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The Amanpour Hour

Interview with Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT); Interview with Former Colombian President and Nobel Peace Laureate Juan Manuel Santos; Colombia Ramping Up Security on Venezuelan Border; Interview with "Blue Moon" Actor Ethan Hawke; The Broken Promises of U.S. Regime Change in Iraq; why Maduro Thought He was Untouchable. Aired 11a-12p ET

Aired January 10, 2026 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:00:48]

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello everyone, and welcome to THE AMANPOUR HOUR.

Here's where we're headed this week.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT): Trump is basically saying, look, I am powerful. I can do whatever I want. If I want Venezuela's oil, I'm going to get Venezuela's oil.

AMANPOUR: A furious Senator Bernie Sanders responds to Trump's hemispheric moves and the brewing crisis at home.

Then, after Venezuela, everyone is asking who's next? Trump has threatened Greenland and Colombia. Its former president and Nobel Peace Prize winner Juan Manuel Santos insists that the law of the jungle must give way again to the rule of law.

JUAN MANUEL SANTOS, FORMER COLOMBIAN PRESIDENT AND NOBEL PEACE LAUREATE: Chaos is a preamble for war.

AMANPOUR: And --

DAVID CULVER, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Let's get in here.

Got it?

AMANPOUR: A special report. How Colombia is bolstering its borders.

Then do you even recognize yourself looking at that scene?

ETHAN HAWKE, ACTOR, "BLUE MOON": No, I don't.

AMANPOUR: Actor Ethan Hawke on the buzz around his new film "Blue Moon", which follows the tragic downfall of an American musical genius. Plus, from my archive, the last time the U.S. tried its hand at regime

change. What Iraqi students told me about newfound freedoms and broken promises that endure to this day.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We didn't ask the American government to send us to the moon. No, no. It's very simple.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Welcome to the program, everyone. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London.

A new year, a new reality for Venezuela and for the world. It's a new era of American imperialism with dashes of neocolonialism.

Many allies have managed to applaud the morality of removing Venezuelan dictator president, Nicolas Maduro, but they also have serious questions about the legality and the consequences.

Here in Europe, there's a sense of being ensnared in the vise grip of Russia on one side, and the United States of America on the other side. With all this talk about acquiring Greenland, an autonomous area that is in fact part of NATO ally Denmark.

One week since the daring raid on Maduro, lessons from Venezuela are already coming in. For one, Maduros regime and his loyalists are still in power. Only now, the United States is working with them, even as they step up their crackdown on the Venezuelan people.

Also, Trump dissing the opposition, which, after all, handily won the recent elections that stunned people there and abroad.

In the United States, the administration kept Congress in the dark, sidelining its constitutional role to consider and approve these matters.

I asked U.S. Independent Senator Bernie Sanders how Congress is actually going to carry out their mandate. But we started with his reaction to this horrific video that has flooded the airwaves, causing masses of protests. This is ICE agents shooting 37-year-old U.S. citizen Renee Nicole Good.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. No. Shame, shame. Oh my (EXPLETIVE DELETED) God. What the (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: Unbelievable.

The administration says it was in self-defense. The mayor of Minneapolis calls BS on that, and officials there are calling it cold- blooded murder.

Here's Senator Bernie Sanders. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Senator Sanders, welcome to the program.

SANDERS: Good to be with you.

AMANPOUR: You know, it's been a very, very turbulent first week to this new year. I want to start by what's happening in, you know, the American backyard right now. And that is in Minneapolis, where there's been these ongoing clashes between protesters and ICE, because of this incident in which ICE shot dead a American citizen. And the video does not appear to show there was any need for that.

Could you please describe for me what you are thinking about this? What needs to be next steps?

SANDERS: Well, look, this has everything to do -- what happened in Minneapolis is outrageous. It's wrong. And as usual, the Trump administration is lying about what happened.

[11:04:44]

SANDERS: But overall, it reflects a policy of the Trump administration that they are going after many, many hundreds of thousands of people in this country, undocumented people, often without due process, sometimes American citizens.

To my mind, what we have got to do, and I think most Americans understand, is we need to move to comprehensive immigration reform, not send out a small army called ICE to harass, arrest and yesterday shoot people. That is not what this country is supposed to be about.

It's a scary situation. And what we have now is a very well-armed, very significantly increased force of ICE agents who are operating under a president who is doing very bad things.

AMANPOUR: You are going into a vote on a very important matter, which is Congress' obligations and constitutional duties regarding war powers and approving and discussing these kinds of things.

So, what do you think is going to happen in this vote?

SANDERS: Look, here's the issue. In the Constitution of the United States, it is the Congress that has the authority to declare war. The president -- this was not an emergency. This was not a situation like Pearl Harbor or 9/11. Nobody attacked the United States.

This was a premeditated effort. They probably planned it for months. The Congress not only was not -- did not give authorization for this act, they didn't even know about it.

So, this is a president acting unilaterally in violation of the Constitution and the rule of law.

What worries me very much, Christiane, is if you have a president who thinks that he can simply invade another country, you're giving a green light and a justification for any nation, any terrorist organization in the world to do the same. And that's a big deal.

And what Trump is basically saying is, look, I am powerful. I can do whatever I want. If I want Venezuela's oil, I'm going to get Venezuela's oil.

And what that does, I think, is make the world more unstable. It's a justification for Putin. How are you going to criticize Putin for his invasion of Ukraine?

What do you have to say for China if China involves -- gets involved in military adventurism or any other country?

So, it is -- that, to me, is the most dangerous aspect of what Trump has done, unleashing anarchy around the world, saying to any country on earth, you can do whatever you want, undermining the international organizations, the international rule of law. It's a serious concern.

AMANPOUR: Obviously, GOP senators have a different view, and they support it by and large. What is there to stop Trump, though?

SANDERS: All right. Let me just -- let me just back up a little bit here. I mean, what we are talking about is not only the breaking of international law and international anarchy. You're talking about old- fashioned imperialism. And all that that is throughout the history of the world -- England, Spain, Portugal -- way back when, powerful nations went into poor, undeveloped areas and just exploited their resources. They were powerful. They were able to do that.

And what we have seen in the last 100 years in Africa, in Latin America, is an effort for people in those countries to stand up and say, you know what, these are our countries. You can't overthrow our governments. You can't run our governments. You can't steal our natural resources. We have to control our own future.

And what Trump is saying, to hell with all of that. We have the power. We're going to take -- we're going to do anything we want. Steal resources for the oil companies.

Not to mention that, again, all over the world, China and other countries understand that the future is not with fossil fuel and oil given climate change, but the much less expensive, sustainable energies like solar.

So, he's propping up the oil industry at a time when we've got to move away from fossil fuel. So, on top of everything else, that's pretty crazy.

AMANPOUR: So, are Republicans getting exercised by some of this unilateral power -- muscle-flexing around the world?

SANDERS: Christiane, I surely hope so. We have an authoritarian president who ignores the Constitution of the United States, acts in illegal ways virtually every day.

And what has disappointed me is there are Republicans in the Senate and the House who know better. And it is long time, it's long overdue for those guys to start standing up to Trump and saying, you know what, you cannot break the law for your own reasons.

So, I would hope that some of my Republican friends and colleagues will begin to stand up to Trump.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: A small but significant bloc of republicans did break with the president, did vote with Sanders and all senate Democrats to allow a future vote on the resolution.

[11:09:54]

AMANPOUR: Coming up next, the former Colombian president, Juan Manuel Santos, tells me what worries him most about this new era of U.S. meddling in Latin America.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANTOS: As a Colombian, I am worried.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: And later in the program, as award season gets into full swing, my conversation with one of the main contenders, Ethan Hawke, discusses his new film, "Blue Moon".

[11:10:16]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: Welcome back.

In the Venezuela raid for the first time in recent memory, restoring democracy or even human rights were nowhere on the list of stated U.S. priorities for removing a brutal dictator. And yet the opposition remains hopeful. And I've been told that with or without Trump administration help, they will have elections soon.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID SMOLANSKY, VENEZUELAN OPPOSITION POLITICIAN: I don't have any doubt, and I want to reiterate that Maria Corina Machado and Edmundo Gonzalez going to lead the rebuilding of Venezuela. They are the ones who can guarantee us a great alliance with the U.S., a great alliance with the democratic countries in Latin America, a great alliance with the European Union and nations that go beyond.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: Now, President Trump has told the "New York Times" that the U.S. plans to stay running Venezuela for a long, long time. The one thing Trump has made clear, oil is the booty. The U.S. now owns the western hemisphere, and there's more strong arming to come.

Trump has openly threatened Venezuela's neighbor, Colombia, where cartels actually do make and traffic cocaine to the United States. And I spoke to the former Colombian president, Nobel Peace laureate

Juan Manuel Santos.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Welcome to the program, Mr. President.

SANTOS: Thank you, Christiane. I'm very glad to be here with you.

AMANPOUR: What was your reaction when you heard that a sitting president, I know many call him illegitimate, and a dictator, all of that, but nonetheless he was extracted and moved to the United States. And the U.S. says it's running that country now? What's your reaction as a South American?

SANTOS: So, you have, on the one side, the good news that Maduro is no longer in power, the bad news that he was taken out of power through an illegal action.

Apparently, this is to restore legitimacy and democracy in Venezuela. But it's very difficult to understand that the person who is replacing Maduro is his vice president, because she is also illegitimate, because the Maduro regime was an illegitimate regime.

So, it's very difficult to understand that he was replaced by an illegitimate person in terms of democratic values.

And this -- all the people that were responsible for the human rights violations and for the terrible things that happened in Venezuela are still in power and backed by the U.S.

So, that is a difficult aspect to understand. And as a Colombian, I am worried.

AMANPOUR: Can you imagine why the United States would not immediately embrace the opposition that it was -- it already said actually won the elections in '24, not Maduro?

SANTOS: He probably thinks that he can control them much better than he could control the opposition. Because if the opposition is granted the space that it deserves, if you want to recuperate legitimacy in Venezuela, I think that they would be much harder to negotiate with on aspects like, for example, what has happened with the oil.

AMANPOUR: Can I just quickly ask you, you're obviously incredibly well-known as the president who took on the FARC, guerrillas, the rebels, the insurgents in your own country and led a long negotiation which, with a lot of bumps and ups and downs, finally succeeded in bringing peace to your country. You won the Nobel Peace Prize.

Do you worry that there could be an Iraq-style insurgency brewing eventually in Venezuela? I mean, I don't know what's going to happen to the current military there. They're currently running it.

The security services, as you put -- you know, you pointed out and everybody knows, is still cracking down on ordinary civilians in Venezuela. But what if they are pushed aside? What is your analysis of what might happen if there's to be a backlash against the American intervention?

SANTOS: Well, that is one of my worries, that there's a backlash, not only from Venezuela, but from the whole region. This is something that the U.S. should take into consideration.

[11:19:44]

SANTOS: Many people are happy that Maduro is not in power anymore. But this attitude of, "I own the hemisphere and therefore you have to do everything that I want you to do". The Latin Americans have dignity and they have pride. And if they're forced to take more stronger -- a more stronger position to defend their dignity and their pride, they will do it.

We have to recuperate what has been working -- dialogue, multilateralism, the peaceful solution of conflicts. We have to go back to that situation.

AMANPOUR: I wanted you to lay that out because I want you then to react to one of President Trump's key advisers and strategists, and that is Stephen Miller, who has been out since, you know, very publicly saying, but we live in the real world which requires strength, might, and power.

fap

Then he said this about the Western Hemisphere. Let me play what Miller said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHEN MILLER, WHITE HOUSE DEPUTY CHIEF OF STAFF: The United States is using its military to secure our interests unapologetically in our hemisphere.

We're a superpower, and under President Trump, we are going to conduct ourselves as a superpower. It is absurd that we would allow a nation in our own backyard to become the supplier of resources to our adversaries but not to us, to hoard weapons from our adversaries, to be able to be positioned as an asset against the United States, rather than on behalf of the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: So, if that's the strongest country in the world talking like that, what hope is there for the rules-based orders?

SANTOS: This trend of not respecting the rule of law, of weakening multilateralism, of doing away with the U.N., because the U.N. is being weakened -- that is a preamble for chaos and anarchy and possibly war.

If you allow the powerful countries to do whatever they want in their zone of influence, if China goes and invades Taiwan, and that's ok. Now Russia invaded Ukraine, and that's ok. Then where does that stop?

This is what worries everybody. It worries me. Because if we don't have an order, chaos will be the rule, and chaos is a preamble for war.

AMANPOUR: Secretary Rubio has indirectly threatened the Cuban regime, saying if I was in Cuba, if I was a member of the government, I would be worried right now. Do you think the Cubans should be worried right now?

SANTOS: I would be worried if I was a Cuban. But again, hopefully we can sit down, or we should sit down and talk and have a constructive dialogue, because things cannot be allowed to develop in the direction that they are developing.

AMANPOUR: President Juan Manuel Santos, thank you very much for joining us from Colombia.

SANTOS: Thank you, Christiane.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Now, in an attempt to defuse the situation, the Colombian president and President Trump have had a conversation which they've described as good in tone. And potentially the two leaders will meet soon.

Now, coming up after a break, we'll take you to Colombia and show how it is cracking down and beefing up border security.

[11:23:22]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: Welcome back to the program.

Now, before the break, you may have heard the former Colombian president tell us that as a Colombian, he's worried. Well, it seems he's not the only one.

As David Culver reports, Colombia is ramping up its security, deploying a heavy military presence to its border with Venezuela. And its relationship with the Trump administration remains rocky, although they have had a call recently.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CULVER: Let's get in here. Got it?

This is the show of force Colombian commanders want the world, and perhaps mostly Washington, to witness.

And so here it is now evening, going into late in the night, and we're about to see some of the many patrols that have sprawled out across the 1,300-plus miles of border between Colombia and Venezuela.

The government says it's now deployed some 30,000 Colombian troops to its eastern border.

Military commanders stress that their priority is security and stability more than anything else. It may look like an escalation, but they say this is about being prepared for whatever situation might unfold.

But you can't look past the timing, and that is all of this happening as scrutiny from Washington intensifies.

At all hours, the Colombian military increasingly present here.

What is the priority right now?

Pushing back on claims from the Trump administration that they're not doing enough to stop criminal organizations and drugs from crossing the border.

LT. COL. JHONNATAN ARCOS, COLOMBIAN ARMY (through translator): The deployment of troops is to guarantee the sovereignty of the territory.

CULVER: Adamant, they're focused on guaranteeing and defending Colombia's sovereignty and primarily its citizens.

ARCOS (through translator): For the defense of the territory and especially the defense of Colombians.

[11:29:49]

CULVER: You can see steady traffic coming in from Venezuela into Colombia.

This is the Simon Bolivar Bridge. Takes you right into Venezuela.

Or out of Venezuela, in Maria's case, if only for a couple of hours.

She's got a doctor's appointment in Colombia.

She says everything is calm.

She's among those still living in Venezuela, willing to tell us on camera she's happier with Maduro gone.

She says as soon as Maduro became president, everything just went downhill from there. So she's hoping it can revert back to the way it was, she says, before.

In a seemingly forgotten, tucked away mountain community here in Cucuta, Colombia, many we meet dream bigger for Venezuela's future.

And this is a community that's basically a migrant settlement.

She thinks there are more Venezuelans in this community than Colombians. Mind you, we're in Colombia.

This family left Venezuela two years ago, intentionally keeping close to their homeland. Do you want to go back?

She would love to go back.

And yet, before returning, she, like most here, want to see lasting changes take shape.

Do you think the U.S. can change things in Venezuela?

She does think the U.S. actually can contribute, not to do everything, but to at least make a better Venezuela, as she sees it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: David Culver reporting there.

And coming up, he spent four decades climbing to Hollywood's starriest heights, but critics say his latest role may be his finest yet. I speak to actor Ethan Hawke. That's after the break.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HAWKE: I've done nine movies with Richard Linklater, and before we started this one, he told me right when rehearsal started, he's like, I don't want to see you for the next couple of months.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[11:31:53]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: Welcome back to a world of sequined gowns, tailored tuxedos, and the glowing lights of Broadway. "Blue Moon" is the latest film from director Richard Linklater, who takes us to 1940s New York and gives us a peek at the grim reality behind the magic of showbiz musicals.

The films subject is Lorenz Hart, the real-life lyricist who wrote "My Funny Valentine", "The Lady is a Tramp" and, of course, "Blue Moon". We meet him in a moment of crisis, as his life and career begin to unravel.

Critics are calling it a career-defining performance for actor Ethan Hawke, best known for his roles in "Before Sunrise", "Dead Poets' Society" and "Training Day". And he joined me from New York.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Ethan Hawke, welcome to the program.

HAWKE: Thank you for having me.

AMANPOUR: Can I say, I'm now seeing Ethan Hawke as I know Ethan Hawke. When I saw you turn up in "Blue Moon," I literally nearly fell off my chair. You were barely recognizable. I mean, no hair or at least heavily, you

know, shaved and all the rest of it.

Just tell me a little bit about Lorenz Hart and what made him a person who you wanted to inhabit and you wanted to tell this story.

HAWKE: Well, this story is kind of a howl into the night. It's a moment I think a lot of us can relate to of when you fully absorb your own irrelevance. And when it's happening from a human being whose ego is huge, it's even more devastating.

This is a guy who -- you know, Rodgers and Hart were the Lennon and McCartney of their era. For 25 years, their music was played on every jukebox in America, and they're being covered by all the other musicians in the world, and all of a sudden, you know, Rodgers is collaborating with a new partner, Oscar Hammerstein, and musical theater is changing. And it's almost like Lorenz Hart is put on a little iceberg that's just floating away as the jazz era ends and this new era of American arts is happening. And he knows he's witnessing his own death.

AMANPOUR: So, I'm going to play the first of the few clips that we have. Rodgers has said that he wants to collaborate again with Hart. And this is a little bit of this as they take photos together.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, you up for that? You feeling healthy? Is that something you could take seriously?

HAWKE: Yes. I'm on the wagon. I'm serious. I've been drinking ginger ale all night, well, except for this second, because this second we have to celebrate. This is the greatest musical in the history of American theater.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, no, no, I'm not drinking with you, Larry.

HAWKE: Ok. Ok. All right. Shoot this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What? Oh, no, no, no. Larry, I got it.

HAWKE: Rodgers and Hart, together again.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All right.

HAWKE: Closer. Come on, closer.

I want 10 copies of that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Great. Write me a check.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: I mean, it's poignant. By the way, do you even recognize yourself looking at that scene? HAWKE: No, I don't. I mean, that was -- you know, I've done nine movies with Richard Linklater, and before we started this one, he told me, right when rehearsal started, he's like, I don't want to see you for the next couple months.

And part of my job was the deductive process of trying to get rid of all the normal tools I use as an actor and try to find different ones.

[11:39:47]

HAWKE: You know, and I did want to say that that clip that you showed is really interesting because Hart did write a few more songs for the revival of "Connecticut Yankee" and that was the last time they collaborated.

But it's so sad because at the opening night of that "Connecticut Yankee" revival Hart was so drunk that he wouldn't stop singing along with the actors on stage to the point where Rodgers had to ask police to escort him out.

AMANPOUR: I want to talk about Richard Linklater because as you say nine movies with him. What is it about him, and also, you know, they talk about sort of in the film -- I mean, the impact is of a creative divorce between Hart and Rodgers. And obviously, you haven't had that with Linklater. You're still working really strong.

But tell me about what it's like to work with somebody for so long and to trust them and to both of you make such good work and be so rightly celebrated for it like those two were.

In their case it fell apart. Do you ever think about that and consider that?

HAWKE: Yes. I mean, it's certainly in the subconscious of the film. Rodgers and Hart had a 20-year, 25-year collaboration, and so do Linklater and I.

And what is it that makes artistic intimacy? I mean, it's a very close -- when you create together, when your names are associated with each other, when you're pouring pieces of yourself into your art, mixing them with the other person, it's a powerful connection and I think we wanted to make a film about that.

The obvious answer about how we keep working together is we stay at a rehab you know or -- meaning in a lot of ways the greatest demons in our life and the destruction of our relationships is usually self- sabotage.

And Larry Hart had some demons he couldn't -- he couldn't wrangle and then that made it very difficult for him to maintain friendships.

And I think that Rick and I, we do try to take care of ourselves and each other.

AMANPOUR: It's been a blockbuster year for the Hawkes. You have done this. You've done many others. You've done "The Lowdown," "Black Phone 2," et cetera, all these things. You're getting a lot of critical acclaim.

Your son is doing so well in his role. And your daughter, Maya Hawke, is part of the massive zeitgeist right now in "Stranger Things," right? How do you feel about that?

HAWKE: It's one of these incredible gifts I never -- I guess you can't understand it until it happens to you, to watch your children become themselves.

You know, I got to see my son star at Lincoln Center doing "Ibsen's Ghosts" this year. Maya's not only in "Stranger Things" but she was in this beautiful Sarah Ruhl play, "Eurydice", here.

And to watch them thrive and watch them love each other, their younger siblings, watching these people that were children have their own lives and being so proud of them is something my heart didn't know was going to happen.

You know, they spend a lot of energy telling you you're going to fall in love someday, but this feeling of watching your children grow up and watching them thrive is not like any other feeling I've understood.

AMANPOUR: Yes. Well, that's wonderful.

Congratulations on all that you do and thanks for being with us.

HAWKE: Well, thank you for having me. I appreciate your time and your interest.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: "Blue Moon" is playing in select theaters, and of course, you can rent or buy it on streaming platforms.

When we come back, America's record of military intervention since 9/11 have been riddled with pitfalls. Some lessons from my archive next from the mother of all regime changes, George W. Bush's 2003 invasion of Iraq to remove the dictator Saddam Hussein.

[11:43:39]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: Welcome back.

Throughout this hour, we've tried to figure out the logic of the Trump "might makes right" doctrine. The administration and its supporters insist that by not invading Venezuela and just surgically decapitating its leader, the U.S. has learned the lessons of Iraq.

But as we know, decapitation was the easy part then. Running and rebuilding that country was the hard and deadly part.

And the United States is widely considered to have failed there despite decades and tens of thousands of troops on the ground. I spoke with young people at a Baghdad University less than a year

after the fall of Saddam Hussein. And while they were happy their dictator was gone, they couldn't understand why they were still paying such a high price for the U.S. action.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: At Baghdad University's Language College, students tell us they are still high on their newfound freedom.

"Freedom of opinion, freedom of speech, freedom of thought," says Bishar. But the conversation quickly turns pessimistic. Bishar uses English to make sure we understand.

[11:49:48]

BISHAR, STUDENT, BAGHDAD UNIVERSITY: I think there is no good future in Iraq nowadays because there's no security.

AMANPOUR: 19-year-old Rhym (ph) says the lack of security makes it hard just to get to school. Things have not turned out as most Iraqis hoped.

"It's been eight months since the end of the war," she says, "and nothing has improved. "America is meant to be a great country that can do anything. Why can't it control the violence?"

And all these months later, 27-year-old Hadi Salah (ph) is astounded that power cuts can still last for days.

HADI SALAH, STUDENT, BAGHDAN UNIVERSITY: And we didn't ask the American government to send us to moon. No. No. It's very simple. Our problems is very simple like electricity, the water.

AMANPOUR: 19-year-old Hamza (ph) now sees only a bleak future, unsure whether the Americans will be able to bring the democracy and stability they promised.

"It's possible," she says, "but not in my lifetime. We've come to a point where I don't think anything good is going to happen and I wish I could leave this country, because it's frightening."

Although American officials publicly present a sunny picture of flowering democracy here, a CIA report leaked this month has a much grimmer assessment of ordinary Iraqis losing faith in the United States, its staying power and its ability to fulfill its promises. This, in turn, is said to be fueling the growing insurgency.

There used to be 30,000 phone lines to this particular Baghdad neighborhood. But eight months after the U.S. bombed the central exchange during the war, there is still no service.

Sajad (ph), the telephone engineer, says this is the kind of thing that fuels people's resentment.

"If the Americans show they're accomplishing something for the Iraqi people," he says, "naturally the people will accept them. But they're not seeing anything from the Americans yet, so it's natural that the resistance is growing."

Sajad and his team are racing to try to accomplish something for this neighborhood, getting the phone back up by the end of the year.

Meanwhile, back at the university, Jaffah Saheb (ph) clings to the hope that the U.S. current crackdown on the guerrillas will succeed.

"We have a saying here, when a bull is slaughtered, he gives a few last kicks. We hope these are the last kicks of the terrorists."

Christiane Amanpour, CNN -- Baghdad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: But as we know, it took many, many years to crack down and tamp down on that terrorist insurgency. And 20 years and many billions of dollars later, even now, the energy infrastructure remains broken. People still struggle for electricity.

I will never forget that young man who told me we didn't ask America to send us to the moon. No, we just want electricity.

In the famous phrase, "the U.S. broke it, but they have not fixed it", it should stand as a sobering lesson, especially as the Trump administration seems to be signaling that it's ready for another Middle East adventure in neighboring Iran, not to mention staying for many, many years in Venezuela.

When we come back, keep calm and carry on? Who knows what Maduro was thinking with these pre-snatched dance moves that may have been one wiggle too far. Nicolas Maduro's overconfident composure on display even when I spoke to him shortly after he took over from Hugo Chavez. After a break.

[11:53:20]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: And finally -- blindfolded, bound and behind bars, this week we saw the ousted Venezuelan president as we've never seen him before. But just a week earlier, Nicolas Maduro was dancing at a rally shown all over state television, shrugging off U.S. escalation all around him.

That show of overconfidence or blissful ignorance was Maduro's go-to posture until the end. And I saw it close up when I interviewed him in 2014, after he had succeeded Hugo Chavez, who the U.S. Had also tried to overthrow a decade earlier. Even then, Maduro was convinced of his own invincibility.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: Do you really believe they want to reconquer Latin America? NICOLAS MADURO, FORMER VENEZUELAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Of

course. Of course I do. They want, first of all, the economic control, they have the political control through political classes and elites that govern some of our countries.

And they want to have the military control because, regrettably, the U.S. elite, they have a project to establish the hegemony and the control.

AMANPOUR: What keeps you up at night? What worries you?

MADURO: Me?

AMANPOUR: Yes.

MADURO: I sleep peacefully. I have no problems to get -- I sleep like a child.

AMANPOUR: Really?

MADUOR: And luckily. I'm a -- peace of mind. Total peace of mind. And I do so, and I have it because I know I've been loyal. And I'm fulfilling with the legacy of this marvelous, giant figure who is President Chavez. And that gives me a lot of peace of mind.

[11:59:47]

MADURO: And I do things with honesty to favor our people. I do not nothing -- for my own profit. The only one governing me is my conscience and the Venezuelan people.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Well, the Venezuelan people have long spoken out against Maduro's dictatorship, but it's unclear when they will actually be free of it, as his actual regime remains in power, with President Trump saying he'll be running Venezuela along with them for many more years into the foreseeable future.

And that's all we have time for. Don't forget, you can find all our shows online as podcasts at cnn.com/audio and on all other major platforms.

I'm Christiane Amanpour in London. Thank you for watching and I'll see you again next week.