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CNN Connie Chung Tonight
Police Arrest Suspect in Samantha Runnion Murder; Interview with Johnnie Cochran
Aired July 19, 2002 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CONNIE CHUNG, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening. I'm Connie Chung.
Tonight, have police captured the man who killed Samantha Runnion? Who is he, and can you keep your children safe?
ANNOUNCER: Is this the serial killer we're looking for?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL CARONA, ORANGE COUNTY SHERIFF: We have made an arrest in connection with this case.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Tonight, the suspect's mother says her son is innocent.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ADELINA AVILA, ALEJANDRO'S MOTHER: I don't think my son did anything.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: And the chilling 911 tapes that launched the murder investigation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, my God! I found a dead body. It's a baby. I think it might even be the little girl from the news.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Now, parents across the nation are asking: What can I do to protect my child? Tonight, survival strategies.
New video in the Inglewood beating case.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNNIE COCHRAN, ATTORNEY: This young man was in custody. He was disabled. And at that time, when he slammed that face into the car, that became a crime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Tonight, the beating victim's new lawyer, Johnnie Cochran, is outraged.
Consumer alert: Before you throw that burger on the grill, listen to this. Thirty tons of bad beef is recalled. Is any of it in your freezer?
Live from CNN's Broadcast Center in New York, Connie Chung.
CHUNG: Good evening.
The sheriff dropped a bombshell today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CARONA: At 9:55 this morning, members of the investigative team arrested Alejandro Avila, date of birth 3/13/75, a 27-year-old male, six-foot tall, 200 pounds.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUNG: Alejandro Avila is under arrest in connection with the kidnapping, sexual assault and killing of 5-year-old Samantha Runnion. Who is Avila? He's been accused of molesting girls before, but was found not guilty. We'll have more on him, including remarks from his mother today in just a moment.
But first, the police today also released a chilling tape of Tuesday's 911 call. It came from a man identified only as Justin. The call alerted them that a body, which turned out to be Samantha's, had been found.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hello?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, what's going on?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, my God. I found a dead body. Please hurry. OK, I'm in the Ortegas (ph), OK. OK, in the mountains (ph). I'm in Riverside (AUDIO GAP), OK.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Listen to me. I'm scared to sit here. There's another truck up the street, and we want to get out of here. We're scared.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. I understand that. I need to know what street...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE). Listen. I got to hear her. What? Tell me. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What street are you on?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm on Killen Trail. It's a main street -- it's not's a main street, but it's a big street out here. K-I-L-L-E-N Trial.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. And what is your name?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My name is Justin (AUDIO GAP). Hey, can I go to my house? I'm really nervous right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fine. What is your phone number that you're on?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My phone number that I'm on is a cell phone. If you can call me in a couple of minutes, I'll be at my house too. I'll give you that number.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, we're going to go because I'm scared right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justin, what is your address?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know my address there. I just moved there like a couple of weeks ago. It's my friend. They let me move into their barn.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And we just got off of work and we pulled up, and there was this (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, Justin? Justin, I need you to calm down a little.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justin, I understand. You need to calm down a little. Where is the body at on Killen?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (AUDIO GAP) come back here about, I'd say, about a mile. (UNINTELLIGIBLE).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justin, you're breaking up. I can't hear you. Justin? Justin?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hello?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Justin.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, my phone is cutting out. I'm going to my house right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's OK. How soon will it be until you get to your house?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm pulling into my gated community. I'll be there within like four minutes. (AUDIO GAP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If I just call 911 there, will I just get back to you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You'll get back to us, yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. I'm just going to call you as soon as I get there. I'm so scared right now. It was a little kid.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Calm down.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm sorry, but I have a 3-year-old son.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You have a 3-year-old son with you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, but...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Justin -- hey, hey, was this an adult?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Was it an adult body?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, it was a baby. I think it might even be the little girl that's been on the news. It's a little girl, I swear. We just looked. And as soon as we'd seen it, we left.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Now, how far off Killen?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (UNINTELLIGIBLE).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, Justin, do this. As soon as you get home, I want you to dial 911 and ask for Mary (ph), OK?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can't really hear you. I'm freaking out. I'm sorry. I'll stop, all right.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's OK. That's OK. I want you to dial 911 as soon as you get home and ask for Mary, OK?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK. All right. OK. Ask for Mary?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK, bye.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Bye.
(END VIDEO CLIP) CHUNG: Just wrenching. CNN's Charles Feldman has been on the story since it broke. He joins us now from Los Angeles. Charles, authorities first played that 911 tape and then announced the arrest of Avila, but quickly went silent until they'll hold a news conference in about an hour from now. Isn't that unusual?
CHARLES FELDMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Connie, it's very unusual. And here's what happened, I'm told. They felt very compelled to make the arrest this morning because of all the media pressure. By this morning, some local TV stations were already talking about the name of the suspect. They were already airing or planning to air some pictures of him. So, it was decided early on that they would make the arrest and then spend the rest of the day, and they have done that, gathering more information so that they can complete it. And they intend to, at their news conference later tonight, dot the Is and cross the Ts -- Connie.
CHUNG: So, what can you tell us about the suspect?
FELDMAN: Well, this is not the first brush with the law that Mr. Avila has had. It is alleged that back in 1999, he molested two children. One was the daughter of the woman he was dating at the time. The other was that young girl's cousin. He was actually brought to trial on those charges, but a jury found him not guilty. That was back in 2001.
And I was told this afternoon by the deputy district attorney in Riverside County that the man who prosecuted that case today is devastated, his words, and feels awful that this man is now being accused of another sexual abuse case, but this one leading to the murder of a young girl.
CHUNG: Charles, do you have any idea what led police to Avila?
FELDMAN: No, except that we have been told in general terms, Connie, that this is a case that has been really very reliant upon tips from people. Forensics, yes, evidence, yes, but also, and most importantly, we're told tips from the average person. That's one of the reasons why they've been careful all along to appeal to the public to call in with any information they may have. And at this news conference later tonight, I suspect we'll learn a lot more about how they found their suspect -- Connie.
CHUNG: Charles, I know that the police brought in a lot of other people, a number of other people, for questioning. Are there any other suspects?
FELDMAN: I'm told the answer to that is no. They don't believe he operated with an accomplice. They don't believe that anybody else was responsible. They do believe, as they had early on when they arrested him this morning, that he is their man. They spent the day trying to make sure they have enough evidence to go before a judge and an arraignment, probably on Monday. And they are confident that this is the guy -- Connie.
CHUNG: And one other question, back to his previous arrests. Did you -- were you able to gain any knowledge about why he was acquitted?
FELDMAN: Well, when I talked to the deputy district attorney, he said that he felt that part of the problem with that earlier trial was that there was some evidence about some pornographic material that Mr. Avila allegedly had in his possession at the time he was charged with those other crimes. That material was not allowed into the trial. The deputy district attorney told me he thought that may have had an affect on the outcome of the trial. But he said he wasn't really sure, but they all feel awful.
CHUNG: Charles, there's one more question in five seconds. Any word on Justin, because that 911 tape was so difficult to listen to.
FELDMAN: Yes, no, except that this is clearly a very upset young man. I mean, there is no other way to put it. And you can imagine, you know, finding the body of a small child, I think almost anybody would react that way. I feel sorry for him.
CHUNG: All right. Thank you, Charles Feldman in Los Angeles.
Now, earlier today, freelance videographer John Casper spoke with Avila's mother, Adelina, about his arrest as she was speaking with her son on the phone. Here's some of what she had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AVILA: They are just investigating because he has a green card, but his car is Thunderbird. They gave me's search warrant and it mentioned the little girl's death. And I said, well, I don't think my son did anything. But as long as he's cooperating, and I don't -- I don't have anything against that.
QUESTION: You don't think your son would do something like this?
AVILA: No. No.
QUESTION: Is that your son you are talking to now on the phone?
AVILA: Yes.
QUESTION: What does he have to say?
AVILA: Since he was detained -- well, he's detained for investigation, but he's not arrested. This is the first time I talked to him.
QUESTION: And where was he last Monday and Tuesday?
AVILA: Monday, he was at the Mall in Ontario. And Tuesday, he was, I don't know, here with us, and then -- he comes and goes. So, I just told him what I know.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUNG: David Casper and his wife, producer Nancy Casper, join us now from Lake Elsinore, California. Mr. Casper, did Avila's mother talk to you about how her son was being treated by the authorities?
DAVID CASPER, FREELANCE VIDEOGRAPHER: When we were there, Connie, as she just had received the call from him and he indicated, like we heard, that he was being held at a hotel, not in a jail cell. We thought it was kind of unusual that his mom should get a call from her son from jail. So, we began asking and found out...
CHUNG: You mean, from a cell.
CASPER: ... that he's, in fact -- right, right...
NANCY CASPER, FREELANCE TV PRODUCER: Right next door to the jail.
CHUNG: I see.
D. CASPER: And so we began asking her about it, and did discover in fact that he was not free to leave, but he couldn't tell us where he was either.
CHUNG: Did she indicate whether police were questioning him? I thought I had heard a little earlier that the police were yelling at him, trying to get him to confess.
D. CASPER: We had heard some of those same things. We, unfortunately, didn't have direct contact with anybody that in fact saw that happen. She was pretty cool as a mom, and we couldn't tell what his demeanor was on the phone. But we asked if he had any particular message to the public. And he said, yes, I didn't do it. That's all he could tell us.
N. CASPER: In fact, when his mom was talking to him on the phone, it was like just a normal conversation between a mom and a son that was down the street. She didn't seem upset and neither did he. And he was just answering questions that us reporters were asking him.
CHUNG: Mrs. Casper, when you got there, we were told certainly that there were a number of search warrants. Did you see anything being taken out by the authorities?
N. CASPER: Oh, yes. They had huge bags of things. I would say in all, I found maybe 15 bags, and they were a good three or four feet tall. So I don't know what they put in them, if they were bedding or clothing or what, but they were big bags.
CHUNG: We were also told that the -- a couple of cars, as many as four actually, were taken into custody as well.
N. CASPER: Yes.
D. CASPER: That was one thing that we noticed. When we got here, they were towing away a white vehicle. There was a lot of talk about a green vehicle. We were told by some of the people that that was parked in a field nearby and had been towed away earlier. We didn't have a chance to see that, but that was the vehicle that was described as being involved in the kidnapping. N. CASPER: The white vehicle, they put it on the tow truck and took it away while we were here.
CHUNG: I see. Mrs. Casper, you also questioned one of the neighbors. What was the result of that conversation?
N. CASPER: Connie, it was amazing. We've done so many crime scenes. And when we pulled up, it was totally different. Normally, when people see a news crew, they run up and say, put me on TV, put me on TV. But this time, it was so different. They just stood around and hugged their kids and didn't say too much. And I interviewed one woman and she said, "I cannot believe that this is happening in my own backyard. We live right by this man, and I have two little girls."
D. CASPER: We had dozens of people asking us, have they caught him? Have they caught him? And at that point we couldn't answer. We didn't know what to say.
CHUNG: Was there one woman who had had an encounter with Avila in the recent days?
N. CASPER: Yes, there was. There was a woman that had gone down to her car, and it was around 10:00 at night. And she had gone to her car, got something out of it and was walking back. And the -- she said the hairs on the back of her neck kind of stood up, and she looked around and this Avila guy was following her and watching her. And she couldn't figure out why he was watching her. And she says, "I've got a little girl, so that is what I think he was looking at."
CHUNG: All right. John Casper, Nancy Casper, thank you so much for joining us. We appreciate it.
And one other note, Mrs. Avila apparently had told reporters that, quote, "whoever committed that crime needs to be tied up to something and burned up alive." And she also said that she and her son had discussed the fact that the girl's body was discovered, and he said who could do such a thing to a little girl?
And to remind you once again, the Orange County sheriff will hold another news conference tonight at 9:00 Eastern time. CNN will have live coverage, so do stay with us.
ANNOUNCER: Coming up, are your children targets?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And if he grabs this kid, he should just run around and spin and not give up, don't let me get ahold of him. You know, and if he breaks away from me, you know, you can't catch a 9- year-old.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Strategies for protection and survival when CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: Part of the hunt for the killer of 5-year-old Samantha Runnion has involved the construction of a profile of what his personality might be. What is that profile? How has it been developed and what does it tell police?
Well, joining me now from Palm Springs, California is Patrick Mullany, one of the pioneers of the FBI's profiling techniques. Welcome and thank you for being with us.
Now, first, take us inside the mind of a killer. Who would rape a girl, kill her? Who would have this sick mind?
PATRICK MULLANY, FORMER FBI PROFILER: Well, almost 30 years ago, Connie, we started psychological profiling. And that was one of the first questions that we asked ourselves. And quite honestly, there are a number of different categories of people that do kill and people that do kill children. One of the things, I think, that police are trying to determine right now is that category that they are seeing at the crime scene.
CHUNG: Mr. Mullany, is this person insane?
MULLANY: Absolutely not. This person is in total contact with reality. This person is able to plan. This person is able to deceive. This person is able to con. He definitely is not classified as insane.
CHUNG: Now, police arrested a person today, and we need to stress that this person is simply a suspect. The question is, though, does this suspect fit the profile?
MULLANY: Well, this suspect very much fits the profile. And it's very consistent with the profile of someone that would kill a very young child. Everything that I have...
CHUNG: Why do you say that?
MULLANY: Because one of the things that the police were convinced about is that this person had previously involved himself in some sort of molestation, and I think that is turning out...
CHUNG: But he was acquitted, sir.
MULLANY: Well, to be acquitted and to be involved in it -- in the state of California -- is very much the same thing. We in California can use an acquittal like that as evidence in this particular case. And that's by state law.
CHUNG: Really? I don't understand why.
MULLANY: Because it's evidentiary.
CHUNG: And, I mean, but even though he was found not guilty, wouldn't the defense really take exception to that? MULLANY: Well, they can take exception to it being entered in a courtroom, but yet again, the police can consider it, the prosecution in this case considered it as well as evidentiary in the type of behavior that was exhibited with this crime.
CHUNG: All right, Mr. Mullany, we interviewed two young girls yesterday who said about a month ago they were approached by a man who basically fit the composite drawing that was circulated and that this man approached them and asked them if they had seen a Chihuahua.
Very similar to the story that occurred with Samantha. We asked these girls if the suspect looks like that same person who approached them. And they said, I don't think so. But part of the problem, they said, was because the man they saw was bald. Now this is really tough business, isn't it, in terms of trying to identify a potential suspect.
MULLANY: It's tough business, but it's interesting in that interview, which I happened to see, they didn't refer to him as bald, they basically referred he had very short, cropped hair, which could very well be the case when they saw him. Maybe not necessarily, but could very well be the case.
CHUNG: Well, they said that his head was shiny. So they sort of led us to believe that this man, this suspect, Avila, did not resemble the person that they had seen.
MULLANY: Well, if that is the case, that points to one of the dilemmas that law enforcement is involved in. Because that becomes a lead which they have to follow through with and determine whether or not that person who presented himself to those two young ladies is one and the same person.
And there's a very, good chance that he's not. But yet again, they are going to have to take that lead, follow it through, and find out if in fact the subject that they have now, the suspect, could possibly have been involved in that encounter.
CHUNG: The authorities keep saying that this particular killer left basically a signature, and one of the aspects of this was that the way the body was left, does it usually tell you something about the type of crime that occurred?
MULLANY: Connie, the crime scene will tell an investigator everything. The crime scene, you know, I find to be the single most factor that you have to put into profiling a potential suspect in a murder. And when I heard them say that a calling card was left, it told me that this crime scene was very, sloppily done. In other words, there was no effort at covering up.
What I think will be of interest is simple things, like seeing how far the car track is from where the body was dropped, to see how far the footprints go, you know, from the car track to where the body was dropped. And quite honestly, in that crime scene we also have to look at the condition of the victim. And it is going to tell the investigators a tremendous amount. It also tells the profiler a tremendous amount.
CHUNG: Just very quickly, in about 10 seconds, can you tell us why the -- how far the steps are from -- the footprints are from the body and all that, why that is significant? What would it tell you?
MULLANY: It would tell me immediately if -- let's say the car print was right near where the body was found. It would tell me that we have a killer who is probably acting out of complete panic at trying to get rid of this body. He is not interested at all in covering up his crime, and what he's basically doing, he's leaving, as the police have said, his calling card.
Those things, like footprints and tire prints, are almost as good as fingerprints at a crime scene.
CHUNG: All right. Thank you so much Patrick Mullany.
MULLANY: Connie, it was good to be here.
CHUNG: All right.
We've been trying get some idea about what leads a human being to do something so awful to another human being, whether it is 5-year-old Samantha Runnion or 14-year-old Elizabeth Smart. But we also wanted to get some insights into what parents can do to protect their kids from these predators, however rare they may be.
So earlier I spoke with a personal safety consultant, J.J. Bittenbinder, a detective in the Cook County Sheriff Office, along with an unofficially deputized assistant.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CHUNG: J.J., what's the biggest mistake parents make?
J.J. BITTENBINDER, PERSONAL SAFETY CONSULTANT: Not talking to their children and telling them they have a problem. You have got to talk to your children and tell them that strangers are not allowed in your home, around your children. And you talk to them in a school situation.
The whole class hears it. And then you take them home and you reinforce it. But if you just take your finger and wiggle it at the child and say, you know you can't do this, the child is going to rebel. But if everybody gets the same message at the same time, everybody is on the same page.
CHUNG: You know, I've always heard that you should fingerprint the child. But that sounds -- I don't know -- it doesn't sound like something I would do with my son.
BITTENBINDER: Well, first of all, you can do that. You can go to the police department and they'll fingerprint your child and they'll give you the set of fingerprints if you want to do that. But it's very important to have a picture of your child, so that you would be able to put that in the newspaper if the child was abducted. But the smart thing to do is make sure your child is not abducted. And there's three rules to teach you to do that. And the first rule is, if the child is approached either by somebody in a vehicle or somebody on foot, the child yells, "Stranger!" as loud as the child can get, because the word stranger is the only word that says the man dragging this kid into the car is not his father, and stranger is the only word that will get every adult to look over there. Every parent for sure, and maybe we can save one.
The second rule is, I want the children to stay together. You know? Over 90 percent of all these abductions, they take one child. Rarely two and never three. So if the children are in a group, they're a lot tougher.
And I want them to run. That's a third rule. Run as a group. Not in separate directions, but as one group. Stay together in that group.
CHUNG: All right, J.J. If your child is grabbed by the stranger, what should he do?
BITTENBINDER: Well, it all depends. We'll show you how this works. If the child is going to and from school and he's got that book bag on, you want the child to run always.
But before you want him to run, you tell him to drop the books. So if this guy comes up and he's going to grab the child, and the child drops the books, all we've got here is this book bag. That's all we've got. And he's not after this kid for the book bag. That's not what he's here for. He wanted that kid, but he didn't get him.
Now, if the kid is just wearing a jacket or a sweater or something, and he reaches for the kid, and the kids comes right out of the sweater or the jacket, he's standing here with this coat and that's all he got. The kid got away. There is nothing that anybody can put on their body that is worth getting sexually assaulted for.
So whether it's the books or the clothes or whatever, he starts to scream. And he has to start to scream. And he has to get other people involved. Otherwise he's going to have to deal with it by himself, and that's not fair.
CHUNG: But J.J., if this man or whoever it is, is a lot larger than the child is...
BITTENBINDER: It's a man.
CHUNG: All right -- and grabs this child from the back, what should the child do?
BITTENBINDER: You've got -- you've got to spin around. Come on over here, young man.
You have got to spin around. And if he grabs this kid, he should just run around and spin and not give up and don't let me get a hold of him. If he breaks away from me, you can't catch a 9-year-old, there's no way you can do it. Because a 9-year-old can make those real sharp turns and they're are going to get away. They really are going to get away. But say he gets him...
CHUNG: Yes.
BITTENBINDER: And he's going to try to stuff him in the car.
CHUNG: Right.
BITTENBINDER: If he gets him and he's going to try to stick him in the car, well, the kid never stops fighting. He fights all the way into the car, and I shove him into the car, and he honks the horn. Before I can get him, he's out the door.
CHUNG: Right.
BITTENBINDER: Now -- he's never stop fighting. He can't stop fighting, because if they get into the car, they're not going to be back. That happens to many, many people. We find bodies in the woods in the forest preserve all across this nation every week. Men, women and children, and none of those people were walking through those forest preserves when they were attacked. They were brought there, and they were brought there in a car. You can't get into the car. If you get into the car, you're not going to be back.
CHUNG: But J.J., what if the other door is locked in the front and the child can't open the door and get himself out?
BITTENBINDER: Well, what he can do is jump into the back seat and go out the back on the other side, the passenger side back. Now, I don't want the kid to jump out while the car is moving. You wait for a red light or a stop sign or something. If the kid is put into the trunk there is no possibility. This kid has got serious problems. They should fight all the way. They should scream and holler and make sure that we get involved. By we I don't mean just the police, I mean everybody, every citizen, and we've all got to do this together. We're all part of the group.
CHUNG: Well, if the child is able to roll the window down, what should he yell, again?
BITTENBINDER: He should be yelling, "stranger, help, call the police, this is not my father." Just screaming and screaming and screaming.
CHUNG: All right. And what happens...
BITTENBINDER: You've got to get somebody else involved.
CHUNG: And what happens if the man comes up to him -- I've always heard the mom or the dad should agree with the child what a special password is, because these people are very clever and they'll come up and say, "my mom told me to pick you up."
BITTENBINDER: Some of the lures are, you know, your mother has been in an accident, you know, and I'm supposed to bring you to the hospital, or I'm supposed to take you to your father because your mother went to your father -- they'll come up with something. And the child should immediately say, "what's the password?" Now, while the child is talking, he should be backing up, because right away the flag is up here. We know that this could be a problem.
And if the guy says, well, I forgot it or I left it in the car, come here, I'll read it to you. No, no, the kid is gone. The kid is gone. Passwords are very important.
CHUNG: All right. And there is one other thing that I've heard about, and that is if the child is chewing chewing gum, they can stick it in the ignition of the car. Now, to me that sounds very difficult.
BITTENBINDER: That's not something that the child should do. I don't want the child to spend any effort at all trying to disable his car. I want the child to spend all of his effort getting out of the car and getting away from this man, because if he doesn't do it, he's in for a very, very bad time.
CHUNG: All right. J.J. Bittenbinder, thank you so much for being with us.
BITTENBINDER: You're welcome.
CHUNG: Still ahead -- CNN will be live at the news conference on the arrest of a suspect in the killing of Samantha Runnion. Stay with us.
ANNOUNCER: Still ahead -- tainted beef? Millions of pounds in 21 states now under scrutiny. Tonight -- how to make sure what you are cooking on the grill is safe, when CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: We'll continue, but first let's go to Aaron Brown in New York for a quick check of tonight's developing stories to the minute -- Aaron.
AARON BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Thank you, Connie. And here's a quick look at what's making news. Stock prices got hammered today. The Dow Industrial Average dropping 390 points. It was lower than that toward the end of the day. Sell-off dragged the Dow to its lowest level in almost four years. It closed just above the 8,000 mark. Nasdaq dropped almost 38 points. The S&P 500, off 33. It was a miserable day in the stock market.
An important day in the investigation into the death of Samantha Runnion in California. Police today arrested a suspect in connection with the kidnapping and the murder of the 5-year-old. But authorities say the arrest of 27-year-old Alejandro Avila does not conclude their investigation. We hope to find out more about what that means when the Orange County sheriff holds a news conference about 26 minutes from now. CNN will cover it live. And then in about 90 minutes on "NEWSNIGHT," we'll talk to the sheriff about the case, any questions that arise from the news conference. Also coming up on "NEWSNIGHT" tonight here in New York, Beth Nissen spends time with Port Authority police officers. These are men and women returning to their normal routine after many months of sifting through the debris at ground zero. It is an awkward and difficult transition. Nissen tonight. That and much more on "NEWSNIGHT," 10:00 Eastern time. We hope you will join us for that. Connie, that includes you.
CHUNG: I absolutely will. Aaron, thank you so much, and as you mentioned, in just a short while, once again, a reminder, CNN will have live coverage of tonight's news conference on the arrest of the suspect in the murder of Samantha Runnion. Stay with us.
ANNOUNCER: Coming up -- a new video surfaces in the Inglewood beating. Now who is telling the truth? CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT returns in a moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: A new videotape released today has reignited the firestorm of debate over Inglewood, California's police officers. The gas station surveillance tape was eagerly anticipated in hopes it might shed light on what happened during an arrest two weeks ago. The tape shows different angles and different portions of the encounter between Inglewood police officers and 16-year-old Donovan Jackson. The D.A. has filed charges against two of the officers seen in the tape -- one charge of filing a false report, one charge of assault.
Donovan Jackson's attorney is Johnnie Cochran, who joins us tonight from Los Angeles. Johnnie, thank you so much for joining us.
JOHNNIE COCHRAN, ATTORNEY FOR DONOVAN JACKSON: My pleasure, Connie.
CHUNG: Let's start with that surveillance tape. When you look at it, what do you see?
COCHRAN: Well, you know, I looked at it. I saw it as early as this morning. What I see is a real overreaction by the Inglewood police officers. At some point, you can see the officers in the dark approaching. It seems to me there they are overly aggressive and, you know, this -- the sheriffs stopped and detained this young man. And you keep in mind, Connie, the sheriffs testified in the grand jury, and I think you'll find they'll be more consistent with what Donovan claims happened. I think there's an overreaction by these Inglewood police officers, it's their jurisdiction.
Then it looks like the WWF. They are rolling around on the ground. But you got to remember that my client speaks very slowly, processes things slowly, and he gets up. But it doesn't change at all the assault that occurs after the young man is clearly handcuffed...
CHUNG: All right, before we go to that second videotape, I want to discuss this surveillance tape -- two points. One, I don't think I can see anything very well, honestly. And point number two, it actually does look like, doesn't it, that Donovan Jackson is down there on the ground and fighting, or, you know -- because all of these other officers are battling with him.
COCHRAN: Well, it's hard really to tell, because you can't tell, you know, who is the original aggressor. But I think that -- that's why the point I tried to make was I think when the officer in black comes into it and they jump on the ground, there are three or four of the officers and this is a 16-year-old kid, a child, really, that's down on the ground. So it seems like there is a lot of tussling. But in nothing that I see justifies what happens to Donovan.
Keep in mind, this 16-year-old has just come out of the store with a bag of potato chips. He has done absolutely nothing wrong. Never had an arrest. And he has no problem with the police. They've stopped his father, keep in mind, for a tag that's expired.
And so, you know, Donovan has no reason to fight with them. And I think you're going to find out that this young man's emotional state is such, he's not an aggressive person at all. And I don't think he does anything aggressive that day, really.
CHUNG: Did officer -- did Donovan Jackson cause that injury to Officer Morse, because you can see it in the other videotape, the amateur videotape, that he has a cut on his face.
COCHRAN: I don't believe so. He said he never, ever struck the officer. Certainly I think we can better explain that injury to the officer now. I mean, there are so many officers around, and they're wrestling around on the ground, it could have happened, really, at any time, couldn't it? I mean, given that.
And it's not clear when that might have occurred.
CHUNG: All right. Back to the new -- I mean, to the old videotape, the amateur videotape.
Did -- you claim that Donovan Jackson's testicles were grabbed, but Officer Morse says it was Donovan Jackson who grabbed his testicles.
COCHRAN: If you look at the tape, both tapes, you'll never see any grabbing. In fact, Connie, quite to the contrary.
The second video -- the original videotape, the one in which he is slammed down on the car, this young man is basically out of it at that point. And I think that's consistent with what he's always said.
He's slammed on the car and punched in the face. There is no justification. And I'm telling you, there will be no justification at all by anybody under those circumstances. That is what I call creative report-writing in an attempt to justify assaulting this kid.
They did not know, you know, when they wrote all this up, that there was a video which clearly pointed out what they had done. And to further add to this, this particular officer, Morse, has a propensity for violence.
We have another client that he had in the hospital, choked out, in intensive care two weeks before this, on June 22. This man has a pattern, as with that department because they cannot, and will, not police themselves.
CHUNG: That's an allegation, though. It hasn't been confirmed in a court of law or anything of the sort.
COCHRAN: Which one is that? That he was choked out?
CHUNG: Yes, the other person you're representing.
COCHRAN: Well, no, it hasn't been proven.
But I can tell you and represent to you that he was in the hospital and choked out. There are witnesses.
And, in fact, we are not -- we're going to prove it, as you're going to see, I think, over the course of the next couple of weeks you're going to see a number of people coming forward regarding this officer. And I would be very, very surprised if you don't see this officer terminated by the Inglewood Police Department.
CHUNG: All right, Johnnie Cochran, one other question about the videotape. You're saying that you'll be able to prove your case. But even in the Rodney King case there was a videotape. But when it came to state charges, the jury was not convinced that the videotape told the story.
COCHRAN: I think a lot of things happened in that case, Connie. The Rodney King case, if you remember, was transferred from downtown Los Angeles to Simi Valley. If you know anything about L.A., that's an obscure area outside of Los Angeles that is not diverse at all.
I think you'll find in this case, this will not happen. Ultimately this case is going to be tried where there is some diversity on the jury panel.
And I think the prosecutors have learned a lot. I think the criminal case, I think, I'd be very surprised if they didn't secure a conviction. And there should be a trial.
And I think that You're going to be left with that video -- both videos, but lastly -- the last video where he's slammed on the car, there is no justification for that.
On my civil case, I think it's pretty clear that this officer used excessive force against a 16-year-old who had no reason to be fighting at all, and he was basically helpless at the time. And that's why this officer, I think, will be convicted.
CHUNG: Have you had any contact with Mitchell Crooks, the amateur videographer?
COCHRAN: Only this. I believe I was still in New York, Connie, I think, when he was arrested outside of the CNN station here. I think that he or someone on his behalf had called my office. We referred several lawyers to him, so he got a lawyer. I have not talked to him since, except to say in a press conference we had yesterday the family is very, very grateful that he took that video and had the courage to come forward because, Connie, were it not for that video, this would be business as usual out here. They would contend it was that he did this to us, and whatever; nothing would happen.
That video changed everything, and resulted in this indictment, and I think it will result in a conviction.
CHUNG: All right, Johnnie Cochran, thank you for being with us. Have a good weekend.
COCHRAN: It's always my pleasure. Thank you. You have a great weekend. It's great talking to you.
CHUNG: All right.
When we come back -- oh, we should also mention that we invited Officer Morse's attorney to join us tonight, but he declined.
And when we come back: Could the beef in your freezer kill you? If it's contaminated with the deadly E. coli bacteria, it just might.
We'll tell you how to make sure your food is safe right after this.
ANNOUNCER: Up next: E. coli alert. What you need to know before your next summer barbecue when CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: O.J. Simpson assembled his so-call Dream Team of defense attorneys for his trial on charges he killed his ex-wife Nicole and her friend Ronald Goldman.
But decade before they came along, his lead counsel was his friend, former roommate and frequent tennis partner Robert Kardashian. His connection with Simpson was so tight that he read Simpson's letter after the killings.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERT KARDASHIAN, FORMER O.J. SIMPSON LAWYER: First, everyone understand I had nothing to do with Nicole's murder. I loved her, always have, and always will. If we had a problem, it's because I loved her so much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: And Kardashian very nearly became part of the trial when prosecutors wanted him to testify about Simpson's bag, which he was seen carrying shortly after the murders.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) KARDASHIAN: I've always wanted to tell the truth. I wanted to show everybody this is a total smokescreen and this really has nothing to do with anything. And you'll find that out when I get the opportunity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Nothing was ever found in the bag. But Kardashian's more than a quarter-century of friendship with Simpson ended not long after the trial.
Why? The answer when we return.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: What happened to the long-standing friendship between O.J. Simpson and attorney Robert Kardashian? Kardashian cooperated with a book and a TV movie about the trial, and Simpson claimed that Kardashian violated attorney/client privilege in doing so. Simpson filed suit to block the movie, but the suit failed.
CHUNG: You are looking at a live picture from the command center in Stanton, California, where a news conference on the latest developments in the Samantha Runnion murder case will get under way in just a few minutes.
And finally on our program tonight, the second biggest recall of contaminated beef in the history of the United States is under way tonight. The recall affects 18.5 million pounds of beef in 21 states. And the potentially deadly E. coli bacteria this beef carries is being blamed for making more than a dozen people sick.
So how can you know whether you've got some of it in your home, in your refrigerator? And what can you do to make sure you are safe from E. coli and other contaminants? Well, we've asked CNN medical correspondent Rea Blakey -- excuse me, Rea, I'm sorry -- to help us answer some of these questions.
You know, I had just ordered my lunch, a Philadelphia cheese steak, when this story came out and I said to myself...
REA BLAKEY, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Did you hesitate?
CHUNG: Of course I did. Tell us what should we look for. What's the problem?
BLAKEY: Well, E. coli is a bacteria that's quite common, but there are various strains that can be more virulent than others, and this is a particular strain that carries a lot of bad apples with it, if you will.
This actually is an extension of a recall that started in June, the end of June, on the 30th. And the company involved, ConAgra, looked at this as an opportunity for them to do the best thing for the public. So it's a voluntarily recall, even though the USDA did, in fact, find the bacteria initially. Part of the issue here is that ConAgra said, look, we know that we've got some contamination somewhere in one of our plants, so we're going to recall 350,000 pounds that happened in June. As things progressed, there was a little bit more concern that there might be more positive cases out there, more positive samples, and so that's when it got expanded today to 18.5 million pounds of ground beef.
CHUNG: So how do we identify this ground beef? I mean, is there a serial number, is there any way to identify it?
BLAKEY: There are serial numbers, but you have to keep in mind that this is food that's been going through a processing system. So it started off as raw, and in the plant this bacteria was found. So essentially, consumers may not be able to tell by a product code. You may have something with a product code on it, but it's very likely that a larger wholesaler of meat products would have a product code.
So for the average consumer, they really need to take a look at where they purchased this product. Go to the USDA Web site, which by the way is up and running. It's FSIS -- that stands for Food Service and Inspection Safety -- usda.gov. And that will give you a list of the lot numbers.
But the bottom line is, you can't smell it, you can't see it. So you really have got to be cautious about it. If you have any concerns whatsoever, throw it out. Don't use it.
CHUNG: All right. And what symptoms should I look for if I've eaten something and I don't feel well. How will I know I have E. coli bacteria?
BLAKEY: It's going to be pretty obvious to you. These symptoms are things like stomach cramps, and bloody diarrhea in some cases. There could be some nausea, some vomiting. You're going to feel like you got a bad intestinal bug.
And generally there is no fever. That's something that usually tips people off to the sign of an infection. In this case, no fever. If you do have one, it is probably going to be mild. And the people who are at greatest risk are very young children, under the age of 5, the elderly, and people who have compromised immune systems, whose bodies are, you know, already fighting a number of things.
CHUNG: All right. So if I'm going to have a barbecue, which I'm sure a lot of people will this weekend, tell me again, what should I be looking for? I mean, can I see it in the meat when I'm looking at it? Will it smell funny?
BLAKEY: You can't see it. It won't smell strange. The thing you should probably do which the USDA recommends is make certain that you have an accurate digital thermometer -- key being that if you heat your beef up to 160 degrees Fahrenheit -- and you must make sure it's 160 degrees Fahrenheit. You can't judge by the color just because it's brown. If you heat it to that temperature, it will kill the E. coli bacteria. In that case, you'll be safe.
CHUNG: So say like I don't have that. I don't have any way to measure that. Well done, would that do it?
BLAKEY: Won't necessarily do it. You need the temperature specifically, because that's the key to killing the bacteria. So again, if you are in doubt, throw it out.
CHUNG: Oh, dear. Thank you, Rea. We appreciate it.
When we come back, we're going to have one last thought.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: On Monday, a custody battle that spans oceans and religions. She's converted to Islam and wants to take their child to Egypt.
Now to get a preview of our program every day, be sure to sign up for our daily e-mail by logging on to cnn.com/connie.
And coming up next on "LARRY KING LIVE" -- the latest on the suspect in the killing of Samantha Runnion, including the sheriff's news conference scheduled for 9:00 p.m. Eastern time.
I want to thank you for joining us. For all of us at CNN, good night, have a great weekend, and come back on Monday.
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