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CNN Newsnight Aaron Brown

Columbia Crash Investigators Conduct Tests; Small Plane Hits L.A. Apartment Building; Hamas Pulls out of Cease-Fire Talks

Aired June 06, 2003 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening again, everyone.
If there is a theme to the program tonight, it appears to be questions, lots of questions, some answered and some not. New questions about Iraqi weapons of mass destruction, the same old questions about peace in the Middle East, questions about how a woman died, how a brother behaved, and perhaps the most uncomfortable question why we don't seem to care much about the deaths of thousands of people in a faraway place.

And, the question that begins the whip do we now know what brought the shuttle down? We go first to CNN NASA correspondent Miles O'Brien. Miles, start us off with a headline.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN NASA CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, Columbia crash investigators aimed and fired some foam at a piece of shuttle heat shield today, and there's every reason to believe they hit the bullseye on finding the cause of the tragedy.

BROWN: Miles, thank you. We'll get back to you at the top tonight.

On to Los Angeles now where a small plane did major damage in a residential neighborhood. CNN's Dan Lothian nearby, Dan welcome and a headline please.

DAN LOTHIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Aaron, it was a quiet Friday afternoon here in the Fairfax community of Los Angeles made up of mainly 30-somethings and Orthodox Jews as well when suddenly shortly before four o'clock Pacific time, a small plane plunges out of the sky and lands in a three-story apartment building -- Aaron.

BROWN: We'll get to you too pretty close to the top tonight.

Next, to Jerusalem where both sides are rediscovering the road map to peace better resembles a mine field. CNN's Kelly Wallace there again for us, Kelly a headline from you.

KELLY WALLACE, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, the radical Palestinian group Hamas suddenly announces it is pulling out of cease-fire talks with the Palestinian prime minister. The question now is is this a temporary or permanent roadblock to that Mid East road map -- Aaron.

BROWN: Kelly, it sounds like you got a live one there tonight, thank you.

And, CNN's David Mattingly in Modesto, California covering the twists and turns in the Laci Peterson case, so David a headline from you.

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, the intense demand for information in the Laci Peterson murder case is causing problems for both the prosecution and the defense. The court is still continuing to work through the question of how best to protect the evidence and protect Scott Peterson's right to a fair trial -- Aaron.

BROWN: David, thank you, back to you and the rest shortly.

Also ahead for us tonight, we'll talk with Hamas and the question does the pulling out of the cease-fire talks mean a fresh start to the killing and the terrorism?

New questions tonight about who knew what and when about Iraqi chemical weapons, that and growing questions about nuclear weapons in Iran, not just the United States doing the asking here.

We don't think we're ending our week on a sour chord. We try not to. In tonight's installment of "On the Rise" you'll meet a young woman who is trading a good career in semiconductors for an uncertain future in quarter notes. Nice way to end a Friday, all that to come.

We begin tonight with the physics of a pound and a half of orange foam. Drop it on your head and you barely muss your hair. Send it flying at 500 miles an hour and it's a totally different story once convincing enough to persuade skeptical NASA engineers that this pound and a half chunk of foam may indeed have triggered of the Space Shuttle Columbia and the seven astronauts onboard.

We begin tonight with CNN's Mile O'Brien.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN (voice-over): It is a shot of stark reality for NASA. Despite what engineers always assumed, fast-moving foam can in fact pierce a space shuttle's heat shield, and while investigators say it's too early to say for certain, it may soon lead them to smoking gun proof of what happened to Columbia four months ago.

SCOTT HUBBARD, COLUMBIA ACCIDENT INVESTIGATION BOARD: This is the first evidence that we have that a piece of foam that approximates what was observed in the accident can in fact crack and damage a piece of flight reinforced carbon panel.

O'BRIEN: Scott Hubbard of the Columbia Accident Investigation Board is leading the testing effort at a private facility in San Antonio, Texas. They hope to replicate what happened to the Space Shuttle Columbia 81 seconds after her last launch. That's when a piece of insulating foam flew off the fuel tank, striking the carbon panels at the leading edge of the orbiter's left wing at a relative speed of more than 500 miles an hour.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Columbia, Houston, we see your tire pressure messages and we did not copy your last.

O'BRIEN: While NASA engineers and mission managers concluded during the mission it was nothing to worry about, the accident board believes the foam inflicted a mortal wound on Columbia, a breach that allowed 3,000 degree plasma to blow torch the aluminum skin when Columbia returned to earth on February 1st.

And, the testing is offering the strongest evidence to date they are right. In this case, the foam projectile dislodged the carbon panel by a tenth of an inch and left a three-quarter-inch crack. The panel was removed from the Shuttle Discovery's wing and affixed to a mock-up.

HUBBARD: We don't know the structural or thermal implications of this crack yet. What I can say is if such a crack had been found on an inspection you would not fly with it. You would not take a piece that is this damaged into space.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: This is still a work in progress. In another few weeks they will fire another piece of foam at another carbon panel from a different spot on Discovery's left wing to see how it fares. Ultimately these panels will be put through a thermal test to see how much heat might penetrate them.

Meanwhile, the board itself is working on its final ten chapter report. A board spokesperson tells us it is a document with a big scope and broad criticisms of NASA's longstanding budgetary woes, management turmoil, its inability to decide on whether to upgrade or replace the shuttle, and its risk management techniques -- Aaron.

BROWN: Well, first I have an observation then a question. I think for those of us far less familiar with the shuttle than you that crack or that damage looks tiny. It doesn't look catastrophic. Had there been foam issues on other launches of other shuttle flights?

O'BRIEN: Yes, numerous times. NASA watched that foam fall off and came to the conclusion that it was not a real problem. What's interesting about it, Aaron, is they spent an awful lot of time focusing on those heat resistant tiles because they felt they were more fragile than that stuff that's at the leading edge of the wing. As it turns out that might have been a bigger problem.

BROWN: Miles, thank you very much, good to have you on the program again tonight, Miles O'Brien in Atlanta.

Next to the site of the small plane crash in Los Angeles. Being Los Angeles, the news helicopters arrived early and the live pictures have been coming all evening, the facts, however, a bit slower. The investigation is just beginning.

For what we know we go back to the scene and CNN's Dan Lothian -- Dan.

LOTHIAN: Aaron, I am about a block away from where that small plane fell out of the sky and crashed into a three-story apartment building. CNN has obtained some home video that shows that plane spiraling out of the sky and into the building.

We are told it is a Beechcraft 135 four-seater, authorities now telling us that the pilot of that plane was killed in the crash and a second person who was on the second floor of that apartment building also died.

What is unknown at this hour is what caused that plane to go down but federal authorities are here on the scene, the Secret Service, the NTSB, and the FBI, the FBI releasing a statement telling us at this point there is no evidence that shows that there's any connection to terrorism but they are here investigating to make sure that that is the case.

Authorities are currently also combing through the building searching what's left of that building searching for additional victims. So far, seven people have been hospitalized, one of them with burns over 35 percent of his body.

The difficulty for authorities now is that that plane came down right through the building and ended up in the basement. We are told all that was left on top of the building was the propeller of that plane. It is now in the bottom of that building in the basement and it has caused that building to be quite unstable so they have to stabilize that building so they can go in there and search for additional victims.

One other point, they are still trying to determine if that plane indeed did come from the Santa Monica Airport. We were told that earlier this afternoon. Santa Monica Airport is about ten miles from here, authorities trying to get to the tail of that plane to check the numbers to find out if indeed it did come from that airport -- Aaron.

BROWN: Well, just in the home video you can see it went straight, literally straight down. Quickly, was there any communication between the plane and any of the air traffic controllers?

LOTHIAN: It's possible, Aaron, but we simply don't know at this point.

BROWN: OK.

LOTHIAN: It's so early in the investigation that we don't know.

BROWN: Dan, thank you, Dan Lothian in Los Angeles.

Now yet more proof that knowing if a country has weapons of mass destruction is more art than science. It is hard enough when you've got the run of the place. It's tougher still before you get there. Today, there came a leaked document that betrays a measure of uncertainty in the run-up to the war with Iraq, this at a time when the administration was sounding much more certain about the case to be made.

The details reported tonight from CNN Pentagon Correspondent, Barbara Starr.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Even as U.N. nuclear weapons inspectors return to Iraq to check looted nuclear facilities, in Washington the political storm about what top Bush administration officials knew and when they knew it about Iraq's weapons program continued to escalate.

A one-page summary of a classified Defense Intelligence Agency September, 2002 report on Iraq had a stunning revelation. Just as the administration was saying Iraq posed a threat, the DIA was saying this:

"There is no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing and stockpiling chemical weapons or where Iraq has or will establish its chemical warfare agent production facilities."

On Capitol Hill, DIA Director Vice Admiral Lowell Jacoby said the agency always had believed Iraq had weapons of mass destruction but could not come to a definitive conclusion on key facts.

VICE ADM. LOWELL JACOBY, DEFENSE INTELLIGENCE AGENCY: As of 2002, in September, we could not reliably pin down for somebody who is doing contingency planning specific facilities, locations, or production that was underway at a specific location at that point in time.

STARR: The report does have contradictions. It questioned whether Iraq could produce large amounts of nerve agent, saying most facilities had been destroyed in previous U.S. attacks.

The DIA said Iraq probably had chemical munitions but said the agency had no direct information on that point and while the report says Iraq had biological weapons the size, nature, and condition of the biological stockpile is unknown.

A senior administration official continued to insist that the intelligence was solid before the war, telling CNN: "I take strong exception to any suggestion or conclusion that the Bush administration's decision to go to war is based on unreliable intelligence."

STARR: The DIA said there was plenty to worry about. Iraq last year was rebuilding some chemical weapons plants under the guise of being industrial facilities and, in what appears to contradict other portions of the report, the DIA noted unusual munitions transfer activity last year suggesting Iraq was distributing chemical weapons in preparation for an anticipated U.S. attack.

Barbara Starr, CNN, the Pentagon.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: We got an e-mail today pitching a conference for us to cover, a conference calling for a road map for peace in Korea. The Koreans should be so lucky. Then perhaps they too could experience the ups and downs of the original, the ups earlier in the week, the downs today.

Reporting for us, CNN's Kelly Wallace.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE (voice-over): Anger on the streets of Gaza City as hundreds of members of the radical Palestinian group Hamas accuse the Palestinian prime minister of selling out to Israel and the United States.

The group's leaders throwing down the gauntlet saying they are cutting off talks with Mahmoud Abbas, widely known as Abu Mazen, concerning any halt in attacks against Israelis.

"We have stopped the dialogue with the authority because of its bad position which ignored the right of refugees, forgot the prisoners, ignored Jerusalem, and ignored the rest of our faithful causes" Hamas' spiritual leader said.

But the move represents a reversal because immediately following the Aqaba Summit, Hamas leaders said they were still willing to talk with the prime minister even as they rejected his call for an end to the armed intifadah against Israel. What changed?

Two events Thursday seemed to be key, a late night meeting of Hamas leaders and Israeli soldiers shooting and killing two members of Hamas inside a West Bank house.

Israeli security sources say the men were planning a suicide bombing attack and refused to surrender to the soldiers but Palestinian sources say the men did not resist.

"They came last night and killed my son in front of my eyes" this woman said.

A senior Palestinian minister told CNN, "This Israeli military action was the reason that Hamas decided to stop the talks."

Late Friday, Prime Minister Abbas met with Palestinian President Yasser Arafat who has made it clear he's not impressed with Israel's offer so far. Mr. Abbas' aides stressed that they have not been notified by Hamas that the talks are over insisting the dialogue will continue.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE: Hamas has now called for a meeting of all radical Palestinian groups Saturday evening and if Mahmoud Abbas cannot reach an agreement with these groups, he faces a stark choice, either using force and risking a possible outbreak of civil war, or watching this Mid East crumble like so many other peace plans in the past -- Aaron.

BROWN: It does appear from here he's being undercut left and right. Hamas you knew would be a problem. Arafat not surprising I suppose that he wants to get some attention here too.

WALLACE: Not at all. On Thursday, in fact, Yasser Arafat speaking out kind of a slap to Mahmoud Abbas saying that Ariel Sharon, the Israeli Prime Minister has not offered anything "tangible" to the Palestinians so far.

Privately, Aaron, Israeli and American officials remain concerned. They think Yasser Arafat is trying to assert a great deal of power and undermine Mahmoud Abbas. People close to Yasser Arafat say that is not the case -- Aaron.

BROWN: Kelly, thank you very much, Kelly Wallace in Jerusalem.

Ahead on NEWSNIGHT on this Friday in New York City, nuclear inspectors return to Iraq looking for material apparently looted from a site there.

We'll keep you up tonight. We'll talk to a Hamas spokesman, ask him why his group is refusing to negotiate a cease-fire, that and much more as NEWSNIGHT continues on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: We all got to know the International Atomic Energy Agency in the months leading up to the war with Iraq. Back then and since then the head of the IAEA has often seemed at war with the Bush administration.

Now on the subject of Iran at least the two are singing from the same choir book. Today, CNN obtained a portion of an IAEA report saying Iran has failed to properly report on aspects of its nuclear program, specifically a Russian engineered nuclear reactor at what many suspect to be a plant churning out weapons grade uranium.

Iran has signed a treaty promising not to develop nuclear weapons. The United States is pushing for tough inspections and pressing the Russians to stop delivery of nuclear fuel. The IAEA will meet in a little more than a week to decide what to do next.

And as that one simmers, inspectors have returned to Iraq. Barbara Starr touched on this briefly in her report earlier in the program. Their mission is a shadow of their previous one essentially counting the horses after the stable has burned down and a lot of people get hurt.

Our report is from CNN's Jane Arraf.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JANE ARRAF, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's the start of the mission but this might be the end of the road for the International Atomic Energy Agency's work in Iraq.

The U.N.-backed agency has monitored or investigated Iraq's nuclear program for decades but a recent Security Council resolution sidelined the U.N. inspectors. The U.S. plans to do the job itself, so senior U.S. Defense Department officials say these experts are here for a very limited mandate.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, actually we can't tell you anything. Can we please have some privacy here?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You need to leave the premises. You need to go.

ARRAF: The approved mission to go to an old nuclear facility looted after Saddam Hussein's regime fell.

BRIAN RENS, IAEA TEAM LEADER: It has nothing at all to do with weapons of mass destruction. That's not our objective. It's to establish what materials have been removed from the site and what remains and to secure that material and to place it under seal, under agency seal. That's the mission.

ARRAF: (Unintelligible) was a main site for Iraq's secret nuclear program. What was left of it after the '91 Gulf War was destroyed by the Vienna-based agency. The agency sealed tons of the low-grade remnants of the nuclear program in barrels, processed uranium, depleted uranium, and other radioactive materials but in April poor villagers looted the facility dumping out the contents and taking the barrels home.

"When I opened up the first barrel" says Therat al-Moamar (ph), "I was hit by a wave of something that knocked me back. I was choking. Then I came back, held my breath, and emptied the barrels out quickly one by one."

Hisham Abdul-Malek, an Iraqi inspector at Tuwaitha says villagers are being paid to return the barrels by the damage has been done.

HISHAM ABDUL-MALEK, IRAQI NUCLEAR INSPECTOR: We are waiting for help now. Their area, the area there is contaminated. Their health is going down. We have no medical supplies. We do nothing.

ARRAF: The International Atomic Energy Agency won't be assessing the health effects, though, or looking at any other looted nuclear sites. After fulfilling their limited mandate, they expect to be out of Iraq in two weeks.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ARRAF: And to leave the United States to continue to try to prove that there are banned weapons of mass destruction here. They just have to find them -- Aaron.

BROWN: There's a lot of fear. Is there any evidence that any of this material from the nuclear weapon site ended up in the hands of truly bad guys?

ARRAF: No, no real evidence although it's still quite uncertain where exactly it went. Essentially what happened is really quite tragic. These people from nearby villages came in. There was no U.S. military protection there at that time. Now, the IAEA had asked the U.S. military to secure those sites but they seemed apparently unable to or didn't have the resources to, so they were essentially overrun and all of this radioactive material basically got dumped out.

One Iraqi official said when they got there the only thing they could do was cover it over with concrete. There is so much processed uranium on the ground it really could have gone anywhere but the major fear now is not so much that it could be used to make a dirty bomb, a crude nuclear weapon, although it could be, is really that this whole area has been contaminated and that we're going to see the health effects for years to come -- Aaron.

BROWN: Jane, thank you very much, Jane Arraf in Baghdad.

Coming up on the program still, roadblock on the road to peace in the Middle East as Hamas rejects calls for cease-fire. We'll ask why when we come back.

This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Faced with a choice between a road less traveled and the well beaten path, Israelis and Palestinians alike have tended to choose the latter. This has meant bulldozers and bombs and funerals and retribution.

So, when Hamas today pulled out of the cease-fire talks with the Palestinian Authority their choice was plain to make and when we interviewed one of their spokesmen this afternoon, our first question was the pressing one.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN (voice-over): Sir, I gather based on the news today that Hamas has decided it will continue its attacks on Israeli civilians, fair enough?

ISMAIL ABU SHANAB, HAMAS SPOKESMAN: Let me say it in a better way. We stopped negotiation with Abu Mazen's government for a cease- fire and we will continue our defending ourselves and resisting Israeli occupation because the Israelis are not respecting any of the efforts to world peace.

BROWN: Which as a practical matter means, does it not, that you will continue attacks on Israeli civilians?

SHANAB: No. We resist the Israeli occupation. I want you to see the Israeli tanks (unintelligible), Israeli soldiers in Gaza, the Israeli soldiers in Nablus and Bethlehem and Hebron, in all of those Palestinian territories. So, we want to continue our resistance to Israeli military elements which occupies our land.

BROWN: If the violence from the Palestinian side were to stop, would that not put pressure on the Israeli government to change the way it does business? But as long as there is that violence, doesn't the Israeli government have a free reign, if you will, to do what it wants in the West Bank? You're making it easy for them.

SHANAB: We give the chance many times for the Israeli government and the Israeli government did not respect any of those chances and the Palestinians fed up with all those talks which ask them not to scream while they are under attack and under the Israeli military forces pressure and asking them to stay calm while nobody wants the Israelis to stay calm and to withdraw or to stop their attacks against Palestinians.

BROWN: Do you think that a majority of Palestinians support the position of Hamas to continue the attacks on Israeli civilians or the armed resistance, or however you want to frame it?

SHANAB: It's not a matter of rhetoric words. I want you to understand our position. Palestinians are supporting resistance and the resistance which Palestinians are doing is against the Israeli soldiers and if you do not believe me please get your camera to see Israeli soldiers and Israeli tanks on the Palestinian land and what they are doing for the Palestinians.

BROWN: No, I understand where the Israeli tanks are but I must say it's a little bit of a stretch to ask people to believe that there are not also attacks on Israeli civilians when a bus gets blown up and there are civilians on that bus. That's an attack against civilians, isn't it?

SHANAB: Yes, and we offered a very, very clear statement to the Sharon government that please avoid Palestinian civilians, do not kill Palestinian children. It is fair game that if Israelis stop killing Palestinians, Palestinians will never attack Israelis.

BROWN: Mr. Abu Shanab, it's good it talk to you again. Thank you. It's an important time in the region and hopefully some good will come of it. We appreciate your time, thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: So what to make of the complications of the day? Rhetorical and otherwise. We're joined again by Stephen Cohen, the president of the Institute for Middle East Peace and Development. Glad to have him back with us. It's been an eventful week.

I don't suppose it is terribly surprising, the events of today and yesterday even, Arafat's words yesterday, Hamas's decision today?

STEPHEN COHEN, INSTITUTE FOR MIDDLE EAST PEACE & DEVELOPMENT: Not surprising at all. And in fact the only surprise here is that Hamas responds, first of all by using words and not yet by using violence. And that's a little bit better than we could have expected.

In other words, last night, Israelis killed two Hamas people. The Hamas response is going to be very likely an attempt to use violence to avenge. The fact that they haven't done so yet means they're now engaged in pressure on Abu Mazen to try to pressure the United States to condemn what Israel has done, to stop what Israel has done.

In other words, I think that we're now engaged in an intense internal Palestinian negotiation about what to do when Israel reacts militarily, as there will be an intense interaction within Israel and between Israel and the United States about what Israel does when Palestinians act.

BROWN: How many sides in this negotiation? On the Palestinian's side?

COHEN: Well, that's the interesting thing, Aaron, is that not only do you have many parties even between Abu Mazen, Arafat, Hamas, Islamic Jihad. But even within Hamas, you have different forces that are competing for power and trying to make this decision.

And the guys who are usually the dominant force in Hamas are finding themselves now in a situation where a new force in Hamas is having a decisive effect and that is the Hamas people who are in Israeli prisons. The Hamas people in Israeli prisons have a lot of time to think about politics and to negotiate with Palestinians from other political movements.

BROWN: While they are in prison?

COHEN: While they're in prison. And there are a of Palestinians in Israeli prison and a lot of important Palestinians in Israeli prisons, including the fact that one of the most important people in engaged in the whole of this intifada is in prison right now. And as long as that's happening, you have a very important voice of Palestinian politics and military activity that coming from within those prisons, changing the rhetoric and the policy that is coming. So I do not...

BROWN: Does it radicalize it or moderate it?

COHEN: Surprisingly right now, they have been a moderate voice. Surprisingly, they have been the ones that have been pushing for Hamas to give Abu Mazen the chance to try out his political methods with the United States.

Now the question is, the American team that's supposed to monitor the situation is arriving on Sunday. And I believe that what we have here is the introduction to their first task, which is going to be to try to get this back on track.

BROWN: Well, it didn't take long. We've go a little less than a minute here.

If at end of this day, it seems to me on the Palestinian's side, this is a huge test now for Abu Mazen and whatever government he's able to form and whatever influence he's able to wield.

COHEN: Yes, but don't underestimate how many times Abu Mazen has faced in his life these kind of Palestinian internal pressures one against another. And he is now going to this weekend have the advantage that for the first time the American monitors are going to be there to help him out.

I do not believe this is the end of the game. I believe this is one of the moves in this very complicated, very difficult game. We haven't seen the worst and we certainly haven't seen the best.

BROWN: I would hope four days in, three days in, it wasn't at the end of the game yet. Travel safely this weekend. We look forward talking to you when you get back.

COHEN: Thank you very much.

BROWN: Thank you very much.

Still ahead on NEWSNIGHT, Scott Peterson back in court. The judge hears arguments about phone taps and autopsies among other things. We'll take a look at and more as NEWSNIGHT continues around the world.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: And NEWSNIGHT continues in a moment with the developments in the courtroom in the Scott Peterson case. We take a short break first.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: The death of Laci Peterson was gruesome and so necessarily many of things that need to be discussed at the trial of the man, her husband, accused of killing her must be gruesome as well.

At issue today, especially hard for Ms. Peterson's family to listen to, was the question of whether the coroner's postmortem medical reports should be released to the public. CNN's David Mattingly spent date in court in Modesto, California.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The autopsies performed on Laci Peterson and the unborn child, Connor, are to remained sealed by the court. This inspite of early leaks of portions of the reports to the media.

MARK GERAGOS, PETERSON DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don't know how to find out where the leaks are coming from, I don't know how to plug the leaks, if you will. But this is a capital case.

MATTINGLY: Just the discussion of the autopsies was enough for Laci's mother to abruptly leave courtroom. Scott Peterson appeared to become emotional as well as the court ordered the released the order of death certificates.

Outside the courthouse, an entire street was blocked off for the media. Scott Peterson's family arrived to a crowd of cameras. During the hearing, dozens watched a courtroom feed set up outside. The judge, however, did not immediately rule on whether or not to impose a gag order. But leaks and misinformation are still clearly a major concern to the court.

JOHN GOOLD, PROSECUTOR: The issues can be misconstrued. None of you have been able to hear any witnesses testify. I doubt that any of you have seen all of the police reports. And to go over to what people think the evidence is or what they think has been leak of the evidence can just slant things the wrong way.

MATTINGLY: But in spite of concerns, there continue to be signs that spin still rules outside the courtroom, with new apparent leaks. The latest is a report from affiliate KTUV in Oakland, California. The details how investigators searched Scott's computer and formulated a theory of how he could have killed Laci.

GERAGOS: Unfortunately, it sounds to me like the police are doing some leaking, and once again they're leaking misinformation and false information.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: But while both sides complain, official details in this case remain very hard to come by. For example, the death certificates that were ordered released by the court today were made public. All they tell us is that Laci Peterson's death is ruled a homicide and that the actual cause of death is undetermined -- Aaron.

BROWN: Well, what's next in court?

MATTINGLY: Next in court, a number of filings. A number of deadlines set for both sides. Scott Peterson due back about a week to 10 days from now, and the court, again, still mulling over the idea of whether or not to impose the gag order and how best to protect the evidence in this case.

BROWN: For those of us who don't follow every word in this, David, when is this case expected to get before a jury?

MATTINGLY: I've heard estimates that it could take a year before this actually goes to a jury. We had a preliminary hearing coming up in the middle of July. After that, they'll consider a change of venue.

So, so many big decisions have to be made before we actually get before a jury.

BROWN: David, thank you very much. David Mattingly in Modesto.

To talk more about the developments in the case today, we're joined by CNN's Jeffrey Toobin, who is in San Francisco tonight. Jeffrey, good to see you. Was today a particularly important day one way or other for either side or any side?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I don't think so. What really struck me today is that all of the legal issues, with one exception, dealt with the media. I mean, this case is so dominated by the public attention to it that it even dominates what goes on in court, because the two big issues today is, should the autopsy be released to the public, and should there be a gag order? That's what they spent their time talking about today. And both of those are issues only because of the extraordinary public interest in the case.

BROWN: And there's also this question out there about the phone taps on Mr. Peterson's phone that recorded some conversations with his lawyers, which I would think is troubling to the court, and recorded some conversations with reporters, which certainly is troubling to reporters.

TOOBIN: Right. That was the other issue discussed in court today. And it was really, I have to say in the grim setting almost funny, because you had this sense of all these reporters calling Scott Peterson constantly. In fact, there was one moment in court where the lawyer said, well, you know, the tap recorded Scott checking his messages on his cell phone and hearing all the messages he got from the reporters trying to talk to him. Sort of this inundation of press attention even affected that, and the question was, should the reporters have the right to hear their own voices on the taps before those taps were given to the defense and the prosecution?

BROWN: And the answer to this point is no?

TOOBIN: It was no. In fact, they said, reporters, tough luck. We're giving them to the parties in the case and you are just going to have to deal with it.

BROWN: And on the larger question here, and I would think -- well, I don't think, I am sure, the more troubling question, they recorded conversations with his lawyers. How serious of a problem for the court is that?

TOOBIN: It's probably not much that big a problem, because of the way the wiretaps were set up. Basically the way it was done was that investigators, police officers listened to the initial few minutes of each conversation. When they realized they were conversations going on between Scott Peterson and his lawyer, they stopped listening.

The lawyers, the prosecutors in the case never even heard those tapes. They only got the reports that these were attorney/client conversations. So it sounds to me like the prosecutors were well insulated from anything they weren't supposed to hear, and the idea there should be big sanctions against the government, it seems extremely unlikely if what the government is saying in court is true today.

BROWN: Half a minute. Viewed from afar, and I view this from pretty far away, as you know, the defense seems far more confident than perhaps we thought they might seem early on. Is that just good acting, or in fact have things happened to change the playing field?

TOOBIN: Well, I think, you know, it's as simple as these leaks. I mean, all of these leaks, whether it deals with the cause of death, or you know, mysterious other possible perpetrators, it all goes to help the defense. And I think you can argue pretty persuasively, it's a conscious strategy and they are planning alternative scenarios. When this case goes before a jury, if any of those scenarios actually come to fruition, whether there's any proof to back them up, that's a very, very separate question.

BROWN: Jeffrey, thank you very much. Jeffrey Toobin out in San Francisco tonight.

Ahead on NEWSNIGHT, we will check the roundups for today. Some of the top stories around the country and around the world. And later, "On the Rise." An up and coming singer and songwriter Vienna Teng. This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Quick look at some of the other stories that made news today around the country, beginning in the Windy City, Chicago, where Sammy Sosa of the Chicago Cubs learned what punishment he will have to serve for using a cork bat last Tuesday. Eight games suspension. Cubs general manager Jim Henry says Mr. Sosa will appeal the decision, hoping to have the penalty reduced.

Couple of happy endings. First, New Mexico, where a 14-year-old Boy Scout was rescued after spending 16 hours in a cave. Raleigh Walker (ph) had slipped off a ledge, suffered a gash in his leg, but otherwise OK.

And happy ending No. 2. A runaway train barreling along near Boise, Idaho, finally slowed down long enough for a bold state trooper who had been chasing it for 22 miles to jump off his motorcycle and jump onboard the train. Hats off to you, Corporal Dwayne Prescott (ph). Nicely done.

No happy endings in southern Mexico today, one of the other stories we're following around the world tonight. It started with flooding in a truck stop on the road from Mexico City to Veracruz. Then came a landslide. Landslide ruptured a gas main, which set off an explosion. In all, two people are known to have died; 10 are missing, at least 80 have been hurt.

Day two of Pope John Paul's visit to Croatia today in Dubrovnik. A beautification ceremony for a local nun who died in 1966. The pope using the occasion to pay tribute to Croatian women, who suffered during the country's civil war in the early and mid '90s.

And at a cemetery in France today, Americans and French men and women stood shoulder to shoulder. They came to remember that historic day 59 years ago when allied forces returned to liberate Europe, D- Day, 1944.

NEWSNIGHT continues in a moment with "On the Rise," a story of a young woman making her mark in the world of music.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Been more than a week since we brought you an installment in our "On the Rise" series, stories of people making a big change in their lives, taking a chance in hopes of achieving a dream -- jumping the tracks you might say to go someplace the train they were on would never go. You might say that, or you just might say they were taking a chance.

Take the young woman you're about to meet, who was pulling in a comfortable income engineering software for a big computer company, top of the world at a young age. Only that's not what she wanted. What she wanted was to make music.

And now she does.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(MUSIC AND SINGING)

VIENNA TENG, MUSICIAN: My name is Vienna Teng. I'm a singer, songwriter and pianist hoping to go out all over the country in the next few months in support of my debut CD, which is called "Waking Hour."

I started singing before I could talk and so, I'd have these, like, these nonsensical syllables in the songs I was singing. But, like, I would be dead on in terms of the pitch.

(SINGING)

TENG: A lot of the venues I'm playing right now are small clubs or coffeehouses.

(SINGING)

TENG: Vienna was the name I came up with when I was a kid. I really liked the name of the city and I also knew that there was a thriving music scene, especially during the Classical Period.

When the CD came out, I just felt like it would be a nice gesture to that 12-year-old me that I was keeping that name.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You were great on Letterman.

TENG: Thank you.

DAVID LETTERMAN, HOST, "THE LATE SHOW": I've heard the entire CD. There is not a dud on this.

TENG: Being on "Letterman"? It was sort of surreal.

(SINGING)

TENG: Here I am writing -- you know, working out of my kitchen and suddenly being thrust into, you know, this nice hotel New York and taking the limo to the studio and all that. It's sort of a Cinderella story.

LETTERMAN: Vienna Teng, everybody.

TENG: I spent a lot of time during the day at home. I am my own booking agency, for the most part, answering e-mails, making phone calls. It's not my favorite part of the job. Biographies, a couple of press quotes.

The cool thing about this age of computer developments is that I can basically run my whole operation out of my kitchen.

Just paying my dues for now.

In the middle, I do find a bit of time to do some writing at my piano and work on some new songs.

The music is all in my head.

Something's going on there.

I moved onto one of the busiest streets in San Francisco in that part of the neighborhood. When I first moved here, I didn't really have -- I didn't have a piano yet.

I ended up also trying to play the guitar and I can't play guitar. So I was being lazy and trying to think of all the one-finger cords. I keep sliding my finger around.

There's a guitar song but I'm not going to -- I'm going to spare you and play it on the piano.

(SINGING)

TENG: I wanted to write my own songs and so you kind of have to surround yourself with all sorts of other things.

I used to be a software engineer until recently. I majored in computer science. I think that if I had studied music all of the time, I would probably write a lot less. If I put my own CD in the player and was really impressed or moved by my own music, I think that would be a success.

(SINGING)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Very nice. Since we shot the story Vienna Teng, she's risen a bit more. Now she has a manager to do the booking for her. Good for her.

That's the work of NEWSNIGHT producer Amanda Townshend (ph).

And that's two-thirds of NEWSNIGHT, but there's still one more third to come, including a judge's ruling in the case of a Florida woman who refused to remove her veil for a driver's license photo.

And more on the case of the Boston mobster and his university president brother, and whether the good brother should help find the bad brother. A perfect story for NEWSNIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: This is a story about a few ounces of fabric and a collision between God's law and the laws of the land. Hard to imagine a weightier issue hanging from something as weightless as a veil.

An explanation tonight from CNN's Brian Cabell.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sultaana Freeman, a Muslim, had claimed in court she couldn't take off her veil, or nikab (ph), for a driver's license photograph because it would violate her religious beliefs.

SULTAANA FREEMAN, MUSLIM PLAINTIFF: I don't unveil normally in situations like this, because it would be disobeying my Lord.

CABELL: Florida had previously granted her a license with a photograph in which she was veiled. But after the September 11 attacks, the state changed its policy. It demanded that she take new a photograph with her face fully exposed or lose her license.

She refused, and the license was revoked.

Circuit Judge Janet Thorpe ruled in favor of the state. In her decision, she wrote, "It would be foolish not to recognize that there are new threats to public safety, including both foreign and domestic terrorism. Plaintiff's veiling practices must be subordinated to society's need to identify people as quickly as possible."

Florida's attorney general approves.

CHARLIE CRIST, FLORIDA ATTORNEY GENERAL: Nobody was going to make this person take off her veil. But if she wanted to have the privilege, not the right but the privilege to drive a car in the state of Florida, then we would respectfully ask that she do so...

CABELL: While most Muslims do not believe their religion requires women to cover their faces, Freeman testified that was her belief, and her attorney argued that, veiled or unveiled, she in no way posed a threat to anyone's security.

HOWARD SIMON, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, ACLU, FLORIDA: What this case was really all about is that the courts more and more, dangerously, I believe, are prepared to set aside fundamental constitutional principles because some government official comes into court and claims, just claims, that we need to restrict freedom for the sake of enhancing all security.

CABELL: Officials of the American Civil Liberties Union, which represented Freeman in the trial, claim that at least 15 other states do allow exemptions in driver's license statutes for people who have religious objections to be photographed.

Brian Cabell, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: From a question raised by the Koran to one raised by the Bible, "Am I my brother's keeper?" We've been reporting the story of the Bulger boys of Massachusetts since it began, one of them a reputable educator and public figure, and the other about as disreputable as you can get, a gangster and an informer.

The good brother has insisted all along that he doesn't really know anything about the fugitive bad brother. The powers that be in this state have suggested that perhaps it is otherwise. We use "suggested" today in the past tense.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN (voice-over): It has been a long time coming, but Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney finally told the president of his state's university system that enough is enough.

GOV. MITT ROMNEY (R), MASSACHUSETTS: The president continues to, in the way he responds to this inquiry, continues to cast a shadow on his leadership and on the university itself.

BROWN: The man in question is William Bulger, who for years has been a Democratic power broker in the state, and earlier this week, the state's attorney general, who is also a Democrat, also called for Bulger's resignation. And Bulger quickly responded.

WILLIAM BULGER, PRESIDENT, UNIVERSITY OF MASSACHUSETTS: There are those who try to seize political advantage wherever it can be found, no matter how shameless or shabby those efforts may be.

ROMNEY: I was very troubled by President Bulger's reaction to the attorney general's comments. I did not feel that they were appropriate comments to be made by a university president.

BROWN: At the heart of all of this is Mr. Bulger's relationship with his brother, James "Whitey" Bulger. Whitey has been on the FBI's 10 most wanted list for years, charged by the government in connection with nearly 20 murders. He telephoned his brother, William, at least once back in 1995, but the man who was then the leader of the state senate never told authorities about the call.

That phone call was only disclosed late last year, and William Bulger has since been accused of not doing nearly enough to help law enforcement track down his brother, Whitey.

ROMNEY: I am seeking to eliminate the office of the UMass president.

BROWN: The governor is so determined to get rid of William Bulger that he wants his job title eliminated. But the state senate in Massachusetts, which is controlled by Democrats, has so far said no.

(END VIDEOTAPE) BROWN: Tonight's installment. This seemed like on a Friday night in this particular week, seemed like a good time to spend a few minutes with our friend Randy Cohen, who is a guy who is paid -- yes, you're paid...

RANDY COHEN, "THE ETHICIST," "NEW YORK TIMES" MAGAZINE: Marginally, yes.

BROWN: ... (UNINTELLIGIBLE) well, he's paid, to wrestle with issues of right and wrong, not legal or illegal, but right and wrong, different animals altogether. He writes a "New York Times" column called The Ethicist.

Nice to see you. It's been a while since I've seen you, at least.

All right, let's deal with the Bulgers first. Does a brother have a responsibility, an ethical responsibility, to rat out his sibling?

COHEN: Once the words "rat out" get in...

BROWN: Oh.

COHEN: ... I feel (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...

BROWN: You think that's loaded?

COHEN: ... (UNINTELLIGIBLE) the question. But it's interesting that the whole language of duty to report questions is pejorative, you know, squealers, rats...

BROWN: Tattletale.

COHEN: ... canaries. Sure, remember in "On the Waterfront," a whole duty to report movie, Marlon Brando didn't want to be a cheese- eater.

BROWN: That's right.

COHEN: We -- our society takes a very dim view of people who come forward. And it also makes special provisions for intimate relationships. We don't compel spouses to testify against each other.

So there are times when you definitely, and we each have a duty to report, in particular when we might help thwart harm to another person. But that doesn't seem so in this case. There doesn't seem to be an immediate threat to some life.

BROWN: It's interesting to me that on this question, we humans seem to have a difficult time. For example, we teach our kids to both tell the truth and not be tattletales.

COHEN: Yes. I see -- the -- these kind of questions, duty to report questions, are the kind I get most often, and that ambivalence runs all through the people writing in. They often involve divided loyalties, but they really involve that notion of, we don't like the tattletale.

And, you know, the fate of whistle-blowers in our country is pretty grim.

BROWN: Yes. Is it -- have you come up with a hard, fast rule on this? It's you must tell when, obviously, you can prevent some harm coming to somebody, I mean, that's...

COHEN: Yes, that's good.

BROWN: ... a slam-dunk. But is there a shade below that, when you must tell?

COHEN: Oh, there's a series of rules. You know, doctors run up against this when they have an obligation to protect the confidentiality of a patient, but the patient might have a communicable disease that could affect someone else.

And they have a set of guidelines that work pretty well in general, that it is there -- if -- a threat to another person? Is the threat imminent? Is the threat serious? Can the other person take action to protect themselves? And is there no other way to avoid the threat?

If you start with those guidelines, I think that takes you a long way.

BROWN: All right. Couple other things in the news today, and I'm not sure where the ethical questions necessarily lie, but we'll throw them out. The Martha Stewart case, do you see ethical issues there?

COHEN: Yes, for journalists.

BROWN: Ahh.

COHEN: But it's interesting that so much attention is paid to Martha Stewart's problems, when other financial crimes seem to get a lot less ink. And it seems to me it's part of a journalist's obligation to prioritize stories. That's how the front page of a newspaper work. That's how the lead story of television news works.

It's a way of saying to our viewers and our readers, These are the most important issues...

BROWN: What hasn't gotten attention?

COHEN: Well, there's the ongoing story of the lackluster SEC failing to vigorously investigate corporate crime. There's the ongoing story of the defunding of the IRS so that fewer and fewer tax returns get audited. And the ones that do get audited are the small money ones.

Those are serious stories involving millions of people and lots of money, and they get less ink than Martha. I think it's probably because there's no pie involved. BROWN: To -- I think there's because there's no dough involved, because, to a certain extent, decisions, journalistic decisions, are made based on what sells newspapers, and what sells television programs...

COHEN: Surely not, surely not.

BROWN: This is true.

COHEN: I'm shocked to hear it.

BROWN: Perhaps not in your paper over at "The New York Times," but I assure you that television is the ultimate democracy. People vote all the time, and that's, right or wrong, honestly, we need to pay some attention to that, don't we?

COHEN: Well, sure. And it's a story that should be covered. But the question is, how much is it covered? And what other stories are neglected in order to cover it? That, I think, is -- involves a professional ethical obligation to the people that you -- look to you and -- well, less so to me -- for news.

BROWN: There's an interesting right or wrong, I'm not sure exactly where it centers, in this whole debate and discussion over weapons of mass destruction and what the government may have known, may have sort of known, but made it sound like maybe they knew more, all of that. What do you see there?

COHEN: I see you being surprising gentle, Aaron. I think the story -- and I think this is the big ethical story of the week -- is many people are asserting that the president is a liar, that the president lied about -- in order to get our country into a war. That's a serious story.

BROWN: Well, yes, but it's also -- that would be a very serious story. One should have evidence of that, though, shouldn't one, before one makes that argument?

COHEN: Do you mean, before one drags the country into a war?

BROWN: Well, that also. But before one asserts that anyone, including the president of the United States, is a liar, one ought to be able to prove that.

COHEN: Well, it's an interesting problem, that the -- and more and more papers are reporting it now, that the president listed three causes for the war, Iraq was an imminent threat to us, and to its neighbors, that Iraq was connected with the events of September 11, and that there would be weapons of mass destruction there.

None of these things have been found. And I think many people believe the burden is on the president to prove his case. And if he doesn't, he then, it seems to me, is either a liar or a fool, and that's a very awkward position to be in.

BROWN: Well, couldn't -- how are we doing on time here? Oh, well, that answers that question.

I mean not sure what the ethic -- Let me just go another minute, OK? We'll figure it out. I know you will.

Why is the burden on the president, and why are those the two choices? Why isn't one of the choices that intelligence was simply wrong? They thought they were right, but they were wrong. That is also a possibility.

COHEN: Well, yes, but the alternatives then are corrupt or incompetent. And that if you are so wrong about all three causes, then I wonder if you can honorably hold -- continue to hold your office. It's an important thing. Many people died.

BROWN: They died (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

COHEN: And the questions of his integrity have been raised by many places.

BROWN: And I agree with that.

COHEN: By members of both parties. I think it has to be taken seriously as an ethical matter, absolutely.

BROWN: Usually we come, you know, you come in here and we yuk it up some. But...

COHEN: Well, I -- it's a big week for ethics.

BROWN: It is a big week.

COHEN: And this is kind of the big ethical story, and it's a serious story.

BROWN: It is a very serious story. We don't...

COHEN: (UNINTELLIGIBLE), I know, I like the funny ones so much better myself.

BROWN: Well, we like them both, and we like you. Thanks for coming in.

COHEN: Thanks for having me.

BROWN: Thank you very much.

As we continue, take a look at some of the stories from overseas, and they're, believe me, in the control room, trying to figure out how much time we have for this. We'll take a break first, then we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: The fighting in Liberia in West Africa seems to have escalated now to a point where the United States today ordered non- emergency embassy personnel to leave the capital city of Monrovia, and also said that the Liberian president, Charles Taylor, should face a war crimes tribunal.

CNN's Jeff Koinange is on the phone from Monrovia tonight -- Jeff.

JEFF KOINANGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on phone): That's right, Aaron. And the capital, as we speak, is very tense. We understand there was heavy fighting today, all day. The rebels have crushed a key bridge leading into the city. And for the first time, they are inside the city itself, which is causing a lot of alarm within the government.

On our drive from the airport, Aaron, a 70-kilometer drive, about 40 miles, there were about 20 military checks, an average of one every two miles. And we had to stop, and they would check our bags. And you know how us TV people travel with so much equipment. It was very tiresome, it was very tense. And the soldiers were taking no chances.

They don't any foreigners here. They kept asking us what we're doing here. But we insisted we were here to do this story. It was extremely, extremely tense. I've been traveling through Liberia many times. I have never seen it this tense.

But the government do insist they are in full control. They're going to do whatever they can to repel the rebels. And the weekend should bring more news, Aaron. But right now, the situation is, as I said, very tense.

BROWN: All right, two quick questions, Jeff. One is, is this an ideological battle between the rebels and the government? And secondly, how does this government in Liberia come to power? Did it come to power in elections? Did it come to power by force?

KOINANGE: Let me answer the second one first, Aaron. In 1997, they held widely acclaimed elections. President Charles Taylor did actually win that election. However, because he had begun a civil war nine years earlier, people thought that he was the best man for the job only because the war would stop.

Since he's been in power, he's been embattled because various rebel groups came up and started challenging him and his presidency.

So he hasn't had a good time, he hasn't had an easy time in the last six years or so. Couple of days ago, he said he would step down if it meant that peace will come to Liberia. I think this ideological (UNINTELLIGIBLE) that you talk about is the rebels now see the momentum, they see that now that Charles Taylor has said he's willing to step down, they're going to intensify the struggle.

And that's why you see them in the city. They haven't been able to get into the city limits before. This time they've crossed that key bridge I talked about. They are within the city limits.

And on top of that, the citizens, instead of fleeing the other way, out of town, they are fleeing into town, so the rebels now have a chance to infiltrate within the population. And it's making the situation even more tense, because the soldiers are not going to take any chances, Aaron.

BROWN: Jeff, stay safe in your reporting assignment there. We appreciate your work tonight. Thank you very much.

Jeff Koinange in Monrovia tonight.

Onsun Suchi (ph), the Burmese opposition leader, who won the Nobel Peace Prize a decade ago, has not been seen for a week now, not since she was taken into what the military government that she opposes, by the way, calls protective custody. This has lots of people worried, more than worried.

Bush administration is talking about new sanctions against the government of Myanmar, as Burma is now called. And the U.N. representative is in the country, hoping to find Suchi if he can.

From Thailand, CNN's Tom Mintier has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM MINTIER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As efforts were under way by a U.N. envoy to secure the release of Onsun Suchi, demonstrators gathered outside the U.N.'s regional headquarters in Bangkok to voice their concerns.

These are members of the Overseas National Students Organization of Burma, frequent protesters here, usually outside the Myanmar embassy.

AUNG TUNG HTWE, NATIONAL STUDENTS ORGANIZATION OF BURMA: We oppose the terrorist government in Burma who oppress all people, including Onsun Suchi, and all opposition party members.

MINTIER: Onsun Suchi has not been seen in public since last Friday, when she was detained by the military authorities, along with nearly two dozen of her supporters, following a clash with what some called government-sponsored opponents.

The U.N. has sent a special envoy to Myanmar in an attempt to see Suchi or gain her release. Malaysian diplomat Razali Ismail is no stranger to the government in Myanmar. It was Razali who helped secure Suchi's release from house arrest more than a year ago.

RAZALI ISMAIL, U.N. SPECIAL ENVOY TO MYANMAR: There's increasing concern about her -- about Onsun Suchi now. Nobody has seen her. She has not said a word. And as I said, rumors are swirling about her being injured. So I must be able to come out and see her and then come out and to be able to assure everybody that she is fine, or (UNINTELLIGIBLE) she is not injured.

MINTIER: There have been persistent rumors that Suchi was seriously injured in last Friday's clashes. U.S. diplomats have claimed that evidence at the scene of the clash indicates that many people could have been injured, more than they say the Myanmar government has admitted to. The U.N. envoy that is currently in Myanmar has called on countries in the region to support his mission to free Suchi. On Friday, the Japanese foreign minister called on the Myanmar government to cooperate.

YORIKO KAWAGUCHI, JAPANESE FOREIGN MINISTER (through translator): We would like to have Onsun Suchi released immediately, the NLD be allowed to resume their political activities freely, and the situation in Myanmar return to normal as soon as possible.

MINTIER: The current situation is far from normal. These are the most recent pictures of Suchi during a recent rally, amateur video smuggled out of the country.

After these pictures were taken, not only was Suchi detained, but offices of the National League for Democracy, or NLD, were closed around the country, and other political activists were either picked up or restricted to their homes.

Nobody is quite sure who has been arrested, but contact with any NLD leaders has been impossible because phone lines have apparently been cut.

The U.N. envoy is scheduled to remain in the Myanmar for five days. Before he arrived, he said freeing Suchi was a primary objective.

RAZALI: I would want her to be free, but if I were any -- Yes. (UNINTELLIGIBLE), she was free before. Why put her back?

MINTIER: Onsun Suchi has spent years under house arrest since her victory in the 1990 elections, elections that have never been honored by the military rulers of Myanmar. Allowed to leave her home a year ago and stage rallies around the country, it appeared to some that things might have changed for the better in Myanmar.

That illusion was shattered a week ago by the harsh crackdown on dissent that has included the closure of schools and universities across the country.

Tom Mintier, CNN, Bangkok.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Still ahead on NEWSNIGHT, tomorrow's news tonight. Actually a kind of a long segment of tomorrow's news tonight. We'll take a look at morning papers from around the country and around the world. But we'll take a break first.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Weird collection of stories there, wasn't it?

Speaking of which, time for morning papers, a look at newspapers from around the country and around the world. We get a lot of mail on this segment. People either love it or hate it. But those people who love it think we do it too quickly. That is not going to be the problem tonight. OK?

Remember when I went a little long with Randy -- OK. You do. About to pay for it.

Fortunately, there are some sort of cool things in the papers today. We'll see, won't we?

"The Cincinnati Enquirer," the paper of Cincinnati, Ohio, Funny Cide, the horse who runs for the Triple Crown tomorrow here in New York, makes the front page in most papers. No joke, Funny Cide could make history. But what is -- oh, down at the bottom, then I'll get to the one I really want to talk about.

"Wet Spring Has Farmers' Crops on the Ropes." I don't know if it's been terribly -- terrible weather where you are, but out here in the East and in a lot of the Midwest, it's just been awful, and it's going to be lousy again this weekend.

Now, here's what I like. Watch how different papers play this story. "Pentagon Concedes Intelligence Shortfall, Nukes, Germs Unproven." This is the weapons of mass destruction story today. And this is how "The Cincinnati Enquirer played it, "Pentagon Concedes Intelligence Shortfall."

Same story, OK, different paper. "The San Francisco Chronicle" headlines the story this way, "Pentagon Defends Iraq Arms Claim, Two Top Officials Go Public About the Lack of Evidence."

So in "The Chronicle," "Pentagon Defends," and in the "Enquirer," "Pentagon Concedes." Which is it, you guys? It's actually both, depending on what part of the story you wrote, but that's how the two papers headline the story.

One other thing I wanted to mention, now, in "The Enquirer," or rather "The Chronicle," the veil, the women in Florida who wanted to keep her veil on when she had the driver's license picture, they have that story on the front page, and you see her veiled, right?

OK, "Miami Herald," of course they would front-page the story, because it's a Florida story. "Judge: Veil Must Come Off," and you see the woman again, and you see the picture of her veiled. Now, also they put the Pentagon story, "Pentagon Agency Had Doubts on Iraqi Arms." That's a pretty good take on that story.

Now, back to -- now "The Washington Times." GO down to the bottom here. "The Washington Times," "Court Lifts Veil from Driver's License, Muslim Woman's Rights Not Infringed, Florida Judge Rules." And they have the picture of her veiled, and they also have a picture of her unveiled. This is actually a mug shot. She was arrested at some point in her life in the state of Illinois, 1998, I don't know what she was arrested for.

But they decided to show you what she looks like. I'm not sure that was a good or bad decision. We don't make that judgment, we just point it out.

And the last one, and interestingly, it is the last one, "Hit the Road." "The Boston Herald," "Romney Calls on Bulger to Quit" U.S. -- or "UMass Presidency." And Funny Cide is right there too.

And I don't know if Funny Cide will win tomorrow, but I'll be rooting for -- is it a him or a her? Well, it's sort of in between, actually.

We'll see you on Monday, 10:00 Eastern time. Until then, good night for all of us at NEWSNIGHT.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com





Hits L.A. Apartment Building; Hamas Pulls out of Cease-Fire Talks>


Aired June 6, 2003 - 22:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening again, everyone.
If there is a theme to the program tonight, it appears to be questions, lots of questions, some answered and some not. New questions about Iraqi weapons of mass destruction, the same old questions about peace in the Middle East, questions about how a woman died, how a brother behaved, and perhaps the most uncomfortable question why we don't seem to care much about the deaths of thousands of people in a faraway place.

And, the question that begins the whip do we now know what brought the shuttle down? We go first to CNN NASA correspondent Miles O'Brien. Miles, start us off with a headline.

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN NASA CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, Columbia crash investigators aimed and fired some foam at a piece of shuttle heat shield today, and there's every reason to believe they hit the bullseye on finding the cause of the tragedy.

BROWN: Miles, thank you. We'll get back to you at the top tonight.

On to Los Angeles now where a small plane did major damage in a residential neighborhood. CNN's Dan Lothian nearby, Dan welcome and a headline please.

DAN LOTHIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Aaron, it was a quiet Friday afternoon here in the Fairfax community of Los Angeles made up of mainly 30-somethings and Orthodox Jews as well when suddenly shortly before four o'clock Pacific time, a small plane plunges out of the sky and lands in a three-story apartment building -- Aaron.

BROWN: We'll get to you too pretty close to the top tonight.

Next, to Jerusalem where both sides are rediscovering the road map to peace better resembles a mine field. CNN's Kelly Wallace there again for us, Kelly a headline from you.

KELLY WALLACE, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, the radical Palestinian group Hamas suddenly announces it is pulling out of cease-fire talks with the Palestinian prime minister. The question now is is this a temporary or permanent roadblock to that Mid East road map -- Aaron.

BROWN: Kelly, it sounds like you got a live one there tonight, thank you.

And, CNN's David Mattingly in Modesto, California covering the twists and turns in the Laci Peterson case, so David a headline from you.

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, the intense demand for information in the Laci Peterson murder case is causing problems for both the prosecution and the defense. The court is still continuing to work through the question of how best to protect the evidence and protect Scott Peterson's right to a fair trial -- Aaron.

BROWN: David, thank you, back to you and the rest shortly.

Also ahead for us tonight, we'll talk with Hamas and the question does the pulling out of the cease-fire talks mean a fresh start to the killing and the terrorism?

New questions tonight about who knew what and when about Iraqi chemical weapons, that and growing questions about nuclear weapons in Iran, not just the United States doing the asking here.

We don't think we're ending our week on a sour chord. We try not to. In tonight's installment of "On the Rise" you'll meet a young woman who is trading a good career in semiconductors for an uncertain future in quarter notes. Nice way to end a Friday, all that to come.

We begin tonight with the physics of a pound and a half of orange foam. Drop it on your head and you barely muss your hair. Send it flying at 500 miles an hour and it's a totally different story once convincing enough to persuade skeptical NASA engineers that this pound and a half chunk of foam may indeed have triggered of the Space Shuttle Columbia and the seven astronauts onboard.

We begin tonight with CNN's Mile O'Brien.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN (voice-over): It is a shot of stark reality for NASA. Despite what engineers always assumed, fast-moving foam can in fact pierce a space shuttle's heat shield, and while investigators say it's too early to say for certain, it may soon lead them to smoking gun proof of what happened to Columbia four months ago.

SCOTT HUBBARD, COLUMBIA ACCIDENT INVESTIGATION BOARD: This is the first evidence that we have that a piece of foam that approximates what was observed in the accident can in fact crack and damage a piece of flight reinforced carbon panel.

O'BRIEN: Scott Hubbard of the Columbia Accident Investigation Board is leading the testing effort at a private facility in San Antonio, Texas. They hope to replicate what happened to the Space Shuttle Columbia 81 seconds after her last launch. That's when a piece of insulating foam flew off the fuel tank, striking the carbon panels at the leading edge of the orbiter's left wing at a relative speed of more than 500 miles an hour.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Columbia, Houston, we see your tire pressure messages and we did not copy your last.

O'BRIEN: While NASA engineers and mission managers concluded during the mission it was nothing to worry about, the accident board believes the foam inflicted a mortal wound on Columbia, a breach that allowed 3,000 degree plasma to blow torch the aluminum skin when Columbia returned to earth on February 1st.

And, the testing is offering the strongest evidence to date they are right. In this case, the foam projectile dislodged the carbon panel by a tenth of an inch and left a three-quarter-inch crack. The panel was removed from the Shuttle Discovery's wing and affixed to a mock-up.

HUBBARD: We don't know the structural or thermal implications of this crack yet. What I can say is if such a crack had been found on an inspection you would not fly with it. You would not take a piece that is this damaged into space.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

O'BRIEN: This is still a work in progress. In another few weeks they will fire another piece of foam at another carbon panel from a different spot on Discovery's left wing to see how it fares. Ultimately these panels will be put through a thermal test to see how much heat might penetrate them.

Meanwhile, the board itself is working on its final ten chapter report. A board spokesperson tells us it is a document with a big scope and broad criticisms of NASA's longstanding budgetary woes, management turmoil, its inability to decide on whether to upgrade or replace the shuttle, and its risk management techniques -- Aaron.

BROWN: Well, first I have an observation then a question. I think for those of us far less familiar with the shuttle than you that crack or that damage looks tiny. It doesn't look catastrophic. Had there been foam issues on other launches of other shuttle flights?

O'BRIEN: Yes, numerous times. NASA watched that foam fall off and came to the conclusion that it was not a real problem. What's interesting about it, Aaron, is they spent an awful lot of time focusing on those heat resistant tiles because they felt they were more fragile than that stuff that's at the leading edge of the wing. As it turns out that might have been a bigger problem.

BROWN: Miles, thank you very much, good to have you on the program again tonight, Miles O'Brien in Atlanta.

Next to the site of the small plane crash in Los Angeles. Being Los Angeles, the news helicopters arrived early and the live pictures have been coming all evening, the facts, however, a bit slower. The investigation is just beginning.

For what we know we go back to the scene and CNN's Dan Lothian -- Dan.

LOTHIAN: Aaron, I am about a block away from where that small plane fell out of the sky and crashed into a three-story apartment building. CNN has obtained some home video that shows that plane spiraling out of the sky and into the building.

We are told it is a Beechcraft 135 four-seater, authorities now telling us that the pilot of that plane was killed in the crash and a second person who was on the second floor of that apartment building also died.

What is unknown at this hour is what caused that plane to go down but federal authorities are here on the scene, the Secret Service, the NTSB, and the FBI, the FBI releasing a statement telling us at this point there is no evidence that shows that there's any connection to terrorism but they are here investigating to make sure that that is the case.

Authorities are currently also combing through the building searching what's left of that building searching for additional victims. So far, seven people have been hospitalized, one of them with burns over 35 percent of his body.

The difficulty for authorities now is that that plane came down right through the building and ended up in the basement. We are told all that was left on top of the building was the propeller of that plane. It is now in the bottom of that building in the basement and it has caused that building to be quite unstable so they have to stabilize that building so they can go in there and search for additional victims.

One other point, they are still trying to determine if that plane indeed did come from the Santa Monica Airport. We were told that earlier this afternoon. Santa Monica Airport is about ten miles from here, authorities trying to get to the tail of that plane to check the numbers to find out if indeed it did come from that airport -- Aaron.

BROWN: Well, just in the home video you can see it went straight, literally straight down. Quickly, was there any communication between the plane and any of the air traffic controllers?

LOTHIAN: It's possible, Aaron, but we simply don't know at this point.

BROWN: OK.

LOTHIAN: It's so early in the investigation that we don't know.

BROWN: Dan, thank you, Dan Lothian in Los Angeles.

Now yet more proof that knowing if a country has weapons of mass destruction is more art than science. It is hard enough when you've got the run of the place. It's tougher still before you get there. Today, there came a leaked document that betrays a measure of uncertainty in the run-up to the war with Iraq, this at a time when the administration was sounding much more certain about the case to be made.

The details reported tonight from CNN Pentagon Correspondent, Barbara Starr.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Even as U.N. nuclear weapons inspectors return to Iraq to check looted nuclear facilities, in Washington the political storm about what top Bush administration officials knew and when they knew it about Iraq's weapons program continued to escalate.

A one-page summary of a classified Defense Intelligence Agency September, 2002 report on Iraq had a stunning revelation. Just as the administration was saying Iraq posed a threat, the DIA was saying this:

"There is no reliable information on whether Iraq is producing and stockpiling chemical weapons or where Iraq has or will establish its chemical warfare agent production facilities."

On Capitol Hill, DIA Director Vice Admiral Lowell Jacoby said the agency always had believed Iraq had weapons of mass destruction but could not come to a definitive conclusion on key facts.

VICE ADM. LOWELL JACOBY, DEFENSE INTELLIGENCE AGENCY: As of 2002, in September, we could not reliably pin down for somebody who is doing contingency planning specific facilities, locations, or production that was underway at a specific location at that point in time.

STARR: The report does have contradictions. It questioned whether Iraq could produce large amounts of nerve agent, saying most facilities had been destroyed in previous U.S. attacks.

The DIA said Iraq probably had chemical munitions but said the agency had no direct information on that point and while the report says Iraq had biological weapons the size, nature, and condition of the biological stockpile is unknown.

A senior administration official continued to insist that the intelligence was solid before the war, telling CNN: "I take strong exception to any suggestion or conclusion that the Bush administration's decision to go to war is based on unreliable intelligence."

STARR: The DIA said there was plenty to worry about. Iraq last year was rebuilding some chemical weapons plants under the guise of being industrial facilities and, in what appears to contradict other portions of the report, the DIA noted unusual munitions transfer activity last year suggesting Iraq was distributing chemical weapons in preparation for an anticipated U.S. attack.

Barbara Starr, CNN, the Pentagon.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: We got an e-mail today pitching a conference for us to cover, a conference calling for a road map for peace in Korea. The Koreans should be so lucky. Then perhaps they too could experience the ups and downs of the original, the ups earlier in the week, the downs today.

Reporting for us, CNN's Kelly Wallace.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE (voice-over): Anger on the streets of Gaza City as hundreds of members of the radical Palestinian group Hamas accuse the Palestinian prime minister of selling out to Israel and the United States.

The group's leaders throwing down the gauntlet saying they are cutting off talks with Mahmoud Abbas, widely known as Abu Mazen, concerning any halt in attacks against Israelis.

"We have stopped the dialogue with the authority because of its bad position which ignored the right of refugees, forgot the prisoners, ignored Jerusalem, and ignored the rest of our faithful causes" Hamas' spiritual leader said.

But the move represents a reversal because immediately following the Aqaba Summit, Hamas leaders said they were still willing to talk with the prime minister even as they rejected his call for an end to the armed intifadah against Israel. What changed?

Two events Thursday seemed to be key, a late night meeting of Hamas leaders and Israeli soldiers shooting and killing two members of Hamas inside a West Bank house.

Israeli security sources say the men were planning a suicide bombing attack and refused to surrender to the soldiers but Palestinian sources say the men did not resist.

"They came last night and killed my son in front of my eyes" this woman said.

A senior Palestinian minister told CNN, "This Israeli military action was the reason that Hamas decided to stop the talks."

Late Friday, Prime Minister Abbas met with Palestinian President Yasser Arafat who has made it clear he's not impressed with Israel's offer so far. Mr. Abbas' aides stressed that they have not been notified by Hamas that the talks are over insisting the dialogue will continue.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WALLACE: Hamas has now called for a meeting of all radical Palestinian groups Saturday evening and if Mahmoud Abbas cannot reach an agreement with these groups, he faces a stark choice, either using force and risking a possible outbreak of civil war, or watching this Mid East crumble like so many other peace plans in the past -- Aaron.

BROWN: It does appear from here he's being undercut left and right. Hamas you knew would be a problem. Arafat not surprising I suppose that he wants to get some attention here too.

WALLACE: Not at all. On Thursday, in fact, Yasser Arafat speaking out kind of a slap to Mahmoud Abbas saying that Ariel Sharon, the Israeli Prime Minister has not offered anything "tangible" to the Palestinians so far.

Privately, Aaron, Israeli and American officials remain concerned. They think Yasser Arafat is trying to assert a great deal of power and undermine Mahmoud Abbas. People close to Yasser Arafat say that is not the case -- Aaron.

BROWN: Kelly, thank you very much, Kelly Wallace in Jerusalem.

Ahead on NEWSNIGHT on this Friday in New York City, nuclear inspectors return to Iraq looking for material apparently looted from a site there.

We'll keep you up tonight. We'll talk to a Hamas spokesman, ask him why his group is refusing to negotiate a cease-fire, that and much more as NEWSNIGHT continues on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: We all got to know the International Atomic Energy Agency in the months leading up to the war with Iraq. Back then and since then the head of the IAEA has often seemed at war with the Bush administration.

Now on the subject of Iran at least the two are singing from the same choir book. Today, CNN obtained a portion of an IAEA report saying Iran has failed to properly report on aspects of its nuclear program, specifically a Russian engineered nuclear reactor at what many suspect to be a plant churning out weapons grade uranium.

Iran has signed a treaty promising not to develop nuclear weapons. The United States is pushing for tough inspections and pressing the Russians to stop delivery of nuclear fuel. The IAEA will meet in a little more than a week to decide what to do next.

And as that one simmers, inspectors have returned to Iraq. Barbara Starr touched on this briefly in her report earlier in the program. Their mission is a shadow of their previous one essentially counting the horses after the stable has burned down and a lot of people get hurt.

Our report is from CNN's Jane Arraf.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JANE ARRAF, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's the start of the mission but this might be the end of the road for the International Atomic Energy Agency's work in Iraq.

The U.N.-backed agency has monitored or investigated Iraq's nuclear program for decades but a recent Security Council resolution sidelined the U.N. inspectors. The U.S. plans to do the job itself, so senior U.S. Defense Department officials say these experts are here for a very limited mandate.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, actually we can't tell you anything. Can we please have some privacy here?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You need to leave the premises. You need to go.

ARRAF: The approved mission to go to an old nuclear facility looted after Saddam Hussein's regime fell.

BRIAN RENS, IAEA TEAM LEADER: It has nothing at all to do with weapons of mass destruction. That's not our objective. It's to establish what materials have been removed from the site and what remains and to secure that material and to place it under seal, under agency seal. That's the mission.

ARRAF: (Unintelligible) was a main site for Iraq's secret nuclear program. What was left of it after the '91 Gulf War was destroyed by the Vienna-based agency. The agency sealed tons of the low-grade remnants of the nuclear program in barrels, processed uranium, depleted uranium, and other radioactive materials but in April poor villagers looted the facility dumping out the contents and taking the barrels home.

"When I opened up the first barrel" says Therat al-Moamar (ph), "I was hit by a wave of something that knocked me back. I was choking. Then I came back, held my breath, and emptied the barrels out quickly one by one."

Hisham Abdul-Malek, an Iraqi inspector at Tuwaitha says villagers are being paid to return the barrels by the damage has been done.

HISHAM ABDUL-MALEK, IRAQI NUCLEAR INSPECTOR: We are waiting for help now. Their area, the area there is contaminated. Their health is going down. We have no medical supplies. We do nothing.

ARRAF: The International Atomic Energy Agency won't be assessing the health effects, though, or looking at any other looted nuclear sites. After fulfilling their limited mandate, they expect to be out of Iraq in two weeks.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ARRAF: And to leave the United States to continue to try to prove that there are banned weapons of mass destruction here. They just have to find them -- Aaron.

BROWN: There's a lot of fear. Is there any evidence that any of this material from the nuclear weapon site ended up in the hands of truly bad guys?

ARRAF: No, no real evidence although it's still quite uncertain where exactly it went. Essentially what happened is really quite tragic. These people from nearby villages came in. There was no U.S. military protection there at that time. Now, the IAEA had asked the U.S. military to secure those sites but they seemed apparently unable to or didn't have the resources to, so they were essentially overrun and all of this radioactive material basically got dumped out.

One Iraqi official said when they got there the only thing they could do was cover it over with concrete. There is so much processed uranium on the ground it really could have gone anywhere but the major fear now is not so much that it could be used to make a dirty bomb, a crude nuclear weapon, although it could be, is really that this whole area has been contaminated and that we're going to see the health effects for years to come -- Aaron.

BROWN: Jane, thank you very much, Jane Arraf in Baghdad.

Coming up on the program still, roadblock on the road to peace in the Middle East as Hamas rejects calls for cease-fire. We'll ask why when we come back.

This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Faced with a choice between a road less traveled and the well beaten path, Israelis and Palestinians alike have tended to choose the latter. This has meant bulldozers and bombs and funerals and retribution.

So, when Hamas today pulled out of the cease-fire talks with the Palestinian Authority their choice was plain to make and when we interviewed one of their spokesmen this afternoon, our first question was the pressing one.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN (voice-over): Sir, I gather based on the news today that Hamas has decided it will continue its attacks on Israeli civilians, fair enough?

ISMAIL ABU SHANAB, HAMAS SPOKESMAN: Let me say it in a better way. We stopped negotiation with Abu Mazen's government for a cease- fire and we will continue our defending ourselves and resisting Israeli occupation because the Israelis are not respecting any of the efforts to world peace.

BROWN: Which as a practical matter means, does it not, that you will continue attacks on Israeli civilians?

SHANAB: No. We resist the Israeli occupation. I want you to see the Israeli tanks (unintelligible), Israeli soldiers in Gaza, the Israeli soldiers in Nablus and Bethlehem and Hebron, in all of those Palestinian territories. So, we want to continue our resistance to Israeli military elements which occupies our land.

BROWN: If the violence from the Palestinian side were to stop, would that not put pressure on the Israeli government to change the way it does business? But as long as there is that violence, doesn't the Israeli government have a free reign, if you will, to do what it wants in the West Bank? You're making it easy for them.

SHANAB: We give the chance many times for the Israeli government and the Israeli government did not respect any of those chances and the Palestinians fed up with all those talks which ask them not to scream while they are under attack and under the Israeli military forces pressure and asking them to stay calm while nobody wants the Israelis to stay calm and to withdraw or to stop their attacks against Palestinians.

BROWN: Do you think that a majority of Palestinians support the position of Hamas to continue the attacks on Israeli civilians or the armed resistance, or however you want to frame it?

SHANAB: It's not a matter of rhetoric words. I want you to understand our position. Palestinians are supporting resistance and the resistance which Palestinians are doing is against the Israeli soldiers and if you do not believe me please get your camera to see Israeli soldiers and Israeli tanks on the Palestinian land and what they are doing for the Palestinians.

BROWN: No, I understand where the Israeli tanks are but I must say it's a little bit of a stretch to ask people to believe that there are not also attacks on Israeli civilians when a bus gets blown up and there are civilians on that bus. That's an attack against civilians, isn't it?

SHANAB: Yes, and we offered a very, very clear statement to the Sharon government that please avoid Palestinian civilians, do not kill Palestinian children. It is fair game that if Israelis stop killing Palestinians, Palestinians will never attack Israelis.

BROWN: Mr. Abu Shanab, it's good it talk to you again. Thank you. It's an important time in the region and hopefully some good will come of it. We appreciate your time, thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: So what to make of the complications of the day? Rhetorical and otherwise. We're joined again by Stephen Cohen, the president of the Institute for Middle East Peace and Development. Glad to have him back with us. It's been an eventful week.

I don't suppose it is terribly surprising, the events of today and yesterday even, Arafat's words yesterday, Hamas's decision today?

STEPHEN COHEN, INSTITUTE FOR MIDDLE EAST PEACE & DEVELOPMENT: Not surprising at all. And in fact the only surprise here is that Hamas responds, first of all by using words and not yet by using violence. And that's a little bit better than we could have expected.

In other words, last night, Israelis killed two Hamas people. The Hamas response is going to be very likely an attempt to use violence to avenge. The fact that they haven't done so yet means they're now engaged in pressure on Abu Mazen to try to pressure the United States to condemn what Israel has done, to stop what Israel has done.

In other words, I think that we're now engaged in an intense internal Palestinian negotiation about what to do when Israel reacts militarily, as there will be an intense interaction within Israel and between Israel and the United States about what Israel does when Palestinians act.

BROWN: How many sides in this negotiation? On the Palestinian's side?

COHEN: Well, that's the interesting thing, Aaron, is that not only do you have many parties even between Abu Mazen, Arafat, Hamas, Islamic Jihad. But even within Hamas, you have different forces that are competing for power and trying to make this decision.

And the guys who are usually the dominant force in Hamas are finding themselves now in a situation where a new force in Hamas is having a decisive effect and that is the Hamas people who are in Israeli prisons. The Hamas people in Israeli prisons have a lot of time to think about politics and to negotiate with Palestinians from other political movements.

BROWN: While they are in prison?

COHEN: While they're in prison. And there are a of Palestinians in Israeli prison and a lot of important Palestinians in Israeli prisons, including the fact that one of the most important people in engaged in the whole of this intifada is in prison right now. And as long as that's happening, you have a very important voice of Palestinian politics and military activity that coming from within those prisons, changing the rhetoric and the policy that is coming. So I do not...

BROWN: Does it radicalize it or moderate it?

COHEN: Surprisingly right now, they have been a moderate voice. Surprisingly, they have been the ones that have been pushing for Hamas to give Abu Mazen the chance to try out his political methods with the United States.

Now the question is, the American team that's supposed to monitor the situation is arriving on Sunday. And I believe that what we have here is the introduction to their first task, which is going to be to try to get this back on track.

BROWN: Well, it didn't take long. We've go a little less than a minute here.

If at end of this day, it seems to me on the Palestinian's side, this is a huge test now for Abu Mazen and whatever government he's able to form and whatever influence he's able to wield.

COHEN: Yes, but don't underestimate how many times Abu Mazen has faced in his life these kind of Palestinian internal pressures one against another. And he is now going to this weekend have the advantage that for the first time the American monitors are going to be there to help him out.

I do not believe this is the end of the game. I believe this is one of the moves in this very complicated, very difficult game. We haven't seen the worst and we certainly haven't seen the best.

BROWN: I would hope four days in, three days in, it wasn't at the end of the game yet. Travel safely this weekend. We look forward talking to you when you get back.

COHEN: Thank you very much.

BROWN: Thank you very much.

Still ahead on NEWSNIGHT, Scott Peterson back in court. The judge hears arguments about phone taps and autopsies among other things. We'll take a look at and more as NEWSNIGHT continues around the world.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: And NEWSNIGHT continues in a moment with the developments in the courtroom in the Scott Peterson case. We take a short break first.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: The death of Laci Peterson was gruesome and so necessarily many of things that need to be discussed at the trial of the man, her husband, accused of killing her must be gruesome as well.

At issue today, especially hard for Ms. Peterson's family to listen to, was the question of whether the coroner's postmortem medical reports should be released to the public. CNN's David Mattingly spent date in court in Modesto, California.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The autopsies performed on Laci Peterson and the unborn child, Connor, are to remained sealed by the court. This inspite of early leaks of portions of the reports to the media.

MARK GERAGOS, PETERSON DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I don't know how to find out where the leaks are coming from, I don't know how to plug the leaks, if you will. But this is a capital case.

MATTINGLY: Just the discussion of the autopsies was enough for Laci's mother to abruptly leave courtroom. Scott Peterson appeared to become emotional as well as the court ordered the released the order of death certificates.

Outside the courthouse, an entire street was blocked off for the media. Scott Peterson's family arrived to a crowd of cameras. During the hearing, dozens watched a courtroom feed set up outside. The judge, however, did not immediately rule on whether or not to impose a gag order. But leaks and misinformation are still clearly a major concern to the court.

JOHN GOOLD, PROSECUTOR: The issues can be misconstrued. None of you have been able to hear any witnesses testify. I doubt that any of you have seen all of the police reports. And to go over to what people think the evidence is or what they think has been leak of the evidence can just slant things the wrong way.

MATTINGLY: But in spite of concerns, there continue to be signs that spin still rules outside the courtroom, with new apparent leaks. The latest is a report from affiliate KTUV in Oakland, California. The details how investigators searched Scott's computer and formulated a theory of how he could have killed Laci.

GERAGOS: Unfortunately, it sounds to me like the police are doing some leaking, and once again they're leaking misinformation and false information.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: But while both sides complain, official details in this case remain very hard to come by. For example, the death certificates that were ordered released by the court today were made public. All they tell us is that Laci Peterson's death is ruled a homicide and that the actual cause of death is undetermined -- Aaron.

BROWN: Well, what's next in court?

MATTINGLY: Next in court, a number of filings. A number of deadlines set for both sides. Scott Peterson due back about a week to 10 days from now, and the court, again, still mulling over the idea of whether or not to impose the gag order and how best to protect the evidence in this case.

BROWN: For those of us who don't follow every word in this, David, when is this case expected to get before a jury?

MATTINGLY: I've heard estimates that it could take a year before this actually goes to a jury. We had a preliminary hearing coming up in the middle of July. After that, they'll consider a change of venue.

So, so many big decisions have to be made before we actually get before a jury.

BROWN: David, thank you very much. David Mattingly in Modesto.

To talk more about the developments in the case today, we're joined by CNN's Jeffrey Toobin, who is in San Francisco tonight. Jeffrey, good to see you. Was today a particularly important day one way or other for either side or any side?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I don't think so. What really struck me today is that all of the legal issues, with one exception, dealt with the media. I mean, this case is so dominated by the public attention to it that it even dominates what goes on in court, because the two big issues today is, should the autopsy be released to the public, and should there be a gag order? That's what they spent their time talking about today. And both of those are issues only because of the extraordinary public interest in the case.

BROWN: And there's also this question out there about the phone taps on Mr. Peterson's phone that recorded some conversations with his lawyers, which I would think is troubling to the court, and recorded some conversations with reporters, which certainly is troubling to reporters.

TOOBIN: Right. That was the other issue discussed in court today. And it was really, I have to say in the grim setting almost funny, because you had this sense of all these reporters calling Scott Peterson constantly. In fact, there was one moment in court where the lawyer said, well, you know, the tap recorded Scott checking his messages on his cell phone and hearing all the messages he got from the reporters trying to talk to him. Sort of this inundation of press attention even affected that, and the question was, should the reporters have the right to hear their own voices on the taps before those taps were given to the defense and the prosecution?

BROWN: And the answer to this point is no?

TOOBIN: It was no. In fact, they said, reporters, tough luck. We're giving them to the parties in the case and you are just going to have to deal with it.

BROWN: And on the larger question here, and I would think -- well, I don't think, I am sure, the more troubling question, they recorded conversations with his lawyers. How serious of a problem for the court is that?

TOOBIN: It's probably not much that big a problem, because of the way the wiretaps were set up. Basically the way it was done was that investigators, police officers listened to the initial few minutes of each conversation. When they realized they were conversations going on between Scott Peterson and his lawyer, they stopped listening.

The lawyers, the prosecutors in the case never even heard those tapes. They only got the reports that these were attorney/client conversations. So it sounds to me like the prosecutors were well insulated from anything they weren't supposed to hear, and the idea there should be big sanctions against the government, it seems extremely unlikely if what the government is saying in court is true today.

BROWN: Half a minute. Viewed from afar, and I view this from pretty far away, as you know, the defense seems far more confident than perhaps we thought they might seem early on. Is that just good acting, or in fact have things happened to change the playing field?

TOOBIN: Well, I think, you know, it's as simple as these leaks. I mean, all of these leaks, whether it deals with the cause of death, or you know, mysterious other possible perpetrators, it all goes to help the defense. And I think you can argue pretty persuasively, it's a conscious strategy and they are planning alternative scenarios. When this case goes before a jury, if any of those scenarios actually come to fruition, whether there's any proof to back them up, that's a very, very separate question.

BROWN: Jeffrey, thank you very much. Jeffrey Toobin out in San Francisco tonight.

Ahead on NEWSNIGHT, we will check the roundups for today. Some of the top stories around the country and around the world. And later, "On the Rise." An up and coming singer and songwriter Vienna Teng. This is NEWSNIGHT on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Quick look at some of the other stories that made news today around the country, beginning in the Windy City, Chicago, where Sammy Sosa of the Chicago Cubs learned what punishment he will have to serve for using a cork bat last Tuesday. Eight games suspension. Cubs general manager Jim Henry says Mr. Sosa will appeal the decision, hoping to have the penalty reduced.

Couple of happy endings. First, New Mexico, where a 14-year-old Boy Scout was rescued after spending 16 hours in a cave. Raleigh Walker (ph) had slipped off a ledge, suffered a gash in his leg, but otherwise OK.

And happy ending No. 2. A runaway train barreling along near Boise, Idaho, finally slowed down long enough for a bold state trooper who had been chasing it for 22 miles to jump off his motorcycle and jump onboard the train. Hats off to you, Corporal Dwayne Prescott (ph). Nicely done.

No happy endings in southern Mexico today, one of the other stories we're following around the world tonight. It started with flooding in a truck stop on the road from Mexico City to Veracruz. Then came a landslide. Landslide ruptured a gas main, which set off an explosion. In all, two people are known to have died; 10 are missing, at least 80 have been hurt.

Day two of Pope John Paul's visit to Croatia today in Dubrovnik. A beautification ceremony for a local nun who died in 1966. The pope using the occasion to pay tribute to Croatian women, who suffered during the country's civil war in the early and mid '90s.

And at a cemetery in France today, Americans and French men and women stood shoulder to shoulder. They came to remember that historic day 59 years ago when allied forces returned to liberate Europe, D- Day, 1944.

NEWSNIGHT continues in a moment with "On the Rise," a story of a young woman making her mark in the world of music.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Been more than a week since we brought you an installment in our "On the Rise" series, stories of people making a big change in their lives, taking a chance in hopes of achieving a dream -- jumping the tracks you might say to go someplace the train they were on would never go. You might say that, or you just might say they were taking a chance.

Take the young woman you're about to meet, who was pulling in a comfortable income engineering software for a big computer company, top of the world at a young age. Only that's not what she wanted. What she wanted was to make music.

And now she does.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(MUSIC AND SINGING)

VIENNA TENG, MUSICIAN: My name is Vienna Teng. I'm a singer, songwriter and pianist hoping to go out all over the country in the next few months in support of my debut CD, which is called "Waking Hour."

I started singing before I could talk and so, I'd have these, like, these nonsensical syllables in the songs I was singing. But, like, I would be dead on in terms of the pitch.

(SINGING)

TENG: A lot of the venues I'm playing right now are small clubs or coffeehouses.

(SINGING)

TENG: Vienna was the name I came up with when I was a kid. I really liked the name of the city and I also knew that there was a thriving music scene, especially during the Classical Period.

When the CD came out, I just felt like it would be a nice gesture to that 12-year-old me that I was keeping that name.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You were great on Letterman.

TENG: Thank you.

DAVID LETTERMAN, HOST, "THE LATE SHOW": I've heard the entire CD. There is not a dud on this.

TENG: Being on "Letterman"? It was sort of surreal.

(SINGING)

TENG: Here I am writing -- you know, working out of my kitchen and suddenly being thrust into, you know, this nice hotel New York and taking the limo to the studio and all that. It's sort of a Cinderella story.

LETTERMAN: Vienna Teng, everybody.

TENG: I spent a lot of time during the day at home. I am my own booking agency, for the most part, answering e-mails, making phone calls. It's not my favorite part of the job. Biographies, a couple of press quotes.

The cool thing about this age of computer developments is that I can basically run my whole operation out of my kitchen.

Just paying my dues for now.

In the middle, I do find a bit of time to do some writing at my piano and work on some new songs.

The music is all in my head.

Something's going on there.

I moved onto one of the busiest streets in San Francisco in that part of the neighborhood. When I first moved here, I didn't really have -- I didn't have a piano yet.

I ended up also trying to play the guitar and I can't play guitar. So I was being lazy and trying to think of all the one-finger cords. I keep sliding my finger around.

There's a guitar song but I'm not going to -- I'm going to spare you and play it on the piano.

(SINGING)

TENG: I wanted to write my own songs and so you kind of have to surround yourself with all sorts of other things.

I used to be a software engineer until recently. I majored in computer science. I think that if I had studied music all of the time, I would probably write a lot less. If I put my own CD in the player and was really impressed or moved by my own music, I think that would be a success.

(SINGING)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Very nice. Since we shot the story Vienna Teng, she's risen a bit more. Now she has a manager to do the booking for her. Good for her.

That's the work of NEWSNIGHT producer Amanda Townshend (ph).

And that's two-thirds of NEWSNIGHT, but there's still one more third to come, including a judge's ruling in the case of a Florida woman who refused to remove her veil for a driver's license photo.

And more on the case of the Boston mobster and his university president brother, and whether the good brother should help find the bad brother. A perfect story for NEWSNIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: This is a story about a few ounces of fabric and a collision between God's law and the laws of the land. Hard to imagine a weightier issue hanging from something as weightless as a veil.

An explanation tonight from CNN's Brian Cabell.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN CABELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sultaana Freeman, a Muslim, had claimed in court she couldn't take off her veil, or nikab (ph), for a driver's license photograph because it would violate her religious beliefs.

SULTAANA FREEMAN, MUSLIM PLAINTIFF: I don't unveil normally in situations like this, because it would be disobeying my Lord.

CABELL: Florida had previously granted her a license with a photograph in which she was veiled. But after the September 11 attacks, the state changed its policy. It demanded that she take new a photograph with her face fully exposed or lose her license.

She refused, and the license was revoked.

Circuit Judge Janet Thorpe ruled in favor of the state. In her decision, she wrote, "It would be foolish not to recognize that there are new threats to public safety, including both foreign and domestic terrorism. Plaintiff's veiling practices must be subordinated to society's need to identify people as quickly as possible."

Florida's attorney general approves.

CHARLIE CRIST, FLORIDA ATTORNEY GENERAL: Nobody was going to make this person take off her veil. But if she wanted to have the privilege, not the right but the privilege to drive a car in the state of Florida, then we would respectfully ask that she do so...

CABELL: While most Muslims do not believe their religion requires women to cover their faces, Freeman testified that was her belief, and her attorney argued that, veiled or unveiled, she in no way posed a threat to anyone's security.

HOWARD SIMON, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, ACLU, FLORIDA: What this case was really all about is that the courts more and more, dangerously, I believe, are prepared to set aside fundamental constitutional principles because some government official comes into court and claims, just claims, that we need to restrict freedom for the sake of enhancing all security.

CABELL: Officials of the American Civil Liberties Union, which represented Freeman in the trial, claim that at least 15 other states do allow exemptions in driver's license statutes for people who have religious objections to be photographed.

Brian Cabell, CNN.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: From a question raised by the Koran to one raised by the Bible, "Am I my brother's keeper?" We've been reporting the story of the Bulger boys of Massachusetts since it began, one of them a reputable educator and public figure, and the other about as disreputable as you can get, a gangster and an informer.

The good brother has insisted all along that he doesn't really know anything about the fugitive bad brother. The powers that be in this state have suggested that perhaps it is otherwise. We use "suggested" today in the past tense.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN (voice-over): It has been a long time coming, but Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney finally told the president of his state's university system that enough is enough.

GOV. MITT ROMNEY (R), MASSACHUSETTS: The president continues to, in the way he responds to this inquiry, continues to cast a shadow on his leadership and on the university itself.

BROWN: The man in question is William Bulger, who for years has been a Democratic power broker in the state, and earlier this week, the state's attorney general, who is also a Democrat, also called for Bulger's resignation. And Bulger quickly responded.

WILLIAM BULGER, PRESIDENT, UNIVERSITY OF MASSACHUSETTS: There are those who try to seize political advantage wherever it can be found, no matter how shameless or shabby those efforts may be.

ROMNEY: I was very troubled by President Bulger's reaction to the attorney general's comments. I did not feel that they were appropriate comments to be made by a university president.

BROWN: At the heart of all of this is Mr. Bulger's relationship with his brother, James "Whitey" Bulger. Whitey has been on the FBI's 10 most wanted list for years, charged by the government in connection with nearly 20 murders. He telephoned his brother, William, at least once back in 1995, but the man who was then the leader of the state senate never told authorities about the call.

That phone call was only disclosed late last year, and William Bulger has since been accused of not doing nearly enough to help law enforcement track down his brother, Whitey.

ROMNEY: I am seeking to eliminate the office of the UMass president.

BROWN: The governor is so determined to get rid of William Bulger that he wants his job title eliminated. But the state senate in Massachusetts, which is controlled by Democrats, has so far said no.

(END VIDEOTAPE) BROWN: Tonight's installment. This seemed like on a Friday night in this particular week, seemed like a good time to spend a few minutes with our friend Randy Cohen, who is a guy who is paid -- yes, you're paid...

RANDY COHEN, "THE ETHICIST," "NEW YORK TIMES" MAGAZINE: Marginally, yes.

BROWN: ... (UNINTELLIGIBLE) well, he's paid, to wrestle with issues of right and wrong, not legal or illegal, but right and wrong, different animals altogether. He writes a "New York Times" column called The Ethicist.

Nice to see you. It's been a while since I've seen you, at least.

All right, let's deal with the Bulgers first. Does a brother have a responsibility, an ethical responsibility, to rat out his sibling?

COHEN: Once the words "rat out" get in...

BROWN: Oh.

COHEN: ... I feel (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...

BROWN: You think that's loaded?

COHEN: ... (UNINTELLIGIBLE) the question. But it's interesting that the whole language of duty to report questions is pejorative, you know, squealers, rats...

BROWN: Tattletale.

COHEN: ... canaries. Sure, remember in "On the Waterfront," a whole duty to report movie, Marlon Brando didn't want to be a cheese- eater.

BROWN: That's right.

COHEN: We -- our society takes a very dim view of people who come forward. And it also makes special provisions for intimate relationships. We don't compel spouses to testify against each other.

So there are times when you definitely, and we each have a duty to report, in particular when we might help thwart harm to another person. But that doesn't seem so in this case. There doesn't seem to be an immediate threat to some life.

BROWN: It's interesting to me that on this question, we humans seem to have a difficult time. For example, we teach our kids to both tell the truth and not be tattletales.

COHEN: Yes. I see -- the -- these kind of questions, duty to report questions, are the kind I get most often, and that ambivalence runs all through the people writing in. They often involve divided loyalties, but they really involve that notion of, we don't like the tattletale.

And, you know, the fate of whistle-blowers in our country is pretty grim.

BROWN: Yes. Is it -- have you come up with a hard, fast rule on this? It's you must tell when, obviously, you can prevent some harm coming to somebody, I mean, that's...

COHEN: Yes, that's good.

BROWN: ... a slam-dunk. But is there a shade below that, when you must tell?

COHEN: Oh, there's a series of rules. You know, doctors run up against this when they have an obligation to protect the confidentiality of a patient, but the patient might have a communicable disease that could affect someone else.

And they have a set of guidelines that work pretty well in general, that it is there -- if -- a threat to another person? Is the threat imminent? Is the threat serious? Can the other person take action to protect themselves? And is there no other way to avoid the threat?

If you start with those guidelines, I think that takes you a long way.

BROWN: All right. Couple other things in the news today, and I'm not sure where the ethical questions necessarily lie, but we'll throw them out. The Martha Stewart case, do you see ethical issues there?

COHEN: Yes, for journalists.

BROWN: Ahh.

COHEN: But it's interesting that so much attention is paid to Martha Stewart's problems, when other financial crimes seem to get a lot less ink. And it seems to me it's part of a journalist's obligation to prioritize stories. That's how the front page of a newspaper work. That's how the lead story of television news works.

It's a way of saying to our viewers and our readers, These are the most important issues...

BROWN: What hasn't gotten attention?

COHEN: Well, there's the ongoing story of the lackluster SEC failing to vigorously investigate corporate crime. There's the ongoing story of the defunding of the IRS so that fewer and fewer tax returns get audited. And the ones that do get audited are the small money ones.

Those are serious stories involving millions of people and lots of money, and they get less ink than Martha. I think it's probably because there's no pie involved. BROWN: To -- I think there's because there's no dough involved, because, to a certain extent, decisions, journalistic decisions, are made based on what sells newspapers, and what sells television programs...

COHEN: Surely not, surely not.

BROWN: This is true.

COHEN: I'm shocked to hear it.

BROWN: Perhaps not in your paper over at "The New York Times," but I assure you that television is the ultimate democracy. People vote all the time, and that's, right or wrong, honestly, we need to pay some attention to that, don't we?

COHEN: Well, sure. And it's a story that should be covered. But the question is, how much is it covered? And what other stories are neglected in order to cover it? That, I think, is -- involves a professional ethical obligation to the people that you -- look to you and -- well, less so to me -- for news.

BROWN: There's an interesting right or wrong, I'm not sure exactly where it centers, in this whole debate and discussion over weapons of mass destruction and what the government may have known, may have sort of known, but made it sound like maybe they knew more, all of that. What do you see there?

COHEN: I see you being surprising gentle, Aaron. I think the story -- and I think this is the big ethical story of the week -- is many people are asserting that the president is a liar, that the president lied about -- in order to get our country into a war. That's a serious story.

BROWN: Well, yes, but it's also -- that would be a very serious story. One should have evidence of that, though, shouldn't one, before one makes that argument?

COHEN: Do you mean, before one drags the country into a war?

BROWN: Well, that also. But before one asserts that anyone, including the president of the United States, is a liar, one ought to be able to prove that.

COHEN: Well, it's an interesting problem, that the -- and more and more papers are reporting it now, that the president listed three causes for the war, Iraq was an imminent threat to us, and to its neighbors, that Iraq was connected with the events of September 11, and that there would be weapons of mass destruction there.

None of these things have been found. And I think many people believe the burden is on the president to prove his case. And if he doesn't, he then, it seems to me, is either a liar or a fool, and that's a very awkward position to be in.

BROWN: Well, couldn't -- how are we doing on time here? Oh, well, that answers that question.

I mean not sure what the ethic -- Let me just go another minute, OK? We'll figure it out. I know you will.

Why is the burden on the president, and why are those the two choices? Why isn't one of the choices that intelligence was simply wrong? They thought they were right, but they were wrong. That is also a possibility.

COHEN: Well, yes, but the alternatives then are corrupt or incompetent. And that if you are so wrong about all three causes, then I wonder if you can honorably hold -- continue to hold your office. It's an important thing. Many people died.

BROWN: They died (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

COHEN: And the questions of his integrity have been raised by many places.

BROWN: And I agree with that.

COHEN: By members of both parties. I think it has to be taken seriously as an ethical matter, absolutely.

BROWN: Usually we come, you know, you come in here and we yuk it up some. But...

COHEN: Well, I -- it's a big week for ethics.

BROWN: It is a big week.

COHEN: And this is kind of the big ethical story, and it's a serious story.

BROWN: It is a very serious story. We don't...

COHEN: (UNINTELLIGIBLE), I know, I like the funny ones so much better myself.

BROWN: Well, we like them both, and we like you. Thanks for coming in.

COHEN: Thanks for having me.

BROWN: Thank you very much.

As we continue, take a look at some of the stories from overseas, and they're, believe me, in the control room, trying to figure out how much time we have for this. We'll take a break first, then we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: The fighting in Liberia in West Africa seems to have escalated now to a point where the United States today ordered non- emergency embassy personnel to leave the capital city of Monrovia, and also said that the Liberian president, Charles Taylor, should face a war crimes tribunal.

CNN's Jeff Koinange is on the phone from Monrovia tonight -- Jeff.

JEFF KOINANGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on phone): That's right, Aaron. And the capital, as we speak, is very tense. We understand there was heavy fighting today, all day. The rebels have crushed a key bridge leading into the city. And for the first time, they are inside the city itself, which is causing a lot of alarm within the government.

On our drive from the airport, Aaron, a 70-kilometer drive, about 40 miles, there were about 20 military checks, an average of one every two miles. And we had to stop, and they would check our bags. And you know how us TV people travel with so much equipment. It was very tiresome, it was very tense. And the soldiers were taking no chances.

They don't any foreigners here. They kept asking us what we're doing here. But we insisted we were here to do this story. It was extremely, extremely tense. I've been traveling through Liberia many times. I have never seen it this tense.

But the government do insist they are in full control. They're going to do whatever they can to repel the rebels. And the weekend should bring more news, Aaron. But right now, the situation is, as I said, very tense.

BROWN: All right, two quick questions, Jeff. One is, is this an ideological battle between the rebels and the government? And secondly, how does this government in Liberia come to power? Did it come to power in elections? Did it come to power by force?

KOINANGE: Let me answer the second one first, Aaron. In 1997, they held widely acclaimed elections. President Charles Taylor did actually win that election. However, because he had begun a civil war nine years earlier, people thought that he was the best man for the job only because the war would stop.

Since he's been in power, he's been embattled because various rebel groups came up and started challenging him and his presidency.

So he hasn't had a good time, he hasn't had an easy time in the last six years or so. Couple of days ago, he said he would step down if it meant that peace will come to Liberia. I think this ideological (UNINTELLIGIBLE) that you talk about is the rebels now see the momentum, they see that now that Charles Taylor has said he's willing to step down, they're going to intensify the struggle.

And that's why you see them in the city. They haven't been able to get into the city limits before. This time they've crossed that key bridge I talked about. They are within the city limits.

And on top of that, the citizens, instead of fleeing the other way, out of town, they are fleeing into town, so the rebels now have a chance to infiltrate within the population. And it's making the situation even more tense, because the soldiers are not going to take any chances, Aaron.

BROWN: Jeff, stay safe in your reporting assignment there. We appreciate your work tonight. Thank you very much.

Jeff Koinange in Monrovia tonight.

Onsun Suchi (ph), the Burmese opposition leader, who won the Nobel Peace Prize a decade ago, has not been seen for a week now, not since she was taken into what the military government that she opposes, by the way, calls protective custody. This has lots of people worried, more than worried.

Bush administration is talking about new sanctions against the government of Myanmar, as Burma is now called. And the U.N. representative is in the country, hoping to find Suchi if he can.

From Thailand, CNN's Tom Mintier has the story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM MINTIER, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): As efforts were under way by a U.N. envoy to secure the release of Onsun Suchi, demonstrators gathered outside the U.N.'s regional headquarters in Bangkok to voice their concerns.

These are members of the Overseas National Students Organization of Burma, frequent protesters here, usually outside the Myanmar embassy.

AUNG TUNG HTWE, NATIONAL STUDENTS ORGANIZATION OF BURMA: We oppose the terrorist government in Burma who oppress all people, including Onsun Suchi, and all opposition party members.

MINTIER: Onsun Suchi has not been seen in public since last Friday, when she was detained by the military authorities, along with nearly two dozen of her supporters, following a clash with what some called government-sponsored opponents.

The U.N. has sent a special envoy to Myanmar in an attempt to see Suchi or gain her release. Malaysian diplomat Razali Ismail is no stranger to the government in Myanmar. It was Razali who helped secure Suchi's release from house arrest more than a year ago.

RAZALI ISMAIL, U.N. SPECIAL ENVOY TO MYANMAR: There's increasing concern about her -- about Onsun Suchi now. Nobody has seen her. She has not said a word. And as I said, rumors are swirling about her being injured. So I must be able to come out and see her and then come out and to be able to assure everybody that she is fine, or (UNINTELLIGIBLE) she is not injured.

MINTIER: There have been persistent rumors that Suchi was seriously injured in last Friday's clashes. U.S. diplomats have claimed that evidence at the scene of the clash indicates that many people could have been injured, more than they say the Myanmar government has admitted to. The U.N. envoy that is currently in Myanmar has called on countries in the region to support his mission to free Suchi. On Friday, the Japanese foreign minister called on the Myanmar government to cooperate.

YORIKO KAWAGUCHI, JAPANESE FOREIGN MINISTER (through translator): We would like to have Onsun Suchi released immediately, the NLD be allowed to resume their political activities freely, and the situation in Myanmar return to normal as soon as possible.

MINTIER: The current situation is far from normal. These are the most recent pictures of Suchi during a recent rally, amateur video smuggled out of the country.

After these pictures were taken, not only was Suchi detained, but offices of the National League for Democracy, or NLD, were closed around the country, and other political activists were either picked up or restricted to their homes.

Nobody is quite sure who has been arrested, but contact with any NLD leaders has been impossible because phone lines have apparently been cut.

The U.N. envoy is scheduled to remain in the Myanmar for five days. Before he arrived, he said freeing Suchi was a primary objective.

RAZALI: I would want her to be free, but if I were any -- Yes. (UNINTELLIGIBLE), she was free before. Why put her back?

MINTIER: Onsun Suchi has spent years under house arrest since her victory in the 1990 elections, elections that have never been honored by the military rulers of Myanmar. Allowed to leave her home a year ago and stage rallies around the country, it appeared to some that things might have changed for the better in Myanmar.

That illusion was shattered a week ago by the harsh crackdown on dissent that has included the closure of schools and universities across the country.

Tom Mintier, CNN, Bangkok.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Still ahead on NEWSNIGHT, tomorrow's news tonight. Actually a kind of a long segment of tomorrow's news tonight. We'll take a look at morning papers from around the country and around the world. But we'll take a break first.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Weird collection of stories there, wasn't it?

Speaking of which, time for morning papers, a look at newspapers from around the country and around the world. We get a lot of mail on this segment. People either love it or hate it. But those people who love it think we do it too quickly. That is not going to be the problem tonight. OK?

Remember when I went a little long with Randy -- OK. You do. About to pay for it.

Fortunately, there are some sort of cool things in the papers today. We'll see, won't we?

"The Cincinnati Enquirer," the paper of Cincinnati, Ohio, Funny Cide, the horse who runs for the Triple Crown tomorrow here in New York, makes the front page in most papers. No joke, Funny Cide could make history. But what is -- oh, down at the bottom, then I'll get to the one I really want to talk about.

"Wet Spring Has Farmers' Crops on the Ropes." I don't know if it's been terribly -- terrible weather where you are, but out here in the East and in a lot of the Midwest, it's just been awful, and it's going to be lousy again this weekend.

Now, here's what I like. Watch how different papers play this story. "Pentagon Concedes Intelligence Shortfall, Nukes, Germs Unproven." This is the weapons of mass destruction story today. And this is how "The Cincinnati Enquirer played it, "Pentagon Concedes Intelligence Shortfall."

Same story, OK, different paper. "The San Francisco Chronicle" headlines the story this way, "Pentagon Defends Iraq Arms Claim, Two Top Officials Go Public About the Lack of Evidence."

So in "The Chronicle," "Pentagon Defends," and in the "Enquirer," "Pentagon Concedes." Which is it, you guys? It's actually both, depending on what part of the story you wrote, but that's how the two papers headline the story.

One other thing I wanted to mention, now, in "The Enquirer," or rather "The Chronicle," the veil, the women in Florida who wanted to keep her veil on when she had the driver's license picture, they have that story on the front page, and you see her veiled, right?

OK, "Miami Herald," of course they would front-page the story, because it's a Florida story. "Judge: Veil Must Come Off," and you see the woman again, and you see the picture of her veiled. Now, also they put the Pentagon story, "Pentagon Agency Had Doubts on Iraqi Arms." That's a pretty good take on that story.

Now, back to -- now "The Washington Times." GO down to the bottom here. "The Washington Times," "Court Lifts Veil from Driver's License, Muslim Woman's Rights Not Infringed, Florida Judge Rules." And they have the picture of her veiled, and they also have a picture of her unveiled. This is actually a mug shot. She was arrested at some point in her life in the state of Illinois, 1998, I don't know what she was arrested for.

But they decided to show you what she looks like. I'm not sure that was a good or bad decision. We don't make that judgment, we just point it out.

And the last one, and interestingly, it is the last one, "Hit the Road." "The Boston Herald," "Romney Calls on Bulger to Quit" U.S. -- or "UMass Presidency." And Funny Cide is right there too.

And I don't know if Funny Cide will win tomorrow, but I'll be rooting for -- is it a him or a her? Well, it's sort of in between, actually.

We'll see you on Monday, 10:00 Eastern time. Until then, good night for all of us at NEWSNIGHT.

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