrong for anyone to contend or suggest that I have.

I have devoted much of my professional career to safeguarding men, women and children from the scourge of different types of disease, from leukemia to infectious disease. I am extremely proud of my service with the government and my efforts to help safeguard public health and protect our country against the scourge of offensive biological warfare.

I'm appalled at the terrible acts of biological terrorism that have caused death, disease and a havoc in this great country starting last fall. But I am just as appalled that my experience, knowledge, dedication and service relative to defending the United States against biological warfare has been turned against me in connection with the search for the anthrax killer.

As a scientist in the field of biological warfare defense, I have never had any reservations whatsoever about helping the anthrax investigation in any way that I could. It's true that my research expertise is in virology, for example the Ebola virus, Marburg (ph) virus and monkey pox, and not bacteriology as in the case of the anthrax organism. It's also true that I have never, ever worked with anthrax in my life. It's a separate field from the research I was performing at Fort Detrick.

But if I could be of assistance I was happy to help. This is the price I think that scientists in this field are happy to pay. And this price is more than offset by the satisfaction I think we all gain in doing work that we believe is important for the security of our country. All Americans value the freedom of speech and the freedom of the press. And I believe this is essential for our continued way of life.

If I am a subject of interest, I'm also a human being. I have a life. I have or I had a job. I need to earn a living. I have a family and until recently, I had a reputation, a career and a bright professional future. I acknowledge the right of the authorities and the press to satisfy themselves as to whether I am the anthrax mailer. This does not, however, give them the right to smear me and gratuitously make a wasteland of my life in the process.

I will not be railroaded. I am a loyal American. I am extremely proud of the work I have done for the United States and for my country and her people. I expect to be treated as such by the representatives of my government and those who report its work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Dr. Steven Hatfill and his side of the story.

A couple of items making news around the country, beginning with a terror alert out west involving the Golden Gate Bridge. We went through this once before last fall, didn't we? California state officials downgraded their alert level from super heightened to heightened. The state got an anonymous tip on Friday that a terrorist was planning to crash a U.S. military plane into the bridge. Federal officials decided the threat was not credible.

US Airways continued operating today. Yesterday it filed Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection. The carrier says its business was hurt badly by September 11. It hadn't been the strongest airline even before. It is the biggest airline serving Reagan National in Washington, D.C., and of course Reagan National was closed for weeks after the attack.

And baseball Hall-of-Famer Enos Slaughterer, better known as Enos "Country" Slaughter, has died. Mr. Slaughterer played in five World Series, spent the first 13 years of his career with the St. Louis Cardinals. He once said one of the great quotes in sports, "I learned early on never to walk while you are on the ballfield. I ran everywhere I went." Mr. Slaughter was 86 years old.

Ahead on NEWSNIGHT a little later, hidden agenda for some celebrity interviews. We'll tell you about that.

Up next an inside story on insider trading. This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.

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BROWN: Well, this might be a bit of a delicate dance for us, we want to get some perspective on the insider trading scandal involving ImClone and other companies now, some idea of the methods, the motivations, the consequences. And we think we have someone who's got all that covered, after all, he went to jail for his role in an insider trading case. Though the circumstances actually were quite a lot different, Foster Winans was a reporter for the "The Wall Street Journal" in the '80s who gave brokers advance information about his articles, and he joins us tonight. I guess not the greatest thing to be known for.

FOSTER WINANS, AUTHOR, "TRADING SECRETS, SEDUCTION AND SCANDAL AT 'THE WALL STREET JOURNAL'": No it's not. I'd like to think of myself as a writer as opposed to a convict but the two kind of go together.

BROWN: They did in your case. Do you ever look at this and go, well, another decade another scandal.

WINANS: Absolutely. Mark Twain said, history doesn't repeat itself it rhymes. And it sounds just like the '80s to me.

BROWN: And we think of the '80s in fact as quite different than we think of the '90s. But you draw some interesting parallels I think to the two decades.

WINANS: Well, you had a run-up in stock prices in the '80s. Nobody complains when stock prices are going up. And then when the crash comes and the bull dies and it starts to rot, then the flies come out. And that's what I think is going on right now. We had a huge run-up to 2000. Nobody was complaining when stocks were going up and insider trading was probably rampant at that time. And now that stocks have collapsed, the tide has gone out and the fish stink.

BROWN: Is it that - do you think it is that the people who do this, A, know they are doing wrong and, B, figure, hey, won't get caught? Is that how you looked at it?

WINANS: Well, in my case when you do, when you engage in behavior like this you don't think about getting caught, first of all. It's something that is just sort of way in the back of your mind. You don't think about the consequences. Insider trading is all over Wall Street every day all the time. It happens...

BROWN: It just depends whether it's legal or whether it's illegal or not.

WINANS: Exactly. Well, it's insider trading - illegal insider trading takes place on Wall Street all the time. It's just a few people get caught. Martha Stewart is a very hot catch and I think that that's why, and partly because apparently the Waksals were really very sloppy about the way they were doing it and she got caught. I think it's becoming sort of a celebrity-fest right now.

BROWN: Do you think we're going to see Ms. Stewart walking with a rain coat over her head and walking on the street in one of the perp walks?

WINANS: I don't think she's going to be arrested. If they subpoena had her before Congress, she will probably take the Fifth Amendment. But I think her goose is cooked. I think that she was a stock broker. She sits on the New York Stock Exchange board. And she is the CEO of a company that she herself took public. If she doesn't know what insider trading is, nobody does.

BROWN: Well, why then do you say she won't be arrested but her goose is cooked? What's the - are you making some distinction...

(CROSSTALK)

WINANS: The arrested is the handcuffs.

BROWN: I got it. So you don't think they're going to do a big public humiliation deal on her.

WINANS: I think that they are trying to do that in Congress.

BROWN: Do you have any feelings about why that is?

WINANS: Sure. She's a celebrity suspect and Congress and Jim Greenwood, who is the chairman of the committee, is running for re- election. And I think anybody who is in that position would love to have - it's a great opportunity to get out front.

BROWN: Go back to your case because it's what you know best, to be honest.

WINANS: One of the things.

BROWN: You were making pretty decent money at "The Journal." You weren't getting rich at "The Journal."

WINANS: Twenty-eight thousand dollars a year.

BROWN: Yes, well, it was 1984.

WINANS: Right.

BROWN: OK. That was when 28,000 was really money.

WINANS: Right. Exactly.

BROWN: Did you think, this is wrong?

WINANS: Absolutely. What I did was wrong. And I knew what I was doing was wrong.

BROWN: At the time you knew it was wrong.

WINANS: Yes, yes.

BROWN: Did it keep you up at night?

WINANS: Absolutely. It did. In fact by the time that the whole thing came out I had already sort of severed my contacts with him.

BROWN: Yes. And were you - did it become oddly addicting? At what point - at some point you said, this is wrong, but you kept doing it.

WINANS: Well, it wasn't so much - it kept me up at night, I was miserable about it. I was also not terribly happy about the newspaper schedule and the pressure and the pressure that he was putting on me. He was suicidal. There was a lot of crazy stuff going on.

BROWN: He the broker?

WINANS: Yes, I'm sorry. Peter Brandt (ph), who was the broker I was giving information to. The whole thing was sort of spinning out of control. And I had already accepted a position at Standard & Poor's when this all broke. So I was already leaving "The Journal" at that point.

BROWN: You were writing one of the most - at the time, one of the really prestige columns in "The Journal." You were a young guy. How old were you then?

WINANS: Thirty-four.

BROWN: As you look back on it now, do you think, what a dummy I was.