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Nuclear Deal Reached with Iran; Israeli Leader Sounds Alarm on Iran Nuclear Deal; World Lawmakers Looking at Iran Nuclear Deal; Some in Congress Already Saying Nuclear Deal a Bad Deal; John Kerry Comments on Nuclear Deal; No Sign of Guzman, Trump Claims Guzman Threats. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired July 14, 2015 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:00] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you for joining me today. I'm Carol Costello.

AT THIS HOUR with Berman and Bolduan starts now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Kate Bolduan.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm John Berman.

The breaking news, the reaction pouring in, from the optimistic to the furious, and the United States and world powers strike a deal with Iran over its nuclear program. This comes after months of contentious talks and missed deadline.

BOLDUAN: And the details we're going to discuss throughout the hour and in just a moment, but essentially the deal will give Iran relief from international sanctions in exchange for bans, limits on uranium enrichment and caps on its stockpile. Iran agreed to allow access to IAEA inspectors for years to come.

President Obama says the deal, which is the focal point of his foreign policy, it will slow the threat of a nuclear arms race. Listen here to the president.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Because of this deal, the international community will be able to verify that the Islamic Republic of Iran will not develop a nuclear weapon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Thank you so much.

We're going to get back and talk more about the details of the deal in just a second.

That was the president speaking right there, just a little bit of his announcement this morning. We also know that the nuclear deal with America's long-time ally is

being condemned quickly by America's closest ally in the region. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu calling the agreement a stunning historic mistake.

BERMAN: We heard from the Israeli leader just last hour. He was sounding the alarm.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: In a decade, this deal will give an unreformed, unrepentant, and a far richer terrorist regime the capacity to produce many nuclear bombs, in fact, an entire nuclear arsenal with the means to deliver it. What a stunning historic mistake.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Prime Minister Netanyahu said the world is less safe today than it was yesterday.

Let's go to CNN's Erin McLaughlin live in Jerusalem.

Condemnation across the board from Israel on this deal.

ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, John. We've heard Israeli officials call this deal tragic. They say this is a dark day in history. They say it's an agreement built on lies and deceit and that kind of rhetoric not only gives you an idea of the level of dislike but it also gives you an idea of the level of distrust among Israeli officials that was felt throughout this entire process. We're also hearing from government officials in terms of some of their specific objections to the agreement just reached. We spoke to hard- line coalition partner, Naftali Bennett, who says promises were broken. Take a listen.

NAFTALI BENNETT, ISRAELI COALITION PARTNER: It's going to legitimize Iran's quest for nuclear power, and in effect all the promises that we've heard over the past year that the embargo would not be lifted, well, the embargo is lifted on missiles albeit five years down. We have heard there's going to be anywhere, anytime sanctions. Now we know it's not anytime, anywhere sanctions. We know when the West wants to inspect something, it will have to be a very cumbersome process that will give enough time for Iran to hide its activities.

MCLAUGHLIN: Now, Israeli officials tell me they're just getting their hands on this agreement. When Bennett was here in the CNN bureau, he was actually sitting there reading it leading up to that interview, so they're going through this agreement right now line by line, word for word, every piece of this agreement no doubt will be analyzed by Israeli officials. There is a security cabinet meeting going on today as well. We heard from prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu before that cabinet began. I can imagine we will hear more from Israeli officials in the coming hours.

BERMAN: Erin McLaughlin for us in Jerusalem. Indeed, there are lawmakers around the world going line by line

through this deal.

Let's go to Vienna right now to find out what is inside these pages, some 80-pages, plus annexes. Our senior international correspondent, Nic Robertson, has been at the talks for the duration.

Good morning, Nic.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, good morning, John. I mean, what is in the detail here, details like the reduction of Iran's nuclear material stockpile, the low enriched uranium will be reduced to 1200 kilograms to 300 kilograms. The number of centrifuges to be cut by two-thirds. The inspection program, a 24/7 inspection program, a monitoring system to monitor Iran's uranium literally from the ground where it's mined through the mills where it's turned into yellow cake to the centrifuges where its enriched to the final facilities.

So this is a system that Secretary Kerry has said will prevent Iran building a nuclear weapon, that the breakout time is increased from a matter of months right now to a year. That this will stay in place for a year. But he also described this agreement as something that is, if you will, balanced and fair, that addresses concerns of both sides. This is what he said.

[11:05:] JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: The true measure of this agreement is not whether it meets all of the desires of one side at the expense of the other. The test is whether or not it will leave the world safer and more secure than it would be without it.

ROBERTSON: And what Iran wants here and what it is getting, it is getting sanctions relief, that to be phased in over time once it has complied with portions of the agreement and that has been verified. There's a facility to snap back on those sanctions if Iran doesn't measure up to the agreement. The inspection system is backed up by a robust escalation of problems directly to U.N. Security Council within a matter of two weeks. That is designed to prevent Iran, if you will, spinning things out on the ground when the inspectors want to visit a site. It's designed to stop Iran saying maybe you will get there next week, the week after. A lot of details in this as you say. Many, many pages being gone through all around the world.

BOLDUAN: And in the details is absolutely the important part of this deal that's been negotiated now over some 20 months and beyond.

Nic, thank you so much. Nic is there at the site of the talks for us. BERMAN: Happening now, the tension moves from Vienna, where Nic is,

to Washington. Congress will now review this nuclear view and many Democrats and Republicans, frankly, calling it a bad deal even before it was done. This morning, House Speaker John Boehner said the Obama administration abandoned its stated goals for the accord.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JOHN BOEHNER, (R-OH), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: And that's why the deal we have out there in my view from what I know thus far is unacceptable. It's going to hand a dangerous regime billions of dollars of sanctions relief while paving the way for a nuclear Iran. And this isn't about Democrats or Republicans. It's not a partisan issue at all. It's about right versus wrong.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: And that question, right versus wrong, is now before Congress, will be shortly. Congress now has 60 days to review and approve the agreement. President Obama said just this morning he will veto any attempt by Congress to reject the deal. It would require a two-thirds vote by Congress to override a presidential veto. A tough hill to climb.

We will get to a congressman to discuss in a second, this deal and his reaction to the deal.

First, we have some new sound coming in. Christiane Amanpour, she sat down with Secretary of State John Kerry for an interview. This is fresh sound, new interview. Let's listen to a bit of it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KERRY: Sanctions brought them to the table to negotiate. They did the very thing everybody put the sanctions in place to get them to do, which is negotiate. So they negotiated. Now measure the agreement to see whether or not it achieves what we need to in terms of insight, restraint, accountability, and so forth. That's what we should be doing.

We have unprecedented access through this in terms of verification. So, yes, they get to do more in the out years. That's their right as they clean up, supposedly, and become an NPT good-standing country. Remember, during all of this time, Iran never pulled out of the non- proliferation treaty. They could have. They could have said, to hell with you, we'll do our own thing. They've lived by the NPT. They're living by it now. Well, they say they're living by it. They haven't lived by it completely which is why we put the sanctions on them. Now, we're putting to test if there's a change of heart, a change of mind, a change of direction, and if there isn't, we have every option available to us every day that we have right now.

We exclusively negotiated a nuclear deal because we knew that, if we got into the other issues, you would never get to the nuclear deal. So an Iran without a nuclear weapon, I think, you know, this as a matter of common sense, is better to deal with than an Iran one with one. For those who are worried about Iran's behavior in the region, we are better off pushing back and dealing with that behavior if they're not on a path to get one, and we believe we're clearly demonstrating a way in which they can not get a nuclear weapon.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Iran without a nuclear weapon is better than Iran with a nuclear weapon. Now the question is before Congress.

Joining us to discuss is a Democratic Representative from Connecticut, Congressman Jim Himes, a member of the House Intelligence Committee.

Congressman, it is great to have you.

[11:10:15] REP. JIM HIMES, (D), CONNECTICUT: Hi, Kate.

BOLDUAN: A lot of details coming out. I'm sure you're still going through it. From what you have seen, what do you think of this historic deal?

HIMES: Well, you know, it's a good moment to sort of step back and take a deep breath. It's a very complicated thing with profound consequences for the world. Anybody who has come out in the last two hours with aggressive statements that this is a no-brainer that it's obvious frankly should stop being listened to for the duration of this consideration. These are hugely consequential war and peace type items. It's a complicated thing. I always knew this deal wasn't going to be anything we were going to celebrate. It is, in fact, a compromise. We need to get into the details and satisfy ours Iran is going to be further away from having a nuclear weapons than they were before and this is a key point, and that we have an ability both to see cheating if it happens, that's essential, but also to bring back significant pain through sanctions if, in fact, they do cheat. Lastly, and this is really critical and nobody is talking about it, you never choose in Congress between the good and the perfect. You choose between the alternative you have and all the other scenarios. We have to start a conversation about what happens. Let's just imagine that Congress says no to this thing. Where does that leave us? In particular if our other allies say yes. These are all really complicated things we need to take up and be very serious about in the coming days.

BERMAN: Congressman, we appreciate your no hot take mandate, but there are critics who say, and this is not a hot take, they have been looking at this for some time, this is undeniable, this will make Iran richer. It will give them a hundred billion dollars they did not have yesterday. Are you concerned they're going to take that money and continue their sponsorship of terrorism?

HIMES: It is undeniable it will make Iran richer. That's one of the very significant risks associated with the deal which therefore means we ought to be very, very careful in its consideration rather than coming right out and having strong black and white statements. But it is undeniable it will make Iran richer and that is a problem. It will also as the secretary points out if, and again we all have to look at this thing, it will also, you know, presumably and again we have to look at this thing make Iran a lot further away from having a nuclear bomb than they were before. The money is what they get. What we get, of course, is the removal at least immediately of the possibility that Iran has a weapon and, of course, the possibility, and here we look at this with a great deal of cynicism and we're not naive, that the possibility interacting more with the world, having a more reasonable society actually begins to change that regime from a pariah regime to a more constructive participant in the region. That's far from a no- brainer but we have to consider it as a possibility.

BOLDUAN: One of the details in here getting a lot of attention is the U.N. Arms embargo. The fact you will see a lifting of an arms embargo in five to eight years. We're talking about conventional weapons, the country's ballistic weapons program. The Democratic ranking member on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, Eliot Engle, released a blistering statement saying the fact that the arms embargo, this was one of the issues that was off the table. Maybe it was described as a red line. This was off the table for a long time. Saying now that it's included in the sanctions relief is deeply troubling. Even Ash Carter, the president's defense secretary, has said he has huge concerns allowing the arms embargo to be lifted. Do you think it's a good idea?

HIMES: No, it's not a good idea, and again this is a deal, right? That means we get some things and they get some things. And it's uncomfortable to think as we talked about before they get a whole lot of money that they may use to try to buy off their middle class, to help their economy, but they will also probably use it to further their own aims in the region.

And the prospects of weapons going in is not a happy prospect. It probably makes the Russians and the Chinese and the French, who want to sell them weapons happily, but that's a big concern. We have to remember what the core negotiation was, which was taking away Iran's ability to develop a nuclear weapon.

When we negotiated with the Soviets, they were a bad actor. They sponsored terrorism. They oppressed Jews in the Soviet Union. They had proxy armies all over the world. They considered it worthwhile to negotiate with them narrowly on the issue of nuclear weapons. And we did that.

We need to remember that this is a deal and we're not going to get everything we want and they're going to get some of the things we want.

BERMAN: An interesting 60 days ahead of you.

Congressman Jim Himes, of Connecticut, thank you for being here.

HIMES: Thank you. Take care.

BOLDUAN: Thanks so much, Congressman.

Next, Fareed Zakaria will be joining us on what the deal means for President Obama's legacy and beyond, and also how this will and is already playing into the 2016 election.

[11:45:03] BERMAN: Plus, the hunt for one of the most dangerous men on earth, the one who keeps breaking out of prison. You could make three million bucks for information leading to the capture of El Chapo, missing, but according to Donald Trump's team, sending hate tweets the billionaire's way.

That, and a stunning story of survival. A teenager said she walked away from a plane crash that killed her grandparents. We'll speak with one of the people who saw her first.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BOLDUAN: A high-risk legacy defining moment for President Obama. A long-sought nuclear deal with Iran announced just hours ago. It's being called really historic by both the deal supporters and the critics at the moment.

BERMAN: The president still has to sell this deal to Congress. Well, that's not totally true. Congress gets 60 days to review the deal. The president could veto whatever they pass.

Joining us now to discuss, Fareed Zakaria, host of CNN's "Fareed Zakaria, GPS."

Fareed, whether you support or oppose this deal, it is undeniable this is a remarkable piece of diplomacy, one years in the making, a marathon set of weeks of negotiations right now passing one deadline after another and, to a certain extent, it's the culmination of something President Obama compromised in his campaign for the presidency in 2007 and 2008.

FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN HOST, FAREED ZAKARIA, GPS: Right from the start, in that famous debate, democratic debate, he said, I would talk to Iran at a time when even Hillary Clinton was saying that she wouldn't. You know, this is part and par selling of something that Obama clearly has been trying to do, which is to figure out whether there are ways to bring in the last remaining countries from -- in from the cold. You know, what I mean is there's a whole bunch of countries that are still not part of the international community, the world system. They are outliers, rogue regimes, Cuba, Venezuela, Burma, Myanmar, Iran, and of all of them, Iran is the prize because it is the biggest country. It's an 80-million person oil-producing nation in the heart of the Middle East at the center of so much of the instability in the world. And the fact that he has been able to make a significant step in that direction is clearly historic.

[11:50:36] BERMAN: In the past, Fareed, you have said reaching a deal with Iran on this nuclear program is the best option. What we're seeing here, and as everyone is looking through the 100-pages-plus, is this the best option that you see?

ZAKARIA: Yes. Look, I have skimmed the deal, but it's pretty clear that it has more safeguards, more inspections, more verifications and more pathways blocked than any nuclear deal we've ever seen before. And the key thing to remember, the key number to remember is two months. Iran is currently two months away from being able to produce enough fuel to make a nuclear weapon.

BOLDUAN: The breakout period.

ZAKARIA: Under the deal almost everyone agrees that goes to a year. Just to make enough material for one bomb. It would then take a lot longer to make several or to turn it into a weapon. So clearly it lengthens the breakout time. It also has monitoring of a kind never seen before so that you track the uranium from the point at which it is mined to the point at which it is transported to the point at which it's used, so that a secret pathway becomes very difficult because where would they get the uranium from? So there are a number of intrusive and unprecedented measures in here.

Of course, Iran gets things. People keep saying --

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: $100 billion things. A lot of money.

ZAKARIA: But remember, that's their money. Iran sells hundreds of billions of dollars of oil on international markets. This is their money. There are a lot of countries I wish didn't have oil wealth. Iran is one of them, but the truth is it has that money.

BERMAN: They didn't have it yesterday. They don't have it today. Critics say they're going to get it.

ZAKARIA: An international group was able to freeze that money because it was being put in escrow while these negotiations were on. There is no prospect of permanently taking away all Iran's oil revenues in perpetuity.

(CROSSTALK)

BERMAN: Let me ask -- sorry, I want to ask about some of the unintended consequences the critics are looking at right now. One of them is the idea of an arms race in the Middle East. The idea that if Iran one day, 15 years from now, is able to produce a weapon, if Saudi Arabia with get in the game, other Islamic states would get in the game.

ZAKARIA: Again, remember, if you had no deal -- 12 years ago, they almost came to a deal, the Europeans and Iran. We weren't willing to negotiate even at the time. The Europeans under American pressure killed the deal. Iran had 164 centrifuges at the time. Because there was no deal, Iran went on a huge ramp up and went from 164 to 19,000 centrifuges. My point is, if there's no deal, you think Iran is going to sit back? So they're going to build more. Right now, there's a prospect I think of them saying, look, we've got a lot of the other stuff we wanted. Yeah, are they going to build up a powerful, modern army? They already have one. They'll build one again. We can't change the reality that Iran is an oil-rich country that has foreign policy and military ambitions.

BERMAN: And smart people.

ZAKARIA: And smart people. It's the oldest trading country in the world.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLDUAN: But how to change its behavior as it relates to terrorism around the world and its relationship with the United States, that's obviously a focus now.

ZAKARIA: And I would argue the deal makes that marginally more likely. Let's not have illusions and be naive, but again are you likely to make Iran a little bit more cooperative by having this deal or by, you know, shunning them, isolating them, sanctioning them? I think it's more likely that you have some small moderation in Iranian behavior.

Look, China, when we made the opening to China, it was still essentially fighting a war with the United States in Vietnam. It was still funding guerilla moments all over the world. But over the time slowly, it did moderate.

BERMAN: And anyone that wants black-and-white diplomacy I think will be sorely disappointed over the generations.

Fareed Zakaria --

(CROSSTALK)

BOLDUAN: That's going to be put under a hot, bright light in Congress right now.

Thanks, Fareed.

ZAKARIA: You're welcome.

BERMAN: You can watch "Fareed Zakaria, GPS," Sundays, 10:00 p.m. right here on CNN.

A stunning story of survival to tell you about. A plane disappeared and, suddenly, a teenager showed up alive, walking away from the crash. We will speak to the owner of the store where the teenager showed up.

[11:49:58]BOLDUAN: Plus, help find the world's most notorious drug lord and you will get nearly $4 million. This new award announced as Donald Trump's campaign claims he's being threatened by the cartel.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: New this morning, no apparent sign of one of the most dangerous men on earth. A drug lord so powerful he's believed to have ordered the murders of some 10,000 people. The kingpin who busted out of prison again. Now the Mexican government is offering a $3.8 million reward for El Chapo Guzman.

BOLDUAN: His stunning escape through a mile-long tunnel is costing top prison officials their jobs.

It also has Donald Trump claiming the cartel leader is threatening him online.

Let's get the very latest from the site of the prison break. National correspondent, Polo Sandoval, is in Mexico -- Polo?

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Kate, John. Good morning to you. That search continues amid growing criticism against the Mexican government. There's so many people not only in this community but really throughout the country, people who want to know exactly how this very dangerous individual, Joaquin "El Chapo" Guzman was able to tunnel out of prison.

There's heavy criticism being leveled at the current president. We believe this man has been the subject of much criticism, also for not addressing very high levels of corruption throughout all levels of government, so I can tell you that the other uncertainty here, also for not addressing very high levels of corruption throughout all levels of government.

So I can tell you that the other uncertainty here is what this development may mean for the cartel landscape.