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CNN Newsnight Aaron Brown
Terror on Tape: al Qaeda Tapes Reveal Chemical Weapons Testing
Aired August 19, 2002 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening again everyone.
We have often used this page to explain why we've made the decisions we've made, on one occasion we used the page to explain why we regretted making a decision. It is part of the reason the page exists.
Tonight we need to talk about the tapes. Most of you have heard about them by now, many of you, if you keep the TV on CNN all day, have seen them. The rest of you can consider this fair warning.
The al Qaeda tapes are important. They are important because they tell us, they show us more than we've ever known before about the bin Laden operation and its ability wage a terror war. So in that regard, there isn't much debate, which brings us to tonight's excerpt: the use of poison gas or some sort of agent and the test run on dogs that al Qaeda operatives performed. It is horrible. It is horrible that they did it. It is horrible to watch. And I do not blame any of you for tuning away and tuning this out during that portion.
But briefly here's our reasoning. And it is brief. We felt it important to show not just that they were working on these sorts of weapons, but how far along they were, how cruel they could be. They are an enemy and we need to understand them, how they think, what they are capable of.
Could we have edited the tapes differently? Yes, absolutely, they would have been less sickening. But by sanitizing them they also would have had less impact, and the impact matters. And one more thing on this before we move on, and this may sound self serving, it is a risk we have to take. I know some you think we are running this stuff simply because we believe we will get good ratings. You are wrong. I find them so repulsive I rather suspect many of you will not watch them at all. So it can't be ratings. This was an issue debated long and hard by good and smart people. You may disagree with the decision made, but know, please, and believe it, it was not a decision made with ratings in mind, but with the best principles of journalism in mind.
Now we go on to "The Whip." And we begin "The Whip" with the tapes and the man who uncovered them. Nic Robertson joins us in Atlanta tonight.
Nic, the headline please.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, the tapes we'll see tonight show the testing of chemical agents on dogs, three different dogs. Those dogs will die, our analysts will tell us exactly what happened.
BROWN: Nic, thank you. Back to you shortly. Onto the Pentagon now, a possible covert operation against al Qaeda that was talked about within the Bush administration. Barbara Starr at the Pentagon working on that.
Barbara, a headline from you please.
BARBARA STARR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: President Bush once said he would go after the al Qaeda anywhere anytime. But tonight, word of an attack that may have been called off - Aaron.
BROWN: Barbara thank you. Onto the investigation into a missing child, another girl, this time in Virginia. Jeanne Meserve continues to work that story.
So Jeanne, a headline from you please.
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, we learned today that the phone line to the Short home had been cut, that Mary and Michael Short were shot by a .22 and that a .22 caliber weapon was found in the home. But are authorities any closer to finding Jennifer Short and solving the crime? apparently not - Aaron.
BROWN: Jeanne, thank you. Back with all of you shortly. As we said, we have an awful lot on the program tonight on the al Qaeda tapes. We're also pleased to say we have an expert eye to help us analyze them: Judith Miller, who's been covering terrorism for years for "The New York Times." And Judy will join us in a little while. And the two hottest words in the world of golf at least on this day are not Tiger Woods. The name to talk about tonight is Rich Beem who won the PGA yesterday. We'll talk with a reporter who's known him for a while before he was the PGA champ. Alan Shipnuck joins who may just be the second happiest man on the planet these days, Alan, and we'll explain why as the night goes on.
All of that in the hour ahead from Atlanta. But we begin at the Pentagon, and in the NEWSNIGHT tradition of putting the footnote first, we point out the only reason we're reporting on a U.S. covert operation is because we believe it has now been canceled. This network has not and will not report on anything that might jeopardize forces, either in the field, or about to be sent into the field. This seems to be our night for journalistic dilemmas, doesn't it? But we learned late today about planning of a covert operation against al Qaeda forces in a part of Iraq. That is the lead. We turn to CNN's Barbara Starr.
STARR: Aaron, CNN has been told by officials that no attack is imminent. But indeed in the last several weeks, top Bush administration officials have discussed whether or not to attack a suspected al Qaeda biological and chemical weapons facility in northern Iraq. This is an area of Iraq not under the control of Saddam Hussein. But again, one official going so far to tell us any plan for an attack has now been called off. The site has said to have been fairly primitive, an area, a place where chemicals and biological agents were tested against barnyard animals and possibly even an unsuspecting man in the area.
It is not clear that the U.S. military ever put forward a formal plan for the military and the CIA to attack this facility and destroy it. At best, being a primitive, facility, it's most likely any mission would have involved Special Forces going in on the ground quite covertly and destroying the facility on site.
It is said to be located in Kurdish-controlled northern Iraq, an area not under Saddam's control. He probably did not even know that this operation, this facility was in existence. Now in this part of northern Iraq, there are radical Kurdish groups, one of them is called Ansor el Islam (ph). They are said to shelter al Qaeda, which U.S. intelligence says has slipped across the border in recent weeks from Iran into Iraq. U.S. intelligence is quite clear in their minds that there are al Qaeda in this portion of Kurdish-controlled northern Iraq. And that's how they believe this facility has sprung up.
And senior administration officials today did confirm to John King, CNN senior White House correspondent, that President Bush had been briefed by his national security team in recent days on this facility, that there had been some discussions about what to do about it. But what's not clear is why it's all being called off - Aaron.
BROWN: I probably have two dozen questions in and about a half a minute to deal with them. Do we have any idea how many al Qaeda operatives were or are, I think this part is not quite clear, were or are in that area?
STARR: Well, it's described by intelligence officials as a relatively small number. And of course, it's a very fluid situation. It's believed these people come and go. They meld into the landscape. They certainly are getting some shelter from, as I say, these so- called radical Kurdish groups up in this region. But as far as anybody can determine, it's relatively small number at this point.
BROWN: OK. Barbara, I know that because we've been kicking this around for the last couple of hours, there is still reporting that needs to be done on this. And I know you're aggressively doing that. Why don't we let you go and if you come up with something before we leave here, put you back on. Thank you, Barbara Starr at the Pentagon.
On now to the al Qaeda tapes. We've said already this is not very easy to watch, especially not tonight's installment. We do think it's important to see. The tapes represent our first best look not at what al Qaeda can do, there's hardly an American who doesn't know that, but how al Qaeda works, how it sees itself.
In a bit, we will talk with correspondent Nic Robertson, whose sources led him to these tapes. Later we'll talk to Judith Miller about the impact of it all. But first the tapes themselves, chemical and biological weapons that al Qaeda has and has tested. And one more time, OK, this stuff is very difficult to watch. This is not hype, this is not a trick to get to you watch. This is tough stuff. Here's CNN's Nic Robertson.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Hardest to watch of all the tapes in what experts say is al Qaeda's video library, this one: apparent testing of a poison gas on dogs. Exactly who taped it and where may never be known. The dog tape, just one in a broad and deep range of carefully catalogued material contained in 64 tapes CNN obtained from a secret location in Afghanistan shortly after they had been dug up from a hiding place in the desert. We have shown the tapes to many experts, including Rohan Gunaratna, a leading al Qaeda analyst who in his consultation work for western governments has interviewed al Qaeda members and viewed more than 200 of the terror groups' previous tapes, but until now, none of these.
ROHAN GUNARATNA, AUTHOR, "INSIDE AL QAEDA": The collection has al Qaeda videos taken by al Qaeda of events. Whenever Osama bin Laden met with foreign journalists, he always had his own tape, his own cameraman. And, it is those tapes that are there, because that itself shows that this is the al Qaeda library, this is not the library of someone else, that this is the registry, the record room of Osama bin Laden.
ROBERTSON: Perhaps most revealing about Osama bin Laden, these never-before-seen pictures show in graphic detail the al Qaeda leader's personal security arrangements. All this material and much more discovered in an Afghan house said to have been used by the al Qaeda leader, a video archive spanning more than a decade, giving new insight to al Qaeda's planning, tactics and mindset.
GUNARATNA: Those videos are not for public consumption. They're only for the al Qaeda leadership, not even for their members. It is the al Qaeda memory. You have taken a part of the al Qaeda memory.
ROBERTSON: In the collection, a three-hour tape of how to make purified TNT from easy-to-get ingredients, sophistication in planning and explosives skills that scare government bomb experts, terrorists in training, not the made-for-camera al Qaeda promos we've seen before, but detailed demonstrations of how to kill, hijack and ambush.
Experts we have talked with say no terrorist organization has ever put this much expertise on videotape before, no terror organization has ever disseminated its knowledge this way.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Now you have some idea of why we believe they are what they say they are. And in a second we'll get in more to the chemical weapons testing which is quite difficult. Before we do that, let me turn quickly to Nic.
Nic, when you first saw these tapes, did you question their authenticity? I don't mean in a professional sense. Because we all do it in a professional sense. I mean in your gut, did you know, man, this is real?
ROBERTSON: I knew that this hadn't been seen before. And that gave me great cause for concern. And I knew professionally, as you say, that this is very, very important material. So yes, I did question it. You have to, but in my gut I thought I was seeing the real thing.
BROWN: And help us just briefly here set up the next piece of tape. This is - do we have any idea, for example, where these tests were conducted?
ROBERTSON: We believe that they were conducted in eastern Afghanistan, at the Darunta camp. This was a spread out camp not far from the eastern Afghan city of Jalalabad. It was a military camp but it was also the place where Abu Khebab (ph), who headed Osama bin Laden's chemical research program, that's where they were believe to be based.
BROWN: OK, we'll talk to Nic more in a moment. Here is part two of tonight's installment of the al Qaeda tapes.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ROBERTSON (voice-over): We begin with possibly the saddest and scariest tape of all, showing the death of three dogs. Calling out to each other to hurry, several individuals, wearing Afghan-style sandals, rush from the room. As they leave, a white liquid giving off a gas slowly seeps from the left, and we discover these men are executioners, and this is a death chamber. We never find out their identity, but they laugh as they leave the dog to his fate.
The video you are about to see is very disturbing, and is not suitable for children. Some adults, too, may want to turn away. Coalition intelligence sources who have examined this tape say this appears to be an al Qaeda lethal-weapons experiment at its remote Afghan Darunta camp. Those sources say no intelligence agency has seen this before, the experimentation by al Qaeda with poison gas.
Already, the dog reacts, licking his lips, a sign of increased salivation, a sign, say some of the experts we asked to examine the tapes, of a nerve agent. John Gilbert is a chemical weapons specialist who advises the U.S. government.
JOHN GILBERT, SCIENCE APPLICATIONS INT'L CORP.: Well, the first impression I had that it is, that it's a test or a demonstration of a very powerful and quick-acting chemical that behaves like a nerve agent, such as sarin, which was used in the Tokyo subway terrorist attacks in the 1990s.
ROBERTSON: Watching the tapes with Gilbert, David Kay, formerly a United Nation's weapons inspector in Iraq, for whom the tape raises the specter of weapons of mass destruction.
DAVID KAY, UNSCOM WEAPONS INSPECTOR: Well, it's a powerful segment of tape, first of all, and the emotional response to seeing it is there. Second one is horror. Here again is another group that has managed to open the door to serious WMD capability. I'm above a reasonable doubt convinced this is a nerve agent that they've developed, either improvised one or they may have actually developed actually sarin in some form to use. ROBERTSON: Al Qaeda documents examined by CNN last fall in the bombed out ruins of Darunta camp showed chemical formulas for sarin. Other documents connect al Qaeda's Darunta camp, a series of mud and stone buildings not unlike this room, to chemical testing.
KAY: You're looking at the classic symptoms that the dog demonstrates. For example, he loses certain muscle control, his eyes, as they react, the way his muscles react, and then the gradual loss of voluntary muscles and the final, the wracking, the loss of diaphragm, lung capacity, as he dies is the normal progression of a nerve agent.
ROBERTSON: We also asked chemical and bio-weapons specialist Jonathan Tucker, from the Monterey Institute, to examine the tape. He, too, says he is shocked by what he sees, but he cautions that for him the dog's symptoms indicate not a nerve agent, but a form of cyanide.
JONATHAN TUCKER, MONTEREY INSTITUTE OF INT'L STUDIES: We saw visible fumes from the material that you probably would not see from a nerve agent, but it is consistent with production of crude hydrogen cyanide gas, by mixing cyanide crystals in acid. We saw a flask that had some white material in it that is suggestive of powdered cyanide. And I think what we have here is a very crude binary weapon that terrorists could - would be attractive to terrorists because it is extremely low tech, and also very safe to use.
ROBERTSON: Dr. Frederick Sidell, another of the dozen experts consulted by CNN, says evaluation of the chemical is difficult.
DR FREDERICK SIDELL (RETIRED), U.S. ARMY INST. OF CHEMICAL DEFENSE: The most common chemical agent is something called mustard, which is a blister agent, and it's certainly not that. It could be a nerve agent, or cyanide, but they - characteristically, the effects come sooner, if this was vapor. Those dogs appear to be conscious until the end, which they aren't with nerve agents and cyanide. Those two don't cause selective paralysis of the hindquarters, as that agent did. So we could almost say it wasn't those, either. So, I don't know what it is.
ROBERTSON: On this tape, more experiments, and close-ups cataloging symptoms of death. The metal box's in the corner manufactured in the Afghan style give an additional indication the experiments took place inside Afghanistan. The implication of the rudimentary laboratory test is unmistakable for our experts.
GILBERT: The implication is that al Qaeda or another terrorist group could create a number of different ways of attacking people. You know, for example, in an enclosed area, such as an airport lobby, or in a theater, or a train, or a bus. Another is that it could be used against individuals selectively, who are targeted for assassination.
ROBERTSON (on camera): How significant do you think the discovery of this tape is?
GILBERT: I think it's probably extremely significant, if not profound. I know there's been a lot of speculation about the state of technology, and how far they may have advanced toward having a usable chemical weapon. The fact that they were able to repeat tests or demonstrations on this tape indicates that they clearly have a way to produce a predictably lethal chemical.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Until now, intelligence agencies have had only fragmentary information to help build their picture of al Qaeda's chemical threat. Satellite images of Darunta camp showed dead dogs, according to coalition intelligence sources. In the eleventh volume of al Qaeda's encyclopedia of Jihad, obtained by CNN, detailed timings of how long it takes to kill a rabbit with cyanide, and recent testimony in federal court about activities at the Darunta camp by Ahmed Ressam, a man trained by al Qaeda and who pled guilty in 2001 to attempting to bomb Los Angeles airport. This is an excerpt of that testimony.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You watched as your chief put a dog in a box, correct?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. We were all present there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Your chief put cyanide in a box, is that correct?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He added sulfuric acid to the cyanide, is that correct?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the dog shortly thereafter died from that experiment, correct?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Correct.
ROBERTSON: Al Qaeda expert Rohan Gunaratna interviewed an al Qaeda member who said he'd been involved in al Qaeda's chemical- weapons program.
(on camera): Do we know where they did that?
GUNARATNA: No, we do not know, but it was very likely that it was in the Darunta complex, or a safe house near that complex.
ROBERTSON (on camera): The tapes CNN obtained are disturbing, but at the same time they are hugely informative about al Qaeda's current threat. They add much detail, like the Egyptian accents of the men testing the chemicals on the dogs, in keeping with information that al Qaeda's chemical weapons chief Abu Khebab preferred to work with Egyptians. Still, the tapes hide as much as they reveal.
KAY: Only in one instance do you actually see the liquid, which appears to be either poured or pumped out, going out. You don't see it the rest of the time. So you really don't know like at what level they are, in terms of weaponizing it. There are a lot more questions this tape leaves than answers unfortunately. Well, the questions are really bad questions.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Questions, however, that if answered could help thwart the threat.
GILBERT: If the actual locations where those demonstrations were conducted could be found, there might be some residual material available that could be analyzed, and might show definitively which chemicals were used.
ROBERTSON: Among those who evaluate terrorist groups, the equation of threat equals ability times intent. What is clear is that the al Qaeda equation now totals much more than it did before.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BROWN: Well, you know, I don't know precisely to react. I've seen this stuff now a number of times over the last several days. And the truth is, it is no less sickening the tenth time than it was the first time. I can't imagine how you're reacting to it. When we come back we'll be joined by Judith Miller, a terrific reporter for "The New York Times" who has been writing about this murky world of biological and chemical weapons. We'll talk more with Nic. We have ways in terms to go on this. But in terms of the pictures, the worst are over, OK. This is NEWSNIGHT tonight from Atlanta.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: We want to put some perspective on the nine or 10 or 11 minutes we've been looking. You've already met correspondent Nic Robertson, who's with me here in Atlanta. Also please to welcome to the program again Judith Miller of "The New York Times." Ms. Miller's the author of "Germs" which is about to come out in paperback she just informed me. She is one of the truly great reporters on the subject of chemical and biological weapons and terrorism and the like. And it's always a pleasure to have her on the program.
Judy, you looked at the tapes. We showed you the tapes over the weekend. I'm curious what your reaction was to them. Did you question their authenticity. Anything jump out at you that we may have missed.
JUDITH MILLER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": No. I don't think you've missed a lot. And the one thing that strikes anybody who sees these tapes who is used to looking at al Qaeda material is how extraordinary they are. This is really al Qaeda up close, as they see themselves as they would like to project themselves to the world. And yet it's a very kind of personal but corporate look at an organization, the birth, the growth, the development, great moments. And I didn't have a shred of doubt when I looked at the material that it was genuine.
BROWN: I think there is an interesting - Nic, jump in here as we go. Judy said an interesting thing here that this is the way they want to be seen by the world. Nic, I wonder if you think these tapes were meant to be seen by the world or for some other purpose that we may or may not quite understand? ROBERTSON: Well in some ways the material we'll see tomorrow, which was May 1998, where Osama bin Laden essentially launches his jihad on the rest of the world, he comes out and announces it. He videotaped the event but what for? For his own sense of history? Because he, at this point, had no intention of ever sharing or showing that material. It's the first time it's been viewed, been aired. So what was the point? his own sense of history to go in with the archive of other material.
BROWN: Judy when you look at them, how did these tapes in your view differ from the al Qaeda training tapes or whatever we call them that have been out there on the Internet now for a while?
MILLER: Well, Aaron much of what we've seen have really been recruitment tapes, and that is material prepared to attract the uninitiated into this great world of Islamic militancy and worldwide jihad. This, as Nic said, and I agree, is for internal consumption. It is to remind them of whom they are. It's, by the way, not uncommon in militant groups, in militant circles, whether it be secular or religious, fanatical groups, I remember being struck by the extent to which when I was in Libya, Qaddafi used to tape everything and used to play those tapes again and again to himself, for his family, sometimes on national television. People who think they're doing great things tend to want to record those. And that's what you see here in action here, I think.
BROWN: You know, that's a great thing to - it is the sense of their own belief that they are righteous. The rest of us can look at this and see it in the way that we see it, but obviously the perpetrators in these situations aren't sitting there going, we are the most evil people on the planet, let's go kill a dog, they see themselves as doing God's work almost literally which is why they are so terrifying.
MILLER: Exactly, and the contrast between the agony of the dog, the cries of this puppy, and the fixed camera in a scientific detached manner just photographing this wonderful demonstration of their chemical prowess, I found really chilling. And it made me realize that as terrible as September 11 was, if these people had been able to perfect that capability and been able to use it, we could have had an even greater tragedy on our hands.
BROWN: In that regard perhaps we have learned something unintended, Nic, which is a sense of how far, although we don't precisely when this was recorded, we certainly know when September 11 occurred, how far along they are in weaponizing, to make up a word, weaponizing this?
ROBERTSON: Certainly coalition intelligence sources we've talked with and showed them -- explained to them and shown them this material, say that it represents for them something very, very frightening that had never been seen before, and they believe at this time that al Qaeda does pose a very real threat, that it still -- al Qaeda still intends to try to use chemical weapons in some way, shape or form. BROWN: One of you as, I was watching I jotted this down because I didn't understand it. Does it make any real difference whether they were testing a nerve agent or cyanide? Does it matter?
MILLER: Well, I think we want to know what they were testing, but I think in the end, to the dog it certainly didn't matter, and to the people upon whom they use it it doesn't matter, but I think it's important to know their level of expertise. And the fact that the experts cannot agree on what they're using simply from looking at the videotape shows us how difficult an area this is.
BROWN: Maybe where I was going with this is that is one or the other of these more easy to spread upon a large population, that sort of thing?
ROBERTSON: Sarin or hydrogen cyanide can easily be disseminated. It's probably better for me not actually to explain how it can be done, but it's a very, very, very simple process. And for example, in a tube train, they can easily be disseminated. Perhaps the key thing for finding out -- the important reason for finding out what they were testing, what they do have knowledge of is exactly what the chemical is, how long will it last in the environment, how far will it spread. The knowledge of that will certainly help government agencies try to defeat the threat.
BROWN: And let me just in the half-minute we have left go to Judy for the last word here. You've been knocking on doors and ringing phones on this for a long, long time. Do you think there's anything in these tapes that the U.S. government, that intelligence agencies around the world did not reasonably expect in dealing with al Qaeda?
MILLER: I don't think that U.S. intelligence ever saw tapes like this, demonstration tapes of al Qaeda's ability, actual ability to use chemicals to kill animals. I know they believed that was so, they alleged it, but this is a smoking gun, Aaron. And one other disturbing aspect of it: It seems to me that tapes like this suggest that they had planned eventually for the loss of Afghanistan, that their geographic base might disappear, but through instructional tapes like this and demonstration tapes, they feared, they hoped that they would be able to carry on if and when they ever lost Afghanistan.
BROWN: Judy, Judith Miller, thank you for coming in and joining us tonight.
MILLER: Thank you.
BROWN: Nic, we'll see you again tomorrow. We'll talk more about tomorrow in just a second. This question, though, has come up a bunch of times today on the official reaction, what governments know and what government does not know. Let me just do this in the most official language, because it's the most official and correct way to do it. Out of concern for public safety, both in this country and around the world, CNN has shown these tape to appropriate government authorities. The White House today responded this way.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ARI FLEISCHER, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: These tapes are just another troubling sign of the type of enemy we face, an enemy who would be willing to use these types of means to practice killing animals for the purpose of killing people. And it's just one more troublesome sign about the type of enemy we face, and why it's important for us to pursue this war on terror so people who do these things would not be successful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BROWN: Mr. Fleischer said the president had been briefed on the tapes. He could not say if Mr. Bush had watched them.
One other piece of business before we move on. We and the network, as you know, are devoting a fair amount of time on this story and where it goes. Tomorrow starting on "AMERICAN MORNING," Nic comes back to explore Osama bin Laden, the commanders of al Qaeda, and how they figure in the tapes. These are very -- this is tricky stuff now the rest of the week. That's throughout the day and week, and across the board pretty much on the network. We will look at their training in explosives, the making of TNT. Some of the urban terrorist training, and we'll sum it up all on Friday as "Terror on Tape" continues.
Nic, thank you yet again.
When we come back, this is a tough night around here, isn't it? When we come back, a story of intrigue closer to home. We'll go out to Roswell, New Mexico -- not the usual story out of Roswell, I guarantee you. This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN tonight.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: On to New Mexico now and a story that seems alarming and intriguing and a little bit baffling, all at the same time. A school that offers training in counterterrorism with some students from Arab countries that was found to have thousands of missiles and explosives, weapons seized by federal agents last week, and they found more of those weapons today. That's the rough outline of a story, and while it has an ominous tone about it, we are still at the very beginning of looking at what this school does and what, if anything, it has done wrong. Here is CNN's Ed Lavandera.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): ATF and Customs agents emerge from this bunker carrying a load of high-powered weaponry. Two months after, they got the feeling that something wasn't quite right here. First, word was spreading through these parts of New Mexico that a company called High Energy Access Tools was training about 45 counterterrorism military students from the United Arab Emirates. The company says it specializes in this kind of work.
When the agents moved in to search, they found some 2,300 missiles and another 4,000 pounds of explosives. The ATF says the president of the company, David Hudak, owned the weapons illegally. The weapons are now being pulled out of the bunker and taken to an undisclosed site.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Any type of federal violations, particularly in the explosives laws, ATF, Customs, and other agencies take an interest in that. And certainly, as you could see here today, in the amount of assets and agents that are present, you know, taking care of this -- all these explosives and processing it, and the investigation against Mr. Hudak continues for maybe potential further violations of federal firearms or explosives laws.
LAVANDERA: Hudak has been charged with federal ammunition violations. Federal investigators also say Hudak's company was teaching these students to fire weapons using shoulder-launch systems, but a company spokesperson insists they're not involved in any kind of terrorist activity.
FRANK FISH, H.E.A.T. SECURITY DIRECTOR: The federal firearm licenses all those things are very important, and even more so after September 11, make sure that we are doing everything in compliance. And we have been trying our best to make sure that we have. We feel that we are. We hope we haven't missed anything.
LESLIE HUDAK, WIFE: I don't know all the details yet. It's really hard to comment. Most of it is speculation right now.
LAVANDERA: Federal agents will spend the next week trying to figure out where these weapons came from and what was going to be done with them. In the aftermath of September 11, the worry is firepower like this could ends up in the wrong hands.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's always a concern, and again, that's certainly that's something that we are looking into, along with Customs, as far as Mr. Hudak's storage records, if they are in compliance, and import and exportation of certain explosive items is always a concern for law enforcement.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LAVANDERA: Aaron, federal investigators also stress at this point that there's still no evidence linking either the company or the students to any kind of terrorist activity, but there is one intriguing thing that they do point out: The school has said that they had told the U.S. State Department and the proper federal authorities about who would be training there, who these students were, although in court documents, federal investigators say that's just not the case -- Aaron.
BROWN: Well, I guess that's why they have trials, Ed. Thank you. Ed Lavandera in Roswell, New Mexico tonight.
Still ahead on NEWSNIGHT, a heartbreaker of a story. A fourth grade classroom in Virginia where one desk remains empty. The search for Jennifer Short. This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BROWN: One welcome development tonight from the Middle East -- not a peace agreement, not even a cease-fire, more along the lines of a trial separation. Israeli troops and tanks today pulled out of Bethlehem, turning control of the city back over to the Palestinian security forces. For their part, the Palestinians have agreed to try and rein in attacks on Israelis -- to try. Both sides appear to be setting the bar fairly low here, and perhaps that's a good sign.
A few other stories making news around the world today, beginning with the death in Baghdad of the terrorist leader Abu Nidal. A Palestinian newspaper is saying Abu Nidal was in poor health and took his own life. Palestinian officials who spoke to CNN said they were told that Nidal had been shot dead, though they could not describe how he died precisely. Nidal was responsible for dozens of attacks on Israelis, on Europeans and Americans, hundreds of people died because of his terrorist activity.
To Europe, and the floods that have already killed more than 100 people. The human toll, of course, devastating. The financial cost is now being estimated at more than $20 billion. A bit of good news, though, for Europeans trying to clean up and shore up flood barriers: Dry weather expected over the next several days.
And those predicting that Pope John Paul would go home to Poland and stay were proved wrong, yet again. The pope returned to Rome tonight after a three-day trip to Poland, not before taking on those rumors of his resignation. He asked Poland to pray for him, to give him the strength to carry out the end, the mission that has been given me. The pope today back home from Poland.
To Virginia next, where detectives say they're pretty much at square one as they try and figure out who killed the couple and apparently kidnapped their daughter. Investigators today say they have removed guns, ammunition and documents from the home where Mary and Michael Short were found shot to death last week. Documents include such things as a business checkbook and some unidentified papers in a briefcase.
More importantly for tonight, the search goes on for 9-year-old Jennifer Short, though investigators say they're frustrated by the lack of good leads. But for those who know Jennifer, the emotions are much more powerful than frustration. To them, she is a friend, a classmate, a student. She's not a news story, she's a real child. Once again, CNN's Jeanne Meserve.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MESERVE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In Collinsville, Virginia, in the Figuesboro (ph) elementary school, in Mrs. Young's fourth grade classroom is a desk, ready and waiting for Jennifer Short. What if that desk is still empty next Monday on the first day of school? What will teacher tell her students?
LAURIE YOUNG, TEACHER: If they want to talk, we'll talk. If they want to not stress about it and discuss it a lot, then we won't. I'm just going to kind of wait and take their lead and see how they feel.
MESERVE: Jennifer collecting pennies at school to help victims of September 11, a good citizen, a good student, a good kid. According to her past teachers, Phyllis Warrick and Glenn Davis (ph). Phyllis was at school last Thursday, the day Jennifer was discovered missing, her parents murdered.
PHYLLIS WARRICK, TEACHER: The police had called me asked me, you know, how tall she was, how much she weighed, Social Security number and all this, and we didn't understand why they wanted to know this, why couldn't her parents give them this information. And so I went home and then someone called me at home and told me what happened. I put on the TV and I just couldn't believe it. I just broke down.
MESERVE: This is tape of Jennifer at a school assembly last year. What if she is never in another? The teachers don't want to consider that possibility.
WARRICK: It's hard. I just hope we can do whatever we can to find her, to go out there and just search everywhere, if everybody would just search everywhere, search your property and just make sure she's not there, and maybe we could find her.
MESERVE: The teachers talk of Jennifer's beautiful smile, her affectionate ways, her loving spirit.
WARRICK: She's just a beautiful child that would not hurt anyone. And I hope no one has hurt her, and if they have her, they would just let her go. Because she's a beautiful child that doesn't...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She's so sweet and innocent. Just an angel.
MESERVE: An angel, somewhere.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MESERVE: These teachers are speaking out because Jennifer's parents are dead. Her other relatives are quiet, and they're afraid that without publicity, people will forget to look for a particular little girl with brown hair, brown eyes and a beautiful smile -- Aaron.
BROWN: Is there any theory in this case as to why the parents were shot? I mean, setting aside the kidnapping for a second, unless that is the reason the parents were shot. Is there a theory in play here?
MESERVE: There are many theories in play here. The problem is, Aaron, they haven't been able to figure out which one is the right one. Was this an abduction that turned into a murder? Was this a double murder that turned into abduction? They don't even have that much of an answer, much less anything that would resemble a motive here -- Aaron. BROWN: Anything in the parents' past that gives us or authorities any clue? I know we are going nowhere here, Jeanne, but I feel like I need to ask anyway -- that gives authorities a clue as to the reason for this?
MESERVE: They're described as quiet, working class people, no history of drug use, no criminal record as far as we've been able to determine, good, shy, but quiet people. The only thing they can speculate on is that perhaps it had something to do with his business. We know that amongst the things they seized were many documents relating to his employees. We've been told they're trying to track them down and interview them, thinking that perhaps there was some disagreement, somebody who was disgruntled in the business line -- Aaron.
BROWN: Jeanne, thank you. Jeanne Meserve in Virginia tonight. We continue to work that.
Onto ground zero. We were struck by one part of the ceremony planned for the 11th of September and how it came to be. One of the things that will happen is family members will leave roses at ground zero, an idea that planners received from an e-mail that came from someone in Australia. City Hall in New York went to great length to take ideas from all over the globe. We liked the spirit of that here at NEWSNIGHT. As you know if you watch often -- we know you do -- you know we're taking your ideas on our Web site for ground zero, cnn.com/newsnight. Follow the links, it will take you to the site, and hopefully it will be relatively easy to figure out how to submit your idea for ground zero. No awards here, but at some point we would like to present some of the ideas to the city.
In the meantime, we will keep looking at some of your proposals as we go. Christine in Iowa sent us this one. We'll build the twin towers on the footprints, with a connecting bridge, a reflecting pool. Would have the names of the victims engraved in stone.
This one came to us from Israel. A rabbi in Israel -- a tower 110 stories high in the middle of a park at ground zero. There would be a beam of light out the top. I think the idea of a light has come up a number of times. And Dennis in Los Angeles, California sent us this, a building which would preserve the silhouette of the original buildings and the evening light would shine down from the buildings onto a park, to show the silhouette. Lots of fun and interesting and thoughtful ideas. And we hope you will send yours along, if you're so inclined, to cnn.com/newsnight, follow the links, you know the rest.
Ahead on NEWSNIGHT, a walk on the wild side of the PGA. Finally we get to talk about golf on the program. It's a good story. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BROWN: Finally from us tonight, joy. While we can't prove it, we believe the happiest man in America today is a former cell phone salesman named Rich Beem. Mr. Beem yesterday went toe-to-toe with the best golfer in the history of the world and walked off a winner, the PGA champion. We now believe the second happiest man in the world is "Sports Illustrated" senior writer Alan Shipnuck, who a couple of years ago wrote a book about Rich Beem before anybody had a clue who he was. The book did nicely. the book, all of a sudden, is really valuable.
Alan joins us from New York tonight. Nice to have you with us on the program.
ALAN SHIPNUCK, SPORTS ILLUSTRATED: I'm happy to be here.
BROWN: Thank you. And we will probably even see you in a moment. We saw Rich teeing off.
There actually is something, I think, in reading your book, something in Rich's make-up, his personality that allows him, allowed him to withstand what is an incredible pressure-packed four and a half hours, going toe-to-toe in a major tournament with the best golfer on the planet.
No question. Rich came up the hard way, and he is the guy who was playing for himself. I mean, you know, he got out of golf, he was so frustrated by the mini tour grind, and he wound up at a El Paso country club, where he was folding sweaters and making maybe, you know, $400 a week, and he often played money games for twice that, so when put in that kind of position, I think it hardens you a little bit. You know, he had nothing to worry about. When it comes to Tiger Woods, I mean, pressure is on when you $100 in your pocket and playing for 500, so I wasn't surprised.
BROWN: I think that's what we all say, unless you're playing for a major that you know is going change your life, that's going to put you in the history books. I mean, in the context of the sport, he is now forever.
SHIPNUCK: No question, but I think a lot of the players that have tried to challenge Tiger like the Phil Mickelsons, they think about their place in history and they obsess over it, and Rich just went out there and attacked the golf course, and had a good time. And he flirted with the gallery, and kind of hammed it up for the cameras. He just played his game. He didn't worry about the rest. And that's why he was able to get it done.
BROWN: And we've got some pictures of him up there. There was a point, two weeks ago -- golf is a funny sport in that these guys make a ton of their money in a relatively short period of time, maybe a month, six weeks, when they get hot, and Rich has clearly been hot. He won a couple of weeks ago. And so in some sense, you did sort of expect him to have a good week, but not this good.
SHIPNUCK: No, I mean, I'd like to say that back in '99 when I started writing this book, I knew he was going to win the PGA Championship, but you know, he's been building toward this for a few years, but certainly this goes down as one of the all-time great shockers, probably up there with John Daly in '91 winning the same tournament. BROWN: And we've got about a minute left. In fact, one of the themes of the book is that here is a guy with tremendous talent who may, in fact, be wasting the talent by not taking it seriously enough.
SHIPNUCK: Well, it's a sort of a happy ending in that, Beem realized he was sitting on this incredible potential, and he re- dedicated himself to golf. And you know, it's kind the classic underachiever who found it within himself to beat the best, and you know, that's the stuff of bad Hollywood movies, but it came true, so it's nice when the good guy wins, I guess.
BROWN: We've got about 10 seconds left. The other character in the book is a caddy who was with him a couple of years ago. Was the caddy on the bag yesterday, or was it someone else?
SHIPNUCK: No, I talked to -- his name is T.J. Plantiss (ph). He's in exile on the European tour. I talked to him Sunday night from London, and it was pretty emotional. You know, it was a big moment for him too, because he was such a big part of Beem's success just getting to the PGA tour. So he was with him in spirit, but he was about 4,000 miles away.
BROWN: Yeah, and about 80 grand lighter for the experience. Alan, it's nice to meet you. As I told you before, it's a terrific book. It's great fun to read, and it's got value now. Congratulations. Thank you.
SHIPNUCK: Well, thanks for having me.
BROWN: And thank all of you for joining us tonight. We'll see you back home in New York City tomorrow. Good night for all of us at NEWSNIGHT.
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