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CNN Connie Chung Tonight
Suspects in Beltway Sniper Murders Appear in Federal Court in Baltimore; Who Are the Two Suspects and Their Motives?
Aired October 24, 2002 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: This is a special edition of CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT: "The Sniper Suspects."
One man's early days in Baton Rouge, his conversion to Islam, his military training in Washington state. Then: Service in the Gulf War, his two marriages that ended in divorce, and his relationship with a 17-year-old, did it all culminate in a deadly killing spree?
Tonight: Who are John Allen Muhammad and John Lee Malvo?
This is CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT. Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York: Connie Chung.
CONNIE CHUNG, HOST: Good evening.
Tonight: an in-depth look at the lives and the backgrounds of the two men police believe killed 10 people and seriously injured three others in a string of sniper shootings that shocked the nation and terrorized millions of residents in Washington, Maryland, and Virginia, a bloody spree that triggered an unprecedented manhunt by hundreds of local police and more than 1,300 federal law enforcement agents.
The two men are 41-year-old Gulf War veteran John Allen Muhammad and 17-year-old Jamaican citizen John Lee Malvo. They were arrested at 3:19 this morning after a tip that police believe came from one of the shooters led them to a fatal September shooting in Montgomery, Alabama. That shooting yielded a fingerprint police said came from John Lee Malvo.
And that led to last night's search of the Tacoma, Washington, home that Malvo shared with John Allen Muhammad and the search for their car, a blue 1990 Chevrolet Caprice. After a motorist spotted them at a rest step in Myersville, Maryland, about 50 miles north of D.C., police arrested them and found a Bushmaster .223 rifle in the car, along with a scope and a stand. Police said ballistics test show the rifle is the murder weapon. The car had been outfitted to accommodate a rifle stand in the back.
Tonight, the two appeared in federal court in Baltimore. Muhammad was advised of his rights and told of federal weapons charges against him, charges not connected to the shootings. Malvo's hearing was closed because he's a juvenile. Prosecutors tomorrow will discuss how to charge Muhammad and Malvo for the sniper killings. But their possible motives for the killings remain absolutely unclear. And what was behind the cryptic notes, the strange references, a folk tale in which a duck is caught in a noose, a Jamaican band called Five Stars, the death card from a tarot deck?
Tonight, we're going to take you step by step through the details which are still emerging of the lives of John Allen Muhammad and John Lee Malvo. We're going to start with the early years, when Muhammad lived in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. Then, we'll examine several turning points in Muhammad's life, including his conversion to Islam, his first divorce, and his move to Washington for his career in the Army.
From there, we'll move on to his life with John Lee Malvo, who lived with Muhammad in Tacoma, Washington. And then we'll focus on their time in Maryland, when police say the two began a bloody chain of random, ruthless killings.
We're going to start by taking you to Baton Rouge, Louisiana, where CNN's Susan Candiotti will bring us an exclusive interview, for the first time on national television, with one of Muhammad's family members. And she's been piecing together what little is known about his early years -- Susan.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Connie.
Yes, John grew up in this area in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and spent many, many years here. His mother died when he was very young. And according to family members, John was taken in by other aunts, who helped raise him. Evidently, his father wasn't in the picture very much as he was growing up.
But John eventually went to high school and did graduate in 1978, did pretty well there, especially in the athletic department, played tennis and played track. And his relatives will tell you more about that in a little while. And then he met his wife through one of his brothers. They had a very brief courtship. And then they married.
And they were married for more than 15 years. Evidently, according to family members, he not only had a son with his wife, but also had another son out of wedlock. That son still lives in this area and is in his 20s and is working. Evidently, when he learned the news about his father from a friend today, we were told that he was extremely upset and was in denial about this.
He did visit this area less than three months ago and a couple of times before that in this past year, including this past summer.
Joining us now: one of the people who saw him last, as recently as August. And that is his first cousin, who knew him well growing up. His name is Ed Holiday.
Ed, first of all, of course, you told us that you had last seen him in August, and, when you heard the news this morning, this just did not fit the picture of the John you knew growing up. Why is that? ED HOLIDAY, COUSIN OF JOHN ALLEN MUHAMMAD: Because he was just a real kind, nice guy. He was always the one that would keep the other kids out of trouble. He was always clean-cut John.
CANDIOTTI: What did you think when you heard about the arrest?
HOLIDAY: Oh, I was shocked about it, because he was always talking about taking care of himself, taking care of his kids. And he wanted us to grow up, take care of our kids also.
CANDIOTTI: Tell us about that visit with him last August.
HOLIDAY: Oh, we just -- he introduced his son to me. And we just talked about old times.
CANDIOTTI: And by his son, you mean the teenager Malvo?
HOLIDAY: Right. Right.
CANDIOTTI: Mr. Malvo.
HOLIDAY: Exactly.
CANDIOTTI: And he introduced him as his son?
HOLIDAY: Right.
CANDIOTTI: What did you know of him?
HOLIDAY: That was my first time seeing him. I just always wanted to meet his kids. And I was glad to meet him.
CANDIOTTI: And just before that, you had also visited with him a few months before that, didn't you?
HOLIDAY: Yes, about six months, probably.
CANDIOTTI: About six months before that.
Tell us about the difference between when you saw him then and when you saw him in August. How did he appear to you six months ago -- physically?
HOLIDAY: He was just working out and just real tired. He said he just came from the Y.
CANDIOTTI: What was your understanding about what he did for a living?
HOLIDAY: Well, I just thought he was in the military, still in the military.
CANDIOTTI: And doing well, owned homes?
HOLIDAY: Right. Right. CANDIOTTI: And then he looked very clean-cut. So when you saw him most recently in August, he looked a lot different, you told me. How did he look?
HOLIDAY: He had just come from working out. And he was just tired.
CANDIOTTI: I know Connie has some questions for you, too, about that visit and maybe what you might have discussed about what he was doing, what he was up to, and how he had even offered to, what, sleep in a bus station while he was visiting then?
HOLIDAY: Right.
CANDIOTTI: Can you tell Connie about that?
HOLIDAY: Well, he just wanted me to take him to the bus station. And I told him he could sleep in my home tonight.
(CROSSTALK)
CHUNG: And he did sleep if your home, Ed? He did end up sleeping in your home?
HOLIDAY: Yes, right.
CHUNG: Ed, when you saw him this last time in August, did he express any anger? Was he upset about anything?
HOLIDAY: Not to me at all.
CHUNG: Did he express to you any anti-American feelings or anti- law enforcement feelings?
HOLIDAY: Oh, not to me, not at all.
CHUNG: I understand that you talked about the possibility of war with Iraq. Did he say whether or not he thought that -- he had served in the military, certainly -- whether or not that was something that he supported?
HOLIDAY: I just asked him his opinion on it. And he wasn't really one way or the other about it.
CANDIOTTI: He wasn't really in favor of going to war?
HOLIDAY: Yes, probably like a lot of people. Right.
CHUNG: Do you know if he possessed a gun this last time that you saw him?
HOLIDAY: No, I didn't see a gun.
CHUNG: Did you know that he was proficient with guns, that he was a marksman?
HOLIDAY: No.
CHUNG: No?
HOLIDAY: No, I didn't know anything about a gun. And he never -- we never talked about guns.
CHUNG: How would you describe this young man who was with him, John Malvo?
HOLIDAY: Well, he just seemed like he was well-mannered. That's basically it. I just saw him once.
CANDIOTTI: What's a little unusual -- if I may jump in for a moment -- I know, is that a niece of his, or a relation, had talked about that she had met the young man also, Mr. Malvo, the teenager, and that, afterwards, he wrote her a note.
And in it, according to relatives of this young lady, she said that he sounded depressed, that he didn't really care for his life on the road, moving around so much. Did you have any indication of that, because, evidently, John was moving around a bit, or at least this young man was?
HOLIDAY: No, I didn't get that impression, though. I didn't get that impression at all. They seemed like a happy father and son.
CHUNG: Did you know that, apparently, the young man is not your cousin's biological son? Did they talk at all about their relationship?
HOLIDAY: No, they didn't. They just talked about going back home.
CHUNG: You know, another former relative said that, when she met John Malvo, that he was only allowed to eat crackers and honey and that he wasn't allowed to eat a regular diet. Did you happen to have a meal with the two of them?
HOLIDAY: Yes, we bought some -- I bought some fish and some other things. So he had more than crackers that night.
CHUNG: All right.
Did you know that your cousin had converted to Islam some time ago?
HOLIDAY: Yes, I did.
CHUNG: Did he still appear to be part of that religion? Did he talk about it?
HOLIDAY: Oh, not much. He was just saying he was always going to be a Williams. He changed his name, but he was always going to be a Williams, because he was proud of his background.
CHUNG: Ed, do you have any idea, if indeed he is charged, convicted, if indeed he is allegedly the killer, that he could possibly do such a thing?
HOLIDAY: Oh, this just doesn't sound like the John I know.
CHUNG: All right, thank you.
HOLIDAY: And it's just a shock to me.
CHUNG: A complete shock.
All right, thank you so much, Ed Holiday, for joining us. We appreciate it.
Susan Candiotti, in Baton Rouge, we also appreciate all your fine reporting and for bringing Ed Holiday to us. Thank you.
CANDIOTTI: Thank you, Connie.
CHUNG: Now, in the mid-1980s, the life of John Allen Muhammad, who was still going by the name John Allen Williams, went through several life-changing events: moving, converting, and then marrying again.
CNN national correspondent Frank Buckley joins us with more on Muhammad's life in Washington state -- Frank.
FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Connie, Muhammad's wife tells us that he converted to Islam in the mid-1980s after his divorce from his first wife.
Then, in 1988, he married again to a second woman, Mildred Green. In the early 1990s, he, serving in the U.S. Army, went to the Gulf War. Then, in 1994, he returned here to Tacoma with Mildred Green and a growing family to begin this phase of his life.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(voice-over): During the mid to late 1990s, John Allen Muhammad and his second wife, Mildred Green, lived in this tiny Tacoma, Washington, home with their three young children. From all outside appearances, it was a typical suburban life, Muhammad the typical dad.
KAY WHITLOCK, MUHAMMAD FAMILY FRIEND: You'd see him out there watching the kids play football and cheering them on and telling them to, "Go get 'em." And when his son would go in the hospital because of his asthma, he was right there.
BUCKLEY (on camera): So he was likable?
WHITLOCK: Yes. John was likable.
BUCKLEY (voice-over): Kay Whitlock knew the family through her grandson, whom she says was a best friend of Muhammad's son. The couple ran a roadside auto repair business in the Tacoma area. Neighbor Bob Bianchi says he'd frequently chat with Muhammad as he worked on his cars.
BOB BIANCHI, FORMER NEIGHBOR: Just another person on the street in the United States.
BUCKLEY: But people in the neighborhood knew John Allen Muhammad as John Williams at first. Kay Whitlock says, at some point, Mrs. Williams began to wear what appeared to her to be traditional Muslim clothes.
WHITLOCK: I know that their names were Williams when they moved in and that, all of a sudden, after a couple of years, it was Muhammad. They had changed it.
BUCKLEY: What also change, according to court documents, was the picture of the happy suburban family that lived in this home. In early 2000, after nearly 12 years of marriage, Mrs. Muhammad filed for a protection order against her husband, claiming she was a victim of his abuse.
In her petition, she said he claimed to have tapped the phones. "He said the information that he had would destroy me. He started threatening me. And I became very unsafe." The order was granted. Soon after that, the marriage was over. And Whitlock claims that John Allen Muhammad then did something that would leave his ex-wife emotionally wounded for months.
WHITLOCK: He came to pick his kids up for his parental-rights type of visits, court-ordered, and never came back with them.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BUCKLEY: Now, authorities eventually did locate the children and did return them to Mrs. Williams, Mrs. Muhammad -- during the marriage, that was her name -- did reunite the mother and the children. And, eventually, the mother, with custody of her children, moved to Maryland -- Connie.
CHUNG: Frank, in your reading of the court documents, did his wife claim that he actually issued death threats against her?
BUCKLEY: In fact, she did claim that there were death threats. They occurred while she was in the hospital recovering from what she felt was an abduction of her children.
During that period, she in fact filed reports that the hospital backed up with its own report in which she claimed that he called, threatened her life while she was hospitalized. She said in the report that she felt that he had the ability and the drive to make good on his threat. She also mentioned the fact that, with his military training, she felt that he could make a weapon out of anything.
CHUNG: That's ominous.
Thank you, Frank Buckley.
And now, we just outlined what we know about his personal life after he moved to Washington state. But now we're going to focus on his professional life. And CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has discovered details of his record of nine years in the Army and relevant information about his training.
How was he trained, Barbara? What information do you have on that?
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, we took a look at his military record today.
And what's the most interesting thing that really leaps out at you, this man who served as an enlisted sergeant for about nine years, with no particular distinction in his service record, was in fact an expert marksman with an M-16 rifle. What we should explain is, every year, Army, both enlisted and officers, have to go through a qualification trial with their M-16s.
And when he did this, by one account, he scored so well, he was awarded the expert badge, that meaning, Connie, that he hit 36 of 40 targets at a range of 50 to 300 meters. Now, Army officials that we talked to today explained to us, this is good shooting, by any account, but it's far from anything that would approach the level of sniper training or special forces training.
And, in looking at his record, he certainly -- there's no evidence that he was ever affiliated with sniper units or special forces units, quite an undistinguished record, except for this marksmanship award.
CHUNG: Barbara, was he honorably or dishonorably discharged?
STARR: Quite interesting. As far as we can determine, he was honorably discharged from his active-duty service.
In fact, in his years in the Army, including that service in the Persian Gulf War, he served as a combat engineer, as a metal worker and as a water transport specialist. Apparently, he drove a water truck -- honorably discharged from that. But what we did learn: Prior to serving in the active-duty military, prior to the mid-'80s, he served in the Louisiana National Guard.
And, in that service, he did receive a summary court-martial. Now, that's a very low level of court martial. But what he was charged and convicted of was failing to obey a legal order, not being at his duty station on time, and, in one case, striking another noncommissioned officer. He was reduced in rank. He served seven days of confinement.
But, apparently, the Army, once they took him on as an enlisted sergeant, they either didn't know about this or, back in the 1980s, it wasn't considered a particularly troubling matter.
CHUNG: All right, CNN's Barbara Starr, thank you.
We're joined now by phone from Montana by an Army veteran, Ron James, who served with Muhammad in Washington. Mr. James, thank you for being with us.
I understand that you knew him as his last name was Williams and not Muhammad. Tell us, how would you describe him? What was he like?
RON JAMES, FORMER ARMY VETERAN: He was outgoing, friendly.
CHUNG: Yes? Anything unusual about him, in your mind?
JAMES: No. He did his job. If he was asked to do something, he did it. Everybody got along with him.
CHUNG: Would you say that he was patriotic or anti-American?
JAMES: He was not anti-American at all, when I knew him. I'm just as shocked as he is -- as his first cousin. I'm stunned.
CHUNG: Did he ever express any anti-law enforcement tendencies?
JAMES: No.
CHUNG: Did you ever witness him training with the M-16 or did you know anything about his marksmanship?
JAMES: Yes, everybody goes through the training with the M-16.
CHUNG: All right.
JAMES: Everybody, from the time you enter boot camp, throughout your time in the military.
CHUNG: Do you remember him as being a good marksman?
JAMES: Yes, I do, because, every year, we have to go on the rifle range.
CHUNG: Was he proud of that?
JAMES: He was glad, like I was, to qualify with the M-16.
CHUNG: Did he ever appear angry to you or upset about anything?
JAMES: No. Like I said, he kept his personal life quite out of it. He did his job. Nobody knew. He joked around with everybody. We went to the clubs after duty hours. He associated with everybody. He was friendly, cordial.
CHUNG: Ron James, if indeed he is the alleged sniper, do you have any idea where this came from?
JAMES: I don't. And as far as I'm concerned, from listening to -- from the interview in Baltimore there...
CHUNG: Yes.
JAMES: ... he's already tried and convicted by you guys and Fox, by the media. He's already tried and convicted.
CHUNG: Sir, I understand what you're saying. I hear you. And it's so difficult, isn't it?
JAMES: Yes, it is.
CHUNG: Yes.
I thank you so much for being with us. Is there anything else you want to tell about your friend?
JAMES: Well, I'd just like to -- my heart goes out to his family and plus to the families of the victims. And John probably feels the same way as I do after the Gulf War and a lot of veterans. We all got shortchanged, in the long run.
CHUNG: All right, Ron James, thank you so much for being with us. We appreciate your thoughts.
And when we come back, we'll take you back to Muhammad's neighborhood. You'll meet some of Muhammad's neighbors and get a glimpse into the background of the young Jamaican man known as John Lee Malvo.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: When we left off with this story, John Allen Muhammad had made a life for himself in Washington state. He served in the Gulf War. He began raising the new children he had had with his second wife, Mildred.
But, at some point -- and the details are really unclear -- a young man from Jamaica named John Lee Malvo entered Muhammad's life. When the story first broke, Malvo was identified as Muhammad's stepson. As CNN has been reporting, that is not the case. But a law enforcement source has told CNN that Muhammad has a relationship with Malvo's mother.
CNN's James Hattori has begun piecing together what do we know about John Lee Malvo.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JAMES HATTORI, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): His arrest early Thursday wasn't the first time John Lee Malvo found himself in custody. When he tried to enroll at Bellingham High School in December of last year, officials there say they had trouble finding his paper trail.
CHIEF RANDY CARROLL, BELLINGHAM POLICE DEPARTMENT: We were unable to determine where he had come from. And we were unable to verify any transcripts or any prior education.
HATTORI (on camera): At about the same time, as CNN's Kelli Arena has learned, police responded to an incident at Malvo's mother's house involving her, Malvo and John Muhammad.
As a result, police began asking questions about the immigration status of Malvo and his mother, Una James. They were found to be in the country illegally. And both were taken into custody by the INS. There, Malvo submitted fingerprints. And it was those fingerprints that matched some of those found at one of the sniper crime scenes.
(voice-over): Jamaican officials tell CNN Malvo was born there, moving to the U.S. when he was 4. The State Department has no record of issuing him a visa. When he was 13, he took karate lessons in Bellingham. The instructor, Felix Strozier, ran the school with John Muhammad. This was in the late 1990s, the first known link between Muhammad and Malvo.
FELIX STROZIER, FORMER CO-WORKER OF MUHAMMAD: We had problems. I could just see he had a temper. He was, most of the time, overaggressive with the smaller kids. And he would try to get overaggressive with me.
HATTORI: Years later, we know that he enrolled successfully at a high school in Fort Myers, Florida. Earlier this year, he and Muhammad were back in Washington at the Lighthouse Mission, a homeless shelter in Bellingham.
MARK ASMUNDSON, MAYOR OF BELLINGHAM: What I can say is that the individuals were of interest to the police while they were here several months ago. We don't have any record of them having been in Bellingham within the last nine months.
HATTORI: And, just three months ago, he paid a visit with Muhammad to Muhammad's first wife in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, where relatives say he was thin and acted afraid of Muhammad. Relatives say Muhammad had Malvo on a strict diet: honey and crackers.
SHEILA TEZANDO, SISTER-IN-LAW OF WILLIAMS: We even went out later that night to get honey and crackers to make sure that they had something to eat.
HATTORI: James Hattori, CNN, Tacoma, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHUNG: We are joined now by some folks in Washington state who knew John Allen Muhammad. And they are Leo and Barbara Dudley in Seattle.
Thank you for being with us.
Leo, let's start with you.
I know that you were not only neighbors, but you were friends, and you coached his son. How would you describe his personality?
LEO DUDLEY, FORMER NEIGHBOR OF MUHAMMAD: Well, when we first met, John was really outgoing. He kind of came by, introduced himself. I had a carpet-cleaning service, Premier Carpet Service (ph).
And he asked me if we could do some bartering, and if I could clean his house, and he'd take care of my cars. And so we kind of did a little bit of business arrangements and stayed in touch with each other for a couple of years.
CHUNG: Did you ever see any guns? Or did he ever go out and target-practice?
L. DUDLEY: No, and that's -- because I went all through his house, even when he wasn't there with his wife and the kids, who were there. And I would clean all his rooms, and never seen any type of firearms at all, no magazines or any of that kind of stuff at all.
CHUNG: Did you ever meet a person named John Malvo?
L. DUDLEY: No, no, not at all. He was there with his wife and three kids, and no John Malvo at all.
CHUNG: Barbara, I know that, when they separated, when John and his wife Mildred separated, she confided in you, didn't she?
BARBARA DUDLEY, FORMER NEIGHBOR OF MUHAMMAD: Yes. She actually came over to our house -- well, not actually when they separated, but when he took the kids. She came over and told me that he took the kids and that she was going to try to stay in the home as long as she could, so that the kids could call her and have a place to know where to call.
CHUNG: And how long a span was it that he had the children and she didn't know where they were?
B. DUDLEY: I was I think about a year-and-a-half, a year-and-a- half.
CHUNG: Oh, my goodness.
And when she finally got the children back, did she come over and talk to you before she left?
B. DUDLEY: No, actually, I received a phone call. She sounded very excited. And she said, "I just wanted to let you know that I have John and the girls back." And she was just very happy.
CHUNG: You mean her son John?
B. DUDLEY: Her son John, yes, John Jr. She had all the kids back. So she was very excited. So wanted to let us know, since she had came and told us, and also that she wanted her son to speak to my son, because they were friends and they played flag football together.
CHUNG: Have you talked to her since then at all?
B. DUDLEY: No. She said after that -- after that conversation, she said that she probably would not be in touch with us again, because she was going to be under some protective custody, or move somewhere, so that she could not be found. She was afraid to tell us any information. She didn't want her husband to find her.
CHUNG: Barbara and Leo, we thank you so much for being with us. Leo and Barbara Dudley, appreciate it.
L. DUDLEY: Thanks.
B. DUDLEY: Thanks.
CHUNG: And still ahead: Things get weird, as Muhammad takes Malvo out of Washington and possibly, police allege, into one of the most chilling criminal rampages in memory.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: With his marriage broken and an ugly custody battle ensuing, John Allen Muhammad took John Lee Malvo on the road. And they began living the life of nomads.
Many details of their movements over the past two years just remain unclear. But we do know, according to the A.P., that Muhammad recently visited an Army buddy several times in Tacoma, showing off at least one type of assault rifle. According to court papers obtained by the A.P., Muhammad told his friend he wanted to outfit one of them with a silencer and said -- quote -- "Can you imagine the damage you could do if you could shoot with a silencer?"
CNN's Kevin Sites has been piecing together what else we know about Muhammad and Malvo's activities in the months leading up to their arrest.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KEVIN SITES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): When did John Muhammad and John Lee Malvo first come here and why did they come to the capitol area at all? According to neighbors, Muhammad had been to Washington once before, working security for the 1995 Million Man March.
But Muhammad also has an ex-wife in the area. Mildred Muhammad moved into her sister's house in Clinton, Maryland shortly after divorcing John in Washington State in October, 2000. Reasons for the divorce in court documents state domestic abuse. But despite the messy divorce, one of Mildred's neighbors in Clinton says he saw Muhammad near her house earlier this year.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I had a brief conversation with him maybe about three months ago. He happened to be standing over here and I commented on the dogs and we just spoke about the dogs and the weather. That's about it. He was regular guy, you know. He said, Hey, how you doing? That's about it. When I saw the picture on TV, I knew I had seen him somewhere.
SITES: But was Muhammad living with his ex-wife or simply trying to be near her? According to public records, his listed address in the Washington area beginning in February, 2001 until July, 2002 is the same as hers, but could he have been there more recently? Another neighbor says he saw what he thought were unmarked police cars around the development, possibly on a stakeout.
VINCENT LAWRENCE, NEIGHBOR OF MUHAMMAD: It was like black, unmarked police car. That's what I thought it was because I was like, he was parked on the opposite side of where everybody park at, so I was like, that was kind of strange for, you know, just a guy that's sitting there in a car.
SITES: Muhammad can be definitively traced to the area during the first week of the sniper shootings. Baltimore police became suspicious after they found him asleep in his car on October 8. They eventually let him go.
And where was Malvo during all this? Possibly in Washington, too, but not continuously. Police say Malvo's fingerprint was pulled from a crime scene where two liquor store employees were shot on September 21, less than two weeks before the sniper shooting began.
(on camera): Investigators are speaking to any and everyone connected to Muhammad and Malvo, including Mildred Muhammad. But, so far, there's no indication from authorities that she knew about Muhammad's possible involvement in the sniper shootings.
Kevin Sites, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHUNG: We've tried to answer many questions tonight, but there are still other intriguing ones.
For example, if indeed they might be guilty, what sparked the rampage? And why did they target the communities they did? What did they want? What was the meaning of the tarot card and the possible reference to a Jamaican band? Prosecutors are preparing formal charges, which may yield some answers. Some we may never know.
And when we come back, a quick word about tomorrow.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: Before we go, we wanted to let you know about one just more story. The FBI today warned police nationwide about a possible attack soon against America's transportation system. Railroads in particular were singled out. The warning was based on information obtained from al Qaeda prisoners, who suggested that terrorists may target bridges, train engines or vital sections of track.
And we'll keep you posted on this story and also the latest on the sniper story as well.
Be sure to join "LARRY KING LIVE." Coming up, he has interviews with relatives of Muhammad; and, also, on "NEWSNIGHT" tonight with Aaron Brown, a special close-up look at how police cracked the case.
We thank you for joining us. Have a good night.
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in Baltimore; Who Are the Two Suspects and Their Motives?>
Aired October 24, 2002 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: This is a special edition of CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT: "The Sniper Suspects."
One man's early days in Baton Rouge, his conversion to Islam, his military training in Washington state. Then: Service in the Gulf War, his two marriages that ended in divorce, and his relationship with a 17-year-old, did it all culminate in a deadly killing spree?
Tonight: Who are John Allen Muhammad and John Lee Malvo?
This is CONNIE CHUNG TONIGHT. Live from the CNN Broadcast Center in New York: Connie Chung.
CONNIE CHUNG, HOST: Good evening.
Tonight: an in-depth look at the lives and the backgrounds of the two men police believe killed 10 people and seriously injured three others in a string of sniper shootings that shocked the nation and terrorized millions of residents in Washington, Maryland, and Virginia, a bloody spree that triggered an unprecedented manhunt by hundreds of local police and more than 1,300 federal law enforcement agents.
The two men are 41-year-old Gulf War veteran John Allen Muhammad and 17-year-old Jamaican citizen John Lee Malvo. They were arrested at 3:19 this morning after a tip that police believe came from one of the shooters led them to a fatal September shooting in Montgomery, Alabama. That shooting yielded a fingerprint police said came from John Lee Malvo.
And that led to last night's search of the Tacoma, Washington, home that Malvo shared with John Allen Muhammad and the search for their car, a blue 1990 Chevrolet Caprice. After a motorist spotted them at a rest step in Myersville, Maryland, about 50 miles north of D.C., police arrested them and found a Bushmaster .223 rifle in the car, along with a scope and a stand. Police said ballistics test show the rifle is the murder weapon. The car had been outfitted to accommodate a rifle stand in the back.
Tonight, the two appeared in federal court in Baltimore. Muhammad was advised of his rights and told of federal weapons charges against him, charges not connected to the shootings. Malvo's hearing was closed because he's a juvenile. Prosecutors tomorrow will discuss how to charge Muhammad and Malvo for the sniper killings. But their possible motives for the killings remain absolutely unclear. And what was behind the cryptic notes, the strange references, a folk tale in which a duck is caught in a noose, a Jamaican band called Five Stars, the death card from a tarot deck?
Tonight, we're going to take you step by step through the details which are still emerging of the lives of John Allen Muhammad and John Lee Malvo. We're going to start with the early years, when Muhammad lived in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. Then, we'll examine several turning points in Muhammad's life, including his conversion to Islam, his first divorce, and his move to Washington for his career in the Army.
From there, we'll move on to his life with John Lee Malvo, who lived with Muhammad in Tacoma, Washington. And then we'll focus on their time in Maryland, when police say the two began a bloody chain of random, ruthless killings.
We're going to start by taking you to Baton Rouge, Louisiana, where CNN's Susan Candiotti will bring us an exclusive interview, for the first time on national television, with one of Muhammad's family members. And she's been piecing together what little is known about his early years -- Susan.
SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Connie.
Yes, John grew up in this area in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and spent many, many years here. His mother died when he was very young. And according to family members, John was taken in by other aunts, who helped raise him. Evidently, his father wasn't in the picture very much as he was growing up.
But John eventually went to high school and did graduate in 1978, did pretty well there, especially in the athletic department, played tennis and played track. And his relatives will tell you more about that in a little while. And then he met his wife through one of his brothers. They had a very brief courtship. And then they married.
And they were married for more than 15 years. Evidently, according to family members, he not only had a son with his wife, but also had another son out of wedlock. That son still lives in this area and is in his 20s and is working. Evidently, when he learned the news about his father from a friend today, we were told that he was extremely upset and was in denial about this.
He did visit this area less than three months ago and a couple of times before that in this past year, including this past summer.
Joining us now: one of the people who saw him last, as recently as August. And that is his first cousin, who knew him well growing up. His name is Ed Holiday.
Ed, first of all, of course, you told us that you had last seen him in August, and, when you heard the news this morning, this just did not fit the picture of the John you knew growing up. Why is that? ED HOLIDAY, COUSIN OF JOHN ALLEN MUHAMMAD: Because he was just a real kind, nice guy. He was always the one that would keep the other kids out of trouble. He was always clean-cut John.
CANDIOTTI: What did you think when you heard about the arrest?
HOLIDAY: Oh, I was shocked about it, because he was always talking about taking care of himself, taking care of his kids. And he wanted us to grow up, take care of our kids also.
CANDIOTTI: Tell us about that visit with him last August.
HOLIDAY: Oh, we just -- he introduced his son to me. And we just talked about old times.
CANDIOTTI: And by his son, you mean the teenager Malvo?
HOLIDAY: Right. Right.
CANDIOTTI: Mr. Malvo.
HOLIDAY: Exactly.
CANDIOTTI: And he introduced him as his son?
HOLIDAY: Right.
CANDIOTTI: What did you know of him?
HOLIDAY: That was my first time seeing him. I just always wanted to meet his kids. And I was glad to meet him.
CANDIOTTI: And just before that, you had also visited with him a few months before that, didn't you?
HOLIDAY: Yes, about six months, probably.
CANDIOTTI: About six months before that.
Tell us about the difference between when you saw him then and when you saw him in August. How did he appear to you six months ago -- physically?
HOLIDAY: He was just working out and just real tired. He said he just came from the Y.
CANDIOTTI: What was your understanding about what he did for a living?
HOLIDAY: Well, I just thought he was in the military, still in the military.
CANDIOTTI: And doing well, owned homes?
HOLIDAY: Right. Right. CANDIOTTI: And then he looked very clean-cut. So when you saw him most recently in August, he looked a lot different, you told me. How did he look?
HOLIDAY: He had just come from working out. And he was just tired.
CANDIOTTI: I know Connie has some questions for you, too, about that visit and maybe what you might have discussed about what he was doing, what he was up to, and how he had even offered to, what, sleep in a bus station while he was visiting then?
HOLIDAY: Right.
CANDIOTTI: Can you tell Connie about that?
HOLIDAY: Well, he just wanted me to take him to the bus station. And I told him he could sleep in my home tonight.
(CROSSTALK)
CHUNG: And he did sleep if your home, Ed? He did end up sleeping in your home?
HOLIDAY: Yes, right.
CHUNG: Ed, when you saw him this last time in August, did he express any anger? Was he upset about anything?
HOLIDAY: Not to me at all.
CHUNG: Did he express to you any anti-American feelings or anti- law enforcement feelings?
HOLIDAY: Oh, not to me, not at all.
CHUNG: I understand that you talked about the possibility of war with Iraq. Did he say whether or not he thought that -- he had served in the military, certainly -- whether or not that was something that he supported?
HOLIDAY: I just asked him his opinion on it. And he wasn't really one way or the other about it.
CANDIOTTI: He wasn't really in favor of going to war?
HOLIDAY: Yes, probably like a lot of people. Right.
CHUNG: Do you know if he possessed a gun this last time that you saw him?
HOLIDAY: No, I didn't see a gun.
CHUNG: Did you know that he was proficient with guns, that he was a marksman?
HOLIDAY: No.
CHUNG: No?
HOLIDAY: No, I didn't know anything about a gun. And he never -- we never talked about guns.
CHUNG: How would you describe this young man who was with him, John Malvo?
HOLIDAY: Well, he just seemed like he was well-mannered. That's basically it. I just saw him once.
CANDIOTTI: What's a little unusual -- if I may jump in for a moment -- I know, is that a niece of his, or a relation, had talked about that she had met the young man also, Mr. Malvo, the teenager, and that, afterwards, he wrote her a note.
And in it, according to relatives of this young lady, she said that he sounded depressed, that he didn't really care for his life on the road, moving around so much. Did you have any indication of that, because, evidently, John was moving around a bit, or at least this young man was?
HOLIDAY: No, I didn't get that impression, though. I didn't get that impression at all. They seemed like a happy father and son.
CHUNG: Did you know that, apparently, the young man is not your cousin's biological son? Did they talk at all about their relationship?
HOLIDAY: No, they didn't. They just talked about going back home.
CHUNG: You know, another former relative said that, when she met John Malvo, that he was only allowed to eat crackers and honey and that he wasn't allowed to eat a regular diet. Did you happen to have a meal with the two of them?
HOLIDAY: Yes, we bought some -- I bought some fish and some other things. So he had more than crackers that night.
CHUNG: All right.
Did you know that your cousin had converted to Islam some time ago?
HOLIDAY: Yes, I did.
CHUNG: Did he still appear to be part of that religion? Did he talk about it?
HOLIDAY: Oh, not much. He was just saying he was always going to be a Williams. He changed his name, but he was always going to be a Williams, because he was proud of his background.
CHUNG: Ed, do you have any idea, if indeed he is charged, convicted, if indeed he is allegedly the killer, that he could possibly do such a thing?
HOLIDAY: Oh, this just doesn't sound like the John I know.
CHUNG: All right, thank you.
HOLIDAY: And it's just a shock to me.
CHUNG: A complete shock.
All right, thank you so much, Ed Holiday, for joining us. We appreciate it.
Susan Candiotti, in Baton Rouge, we also appreciate all your fine reporting and for bringing Ed Holiday to us. Thank you.
CANDIOTTI: Thank you, Connie.
CHUNG: Now, in the mid-1980s, the life of John Allen Muhammad, who was still going by the name John Allen Williams, went through several life-changing events: moving, converting, and then marrying again.
CNN national correspondent Frank Buckley joins us with more on Muhammad's life in Washington state -- Frank.
FRANK BUCKLEY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Connie, Muhammad's wife tells us that he converted to Islam in the mid-1980s after his divorce from his first wife.
Then, in 1988, he married again to a second woman, Mildred Green. In the early 1990s, he, serving in the U.S. Army, went to the Gulf War. Then, in 1994, he returned here to Tacoma with Mildred Green and a growing family to begin this phase of his life.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(voice-over): During the mid to late 1990s, John Allen Muhammad and his second wife, Mildred Green, lived in this tiny Tacoma, Washington, home with their three young children. From all outside appearances, it was a typical suburban life, Muhammad the typical dad.
KAY WHITLOCK, MUHAMMAD FAMILY FRIEND: You'd see him out there watching the kids play football and cheering them on and telling them to, "Go get 'em." And when his son would go in the hospital because of his asthma, he was right there.
BUCKLEY (on camera): So he was likable?
WHITLOCK: Yes. John was likable.
BUCKLEY (voice-over): Kay Whitlock knew the family through her grandson, whom she says was a best friend of Muhammad's son. The couple ran a roadside auto repair business in the Tacoma area. Neighbor Bob Bianchi says he'd frequently chat with Muhammad as he worked on his cars.
BOB BIANCHI, FORMER NEIGHBOR: Just another person on the street in the United States.
BUCKLEY: But people in the neighborhood knew John Allen Muhammad as John Williams at first. Kay Whitlock says, at some point, Mrs. Williams began to wear what appeared to her to be traditional Muslim clothes.
WHITLOCK: I know that their names were Williams when they moved in and that, all of a sudden, after a couple of years, it was Muhammad. They had changed it.
BUCKLEY: What also change, according to court documents, was the picture of the happy suburban family that lived in this home. In early 2000, after nearly 12 years of marriage, Mrs. Muhammad filed for a protection order against her husband, claiming she was a victim of his abuse.
In her petition, she said he claimed to have tapped the phones. "He said the information that he had would destroy me. He started threatening me. And I became very unsafe." The order was granted. Soon after that, the marriage was over. And Whitlock claims that John Allen Muhammad then did something that would leave his ex-wife emotionally wounded for months.
WHITLOCK: He came to pick his kids up for his parental-rights type of visits, court-ordered, and never came back with them.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BUCKLEY: Now, authorities eventually did locate the children and did return them to Mrs. Williams, Mrs. Muhammad -- during the marriage, that was her name -- did reunite the mother and the children. And, eventually, the mother, with custody of her children, moved to Maryland -- Connie.
CHUNG: Frank, in your reading of the court documents, did his wife claim that he actually issued death threats against her?
BUCKLEY: In fact, she did claim that there were death threats. They occurred while she was in the hospital recovering from what she felt was an abduction of her children.
During that period, she in fact filed reports that the hospital backed up with its own report in which she claimed that he called, threatened her life while she was hospitalized. She said in the report that she felt that he had the ability and the drive to make good on his threat. She also mentioned the fact that, with his military training, she felt that he could make a weapon out of anything.
CHUNG: That's ominous.
Thank you, Frank Buckley.
And now, we just outlined what we know about his personal life after he moved to Washington state. But now we're going to focus on his professional life. And CNN Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has discovered details of his record of nine years in the Army and relevant information about his training.
How was he trained, Barbara? What information do you have on that?
BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, we took a look at his military record today.
And what's the most interesting thing that really leaps out at you, this man who served as an enlisted sergeant for about nine years, with no particular distinction in his service record, was in fact an expert marksman with an M-16 rifle. What we should explain is, every year, Army, both enlisted and officers, have to go through a qualification trial with their M-16s.
And when he did this, by one account, he scored so well, he was awarded the expert badge, that meaning, Connie, that he hit 36 of 40 targets at a range of 50 to 300 meters. Now, Army officials that we talked to today explained to us, this is good shooting, by any account, but it's far from anything that would approach the level of sniper training or special forces training.
And, in looking at his record, he certainly -- there's no evidence that he was ever affiliated with sniper units or special forces units, quite an undistinguished record, except for this marksmanship award.
CHUNG: Barbara, was he honorably or dishonorably discharged?
STARR: Quite interesting. As far as we can determine, he was honorably discharged from his active-duty service.
In fact, in his years in the Army, including that service in the Persian Gulf War, he served as a combat engineer, as a metal worker and as a water transport specialist. Apparently, he drove a water truck -- honorably discharged from that. But what we did learn: Prior to serving in the active-duty military, prior to the mid-'80s, he served in the Louisiana National Guard.
And, in that service, he did receive a summary court-martial. Now, that's a very low level of court martial. But what he was charged and convicted of was failing to obey a legal order, not being at his duty station on time, and, in one case, striking another noncommissioned officer. He was reduced in rank. He served seven days of confinement.
But, apparently, the Army, once they took him on as an enlisted sergeant, they either didn't know about this or, back in the 1980s, it wasn't considered a particularly troubling matter.
CHUNG: All right, CNN's Barbara Starr, thank you.
We're joined now by phone from Montana by an Army veteran, Ron James, who served with Muhammad in Washington. Mr. James, thank you for being with us.
I understand that you knew him as his last name was Williams and not Muhammad. Tell us, how would you describe him? What was he like?
RON JAMES, FORMER ARMY VETERAN: He was outgoing, friendly.
CHUNG: Yes? Anything unusual about him, in your mind?
JAMES: No. He did his job. If he was asked to do something, he did it. Everybody got along with him.
CHUNG: Would you say that he was patriotic or anti-American?
JAMES: He was not anti-American at all, when I knew him. I'm just as shocked as he is -- as his first cousin. I'm stunned.
CHUNG: Did he ever express any anti-law enforcement tendencies?
JAMES: No.
CHUNG: Did you ever witness him training with the M-16 or did you know anything about his marksmanship?
JAMES: Yes, everybody goes through the training with the M-16.
CHUNG: All right.
JAMES: Everybody, from the time you enter boot camp, throughout your time in the military.
CHUNG: Do you remember him as being a good marksman?
JAMES: Yes, I do, because, every year, we have to go on the rifle range.
CHUNG: Was he proud of that?
JAMES: He was glad, like I was, to qualify with the M-16.
CHUNG: Did he ever appear angry to you or upset about anything?
JAMES: No. Like I said, he kept his personal life quite out of it. He did his job. Nobody knew. He joked around with everybody. We went to the clubs after duty hours. He associated with everybody. He was friendly, cordial.
CHUNG: Ron James, if indeed he is the alleged sniper, do you have any idea where this came from?
JAMES: I don't. And as far as I'm concerned, from listening to -- from the interview in Baltimore there...
CHUNG: Yes.
JAMES: ... he's already tried and convicted by you guys and Fox, by the media. He's already tried and convicted.
CHUNG: Sir, I understand what you're saying. I hear you. And it's so difficult, isn't it?
JAMES: Yes, it is.
CHUNG: Yes.
I thank you so much for being with us. Is there anything else you want to tell about your friend?
JAMES: Well, I'd just like to -- my heart goes out to his family and plus to the families of the victims. And John probably feels the same way as I do after the Gulf War and a lot of veterans. We all got shortchanged, in the long run.
CHUNG: All right, Ron James, thank you so much for being with us. We appreciate your thoughts.
And when we come back, we'll take you back to Muhammad's neighborhood. You'll meet some of Muhammad's neighbors and get a glimpse into the background of the young Jamaican man known as John Lee Malvo.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: When we left off with this story, John Allen Muhammad had made a life for himself in Washington state. He served in the Gulf War. He began raising the new children he had had with his second wife, Mildred.
But, at some point -- and the details are really unclear -- a young man from Jamaica named John Lee Malvo entered Muhammad's life. When the story first broke, Malvo was identified as Muhammad's stepson. As CNN has been reporting, that is not the case. But a law enforcement source has told CNN that Muhammad has a relationship with Malvo's mother.
CNN's James Hattori has begun piecing together what do we know about John Lee Malvo.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JAMES HATTORI, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): His arrest early Thursday wasn't the first time John Lee Malvo found himself in custody. When he tried to enroll at Bellingham High School in December of last year, officials there say they had trouble finding his paper trail.
CHIEF RANDY CARROLL, BELLINGHAM POLICE DEPARTMENT: We were unable to determine where he had come from. And we were unable to verify any transcripts or any prior education.
HATTORI (on camera): At about the same time, as CNN's Kelli Arena has learned, police responded to an incident at Malvo's mother's house involving her, Malvo and John Muhammad.
As a result, police began asking questions about the immigration status of Malvo and his mother, Una James. They were found to be in the country illegally. And both were taken into custody by the INS. There, Malvo submitted fingerprints. And it was those fingerprints that matched some of those found at one of the sniper crime scenes.
(voice-over): Jamaican officials tell CNN Malvo was born there, moving to the U.S. when he was 4. The State Department has no record of issuing him a visa. When he was 13, he took karate lessons in Bellingham. The instructor, Felix Strozier, ran the school with John Muhammad. This was in the late 1990s, the first known link between Muhammad and Malvo.
FELIX STROZIER, FORMER CO-WORKER OF MUHAMMAD: We had problems. I could just see he had a temper. He was, most of the time, overaggressive with the smaller kids. And he would try to get overaggressive with me.
HATTORI: Years later, we know that he enrolled successfully at a high school in Fort Myers, Florida. Earlier this year, he and Muhammad were back in Washington at the Lighthouse Mission, a homeless shelter in Bellingham.
MARK ASMUNDSON, MAYOR OF BELLINGHAM: What I can say is that the individuals were of interest to the police while they were here several months ago. We don't have any record of them having been in Bellingham within the last nine months.
HATTORI: And, just three months ago, he paid a visit with Muhammad to Muhammad's first wife in Baton Rouge, Louisiana, where relatives say he was thin and acted afraid of Muhammad. Relatives say Muhammad had Malvo on a strict diet: honey and crackers.
SHEILA TEZANDO, SISTER-IN-LAW OF WILLIAMS: We even went out later that night to get honey and crackers to make sure that they had something to eat.
HATTORI: James Hattori, CNN, Tacoma, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHUNG: We are joined now by some folks in Washington state who knew John Allen Muhammad. And they are Leo and Barbara Dudley in Seattle.
Thank you for being with us.
Leo, let's start with you.
I know that you were not only neighbors, but you were friends, and you coached his son. How would you describe his personality?
LEO DUDLEY, FORMER NEIGHBOR OF MUHAMMAD: Well, when we first met, John was really outgoing. He kind of came by, introduced himself. I had a carpet-cleaning service, Premier Carpet Service (ph).
And he asked me if we could do some bartering, and if I could clean his house, and he'd take care of my cars. And so we kind of did a little bit of business arrangements and stayed in touch with each other for a couple of years.
CHUNG: Did you ever see any guns? Or did he ever go out and target-practice?
L. DUDLEY: No, and that's -- because I went all through his house, even when he wasn't there with his wife and the kids, who were there. And I would clean all his rooms, and never seen any type of firearms at all, no magazines or any of that kind of stuff at all.
CHUNG: Did you ever meet a person named John Malvo?
L. DUDLEY: No, no, not at all. He was there with his wife and three kids, and no John Malvo at all.
CHUNG: Barbara, I know that, when they separated, when John and his wife Mildred separated, she confided in you, didn't she?
BARBARA DUDLEY, FORMER NEIGHBOR OF MUHAMMAD: Yes. She actually came over to our house -- well, not actually when they separated, but when he took the kids. She came over and told me that he took the kids and that she was going to try to stay in the home as long as she could, so that the kids could call her and have a place to know where to call.
CHUNG: And how long a span was it that he had the children and she didn't know where they were?
B. DUDLEY: I was I think about a year-and-a-half, a year-and-a- half.
CHUNG: Oh, my goodness.
And when she finally got the children back, did she come over and talk to you before she left?
B. DUDLEY: No, actually, I received a phone call. She sounded very excited. And she said, "I just wanted to let you know that I have John and the girls back." And she was just very happy.
CHUNG: You mean her son John?
B. DUDLEY: Her son John, yes, John Jr. She had all the kids back. So she was very excited. So wanted to let us know, since she had came and told us, and also that she wanted her son to speak to my son, because they were friends and they played flag football together.
CHUNG: Have you talked to her since then at all?
B. DUDLEY: No. She said after that -- after that conversation, she said that she probably would not be in touch with us again, because she was going to be under some protective custody, or move somewhere, so that she could not be found. She was afraid to tell us any information. She didn't want her husband to find her.
CHUNG: Barbara and Leo, we thank you so much for being with us. Leo and Barbara Dudley, appreciate it.
L. DUDLEY: Thanks.
B. DUDLEY: Thanks.
CHUNG: And still ahead: Things get weird, as Muhammad takes Malvo out of Washington and possibly, police allege, into one of the most chilling criminal rampages in memory.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: With his marriage broken and an ugly custody battle ensuing, John Allen Muhammad took John Lee Malvo on the road. And they began living the life of nomads.
Many details of their movements over the past two years just remain unclear. But we do know, according to the A.P., that Muhammad recently visited an Army buddy several times in Tacoma, showing off at least one type of assault rifle. According to court papers obtained by the A.P., Muhammad told his friend he wanted to outfit one of them with a silencer and said -- quote -- "Can you imagine the damage you could do if you could shoot with a silencer?"
CNN's Kevin Sites has been piecing together what else we know about Muhammad and Malvo's activities in the months leading up to their arrest.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
KEVIN SITES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): When did John Muhammad and John Lee Malvo first come here and why did they come to the capitol area at all? According to neighbors, Muhammad had been to Washington once before, working security for the 1995 Million Man March.
But Muhammad also has an ex-wife in the area. Mildred Muhammad moved into her sister's house in Clinton, Maryland shortly after divorcing John in Washington State in October, 2000. Reasons for the divorce in court documents state domestic abuse. But despite the messy divorce, one of Mildred's neighbors in Clinton says he saw Muhammad near her house earlier this year.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I had a brief conversation with him maybe about three months ago. He happened to be standing over here and I commented on the dogs and we just spoke about the dogs and the weather. That's about it. He was regular guy, you know. He said, Hey, how you doing? That's about it. When I saw the picture on TV, I knew I had seen him somewhere.
SITES: But was Muhammad living with his ex-wife or simply trying to be near her? According to public records, his listed address in the Washington area beginning in February, 2001 until July, 2002 is the same as hers, but could he have been there more recently? Another neighbor says he saw what he thought were unmarked police cars around the development, possibly on a stakeout.
VINCENT LAWRENCE, NEIGHBOR OF MUHAMMAD: It was like black, unmarked police car. That's what I thought it was because I was like, he was parked on the opposite side of where everybody park at, so I was like, that was kind of strange for, you know, just a guy that's sitting there in a car.
SITES: Muhammad can be definitively traced to the area during the first week of the sniper shootings. Baltimore police became suspicious after they found him asleep in his car on October 8. They eventually let him go.
And where was Malvo during all this? Possibly in Washington, too, but not continuously. Police say Malvo's fingerprint was pulled from a crime scene where two liquor store employees were shot on September 21, less than two weeks before the sniper shooting began.
(on camera): Investigators are speaking to any and everyone connected to Muhammad and Malvo, including Mildred Muhammad. But, so far, there's no indication from authorities that she knew about Muhammad's possible involvement in the sniper shootings.
Kevin Sites, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHUNG: We've tried to answer many questions tonight, but there are still other intriguing ones.
For example, if indeed they might be guilty, what sparked the rampage? And why did they target the communities they did? What did they want? What was the meaning of the tarot card and the possible reference to a Jamaican band? Prosecutors are preparing formal charges, which may yield some answers. Some we may never know.
And when we come back, a quick word about tomorrow.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHUNG: Before we go, we wanted to let you know about one just more story. The FBI today warned police nationwide about a possible attack soon against America's transportation system. Railroads in particular were singled out. The warning was based on information obtained from al Qaeda prisoners, who suggested that terrorists may target bridges, train engines or vital sections of track.
And we'll keep you posted on this story and also the latest on the sniper story as well.
Be sure to join "LARRY KING LIVE." Coming up, he has interviews with relatives of Muhammad; and, also, on "NEWSNIGHT" tonight with Aaron Brown, a special close-up look at how police cracked the case.
We thank you for joining us. Have a good night.
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in Baltimore; Who Are the Two Suspects and Their Motives?>
