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CNN Crossfire
Politics of Iraq
Aired April 30, 2004 - 16:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CROSSFIRE. On the left, James Carville and Paul Begala; on the right, Robert Novak and Tucker Carlson.
In the CROSSFIRE: the politics of Iraq.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Major combat operations in Iraq have ended.
ANNOUNCER: A year ago, the message was, mission accomplished. Did the president speak too soon?
For John Kerry, it's an anniversary and an opportunity as he lays out his vision for Iraq.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go!
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: America must lead a broad coalition against our adversaries.
ANNOUNCER: But does he really have a plan?
Today on CROSSFIRE.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the George Washington University, Paul Begala and Robert Novak.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST: Welcome to CROSSFIRE.
President Bush is standing by his speech a year ago. Remember, he took down Saddam Hussein's regime. That mission was accomplished. President Bush said there would be hard going ahead. He never said it would be easy. That's a Democratic myth.
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST: Well, actually, President Bush and Vice President Cheney did say it would be easy. Mr. Cheney said that we would be greeted as liberators in Iraq. Judging by the scenes from Fallujah, they have a funny way of greeting liberators over there.
Today's debate, Iraq, one year later, is the mission accomplished?
But first, we begin with the best little political briefing in television, our CROSSFIRE "Political Alert."
Before the 9/11 Commission yesterday, President Bush said he thought warnings of an al Qaeda attack were for targets overseas, not inside the U.S. But Mr. Bush and his government were warned of an attack inside the U.S. by the Hart-Rudman commission and the Gilmore commission and by the Clinton administration and by the CIA, whose memo to Mr. Bush screamed -- quote -- "Bin Laden determined to attack inside the United States" -- unquote.
And now we learn that six months before 9/11, Paul Bremer of all people said of Mr. Bush -- quote -- "The new administration seems to be paying no attention to the problem of terrorism. What they will do is stagger along until there's a major incident." Bremer noted that the Clinton administration had given Mr. Bush -- quote -- "a window of opportunity with very little terrorism now and they're not taking advantage of it."
NOVAK: Paul, if the Bush administration was asleep at the switch, so was the Clinton administration. I looked at Mr. Bremer's speech. I looked in the news reports. And, oh, buddy, you're making it up. He never said the Clinton administration had done well. There is not one word of praise in there for the Clinton administration. And if you can find that, I'll eat it.
BEGALA: Well, you eat it, because he said Bush has been given a window of opportunity. Who gave it to him, Santa Claus?
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Bill Clinton protected this country for eight years from al Qaeda.
(BELL RINGING)
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: And he told President Bush that that should be his No. 1
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: And Bush didn't listen him. And Bush didn't protect us.
NOVAK: Never said anything about the Clinton administration. The word Clinton isn't in there.
The joint appearance by President Bush and Vice President Cheney before the 9/11 Commission was deemed an historic occasion. Yet, two Democrats on the commission couldn't even sit through the three hours behind closed doors. The vice chairman, former Congressman Lee Hamilton of Indiana, raced out to introduce a speech by -- for the prime minister of Canada.
Another commissioner, former Senator Bob Kerrey of Nebraska, left to keep an appointment with Republican Senator Pete Domenici to discuss the New University in New York City, an institution that happens to be headed by Bob Kerrey. Want to bet that commissioners Hamilton and Kerrey both would have stuck around if the session was on live television?
BEGALA: Maybe it should have been on live television, then. Why not hold the president publicly accountable?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: You make a very good point, though. You are right. You are right that there's no more important work for those commissioners than being there. And it was wrong for them to leave. I love Bob Kerrey. I admire Lee Hamilton, don't know him well. They've done a great service for our country, but for that hour, they should have been there. Nothing was more important and I agree with you on that.
NOVAK: I'm glad we can agree on anything. And I think I would remember, too, that, when they interviewed Bill Clinton and Al Gore, that was behind closed doors also.
BEGALA: All of it should be public. All of it should be under oath, including President Clinton, Vice President Gore, everybody. Swear them under oath. Put them on TV. Let the American people know what really happened.
(BELL RINGING)
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Well, I know where I'm going to be tonight at 11:30 Eastern. I'll be watching "Nightline."
Journalistic giant Ted Koppel is going to devote his entire program tonight to reading the names and displaying the photos of each of the more than 700 American heroes who have died in Mr. Bush's war in Iraq. But the Sinclair Broadcast Group plans to censor Mr. Koppel's tribute, refusing to air it on its stations.
Now, whether you oppose the war or support it, I believe all Americans have a patriotic duty to honor and acknowledge the sacrifices of the men and women who gave their lives for our country. Unlike his father and other recent predecessors, President Bush refuses to attend memorial services to publicly recognize our war dead. Photos of flag-draped coffins have been banned. And now "Nightline" is being censored.
Apparently, for some on the right, patriotism is something to be preached, but not practiced.
(APPLAUSE)
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST: You know, Paul, I don't know where I'm going to be at 11:30, but I'm not going to be watching that program. It's not news. It's not a documentary. It's not -- it doesn't tell you anything you didn't know.
What it is, is -- there's only one thing left. It's propaganda. Is it propaganda for the war? Certainly not. It's anti-war propaganda. (APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: And although I have a great respect for Ted Koppel, it shouldn't be on the air.
BEGALA: You know what it is? It's the truth.
(BELL RINGING)
BEGALA: And it is news when 700 Americans are killed and they're ignored by our president.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: Faithful readers -- faithful readers of "The New York Times" this week learned that Senator John Kerry is the first presidential candidate to travel around with his own butler.
Oh, Marvin Nicholson Jr. is listed as chief of stuff, but what he does is wake the senator in the morning, deliver his daily newspapers, help select his neckties, dial his telephone calls, carry his big briefcase, keep an uncapped bottle at the ready, and extract from the huge bag he carries whole wheat bread and strawberry jelly to make him frequent peanut butter and jelly sandwiches.
Am I envious? You bet. How nice would it be to have a butler at CROSSFIRE to fetch bowls of popcorn for me.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: Thank you. Thank you very much.
BEGALA: Bob, you're a legendary reporter, but I hate to correct you, my friend. Izzy Hernandez, a great guy, was a young aide, did the exact same things for then Governor Bush in the 2000 election. He made him his peanut butter sandwiches. Every major presidential candidate has that. And Izzy was a favorite of the press corps. And apparently so is this guy who travels with Kerry.
NOVAK: Is President Clinton -- President Clinton, he carried an intern around with him, didn't he?
(LAUGHTER)
(BELL RINGING)
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Well, it's a little easier. Of course, the guy who traveled with Bush doesn't have to carry any heavy books, at least, so that's good.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: A year ago, our president stood under a banner declaring mission accomplished. Today, no one makes that argument with a straight face. Up next, we'll debate the debacle in the desert and what our next president should do about it.
Later, we'll tell you about a new talk show that may be in the works. It's a real scream.
(APPLAUSE)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD DEAN (D), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And then we're going to Washington, D.C., to take back the White House. Yes!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Join Carville, Begala, Carlson and Novak in the CROSSFIRE. For free tickets to CROSSFIRE at the George Washington University, call 202-994-8CNN or visit our Web site. Now you can step into the CROSSFIRE.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: It is the eve of the anniversary of President Bush's declaration of an end to major fighting in Iraq. And while Americans are dying in combat, Democrats want to make the most of the speech made by the president a year ago.
In its shadow, his critics, including John Kerry, hammer away at the cost of pursuing democracy around the world.
In the CROSSFIRE today, Representative Chris Van Hollen of Maryland, Democrat, and Ken Adelman, former director of the U.S. Arms Control and Disarmament Agency. He's now a member of Defense Secretary Rumsfeld's Policy Board.
BEGALA: Thank you both very much.
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Ken, as you know, today is April 30, celebrated around the world as my brother Dave's birthday.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: But tomorrow, May 1, is the first anniversary of our president going on the USS Abraham Lincoln. Here is a part of what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) BUSH: Major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEGALA: Now, Ken, as an expert on military affairs, major combat operations plainly are not over. And isn't the president's wrong conclusion that they were one of the reasons that we're only now sending the proper armor over there to reinforce our troops?
KEN ADELMAN, FORMER DIRECTOR, U.S. ARMS CONTROL & DISARMAMENT AGENCY: First of all, the major combat operations against Saddam Hussein and the army there to liberate the country from Saddam are...
BEGALA: That's not what he said.
ADELMAN: All right. It was a shorthand for something like that. That was incomplete. And it has gone worse than we expected a year ago. That is true.
BEGALA: But isn't that way there are not only just political ramifications of him having bad judgment? There are military implications. Just now, finally, our troops are getting the heavy armor that they need. They still don't have the body armor they need. But we're shipping as many tanks, Humvees and Strykers over there that we can. They should have been there from day one, but for our president's miscalculation, right?
ADELMAN: Well, the miscalculation was not just the president. The miscalculation was the military to look at that, because we did not expect a lot of this opposition, at least the ferocity of a year.
But, you know, Saddam Hussein had a long time to prepare for something like that. His guys do not want a success of a decent democracy in the Middle East. And the fact is, this is where the war of terror is now being fought.
NOVAK: Congressman...
ADELMAN: And so to lose that would be disastrous.
NOVAK: Congressman Van Hollen, I'm going to give you a little test to see if you're as big a demagogue as Paul is. And I want to show you another bit of the president's speech on the carrier. Let's listen to it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: And we have difficult work to do in Iraq. We are bringing order to parts of that country that remain dangerous. The transition from dictatorship to democracy will take time, but it is worth every effort.
(END VIDEO CLIP) NOVAK: Now, to me, he was saying they had finished the war against the army. We had dangerous stuff to do. Can't -- don't you think it's time for the Democrats to leave that alone and go on to serious debate?
REP. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D), MARYLAND: Well, I think we have a serious debate about what the next step should be.
But I think it's important to go back and see what the president had to say because it was premature and I think misleading to have a big banner on the aircraft carrier saying mission accomplished, because that created the perception in lots of Americans' minds that this was really behind us now. And the fact of the matter is that we've had, as you know, many more Americans killed and wounded since the president made that declaration.
I think from the beginning, the president has not done a good job leveling with the American people about what this is going to entail.
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: Congressman, in all due respect, you're flunked the demagogue test. You're as big a demagogue as Paul is.
VAN HOLLEN: Well, if demagoguery is truth-telling, then I guess we're both
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: I just want to ask you, maybe I'm -- I don't know if the president painted that mission accomplished sign. I understand the president stayed up all that night -- that night -- the night before painting.
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: And then flew in on the jet on the aircraft carrier.
NOVAK: I just want to ask you, do you think I made that quote up? Do you think I spliced that from a current speech? Do you think that was a deception?
VAN HOLLEN: This has been a continuing issue before the war and since the end of the war.
Before the war, the president made lots of statements that made it sound like this would be quick and easy, it would be done with. And since the war, they have made a number of statements suggesting it was going to be over quickly. Even today, the president has not submitted the budget that people on the ground say we need to provide for the military men and women there right now.
He is saying we're going to wait until January to come up with a budget for current operations. And $50 billion is expected to be needed. So he continues to try to create the impression that we're going to -- we're not going to have to confront the difficult choices. And I think that's created lots of trouble going forward.
ADELMAN: I think that's a bit of -- with all due respect, a bit of bum rap. I think the president has always said, this -- the war on terror is going to be tough. It's going to be long. It's going to be difficult. It's going to be costly. So buckle up.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Here's what he did say.
ADELMAN: And I think he was pretty honest on that. I really do.
BEGALA: Well, you said a moment ago that he perhaps misjudged...
ADELMAN: Oh, yes, we all misjudged it.
BEGALA: The insurrection and the opposition.
ADELMAN: Right.
BEGALA: As it became clear on July the 3rd, for example, our president made this comment. Here's the president coming on the rising insurrection in Iraq.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: There are some who feel like that, you know, the conditions are such that they can attack us there. My answer is, bring 'em on.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEGALA: Now, that's an outrage, isn't it, that the president of the United States, who is the commander in chief of armed forces, would say that.
ADELMAN: It was a mistake. Yes, it was a mistake.
BEGALA: Why hasn't he admitted that?
ADELMAN: Well...
NOVAK: Congressman, I want to ask you. Your candidate, Senator Kerry, made a speech on Iraq. I listened very carefully trying to figure out something that he was going to do differently from President Bush. I really tried to get that, because, you know, we're in the midst of a campaign.
(CROSSTALK)
ADELMAN: Bush has been very consistent. Kerry has been all over the map, all over the map.
NOVAK: Listen to what the new
(CROSSTALK) (APPLAUSE)
ADELMAN: He really has.
NOVAK: Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Let's listen
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: Wait a minute, Kenny. Wait a minute. I want to show you a sound bite.
(CROSSTALK)
(BELL RINGING)
VAN HOLLEN: The only thing the president is consistent upon is refusing to admit that he's made mistakes.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: I want to show you what Senator Kerry said this afternoon. Go ahead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KERRY: This is a moment of truth in Iraq, not just for this administration, the country, the Iraqi people, but for the world. This may be our last chance to get it right.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NOVAK: Now, I would -- I understood the senator to say, unlike Carville and Begala, and I would regrettably say Van Hollen, is that he is saying let's stop this terrible partisan bickering and try to get this right in a bipartisan effort. Why won't you join in with him on that?
VAN HOLLEN: I would join him. I saw Senator Kerry's speech and I thought it was a very good speech. And I think he made some very important points in that speech.
One of the president he made was that we need to do a better job of bringing together international support for this effort. Now...
ADELMAN: Like the French.
NOVAK: He said the French, the Germans.
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: The French, the Chinese, and the Russians. Do you really believe we're going to get French, Chinese, and Russians in Iraq?
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE) VAN HOLLEN: Look, the fact of the matter -- the fact of the matter is -- the fact of the matter is, the president at his press conference the other night when he was asked what he was going to do, he essentially said he was going to turn it over to the U.N. envoy, which was what Senator Kerry and others have been pushing for a long time, to get the U.N. engaged.
What I find interesting is everyone saying to Senator Kerry, "Hey, what's your plan?" when we have the president of the United States, the commander in chief, who, when you ask him what his plan is, he doesn't have his answer. When you ask him how long our troops are going to be there, you know what their answer is? As long as necessary and not a day longer.
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: But that is not a plan. That is not a strategy. And to ask Senator Kennedy -- excuse me, Kerry -- to come up with more of a plan than the president...
(LAUGHTER)
NOVAK: Ah, Freudian error. Freudian error.
(CROSSTALK)
ADELMAN: I know they're both gentlemen from Massachusetts, but Kerry is the liberal from Massachusetts.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Let me pick up your point about the French. When you served President Ronald Reagan...
ADELMAN: Yes.
BEGALA: ... he got the French to come along to put intermediate nuclear forces in Europe, very difficult, terrific presidential leadership. President Clinton got the French to come along in the war against Kosovo.
ADELMAN: Right.
BEGALA: Isn't it Bush's job -- President Bush's job to bring the other French and other allies along? I know they're difficult. They've always been difficult since George Washington. If he could do it, why can't George Bush?
(APPLAUSE)
ADELMAN: Not when the French -- not when the French had a bunch of oil deals with Saddam Hussein, not when the French were sharing information with Saddam Hussein.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Halliburton had oil deals with Saddam.
ADELMAN: A lot of money. A lot of money. And that's what determines French foreign policy in many, many instances, all right?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
ADELMAN: I don't hold the French up to a paragon of virtue in foreign affairs. In fact, they're very mercantile and, in many respects, very, I don't want to say bad...
(LAUGHTER)
ADELMAN: But on that. So they're not an example.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: I'm sorry. We'll come back to this line in just
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Hang on, Ken. And hang on, Congressman.
Up next, in the "Rapid Fire," we'll ask our guests about some rather shocking new pictures that have come out of Iraq. And there is a verdict in the trial of former NBA star Jayson Williams. Wolf Blitzer will have the details for us right after the break.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. Coming up at the top of the hour, fighting in Iraq and no end in sight. And more American troops are killed in Fallujah. We'll have a report from the battlefield.
The historic 9/11 panel meeting with President Bush, why did one panel member, Bob Kerrey, specifically leave early? I'll ask him. He'll break his silence and tell us in an exclusive interview.
And is there a terrorist more dangerous than Osama bin Laden? Cofer Black, the State Department's coordinator for counterterrorism, says the answer is yes. He'll tell us.
And the jury delivers a mixed verdict in the trial of former NBA star Jayson Williams. We'll have a live report.
Those stories, much more only minutes away on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS."
Now back to CROSSFIRE.
BEGALA: Thank you, Wolf.
Time now for "Rapid Fire," where we ask questions faster than President Bush can say, bring 'em on. (LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: In the CROSSFIRE, former Reagan aide and current Pentagon adviser Ken Adelman and Congressman Chris Van Hollen, a Democrat from Michigan -- from Maryland. Excuse me.
NOVAK: Congressman, you were criticizing the president for not saying how long the troops are going to be in Iraq. If President -- if Senator Kerry is elected president, how long would they be in Iraq?
VAN HOLLEN: Well, I think, as he has said, that he doesn't know exactly how long it will be. And it will be necessary to complete...
(APPLAUSE)
VAN HOLLEN: But here's the point. No, no, no. Here's the point.
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: Here's the point.
NOVAK: You're in "Rapid Fire."
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: The president is commander in chief and he has an obligation to have a plan and an exit strategy when he goes in.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Ken...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Disturbing new images this week out of Iraq, allegations of torture, as yet unproven. Are we winning the battle of hearts and minds?
ADELMAN: No, I think we're in bad shape on the battle of hearts and minds. I think Al-Jazeera and some of these Arab television stations really poison the air very much against us. And it's a real problem.
NOVAK: Congressman Van Hollen, thank you very much. Ken Adelman, thank you very much.
"Rapid Fire" is over. Jerry Springer, watch out. Is Howard Dean going after your job?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: Move over, Dr. Phil. There may be another doc on the TV talk show circuit soon, Dr. Howard Dean. Now he's no longer governor of Vermont. And he sure isn't running for president anymore, thank God.
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: So where else could the good doctor go to find a job? "Variety" says he's in Hollywood talking to the same producer who brought us Judge Judy. If it pans out, little Dr. Dean ought to do well. We all know what a way with words he has.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEAN: And we're going to South Dakota and Oregon and Washington and Michigan! And then we're going to Washington, D.C., to take back the White House. Yes!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHTER)
NOVAK: And we thought we had pretty much heard the last of Dr. Howard.
BEGALA: I hope not. I hope he gets a show. I hope he's out there. He was right about this godforsaken war. President Bush should have listened to him.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: And helped bring back the Democratic Party's sense of guts, which we wimped out in the 2002 elections. Howard Dean helped us to toughen up again and rediscover our spin.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: God bless him.
NOVAK: Can I ask you a question?
BEGALA: Yes, sir.
NOVAK: Howard Dean wants to do away with all the Bush tax cuts. John Kerry wants to keep most of them. Howard Dean wants to completely pull the troops out of Iraq. Senator Kerry wants to keep them. Howard Dean was against going to war. Senator Kerry voted for it. Who are you with, Dean or Kerry?
BEGALA: I'm with Kerry. And I was before.
NOVAK: But you just said how great Dean was.
BEGALA: He's a great man. It doesn't mean I agree with him on every issue. But he did give my party back its soul and its spine.
NOVAK: You flunked the credibility test, Paul.
BEGALA: And god bless Howard Dean. No, I like him.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: I'm not a Dean basher. He's a good man.
And, by the way, happy birthday to my brother David.
From the left, I am Paul Begala. That's it for CROSSFIRE.
NOVAK: From the right, I'm Robert Novak.
Join us again next time for another edition of CROSSFIRE.
"WOLF BLITZER REPORTS" starts right now.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
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Aired April 30, 2004 - 16:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CROSSFIRE. On the left, James Carville and Paul Begala; on the right, Robert Novak and Tucker Carlson.
In the CROSSFIRE: the politics of Iraq.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Major combat operations in Iraq have ended.
ANNOUNCER: A year ago, the message was, mission accomplished. Did the president speak too soon?
For John Kerry, it's an anniversary and an opportunity as he lays out his vision for Iraq.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's go!
SEN. JOHN KERRY (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: America must lead a broad coalition against our adversaries.
ANNOUNCER: But does he really have a plan?
Today on CROSSFIRE.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the George Washington University, Paul Begala and Robert Novak.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST: Welcome to CROSSFIRE.
President Bush is standing by his speech a year ago. Remember, he took down Saddam Hussein's regime. That mission was accomplished. President Bush said there would be hard going ahead. He never said it would be easy. That's a Democratic myth.
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST: Well, actually, President Bush and Vice President Cheney did say it would be easy. Mr. Cheney said that we would be greeted as liberators in Iraq. Judging by the scenes from Fallujah, they have a funny way of greeting liberators over there.
Today's debate, Iraq, one year later, is the mission accomplished?
But first, we begin with the best little political briefing in television, our CROSSFIRE "Political Alert."
Before the 9/11 Commission yesterday, President Bush said he thought warnings of an al Qaeda attack were for targets overseas, not inside the U.S. But Mr. Bush and his government were warned of an attack inside the U.S. by the Hart-Rudman commission and the Gilmore commission and by the Clinton administration and by the CIA, whose memo to Mr. Bush screamed -- quote -- "Bin Laden determined to attack inside the United States" -- unquote.
And now we learn that six months before 9/11, Paul Bremer of all people said of Mr. Bush -- quote -- "The new administration seems to be paying no attention to the problem of terrorism. What they will do is stagger along until there's a major incident." Bremer noted that the Clinton administration had given Mr. Bush -- quote -- "a window of opportunity with very little terrorism now and they're not taking advantage of it."
NOVAK: Paul, if the Bush administration was asleep at the switch, so was the Clinton administration. I looked at Mr. Bremer's speech. I looked in the news reports. And, oh, buddy, you're making it up. He never said the Clinton administration had done well. There is not one word of praise in there for the Clinton administration. And if you can find that, I'll eat it.
BEGALA: Well, you eat it, because he said Bush has been given a window of opportunity. Who gave it to him, Santa Claus?
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Bill Clinton protected this country for eight years from al Qaeda.
(BELL RINGING)
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: And he told President Bush that that should be his No. 1
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: And Bush didn't listen him. And Bush didn't protect us.
NOVAK: Never said anything about the Clinton administration. The word Clinton isn't in there.
The joint appearance by President Bush and Vice President Cheney before the 9/11 Commission was deemed an historic occasion. Yet, two Democrats on the commission couldn't even sit through the three hours behind closed doors. The vice chairman, former Congressman Lee Hamilton of Indiana, raced out to introduce a speech by -- for the prime minister of Canada.
Another commissioner, former Senator Bob Kerrey of Nebraska, left to keep an appointment with Republican Senator Pete Domenici to discuss the New University in New York City, an institution that happens to be headed by Bob Kerrey. Want to bet that commissioners Hamilton and Kerrey both would have stuck around if the session was on live television?
BEGALA: Maybe it should have been on live television, then. Why not hold the president publicly accountable?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: You make a very good point, though. You are right. You are right that there's no more important work for those commissioners than being there. And it was wrong for them to leave. I love Bob Kerrey. I admire Lee Hamilton, don't know him well. They've done a great service for our country, but for that hour, they should have been there. Nothing was more important and I agree with you on that.
NOVAK: I'm glad we can agree on anything. And I think I would remember, too, that, when they interviewed Bill Clinton and Al Gore, that was behind closed doors also.
BEGALA: All of it should be public. All of it should be under oath, including President Clinton, Vice President Gore, everybody. Swear them under oath. Put them on TV. Let the American people know what really happened.
(BELL RINGING)
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Well, I know where I'm going to be tonight at 11:30 Eastern. I'll be watching "Nightline."
Journalistic giant Ted Koppel is going to devote his entire program tonight to reading the names and displaying the photos of each of the more than 700 American heroes who have died in Mr. Bush's war in Iraq. But the Sinclair Broadcast Group plans to censor Mr. Koppel's tribute, refusing to air it on its stations.
Now, whether you oppose the war or support it, I believe all Americans have a patriotic duty to honor and acknowledge the sacrifices of the men and women who gave their lives for our country. Unlike his father and other recent predecessors, President Bush refuses to attend memorial services to publicly recognize our war dead. Photos of flag-draped coffins have been banned. And now "Nightline" is being censored.
Apparently, for some on the right, patriotism is something to be preached, but not practiced.
(APPLAUSE)
ROBERT NOVAK, CO-HOST: You know, Paul, I don't know where I'm going to be at 11:30, but I'm not going to be watching that program. It's not news. It's not a documentary. It's not -- it doesn't tell you anything you didn't know.
What it is, is -- there's only one thing left. It's propaganda. Is it propaganda for the war? Certainly not. It's anti-war propaganda. (APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: And although I have a great respect for Ted Koppel, it shouldn't be on the air.
BEGALA: You know what it is? It's the truth.
(BELL RINGING)
BEGALA: And it is news when 700 Americans are killed and they're ignored by our president.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: Faithful readers -- faithful readers of "The New York Times" this week learned that Senator John Kerry is the first presidential candidate to travel around with his own butler.
Oh, Marvin Nicholson Jr. is listed as chief of stuff, but what he does is wake the senator in the morning, deliver his daily newspapers, help select his neckties, dial his telephone calls, carry his big briefcase, keep an uncapped bottle at the ready, and extract from the huge bag he carries whole wheat bread and strawberry jelly to make him frequent peanut butter and jelly sandwiches.
Am I envious? You bet. How nice would it be to have a butler at CROSSFIRE to fetch bowls of popcorn for me.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: Thank you. Thank you very much.
BEGALA: Bob, you're a legendary reporter, but I hate to correct you, my friend. Izzy Hernandez, a great guy, was a young aide, did the exact same things for then Governor Bush in the 2000 election. He made him his peanut butter sandwiches. Every major presidential candidate has that. And Izzy was a favorite of the press corps. And apparently so is this guy who travels with Kerry.
NOVAK: Is President Clinton -- President Clinton, he carried an intern around with him, didn't he?
(LAUGHTER)
(BELL RINGING)
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Well, it's a little easier. Of course, the guy who traveled with Bush doesn't have to carry any heavy books, at least, so that's good.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: A year ago, our president stood under a banner declaring mission accomplished. Today, no one makes that argument with a straight face. Up next, we'll debate the debacle in the desert and what our next president should do about it.
Later, we'll tell you about a new talk show that may be in the works. It's a real scream.
(APPLAUSE)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOWARD DEAN (D), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And then we're going to Washington, D.C., to take back the White House. Yes!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANNOUNCER: Join Carville, Begala, Carlson and Novak in the CROSSFIRE. For free tickets to CROSSFIRE at the George Washington University, call 202-994-8CNN or visit our Web site. Now you can step into the CROSSFIRE.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: It is the eve of the anniversary of President Bush's declaration of an end to major fighting in Iraq. And while Americans are dying in combat, Democrats want to make the most of the speech made by the president a year ago.
In its shadow, his critics, including John Kerry, hammer away at the cost of pursuing democracy around the world.
In the CROSSFIRE today, Representative Chris Van Hollen of Maryland, Democrat, and Ken Adelman, former director of the U.S. Arms Control and Disarmament Agency. He's now a member of Defense Secretary Rumsfeld's Policy Board.
BEGALA: Thank you both very much.
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Ken, as you know, today is April 30, celebrated around the world as my brother Dave's birthday.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: But tomorrow, May 1, is the first anniversary of our president going on the USS Abraham Lincoln. Here is a part of what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) BUSH: Major combat operations in Iraq have ended. In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEGALA: Now, Ken, as an expert on military affairs, major combat operations plainly are not over. And isn't the president's wrong conclusion that they were one of the reasons that we're only now sending the proper armor over there to reinforce our troops?
KEN ADELMAN, FORMER DIRECTOR, U.S. ARMS CONTROL & DISARMAMENT AGENCY: First of all, the major combat operations against Saddam Hussein and the army there to liberate the country from Saddam are...
BEGALA: That's not what he said.
ADELMAN: All right. It was a shorthand for something like that. That was incomplete. And it has gone worse than we expected a year ago. That is true.
BEGALA: But isn't that way there are not only just political ramifications of him having bad judgment? There are military implications. Just now, finally, our troops are getting the heavy armor that they need. They still don't have the body armor they need. But we're shipping as many tanks, Humvees and Strykers over there that we can. They should have been there from day one, but for our president's miscalculation, right?
ADELMAN: Well, the miscalculation was not just the president. The miscalculation was the military to look at that, because we did not expect a lot of this opposition, at least the ferocity of a year.
But, you know, Saddam Hussein had a long time to prepare for something like that. His guys do not want a success of a decent democracy in the Middle East. And the fact is, this is where the war of terror is now being fought.
NOVAK: Congressman...
ADELMAN: And so to lose that would be disastrous.
NOVAK: Congressman Van Hollen, I'm going to give you a little test to see if you're as big a demagogue as Paul is. And I want to show you another bit of the president's speech on the carrier. Let's listen to it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: And we have difficult work to do in Iraq. We are bringing order to parts of that country that remain dangerous. The transition from dictatorship to democracy will take time, but it is worth every effort.
(END VIDEO CLIP) NOVAK: Now, to me, he was saying they had finished the war against the army. We had dangerous stuff to do. Can't -- don't you think it's time for the Democrats to leave that alone and go on to serious debate?
REP. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D), MARYLAND: Well, I think we have a serious debate about what the next step should be.
But I think it's important to go back and see what the president had to say because it was premature and I think misleading to have a big banner on the aircraft carrier saying mission accomplished, because that created the perception in lots of Americans' minds that this was really behind us now. And the fact of the matter is that we've had, as you know, many more Americans killed and wounded since the president made that declaration.
I think from the beginning, the president has not done a good job leveling with the American people about what this is going to entail.
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: Congressman, in all due respect, you're flunked the demagogue test. You're as big a demagogue as Paul is.
VAN HOLLEN: Well, if demagoguery is truth-telling, then I guess we're both
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: I just want to ask you, maybe I'm -- I don't know if the president painted that mission accomplished sign. I understand the president stayed up all that night -- that night -- the night before painting.
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: And then flew in on the jet on the aircraft carrier.
NOVAK: I just want to ask you, do you think I made that quote up? Do you think I spliced that from a current speech? Do you think that was a deception?
VAN HOLLEN: This has been a continuing issue before the war and since the end of the war.
Before the war, the president made lots of statements that made it sound like this would be quick and easy, it would be done with. And since the war, they have made a number of statements suggesting it was going to be over quickly. Even today, the president has not submitted the budget that people on the ground say we need to provide for the military men and women there right now.
He is saying we're going to wait until January to come up with a budget for current operations. And $50 billion is expected to be needed. So he continues to try to create the impression that we're going to -- we're not going to have to confront the difficult choices. And I think that's created lots of trouble going forward.
ADELMAN: I think that's a bit of -- with all due respect, a bit of bum rap. I think the president has always said, this -- the war on terror is going to be tough. It's going to be long. It's going to be difficult. It's going to be costly. So buckle up.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Here's what he did say.
ADELMAN: And I think he was pretty honest on that. I really do.
BEGALA: Well, you said a moment ago that he perhaps misjudged...
ADELMAN: Oh, yes, we all misjudged it.
BEGALA: The insurrection and the opposition.
ADELMAN: Right.
BEGALA: As it became clear on July the 3rd, for example, our president made this comment. Here's the president coming on the rising insurrection in Iraq.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: There are some who feel like that, you know, the conditions are such that they can attack us there. My answer is, bring 'em on.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEGALA: Now, that's an outrage, isn't it, that the president of the United States, who is the commander in chief of armed forces, would say that.
ADELMAN: It was a mistake. Yes, it was a mistake.
BEGALA: Why hasn't he admitted that?
ADELMAN: Well...
NOVAK: Congressman, I want to ask you. Your candidate, Senator Kerry, made a speech on Iraq. I listened very carefully trying to figure out something that he was going to do differently from President Bush. I really tried to get that, because, you know, we're in the midst of a campaign.
(CROSSTALK)
ADELMAN: Bush has been very consistent. Kerry has been all over the map, all over the map.
NOVAK: Listen to what the new
(CROSSTALK) (APPLAUSE)
ADELMAN: He really has.
NOVAK: Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Let's listen
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: Wait a minute, Kenny. Wait a minute. I want to show you a sound bite.
(CROSSTALK)
(BELL RINGING)
VAN HOLLEN: The only thing the president is consistent upon is refusing to admit that he's made mistakes.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: I want to show you what Senator Kerry said this afternoon. Go ahead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KERRY: This is a moment of truth in Iraq, not just for this administration, the country, the Iraqi people, but for the world. This may be our last chance to get it right.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NOVAK: Now, I would -- I understood the senator to say, unlike Carville and Begala, and I would regrettably say Van Hollen, is that he is saying let's stop this terrible partisan bickering and try to get this right in a bipartisan effort. Why won't you join in with him on that?
VAN HOLLEN: I would join him. I saw Senator Kerry's speech and I thought it was a very good speech. And I think he made some very important points in that speech.
One of the president he made was that we need to do a better job of bringing together international support for this effort. Now...
ADELMAN: Like the French.
NOVAK: He said the French, the Germans.
(CROSSTALK)
NOVAK: The French, the Chinese, and the Russians. Do you really believe we're going to get French, Chinese, and Russians in Iraq?
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE) VAN HOLLEN: Look, the fact of the matter -- the fact of the matter is -- the fact of the matter is, the president at his press conference the other night when he was asked what he was going to do, he essentially said he was going to turn it over to the U.N. envoy, which was what Senator Kerry and others have been pushing for a long time, to get the U.N. engaged.
What I find interesting is everyone saying to Senator Kerry, "Hey, what's your plan?" when we have the president of the United States, the commander in chief, who, when you ask him what his plan is, he doesn't have his answer. When you ask him how long our troops are going to be there, you know what their answer is? As long as necessary and not a day longer.
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: But that is not a plan. That is not a strategy. And to ask Senator Kennedy -- excuse me, Kerry -- to come up with more of a plan than the president...
(LAUGHTER)
NOVAK: Ah, Freudian error. Freudian error.
(CROSSTALK)
ADELMAN: I know they're both gentlemen from Massachusetts, but Kerry is the liberal from Massachusetts.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Let me pick up your point about the French. When you served President Ronald Reagan...
ADELMAN: Yes.
BEGALA: ... he got the French to come along to put intermediate nuclear forces in Europe, very difficult, terrific presidential leadership. President Clinton got the French to come along in the war against Kosovo.
ADELMAN: Right.
BEGALA: Isn't it Bush's job -- President Bush's job to bring the other French and other allies along? I know they're difficult. They've always been difficult since George Washington. If he could do it, why can't George Bush?
(APPLAUSE)
ADELMAN: Not when the French -- not when the French had a bunch of oil deals with Saddam Hussein, not when the French were sharing information with Saddam Hussein.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Halliburton had oil deals with Saddam.
ADELMAN: A lot of money. A lot of money. And that's what determines French foreign policy in many, many instances, all right?
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
ADELMAN: I don't hold the French up to a paragon of virtue in foreign affairs. In fact, they're very mercantile and, in many respects, very, I don't want to say bad...
(LAUGHTER)
ADELMAN: But on that. So they're not an example.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: I'm sorry. We'll come back to this line in just
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Hang on, Ken. And hang on, Congressman.
Up next, in the "Rapid Fire," we'll ask our guests about some rather shocking new pictures that have come out of Iraq. And there is a verdict in the trial of former NBA star Jayson Williams. Wolf Blitzer will have the details for us right after the break.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington. Coming up at the top of the hour, fighting in Iraq and no end in sight. And more American troops are killed in Fallujah. We'll have a report from the battlefield.
The historic 9/11 panel meeting with President Bush, why did one panel member, Bob Kerrey, specifically leave early? I'll ask him. He'll break his silence and tell us in an exclusive interview.
And is there a terrorist more dangerous than Osama bin Laden? Cofer Black, the State Department's coordinator for counterterrorism, says the answer is yes. He'll tell us.
And the jury delivers a mixed verdict in the trial of former NBA star Jayson Williams. We'll have a live report.
Those stories, much more only minutes away on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS."
Now back to CROSSFIRE.
BEGALA: Thank you, Wolf.
Time now for "Rapid Fire," where we ask questions faster than President Bush can say, bring 'em on. (LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: In the CROSSFIRE, former Reagan aide and current Pentagon adviser Ken Adelman and Congressman Chris Van Hollen, a Democrat from Michigan -- from Maryland. Excuse me.
NOVAK: Congressman, you were criticizing the president for not saying how long the troops are going to be in Iraq. If President -- if Senator Kerry is elected president, how long would they be in Iraq?
VAN HOLLEN: Well, I think, as he has said, that he doesn't know exactly how long it will be. And it will be necessary to complete...
(APPLAUSE)
VAN HOLLEN: But here's the point. No, no, no. Here's the point.
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: Here's the point.
NOVAK: You're in "Rapid Fire."
(CROSSTALK)
VAN HOLLEN: The president is commander in chief and he has an obligation to have a plan and an exit strategy when he goes in.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Ken...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Disturbing new images this week out of Iraq, allegations of torture, as yet unproven. Are we winning the battle of hearts and minds?
ADELMAN: No, I think we're in bad shape on the battle of hearts and minds. I think Al-Jazeera and some of these Arab television stations really poison the air very much against us. And it's a real problem.
NOVAK: Congressman Van Hollen, thank you very much. Ken Adelman, thank you very much.
"Rapid Fire" is over. Jerry Springer, watch out. Is Howard Dean going after your job?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: Move over, Dr. Phil. There may be another doc on the TV talk show circuit soon, Dr. Howard Dean. Now he's no longer governor of Vermont. And he sure isn't running for president anymore, thank God.
(APPLAUSE)
NOVAK: So where else could the good doctor go to find a job? "Variety" says he's in Hollywood talking to the same producer who brought us Judge Judy. If it pans out, little Dr. Dean ought to do well. We all know what a way with words he has.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DEAN: And we're going to South Dakota and Oregon and Washington and Michigan! And then we're going to Washington, D.C., to take back the White House. Yes!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHTER)
NOVAK: And we thought we had pretty much heard the last of Dr. Howard.
BEGALA: I hope not. I hope he gets a show. I hope he's out there. He was right about this godforsaken war. President Bush should have listened to him.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: And helped bring back the Democratic Party's sense of guts, which we wimped out in the 2002 elections. Howard Dean helped us to toughen up again and rediscover our spin.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: God bless him.
NOVAK: Can I ask you a question?
BEGALA: Yes, sir.
NOVAK: Howard Dean wants to do away with all the Bush tax cuts. John Kerry wants to keep most of them. Howard Dean wants to completely pull the troops out of Iraq. Senator Kerry wants to keep them. Howard Dean was against going to war. Senator Kerry voted for it. Who are you with, Dean or Kerry?
BEGALA: I'm with Kerry. And I was before.
NOVAK: But you just said how great Dean was.
BEGALA: He's a great man. It doesn't mean I agree with him on every issue. But he did give my party back its soul and its spine.
NOVAK: You flunked the credibility test, Paul.
BEGALA: And god bless Howard Dean. No, I like him.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: I'm not a Dean basher. He's a good man.
And, by the way, happy birthday to my brother David.
From the left, I am Paul Begala. That's it for CROSSFIRE.
NOVAK: From the right, I'm Robert Novak.
Join us again next time for another edition of CROSSFIRE.
"WOLF BLITZER REPORTS" starts right now.
(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)
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