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CNN Newsnight Aaron Brown

Bush to Go Before U.N.; Mohammed Reveals 9/11 Planning Details; Appeals Court Hears Arguments in California Recall Case

Aired September 22, 2003 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


AARON BROWN, HOST: Good evening again. The world has changed a lot since President Bush last went before the United Nations. There are 150,000 foreign soldiers in Iraq tonight, most all of them American. The skeleton of what may someday be a democracy of sorts is being formed, but between here and there the road is rich with danger.
The security situation in too much of the country threatens any good will the liberation created. Growing pains, to be sure, but serious enough to send the president back to the General Assembly tomorrow morning.

It is not that the president needs the U.N.'s help. The people of Iraq and the people of the United States do, and the president needs to find the right words and the right tone tomorrow, or risk leaving empty handed again.

Much anticipated and expected at the speech. We begin the whip with our senior White House correspondent, John King. John, a headline.

JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, we are told the president will be quite unapologetic. He will say the war is right, was right and the world should rejoice the fact that Saddam Hussein is gone. He will say, though, that he needs U.N. help. His critics say Mr. Bush is better be ready to give up a lot of power in Iraq if that help is to be forthcoming -- Aaron.

BROWN: John, thank you. We'll get to you as quickly as we can. Next to what the planner of the 9/11 attacks is saying and perhaps why we're learning about it now. CNN's David Ensor has been working on that. David, a headline.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Khalid Shaikh Mohammed is talking, Aaron. He is talking to the CIA interrogators that are listening to everything he has to say. He is talking about what was really planned at 9/11, what the original plans were, and they went well beyond the ones that were carried out. They included the West Coast.

BROWN: David, thank you. Onto the California recall. Back in court today. CNN's Frank Buckley keeping tags -- tabs -- goodness. Frank, get me out of this. A headline.

FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, voters here in California don't yet know if they'll be casting their ballots in October or in March. Today lawyers argued over when the election should take place, and in a rare move the federal appeals court that heard the arguments opened their courtroom to cameras -- Aaron.

BROWN: Frank, thank you. Let's see how I do here. Finally, the hurricane, four days later and still being felt. CNN's Susan Candiotti in North Carolina tonight. A headline.

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Aaron. If you live on Cape Hatteras, it will take you four hours by ferry to get back home. In Virginia, several more days to get your power back, and in Maryland, there's a new warning about eating shellfish. All examples of life after Isabel.

BROWN: Susan, thank you. Back to you and the rest shortly.

Also coming up on this Monday edition of "NEWSNIGHT," we'll be joined by Madeleine Albright, the former secretary of state and ambassador to the U.N. We will talk about the president's speech tomorrow.

We'll talk with Bill Maher, certainly the anti-ambassador to someplace. No diplomat he, but someone who cuts through the fog while getting a laugh or two along the way. And if Groucho could get a laugh with a duck, hey, why not rooster? Say the secret words. Morning papers. And the rooster will crow. All will, all that and more in the hour ahead.

We begin with the president's morning tomorrow at the United Nations. The words "deja vu" entirely fitting in this case, and not simply because they're French. Because, in a way, the challenges haven't much changed in the last year or so, even if the circumstances clearly have. President Bush will once again make an appearance at a venue he has approached only reluctantly in the past. He will face a mostly skeptical audience, and we expect will ask the organization of Iraq largely his way. We begin with our senior White House correspondent John King.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KING (voice-over): The president will say the war was right and tell the United Nations it should be proud Saddam Hussein is gone. And as he makes a first-hand appeal for help in rebuilding now, aides say Mr. Bush will insist Iraq's political transition must take place on an orderly timetable, his timetable.

CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: As soon as possible, but to do it in a way that is responsible.

KING: The White House says a French proposal to immediately let Iraqis run their country before elections and without a constitution is a recipe for disaster.

AMB. PAUL BREMER, U.S. CIVIL ADMINISTRATOR TO IRAQ: To do so would invite economic collapse, followed by political extremism, and a return to terrorism. KING: Last year, Mr. Bush rallied U.N. support for new weapons inspections and a new warning to Saddam Hussein, but then failed to get Security Council blessing for the war itself. This year, he will appeal for more international troops and tens of billions in reconstruction money to help win the peace. And the president invited Iraq's new public works and electricity ministers to the Oval Office to help make his case.

AYHAM SAMERAEI, IRAQI ELECTRICITY MINISTER: We are going to build a democracy in Iraq, and it will become an example for all the Middle East areas.

KING: There will be no shortage of critics and skeptics at the United Nations. Mr. Bush will speak at the lowest point of his presidency in terms of public opinion here at home.

Americans are now split when asked to rate Mr. Bush's job performance. Fifty percent approve and 47 percent disapprove. And just 50 percent of Americans now say it was worth going to war in Iraq, down from 58 percent just 10 days ago.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KING: And the president's U.N. agenda goes well beyond the big speech to the General Assembly tomorrow. He will have key one-on-one meetings with a number of world leaders who are critical to this debate, the leaders of France and Germany among them. Some fence- mending there, but Aaron, the White House hopes for somehow having a consensus by the end of this week are now dashed. They hope simply to make some progress. And again the president's critics are saying that progress will only come if this White House is willing to give up more authority on the ground in Iraq. So far the White House says, probably not.

BROWN: What realistically can the Americans hope for here, in terms of numbers of troops and amount of money?

BROWN: The amount of money is the big issue now from the White House standpoint, because of the political dynamic back home. At most, they hope for maybe 15,000 more troops. That would still mean 100,000 U.S. troops in Iraq one year from today. But Paul Bremer was up on Capitol Hill today. Members of Congress are going to give the president his $87 billion, but they are raising hell, excuse the word, about it, because of the economy here at home; $20 billion of that would go to reconstruction. They look for about $12 billion in Iraqi oil next year. They need $50 billion or $60 billion for the reconstruction projects on the drawing board. You don't need to be a math major; this president has to find $40 billion or $50 billion somewhere else out there in the world. So far, very hard to find people willing to say, here comes a check.

BROWN: That was the next question. Is that even close to a realistic number, $40 billion?

KING: Well, that's what they need. The Iraqi electricity minister came out today. He said he was grateful to the United States, he was grateful for that $20 billion, but he said $80 billion, perhaps even $100 billion, if you look two, three years down the road. The United States has invested. The president says the mission cannot fail. If the money doesn't come from somewhere else, he's going to have to go back to Congress.

BROWN: John, thank you. We'll see you tomorrow morning. John King, our senior White House correspondent. We hope we will see you tomorrow morning as well. This quick program note: Join Paula Zahn and me tomorrow, 10:00 our coverage begins. President expected to speak somewhere between 10:20 and 10:30. Again, our coverage begins 10:00 tomorrow morning here on CNN.

As if to underscore the complications of getting involved in Iraq at all, there was another attempt on U.N. lives in Baghdad today.

The fact that it failed attribute to one of the achievements the bomber no doubt was hoping to prevent. There is now an Iraqi police force. An Iraqi security guard saved a lot of lives today while sacrificing his own. Here is CNN's Walt Rodgers.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALTER RODGERS, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): There was another loud explosion in Baghdad. Then the wail of sirens. Fire and rescue vehicles rushing again to the United Nations headquarters here.

The familiar burned out hulk of a suicide bomber's car and a charred corpse. An Iraqi security guard was also killed trying to stop the suicide bomber.

CAPT. SEAN KIRLEY: He wasn't going to get in. And I think he realized that. And his targets -- his -- he changed his target.

RODGERS: Since the far more deadly bombing of the same U.N. building August 19, when 23 people died, U.S. and coalition forces pushed the U.N. security perimeter much further back. Still, if you were among the 18 or 19 wounded, this car bomb was terrifying.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We were passing by in our car in front of the United Nations headquarters when suddenly I fainted. And then I don't remember anything.

RODGERS: After this second attack on the United Nations compound in Baghdad, officials here and in New York are reconsidering the level of the U.N.'s commitment in Iraq. That safety review puts in doubt the future of the U.N.'s vaccination, water purification and other programs here.

ANTONIA PARADELA, U.N. SPOKESWOMAN: We are seeing an increase of security incidents, and we are worried that this might hamper vital U.N. operations in Iraq.

RODGERS (on camera): This latest attempt to bomb U.N. headquarters is yet another fiery reminder that the United Nations label gives no one immunity in Iraq, and that this remains a high-risk war zone for anyone who lives or works here.

Walter Rodgers, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Had it not been for the attacks of 9/11, it's hard to imagine there would have been a war with Iraq. And we have learned much more about the 9/11 plot in just the last days than we ever knew before. The source, if he's being truthful, is impeccable. And the information tells us a good deal about al Qaeda and the man who still leads it. Here is CNN's David Ensor.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR (voice-over): The tallest tower in Los Angeles was among the original targets discussed by Osama bin Laden and Khalid Shaikh Mohammed back in 1996 when they first planned what became the 9/11 attacks. According to U.S. government sources with access to what interrogators are getting from Mohammed, who is now a prisoner of the CIA. The original plan called for five hijacked planes on each coast of the United States, a total of 10 aircraft, these sources say.

Mohammed paints a picture of bin Laden playing a central role in the planning five years before the attacks, scaling them down to improve their chances.

MATT LEVITT, FORMER FBI ANALYST: It was more important to have four successful hijackings that would successfully strike at our political, military and economic infrastructure than to have an attack where eight or 10 planes involved and perhaps because of being overly ambitious, the plot would be discovered and thwarted.

ENSOR: At one point in the planning, the 9/11 attacks were to include 22 hijackers on the four aircraft, officials say Mohammed has told his interrogators. The attacks were to be followed by a second wave, carried out with help from al Qaeda allies in Southeast Asia.

Officials say another key prisoner has been talking, too -- the man known as Hambali, accused of orchestrating the Bali bombings, has told his American interrogators about a plot to attack a couple of large hotels in Thailand during the upcoming meeting of Asian and Pacific leaders, including President Bush.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR: Officials say Hambali's brother and close associate, Ruswan Gunawan (ph), has also been captured, this weekend in Pakistan, along with around 16 others, one official calling that a useful catch -- Aaron.

BROWN: And why are we hearing about this now?

ENSOR: We're hearing about this not because of some kind of leak. You get those in Washington a lot. But it's just hard shoe leather by the Associated Press, which broke this story yesterday. I understand that they had some -- quite some difficulty getting people to tell them about it. And certainly the agencies I spoke to about it today were quite upset the story has come out.

They don't really want al Qaeda people who are out there now listening to this to know too much about what Khalid Shaikh Mohammed is telling them. So they were weren't too happy to have this story coming out today.

BROWN: Thank you. David Ensor in Washington tonight.

Few things are more chilling than the possibility of an enemy within. And we ought to point out few words are more loaded and dangerous and damaging than traitor and spy. Yet those are precisely the words being used in connection with an army chaplain tonight. Rightly or wrongly, we do not know. Nobody but the military has seen the evidence, but it's evidence enough to land the man in a navy bring.

Here's CNN's Barbara Starr.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sources tell CNN that the government is now investigating whether Army Chaplain Captain James Yee was involved with others in possible security breaches at the U.S. naval facility in Guantanamo Bay. He ministered to some of the more than 600 detainees, including suspected al Qaeda.

CAPT. JAMES YEE, U.S. ARMY CHAPLAIN: I don't get into whether or not they're terrorists. That's not my job.

STARR: There may be more arrests. When the Islamic chaplain was taken into custody, sources say he was found to be carrying classified information without authority, including maps and drawings of the detention facility, notes from interrogations of detainees, including detainee names, which have never been divulged, and a laptop computer with a modem, which is prohibited at the base.

He also may have been seen on law enforcement surveillance tapes at locations where Muslim groups had met in the U.S., according to a senior official.

Captain Yee has not been charged, but is now suspected of treason and espionage, sources say.

Yee has appeared on television discussing his work.

YEE: I have belt the rapport. I have built relationships with the detainees, so they feel -- many of them, several of them -- the majority of them feel comfortable talking to me, knowing that I am -- will sincerely address their concerns.

STARR: Yee's family is not talking. A Chinese American, Yee graduated from West Point in 1990, and served as a missile officer during the first Gulf War. He then left the Army, converted to Islam, and moved to Syria to study for four years, before returning to the U.S. and rejoining the army as a Muslim cleric. (on camera): Yee appeared before a military magistrate on September 15 with two defense attorneys. He is now being held at the naval bring in Charleston, South Carolina. The U.S. military has 120 days to charge him.

Barbara Starr, CNN, the Pentagon.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Other news tonight, a number of residents in parts of Virginia heard this today: they can now turn on the tap and drink the water. Perhaps not flip a switch and have the lights come on or send their kids out to school. But four days since Hurricane Isabel, safe drinking water is a nice start. They happen to be the lucky ones.

Here's CNN's Susan Candiotti.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CANDIOTTI (voice-over): In the hardest hit state, Virginia, the president came to call, and thanked rescue workers for helping victims of Hurricane Isabel.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The response to this hurricane has been really great.

CANDIOTTI: However, the storm and its aftermath now have claimed 23 lives in Virginia, bringing the death toll in seven stats to at least 40, including a woman who fell down her stairs in the dark and broke her neck.

About 700,000 Virginia Power customers remain in the dark. The state predicts three quarters of them should be back on line by Thursday.

Ice and water and food deliveries have not slowed. Over the weekend, there were complaints help wasn't coming fast enough.

On Monday, at least some were more patient.

CHARLIE HARRIS, RESIDENT: We're doing all right. It's not so bad. It's not oppressively hot, anything like that. You know ,didn't get to watch the Redskins play football yesterday, but that's OK. We can live without that for one Sunday.

CANDIOTTI: In Maryland, residents around the Chesapeake Bay will have to live without shellfish, at least for a while. Officials have banned catching shellfish in that state's portion of the Bay because of pollution from a sewage treatment plant.

In North Carolina, the Army Corps of Engineers is debating the future of Cape Hatteras -- what to do about Highway 12. Isabel's storm surge of up to 30 feet obliterated the road, cutting off Hatteras Village from the rest of the Outer Banks. They might need a new bridge. The 4,500 residents who lived there can now return by ferry, a four-hour ride, while relief supplies go in. Restoring electricity there might take a while. However, officials predict 75 percent of its customers on the Outer Banks should have their lights back on by Tuesday. Most of the rest of the state by Sunday.

In Kitty Hawk, residents who were allowed to return to oceanfront property over the weekend were ordered out again so crews could repair roads without interference.

Statewide, the Red Cross and National Guard are delivering disaster relief -- hot meals for those in need.

SANDY WALLACE, AMERICAN RED CROSS: It's very important that we give them that little bit of normalcy back into their life.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CANDIOTTI: And a hot meal can make a big difference if you don't have power.

And, Aaron, you also pick up some quirky information in hurricane aftermath. For example, in North Carolina, 150 prison inmates are helping to clean up the debris. Interesting. Although officials add that seven of them are using chainsaws, in case you were wondering.

BROWN: Thank you, Susan. CNN's Susan Candiotti in North Carolina tonight.

Up ahead on NEWSNIGHT, the challenges facing the president at the U.N. tomorrow. We'll be joined by former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright.

And a little bit later on, we'll talk politics national and local, the locale being California, with Bill Maher.

Break first. From CNN, this is NEWSNIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: We're always pleased to welcome our next guest to the program, doubly so tonight. Madeleine Albright has a new book out "Madam Secretary," a memoir of her years as the diplomatic voice as secretary of state during the Clinton administration and of course, earlier than that at the U.N. Ambassador. With President Bush speaking at the U.N. in the morning seemed like a wonderful opportunity to talk with Ms. Albright, so we're glad to see you, welcome.

MADELEINE ALBRIGHT, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: Good to be with you.

BROWN: What do you want to hear from the president tomorrow?

What are the magic words, if there are any in this situation?

ALBRIGHT: Well, I would like to hear him say that we need help from other countries in order to deal with an issue that is of importance to all of us -- the future of Iraq and the Middle East. I'm afraid, though, that President Bush is facing a much more skeptical audience than the last time he spoke. And he does not have an easy job to persuade countries to come in there with us now when they weren't willing to do so at the beginning.

BROWN: But isn't the situation in some respects clearer now? No one wants -- no one -- well, I don't want to say no one because there's always someone. But generally speaking, no one would argue that you can't leave Iraq in the mess that it's currently in.

ALBRIGHT: I think that's true. But the questions, as I understand them that they're trying to resolve in creating a Security Council resolution, is what kind of power the United Nations will have and what the role and coordination with the United States will continue to be. And I think that I would like to hear President Bush say that the U.N. does in fact have a vital role and that they are in a position to run the political, economic and humanitarian part of Iraq while letting the United States run the military command. And it depends on how the president phrases his arguments, whether it will be possible to get that kind of a resolution.

BROWN: What's the -- from the American side of the administration side, what is the downside, if you will, of letting the U.N. handle humanitarian and political side of this while the Americans keep control of the military side?

ALBRIGHT: Well, I think the issues would be some of coordination. And, clearly, it becomes more complicated the more agencies, et cetera, are involved. On the other hand, I think it's an excellent way to share the responsibilities and the burdens and the cost and it's worth it, because I do think this is now an international issue. And we were able, when we were in office, to develop a number of models for dealing with this kind of thing. Whether it was in Kosovo or in Timor, there are different ways for there to be a lead country in the military arena and, at the same time, allow the United Nations to do what it does so well, which is the political, economic and humanitarian aspects.

BROWN: Do you think there are countries that want the Americans to fail in Iraq?

ALBRIGHT: Well, there probably are. I don't think that it's a very useful position, because if there is failure in Iraq, it will have consequences throughout the region and even wider. And, therefore, I wish that we would all understand that it's important for the process to succeed and for Iraq not to become what I'm afraid it is becoming -- a gathering ground or a breeding ground for terrorists. It becomes, in many ways, a self-fulfilling prophecy, because President Bush has said that there was a linkage between what happened 9/11, al Qaeda, Osama bin Laden and Iraq, something that I had problems believing in the first place. But now I do think that it does become a self-fulfilling prophecy. And I hope that other countries would understand that it is no nobody's advantage to have that proceed.

BROWN: Is the world better off with the -- with Iraq as it currently exists than it was with the Iraq of Saddam Hussein?

ALBRIGHT: The world is definitely better off without Saddam Hussein. It is not great, however, to have a chaotic situation in Iraq. And I do believe that there was not enough adequate planning for the post-war part of the Iraqi campaign. I have the greatest admiration and respect for the American military. They did a brilliant job. They won a war very quickly. They are now in a very difficult position. And every morning when I hear the news about one or two or three Americans dying, I think it is a huge tragedy. And I hope very much that there is some admission that mistakes were made and try to look at it from a perspective that will bring success in post-war Iraq.

BROWN: Madam secretary, it's good to talk to you. The book is called "Madam Secretary." Madeleine Albright our guest. Thanks you again.

ALBRIGHT: Thank you, Aaron.

BROWN: Thank you.

When we come back, interesting new poll numbers if you like polls. There is plenty to munch on about the president and his rivals. And the California recall merry-go-round stops at the Federal Appeals Court 9th Circuit. We take a break. This is NEWSNIGHT from New York.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Perhaps comparisons wean Florida 2000 and California 2003 have gotten to be a bit much. Perhaps. Another player in the first drama made an encore appearance today. Constitutional lawyer Laurence Tribe, who argued for postponing the California recall election. With support for the recall fading somewhat -- and we underscore somewhat -- much of the strategy has shifted to questions of timing, which, in a way, is a case of bad timing, because right now nobody but the 11 judges on the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals panel have a say on the timing. And their decision expected very shortly.

Here is CNN's Frank Buckley.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BUCKLEY (voice-over): With half a million absentee ballots already cast, the election underway. Judges from the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals heard arguments on whether election day it self should be postpone. At issue punch card ballots and whether error rate would disenfranchise voters in the six counties that use them.

JUDGE ALEX KOZINSKI, 9TH CIRCUIT COURT OF APPEALS: We don't have the Bush vs. Gore problem. We don't have the problem that

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, it's a worse problem. BUCKLEY: The candidates, meanwhile, pressed on as if October 7 was still the day. The presidential candidate du jour to campaign along the major Democrats in the case, Senator Joe Lieberman, who was with Lieutenant Governor Cruz Bustamante. Bustamante, meanwhile, put a good face on a court ruling that went against him, ordering him to stop accepting money for this race into an old campaign account.

LT. GOV. CRUZ BUSTAMANTE (D-CA), CALIFORNIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: We have done everything according to the way we should be doing it, and we're going to proceed.

BUCKLEY: As Arnold Schwarzenegger prepped in private for this week's debate, his campaign rolled out an ad against Governor Davis that certainly wasn't positive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, AD)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It makes no sense at all. If they're here illegally, why should they be able to drive legally?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BUCKLEY: But the ad did not, his aides claim, break Schwarzenegger's pledge not to go negative. The Davis campaign strongly disagreed. And the governor took a couple of shots at Schwarzenegger during an environmental event.

GOV. GRAY DAVIS (D), CALIFORNIA: California's environmental record under my administration is a leader in America. Arnold hasn't voted very much. He obviously hasn't been reading the paper thoroughly.

BUCKLEY: And while the big guys went after each other...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's willing to go into that upside down.

BUCKLEY: ... the little guys went on "The Tonight Show" together. Jay Leno invited dozens of not-ready-for-prime-time politicians to hang out in the audience.

MARY CAREY, CALIFORNIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: We are a group of oddballs. California is a true democracy. We're showing the world how anyone from all walks of life can run for a government position. And I think that is what is so great about America.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BUCKLEY: And one of our producers who attended the taping at NBC this evening tells us that one of those not-ready-for-prime-time politicians was ejected from the audience. He wouldn't stop yelling, "Equal time, equal time."

As for the voters and the question, "When do we go to the polls?" a decision is expected tomorrow by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals that will either mean an election just two weeks from tomorrow or an election in March. But that could also change if tomorrow's decision is appealed and the Supreme Court decides to take the case -- Aaron.

BROWN: Thank you, Frank. Let's just hope tomorrow, one way or another, it gets decided. Thank you, sir.

On to presidential politics, another day, another Democratic candidate you may have thought was already running. Today, Carol Moseley Braun made it official. The former senator from Illinois launched her campaign this morning at Howard University in Washington, D.C. She said the country is at a tipping point and she said that she offers the clearest alternative to the Bush administration. Recent polling shows her to be a distinct underdog.

Polls, for all their usefulness, need to be read carefully. They are snapshots of a moment, in this case, the current moment, and may or may not be a predictor of the days ahead. With that disclaimer, a new CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup suggests reason for concern at the White House and some cause for celebration in Little Rock. That would be the Arkansas city from which General Wesley Clark hails.

And while we don't necessarily celebrate, we are always pleased when Bill Schneider joins us, as he does tonight.

Mr. Schneider, nice to see you.

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: The president's approval rating, why don't we begin there?

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SR. POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, you begin with the fact that Bush is sinking. His approval rating has sunk from 60 percent just a month ago to 50 percent now.

Now, that is a significant figure, that 50 percent. You see, almost as many Americans disapprove of the job he is doing; 50 percent is the break-even point. When he slips below 50 -- and this is the lowest this president has ever been -- if he slips below 50, his reelection is very much in doubt.

What the polling shows is, he's losing support among men. Men are particularly concerned about the loss of jobs in this country, almost three million lost since 2000. And the tax cuts have not generated the new jobs that were promised. The speech on Iraq did not do the president any good earlier this month, because it raised the prospect of an $87 billion price tag. So a lot of Americans are saying, why are we spending $87 billion in Iraq when this country's economy is in so much trouble?

BROWN: We'll do with the president a little more in a moment. Let's talk about General Clark, who -- this is really the first poll taken since he announced. How does he show?

SCHNEIDER: Amazing. Little Rock, mother of presidents. Who knew?

Because the general has vaulted to the top of the heap. He's only been in the race less than a week. And look at that. He's 22 percent, ahead of Howard Dean, John Kerry, Dick Gephardt, Joe Lieberman. All the other candidates, including Carol Moseley Braun, are in single digits. Clark is clearly a phenomenon. And he declared his candidacy at exactly the right moment. The moment is when Bush begins to look vulnerable and suddenly a new face appears.

The field had been very lackluster to most Democrats. But the one thing you can say about Wesley Clark is, he does not lack luster. After his name come the words supreme allied commander and former Rhodes Scholar and first in his class as West Point. And a lot of men are flocking to his candidacy, the same men who are losing faith in President Bush's policies. So he looks like the right man for this moment. But, of course, half of Americans say they don't know anything about him.

BROWN: Good thing to underscore and also underscore this moment. But just for the fun of it, if it was today a Bush-Clark race, what does our polling say?

SCHNEIDER: The polling says it would be close. It would be down to the wire. Did you enjoy 2000? Well, look at this. Bush vs. Clark, Clark leads Bush by three points. That's the best showing of any of the Democratic contenders.

Suppose it were Howard Dean, who comes in second in the Democratic race. Well, he would lose to Bush by three points. So Clark looks strong. Dean looks weak. But the fact is, in both cases, it's too close to call. It's a statistical dead heat. So there's every indication, one, that President Bush's reelection prospects are insecure. Two, this looks like a very close race, that it could end up being just as close as the race in 2000. Nothing is for sure, except, President Bush is in a lot of trouble.

BROWN: Well, one other thing is for sure. We've got a year to go. We have got a ways to go to see how this plays out.

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: Thank you Bill -- Bill Schneider in Washington.

More on the political landscape in a moment. We'll hear what Bill Maher has to say about California and presidential politics as well.

And a little bit later, Saira Shah returns to the program to talk about her new book, her journey in Afghanistan. You'll remember her documentary, "Beneath the Veil." Who could forget it?

That and more as NEWSNIGHT continues on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: If you think the California recall seems to have a bit of who's on first quality to it, I assure you, you are not alone. Keeping track of who's running, who's dropping out, and when the vote will or won't occur is more confusing than an Abbott & Costello routine.

So who better to help sort us out or make us laugh at it, perhaps, than Bill Maher? His HBO program, "Real Time With Bill Maher," has its season finale this Friday. And in just case you did not know it, HBO and CNN are owned by AOL T.W., which will just be T.W. once the old stationary is gone.

We talked with Mr. Maher earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Mr. Maher, this seems to me, at least at this point, to be the year of supporting candidates we know very little about. Let's start in your state in California, where Mr. Schwarzenegger is doing just fine, thank you, but I'm not sure anybody knows why they're voting for him.

BILL MAHER, COMEDIAN: Well, we in California, I think, are doing better than people are on the national level. They get to watch a debate among 10 Democrats. And each candidate gets about five seconds to answer a question. And among the questions are, "What's your favorite song?" which was in the last debate.

BROWN: Do you watch the Democratic debates?

MAHER: Oh, how can you miss it? It's riveting television.

BROWN: Are you watching it for information or for jokes?

MAHER: For both. But there's too many candidates. There's 10 people there. So nobody gets enough time to really make a point or make an impression or give the voters an informed choice. At least here in California, we have weeded out the 2 and 3 percenters. We're down to the governor and his sidekick, Sancho Panza, and the Viennese weightlifter. We're good.

BROWN: And what about your buddy, Arianna?

MAHER: Well, if you believe the polls -- and we don't -- she's trailing pretty badly. But miracles happen. And that's what we're praying for, because there's nobody better qualified -- not that that matters in an election.

BROWN: Right. Why do you think that is so?

MAHER: Because the public perception of her is of a socialite. And she's having trouble undoing that perception with the common man.

And last time I was on, you asked -- you said you're very hard on the media. Well, that's one of the reasons I am, is because I think they don't help her very much in getting her message out and in enabling people to understand who she really is.

BROWN: Not to seem defensive, because, good lord, I would never do this, but this is a woman who has been writing newspaper columns and appearing on TV talking about issues for many years now. MAHER: Right.

BROWN: Could it be that it might be something to do with her?

MAHER: Well, if she's been doing that, why does the mainstream media keep referring to her as a Gabor sister? I don't remember the Gabor sisters ever writing a prescient newspaper column twice a week. But maybe I missed it. Maybe they were using a pseudonym, like Dear Abby. Maybe the Gabor sisters are really Scotty Reston.

(LAUGHTER)

BROWN: Give me your take on Mr. Schwarzenegger.

MAHER: Well, I think he is a remarkable man. I never thought I would think of one person as both lecherous for a Kennedy and stupid for a bodybuilder. So I'm impressed with him.

(CROSSTALK)

MAHER: He's an outsider. And that still has an amazing cachet here and on the national level. And I don't understand why. I thought we went through this with Ross Perot, when discovered, oh, just because he's not in government doesn't mean that he's going to cure government. If we really want an outsider, I say Jacques Chirac. He's not even from America.

BROWN: And Wesley Clark, on the subject of outsiders and people who seem to have instant credibility, even as people don't necessarily know what he's about.

MAHER: Well, I think we do. What do you mean we don't know what he's about? He was a war hero. He was head of NATO. He led the war in Kosovo. I think we have a lot of information on Wesley Clark.

And I've said many times that I believe that, all things being equal, with the field of candidates, I think you've got to give it to the guy who has went to war, because, if he made the ultimate sacrifice, I think he's got dibs on the nomination. So, for me, it's between him and Kerry at the moment. And it looks like he's pulling ahead. I like him. I think he could be the Democrats' Eisenhower.

Eisenhower was a guy who came into office and gave us an honorable exit strategy from another messy war in Korea. And he could be the guy to do that for us in Iraq.

BROWN: Just finally, you are about to wrap up a season on television. What will you do in the time off?

MAHER: I am going to tend to my herb garden. I'm an amateur herbalist in learning, how to cure myself and to heal myself from all the partying I do during the season.

BROWN: Will you occasionally appear on television during that off-time? MAHER: I normally would. And I guess I probably will a couple of times, if asked by someone I like as much as you. But, generally, I think, the last year, since I got fired at ABC, I've been around a lot. I had a book out. I had this show. I answered a lot of questions on a lot of shows about the recall, because we do our show here in California.

I think the public could use a rest from me for a while. So I may be a little scarce. I may be a little hard to find.

BROWN: Well, we'll keep looking for you anyway.

MAHER: Yes.

BROWN: We enjoyed having you on the program. Thank you.

MAHER: All right.

BROWN: Thank you, Bill.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And that was Bill Maher earlier.

Saira Shah after the break.

Around the world, this is NEWSNIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Those of you who have watched this program from the beginning two years back will remember the night we previewed Saira Shah's documentary, "Beneath the Veil," her story of Afghanistan. And it was extraordinary. She's now written a book called "The Storyteller's Daughter," stories of her life, her family, her homeland and much more. And we're very pleased to see her again.

Welcome.

SAIRA SHAH, AUTHOR, "THE STORYTELLER'S DAUGHTER": Well, thank you for having me.

BROWN: Let's talk about Afghanistan a bit. Are you worried that, in an odd way, the United States went into Afghanistan for its own reasons, but not really for Afghan reasons?

SHAH: I think that absolutely is a central concern.

I think it's quite hard in the West, because it's quite a problem-solving culture. And it seems that there was a problem to solve in Afghanistan. I fear that perhaps the West is trying to solve the wrong problem in Afghanistan. It's very focused on getting rid of the Taliban, Osama bin Laden. But the causes of the Taliban and Osama bin Laden haven't been addressed. And they are the collapse of infrastructure in Afghanistan, the cultural warlordism, the generation that has grown up without education. All these things are fundamentally important. Otherwise, you can have more Taliban any time or more Osamas any time.

BROWN: And has any of that much changed since the Americans went in? We get a sense that the capital is under control and that, as you move out from the capital, it's varying degrees of anarchy or something.

SHAH: Yes, that's very much the impression I get as well.

I should say, I haven't been since I made "Unholy War," which was during the war against terror. I was supposed to go back this year and was unable to. But it is very much the impression that I get. And it also is something that's happened all through Afghanistan's history, that virtually every government has been able to control the capital and about four or five other cities in the country.

But 90 percent of the country carries on the way it's always carried on. And, unfortunately, in recent times, that has included local warlords just ruling their own patch, and with some very sophisticated weapons as well.

BROWN: You have produced a couple of remarkable films. Why write a book? What was it in a book that you couldn't do in a film, in a sense?

SHAH: It was an interesting experience for me, because it was the first time I had tried to write a book. And it was an amazing feeling. It was quite different to writing or reporting for television.

I think that, in the book, you can be more subtle. I think television is quite a linear medium. And you have to sort of stack all your cards up one after another in television, whereas, in a book, you can be a bit more lateral. And, also, I was freer. All my career, I've been a journalist. But whenever I travel to places, particularly Afghanistan, but really anywhere, it's -- I found myself more and more wanting to report the things that I just saw out of the corner of my eye.

And you couldn't possibly put them in a television report. You didn't film them. They didn't quite make sense at the time. You go around thinking about them and thinking about them. And, in a book, you can get all those things in and you can try and make sense of them. Or, even if you can't make sense of them, you can just throw this in and say, well, look, this happened. And it doesn't seem to quite fit in, but it seemed to mean something. So that was what I tried to do.

BROWN: About 30 seconds here, Saira.

You've been working in the Middle East. Depressing?

SHAH: Yes.

The reason I didn't get to Afghanistan earlier this year was because I was working in the Middle East with my friend and colleague James Miller, who worked on "Beneath the Veil" and also worked on "Unholy War," the sequel. And he was very tragically killed by the Israeli army in sort of strange circumstances. And his family is trying to get an investigation into exactly what happened. And I've also been trying as well, because I think, for their grieving process to end, they really need to know what happened.

BROWN: Good luck. Great luck with the book. It's really nice to see you again.

SHAH: Thank you very much.

BROWN: Thank you. Have a good stay in the country.

SHAH: Thank you.

BROWN: Thank you, Saira Shah.

Morning papers after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(ROOSTER CROWING)

BROWN: OK, another week of the rooster. Time to check morning papers from around the country and around the country.

We'll start with "The New York Times" because it's on top. Two stories to point out. Up in the corner, "Ashcroft -- that would be the attorney general, John Ashcroft -- "Limiting Prosecutors' Use of Plea-Bargains, Strike Against Leniency. U.S. Attorneys Told to Presume Most Serious Cases Nearly All the Time." Some back and forth about that. There's some reasons that that makes sense. Some of you will immediately go, that's Ashcroft, must be wrong. Seems a foolish way to react.

I like this story a lot. "A Bleak Ride Home For Zimbabwe Deportees. Train Loads Are Ejected From South Africa as Illegal Workers." What I like about it, it's one of those stories that only a paper like "The Times" would get. And they do and they have and they put it on the front page. That's "The New York Times," and lots of other things.

"The Washington Times." I like this story for different reasons. "Marriage Law Eyed For GOP Platform: Gays' Agenda Called Bigotry." I guess the position of the Republican Party and their platform is going to be against gay marriage and that gays that advocate that are being bigoted. I'm not sure I understand that, but that's on the front page of "The Washington Times." I understand why you might be against it. I'm not sure I get the bigotry part.

"The Boston Herald." "Dems Lead Bush. Poll: Kerry or Clark Would Edge Out President." We caution, we're a year away and the $100 million advertising hasn't kicked in. And this man showed no mercy. I think that man, who may be also that man. Anyway, if you get "The Boston Herald," you will know the details. How much time, David?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-nine.

BROWN: OK, "Richmond Times-Dispatch." Still dealing with the hurricane. "City, Two Counties Lift Water Warnings." So some good news there.

Thirty. I'm getting there.

"Bush Account Details Expensive Task of Rebuilding Iraq." This is the line items of where the $20 billion in construction would go, things like -- I'm not making this up, OK -- $100 million for the witness protection program in Iraq. I'm absolutely serious.

The weather tomorrow in Chicago, blockbuster, if you're there.

We're here tomorrow at 10:00 in the morning for the president's speech, back here at 10:00 tomorrow night for the program. Hope we see you twice tomorrow.

Until then, good night for all of us at NEWSNIGHT.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com





Details; Appeals Court Hears Arguments in California Recall Case>


Aired September 22, 2003 - 22:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
AARON BROWN, HOST: Good evening again. The world has changed a lot since President Bush last went before the United Nations. There are 150,000 foreign soldiers in Iraq tonight, most all of them American. The skeleton of what may someday be a democracy of sorts is being formed, but between here and there the road is rich with danger.
The security situation in too much of the country threatens any good will the liberation created. Growing pains, to be sure, but serious enough to send the president back to the General Assembly tomorrow morning.

It is not that the president needs the U.N.'s help. The people of Iraq and the people of the United States do, and the president needs to find the right words and the right tone tomorrow, or risk leaving empty handed again.

Much anticipated and expected at the speech. We begin the whip with our senior White House correspondent, John King. John, a headline.

JOHN KING, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, we are told the president will be quite unapologetic. He will say the war is right, was right and the world should rejoice the fact that Saddam Hussein is gone. He will say, though, that he needs U.N. help. His critics say Mr. Bush is better be ready to give up a lot of power in Iraq if that help is to be forthcoming -- Aaron.

BROWN: John, thank you. We'll get to you as quickly as we can. Next to what the planner of the 9/11 attacks is saying and perhaps why we're learning about it now. CNN's David Ensor has been working on that. David, a headline.

DAVID ENSOR, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Khalid Shaikh Mohammed is talking, Aaron. He is talking to the CIA interrogators that are listening to everything he has to say. He is talking about what was really planned at 9/11, what the original plans were, and they went well beyond the ones that were carried out. They included the West Coast.

BROWN: David, thank you. Onto the California recall. Back in court today. CNN's Frank Buckley keeping tags -- tabs -- goodness. Frank, get me out of this. A headline.

FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Aaron, voters here in California don't yet know if they'll be casting their ballots in October or in March. Today lawyers argued over when the election should take place, and in a rare move the federal appeals court that heard the arguments opened their courtroom to cameras -- Aaron.

BROWN: Frank, thank you. Let's see how I do here. Finally, the hurricane, four days later and still being felt. CNN's Susan Candiotti in North Carolina tonight. A headline.

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Aaron. If you live on Cape Hatteras, it will take you four hours by ferry to get back home. In Virginia, several more days to get your power back, and in Maryland, there's a new warning about eating shellfish. All examples of life after Isabel.

BROWN: Susan, thank you. Back to you and the rest shortly.

Also coming up on this Monday edition of "NEWSNIGHT," we'll be joined by Madeleine Albright, the former secretary of state and ambassador to the U.N. We will talk about the president's speech tomorrow.

We'll talk with Bill Maher, certainly the anti-ambassador to someplace. No diplomat he, but someone who cuts through the fog while getting a laugh or two along the way. And if Groucho could get a laugh with a duck, hey, why not rooster? Say the secret words. Morning papers. And the rooster will crow. All will, all that and more in the hour ahead.

We begin with the president's morning tomorrow at the United Nations. The words "deja vu" entirely fitting in this case, and not simply because they're French. Because, in a way, the challenges haven't much changed in the last year or so, even if the circumstances clearly have. President Bush will once again make an appearance at a venue he has approached only reluctantly in the past. He will face a mostly skeptical audience, and we expect will ask the organization of Iraq largely his way. We begin with our senior White House correspondent John King.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KING (voice-over): The president will say the war was right and tell the United Nations it should be proud Saddam Hussein is gone. And as he makes a first-hand appeal for help in rebuilding now, aides say Mr. Bush will insist Iraq's political transition must take place on an orderly timetable, his timetable.

CONDOLEEZZA RICE, NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER: As soon as possible, but to do it in a way that is responsible.

KING: The White House says a French proposal to immediately let Iraqis run their country before elections and without a constitution is a recipe for disaster.

AMB. PAUL BREMER, U.S. CIVIL ADMINISTRATOR TO IRAQ: To do so would invite economic collapse, followed by political extremism, and a return to terrorism. KING: Last year, Mr. Bush rallied U.N. support for new weapons inspections and a new warning to Saddam Hussein, but then failed to get Security Council blessing for the war itself. This year, he will appeal for more international troops and tens of billions in reconstruction money to help win the peace. And the president invited Iraq's new public works and electricity ministers to the Oval Office to help make his case.

AYHAM SAMERAEI, IRAQI ELECTRICITY MINISTER: We are going to build a democracy in Iraq, and it will become an example for all the Middle East areas.

KING: There will be no shortage of critics and skeptics at the United Nations. Mr. Bush will speak at the lowest point of his presidency in terms of public opinion here at home.

Americans are now split when asked to rate Mr. Bush's job performance. Fifty percent approve and 47 percent disapprove. And just 50 percent of Americans now say it was worth going to war in Iraq, down from 58 percent just 10 days ago.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KING: And the president's U.N. agenda goes well beyond the big speech to the General Assembly tomorrow. He will have key one-on-one meetings with a number of world leaders who are critical to this debate, the leaders of France and Germany among them. Some fence- mending there, but Aaron, the White House hopes for somehow having a consensus by the end of this week are now dashed. They hope simply to make some progress. And again the president's critics are saying that progress will only come if this White House is willing to give up more authority on the ground in Iraq. So far the White House says, probably not.

BROWN: What realistically can the Americans hope for here, in terms of numbers of troops and amount of money?

BROWN: The amount of money is the big issue now from the White House standpoint, because of the political dynamic back home. At most, they hope for maybe 15,000 more troops. That would still mean 100,000 U.S. troops in Iraq one year from today. But Paul Bremer was up on Capitol Hill today. Members of Congress are going to give the president his $87 billion, but they are raising hell, excuse the word, about it, because of the economy here at home; $20 billion of that would go to reconstruction. They look for about $12 billion in Iraqi oil next year. They need $50 billion or $60 billion for the reconstruction projects on the drawing board. You don't need to be a math major; this president has to find $40 billion or $50 billion somewhere else out there in the world. So far, very hard to find people willing to say, here comes a check.

BROWN: That was the next question. Is that even close to a realistic number, $40 billion?

KING: Well, that's what they need. The Iraqi electricity minister came out today. He said he was grateful to the United States, he was grateful for that $20 billion, but he said $80 billion, perhaps even $100 billion, if you look two, three years down the road. The United States has invested. The president says the mission cannot fail. If the money doesn't come from somewhere else, he's going to have to go back to Congress.

BROWN: John, thank you. We'll see you tomorrow morning. John King, our senior White House correspondent. We hope we will see you tomorrow morning as well. This quick program note: Join Paula Zahn and me tomorrow, 10:00 our coverage begins. President expected to speak somewhere between 10:20 and 10:30. Again, our coverage begins 10:00 tomorrow morning here on CNN.

As if to underscore the complications of getting involved in Iraq at all, there was another attempt on U.N. lives in Baghdad today.

The fact that it failed attribute to one of the achievements the bomber no doubt was hoping to prevent. There is now an Iraqi police force. An Iraqi security guard saved a lot of lives today while sacrificing his own. Here is CNN's Walt Rodgers.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALTER RODGERS, CNN SR. INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): There was another loud explosion in Baghdad. Then the wail of sirens. Fire and rescue vehicles rushing again to the United Nations headquarters here.

The familiar burned out hulk of a suicide bomber's car and a charred corpse. An Iraqi security guard was also killed trying to stop the suicide bomber.

CAPT. SEAN KIRLEY: He wasn't going to get in. And I think he realized that. And his targets -- his -- he changed his target.

RODGERS: Since the far more deadly bombing of the same U.N. building August 19, when 23 people died, U.S. and coalition forces pushed the U.N. security perimeter much further back. Still, if you were among the 18 or 19 wounded, this car bomb was terrifying.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We were passing by in our car in front of the United Nations headquarters when suddenly I fainted. And then I don't remember anything.

RODGERS: After this second attack on the United Nations compound in Baghdad, officials here and in New York are reconsidering the level of the U.N.'s commitment in Iraq. That safety review puts in doubt the future of the U.N.'s vaccination, water purification and other programs here.

ANTONIA PARADELA, U.N. SPOKESWOMAN: We are seeing an increase of security incidents, and we are worried that this might hamper vital U.N. operations in Iraq.

RODGERS (on camera): This latest attempt to bomb U.N. headquarters is yet another fiery reminder that the United Nations label gives no one immunity in Iraq, and that this remains a high-risk war zone for anyone who lives or works here.

Walter Rodgers, CNN, Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Had it not been for the attacks of 9/11, it's hard to imagine there would have been a war with Iraq. And we have learned much more about the 9/11 plot in just the last days than we ever knew before. The source, if he's being truthful, is impeccable. And the information tells us a good deal about al Qaeda and the man who still leads it. Here is CNN's David Ensor.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR (voice-over): The tallest tower in Los Angeles was among the original targets discussed by Osama bin Laden and Khalid Shaikh Mohammed back in 1996 when they first planned what became the 9/11 attacks. According to U.S. government sources with access to what interrogators are getting from Mohammed, who is now a prisoner of the CIA. The original plan called for five hijacked planes on each coast of the United States, a total of 10 aircraft, these sources say.

Mohammed paints a picture of bin Laden playing a central role in the planning five years before the attacks, scaling them down to improve their chances.

MATT LEVITT, FORMER FBI ANALYST: It was more important to have four successful hijackings that would successfully strike at our political, military and economic infrastructure than to have an attack where eight or 10 planes involved and perhaps because of being overly ambitious, the plot would be discovered and thwarted.

ENSOR: At one point in the planning, the 9/11 attacks were to include 22 hijackers on the four aircraft, officials say Mohammed has told his interrogators. The attacks were to be followed by a second wave, carried out with help from al Qaeda allies in Southeast Asia.

Officials say another key prisoner has been talking, too -- the man known as Hambali, accused of orchestrating the Bali bombings, has told his American interrogators about a plot to attack a couple of large hotels in Thailand during the upcoming meeting of Asian and Pacific leaders, including President Bush.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ENSOR: Officials say Hambali's brother and close associate, Ruswan Gunawan (ph), has also been captured, this weekend in Pakistan, along with around 16 others, one official calling that a useful catch -- Aaron.

BROWN: And why are we hearing about this now?

ENSOR: We're hearing about this not because of some kind of leak. You get those in Washington a lot. But it's just hard shoe leather by the Associated Press, which broke this story yesterday. I understand that they had some -- quite some difficulty getting people to tell them about it. And certainly the agencies I spoke to about it today were quite upset the story has come out.

They don't really want al Qaeda people who are out there now listening to this to know too much about what Khalid Shaikh Mohammed is telling them. So they were weren't too happy to have this story coming out today.

BROWN: Thank you. David Ensor in Washington tonight.

Few things are more chilling than the possibility of an enemy within. And we ought to point out few words are more loaded and dangerous and damaging than traitor and spy. Yet those are precisely the words being used in connection with an army chaplain tonight. Rightly or wrongly, we do not know. Nobody but the military has seen the evidence, but it's evidence enough to land the man in a navy bring.

Here's CNN's Barbara Starr.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Sources tell CNN that the government is now investigating whether Army Chaplain Captain James Yee was involved with others in possible security breaches at the U.S. naval facility in Guantanamo Bay. He ministered to some of the more than 600 detainees, including suspected al Qaeda.

CAPT. JAMES YEE, U.S. ARMY CHAPLAIN: I don't get into whether or not they're terrorists. That's not my job.

STARR: There may be more arrests. When the Islamic chaplain was taken into custody, sources say he was found to be carrying classified information without authority, including maps and drawings of the detention facility, notes from interrogations of detainees, including detainee names, which have never been divulged, and a laptop computer with a modem, which is prohibited at the base.

He also may have been seen on law enforcement surveillance tapes at locations where Muslim groups had met in the U.S., according to a senior official.

Captain Yee has not been charged, but is now suspected of treason and espionage, sources say.

Yee has appeared on television discussing his work.

YEE: I have belt the rapport. I have built relationships with the detainees, so they feel -- many of them, several of them -- the majority of them feel comfortable talking to me, knowing that I am -- will sincerely address their concerns.

STARR: Yee's family is not talking. A Chinese American, Yee graduated from West Point in 1990, and served as a missile officer during the first Gulf War. He then left the Army, converted to Islam, and moved to Syria to study for four years, before returning to the U.S. and rejoining the army as a Muslim cleric. (on camera): Yee appeared before a military magistrate on September 15 with two defense attorneys. He is now being held at the naval bring in Charleston, South Carolina. The U.S. military has 120 days to charge him.

Barbara Starr, CNN, the Pentagon.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Other news tonight, a number of residents in parts of Virginia heard this today: they can now turn on the tap and drink the water. Perhaps not flip a switch and have the lights come on or send their kids out to school. But four days since Hurricane Isabel, safe drinking water is a nice start. They happen to be the lucky ones.

Here's CNN's Susan Candiotti.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CANDIOTTI (voice-over): In the hardest hit state, Virginia, the president came to call, and thanked rescue workers for helping victims of Hurricane Isabel.

GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The response to this hurricane has been really great.

CANDIOTTI: However, the storm and its aftermath now have claimed 23 lives in Virginia, bringing the death toll in seven stats to at least 40, including a woman who fell down her stairs in the dark and broke her neck.

About 700,000 Virginia Power customers remain in the dark. The state predicts three quarters of them should be back on line by Thursday.

Ice and water and food deliveries have not slowed. Over the weekend, there were complaints help wasn't coming fast enough.

On Monday, at least some were more patient.

CHARLIE HARRIS, RESIDENT: We're doing all right. It's not so bad. It's not oppressively hot, anything like that. You know ,didn't get to watch the Redskins play football yesterday, but that's OK. We can live without that for one Sunday.

CANDIOTTI: In Maryland, residents around the Chesapeake Bay will have to live without shellfish, at least for a while. Officials have banned catching shellfish in that state's portion of the Bay because of pollution from a sewage treatment plant.

In North Carolina, the Army Corps of Engineers is debating the future of Cape Hatteras -- what to do about Highway 12. Isabel's storm surge of up to 30 feet obliterated the road, cutting off Hatteras Village from the rest of the Outer Banks. They might need a new bridge. The 4,500 residents who lived there can now return by ferry, a four-hour ride, while relief supplies go in. Restoring electricity there might take a while. However, officials predict 75 percent of its customers on the Outer Banks should have their lights back on by Tuesday. Most of the rest of the state by Sunday.

In Kitty Hawk, residents who were allowed to return to oceanfront property over the weekend were ordered out again so crews could repair roads without interference.

Statewide, the Red Cross and National Guard are delivering disaster relief -- hot meals for those in need.

SANDY WALLACE, AMERICAN RED CROSS: It's very important that we give them that little bit of normalcy back into their life.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CANDIOTTI: And a hot meal can make a big difference if you don't have power.

And, Aaron, you also pick up some quirky information in hurricane aftermath. For example, in North Carolina, 150 prison inmates are helping to clean up the debris. Interesting. Although officials add that seven of them are using chainsaws, in case you were wondering.

BROWN: Thank you, Susan. CNN's Susan Candiotti in North Carolina tonight.

Up ahead on NEWSNIGHT, the challenges facing the president at the U.N. tomorrow. We'll be joined by former Secretary of State Madeleine Albright.

And a little bit later on, we'll talk politics national and local, the locale being California, with Bill Maher.

Break first. From CNN, this is NEWSNIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: We're always pleased to welcome our next guest to the program, doubly so tonight. Madeleine Albright has a new book out "Madam Secretary," a memoir of her years as the diplomatic voice as secretary of state during the Clinton administration and of course, earlier than that at the U.N. Ambassador. With President Bush speaking at the U.N. in the morning seemed like a wonderful opportunity to talk with Ms. Albright, so we're glad to see you, welcome.

MADELEINE ALBRIGHT, FORMER SECRETARY OF STATE: Good to be with you.

BROWN: What do you want to hear from the president tomorrow?

What are the magic words, if there are any in this situation?

ALBRIGHT: Well, I would like to hear him say that we need help from other countries in order to deal with an issue that is of importance to all of us -- the future of Iraq and the Middle East. I'm afraid, though, that President Bush is facing a much more skeptical audience than the last time he spoke. And he does not have an easy job to persuade countries to come in there with us now when they weren't willing to do so at the beginning.

BROWN: But isn't the situation in some respects clearer now? No one wants -- no one -- well, I don't want to say no one because there's always someone. But generally speaking, no one would argue that you can't leave Iraq in the mess that it's currently in.

ALBRIGHT: I think that's true. But the questions, as I understand them that they're trying to resolve in creating a Security Council resolution, is what kind of power the United Nations will have and what the role and coordination with the United States will continue to be. And I think that I would like to hear President Bush say that the U.N. does in fact have a vital role and that they are in a position to run the political, economic and humanitarian part of Iraq while letting the United States run the military command. And it depends on how the president phrases his arguments, whether it will be possible to get that kind of a resolution.

BROWN: What's the -- from the American side of the administration side, what is the downside, if you will, of letting the U.N. handle humanitarian and political side of this while the Americans keep control of the military side?

ALBRIGHT: Well, I think the issues would be some of coordination. And, clearly, it becomes more complicated the more agencies, et cetera, are involved. On the other hand, I think it's an excellent way to share the responsibilities and the burdens and the cost and it's worth it, because I do think this is now an international issue. And we were able, when we were in office, to develop a number of models for dealing with this kind of thing. Whether it was in Kosovo or in Timor, there are different ways for there to be a lead country in the military arena and, at the same time, allow the United Nations to do what it does so well, which is the political, economic and humanitarian aspects.

BROWN: Do you think there are countries that want the Americans to fail in Iraq?

ALBRIGHT: Well, there probably are. I don't think that it's a very useful position, because if there is failure in Iraq, it will have consequences throughout the region and even wider. And, therefore, I wish that we would all understand that it's important for the process to succeed and for Iraq not to become what I'm afraid it is becoming -- a gathering ground or a breeding ground for terrorists. It becomes, in many ways, a self-fulfilling prophecy, because President Bush has said that there was a linkage between what happened 9/11, al Qaeda, Osama bin Laden and Iraq, something that I had problems believing in the first place. But now I do think that it does become a self-fulfilling prophecy. And I hope that other countries would understand that it is no nobody's advantage to have that proceed.

BROWN: Is the world better off with the -- with Iraq as it currently exists than it was with the Iraq of Saddam Hussein?

ALBRIGHT: The world is definitely better off without Saddam Hussein. It is not great, however, to have a chaotic situation in Iraq. And I do believe that there was not enough adequate planning for the post-war part of the Iraqi campaign. I have the greatest admiration and respect for the American military. They did a brilliant job. They won a war very quickly. They are now in a very difficult position. And every morning when I hear the news about one or two or three Americans dying, I think it is a huge tragedy. And I hope very much that there is some admission that mistakes were made and try to look at it from a perspective that will bring success in post-war Iraq.

BROWN: Madam secretary, it's good to talk to you. The book is called "Madam Secretary." Madeleine Albright our guest. Thanks you again.

ALBRIGHT: Thank you, Aaron.

BROWN: Thank you.

When we come back, interesting new poll numbers if you like polls. There is plenty to munch on about the president and his rivals. And the California recall merry-go-round stops at the Federal Appeals Court 9th Circuit. We take a break. This is NEWSNIGHT from New York.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Perhaps comparisons wean Florida 2000 and California 2003 have gotten to be a bit much. Perhaps. Another player in the first drama made an encore appearance today. Constitutional lawyer Laurence Tribe, who argued for postponing the California recall election. With support for the recall fading somewhat -- and we underscore somewhat -- much of the strategy has shifted to questions of timing, which, in a way, is a case of bad timing, because right now nobody but the 11 judges on the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals panel have a say on the timing. And their decision expected very shortly.

Here is CNN's Frank Buckley.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BUCKLEY (voice-over): With half a million absentee ballots already cast, the election underway. Judges from the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals heard arguments on whether election day it self should be postpone. At issue punch card ballots and whether error rate would disenfranchise voters in the six counties that use them.

JUDGE ALEX KOZINSKI, 9TH CIRCUIT COURT OF APPEALS: We don't have the Bush vs. Gore problem. We don't have the problem that

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, it's a worse problem. BUCKLEY: The candidates, meanwhile, pressed on as if October 7 was still the day. The presidential candidate du jour to campaign along the major Democrats in the case, Senator Joe Lieberman, who was with Lieutenant Governor Cruz Bustamante. Bustamante, meanwhile, put a good face on a court ruling that went against him, ordering him to stop accepting money for this race into an old campaign account.

LT. GOV. CRUZ BUSTAMANTE (D-CA), CALIFORNIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: We have done everything according to the way we should be doing it, and we're going to proceed.

BUCKLEY: As Arnold Schwarzenegger prepped in private for this week's debate, his campaign rolled out an ad against Governor Davis that certainly wasn't positive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP, AD)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It makes no sense at all. If they're here illegally, why should they be able to drive legally?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BUCKLEY: But the ad did not, his aides claim, break Schwarzenegger's pledge not to go negative. The Davis campaign strongly disagreed. And the governor took a couple of shots at Schwarzenegger during an environmental event.

GOV. GRAY DAVIS (D), CALIFORNIA: California's environmental record under my administration is a leader in America. Arnold hasn't voted very much. He obviously hasn't been reading the paper thoroughly.

BUCKLEY: And while the big guys went after each other...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's willing to go into that upside down.

BUCKLEY: ... the little guys went on "The Tonight Show" together. Jay Leno invited dozens of not-ready-for-prime-time politicians to hang out in the audience.

MARY CAREY, CALIFORNIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE: We are a group of oddballs. California is a true democracy. We're showing the world how anyone from all walks of life can run for a government position. And I think that is what is so great about America.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BUCKLEY: And one of our producers who attended the taping at NBC this evening tells us that one of those not-ready-for-prime-time politicians was ejected from the audience. He wouldn't stop yelling, "Equal time, equal time."

As for the voters and the question, "When do we go to the polls?" a decision is expected tomorrow by the 9th Circuit Court of Appeals that will either mean an election just two weeks from tomorrow or an election in March. But that could also change if tomorrow's decision is appealed and the Supreme Court decides to take the case -- Aaron.

BROWN: Thank you, Frank. Let's just hope tomorrow, one way or another, it gets decided. Thank you, sir.

On to presidential politics, another day, another Democratic candidate you may have thought was already running. Today, Carol Moseley Braun made it official. The former senator from Illinois launched her campaign this morning at Howard University in Washington, D.C. She said the country is at a tipping point and she said that she offers the clearest alternative to the Bush administration. Recent polling shows her to be a distinct underdog.

Polls, for all their usefulness, need to be read carefully. They are snapshots of a moment, in this case, the current moment, and may or may not be a predictor of the days ahead. With that disclaimer, a new CNN/"USA Today"/Gallup suggests reason for concern at the White House and some cause for celebration in Little Rock. That would be the Arkansas city from which General Wesley Clark hails.

And while we don't necessarily celebrate, we are always pleased when Bill Schneider joins us, as he does tonight.

Mr. Schneider, nice to see you.

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: The president's approval rating, why don't we begin there?

WILLIAM SCHNEIDER, CNN SR. POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, you begin with the fact that Bush is sinking. His approval rating has sunk from 60 percent just a month ago to 50 percent now.

Now, that is a significant figure, that 50 percent. You see, almost as many Americans disapprove of the job he is doing; 50 percent is the break-even point. When he slips below 50 -- and this is the lowest this president has ever been -- if he slips below 50, his reelection is very much in doubt.

What the polling shows is, he's losing support among men. Men are particularly concerned about the loss of jobs in this country, almost three million lost since 2000. And the tax cuts have not generated the new jobs that were promised. The speech on Iraq did not do the president any good earlier this month, because it raised the prospect of an $87 billion price tag. So a lot of Americans are saying, why are we spending $87 billion in Iraq when this country's economy is in so much trouble?

BROWN: We'll do with the president a little more in a moment. Let's talk about General Clark, who -- this is really the first poll taken since he announced. How does he show?

SCHNEIDER: Amazing. Little Rock, mother of presidents. Who knew?

Because the general has vaulted to the top of the heap. He's only been in the race less than a week. And look at that. He's 22 percent, ahead of Howard Dean, John Kerry, Dick Gephardt, Joe Lieberman. All the other candidates, including Carol Moseley Braun, are in single digits. Clark is clearly a phenomenon. And he declared his candidacy at exactly the right moment. The moment is when Bush begins to look vulnerable and suddenly a new face appears.

The field had been very lackluster to most Democrats. But the one thing you can say about Wesley Clark is, he does not lack luster. After his name come the words supreme allied commander and former Rhodes Scholar and first in his class as West Point. And a lot of men are flocking to his candidacy, the same men who are losing faith in President Bush's policies. So he looks like the right man for this moment. But, of course, half of Americans say they don't know anything about him.

BROWN: Good thing to underscore and also underscore this moment. But just for the fun of it, if it was today a Bush-Clark race, what does our polling say?

SCHNEIDER: The polling says it would be close. It would be down to the wire. Did you enjoy 2000? Well, look at this. Bush vs. Clark, Clark leads Bush by three points. That's the best showing of any of the Democratic contenders.

Suppose it were Howard Dean, who comes in second in the Democratic race. Well, he would lose to Bush by three points. So Clark looks strong. Dean looks weak. But the fact is, in both cases, it's too close to call. It's a statistical dead heat. So there's every indication, one, that President Bush's reelection prospects are insecure. Two, this looks like a very close race, that it could end up being just as close as the race in 2000. Nothing is for sure, except, President Bush is in a lot of trouble.

BROWN: Well, one other thing is for sure. We've got a year to go. We have got a ways to go to see how this plays out.

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: Thank you Bill -- Bill Schneider in Washington.

More on the political landscape in a moment. We'll hear what Bill Maher has to say about California and presidential politics as well.

And a little bit later, Saira Shah returns to the program to talk about her new book, her journey in Afghanistan. You'll remember her documentary, "Beneath the Veil." Who could forget it?

That and more as NEWSNIGHT continues on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: If you think the California recall seems to have a bit of who's on first quality to it, I assure you, you are not alone. Keeping track of who's running, who's dropping out, and when the vote will or won't occur is more confusing than an Abbott & Costello routine.

So who better to help sort us out or make us laugh at it, perhaps, than Bill Maher? His HBO program, "Real Time With Bill Maher," has its season finale this Friday. And in just case you did not know it, HBO and CNN are owned by AOL T.W., which will just be T.W. once the old stationary is gone.

We talked with Mr. Maher earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: Mr. Maher, this seems to me, at least at this point, to be the year of supporting candidates we know very little about. Let's start in your state in California, where Mr. Schwarzenegger is doing just fine, thank you, but I'm not sure anybody knows why they're voting for him.

BILL MAHER, COMEDIAN: Well, we in California, I think, are doing better than people are on the national level. They get to watch a debate among 10 Democrats. And each candidate gets about five seconds to answer a question. And among the questions are, "What's your favorite song?" which was in the last debate.

BROWN: Do you watch the Democratic debates?

MAHER: Oh, how can you miss it? It's riveting television.

BROWN: Are you watching it for information or for jokes?

MAHER: For both. But there's too many candidates. There's 10 people there. So nobody gets enough time to really make a point or make an impression or give the voters an informed choice. At least here in California, we have weeded out the 2 and 3 percenters. We're down to the governor and his sidekick, Sancho Panza, and the Viennese weightlifter. We're good.

BROWN: And what about your buddy, Arianna?

MAHER: Well, if you believe the polls -- and we don't -- she's trailing pretty badly. But miracles happen. And that's what we're praying for, because there's nobody better qualified -- not that that matters in an election.

BROWN: Right. Why do you think that is so?

MAHER: Because the public perception of her is of a socialite. And she's having trouble undoing that perception with the common man.

And last time I was on, you asked -- you said you're very hard on the media. Well, that's one of the reasons I am, is because I think they don't help her very much in getting her message out and in enabling people to understand who she really is.

BROWN: Not to seem defensive, because, good lord, I would never do this, but this is a woman who has been writing newspaper columns and appearing on TV talking about issues for many years now. MAHER: Right.

BROWN: Could it be that it might be something to do with her?

MAHER: Well, if she's been doing that, why does the mainstream media keep referring to her as a Gabor sister? I don't remember the Gabor sisters ever writing a prescient newspaper column twice a week. But maybe I missed it. Maybe they were using a pseudonym, like Dear Abby. Maybe the Gabor sisters are really Scotty Reston.

(LAUGHTER)

BROWN: Give me your take on Mr. Schwarzenegger.

MAHER: Well, I think he is a remarkable man. I never thought I would think of one person as both lecherous for a Kennedy and stupid for a bodybuilder. So I'm impressed with him.

(CROSSTALK)

MAHER: He's an outsider. And that still has an amazing cachet here and on the national level. And I don't understand why. I thought we went through this with Ross Perot, when discovered, oh, just because he's not in government doesn't mean that he's going to cure government. If we really want an outsider, I say Jacques Chirac. He's not even from America.

BROWN: And Wesley Clark, on the subject of outsiders and people who seem to have instant credibility, even as people don't necessarily know what he's about.

MAHER: Well, I think we do. What do you mean we don't know what he's about? He was a war hero. He was head of NATO. He led the war in Kosovo. I think we have a lot of information on Wesley Clark.

And I've said many times that I believe that, all things being equal, with the field of candidates, I think you've got to give it to the guy who has went to war, because, if he made the ultimate sacrifice, I think he's got dibs on the nomination. So, for me, it's between him and Kerry at the moment. And it looks like he's pulling ahead. I like him. I think he could be the Democrats' Eisenhower.

Eisenhower was a guy who came into office and gave us an honorable exit strategy from another messy war in Korea. And he could be the guy to do that for us in Iraq.

BROWN: Just finally, you are about to wrap up a season on television. What will you do in the time off?

MAHER: I am going to tend to my herb garden. I'm an amateur herbalist in learning, how to cure myself and to heal myself from all the partying I do during the season.

BROWN: Will you occasionally appear on television during that off-time? MAHER: I normally would. And I guess I probably will a couple of times, if asked by someone I like as much as you. But, generally, I think, the last year, since I got fired at ABC, I've been around a lot. I had a book out. I had this show. I answered a lot of questions on a lot of shows about the recall, because we do our show here in California.

I think the public could use a rest from me for a while. So I may be a little scarce. I may be a little hard to find.

BROWN: Well, we'll keep looking for you anyway.

MAHER: Yes.

BROWN: We enjoyed having you on the program. Thank you.

MAHER: All right.

BROWN: Thank you, Bill.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And that was Bill Maher earlier.

Saira Shah after the break.

Around the world, this is NEWSNIGHT.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: Those of you who have watched this program from the beginning two years back will remember the night we previewed Saira Shah's documentary, "Beneath the Veil," her story of Afghanistan. And it was extraordinary. She's now written a book called "The Storyteller's Daughter," stories of her life, her family, her homeland and much more. And we're very pleased to see her again.

Welcome.

SAIRA SHAH, AUTHOR, "THE STORYTELLER'S DAUGHTER": Well, thank you for having me.

BROWN: Let's talk about Afghanistan a bit. Are you worried that, in an odd way, the United States went into Afghanistan for its own reasons, but not really for Afghan reasons?

SHAH: I think that absolutely is a central concern.

I think it's quite hard in the West, because it's quite a problem-solving culture. And it seems that there was a problem to solve in Afghanistan. I fear that perhaps the West is trying to solve the wrong problem in Afghanistan. It's very focused on getting rid of the Taliban, Osama bin Laden. But the causes of the Taliban and Osama bin Laden haven't been addressed. And they are the collapse of infrastructure in Afghanistan, the cultural warlordism, the generation that has grown up without education. All these things are fundamentally important. Otherwise, you can have more Taliban any time or more Osamas any time.

BROWN: And has any of that much changed since the Americans went in? We get a sense that the capital is under control and that, as you move out from the capital, it's varying degrees of anarchy or something.

SHAH: Yes, that's very much the impression I get as well.

I should say, I haven't been since I made "Unholy War," which was during the war against terror. I was supposed to go back this year and was unable to. But it is very much the impression that I get. And it also is something that's happened all through Afghanistan's history, that virtually every government has been able to control the capital and about four or five other cities in the country.

But 90 percent of the country carries on the way it's always carried on. And, unfortunately, in recent times, that has included local warlords just ruling their own patch, and with some very sophisticated weapons as well.

BROWN: You have produced a couple of remarkable films. Why write a book? What was it in a book that you couldn't do in a film, in a sense?

SHAH: It was an interesting experience for me, because it was the first time I had tried to write a book. And it was an amazing feeling. It was quite different to writing or reporting for television.

I think that, in the book, you can be more subtle. I think television is quite a linear medium. And you have to sort of stack all your cards up one after another in television, whereas, in a book, you can be a bit more lateral. And, also, I was freer. All my career, I've been a journalist. But whenever I travel to places, particularly Afghanistan, but really anywhere, it's -- I found myself more and more wanting to report the things that I just saw out of the corner of my eye.

And you couldn't possibly put them in a television report. You didn't film them. They didn't quite make sense at the time. You go around thinking about them and thinking about them. And, in a book, you can get all those things in and you can try and make sense of them. Or, even if you can't make sense of them, you can just throw this in and say, well, look, this happened. And it doesn't seem to quite fit in, but it seemed to mean something. So that was what I tried to do.

BROWN: About 30 seconds here, Saira.

You've been working in the Middle East. Depressing?

SHAH: Yes.

The reason I didn't get to Afghanistan earlier this year was because I was working in the Middle East with my friend and colleague James Miller, who worked on "Beneath the Veil" and also worked on "Unholy War," the sequel. And he was very tragically killed by the Israeli army in sort of strange circumstances. And his family is trying to get an investigation into exactly what happened. And I've also been trying as well, because I think, for their grieving process to end, they really need to know what happened.

BROWN: Good luck. Great luck with the book. It's really nice to see you again.

SHAH: Thank you very much.

BROWN: Thank you. Have a good stay in the country.

SHAH: Thank you.

BROWN: Thank you, Saira Shah.

Morning papers after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(ROOSTER CROWING)

BROWN: OK, another week of the rooster. Time to check morning papers from around the country and around the country.

We'll start with "The New York Times" because it's on top. Two stories to point out. Up in the corner, "Ashcroft -- that would be the attorney general, John Ashcroft -- "Limiting Prosecutors' Use of Plea-Bargains, Strike Against Leniency. U.S. Attorneys Told to Presume Most Serious Cases Nearly All the Time." Some back and forth about that. There's some reasons that that makes sense. Some of you will immediately go, that's Ashcroft, must be wrong. Seems a foolish way to react.

I like this story a lot. "A Bleak Ride Home For Zimbabwe Deportees. Train Loads Are Ejected From South Africa as Illegal Workers." What I like about it, it's one of those stories that only a paper like "The Times" would get. And they do and they have and they put it on the front page. That's "The New York Times," and lots of other things.

"The Washington Times." I like this story for different reasons. "Marriage Law Eyed For GOP Platform: Gays' Agenda Called Bigotry." I guess the position of the Republican Party and their platform is going to be against gay marriage and that gays that advocate that are being bigoted. I'm not sure I understand that, but that's on the front page of "The Washington Times." I understand why you might be against it. I'm not sure I get the bigotry part.

"The Boston Herald." "Dems Lead Bush. Poll: Kerry or Clark Would Edge Out President." We caution, we're a year away and the $100 million advertising hasn't kicked in. And this man showed no mercy. I think that man, who may be also that man. Anyway, if you get "The Boston Herald," you will know the details. How much time, David?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thirty-nine.

BROWN: OK, "Richmond Times-Dispatch." Still dealing with the hurricane. "City, Two Counties Lift Water Warnings." So some good news there.

Thirty. I'm getting there.

"Bush Account Details Expensive Task of Rebuilding Iraq." This is the line items of where the $20 billion in construction would go, things like -- I'm not making this up, OK -- $100 million for the witness protection program in Iraq. I'm absolutely serious.

The weather tomorrow in Chicago, blockbuster, if you're there.

We're here tomorrow at 10:00 in the morning for the president's speech, back here at 10:00 tomorrow night for the program. Hope we see you twice tomorrow.

Until then, good night for all of us at NEWSNIGHT.

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Details; Appeals Court Hears Arguments in California Recall Case>