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Ben Carson Tops Polls Before GOP Debate; S.C. Deputy in Violent Student Arrest to Learn Fate; California Principal Slammed by Student; Florida Paper Tells Sen. Marco Rubio to Resign. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired October 28, 2015 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:00] JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Will Neurosurgeon Ben Carson be on the receiving end of political incisions? His first debate on top of the polls tonight. Just how far will Donald Trump go to retake the lead?

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: And did she strike the officer? A mystery video apparently shows a very different side to this classroom takedown. And very soon the officer involved who threw the student will learn whether he's going to keep his job.

BERMAN: World Series television meltdown. TV control rooms are filled with angry people saying awful things. And that's on a good day. So what happened behind the scenes when the signal went down? You thought the game was dramatic.

Hello, everyone. I'm John Berman.

BOLDUAN: Hello, everyone. I'm Kate Bolduan.

Get ready for round three. 10 of the 2016 Republican presidential candidates are getting ready to face off once again, this time in Boulder, Colorado, for the next debate. Only this time, there's a new front-runner in town, folks, Ben Carson, knocking Donald Trump from the top spot. Carson is leading in at least one national poll and in more than one poll in Iowa.

BERMAN: The CNBC debate is focused on jobs and the economy. So who will stand out? Who might drop out, and could somebody flip out? Someone like John Kasich who essentially just said I'm mad as hell and not going to take it anymore?

With us, CNN political director, David Chalian.

David, I want to focus first on Ben Carson because this really is the first night of the rest of his life. One might think that the debate moderators will focus a great deal of attention on him. The other candidates as well.

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: That's right, John. Donald Trump no longer has center stage to himself. If you look at the lineup, he shares center stage with Ben Carson. And you are absolutely right. This is a whole new phase for Carson. Coming in as the front-runner now nationally and in that key kickoff state of Iowa is a whole new world for him, and he will be under more scrutiny. The other factor in that, of course, John is what does Donald Trump do vis-a-vis Ben Carson? Is he going to be looking to take Ben Carson down a notch, or is Ben Carson just going to wither under what may be a pressing debate, trying to get specifics out of him which have been slow coming throughout this whole campaign season?

BOLDUAN: You're talking about specifics there. I mean, this is a more narrowly focused debate than previous debates. This one's going to focus on jobs and the economy. So who stands to gain? Who stands to lose here on this?

CHALIAN: Well, you know, Trump's campaign is saying that this is his wheelhouse, right, the economy. He is from the world of business, and we'll see. We're also going to see, as we've been talking about, how Donald Trump will sort of react to being number two on the stage.

But, Kate, I agree with your sense, the more narrow focus on the economy going deeper on that area of the issue means that these candidates have to be prepared to offer up more specifics.

BOLDUAN: And that could be tough sometimes for some of those candidates. We'll see. David is there.

It's great to see you, David. Thank you so much.

Let's continue this. Let's bring in Brett O'Donnell, Republican strategist, who is helping, has been helping Senator Lindsey Graham prepare for the undercard debate tonight; and Scottie Nell Hughes, a Trump supporter and Tea Party activist.

Great to see both of you.

That's a beautiful shot there behind you in Boulder.

BRETT O'DONNELL, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Gorgeous here.

BOLDUAN: Brett, first to you.

What do you expect between Trump and Carson tonight?

O'DONNELL: Well, I think they're both going to go after each other a little bit. I think Trump has to go after Carson. He tipped his hand yesterday in Iowa where he was basically commanding voters to get his poll numbers up. And I think that he'll probably be on the aggression with Ben. I think Carson has to prove himself economically that he really knows the economy. Just this morning on NPR, he couldn't differentiate between the budget and the deficit. And so, you know, the big thing for both of these candidates is John Harwood is a great moderator. Last time he was the one who invoked the "Oops" moment from Rick Perry. So it will be interesting to see if either of them has an "Oops" moment tonight.

BERMAN: To be fair, I think Rick Perry -- Rick Perry invoked the "Oops" moment with Rick Perry four years ago. Scottie, I want to talk about Donald Trump a little bit right now because Donald Trump, falling to second place in the CBS /"New York Times" poll. In Iowa, there are three polls that show him in second. And he was there last night essentially begging for Virginia voters to

come back into the fold. Let's listen closely to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE & CEO, TRUMP ORGANIZATION: From the time I announced, I've been at the top of the polls, almost at the top. You know, we're doing well. Iowa, will you get your numbers up, please?

(CHEERING)

(APPLAUSE)

TRUMP: When you get these numbers up, I promise you, I will do such a good job.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: So, Scottie, you are supportive of Donald Trump. What do you think he needs to do on the stage tonight?

[11:05:02] SCOTTIE NELL HUGHES, TRUMP SUPPORTER & TEA PARTY ACTIVIST: Let me say this. I don't think he was necessarily begging just like I don't think he's going to go after Dr. Carson tonight. This is the debate that was made for what he is successful at, business. But when you look at these polls -- and Mr. Trump realizes this poll is just looking at GOP candidates. What it's not counting are those Independents. Even those crossover Democrat votes that the GOP has been trying to get by pandering to both sides, Donald Trump's been able to recruit those because he's talking realistic things that everybody can relate to. So these poll numbers, I don't think, really influence Mr. Trump that much. And when you look at the dozens of polls that have been conducted since Mr. Trump got in and he's number one, he's not going to be one of those petty people that will let one throw him off had his game. He's going to focus on putting this economy back on track, and it's not going to be about attacking others. It's going to be laying out his plan, policy points that he has more of than some of the other candidates, including Dr. Carson.

O'DONNELL: Donald Trump has specialized in petty. I mean, that's been his entire mantra during this campaign is to get petty with every other candidate in the race. I think he won't be able to help himself. He did it with Rand Paul, with Jeb Bush.

(CROSSTALK)

HUGHES: But those are the things that -- I mean, it's not like he sat there and just threw these out. He was attacked first, and that's why America likes him. They want a leader, something we've not seen. And they know to go up against Hillary Clinton or Bernie Sanders, you need to have somebody with not thin little skin and get offended. Mr. Trump does not. He attacks back. He puts up defense.

(CROSSTALK) O'DONNELL: That's going to be interesting because Donald Trump has an economic plan that would go well with Hillary Clinton. In fact, I don't know how he'll debate her with his economic plan.

(CROSSTALK)

HUGHES: That's really interesting, because it's actually pieces of everybody else's, including Jeb Bush's, and that's lacking from the plan that we've seen from Lindsey Graham. And if he has one, it's gotten no attention. That just shows the credibility of it and how much people in America can relate to it.

(CROSSTALK)

BOLDUAN: I think we're seeing contours of some of the fights we'll see tonight in the debate right here.

It does lead to one question. We always ask, whose night is it going to be, is it make or break for? Tonight could be make or break for who? John

Kasich is one person, as John Berman said, he's mad as hell, he's not going to take it anymore. Here's what he said. I want to get your take on what it means for tonight. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KASICH, (R), OHIO GOVERNOR & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Do you know how crazy this election is?

(LAUGHTER)

Let me tell you something. I've about had it with these people. I am sick and tired of listening to this nonsense. And I'm going to have to call it like it is as long as I'm in this race.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Campaign says this is his new confrontational tone, his new strategy that they're going to be employing. But what do these guys, these establishment guys that haven't broken through -- John Kasich is one of them -- what do they have to do to stand out tonight?

O'DONNELL: Well, they have to be more aggressive. But the problem is you can't change really who you are. And John Kasich hasn't been very aggressive in the debates. He hasn't stood out. And so I think for him suddenly to say I'm going to be the new John Kasich is like what some of the other candidates are doing. I think, you know, that's why Lindsey Graham belongs on the center stage because he's been one of the most entertaining candidates. He won the last debate at the Reagan Library on the undercard debate. And he's been very aggressive. He's got something to offer economically and on the security front.

HUGHES: But if you want entertainment, go to a comedy show, which is really good. Graham is an expert in comedy. But Kasich right now, if he's going to continue insults, he's going to be one of these people on the outside.

(CROSSTALK)

HUGHES: 65 percent of the electorate right now support conservative candidates. And using comments like "these people," and insulting them, he's going to end up right where, I say Eric Cantor did, as well as John Boehner, out on the outside of the Beltway.

BERMAN: Quickly, Brett, how high is the bar for Jeb Bush tonight? What does he they'd to do to really reassure his donors and people still supporting him that he's here to stay?

O'DONNELL: Well, he's got to stop telling people that he's got better things to do than be on the campaign trail. And then he's got to reassure his voters that he's got a message and that he is going to aggressively push that message. That hasn't happened in the prior two debates. We'll see if Bush can do that tonight and be one of the more aggressive candidates on stage.

HUGHES: What he doesn't need to do is reference his mommy or daddy or that he's going to run to his brother for help. That does not work. That does not help. We need Jeb to be Jeb.

BOLDUAN: Scottie, Brett, great to have you guys on. I think you should take the stage tonight.

BERMAN: Makes our job easy.

(LAUGHTER)

BOLDUAN: Exactly.

Thanks so much, guys.

HUGHES: Good ratings.

BOLDUAN: Great to see you. Exactly.

A reminder, do not miss the special two-hour edition of "A.C. 360" starting at 10:00 p.m. eastern. Anderson Cooper and the whole team will be breaking down the highlights and the lowlights right after the debate.

BERMAN: The debate's really just a preview for Anderson tonight. Make sure you tune into that.

Very soon the resource officer who took down a female student in class will learn his fate. And it comes as we get word about a mystery video apparently showing a different side of what even happened. But honestly, does that even matter?

BOLDUAN: Plus, another stunning moment inside a different school. This one showing a high school student body slamming his principal. You'll see what's more behind this video.

[11:10:09] BERMAN: And "Marco Rubio, resigned right now, you are ripping us off." That is from a major newspaper in his home state. We'll speak live with the editorial page editor about why the Senator's CNN interview riled them up so much.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:14:50] BOLDUAN: New this morning, we could soon learn the fate of a South Carolina sheriff's deputy. He is on administrative leave. He's been on administrative leave after this disturbing video surfaced of him slamming a high school student to the ground.

BERMAN: The Richland County Sheriff's Office will hold a news conference at noon eastern to address the actions of Deputy Ben fields.

Now, we're told there are at least three different videos they know of. The sheriff says one of them shows the student maybe getting physical, punching at the officer before the arrest. But really, does that even matter?

Here's how one classmate describes what happened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIYA KENNY, CLASSMATE OF ARRESTED STUDENT: He grabbed her arm. And he put his arm around her neck at first. And so that's why you actually see her -- if you get the right video, then you'll see her trying to swing at him. And at that point, then he just flipped the desk back and grabbed her out of it and threw her. And that's when you see her rolling across the floor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Police Lieutenant Sean Burke joins us. He is former president of the National Association of School Resource Officers, a man who really knows these types of situations.

So, Officer, when you look at this, Lieutenant, you look at this incident, what went wrong in your eyes?

LT. SEAN BURKE, FORMER PRESIDENT, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF SCHOOL RESOURCE OFFICERS: Well, thank you for having me, John, Kate.

I think it went wrong from the very beginning. I think -- obviously we don't see the whole interaction. We don't see the interaction between the teacher and the vice principal, but we do see the majority of interaction from the police officer. I think his approach with this student is wrong from the very beginning. I think it sets the wrong tone. I think as a school resource officer, you are trained to de-escalate and to relate to the student. So I think that from the beginning, this was going down the wrong road.

BOLDUAN: Talk about the training. What is the job of the school resource officer? How did it get to this point? Should it have ever gotten to this point, or should have this been the job of a teacher or the administrator who were kind of involved in disciplining and trying to get the student to listen to them in the first place? BURKE: Well, the school resource officer job is probably one of the

greatest developments in law enforcement in recent history. The drawback to that is we're seeing an increased number of school administrators relying on the SRO for a violation of school rules, and that is not the job of the school resource officer. We have administrators that are trained to increase test scores. They are trained to really try to boost the attendance of the school. But they are not being trained on how to work and interact with the SROs that are in their building every day.

BERMAN: What are they there to do, then? If the school resource officer is in the building, you know, as this officer was, what was his job? You say it's not classroom discipline.

BURKE: Correct. Correct. And for those that you talk to that don't know the job of a school officer, have never been in a school, they'll tell you that school resource officers are there to protect against active shooters or threats to the school. That's not true. That's one facet of their job. They're really there to develop relationships with the kids to increase their knowledge of law enforcement, of citizenship, but really to increase the relationships with the young people to get them to better understand what it's like to work or to live in our society and to really hopefully have the kids and students that are in that school have a better relationship, have a better idea and a better opinion of law enforcement.

BOLDUAN: Lieutenant, obviously the big question right now, there's going to be a press conference at noon on this very issue, is whether this officer is going to keep his job or not. From what you see, from what you've learned about this incident, do you think he should lose his job?

BURKE: Well, I think that before you terminate anyone's employment, they all deserve a fair investigation, and listening to the sheriff yesterday, he made a very -- he made it very clear that he would have his decision by today. That's never a soup for someone that wants to keep their job. So I think with that quick turnaround, looking at the violation of their policy, I would expect that the sheriff will announce that they will terminate that officer today.

BERMAN: And, indeed, that announcement coming probably just minutes from now.

Sean Burke, really, thank you for being with us and lending your insight, helping us understand what these people are in the schools to do and what they're not there to do. Appreciate it.

BURKE: Thank you very much.

BERMAN: There's another, a different violent school incident caught on camera. This was in Sacramento, California. A fight broke out apparently inside a lunchroom. The principal ended up getting body slammed by a student. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SHOUTING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: You can just really hear the chaos, what's going on in that lunchroom. You see that image one more time.

The principal did get up and he tried to stop the fight again. Then a school resource officer arrived, steps in to help.

[11:20:17] BERMAN: And that's what helps us understand.

BOLDUAN: What helps us understand the role of the resource officer. Three students were arrested after this incident. Wow.

Coming up for us, a newspaper in Marco Rubio's home state says he needs to do his day job or get out of the way. But the criticism doesn't stop there. The editorial page editor will join us next.

BERMAN: Plus, on the very day Republicans nominate their next speaker of the House, a former one just learned he could be going to prison. What Denny Hastert just pleaded guilty to. That's ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:25:01] BERMAN: New this morning, "If you hate your job, quit." That is what a major Florida newspaper is telling Florida Senator Marco Rubio, presidential candidate, has missed more votes than any other Senator while on the campaign trail.

BOLDUAN: "The Sun-Sentinel" editorial gives a blistering critique of Rubio, saying this, in part, "Sorry, Senator, but Floridians sent you to Washington to do a job." Also saying, "If you hate your job, Senator, follow the honorable lead of House Speaker John Boehner and resign it."

The editorial also quotes from CNN's interview with Rubio, when special correspondent, Jamie Gangel, questioned the Senator on this very issue. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, (R), FLORIDA & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: People, when they have been running for politics in the Senate, they've missed votes. And I'm not missing votes because I'm on vacation.

JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: But this many votes?

RUBIO: Actually, this is lower than what other people have missed. And here's the other point I would make. I'm running for president so that the votes they take in the Senate are actually meaningful again.

GANGEL: Someone might say you're not showing up, you're not doing your job by voting.

RUBIO: Not true. Not true. Because voting is not the only part --

GANGEL: You don't think you're in a glass house?

RUBIO: -- of the Senate job. I mean, the most important thing a Senator does is constituent service.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Let's bring in now Rosemary O'Hara, the editorial page editor of "The Sun-Sentinel."

Thank you so much for joining us.

This is some pretty rough stuff you guys put out there. And this is a paper -- your paper endorsed Marco Rubio in his 2010 Senate race. So what changed, Rosemary?

ROSEMARY O'HARA, EDITORIAL PAGE EDITOR, THE SUN-SENTINEL: You know, we were convinced in 2010 he was passionate, he was articulate. He told us that he wanted to go to Washington to fight for us. And we have some real issues that we need him to fight for us on. We've got problems with our highways, with our beaches, social security, spending. And yet we hardly ever see the Senator in Florida. He's so busy out introducing himself to the nation. And now he's -- they never see him in Washington. So, yes, constituent services is one part of the job, but it's not the only part of the job. We need his leadership in the Senate. And if he doesn't want to do it, if he's really frustrated, if he hates his job, people get that. You know, if you want to run for president, run for president. But right now you have a job to do, and we believe he should be doing it.

BERMAN: I know they weren't your Senators, but when Barack Obama missed votes by some counts more votes than this in 2007 and 2008, Hillary Clinton, John McCain, did the paper call on them to quit their is that the job?

O'HARA: You know, I don't -- I don't know that we did, but he is our Senator. We have a personal relationship with him. We have a personal -- we have expectations for our guy. And yes, you know, it's true. People miss votes when they're running for president. But in this election cycle, there are two other Senators who are running for president, and they've only missed ten votes according to politico's poll or tally. And Marco has missed 59. 59 votes! And it's not just the votes. It's the committee hearings. It's the intelligence briefings. He told your reporter and others that he has a staff show up for intelligence briefings. My god, we've got some serious national and international security threats. And to send a staffer to intelligence briefings is not doing your job.

BOLDUAN: Have you heard from the Rubio campaign after this?

O'HARA: No, we haven't heard from the campaign, and we really don't hear from the Senator very much. As I said, you know, since he went to Washington, you know, he makes such a great case. And you all know that. You know, he gets in front of the camera, and he's articulate. And one on one, he's personable and he's smart. And we were convinced he was going to do the job. But once he went to Washington, we don't hear so much from him. So we're really disappointed. You know -- (CROSSTALK)

BOLDUAN: That was the word I was going to ask you. So safe to say you're disappointed in your Senator.

O'HARA: We're very disappointed. You know, he convinced us that he wanted to work for us. And now he doesn't want to do it. He doesn't like his job. So he wants another job. I get that. But like most of us, if we want another job, we don't get to continue getting paid while we're looking for another one full time.

BOLDUAN: Let's see what the Rubio campaign has to say about it.

O'HARA: That he should -- I'm sorry?

BOLDUAN: No, I was just going to say, it will be interesting to see the Rubio campaign and what Marco Rubio has to say about this, because you can be sure that could be very much a question that you gets tonight at the GOP debate.

Rosemary O'Hara, thanks so much for joining us.

O'HARA: Happy to be here. Thank you.

BOLDUAN: Thank you.

Coming up for us, House Republicans are gathering to nominate their next speaker, but it's a very different day for the man who once held that very powerful job. Up next, former Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert pleading guilty in court. The lies, the hush money and the allegations of sexual abuse.

[11:30:10] BERMAN: All right. John Kasich, he calls his opponents crazy, even hysterical.