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The Global Brief with Bianca Nobilo

UK Leadership Debate; Russia-Ukraine Grain Deal; A Pilgrimage Of Penance. Aired 5-5:30p ET

Aired July 25, 2022 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:18]

BIANCA NOBILO, CNN HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Bianca Nobilo, in London. Welcome to THE GLOBAL BRIEF.

The two candidates vying to become Britain's next prime minister face each other one-on-one for the first time in a heated television debate. And it

was quite heated. On the agenda, the economy immigration and China.

And Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy says his country is determined to resume grain exports from its Black Sea ports despite a Russian missile

strike.

Then, Pope Francis pilgrimage of penance to Canada as the pontiff apologizes for the church's role in the abuse of Canadian indigenous

people.

Now, we've just heard big promises and fierce fighting from the two candidates for British prime minister, former Treasury Secretary Rishi

Sunak and current Foreign Secretary Liz Truss, just faced off in their first one on one debate. They're hoping to conservative members to elect

one of them to replace Boris Johnson as leader of the party, and leader of the nation.

And so far, lawmakers say that Truss has the edge over former chancellor Rishi Sunak. And the debate has been contentious, like their campaigns.

Sunak attacking Truss' economic plans, saying it'll raise inflation and cause mortgages to skyrocket, and Truss accusing Sunak of trying to get too

close economically to China.

Let's talk about it with John Rentoul, chief political commentator of "The Independent".

John, always great to talk to you. I'd love to know your first impressions from that debate, honestly, going into it -- I watch a lot of these things,

too much probably -- I thought Rishi Sunak would give the stronger performance because he's a very slick operator, Liz Truss could be quiet

gaffe-prone and robotic.

My surprise takeaway from that was that Sunak seemed quite aggressive. He may have thought he seemed passionate. And then Liz Truss seemed a lot more

approachable and likable.

JOHN RENTOUL, CHIEF POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, THE INDEPENDENT: Yes, I think that's right. I think Rishi Sunak knows that he had to make an impact in

this debate there for he was extremely aggressive, he was talking over Liz Truss and I suspect lots of people in the audience won't like that. He did

appear to be domineering, and quite sharp as well. I mean, she was sharp, but much more hesitant in her speaking style.

NOBILO: And what do you think this spells for the rest of the campaign because People I've been speaking to, MPs, even people who work on Liz

Truss's campaign have been saying that they thought she may have been more likely to underperform in the campaign and in the debates. It might be

trickier for her. I'm not so sure about that now.

RENTOUL: No, she performed well enough. But actually, when Rishi Sunak did allow her to speak, he actually let her speak for a long sections,

certainly in the second half. I felt she was a much weaker performer than he was, I think she didn't have very much to say, she tends to rely on

sound bites and slogans.

Whereas he, Rishi, talked extremely fast, and what's everyone to know that he knows all the details, these are crossover facts. I think he comes

across and I'm much more impressive potential prime minister. But I'm not sure that's what conservative party members will think, because he's

telling them some pretty unpalatable truths.

NOBILO: Yes, and I agree with the stock phrases coming from Liz Truss. I think if we hear spades in the ground one more time us commentators, our

ears might bleed.

Based on that performance, what we've seen of them in the campaign so far, which of the two do you think has the prospect of bringing the conservative

party more electoral success in the medium term?

RENTOUL: Wow, that's a difficult question. I thought that Rishi Sunak was a better opponent for Keir Starmer and the Labour Party, because I thought

he was pitching his tenth very much on the ground of politics. Whereas Liz Truss, with her tax cutting agenda, give Labour to many hostages to

fortune, because they were able to present as the cut spending.

But I'm not sure that's how it's going to work out. I think the conservative party likes the idea of tax cuts whether or not they're

economically sensible. I think the voters quite like the idea of tax cuts too.

NOBILO: And other than the economic argument, which is obviously a point the main point of contrast at the moment, they're certainly focusing on,

what else is at stake here in terms of the differences between the two candidates, the direction they might take the conservative party and

country, either one of them wins?

[17:05:14]

RENTOUL: Well, Liz Truss is trying to make China a big issue. I think the BBC rather surprisingly helped her allocate quite a bit of time in the

debate to this topic of China. I'm not sure there's a big disagreement with them about that.

I mean, Rishi Sunak said some sensible things about, you know, wanting to defend to be -- wanting to defend on our national security -- but also

wanted to engage with China. I don't think anybody would disagree with that. I think that's Liz Truss trying to use a credentials as far as

foreign secretary.

I think the essential argument between them is the economic one. And Rishi Sunak tried very, very hard to ride home the point that Liz Truss, her main

advisor, said that her policies would result in interest rates going up 7 percent. I'm not sure he did actually say that as a direct cause, because

that is Rishi Sunak's argument.

NOBILO: And as you pointed out, Rishi Sunak, is considered by many, by media, by large majority of MPs to be on paper and in terms of performance,

the more impressive candidate, the person that is clear intentions to detail, which he demonstrates whenever he can.

What do you think he would need to do in order to ingratiate himself and win over the base?

RENTOUL: Well, that's the question! I'm not sure that he's capable of doing that. In the opinion polls of Conservative Party members and the

YouGov poll has been pretty accurate in the past, put Liz Truss so far ahead, but it's difficult to see how Richie Sunak can overcome that.

He's obviously decided to go for the quite aggressive strategy, of just saying, I'm better qualified for this. I know the arguments better, I'm

here to tell people that they can't just have tax cuts, unfunded tax gets paid for borrowing. It'll be interesting to see how that works. We just

wait to see what the next couple of Tory Party member says.

NOBILO: We shall wait, with bated breath.

John Rentoul, it's always great to talk to you. I wish we had more time, but we'll check in with you again as the campaign progress.

Both Rishi Sunak and Liz Truss of play tribute to David Tremble, who's died at the age of 77. Tremble was the first minister of Northern Ireland who

played a crucial role in the Good Friday agreement, a peace deal that ended the troubles between Ireland and Northern Ireland.

And the first shipments of Ukrainian grain could begin leaving Black Sea ports this week, under a U.N. brokered deal to ease the global food crisis.

The U.N. says that both Ukrainian and Russia have reaffirmed the commitment to the deal, after Russian strikes on the key port of Odessa during the

weekend threatened to jeopardize it. Ukraine says that grain export should resume within days, even as President Volodymyr Zelenskyy warns the Odessa

strikes prove that Russia cannot be trusted. Russia's foreign minister insists that his country has not violated the agreement.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SERGEI LAVROV, RUSSIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: If we talk all the upside the took place in Odessa, there's nothing in the obligation that Russia has

taken on, including within the framework of the agreement signed on July 22nd Istanbul which would prohibit us from continuing the special military

operation, destroying military infrastructure, and other military targets.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NOBILO: Let's bring in CNN's Ivan Watson. He's live in Odessa tonight.

Ivan, Turkey's presidential spokesperson, Turkey being one of the players in this deal, said that it may lay the foundation for trust that could lead

to a presumption of seem fire prisoner exchange, and eventually a peace agreement, but after Russian missile struck where you are, the port of

Odessa, one day after the agreement was signed, does anyone Ukraine share that view?

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No. I think most Ukrainians think they're in for a long and bloody war. It's already five

months of this. That said, the Ukrainian president has said that he wants grain to be exported, that he doesn't want Ukraine to be standing in the

way of this, and in the same breath, saying that Russia should unblock the Black Sea to allow this to happen.

But from the point of view of the Turkish government, of the UN, you know, if you want to set a foundation for negotiation, you do need to build areas

of trust. And it may be surprising that, in this kind of very cruel and deadly conflict, there have been other areas where these two warring

parties have come to agreements.

[17:10:03]

They have done a number -- conducted a number of prisoner exchanges. There were negotiations that led to the surrender of Ukrainian troops in the

besieged port of Mariupol, at that Azovstal steel factory.

So, I think that's part of what you're hearing from Turkish government officials, they're hoping that this could lead to something more, that

proof will be in the pudding. You need to see whether or not ships can leave, whether or not the Russians will repeat attacks on the ports, where

the grain exports are supposed to be carried out from, whether or not the Ukrainians will agree with what the Russian foreign minister has insisted,

would be an escort of cargo ships by Russian warships.

And if Russian warships got within range of Ukrainian short ship missiles, would they see a big fat juicy target that they could go after, the way

they sank the Moskva, flagship of Russia's Black Sea fleet, some months ago.

So, there's questions here and as we've heard from the U.S. government, they've pointed out that if this falls apart, there's still the plan B,

that the Ukrainians have been working on, it's not as efficient, it can't carry as much grain, but the Ukrainians are exporting rain right now over

land, in trucks, in trains, and by the River Danube.

But again it can't carry as much grain, and that won't make the impact needed to lower global food prices. This war has put tens and millions of

people on the brink of starvation due to the skyrocketing prices of wheat. That's what happens when you attack one of the biggest bread baskets.

NOBILO: Ivan Watson in Odessa, thank you so much.

Now let's take a look at key climate stories, making headlines, extreme heat is proving to be doubly and destructive across the northern

hemisphere. In Europe, forest fire officials say there's a very extreme danger of wildfires in Spain, Portugal, Italy, and Greece. That's the

highest level of risk. Dozens of homes have already been destroyed in Lesbos, Greece, as firefighters battle a fast-moving wildfire there.

In the meantime, 60 million people in the U.S. remain under heat alert. In California, the fast-moving Oak Fire exploded in size during the weekend

near the Yosemite National Park. It's currently only 10 percent contained. California's fire chief battalion chief calls the wildfire's behavior

unprecedented.

Plus, take a look at this video from China, a bridge in Fujian province split in half while summit blocks expanded due to the heat. More than 70

cities are undoing a red alert, the country's highest heat warning, and meteorologists say this doesn't appear that relief will come anytime soon.

And still to come, a pilgrimage of penance. Pope Francis apologizes for the evil inflicted on indigenous people in Canada by the Catholic Church. We'll

take you live to Edmonton.

Plus, Odessa opera and ballet theater has reopened in the midst of war. We take you inside to show you how it's using beauty and grace to offer a

reprieve to Ukraine's beleaguered people.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:16:28]

NOBILO: Pope Francis is expressing sorrow and shame John what he calls a trip penance to Canada, he's apologizing for the Catholic Church's role in

the residential school system, in which thousands of indigenous children, forced to attend those institutions suffered abuse and oppression. One

government report calls it cultural genocide.

The pope spoke of his pain while meeting with indigenous groups near Edmonton.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

POPE FRANCIS, CATHOLIC CHURCH: I have come to our native land to tell you in person, of my sorrow, to implore God's forgiveness, healing, and

reconciliation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NOBILO: CNN's Paula Newton joins us now for the Edmonton.

Paula, how have indigenous communities responded to this trip of penance, and where does this leave the future of the Catholic Church in Canada?

PAULA NEWTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. There are interesting questions, we begin with that apology and how it was received. I mean, Bianca, so much

pain in these communities and of course mixed feelings at -- as he was making that apology there was a lot of emotion in the audience, a lot of

motion across the country.

What we're going to show you now is the legacy of what's still remains in terms of the hurtful, really torturous things that the Catholic Church did

in this country. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NEWTON (voice-over): It has taken the high-tech tools of this century for Canadian soil to give up the torturous secrets of the last. Drones

hovering, swooping, mapping, ground penetrating radar peering into every layer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We see if there's any disturbances in that soil structure.

NEWTON: Disturbances. These are soil anomalies that could lead to the unmarked graves of indigenous children. Those who were once students at

Fort Alexander Residential School in the Sagkeeng First Nation in the province of Manitoba.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When you have 190 anomalies, it's got to be something.

NEWTON: The Catholic institution is no longer standing, but its survivors want you to know what it stood for -- abuse of all kinds that a government

report found amounted to cultural genocide.

RITA GUIMOND, RESIDENTIAL SCHOOL SURVIVOR: That's where the priests stayed.

NEWTON: Rita Guimond was just 6 when she arrived. The abuse started soon after.

GUIMOND: And he'd have us sit on his lap. And meanwhile, he had his hands under our skirts.

NEWTON: Patrick Bruyere was 7. He endured eight years.

PATRICK BRUYERE, RESIDENTIAL SCHOOL SURVIVOR: He got me drunk. I didn't know what the hell happened when I got up the next morning.

NEWTON: Sarah Mazerolle was 6, forced to stay until she was 14.

SARAH MAZEROLLE, RESIDENTIAL SCHOOL SURVIVOR: Bam. Every morning, she did that to me.

NEWTON: Henry Boubard is 80 now, just 7 when the nightmare started.

HENRY BOUBARD, RESIDENTIAL SCHOOL SURVIVOR: After what the priest did to me, sexually, you know, it changed everything.

MAZEROLLE: You had to survive if you were going to live. You had to find ways to get over everything that was being done to you.

BRUYERE: It was all prayer. It was all behave yourself. It was all don't speak your language because if you do you get punished and a lot of

humiliation.

BOUBARD: They told me to pray, to pray, to pray. But prayer, what is prayer?

[17:20:04]

You know, it means nothing to me. If you don't pray, you'll go to hell. I thought all these years I was living in hell in the residential school.

This is hell to me.

NEWTON: Hundreds of victims like these from one school. And there were dozens of these institutions across Canada, most run by the Catholic

Church. More than 150,000 indigenous children were forced to leave their families and were subjected to forced labor, neglect, and sexual and

physical abuse. And thousands just went missing.

In the past years, several indigenous communities have discovered hundreds of unmarked graves and more searches are under way.

The survivors of Fort Alexander were too young to know where children went and why. There remain unmarked crosses in the cemetery made from the old

school pipes. Who lays there?

So here, too, during the very week Pope Francis is on Canadian soil to apologize, they scour the land.

Which with high tech tools in the digital communities throughout Canada hope they can get the spiritual homecoming, that their lost children

deserve something that no papal apology can give them.

The pope arrives with a singular purpose he says, that of pants. But for decades, there was impunity. Very few staff members were ever prosecuted,

and that influx further trauma, some survivors say. And then there's the fact that this in-person apology took years.

JOE DANIELS, RESIDENTIAL SCHOOL SURVIVOR: This thing needed to be dragged out of this person. Someone had to go to Rome, to go in practically begged

this guy to come here and apologize. Why couldn't he have done it on his own from here?

NEWTON: As extraordinary as the pope's pilgrimage to Canada maybe, it stands diminished by the scope of the abuse that it's already known, the

horrors still to be discovered.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NEWTON (on camera): You know, Bianca, I have to point out here, and, look, CNN has covered abuses by members of the Catholic Church for throughout the

entire world, this is different and why it was systemic. It was cultural destruction.

Even the pope himself in the apology said it had catastrophic consequences for indigenous peoples here. And in the words of the indigenous people who

reacted to this apology, don't ask us to get over it, this is the beginning of the healing, certainly not the end -- Bianca.

NOBILO: Paula Newton in Canada, thank you so much.

And we had a very misleading script in the show a little earlier referring to the troubles, which was a conflict between the unionist and Republican

communities, we apologize for.

That now you're taught to protect your king in chess, but who knew yet protect your fingers as well. One young chess player in Russia found out

the hard way, when a chess playing robot broke his finger. You can see in this video how you -- and squeeze. Apparently, the boy made the chest make

too quickly, the incident happened during a match in the Russian chess opened last week. The president at the Moscow chess federation, Sergey

Lazarev, called it, of course, bad.

Luckily, the boy didn't seem traumatized. Lazarev said the child play the next day, and finish the tournament with his finger in a cast.

And back in Ukraine, the Odesa opera and ballet theater is open once again. It had to close for months because of the war. But now, the dancers are

back on stage in becoming a symbol of resistance. Once again, here's Ivan Watson.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WATSON (voice-over): There is great beauty in Ukraine amid the pain and suffering. In the southern pulled city of Odesa, dancers and rehearsal try

to tune out Russia's deadly war.

This is more than just a beautiful expression of art and culture, against the terrible backdrop of this war. These dancers offer a symbol of

defiance, a sign that Ukrainians are not giving up. The Odesa opera and ballet theater stands like a Jewel, albeit one protected by sandbags. The

Russian rockets and missiles periodically power through Odessa, residents here clinging to prewar normality. And that includes the city's 135-year-

old opera.

Viacheslav Chernukho is the opera's director.

It's beautiful. Do you still need opera and ballet and is a terrible war?

VIACHESLAV CHERNUKHO-VOLICH, ODESA NATIONAL ACADEMIC OPERA & BALLET THEATER: Yes. All people need this, and it's very important for society,

opera house is a symbol of a good life. It's -- for you hear music (ph).

[17:25:01]

WATSON: The good life, tonight's ballet performance. But amid preparations, there's an interruption.

An air raid siren warns of a possible attack. I muster downstairs.

This is shelter.

Musicians and dancers wait in the basement. The threat delays the start of a show. Two of tonight's solo ballerinas try to stay limber.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. This is not normal.

WATSON: Why are you sitting here?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because, war yes in our country.

WATSON: Are you afraid?

Yes, of course, we're se says Catarina Kalchinka (ph). Though we're getting accustom to these threats and that in itself is horrible.

After a long delay, the opera gets the clear. Audience members emerge from their own shelter and take their seats.

ANNOUNCER: In case of an air raid alert, all people must proceed to the shelter. Glory to Ukraine.

WATSON: The music of Chopin fills the halls. And for the briefest of moments, the war seems very far away.

The reality though is some of these performers sent their children away for safety to other countries. A number of the artist and crew are defending

their country, serving in the Ukrainian armed forces, while those on stage struggle to keep the city's cultural spirit alive.

Soloist Catarina Kalchinka (ph) crosses herself before entering stage right.

But after just a few steps, the curtain suddenly close as.

Bad news, the third air siren of the night has just gone off. The curtain just came down, and the show has been brought to a stop.

I want the whole world to start screaming, she tells us, to stop this horse that innocent people stop dying. I asked for help the ballerinas, and for

people to stop not to remain silent.

Ivan Watson, CNN, Odesa, Ukraine.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NOBILO: Thanks for watching. That was THE GLOBAL BRIEF.

And "WORLD SPORT" is up for you next.

END