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CNN Connie Chung Tonight

Massive Maryland Manhunt for Spree Killer Continues; Suspected al Qaeda Terror Cell Busted

Aired October 04, 2002 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CONNIE CHUNG, HOST: Good evening. I'm Connie Chung.
The massive manhunt for a spree killer: Are other shootings now connected?

ANNOUNCER: A high-caliber killer still on the loose.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHARLES MOOSE, MONTGOMERY COUNTY POLICE CHIEF: We feel like we probably have a skilled shooter. And that does heighten our concern.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Five families devastated, and tonight, share their grief.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm feeling terrified.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: A suspected al Qaeda terror cell busted, this time in Oregon.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN ASHCROFT, ATTORNEY GENERAL: We have neutralized a suspected terrorist cell within our borders.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: How many terrorists could still be hiding on American soil?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was surprised. So close to home. You always say it never comes close to you, it won't happen close to you. Well, they're right here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: The skull and bones of a missing little girl are finally identified.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The skeletal remains recovered in Rockingham County have been determined to be a positive match with the DNA profile of the Jennifer Renee Short case.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Tonight: The mystery remains. Who killed Jennifer Short?

She was convicted not for what she did, but for what she failed to do.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JUDITH MCCLOSKEY, CONVICTED OF INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER: I don't feel that I am responsible to the depth of three counts of involuntary manslaughter.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Who is to blame when drunk drivers kill?

This is CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT. Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York: Connie Chung.

CHUNG: Good evening.

An entire community in suburban Maryland is living in fear. A massive manhunt is under way, with still no clues as to who killed five people, the killings random and senseless, this as another woman was shot today in Virginia and a man was shot in Washington, D.C. last night, police now looking for a possible connection to these and yesterday's shooting spree.

CNN's Kathleen Koch has been following this still unfolding story and joins us live from police headquarters in Rockville, Maryland -- Kathleen.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Connie, well, as you just reported, we have now perhaps two more shootings. And sources very close to this investigation here in Montgomery County, Maryland, now tell us that they believe that the killer or killers here or at least a copycat has struck again, this because of that shooting now in Fredericksburg, Virginia, that occurred late this afternoon.

A 43-year-old woman was going about her daily activities, loading packages into her van in front of a Michaels craft store in the Spotsylvania mall, when she was shot in the lower back. Now, police say that the bullet passed through her body. And the woman is now hospitalized, in stable condition. But unlike the cases here in Maryland, in this case, police have found some evidence right on the scene. They have found at least one shell casing. And sources close to the investigation tell us that it was likely this type of a bullet that was fired. This is a .223, a high-caliber bullet. And, Connie, it's the very same type of bullet that was used, police believe at least, in these Montgomery County shootings, fired likely from a very high-powered rifle.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(voice over): Police say a high-powered assault or hunting rifle like these was used in the shooting spree, the bullets high caliber most likely a .223. Using them with such deadly precision, experts say, takes skill.

JOSEPH RIEHL, ATF SPECIAL AGENT: Someone who is very proficient to be accurate, people who shoot a lot, people who have trained previously to shoot these types of weapons at long range would have the capabilities.

KOCH: With such a high-powered weapon, police say a sniper could fire from up to 500 yards away. And authorities are investigating yet another possible victim. A 72-year-old man was shot to death on a Washington, D.C. street corner at 9:15 Thursday night.

The five earlier shootings were in Montgomery County but this one happened only a few miles south, just inside the Washington city line. The bullet from that shooting was being examined in a ballistics lab. The case examined for any similarities.

MOOSE: May be related to those cases in Montgomery County. However, there is no conclusive evidence at this time to confirm the possibility.

KOCH: Montgomery County schools remained locked down for a second day, no outdoor recess or off-campus lunch.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's scary. I think everybody is a little bit nervous.

KOCH: Police say they're still looking for a white box truck with two men inside.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOCH: And we have new information now on the box truck. It does have lettering, police say, two lines of block lettering on the side and on the back. They say the vehicle has six wheels, four wheels in the rear. Another crucial piece of information: Police says it has a roll-up rear door. The cab in the front is smaller and very box-like in appearance.

So those are some important very clues that police hope will help them and help people in the area perhaps recognize this truck and locate the people who are responsible, or the person -- back to you, Connie.

CHUNG: All right, thank you, Kathleen Koch. Appreciate it.

And, as the community continues to brace itself in search of this killer or killers, joining me now with the latest on the search for the killer or killers: Montgomery County Police Chief Charles Moose and Montgomery County Executive Douglas Duncan.

Gentlemen, thank you for being with us.

First, Chief Moose, is there any connection, do you believe, between the shooting that occurred in Virginia just this afternoon and the one in Washington, D.C. last night? Is there any connection between those two shootings and the ones that have occurred here in Montgomery County?

MOOSE: Well, certainly, at this point, we are approaching it with that in mind. But the tendency is for me to not speculate, to see what our investigators tell us, see what the evidence tells us, and then make a decision.

So, certainly, some things look like that may be the case. At this point, the fragments from the shooting in D.C. are in the lab at the ATF office, along with the fragments and evidence from our shootings. And the comparison test is being conducted right now.

I've also been advised that evidence from Virginia is en route to that same lab. And that will certainly be information that will tell us whether or not the connection exists or not.

CHUNG: What is your best estimate on when a report from those tests will emerge?

MOOSE: You know, at this point, I really can't say. I have spent late afternoon guessing. And I have come in and I've missed every time. So the people that are working on it, they are being diligent, they are being professional. We can't rush them. It's not smart to rush them. When we have it, we will release it.

CHUNG: Yes, sir.

The shooting that occurred in Virginia was at Michaels craft store. Was it just a coincidence that the very first shooting in Montgomery County was also at a Michaels craft store? Or was it a copycat, do you think? Or do you think that it was just a coincidence?

MOOSE: At this point, again, I don't know. We looked at that. It was very interesting when that came through. There have been eight shootings, two at craft stores, Michaels craft stores. So does that make a pattern, two out of eight? Maybe, maybe not. It may just be a coincidence at this point.

CHUNG: Do you know if a different weapon was used at each of those sites?

MOOSE: Again, that work, the lab will tell us that. And, as I stated earlier, right now some of that is being done. Some of it will be done later, when the materials get here from Virginia. So we don't know at this time.

CHUNG: All right, County Executive Duncan, I know that schools were open today. But were activities after school also still held?

DOUGLAS DUNCAN, MONTGOMERY COUNTY EXECUTIVE: We are playing football games right now. We had all the after-school activities. Last night, we canceled them. Tonight, they went on. And we've got a full range of activities for the weekend.

The schools were open. The county government was open, libraries. Business went on as close to normal as we could make it today. And almost all the students showed up for school today. The teachers were there. The school bus drivers showed up. So people were getting about, doing their normal routine as best they could, while still in a very anxious, very fearful situation.

CHUNG: All right, Chief Moose, can you tell us if you still believe that two individuals were probably involved?

MOOSE: Well, certainly, we want to remember that, when we talked about the truck that we're looking for, the witness talked about two people in it. So we haven't changed that. That is the initial information.

We know that there is one person involved, and there may well be a second person. So, again, we're not eliminating anything. We are keeping an open mind. We don't want to get tunnel vision. We want to remain driven by the evidence.

CHUNG: And what have the ballistics reports told you about the shooter and the type of weapon he was using?

MOOSE: Again, the ballistic reports have told us that we're talking about a high-velocity round, more than likely a .223, could be a .222 or a .221. But those are very, very similar rounds. That's what it's told us so far.

We're waiting on this latest report to tell us what the connection may be, how much the two -- the various rounds match, and specifically whether the D.C. rounds matched the rounds in Montgomery County.

CHUNG: All right, Montgomery police Chief Charles Moose, we thank you very much. And we also thank County Executive Douglas Duncan.

The second person killed in the spree, the first to be shot yesterday morning, was 39-year-old James Buchanan Jr. His friends and family called him Sonny. The son of a retired Montgomery County police officer, he was shot while mowing a client's lawn. Sonny Buchanan's sister, her son Jake is Sonny's nephew.

And they join me now from Washington.

Thank you both for being with us. Victoria, you were actually waiting for your brother to come over to your house, because you knew that he was going to be mowing a client's lawn. Had you heard about any of the shootings that had occurred?

VICTORIA SNIDER, SISTER OF JAMES BUCHANAN JR.: Yes, Connie, I did.

But at the time, they were -- they just said a Hispanic male mowing a lawn. And so I didn't connect that with my brother at all. It just didn't dawn on me. And at the place they showed the shot, I didn't see -- if I had seen the dealership, I would have connected it. But I didn't. That was his only account he had left here.

CHUNG: You mean his dealership, his landscaping company?

V. SNIDER: Yes, that was the only -- he had dissolved his company. He had moved away. And he was in the process of building a home with my father on the mountain.

CHUNG: So when you did not hear from him, Victoria, the time passed, were you worried?

V. SNIDER: No, because my brother is -- he has so many things on his plate that I knew that he would eventually get to my house. I was getting a little concerned towards 1:00-ish. And I just thought that he was running behind and maybe met a friend or something and then would come to my house on his way to his girlfriend's.

CHUNG: But, in fact, at about 1:30, the police knocked on your door.

V. SNIDER: Yes.

CHUNG: And they told you?

V. SNIDER: Yes. It was very devastating.

CHUNG: Jake, tell me about your uncle. What do you miss about him the most?

JAKE SNIDER, NEPHEW OF JAMES BUCHANAN JR.: My uncle, he was there for me through all my hard times growing up. My uncle was my go-to guy.

He was not only my uncle. He was my friend. He was my best friend. He was my mentor. If I ever had a problem, he was right there. He would be the one I would go and talk to. I always helped him out. He got me involved in the community. I helped out with the Boys & Girls Club. And I sold Christmas trees for seven years straight with him.

CHUNG: Victoria, do you know of anyone who would target your brother?

V. SNIDER: No, I know no one. I think it was a hate crime. I think it was a random crime. I think there is somebody out there that needs help and needs to turn themselves in.

CHUNG: Did he know any of the other victims?

V. SNIDER: No. I knew nobody. We knew nobody, none of the other victims. I think it was very random.

CHUNG: How has this affected you, Victoria? It must be devastating.

V. SNIDER: Oh, I'm still -- I'm in a tunnel. And I know that my brother would not want this notoriety. He was a private person on about a lot of things.

CHUNG: All right, Victoria Snider and Jake Snider, thank you so much for being with us. And we're so sorry. We're so sorry about your loss.

V. SNIDER: Thank you.

J. SNIDER: Thank you.

CHUNG: Thank you, Victoria Snider and Jake Snider.

Victoria Snider has asked us to mention that she's starting a foundation in her brother's memory, an education fund for underprivileged kids: Sonny's Kids, P.O. Box 10666, Rockville, Maryland, 20849.

And still ahead: Another case has been resolved and the news is not good.

We'll be right back.

ANNOUNCER: Next: six U.S. residents, five of them citizens, charged in a conspiracy to wage war against America. How many more are out there?

CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: Six U.S. residents, including a former Army reservist, were charged today with conspiring to assist al Qaeda and the Taliban wage war against the United States. Four of them are under arrest tonight. Attorney General John Ashcroft said the other two are overseas and not yet in custody.

CNN's justice correspondent Kelli Arena has details from Washington.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): These six individuals are charged with being part of an al Qaeda terrorist cell. Five are American-born U.S. citizens. One even served in the U.S. Army as a reservist. ASHCROFT: Today is a defining day in America's war against terrorism. We have neutralized the suspected terrorist cell within our borders.

ARENA: Four of the accused are currently in custody arrested in Portland, Oregon and Detroit, Michigan. Two remain at large overseas. The six are not charged with planning a specific terrorist act inside the U.S. or anywhere else but rather conspiracy to wage war against the United States to provide material support and resources to al Qaeda and to contribute services to al Qaeda and the Taliban. If convicted, they will face life in prison.

SHERIFF CHARLES BRYAN, SAKAMANIA COUNTY, WASHINGTON: A group of Oregon residents, most of whom were U.S. citizens, after September 11 and the attacks on the United States decided to go to Afghanistan and fight for al Qaeda and the Taliban against the United States military. Five of those individuals left the country. One stayed behind and wire transferred money to support them while they were overseas.

ARENA: The five who tried to get to Afghanistan never made it. At least one made it only as far as Bangladesh. Three returned to the United States. Before that, one of the three, Jeffrey Battle, allegedly joined the U.S. Army Reserves to learn about U.S. military tactics and weapons.

ASHCROFT: While in Bangladesh attempting to gain entry into Afghanistan, Battle caused himself to be discharged administratively from the United States Army Reserve in which he had enlisted in order to receive military training intended for use against the United States.

ARENA: The investigation started a year ago, sparked by a tip from a local sheriff from Washington State where the authorities say the suspects were using a gravel pit for weapons training.

(on camera): Officials will not comment on possible associates, but they do say the investigation is still under way. They are asking citizens to be on alert and to report any suspicious activity.

Kelli Arena, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: The breakup of another alleged ring of American-based al Qaeda backers raises some questions about homeland security. How many suspected terrorists are in the United States? Where are they? And how well are we keeping an eye on them?

CNN's Mike Boettcher joins us now from CNN Center in Atlanta.

Mike, I think it's just pretty frightening to realize now that there were suspected terrorists in Buffalo, Detroit, Chicago, and now Portland. How many more are there out there?

MIKE BOETTCHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know something, Connie? I've stopped trying to make an estimate on that, because I've heard varying estimates.

The fact is, they are here. But let's make a distinction. Those arrested in the cities you mentioned were people that it is believed were not specifically al Qaeda cells, so to speak. These were people, some of them wanna-bes, some of them who decided after 9/11 they wanted to take up the cause of terrorism.

So that is distinct from the sleeper cells, who would have been trained by al Qaeda, by Osama bin Laden and his instructors in Afghanistan before 9/11, who were sent to the United States specifically to conduct terrorist operations and are, in effect, sleeper cells waiting for orders or waiting for the right opportunity.

CHUNG: Mike, you had reported exclusively that you had gotten ahold of these documents that showed that John Walker Lindh said 50 al Qaeda members had come to the United States to carry out 20 different missions. Where could they possibly be? Is it that our intelligence has not yet spotted them?

BOETTCHER: Well, if you look, Connie, at the al Qaeda manuals that are out there, you are not going to spot these people. They are trained. The ones that are real al Qaeda cells, sleeper cells, are trained to blend in.

In the manual, for example, it goes through the greatest detail. The al Qaeda manual, training manual, tells them to keep their shoes polished. They don't go to mosques. They're not going to be out training in uniform out in some gravel pit somewhere. It's a unit that's already been trained, that is highly organized and receives funding, a lot of it, from outside the United States.

CHUNG: And, finally, Mike, Attorney General Ashcroft said that today is a defining day in America's war on terrorism. Was it significant?

BOETTCHER: I would say "defining" would be going too far, but he is the attorney general and he knows a lot more about this than I do.

But I will say that, if you do arrest people who have intent, you do stop future terrorist acts, even if they are not al Qaeda cells, there is a nibbling around the edges of a central core of al Qaeda. And if you keep nibbling away at that, you're going to find connections that take you to the inner core.

So you can't let people who are talking about or dreaming about taking terrorist action against the United States, you can't let them go. But it still is a long way from getting a cell like the ones who conducted the raids on 9/11, Connie.

CHUNG: All right, CNN's Mike Boettcher in Atlanta, thank you.

The man known as the Taliban American, John Walker Lindh, was sentenced to 20 years in prison today. Before his sentencing in a Virginia courtroom, Walker Lindh said that he made a mistake by joining the Taliban. If he knew then what he knows now, Walker Lindh told the court -- quote -- "I would never have joined them." He also denounced Osama bin Laden, saying whatever grievances he has, they shouldn't be resolved by violence against Americans. Prosecutors say Lindh is cooperating with their investigation and has agreed to take a lie- detector test.

We'll be back in just a moment.

ANNOUNCER: Still ahead: The disappearance of Jennifer Short ends tragically. Now the hunt is on for her killer.

CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT continues in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: Police in North Carolina confirmed the worst today: that skeletal remains found there have been identified as those of 9-year- old Jennifer Short. Jennifer Short had been missing for seven weeks, after her parents were found murdered in their Virginia home last August.

CNN's Charles Molineaux has the latest on this case.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHARLES MOLINEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Virginia and North Carolina police and the FBI are planning a trip clear up to Canada to talk to what they call a potential witness in the Jennifer Short case.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just above the Arctic Circle, right up here.

MOLINEAUX (on camera): He went about as far as he could go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Again, it's a long ways from North Carolina. So we're going to have to logistically plan to go up there to do an interview.

MOLINEAUX (voice-over): Police have already searched the man's home in North Carolina. And they're hope to take advantage of his arrest by Canadian Mounties on immigration violations there, this after getting word human remains found in North Carolina are Jennifer's.

Jennifer Renee Short disappeared under circumstances that were terrifying from the start. On August 15, her parents were found dead in their home in Henry County, Virginia. They'd both been shot in the head and Jennifer was missing. The Shorts' relatives have been offering emotional appeals for her to be returned.

RUBY YOUNG, AUNT OF JENNIFER SHORT: Police release her, so she can come home. We all miss her beyond words.

MOLINEAUX: Last week, Eddie Albert discovered the remains on his property in Rockingham County, North Carolina, 30 miles away from where the Shorts were murdered.

EDDIE ALBERT, DISCOVERED REMAINS: I've never found anything like that before. It was shocking.

MOLINEAUX: First his dogs turned up a mass of hair he decided was a wig. He threw it in the trash. Two days later, he found his dog Blue with what looked like part of a human skull.

ALBERT: My mind started going backwards: "Well, if this is a skull, what did I throw in the trash can?" We all know about the little girl from up at Bassett that's missing.

MOLINEAUX: A police search of the grounds and two ponds turned up more remains, which an autopsy reveals were a 9-year-old girl who had been shot in the head.

Then, Thursday night, investigators with the Virginia Division of Forensic Science finished up their DNA analysis of the remains and determined they had found Jennifer Short.

(on camera): Now this bridge over a creek where some of the remains were found has become a makeshift memorial. People continue to drop off flowers, stuffed animals, even a hand-written tribute to Jennifer framed and written on looseleaf.

The sheriffs investigating this case say the news about where Jennifer finally ended up is a heartbreaking new piece of an ongoing puzzle.

Charles Molineaux, CNN, Rockingham County, North Carolina.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: And joining me now from Rockingham, North Carolina, is Sam Page, the sheriff in Rockingham County.

Sheriff, thank you so much for being with us. Can you tell us, is there any new information from your investigation?

SAM PAGE, ROCKINGHAM COUNTY POLICE DEPARTMENT: No, not at this time.

I left the investigators a few hours ago. And they are working on the arrangements with the federal authorities to go to Canada to make interviews with the witness in the case, a Mr. Bowman, a Gary Bowman.

CHUNG: We're being very cautious here at CNN in terms of exactly how to characterize him. He is just a witness, correct?

PAGE: At this time, yes, ma'am.

We know where he's at in Canada. And, again, since we have the federal authorities involved, state and local, we have to work through everyone's protocols together so it will in unison when we go up there. And plus, we are going into another country. We are going into another country. So we have to work with them.

CHUNG: No doubt you were concerned that maps were found at his home, as I understand it, pinpointing the Smarts' home.

PAGE: I know that there were some maps found, but I don't want to speculate on what actually they showed. I don't have that confirmed, what you are saying. But I do know that some maps were found with some locations. But other than that, I'd rather not make any further comments, since it is a pending investigation.

CHUNG: All right.

This was such a brutal crime, for this family so tragic. Having found the remains of the little girl, have you gotten any clues from that?

PAGE: Well, it's a very tragic situation. And you're trying to be sensitive to it, because we know every time we go on TV, we know the family sees this. And we want them to know that we feel for the family.

From a professional standpoint, I think, by identifying our victim now, that helps to solidify the investigators from Virginia and North Carolina working together to get resolving this case.

CHUNG: Can you describe exactly where their remains were found and whether or not you believe that the murder of little Jennifer occurred there?

PAGE: I cannot state where the murder occurred at this time. We do know where the abduction occurred. But, as far as the murder, we don't know. But we do know that the remains in question were found over the past week right behind me at the bridge area down in the creek area and also to the residence to the rear of me.

CHUNG: Do you believe that she might have been killed around the same time that her parents were?

PAGE: That's a question I can't answer, although people had asked several questions about the remains that we've found. Again, I just would rather not speculate on that, at that time of death.

CHUNG: All right.

PAGE: We...

CHUNG: Go ahead.

PAGE: I'm sorry.

We do know that the cause of death was ruled as a death by a gunshot wound to the head, which is very similar to the mother and father previous.

CHUNG: Have you been able to talk to members of the Short family? PAGE: I have not personally. Sheriff Cassell from Henry County, Virginia, has been the coordinator and, through his officers, have been in contact with the family prior to our original release of the information today from the state lab.

CHUNG: Are you looking for other potential witnesses or potential suspects?

PAGE: We are.

Again, we appeal to anyone that has any information to please contact us or the Virginia authorities. But, again, we are interviewing anybody that we deem may have information or we think might be of assistance in resolving and solving the case and bringing the perpetrators to justice.

CHUNG: Thank you so much, Sheriff Page, for being with us.

PAGE: Thank you, ma'am.

CHUNG: Still ahead: How much responsibility does a parent assume for the teenagers partying in their basement? One woman was shocked by the answer.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: A Pennsylvania mother faces up to 15 years in jail in a landmark case that extends the responsibility of adults when kids drink and drive.

Here's what happened. Judith McCloskey allowed her two teenager daughters to give a party at their home. She says she did not provide alcohol and she did not see anyone drinking. But because McCloskey failed to stop a drunken teenage boy from driving away from the party, she was found guilty of involuntary manslaughter.

The 19-year-old boy, Christopher Mowad, crashed his SUV, killing himself and two others, Kimberly Byrne and Bryan Kiefer, two passengers in his car.

A short while ago, I spoke with the mother and her lawyer.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: Joining me now is Judith McCloskey and her attorney, Gary Asteak.

Thank you both for being with us.

Judy, on the night that you had the party that your daughters had, this party, you were upstairs. They were downstairs. What did you think they were doing down there?

MCCLOSKEY: Having a get-together to discuss issues regarding the prom that was happening the next week. They were going to be playing some games and listening to loud music.

CHUNG: The police arrived after 11:00 p.m. and asked you if there was any underage drinking going on. And your answer was?

MCCLOSKEY: I didn't believe there was. And he asked if he could come in. And I said, "Sure."

CHUNG: So, at that moment, though, some kids left. They fled. And not long after that, you discovered that there was a car accident that was related, in a way, to your party.

And one of the police officers said to you, "If the accident was related to your party, you better be prepared for a lot of trouble." And the DA said that you responded to the police officer using an expletive.

Did you utter an expletive when you found out that in fact three of the kids were killed?

MCCLOSKEY: Yes, after speaking to my daughter for about two hours that night after the police had left and told us that we may be in big trouble if it was related and that our lives would change drastically, a lot of crying went on that two hours, a lot of guilt on my daughter's part, as well as a lot of fear on my part.

And at 6:10 in the morning, when those three kids arrived to let us know about the three children who did pass away in the accident, I did first cry. I did then go into my daughter's room. And then she came out into the living room. And I did say the wrong thing after having some anger.

CHUNG: Yes.

Judy, a number of the kids said that you did allow them to drink alcohol on several occasions. Is that true?

MCCLOSKEY: That is not true. They said that, but that is not the way it was in our home or in our life.

CHUNG: Here you are found guilty of manslaughter. Were you shocked?

MCCLOSKEY: Extremely shocked.

CHUNG: Do you think you should be held responsible for these three deaths?

MCCLOSKEY: No, I don't.

There was a lot of things that caused those deaths. And my naivete and my trust and belief in my kids is basically what made me realize and feel that evening that I did not have to monitor them any closer than I was already. And there was no signs of alcohol upstairs in my home or any signs of drunkenness downstairs when I opened the door to turn down the music. There was no signs of drunkenness outside anywhere around my home. CHUNG: How do you feel now, knowing that you do face a jail sentence?

MCCLOSKEY: I don't know how else to say it, except not good.

CHUNG: Are you frightened?

MCCLOSKEY: Extremely.

CHUNG: How do your daughters feel about it, Judy?

MCCLOSKEY: Very responsible.

CHUNG: They feel responsible?

MCCLOSKEY: Yes, for not allowing me to know that it might have been getting out of hand and that they couldn't control it, and that they feel like they have done this to me.

CHUNG: Do you feel that they really are responsible for...

MCCLOSKEY: I feel they are somewhat responsible. And I feel that I am somewhat responsible. But I don't feel that I am responsible to the depth of three counts of involuntary manslaughter.

CHUNG: Mr. Asteak, why do you think your defense did not work?

GARY ASTEAK, ATTORNEY FOR JUDITH MCCLOSKEY: The defense didn't work simply because criminal courts are the wrong place to try to solve social problems.

This is not a black-and-white issue. This is not an issue of guilt or not guilty. This is an issue of responsibility that has many shades of gray. And, unfortunately, the way this case turned out, the man who bought the beer got off with a $1,000 fine. All of the teenagers who had been drinking simply got off and were given immunity so that they could testify.

This was an effort by the prosecution to send a message. And it's a rather strange and mixed message. If that message is, parents should be more responsible, that's a good message. But if the message is, teenagers get off scot-free and that they can simply blame the parents, that's the wrong message.

CHUNG: Judy, do you think the other teenagers and your daughters, actually, should be the ones going to jail?

MCCLOSKEY: I don't know about going to jail for them either. My two girls are being punished with probation and community service hours, but none of the other kids are.

And I can guarantee you that my children have learned from this. And a lot of those kids that were involved in that night have been involved in several other things as well. So they haven't learned. And I think maybe they should all have been charged with underage drinking, just the same as my two girls, because maybe then that they would learn.

CHUNG: Judith McCloskey, Gary Asteak, thank you so much for being with us.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: But what about the people who were killed in the accident? Well, when we come back, that part of the story -- in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: The man who successfully prosecuted Judith McCloskey and who will be watching closely when she's sentenced next month for involuntary manslaughter is John Morganelli, the district attorney in Northampton County, Pennsylvania. And he joins me now from Philadelphia.

Thank you, sir, for being with us.

JOHN MORGANELLI, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, NORTHAMPTON COUNTY: Good evening, Connie.

CHUNG: Judy McCloskey did not provide the alcohol. She did not condone it being consumed. And she didn't even know that it was being consumed. Haven't you just gone too far?

MORGANELLI: Well, Connie, the fact of the matter is, Judith McCloskey was a known facilitator of teenage drinking. She had provided a safe haven for teenagers to come to her home on numerous occasions in the past. Seven to 10 kids testified at trial that that was the case. They called her Judy. She was a friend rather than a parent.

And, unfortunately, this was one time too many. On this particular night, there were 60-plus kids in and out of her house over a four-hour period. It was so loud and so noisy that a neighbor down the street contacted the police. Kids testified they were drinking in front of her, as they had done on prior occasions.

She let them drink. She rolled the dice. And, unfortunately, there was a tragic accident that night.

CHUNG: Now, she and her lawyer would lead you to believe that, in fact, you cut a deal for these kids, had them testify against her, and, in fact, that she did not condone drinking and that she had not approved of their drinking on any other occasion as well, that it was strictly your deal that caused them to get up there on the stand and say what they did.

MORGANELLI: Absolutely not.

First of all, when the police arrived, there was kids scattered all over the place. The ones who remained who were tested for alcohol showed negative. A lot of the kids, we don't even know who was there, all of the kids, and no deals were cut. (CROSSTALK)

CHUNG: Well, why, then, weren't other kids charged with underage drinking?

MORGANELLI: Because the ones who remained at the party that evening were tested as not having ingested any alcohol. A lot of kids scattered. When we went out over a period of months to investigate, it was difficult to get the kids to tell us what happened.

We wanted to know what the adult in charge was doing while these kid were drink. I was certainly not interested in going back and revisiting an underage drinking party. What I wanted to know was, why it is that a 42-year-old woman, who was allowing 60 kids to come into her house -- not the first time, I might add -- to drink alcohol.

And, you know, Connie, every night -- we have teenagers. We ask our teenagers when they go out: "Is there a parent going to be home? Is someone going to be there, a responsible adult?" And we ask that question because we want to make sure that someone is in charge. Judith McCloskey was not in charge. She was a facilitator of teenage drinking. She let it happen. And, unfortunately, there was a tragic accident and three young lives were lost.

CHUNG: Well, what about the man who provided those kegs of beer, only a $1,000 fine?

MORGANELLI: Under Pennsylvania law, it was very clear that just providing the alcohol by itself would not rise to the level of gross negligence, which we had to establish. He was not on the premises that night. He was not there allowing kids to become visibly intoxicated.

CHUNG: But he bought it for them, Mr. Morganelli.

MORGANELLI: He bought it for them, absolutely. And I wish I could have prosecuted him for involuntary manslaughter.

But the fact of the matter is, the law of Pennsylvania would not have allowed that prosecution, because he was not in a position to know the extent of the drinking or knowing that they were driving vehicles that night, as McCloskey was. These kids were going in and out of her home, some as young as 14 years of age, drinking alcohol over a period of four hours.

They actually consumed a half-a-keg of beer and almost kicked a quarter keg. That's a lot of alcohol. And when you mix alcohol and teenagers and driving, the results are pretty predictable.

CHUNG: Well, she says that she didn't even know that boy who was driving, that 19-year-old, didn't even know he had a car, didn't even see him.

MORGANELLI: Yes.

But, Connie, the jury heard her defense. The jury heard her testimony, 11 women, I might add, with teenager daughters. If you want to talk about a trial of your peers, she certainly had it. Her defense was preposterous. It was so incredible, because the kids' testimony, 30-some kids testified that they always went to her house to drink alcohol because she let them.

And so she had her trial, and her story was just not credible.

CHUNG: Let's look at the bottom line here. Is the message, which many people could be concerned about -- is the message, teens could do things that are wrong and their parents go off and have to pay for it?

MORGANELLI: No, absolutely not. She is paying for what she did in this case.

Pennsylvania law says you are not allowed to let teenagers come to your house and drink. She let them. She knew about it. She knew they were driving. It was complete reckless conduct on her part. She is being punished for what she did, not what the kids did. She was the facilitator. She was the person who let them do it. And she could have stopped it.

So this whole spin that somehow she's being prosecuted for something someone else did is really not on point.

CHUNG: But do you really think that the kids have learned a lesson from this?

MORGANELLI: Well, I hope so, but we're not so sure if kids learn lessons from other people's experiences. I hope the message...

CHUNG: Well, they weren't punished, so how could they learn a lesson?

MORGANELLI: Well, they lost three of their friends here. A lot of them sat through this trial and they testified. And I think lessons were learned by these young people, maybe not all of them, but certainly some of them.

And I hope that parents out there also get the message. Those who believe that it's OK to let kids drink at your home unsupervised or even supervised, you are rolling the dice. And if you are unlucky, it might come up snake eyes.

CHUNG: Do you think that this case really does set quite a precedent?

MORGANELLI: I think it's a precedent-setting case, to some extent, because of the novelty of it. And I hope that I never have to prosecute another one of these, because we don't want to lose more young lives.

But my goal here is to protect teenagers and also to assure parents, when they send their kids out to a responsible adult's home for the night, that they know that that person in charge is not going to let this happen. CHUNG: All right, thank you, John Morganelli...

MORGANELLI: Thank you.

CHUNG: ... district attorney for Northampton County. We appreciate your being with us.

One woman dedicated her life to getting drunken drivers off the road. She founded the organization Mothers Against Drunk Driving before dropping "Off the Radar."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: Candy Lightner was a mother who launched a crusade after it was too late to save her daughter. On May 5, 1980, 13-year- old Cari Lightner was walking to a carnival when Clarence William Busch, a three-time convicted drunk driver, ran into her and killed her. Lightner thought he'd go away for a long time. She was wrong.

CANDY LIGHTNER, FOUNDER, MADD: I used to say that drunk driving was the only socially acceptable form of homicide we had in this country.

ANNOUNCER: To change that attitude, Lightner formed Mothers Against Drunk Driving; 22 years later, what is MADD doing now and why was Lightner branded a traitor? The answers when we return.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: What happened to Mothers Against Drunk Driving and the woman who founded it? Today, MADD has about 600 chapters across the country, millions of members, and millions in revenue. They got the drinking age raised to 21. And drunk driving deaths plummeted by more than 40 percent from 1980 to 1995. But they've plateaued at about 16,000 a year.

So MADD last week launched a new campaign to decrease that number and dropped the phrase Mothers Against Drunk Driving. As for Lightner, she left in 1985, complaining about the number of men at MADD. Today, she's a consultant for advocacy groups.

Lightner, who is of Lebanese descent, has also lobbied against anti-Arab discrimination. Some in MADD branded her a traitor, though, when she lobbied against the blood-alcohol limit to .08. The man who killed her daughter continued to drive drunk.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: And earlier on our program, we told you about a new fund established in memory of Sonny Buchanan, a victim of the Montgomery County, Maryland, shootings. It will be an educational fund for underprivileged kids. We want to clarify the address for you now. It is: Sonny's Kids, P.O. Box 10666, Rockville, Maryland, 20849.

And coming up Monday: live coverage of President Bush's major speech on Iraq.

And coming up next on "LARRY KING LIVE": two sisters joined at the head for more than 40 years.

Thank you for joining us. And for all of us at CNN, good night. Have a great weekend. And see you on Monday.

TO ORDER A VIDEO OF THIS TRANSCRIPT, PLEASE CALL 800-CNN-NEWS OR USE OUR SECURE ONLINE ORDER FORM LOCATED AT www.fdch.com





Suspected al Qaeda Terror Cell Busted>


Aired October 4, 2002 - 20:00   ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CONNIE CHUNG, HOST: Good evening. I'm Connie Chung.
The massive manhunt for a spree killer: Are other shootings now connected?

ANNOUNCER: A high-caliber killer still on the loose.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHARLES MOOSE, MONTGOMERY COUNTY POLICE CHIEF: We feel like we probably have a skilled shooter. And that does heighten our concern.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Five families devastated, and tonight, share their grief.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm feeling terrified.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: A suspected al Qaeda terror cell busted, this time in Oregon.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN ASHCROFT, ATTORNEY GENERAL: We have neutralized a suspected terrorist cell within our borders.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: How many terrorists could still be hiding on American soil?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was surprised. So close to home. You always say it never comes close to you, it won't happen close to you. Well, they're right here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: The skull and bones of a missing little girl are finally identified.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The skeletal remains recovered in Rockingham County have been determined to be a positive match with the DNA profile of the Jennifer Renee Short case.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Tonight: The mystery remains. Who killed Jennifer Short?

She was convicted not for what she did, but for what she failed to do.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JUDITH MCCLOSKEY, CONVICTED OF INVOLUNTARY MANSLAUGHTER: I don't feel that I am responsible to the depth of three counts of involuntary manslaughter.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Who is to blame when drunk drivers kill?

This is CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT. Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York: Connie Chung.

CHUNG: Good evening.

An entire community in suburban Maryland is living in fear. A massive manhunt is under way, with still no clues as to who killed five people, the killings random and senseless, this as another woman was shot today in Virginia and a man was shot in Washington, D.C. last night, police now looking for a possible connection to these and yesterday's shooting spree.

CNN's Kathleen Koch has been following this still unfolding story and joins us live from police headquarters in Rockville, Maryland -- Kathleen.

KATHLEEN KOCH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Connie, well, as you just reported, we have now perhaps two more shootings. And sources very close to this investigation here in Montgomery County, Maryland, now tell us that they believe that the killer or killers here or at least a copycat has struck again, this because of that shooting now in Fredericksburg, Virginia, that occurred late this afternoon.

A 43-year-old woman was going about her daily activities, loading packages into her van in front of a Michaels craft store in the Spotsylvania mall, when she was shot in the lower back. Now, police say that the bullet passed through her body. And the woman is now hospitalized, in stable condition. But unlike the cases here in Maryland, in this case, police have found some evidence right on the scene. They have found at least one shell casing. And sources close to the investigation tell us that it was likely this type of a bullet that was fired. This is a .223, a high-caliber bullet. And, Connie, it's the very same type of bullet that was used, police believe at least, in these Montgomery County shootings, fired likely from a very high-powered rifle.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(voice over): Police say a high-powered assault or hunting rifle like these was used in the shooting spree, the bullets high caliber most likely a .223. Using them with such deadly precision, experts say, takes skill.

JOSEPH RIEHL, ATF SPECIAL AGENT: Someone who is very proficient to be accurate, people who shoot a lot, people who have trained previously to shoot these types of weapons at long range would have the capabilities.

KOCH: With such a high-powered weapon, police say a sniper could fire from up to 500 yards away. And authorities are investigating yet another possible victim. A 72-year-old man was shot to death on a Washington, D.C. street corner at 9:15 Thursday night.

The five earlier shootings were in Montgomery County but this one happened only a few miles south, just inside the Washington city line. The bullet from that shooting was being examined in a ballistics lab. The case examined for any similarities.

MOOSE: May be related to those cases in Montgomery County. However, there is no conclusive evidence at this time to confirm the possibility.

KOCH: Montgomery County schools remained locked down for a second day, no outdoor recess or off-campus lunch.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's scary. I think everybody is a little bit nervous.

KOCH: Police say they're still looking for a white box truck with two men inside.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KOCH: And we have new information now on the box truck. It does have lettering, police say, two lines of block lettering on the side and on the back. They say the vehicle has six wheels, four wheels in the rear. Another crucial piece of information: Police says it has a roll-up rear door. The cab in the front is smaller and very box-like in appearance.

So those are some important very clues that police hope will help them and help people in the area perhaps recognize this truck and locate the people who are responsible, or the person -- back to you, Connie.

CHUNG: All right, thank you, Kathleen Koch. Appreciate it.

And, as the community continues to brace itself in search of this killer or killers, joining me now with the latest on the search for the killer or killers: Montgomery County Police Chief Charles Moose and Montgomery County Executive Douglas Duncan.

Gentlemen, thank you for being with us.

First, Chief Moose, is there any connection, do you believe, between the shooting that occurred in Virginia just this afternoon and the one in Washington, D.C. last night? Is there any connection between those two shootings and the ones that have occurred here in Montgomery County?

MOOSE: Well, certainly, at this point, we are approaching it with that in mind. But the tendency is for me to not speculate, to see what our investigators tell us, see what the evidence tells us, and then make a decision.

So, certainly, some things look like that may be the case. At this point, the fragments from the shooting in D.C. are in the lab at the ATF office, along with the fragments and evidence from our shootings. And the comparison test is being conducted right now.

I've also been advised that evidence from Virginia is en route to that same lab. And that will certainly be information that will tell us whether or not the connection exists or not.

CHUNG: What is your best estimate on when a report from those tests will emerge?

MOOSE: You know, at this point, I really can't say. I have spent late afternoon guessing. And I have come in and I've missed every time. So the people that are working on it, they are being diligent, they are being professional. We can't rush them. It's not smart to rush them. When we have it, we will release it.

CHUNG: Yes, sir.

The shooting that occurred in Virginia was at Michaels craft store. Was it just a coincidence that the very first shooting in Montgomery County was also at a Michaels craft store? Or was it a copycat, do you think? Or do you think that it was just a coincidence?

MOOSE: At this point, again, I don't know. We looked at that. It was very interesting when that came through. There have been eight shootings, two at craft stores, Michaels craft stores. So does that make a pattern, two out of eight? Maybe, maybe not. It may just be a coincidence at this point.

CHUNG: Do you know if a different weapon was used at each of those sites?

MOOSE: Again, that work, the lab will tell us that. And, as I stated earlier, right now some of that is being done. Some of it will be done later, when the materials get here from Virginia. So we don't know at this time.

CHUNG: All right, County Executive Duncan, I know that schools were open today. But were activities after school also still held?

DOUGLAS DUNCAN, MONTGOMERY COUNTY EXECUTIVE: We are playing football games right now. We had all the after-school activities. Last night, we canceled them. Tonight, they went on. And we've got a full range of activities for the weekend.

The schools were open. The county government was open, libraries. Business went on as close to normal as we could make it today. And almost all the students showed up for school today. The teachers were there. The school bus drivers showed up. So people were getting about, doing their normal routine as best they could, while still in a very anxious, very fearful situation.

CHUNG: All right, Chief Moose, can you tell us if you still believe that two individuals were probably involved?

MOOSE: Well, certainly, we want to remember that, when we talked about the truck that we're looking for, the witness talked about two people in it. So we haven't changed that. That is the initial information.

We know that there is one person involved, and there may well be a second person. So, again, we're not eliminating anything. We are keeping an open mind. We don't want to get tunnel vision. We want to remain driven by the evidence.

CHUNG: And what have the ballistics reports told you about the shooter and the type of weapon he was using?

MOOSE: Again, the ballistic reports have told us that we're talking about a high-velocity round, more than likely a .223, could be a .222 or a .221. But those are very, very similar rounds. That's what it's told us so far.

We're waiting on this latest report to tell us what the connection may be, how much the two -- the various rounds match, and specifically whether the D.C. rounds matched the rounds in Montgomery County.

CHUNG: All right, Montgomery police Chief Charles Moose, we thank you very much. And we also thank County Executive Douglas Duncan.

The second person killed in the spree, the first to be shot yesterday morning, was 39-year-old James Buchanan Jr. His friends and family called him Sonny. The son of a retired Montgomery County police officer, he was shot while mowing a client's lawn. Sonny Buchanan's sister, her son Jake is Sonny's nephew.

And they join me now from Washington.

Thank you both for being with us. Victoria, you were actually waiting for your brother to come over to your house, because you knew that he was going to be mowing a client's lawn. Had you heard about any of the shootings that had occurred?

VICTORIA SNIDER, SISTER OF JAMES BUCHANAN JR.: Yes, Connie, I did.

But at the time, they were -- they just said a Hispanic male mowing a lawn. And so I didn't connect that with my brother at all. It just didn't dawn on me. And at the place they showed the shot, I didn't see -- if I had seen the dealership, I would have connected it. But I didn't. That was his only account he had left here.

CHUNG: You mean his dealership, his landscaping company?

V. SNIDER: Yes, that was the only -- he had dissolved his company. He had moved away. And he was in the process of building a home with my father on the mountain.

CHUNG: So when you did not hear from him, Victoria, the time passed, were you worried?

V. SNIDER: No, because my brother is -- he has so many things on his plate that I knew that he would eventually get to my house. I was getting a little concerned towards 1:00-ish. And I just thought that he was running behind and maybe met a friend or something and then would come to my house on his way to his girlfriend's.

CHUNG: But, in fact, at about 1:30, the police knocked on your door.

V. SNIDER: Yes.

CHUNG: And they told you?

V. SNIDER: Yes. It was very devastating.

CHUNG: Jake, tell me about your uncle. What do you miss about him the most?

JAKE SNIDER, NEPHEW OF JAMES BUCHANAN JR.: My uncle, he was there for me through all my hard times growing up. My uncle was my go-to guy.

He was not only my uncle. He was my friend. He was my best friend. He was my mentor. If I ever had a problem, he was right there. He would be the one I would go and talk to. I always helped him out. He got me involved in the community. I helped out with the Boys & Girls Club. And I sold Christmas trees for seven years straight with him.

CHUNG: Victoria, do you know of anyone who would target your brother?

V. SNIDER: No, I know no one. I think it was a hate crime. I think it was a random crime. I think there is somebody out there that needs help and needs to turn themselves in.

CHUNG: Did he know any of the other victims?

V. SNIDER: No. I knew nobody. We knew nobody, none of the other victims. I think it was very random.

CHUNG: How has this affected you, Victoria? It must be devastating.

V. SNIDER: Oh, I'm still -- I'm in a tunnel. And I know that my brother would not want this notoriety. He was a private person on about a lot of things.

CHUNG: All right, Victoria Snider and Jake Snider, thank you so much for being with us. And we're so sorry. We're so sorry about your loss.

V. SNIDER: Thank you.

J. SNIDER: Thank you.

CHUNG: Thank you, Victoria Snider and Jake Snider.

Victoria Snider has asked us to mention that she's starting a foundation in her brother's memory, an education fund for underprivileged kids: Sonny's Kids, P.O. Box 10666, Rockville, Maryland, 20849.

And still ahead: Another case has been resolved and the news is not good.

We'll be right back.

ANNOUNCER: Next: six U.S. residents, five of them citizens, charged in a conspiracy to wage war against America. How many more are out there?

CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: Six U.S. residents, including a former Army reservist, were charged today with conspiring to assist al Qaeda and the Taliban wage war against the United States. Four of them are under arrest tonight. Attorney General John Ashcroft said the other two are overseas and not yet in custody.

CNN's justice correspondent Kelli Arena has details from Washington.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KELLI ARENA, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): These six individuals are charged with being part of an al Qaeda terrorist cell. Five are American-born U.S. citizens. One even served in the U.S. Army as a reservist. ASHCROFT: Today is a defining day in America's war against terrorism. We have neutralized the suspected terrorist cell within our borders.

ARENA: Four of the accused are currently in custody arrested in Portland, Oregon and Detroit, Michigan. Two remain at large overseas. The six are not charged with planning a specific terrorist act inside the U.S. or anywhere else but rather conspiracy to wage war against the United States to provide material support and resources to al Qaeda and to contribute services to al Qaeda and the Taliban. If convicted, they will face life in prison.

SHERIFF CHARLES BRYAN, SAKAMANIA COUNTY, WASHINGTON: A group of Oregon residents, most of whom were U.S. citizens, after September 11 and the attacks on the United States decided to go to Afghanistan and fight for al Qaeda and the Taliban against the United States military. Five of those individuals left the country. One stayed behind and wire transferred money to support them while they were overseas.

ARENA: The five who tried to get to Afghanistan never made it. At least one made it only as far as Bangladesh. Three returned to the United States. Before that, one of the three, Jeffrey Battle, allegedly joined the U.S. Army Reserves to learn about U.S. military tactics and weapons.

ASHCROFT: While in Bangladesh attempting to gain entry into Afghanistan, Battle caused himself to be discharged administratively from the United States Army Reserve in which he had enlisted in order to receive military training intended for use against the United States.

ARENA: The investigation started a year ago, sparked by a tip from a local sheriff from Washington State where the authorities say the suspects were using a gravel pit for weapons training.

(on camera): Officials will not comment on possible associates, but they do say the investigation is still under way. They are asking citizens to be on alert and to report any suspicious activity.

Kelli Arena, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: The breakup of another alleged ring of American-based al Qaeda backers raises some questions about homeland security. How many suspected terrorists are in the United States? Where are they? And how well are we keeping an eye on them?

CNN's Mike Boettcher joins us now from CNN Center in Atlanta.

Mike, I think it's just pretty frightening to realize now that there were suspected terrorists in Buffalo, Detroit, Chicago, and now Portland. How many more are there out there?

MIKE BOETTCHER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know something, Connie? I've stopped trying to make an estimate on that, because I've heard varying estimates.

The fact is, they are here. But let's make a distinction. Those arrested in the cities you mentioned were people that it is believed were not specifically al Qaeda cells, so to speak. These were people, some of them wanna-bes, some of them who decided after 9/11 they wanted to take up the cause of terrorism.

So that is distinct from the sleeper cells, who would have been trained by al Qaeda, by Osama bin Laden and his instructors in Afghanistan before 9/11, who were sent to the United States specifically to conduct terrorist operations and are, in effect, sleeper cells waiting for orders or waiting for the right opportunity.

CHUNG: Mike, you had reported exclusively that you had gotten ahold of these documents that showed that John Walker Lindh said 50 al Qaeda members had come to the United States to carry out 20 different missions. Where could they possibly be? Is it that our intelligence has not yet spotted them?

BOETTCHER: Well, if you look, Connie, at the al Qaeda manuals that are out there, you are not going to spot these people. They are trained. The ones that are real al Qaeda cells, sleeper cells, are trained to blend in.

In the manual, for example, it goes through the greatest detail. The al Qaeda manual, training manual, tells them to keep their shoes polished. They don't go to mosques. They're not going to be out training in uniform out in some gravel pit somewhere. It's a unit that's already been trained, that is highly organized and receives funding, a lot of it, from outside the United States.

CHUNG: And, finally, Mike, Attorney General Ashcroft said that today is a defining day in America's war on terrorism. Was it significant?

BOETTCHER: I would say "defining" would be going too far, but he is the attorney general and he knows a lot more about this than I do.

But I will say that, if you do arrest people who have intent, you do stop future terrorist acts, even if they are not al Qaeda cells, there is a nibbling around the edges of a central core of al Qaeda. And if you keep nibbling away at that, you're going to find connections that take you to the inner core.

So you can't let people who are talking about or dreaming about taking terrorist action against the United States, you can't let them go. But it still is a long way from getting a cell like the ones who conducted the raids on 9/11, Connie.

CHUNG: All right, CNN's Mike Boettcher in Atlanta, thank you.

The man known as the Taliban American, John Walker Lindh, was sentenced to 20 years in prison today. Before his sentencing in a Virginia courtroom, Walker Lindh said that he made a mistake by joining the Taliban. If he knew then what he knows now, Walker Lindh told the court -- quote -- "I would never have joined them." He also denounced Osama bin Laden, saying whatever grievances he has, they shouldn't be resolved by violence against Americans. Prosecutors say Lindh is cooperating with their investigation and has agreed to take a lie- detector test.

We'll be back in just a moment.

ANNOUNCER: Still ahead: The disappearance of Jennifer Short ends tragically. Now the hunt is on for her killer.

CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT continues in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: Police in North Carolina confirmed the worst today: that skeletal remains found there have been identified as those of 9-year- old Jennifer Short. Jennifer Short had been missing for seven weeks, after her parents were found murdered in their Virginia home last August.

CNN's Charles Molineaux has the latest on this case.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHARLES MOLINEAUX, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Virginia and North Carolina police and the FBI are planning a trip clear up to Canada to talk to what they call a potential witness in the Jennifer Short case.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just above the Arctic Circle, right up here.

MOLINEAUX (on camera): He went about as far as he could go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Again, it's a long ways from North Carolina. So we're going to have to logistically plan to go up there to do an interview.

MOLINEAUX (voice-over): Police have already searched the man's home in North Carolina. And they're hope to take advantage of his arrest by Canadian Mounties on immigration violations there, this after getting word human remains found in North Carolina are Jennifer's.

Jennifer Renee Short disappeared under circumstances that were terrifying from the start. On August 15, her parents were found dead in their home in Henry County, Virginia. They'd both been shot in the head and Jennifer was missing. The Shorts' relatives have been offering emotional appeals for her to be returned.

RUBY YOUNG, AUNT OF JENNIFER SHORT: Police release her, so she can come home. We all miss her beyond words.

MOLINEAUX: Last week, Eddie Albert discovered the remains on his property in Rockingham County, North Carolina, 30 miles away from where the Shorts were murdered.

EDDIE ALBERT, DISCOVERED REMAINS: I've never found anything like that before. It was shocking.

MOLINEAUX: First his dogs turned up a mass of hair he decided was a wig. He threw it in the trash. Two days later, he found his dog Blue with what looked like part of a human skull.

ALBERT: My mind started going backwards: "Well, if this is a skull, what did I throw in the trash can?" We all know about the little girl from up at Bassett that's missing.

MOLINEAUX: A police search of the grounds and two ponds turned up more remains, which an autopsy reveals were a 9-year-old girl who had been shot in the head.

Then, Thursday night, investigators with the Virginia Division of Forensic Science finished up their DNA analysis of the remains and determined they had found Jennifer Short.

(on camera): Now this bridge over a creek where some of the remains were found has become a makeshift memorial. People continue to drop off flowers, stuffed animals, even a hand-written tribute to Jennifer framed and written on looseleaf.

The sheriffs investigating this case say the news about where Jennifer finally ended up is a heartbreaking new piece of an ongoing puzzle.

Charles Molineaux, CNN, Rockingham County, North Carolina.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: And joining me now from Rockingham, North Carolina, is Sam Page, the sheriff in Rockingham County.

Sheriff, thank you so much for being with us. Can you tell us, is there any new information from your investigation?

SAM PAGE, ROCKINGHAM COUNTY POLICE DEPARTMENT: No, not at this time.

I left the investigators a few hours ago. And they are working on the arrangements with the federal authorities to go to Canada to make interviews with the witness in the case, a Mr. Bowman, a Gary Bowman.

CHUNG: We're being very cautious here at CNN in terms of exactly how to characterize him. He is just a witness, correct?

PAGE: At this time, yes, ma'am.

We know where he's at in Canada. And, again, since we have the federal authorities involved, state and local, we have to work through everyone's protocols together so it will in unison when we go up there. And plus, we are going into another country. We are going into another country. So we have to work with them.

CHUNG: No doubt you were concerned that maps were found at his home, as I understand it, pinpointing the Smarts' home.

PAGE: I know that there were some maps found, but I don't want to speculate on what actually they showed. I don't have that confirmed, what you are saying. But I do know that some maps were found with some locations. But other than that, I'd rather not make any further comments, since it is a pending investigation.

CHUNG: All right.

This was such a brutal crime, for this family so tragic. Having found the remains of the little girl, have you gotten any clues from that?

PAGE: Well, it's a very tragic situation. And you're trying to be sensitive to it, because we know every time we go on TV, we know the family sees this. And we want them to know that we feel for the family.

From a professional standpoint, I think, by identifying our victim now, that helps to solidify the investigators from Virginia and North Carolina working together to get resolving this case.

CHUNG: Can you describe exactly where their remains were found and whether or not you believe that the murder of little Jennifer occurred there?

PAGE: I cannot state where the murder occurred at this time. We do know where the abduction occurred. But, as far as the murder, we don't know. But we do know that the remains in question were found over the past week right behind me at the bridge area down in the creek area and also to the residence to the rear of me.

CHUNG: Do you believe that she might have been killed around the same time that her parents were?

PAGE: That's a question I can't answer, although people had asked several questions about the remains that we've found. Again, I just would rather not speculate on that, at that time of death.

CHUNG: All right.

PAGE: We...

CHUNG: Go ahead.

PAGE: I'm sorry.

We do know that the cause of death was ruled as a death by a gunshot wound to the head, which is very similar to the mother and father previous.

CHUNG: Have you been able to talk to members of the Short family? PAGE: I have not personally. Sheriff Cassell from Henry County, Virginia, has been the coordinator and, through his officers, have been in contact with the family prior to our original release of the information today from the state lab.

CHUNG: Are you looking for other potential witnesses or potential suspects?

PAGE: We are.

Again, we appeal to anyone that has any information to please contact us or the Virginia authorities. But, again, we are interviewing anybody that we deem may have information or we think might be of assistance in resolving and solving the case and bringing the perpetrators to justice.

CHUNG: Thank you so much, Sheriff Page, for being with us.

PAGE: Thank you, ma'am.

CHUNG: Still ahead: How much responsibility does a parent assume for the teenagers partying in their basement? One woman was shocked by the answer.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: A Pennsylvania mother faces up to 15 years in jail in a landmark case that extends the responsibility of adults when kids drink and drive.

Here's what happened. Judith McCloskey allowed her two teenager daughters to give a party at their home. She says she did not provide alcohol and she did not see anyone drinking. But because McCloskey failed to stop a drunken teenage boy from driving away from the party, she was found guilty of involuntary manslaughter.

The 19-year-old boy, Christopher Mowad, crashed his SUV, killing himself and two others, Kimberly Byrne and Bryan Kiefer, two passengers in his car.

A short while ago, I spoke with the mother and her lawyer.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: Joining me now is Judith McCloskey and her attorney, Gary Asteak.

Thank you both for being with us.

Judy, on the night that you had the party that your daughters had, this party, you were upstairs. They were downstairs. What did you think they were doing down there?

MCCLOSKEY: Having a get-together to discuss issues regarding the prom that was happening the next week. They were going to be playing some games and listening to loud music.

CHUNG: The police arrived after 11:00 p.m. and asked you if there was any underage drinking going on. And your answer was?

MCCLOSKEY: I didn't believe there was. And he asked if he could come in. And I said, "Sure."

CHUNG: So, at that moment, though, some kids left. They fled. And not long after that, you discovered that there was a car accident that was related, in a way, to your party.

And one of the police officers said to you, "If the accident was related to your party, you better be prepared for a lot of trouble." And the DA said that you responded to the police officer using an expletive.

Did you utter an expletive when you found out that in fact three of the kids were killed?

MCCLOSKEY: Yes, after speaking to my daughter for about two hours that night after the police had left and told us that we may be in big trouble if it was related and that our lives would change drastically, a lot of crying went on that two hours, a lot of guilt on my daughter's part, as well as a lot of fear on my part.

And at 6:10 in the morning, when those three kids arrived to let us know about the three children who did pass away in the accident, I did first cry. I did then go into my daughter's room. And then she came out into the living room. And I did say the wrong thing after having some anger.

CHUNG: Yes.

Judy, a number of the kids said that you did allow them to drink alcohol on several occasions. Is that true?

MCCLOSKEY: That is not true. They said that, but that is not the way it was in our home or in our life.

CHUNG: Here you are found guilty of manslaughter. Were you shocked?

MCCLOSKEY: Extremely shocked.

CHUNG: Do you think you should be held responsible for these three deaths?

MCCLOSKEY: No, I don't.

There was a lot of things that caused those deaths. And my naivete and my trust and belief in my kids is basically what made me realize and feel that evening that I did not have to monitor them any closer than I was already. And there was no signs of alcohol upstairs in my home or any signs of drunkenness downstairs when I opened the door to turn down the music. There was no signs of drunkenness outside anywhere around my home. CHUNG: How do you feel now, knowing that you do face a jail sentence?

MCCLOSKEY: I don't know how else to say it, except not good.

CHUNG: Are you frightened?

MCCLOSKEY: Extremely.

CHUNG: How do your daughters feel about it, Judy?

MCCLOSKEY: Very responsible.

CHUNG: They feel responsible?

MCCLOSKEY: Yes, for not allowing me to know that it might have been getting out of hand and that they couldn't control it, and that they feel like they have done this to me.

CHUNG: Do you feel that they really are responsible for...

MCCLOSKEY: I feel they are somewhat responsible. And I feel that I am somewhat responsible. But I don't feel that I am responsible to the depth of three counts of involuntary manslaughter.

CHUNG: Mr. Asteak, why do you think your defense did not work?

GARY ASTEAK, ATTORNEY FOR JUDITH MCCLOSKEY: The defense didn't work simply because criminal courts are the wrong place to try to solve social problems.

This is not a black-and-white issue. This is not an issue of guilt or not guilty. This is an issue of responsibility that has many shades of gray. And, unfortunately, the way this case turned out, the man who bought the beer got off with a $1,000 fine. All of the teenagers who had been drinking simply got off and were given immunity so that they could testify.

This was an effort by the prosecution to send a message. And it's a rather strange and mixed message. If that message is, parents should be more responsible, that's a good message. But if the message is, teenagers get off scot-free and that they can simply blame the parents, that's the wrong message.

CHUNG: Judy, do you think the other teenagers and your daughters, actually, should be the ones going to jail?

MCCLOSKEY: I don't know about going to jail for them either. My two girls are being punished with probation and community service hours, but none of the other kids are.

And I can guarantee you that my children have learned from this. And a lot of those kids that were involved in that night have been involved in several other things as well. So they haven't learned. And I think maybe they should all have been charged with underage drinking, just the same as my two girls, because maybe then that they would learn.

CHUNG: Judith McCloskey, Gary Asteak, thank you so much for being with us.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: But what about the people who were killed in the accident? Well, when we come back, that part of the story -- in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHUNG: The man who successfully prosecuted Judith McCloskey and who will be watching closely when she's sentenced next month for involuntary manslaughter is John Morganelli, the district attorney in Northampton County, Pennsylvania. And he joins me now from Philadelphia.

Thank you, sir, for being with us.

JOHN MORGANELLI, DISTRICT ATTORNEY, NORTHAMPTON COUNTY: Good evening, Connie.

CHUNG: Judy McCloskey did not provide the alcohol. She did not condone it being consumed. And she didn't even know that it was being consumed. Haven't you just gone too far?

MORGANELLI: Well, Connie, the fact of the matter is, Judith McCloskey was a known facilitator of teenage drinking. She had provided a safe haven for teenagers to come to her home on numerous occasions in the past. Seven to 10 kids testified at trial that that was the case. They called her Judy. She was a friend rather than a parent.

And, unfortunately, this was one time too many. On this particular night, there were 60-plus kids in and out of her house over a four-hour period. It was so loud and so noisy that a neighbor down the street contacted the police. Kids testified they were drinking in front of her, as they had done on prior occasions.

She let them drink. She rolled the dice. And, unfortunately, there was a tragic accident that night.

CHUNG: Now, she and her lawyer would lead you to believe that, in fact, you cut a deal for these kids, had them testify against her, and, in fact, that she did not condone drinking and that she had not approved of their drinking on any other occasion as well, that it was strictly your deal that caused them to get up there on the stand and say what they did.

MORGANELLI: Absolutely not.

First of all, when the police arrived, there was kids scattered all over the place. The ones who remained who were tested for alcohol showed negative. A lot of the kids, we don't even know who was there, all of the kids, and no deals were cut. (CROSSTALK)

CHUNG: Well, why, then, weren't other kids charged with underage drinking?

MORGANELLI: Because the ones who remained at the party that evening were tested as not having ingested any alcohol. A lot of kids scattered. When we went out over a period of months to investigate, it was difficult to get the kids to tell us what happened.

We wanted to know what the adult in charge was doing while these kid were drink. I was certainly not interested in going back and revisiting an underage drinking party. What I wanted to know was, why it is that a 42-year-old woman, who was allowing 60 kids to come into her house -- not the first time, I might add -- to drink alcohol.

And, you know, Connie, every night -- we have teenagers. We ask our teenagers when they go out: "Is there a parent going to be home? Is someone going to be there, a responsible adult?" And we ask that question because we want to make sure that someone is in charge. Judith McCloskey was not in charge. She was a facilitator of teenage drinking. She let it happen. And, unfortunately, there was a tragic accident and three young lives were lost.

CHUNG: Well, what about the man who provided those kegs of beer, only a $1,000 fine?

MORGANELLI: Under Pennsylvania law, it was very clear that just providing the alcohol by itself would not rise to the level of gross negligence, which we had to establish. He was not on the premises that night. He was not there allowing kids to become visibly intoxicated.

CHUNG: But he bought it for them, Mr. Morganelli.

MORGANELLI: He bought it for them, absolutely. And I wish I could have prosecuted him for involuntary manslaughter.

But the fact of the matter is, the law of Pennsylvania would not have allowed that prosecution, because he was not in a position to know the extent of the drinking or knowing that they were driving vehicles that night, as McCloskey was. These kids were going in and out of her home, some as young as 14 years of age, drinking alcohol over a period of four hours.

They actually consumed a half-a-keg of beer and almost kicked a quarter keg. That's a lot of alcohol. And when you mix alcohol and teenagers and driving, the results are pretty predictable.

CHUNG: Well, she says that she didn't even know that boy who was driving, that 19-year-old, didn't even know he had a car, didn't even see him.

MORGANELLI: Yes.

But, Connie, the jury heard her defense. The jury heard her testimony, 11 women, I might add, with teenager daughters. If you want to talk about a trial of your peers, she certainly had it. Her defense was preposterous. It was so incredible, because the kids' testimony, 30-some kids testified that they always went to her house to drink alcohol because she let them.

And so she had her trial, and her story was just not credible.

CHUNG: Let's look at the bottom line here. Is the message, which many people could be concerned about -- is the message, teens could do things that are wrong and their parents go off and have to pay for it?

MORGANELLI: No, absolutely not. She is paying for what she did in this case.

Pennsylvania law says you are not allowed to let teenagers come to your house and drink. She let them. She knew about it. She knew they were driving. It was complete reckless conduct on her part. She is being punished for what she did, not what the kids did. She was the facilitator. She was the person who let them do it. And she could have stopped it.

So this whole spin that somehow she's being prosecuted for something someone else did is really not on point.

CHUNG: But do you really think that the kids have learned a lesson from this?

MORGANELLI: Well, I hope so, but we're not so sure if kids learn lessons from other people's experiences. I hope the message...

CHUNG: Well, they weren't punished, so how could they learn a lesson?

MORGANELLI: Well, they lost three of their friends here. A lot of them sat through this trial and they testified. And I think lessons were learned by these young people, maybe not all of them, but certainly some of them.

And I hope that parents out there also get the message. Those who believe that it's OK to let kids drink at your home unsupervised or even supervised, you are rolling the dice. And if you are unlucky, it might come up snake eyes.

CHUNG: Do you think that this case really does set quite a precedent?

MORGANELLI: I think it's a precedent-setting case, to some extent, because of the novelty of it. And I hope that I never have to prosecute another one of these, because we don't want to lose more young lives.

But my goal here is to protect teenagers and also to assure parents, when they send their kids out to a responsible adult's home for the night, that they know that that person in charge is not going to let this happen. CHUNG: All right, thank you, John Morganelli...

MORGANELLI: Thank you.

CHUNG: ... district attorney for Northampton County. We appreciate your being with us.

One woman dedicated her life to getting drunken drivers off the road. She founded the organization Mothers Against Drunk Driving before dropping "Off the Radar."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: Candy Lightner was a mother who launched a crusade after it was too late to save her daughter. On May 5, 1980, 13-year- old Cari Lightner was walking to a carnival when Clarence William Busch, a three-time convicted drunk driver, ran into her and killed her. Lightner thought he'd go away for a long time. She was wrong.

CANDY LIGHTNER, FOUNDER, MADD: I used to say that drunk driving was the only socially acceptable form of homicide we had in this country.

ANNOUNCER: To change that attitude, Lightner formed Mothers Against Drunk Driving; 22 years later, what is MADD doing now and why was Lightner branded a traitor? The answers when we return.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: What happened to Mothers Against Drunk Driving and the woman who founded it? Today, MADD has about 600 chapters across the country, millions of members, and millions in revenue. They got the drinking age raised to 21. And drunk driving deaths plummeted by more than 40 percent from 1980 to 1995. But they've plateaued at about 16,000 a year.

So MADD last week launched a new campaign to decrease that number and dropped the phrase Mothers Against Drunk Driving. As for Lightner, she left in 1985, complaining about the number of men at MADD. Today, she's a consultant for advocacy groups.

Lightner, who is of Lebanese descent, has also lobbied against anti-Arab discrimination. Some in MADD branded her a traitor, though, when she lobbied against the blood-alcohol limit to .08. The man who killed her daughter continued to drive drunk.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CHUNG: And earlier on our program, we told you about a new fund established in memory of Sonny Buchanan, a victim of the Montgomery County, Maryland, shootings. It will be an educational fund for underprivileged kids. We want to clarify the address for you now. It is: Sonny's Kids, P.O. Box 10666, Rockville, Maryland, 20849.

And coming up Monday: live coverage of President Bush's major speech on Iraq.

And coming up next on "LARRY KING LIVE": two sisters joined at the head for more than 40 years.

Thank you for joining us. And for all of us at CNN, good night. Have a great weekend. And see you on Monday.

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