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Ballot Bowl 2008

Following the Presidential Candidates

Aired April 13, 2008 - 16:00   ET



OBAMA: Bitter.

CLINTON: Bitter.

OBAMA: Bitter.

CLINTON: Bitter.

OBAMA: Bitter.

CANDY CROWLEY, CNN, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: What's in a single word? Well, a lot if you've been listening to coverage since Friday. When that word has come up, it has really taken the campaign trail at least for the last couple of days by storm. We'll be talking about that a little bit later. I'm Candy Crowley coming to you from Grantham, Pennsylvania. This is where Messiah College and the site of tonight's "Compassion Forum." Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama talking to, talking about their faith, their values and how it relates to politics. My co-host today is Jim Acosta. We want to bring him in from Indianapolis with a little look at what's ahead. Jim.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN, CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Candy. That's right. WE are in Indianapolis after a very busy day on the campaign trail yesterday here on the Hoosier state, both the democrats are in Pennsylvania but we're going to be sharing with you some of the sounds from these candidates in Pennsylvania and in Indiana yesterday where at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway Hall of Fame. That's where we're ducking for cover today here in the Hoosier state. But coming up on our game plan, there's a lot of "Ballot Bowl" for the remaining two hours of this afternoon. And we're going to start with, obviously, the bitter aftertaste.

Barack Obama's comments about the blue collar workers in Pennsylvania, his comments describing those workers as bitter. We will be checking in with Barack Obama throughout the next two hours as he talks about that issue. Also, Hillary Clinton who is campaigning in Scranton, Pennsylvania, today in advance of that "Compassion Forum," coming up tonight featuring her and Barack Obama and John McCain, we cannot forget him, even though he is not out on the stump today, he's not campaigning today. He is making his way back to Washington and his campaign has weighed in on this controversy and there is much more in store in "Ballot Bowl." But in the meantime, I will hand it back to my colleague, Candy, back in Pennsylvania. Candy. CROWLEY: Thanks, Jim.

For our viewers who have not seen it yet, there was a statement by Barack Obama. He actually made it last weekend. He was in San Francisco at what he thought was a closed fund-raiser and that generally means the press is not allowed. He made some statements there that, in fact, were tape recorded and then documented later on by a so-called citizen journalist. She wrote on the "Huffington Post" and later put up the sound from that fund-raiser where Barack Obama talked about people in small towns being bitter because their economic needs have not been met. He then linked that bitterness to clinging as he put it to guns and religion. It has caused quite a stir. So, we want to begin at the beginning and that is with Barack Obama's words.


OBAMA: You go into these small towns in Pennsylvania and, like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton Administration, and the Bush Administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are going to regenerate and the have not.

And it's not surprising then they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.


CROWLEY: So, those are the words that started all this this weekend. Hillary Clinton immediately pounced on this as did her campaign. Sending around the clip to reporters. Hillary Clinton calling these words, elitist. Barack Obama, it hit him while he was campaigning in Indiana. So, by the time he came to Terre Haute, it was time for an explanation.


OBAMA: So I said, well, you know, when you're bitter, you turn to what you can count on. So, people, they vote about guns. Or they take comfort from their faith and their family and their community. And they get mad about illegal immigrants who are coming over to this country. Or they get frustrated about how things are changing. That's a natural response. And, now, I didn't say it as well as I should have.


CROWLEY: So, that was on Friday. Then the Clinton campaign continued. Hillary Clinton continued beating up on Barack Obama because of this remark. Again, saying he was elitist, saying that the Pennsylvanians she had met in small towns were resilient and patriotic and worship because that was a deeply held value that guns were a part of the culture. Again, Clinton not letting up. Again, Barack Obama came out and talked about the issue.

One of the things he did was give a statement to the "Winston Salem Journal." This is an interview he did with a reporter in Indiana. Of course, it has it's primary. I'm sorry, North Carolina, of course, has its primary coming up on May 6th, along with Indiana and this is what he told the "Winston Salem Journal." "If I worded things in a way that made people offended, I deeply regret that. the underlying truth of what I said remains which is simply that people who have seen their way of life upended because of economic distress are frustrated and rightfully so. And I hear it all the time when I visit these communities. People say they feel like no one is paying attention or listening to them and that is something -- that is one of the reasons I am running for president. I saw this when I first started off as a community organizer in the steel plants had closed. I was working with churches and communities that had fallen on hard times. They felt angry and frustrated."

So again, that was to the "Winston-Salem Journal." Barack Obama apologizing for these words as they came across, sticking with his center point which is he said that people in these small towns are frustrated. Using a new word now, not bitter but frustrated by what they see as the government ignoring these economic needs that have gone on for decades. So, that in the sum is what has happened since Friday night on these words of Barack Obama as they continue to resonate along the campaign trail. We have no idea, however, we should tell you at this point how this is going to sink in with voters. Generally, that takes several days. So, we do know the statements, we do know that the Obama campaign has felt the need to put him out there to reexplain these arguments and we do know that the Clinton campaign thinks they got a hold of something that really can help them. I want to bring back my colleague, Jim Acosta. Jim.

ACOSTA: And Candy, it was interesting to watch the evolution of Barack Obama's comments yesterday. It seemed at that event in Terre Haute that he was trying to explain those comments, what was going on behind those comments and then once he was able to actually have a few minutes to pause and talk to that reporter from the "Winston-Salem" newspaper that's when we saw those words from Barack Obama that he deeply regrets using those words. So, it will be interesting to see whether or not the Obama campaign responds in the way that they did with Jeremiah Wright controversy and hold a big speech which is what Barack Obama did following that controversy in Philadelphia. So, again, we'll be watching Barack Obama's movements and words over the coming days.

And speaking of words, John McCain's campaign while the candidate is not campaigning this weekend out on the stump, his campaign did release a statement, A McCain campaign spokesman described Barack Obama's comments as nothing short of breathtaking and I have a quote here that I'll read off the handy Blackberry which comes in handy during our editions of "Ballot Bowl" on the weekend but this is from Tucker Bounds from the McCain campaign. "Barack Obama's elitism allows him to believe that the American traditions that have contributed to the identity and greatness of this country are actually just frustrations and bitterness. What everyone knows is that the Constitution's Second Amendment and our country's strong roots and faith are cornerstone customs in this country. And Barack Obama's dismissal of those values is revealing."

So, some tough words from the McCain campaign. Those words are not quite as tough as the few choice words or I should say more than a few choice words that Hillary Clinton has used out on the campaign trail over the last 24 hours to describe these comments from Barack Obama. Across the state of Indiana yesterday, she described these comments as demeaning and elitist. While in Scranton, Pennsylvania, this morning highlighting her blue collar roots, she spent part of her childhood there in northeastern Pennsylvania. She was asked by reporters of what she thought of Barack Obama's comments and whether or not the Illinois senator had made a big mistake.


SEN. HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, I think what's important about this is that Senator Obama has not owned up to what he said and taken accountability for it. You know, first he said he was right and attacked me for raising his remarks and referencing them. Then he admitted he might have said what he said inartfully and now he's deeply apologized if he's offended anyone. But what people are looking for is an explanation. You know, what does he really believe? How does he see the people here in this neighborhood, throughout Pennsylvania, Indiana, North Carolina, other places in our country and I think that's what people are looking for, some explanation and he has simply not provided one.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Senator Clinton, Senator Obama beyond what these words say and do you honestly believe that he has a demeaning, condescending attitude towards small town working class people. And if you do not believe that isn't it fair to ask if you're manipulating these words for political advantage?

CLINTON: Well, Ron, I want to focus on what Senator Obama himself said. You know, Senator Obama is a good man and he is a very talented and gifted man. But I think his comments were elitist and divisive. And the Democratic party has been unfortunately viewed by many people over the last decade as being elitist and out of touch. We have waged elections over that. And, you know, you don't have to think back too far to remember that good men running for president were viewed as being elitist and out of touch with the values and the lives of millions of Americans.

So, I think that this is a very significant concern that people have expressed. You know, the front page of the paper today in Scranton is, you know, very pointed. And the mayor and mayors across Pennsylvania and people across our country have all reacted to what he said. So, I think it's very critical that, you know, the democrats really focus in on this and, you know, make it clear that we are not, we are going to stand up and fight for all Americans and we're going to stand up and fight for the values and the way of life of Americans in every part of our country.


ACOSTA: Hillary Clinton there on Barack Obama's comments, calling blue collar workers bitter in Pennsylvania. Hillary Clinton maximizing the opportunity here and I want to bring in now Peter Hamby, our CNN embedded producer with the Clinton campaign and he is standing by live in Philadelphia. And Peter, I saw you yesterday at that event in Valparaiso and I seem to noticed and I don't know if you'd share this observation that Hillary Clinton had a bit of a spring in her step yesterday there in Valparaiso. Did you all see it that way?

PETER HAMBY, CNN, PRODUCER: Yes, she certainly did. I think we both noticed that. She was sort of infusing her speech with a lot of sort of optimism and can-do Midwestern work ethics. She was very positive and honestly her staff is very upbeat, as well. They certainly see this as an opening and they're pushing the Obama comments on reporters hard. Senator Clinton is being, trying to paint herself as the optimistic candidate, sort of turning Obama's self-described hope monger image on his head. And you know, she's going into these towns and these neighborhoods in Pennsylvania and saying we're not bitter. You know, we're going to work together and you know come together to get things done in America. So, she's definitely trying to push that message.

ACOSTA: And has anybody asked Hillary Clinton because, you know, she, she is definitely going after Barack Obama on these comments, accusing him of being elitist and out of touch and being demeaning in his comments. But this, this uproar has occurred just a week or so after the release of her tax returns. She and her husband's tax returns, which shows that the Clintons made about $100 million over the last eight years, not exactly blue collar economics there in terms of the Clinton finances. She has to be a little bit careful, I guess, is what I'm getting to, Peter, in how she handles this.

HAMBY: Absolutely. You know, yesterday she campaigned across Indiana and sort of putting forth this Midwestern image and then flew home to, you know, her expensive house in Westchester. She faced several questions about that image today at this press conference. You know, someone asked her both you and your husband have earned a lot of money and she said we have been given great opportunities but at the same time we don't take them for granted but have been very blessed. You know, I asked her if she had fired a gun or gone to church recently. She's obviously a person of faith. But you know, she dismissed the question and said, that's not really what this discussion should be about. This is about how the republican party should be perceived heading into the general election.

ACOSTA: And we noticed Hillary Clinton mentioning that the "Scranton Times Tribune" today had are big headline describing this whole affair as a bitter pill but she neglected to mentioned that that newspaper in the town where she spent part of her childhood endorsed Barack Obama.

HAMBY: Yes, that's right. And the editorial that endorsed her referred to her as I believe the quote was something like a lightning rod politician. She has this sort of baggage as well. She's making an argument that Obama can't win but remember back to the beginning of this campaign the knock against Hillary Clinton from Obama supporters, republicans and maybe some other democrats is that, you know, she's divisive, as well. She can't win in a general. You know, again, the Clinton campaign see this as an opening, to paint Barack Obama as the unelectable politician and the other point she made regarding the newspaper endorsement was that, you know, Obama has gotten probably more editorial endorsements across the country at this point but that didn't matter in Ohio and Texas and she's, you know, trying to make Pennsylvania the next Ohio-Texas.

ACOSTA: Peter Hamby with the Clinton campaign, our embedded producer with the Clinton campaign, I should say. Peter, thanks very much. Joining us live from Philadelphia. We appreciate your comments.

And coming up after the break here on "Ballot Bowl" on CNN, more on this controversy swirling around the Barack Obama campaign. Bill Clinton entering the fray. He's been campaigning across Pennsylvania. We'll have his comments coming up. This is "Ballot Bowl" on CNN.


CROWLEY: Hi and welcome back to CNN's "Ballot Bowl," our 4:00 p.m. Eastern time edition. WE have been talking about the remarks by Barack Obama that have dominated the campaign trail for the past couple of days. As you can imagine, just about everybody has an opinion on this. Barack Obama supporters, of course, defending him. His critics not so much and it will also not surprise you to know that Bill Clinton has jumped into the game.


BILL CLINTON, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: Folks, I was shaking hands and taking a few pictures back stage and this fellow looked at me and he said I just want you to know the people you are about to see are not bitter, they're proud. They just want this country to go in a different direction. They want to restore the middle class, reclaim the future for our kids, reform the government taken away for the special interests, restore America's standing in the world, bring our troops home from Iraq and take care of our veterans and our men and women in uniform. That's what Hillary offers.

You know, there's been a lot of hoopla about who said what and who shot John the last couple days. But one of the things that I thought was kind of overlooked in all this is that one more time the campaign's office that Hillary said well there really wasn't any difference between the Clinton years and Bush years rural Pennsylvania didn't do very well. Do you agree with that? I just thought I'd get a few witnesses here. Even I'm a Baptist, on Sunday we look for witnesses.


CROWLEY: Bill Clinton in Bloomsberg, Pennsylvania. Of course, coming to his wife's side criticizing Barack Obama using the words of a voter he met behind stage. There are those of course who are out defending Obama saying he's not an elitist as being charged by the Clinton campaign that perhaps his words were inartful but, nonetheless, he was talking about the real economic distress in some of these small towns across Pennsylvania, Indiana and North Carolina.

One of those defenders and a part of the Obama team is former Senator Tom Daschle. He was on the show this morning talking a little bit about this statement from Barack Obama and what it all means.


SEN. TOM DASCHLE, FORMER SENATE MAJORITY LEADER: Anybody who has made over $110 million would call somebody else elitist, but this is a man who was raised by a single mother who chose to work in one of the poorest neighborhoods of Chicago and who has dedicated his whole life to the disenfranchised. Barack Obama understands with a passion how important it is that we change this country and recognizes that unless we change Washington, we can't change the lives of the people that he was talking about over the last couple days.


CROWLEY: And, so, it continues. I can imagine that tonight you will hear from Barack Obama a little more on this issue. At tonight's "Compassion Forum," compassion and feeling for other people likely to come up. This will be the first time Barack Obama will be interviewed on this subject on television. This "Compassion Forum," as we say, is being hosted by our own Campbell Brown and "Newsweek's" John Meacham. Coming up next on "Ballot Bowl," John McCain and energy policy back to the issue.


ACOSTA: Welcome back to "Ballot Bowl" on CNN. I'm Jim Acosta, coming to you live from the Indianapolis Motor Speedway Hall of Fame Museum in Indianapolis. We want to switch gears now and switch lanes over to the republican side of this race. John McCain was campaigning in Lubbock, Texas, earlier this week and we have some sound from the Arizona senator now talking about energy issues and the war in Iraq. So, here's John McCain at Texas Tech in Lubbock.


SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: To fix our economy and there's a number of things we need to do and one of them, obviously, is energy. I don't have to tell anybody in this room because you all drove here today. What it is like to go to fill up your gas tank today. And my friends, we are now sending 400, $400 billion a year in paying for imported oil to countries that don't like us very much and some of that money ends up in the hands of terrorist organizations. My friends, we've got to go to wind, we have to go to solar. We have a Ph.D. program right here at Texas Tech for wind power and thank you, Ken, for that program.

As they are proving right here at Texas Tech, wind energy production is a viable option and we have to go solar and we have to go tight and we have to do all those things and I also have to tell you one more thing we got to do. And people better understand it. We got to go to nuclear power, as well. We have sailed navy ships around the world for 60 years with nuclear power plants on it. And it's clean. And my friends, we cannot, it's half of our trade deficit. This $400 billion a year. And I'm sorry to tell you that the price of oil, as far as I can tell, is not going to go down any time soon until we eliminate our dependency on it. We can do that as a nation and we can turn down the lights five minutes earlier and we don't have to drive the extra block, and we can do.

By the way, I forgot to mention to you, the French, you know, we love to imitate the French. 80% of their electricity is generated by nuclear power and they now have a pro-American president in France which shows you if you live long enough anything can happen in the world as you know. So, so, so there are those who say if you go to these green technologies which reduced greenhouse emissions and at the same time eliminate our dependency on foreign oil, it's going to cost us a lot.

My friends, look at the programs we have at Texas Tech. Look at the entrepreneurship, the innovation and the strength of America. We can eliminate our dependency on foreign oil and make it profitable for every American and I'm convinced of it. When Americans every time we've been challenged, we have met that challenge and that's why we're the greatest nation in the world today.

And so, I want to discuss with you just a moment about the world we live in. It's a dangerous world. As you know, as we speak, brave, young Americans are in two wars. One in Iraq, one in Afghanistan and it's been long and hard and tough. And I know everybody that's here today knows someone who has served in the Texas Guard or Reserve and we know the incredible performance and it's been too hard and been too tough on them and their families. For too long this war was mismanaged and we didn't expand the Army and the Marine corps, the regular forces and the Air Force and the Navy enough. And we placed a great burden on our guard and reserve. But I also want to tell you that you can be proud to know the Texas Guard and Reserve has performed in the most outstanding and brave and courageous fashion than better in any time in history and I know you're proud of them.

And be sure to say thanks. And every time you see one of these young men and women in uniform, just go over and say thanks for serving. That's all they're asking of us. And their families when you meet them, tell them thanks for serving. So, as I said to you, the war in Iraq and Afghanistan has been long and hard and tough. And, as you probably know, there was a time when I supported this new strategy a long time ago and everybody said that McCain's political ambitions are at an end. I said it that time and I mean it today. That I would much rather lose a political campaign than lose a war. And I knew the strategy that had to be employed.

That strategy is succeeding and we have been blessed with one of the greatest generals in American history in General David Petraeus. And I would remind you that last year before he came to testify before Congress, this that they ran an ad in the "New York Times" which showed General Petraeus' picture and it said General Petraeus or General Betray Us. Can you imagine disgraceful conduct? My friend, this is a transcendent evil we're facing. This evil of radical Islamic extremism is long and hard and tough and it is sometimes beyond our comprehension.


ACOSTA: John McCain on the critical issues of energy policy, Iraq and national security down in Lubbock, Texas. A lot of political analysts noting how John McCain is doing very well in the national polls right now stacked up against either Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama. John McCain down in Texas.

Coming up after a break here on BALLOT BOWL on CNN, we'll check in with other news headlines, including an update on that disturbing videotape beating down in Florida. Stay with us, this is BALLOT BOWL on CNN.


WHITFIELD: Hello I'm Fredricka Whitfield in the CNN Headquarters in Atlanta. Back to BALLOT BOWL in a moment after a quick look at the headlines.

Texas rangers have questioned the man accused of sexual abuse, accused by a girl who once stayed at a polygamist ranch in Texas. Dale Barlow contends he doesn't know the girl. The convicted sex offender was questioned but not arrested. Some 400 children were removed from the compound for their safety after the girl phoned authorities with her claims of abuse.

We're also getting a first-hand look inside the YFZ Ranch in Laredo, Texas, a Utah newspaper which was granted access to the polygamist compound by residents. These images are some of the first images we've seen as well inside that compound where still many adults live.

More outrage over the videotaped beating of a teenage girl in central Florida. Staffers from the Dr. Phil television show bailed the alleged ring leader of the attack out of jail. A spokesman for Dr. Phil now admits that certain staff members went beyond the show's guidelines after posting bail for one of the suspects facing kidnapping and battery charges.

Now, comes word that Dr. Phil is shelving the show that would have focused on this very incident in light of this newest controversy now.

And former President Jimmy Carter has arrived in the Middle East amid questions about his plans to meet with the leader of Hamas. Today, he had a private talk with Israeli President Shimmen Perez. No other Israeli leaders will host him. The government blames scheduling problems but a senior official admits the real reason is the Hamas meeting. In an interview today Carter said he is at ease about his agenda, despite criticism from Israel and the U.S. State Department.

Well, looks like it went better for some than others, but hundreds of people in Milwaukee were immunized against measles this weekend. Locally three children and an adult have been diagnosed with the highly contagious disease and health officials are trying to stop it in its track.

Political repression in Myanmar has led to the exit of thousands of refugees. CNN's Dan Rivers reports on a young boy from Myanmar that is growing up in a garbage dump in Thailand and later how you can help out and impact your world.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DAN RIVERS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): It is 10:00 in the morning and there are fresh pickings at the garbage dump in Thailand. Kin Zaw Lin is just 1 of 300 refugees from Myanmar who lives off other people's rubbish. A 7-year-old scavenging in the searing heat and the nauseating smell. He says he collects bottles and plastics for 3 cents a sac. He shows his feet which are filthy and cut. He doesn't have shoes and walks bare foot amidst this dangerous landscape. Kin Zaw Lin lives here and often adopted by a family when he was just a few months old. His adopted mother explains he brought Lin here from Myanmar as a baby seeking a better life. Incredibly, she says, this is an improvement. Does she think she'll ever get out of this rubbish town?


RIVERS: Most people live on less than $1 a day at the dump and eat scavenged food from the garbage. This man is frying chicken bones thrown away by someone else. This isn't a life; it's an existence, one that Lin endures every single day. The one question that keeps going through my mind here is how on earth it can be allowed that a 7-year- old has spent his entire life living in this, his childhood consumed by poverty and squalor. There are nine government-run refugee camps in Thailand for those that flee Myanmar in fear of their lives which the U.N. supports but not everyone qualifies for help. A U.N. woman explains why.

KITTY MCKINSEY, UNHCR SPOKESWOMAN: In order to be qualified as a refugee you have to establish that is you're fleeing, fighting or fear persecution. Not everyone would qualify.

RIVERS: These people fear if they go to the refugee camps they'll be classed as economic migrants and deported. They're effectively trapped at the dump with no money to go else where and no prospects back home.

SHARI VILLAROSA, U.S. CHARGE DE LA CRUZ:'AFFAIRES TO MYANMAR: There are no jobs for people, the cost of living is increasing, the salaries, and the average salary is something like 20,000, less than $20 a month. You can't live on that.

RIVERS: Some people are trying to help those at the dump. An exile monk who comes here to hand out food, sweets and soap, inspiring others as well.

CARIMA BRANDOW, VOLUNTEER: When I first came here, I didn't believe what I saw, basically. And I could not stop thinking about it.

FRIDA PERJUS, VOLUNTEER: I could never understand how it is to grow up in a garbage dump.

RIVERS: But Kin Zaw Lin understands only too well. It's the only life this little boy has ever known.

Dan Rivers, Thailand.


WHITFIELD: So, to find out how you can help Myanmar refugees in Thailand, logon to

Back in this country, let's talk about some weather, warm in the west, rather chilly eastward. Karen Maginnis is watching all of this in the CNN Weather Center.

KAREN MAGINNIS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Hey, Fredricka. We do have quite a contrast across the country. First of all, let's talk about this area of low pressure stuck and meandering in the atmosphere and around this cold area of low pressure, that is where we are mostly seeing light rain now but tonight when the temperatures become dramatically cooler and unseasonably cold in a lot of areas we are looking at some of this to change over to snowfall all the way down to the southern Appalachians where the snow levels are around 3,000 feet.

That does mean in the mountains of North Carolina they are expected to see some snowfall. In sharp contrast to that, take a look at this. Saturday afternoon, record-setting temperatures in southern California. In Los Angeles, the temperatures soared to 91, a record high for the day, Sacramento 89. But look at Anaheim, 96 degrees and for today temperatures even hotter. I looked at some of the various locations around Los Angeles. Everybody in the mid-90s, some in the upper 90s, Los Angeles right now officially at the downtown location 94 degrees. They have the Santa Ana that's blowing and wind out of the east and northeast fairly brisk.

Some of those higher peaks may see some fairly strong winds. Wind advisories and high wind watches are out. Well, for tomorrow, we're looking at Atlanta only 50 degrees. Now, typical high temperature for us is close to that 70 degree mark while across the northern tier states mostly in the 50s, but temperatures in southern California, Fredricka, are going to be a little bit more normal like in the next day.

WHITFIELD: All right, good deal, thanks so much, Karen.

Talk about contrast in the weather yesterday was really windy and blistery in Augusta and today great weather, still a little windy, but it's clear, at least. Larry Smith is live in Augusta with an update on how things are going out there.

LARRY SMITH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, hi, Fredricka. Still very windy here in the final round and that is taking effect on the scoring, as we thought. No one has made a giant move and that means Trevor Immelman is still the person to beat here. He began today with a two- shot lead at 11 under par and he just bogeyed 18 and now at 10 under par and two shots ahead of Steve Flesch as he approaches and now he's on the ninth fairway about to make the turn.

We talked before about Tiger Woods and he has never come from behind after 54 holes to win a major and it looks like that will not happen again today. Tiger finished the front nine at even par. Tiger is such an intimidating factor when he is high on the leader board. He needed to come out and make a couple birdies early and get the crowd in to it and the gallery and get some cheers to put some fear into these young guys ahead of him who have never won a major in their careers, but he did not do that. This was very inconsistent and now still trying to make a move on the back nine. If you're watching on here's one thing to keep in mind. During the week Tiger Woods is a collective 4 under par in the back nine and Trevor Immelman 8 under par in the back nine. For Immelman, he has never won a major and this could be his first.


WHITFIELD: We know with the masters, anything can happen. Especially in that last hour.

SMITH: Absolutely. That's the one thing in the back nine. If one person, you know, one guy, he puts the ball in the water and corner or he's into the weeds and has a bad out. Anything is possible and that's one thing we knew at the beginning. Tiger needed to put up the good score and he also needed the leaders to come back to him somewhat and they have not done that yet, but, still, several holes to go.

WHITFIELD: All right. Larry Smith thanks so much in Augusta.

That will do it for now in Atlanta, back to CNN BALLOT BOWL right after this.


ACOSTA: Welcome back to BALLOT BOWL '08. I'm Jim Acosta in Indianapolis. The Democrats campaigning for the nomination of their party campaigning in Indiana yesterday and today they are campaigning in Pennsylvania, which, of course, is holding that very important primary coming up on April 22nd and Hillary Clinton in the midst of this controversy swirling around Barack Obama over comments that he made referring to blue collar workers in Pennsylvania as being bitter.

Hillary Clinton has talked about her biography. Talking about her middle class upbringing. She spent part of her childhood in Scranton, Pennsylvania, and she told voters here in Indiana yesterday about how her grandfather once worked in the mills in northeastern Pennsylvania. We're campaigning in Scranton this morning. She talked to reporters there about a very special place in her heart that Scranton holds and the fact that her father is actually buried in that town.

Here's Hillary Clinton in Scranton.


HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Close to where my father is buried and I hope we have time to go by. You know, my father was a very self-reliant, independent, hard-working person who believed that you worked for everything you got in life. And he would never have imagined I would be standing here running for the Democratic nomination. But he would be giving me lots of advice and I would have to keep him away from all of you.

Because he would probably be giving a lot of advice to you, as well. But he, you know, he and my mother were the greatest influences on me and I miss them all the time and I miss his view of the world, his take on current events. That's where I got interested in politics was sitting around the dinner table and listening to my father opine about everything under the sun and I'm very grateful if to the people of Scranton and the people from the American Legion Post who tend his grave for me. I'm very grateful. Kind of a very tangible expression of the way community and family is so important here in Scranton.

(UNIDENTIFED FEMALE): Time for one more question.


ACOSTA: Hillary Clinton talking about her father there in Scranton, Pennsylvania. The name Rodham used to be, according to some analysts, a political liability for Hillary Clinton as some used to bemoan the fact that she would refer to herself as Hillary Rodham-Clinton and now hoping that the Rodham family name will actually pay dividends for her coming up in the Pennsylvania primary.

Coming up after the break here on BALLOT BOWL on CNN, our Candy Crowley will be talking to John King, who is aboard the CNN Election Express in anticipation of tonight's Route 2008.


CROWLEY: Hi, welcome back to the waiting minutes of CNN's BALLOT BOWL the 4:00 version. I'm Candy Crowley here in Grantham, Pennsylvania. This will be the site tonight of the compassion forum that will be hosted by our own CNN Campbell Brown and John Meetra (ph) of "Newsweek." It will give these candidates a chance to talk about their faith, their values and how that all relates to politics. You won't go away after that compassion forum because CNN has other things in store for you, which is why we have John King here.

Generally when I ask people questions I know the answer to it, but I don't know the answer to this one. So, what, after the compassion forum you've got a special.

KING: A couple things. We'll spend 30 minutes after the forum end digesting the forum. We'll have you come out and others to talk about what's discussed. We expect the Democrats to discuss the role of faith in their life and the role of faith in their politics and maybe the whole human rights issue about the Olympics and, of course, you have this confrontation you have been talking about all day, will that come up, as well? What do working class voters want from the candidates? And then we'll have a special week called Route 2008. We call it that because of the bus.

Between the bus and our two crew vehicles we're over 4,000 miles this week going to all these places in Pennsylvania. It's a fascinating state. Yes, big city in Philadelphia, a moderate size city in Pittsburgh and bunch of wonderful communities in between like this. I went to a catholic mass this morning and our Dana Bash went to an evangelical church. So we're going to spend time on faith and politics and some other issues that are critical in the primary. Now, what? Six weeks ago it was Mississippi and five weeks ago it was Mississippi and one more week we'll get to Pennsylvania and it is a big deal. We'll look at the people and the issues a little bit.

CROWLEY: So you have been running around on this bus, if you will, while the whole bitter controversy was going on. Were people talking about that? Is that sort of a part of, are they looking at it as a cultural thing?

KING: It's a question of how these candidates relate to them. If you go to Bethlehem, Allentown, Scranton where Senator Clinton has her roots, the newspapers in those communities this morning endorse Barack Obama and some of the people in those communities are saying what is he talking about? I was in the catholic mass out near Pittsburgh this morning, white ethnic voters, older voters, that's Hillary Clinton's base.

When Barack Obama had his bus tour here he did cut into the margins. If he gets a big black vote in Philadelphia, it is about the margins among the white people. The Clinton campaign hopes this is a reassessment for any of those working class voters. There's a lag. We see things the day they happen. We cover the events when they happen and put them on television as soon as we know it. If you look at the morning newspapers today all across this state, Barack Obama furor, furor over Obama's remarks was the Pittsburgh headline. So I think we are getting a slight sense now that people they understand it happened and they're paying attention to it. I think in 24, 48, 72 hours we'll get the digestion of it.

CROWLEY: So you've been to these churches and you talked to voters about faith. Do you talk to them about the intermingling of faith and religion or to they see their faith as a part of their political view?

KING: Most people say their faith is obviously critical to every decision in their life, but we'll go through in this campaign what we went through in the last campaign. I was in this Catholic Church this morning and the priest was noting that the pope will be here. You have a lot of people saying they know the truth, a lot of people saying they are the good shepherd. He was making reference it is an election year.

Here, the pope is going to be here. What are they talking about the? The teachings of the Catholic Church. Ten days from now Democrats in this state will pick between two Democratic candidates who are very aggressively pro-abortion rights. So, you have the constant tension we went through this with John Kerry in the last campaign and George W. Bush tried to take advantage of the catholic which is a swing vote in this state and other states. You have Catholics who are blue collar working class Democrats that moment who are focused more and more on the economy, but their values and the teachings of the church do matter.

CROWLEY: So, don't go away after the compassion forum, 9:30 round table talking about the compassion forum and a special 10:00 tonight. All that and more, you don't want to miss that.

We do have another hour of BALLOT BOWL coming up and we will hear a little bit of what we heard earlier this week, the candidate and General David Petraeus. Next hour on BALLOT BOWL. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)