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CNN Crossfire
Bush Sets Agenda
Aired January 26, 2005 - 16:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CROSSFIRE. On the left, Paul Begala; on the right, Bay Buchanan.
In the CROSSFIRE: President Bush lays out an ambitious agenda for his second term. And with four days until the election in Iraq, he urges Iraqis to stand up to terror threats and head to the polls.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Some are feeling intimidated. I urge all people to vote. I urge people to defy these terrorists.
ANNOUNCER: Meanwhile, the deadliest day yet for U.S. forces since the Iraq war began after a Marine helicopter goes down. Is Iraq out of control?
And despite Democrats' protests, the Senate confirms Condoleezza Rice as secretary of state.
Today on CROSSFIRE.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(APPLAUSE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the George Washington University Paul Begala, and, sitting in on the right, Bay Buchanan.
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST: Welcome to CROSSFIRE.
Thirty-one American troops were killed in a helicopter crash in Iraq. Six more were killed in action. President Bush today held a news conference in which he covered the waterfront, from the election in Iraq to the election in Ukraine, from Social Security to national security. So there is lots to talk about today in the CROSSFIRE.
And joining me on the right to talk about all of it, Bay Buchanan. She's a Republican strategist and the president of the American Cause.
Bay, welcome back to the CROSSFIRE.
BAY BUCHANAN, GUEST CO-HOST: Thanks. Always good to be here.
BEGALA: Should be fun.
And we will begin as we always do, with the best little political briefing in television, the CROSSFIRE "Political Alert."
Well, 30 Marines and a Navy corpsmen were killed when their helicopter crashed near the Iraqi-Jordanian border this morning. Four more Marines were killed in combat in the western Iraqi province of Al Anbar. Two more American soldiers were killed in attacks around Baghdad, making today the single bloodiest day since the United States invaded Iraq in 2003.
Except for a vague comment to what he called -- quote -- "enormous sacrifices" -- unquote -- President Bush did not even mention the deaths in his prepared remarks at his press conference today. Look, we're not Republicans or Democrats on a day like this. We're not even supporters of the war or opponents. We are instead Americans, united in grief and committed to honoring every one of the 1,418 Americans who made the ultimate sacrifice for our country.
They deserve a lot better than a commander in chief who went out of his way to talk about Ukraine in his prepared remarks, but failed to even mention their deaths until someone asked him about it. I think it's tragic, Bay.
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: Paul, this man, the president, suffers enormously for every one of those deaths. There's just no question about it. I think to mention these deaths over yesterday's or this week's, we've had a very, very bad week. There's no question about it. And I think he anticipates that there's going to be some more trouble between now and Sunday.
And so I don't see what the problem is.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: We do know that the man feels very, very badly about this.
BEGALA: I wish he had mentioned it. That's all.
BUCHANAN: The Democrat Senate Campaign Committee hopes the party faithful will be motivated by Senator Barbara Boxer's recent railing on the new secretary of state, Condoleezza Rice.
But the DSCC sent out a fund-raising letter with a smiling Senator Boxer promoting her tough questions during the Rice's -- during Condoleezza Rice's confirmation hearing. But here's what I don't understand. What is gained by taking on Condi Rice? She's this articulate, tough, and competent black woman beloved by American women across the country. It's like beating up on Colin Powell.
Rice is the first black woman to become secretary of state, a fantastic role model for young black women. And America wants her as our secretary of state. In politics, you have to pick your fights. Blaming Condi Rice for that war makes Democrats look mean-spirited and angry. If they want to pick somebody to blame, why don't they take on the man responsible, the president? Oh, that's right, Paul. You all did that and lost an election.
BEGALA: Well, you make a point. The president is ultimately responsible.
But Dr. Rice misled the country. She said things that were false. It came out in the hearings. Senator Boxer, to her great credit, showed that. I think it's disgraceful that the Senate confirmed her. In the main, the president should have his team, it's true.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: But not someone who misled us about a war. She should not be our secretary of state.
BUCHANAN: You know, you all have spent so many months now telling us all about how the president lied and so and so lied and this person lied.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: We don't believe you anymore.
BEGALA: We don't believe Bush anymore, is the problem.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: I do not believe she misled. I do not believe for a minute that she misrepresented, deliberately misrepresented or lied to the American people.
BEGALA: Well, I do.
Well, speaking of misleading, Howard Kurtz of "The Washington Post" and CNN reveals today that conservative pundit Maggie Gallagher was paid $21,500 by the Department of Health and Human Services while she was writing columns supporting President Bush's marriage initiative. Now, Ms. Gallagher says she was paid to do research and writing about marriage for the department, not to flack for any proposal.
Howie's story follows the revelation that right-wing pundit Armstrong Williams was paid to promote Mr. Bush's education agenda. Now, when he came on CROSSFIRE, Mr. Williams admitted wrongdoing and wholeheartedly apologized. After that, when I was interviewing him, I moved on to ask about the Bush administration's pattern of violating the anti-propaganda law.
Now, this prompted one former Broadway critic, now a weekend pontificator in "The New York Times," to attack me for going too easy on Mr. Bush and Mr. Williams. Look, my view then and now is that the bigger scandal is the potentially illegal activity of the Bush administration, not the ethical lapses of a pundit. I guess I'm just too civil for Frank Rich's taste, but at least I knew where the story was going. BUCHANAN: Yes. You know, Paul...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: That's what we should be talking about.
BUCHANAN: Yes. And I don't mind talking about that, but I want to put the record straight. Maggie Gallagher should not be put in the same category. This contract she had was two years ago, three years ago now, 2002. And she made a presentation and prepared a brochure and got paid for it.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: It had nothing to do with what was going on during the election. She wasn't paid to promote anybody's agenda. She has been for marriage for many, many years.
Here's one of those attacks on common sense that we have come to see more and more often coming out of our court system. A federal appeals court has reinstated part of the class-action suit that blames McDonald's restaurants for making people fat. The suit says thousands of American kids have all kinds of health problems because of McDonald's misleading advertising.
The appellate court says that part of the lawsuit can go forward. But the lower court judge had it right when he pointed out that this law can't protect people from themselves if they choose to supersize. And exactly who has been driving all these little fat kids to McDonald's in the first place and buying them all those Big Macs and fries?
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: It's the parents. And don't tell me they were fooled by the advertising, because we all know Big Macs are fattening. They taste too good to be anything else.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: Well, I don't know that the court system is the best place to resolve this. But I do wish that our Congress would require all of these fast-food companies to simply put the nutritional information on the wrapper that it comes in, like they do at the grocery store.
If you're at the grocery store, it's required that, on the packaging, they tell us how fattening it is specifically. And I think that's what we should make these fast-food companies do.
BUCHANAN: I should be looking for my carbs as I'm biting into that Big Mac? I think they're not going to tell me anything I don't already know. No problem with that.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: They should just disclose. If they're trying to fill our kids with their fat, they ought to tell us how much fat is in it.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: I actually don't have a problem with any disclosure.
BEGALA: Disclose...
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Well, anyway, next in the CROSSFIRE, the president discloses his second-term agenda, spending political capital he thinks he has and money we know he doesn't. Oh, and he's also going to rid the world of tyranny.
And then later, the 2006 election is a long way off, but New York Republicans are desperately seeking a candidate to lose to Hillary Clinton. Could 2006 be seen as Rudy vs. Hillary, part two? We can only hope.
Stay with us to find out.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: CROSSFIRE. During his news conference this morning, President Bush talked about setting a bold new goal for the future, as he set out an ambitious agenda for the next four years. And he says that agenda includes spreading freedom around the world.
Today in the CROSSFIRE, Democratic Congressman from Virginia Jim Moran and Florida Republican Congresswoman Ileana Ros-Lehtinen. Excuse me, Ileana.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: A member of the House International Relations Committee.
BEGALA: Good to see you both again.
REP. ILEANA ROS-LEHTINEN (R), FLORIDA: Thank you. Thank you, Bay.
BEGALA: Welcome back to the CROSSFIRE, Ileana.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Jim.
Congresswoman Ros-Lehtinen, let me ask you about something I mentioned earlier at the beginning of this broadcast. Our president today held a news conference. He had an introductory remark that he had -- remarks that he had prepared. In those remarks, he talked about Ukraine, wherever that its. He talked about Palestine. This is a country that doesn't even exist. He didn't mention 37 Americans killed today in the theater of Iraq.
Why?
ROS-LEHTINEN: Well, I think the president has made it very clear in the way that he's reached out to the families who have lost their sons and their daughters in Iraq and in Afghanistan. He does so in a very private manner.
The Democrats tried to attack him for not showing the coffins as they came off the planes. They tried everything they could to show him as an uncompassionate, unfeeling commander in chief, when in fact...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: And yet, what he did today did more than anything the Democrats could ever do, Congresswoman.
ROS-LEHTINEN: Because what you want him to do is showboat and...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: No, publicly -- these men died for our country. They deserve a public acknowledgement from their commander in chief, don't they?
ROS-LEHTINEN: The president knows that. And the president knows that and the families know that they will get a call from the president. And if they want, they will get...
BEGALA: So they don't deserve a public acknowledgement of their sacrifice?
ROS-LEHTINEN: And he has done so time and time again.
And the president knows that this is a rough situation. It's a tough situation. My stepson will be in Iraq serving in August. And we pray for the lives of all of those young men and women. The president has stated his deep commitment to democracy and his honor that he is the commander in chief when they make these great sacrifices. He is not a man that you say can he does not care about these deaths.
BUCHANAN: Jim, I want you to listen to the president. And you probably watched him this morning.
REP. JIM MORAN (D), VIRGINIA: I did.
BUCHANAN: But let's just see if we -- this is a particularly interesting comment I think that he made here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: In late 2004, the people of Afghanistan defied the threats of terrorists and went to the polls to choose their leaders. The Palestinian people have elected a president who has renounced violence. This week, Ukraine inaugurated a new president, President Yushchenko. And just four days from now, the people of Iraq will vote in free national elections.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BUCHANAN: Jim, the president is obviously proud as he makes those comments. And I think he deserves credit for some of what is going on, these elections, historical elections in these four countries.
MORAN: Why? What has he done? What did he do in Ukraine?
BUCHANAN: My question to you is, how is it you can suggest -- I didn't say that he deserves all the credit for everything going on. Certainly, the Iraqi people deserve a lot of credit.
MORAN: There was the assumption that he deserved credit for what has happened. I don't know what he's done.
BUCHANAN: He is proud that this is happening. He's president of the United States. Clearly, he can take credit for what went on in Afghanistan and certainly much of the credit what is going on in Iraq today or this Sunday.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Well, that's the point. He should take responsibility for what is going on in Iraq, Bay.
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: Are you not for elections in these...
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Are you not for elections in these countries? Are you against them?
MORAN: Of course I'm for elections. And I'm for democracy.
But the risk-reward ratio for our going into Iraq did not justify our taking that action. This has been a disastrous war. This is the deadliest day in a very deadly war. We are paying the price and we -- he was not a threat to the United States, Bay. This did not make sense.
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: What you are arguing is whether we should have gone in or not. We are there, Jim. We are there. Now, would you not agree, though, that, if we are going to be there...
MORAN: But if you don't learn from your mistakes, you are going to keep repeating them, whether it's Iran or any other country.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Should the president just pull out on Monday? Should he just pull out and bring all the troops home? Is that what you're recommending?
MORAN: I'm suggesting he should acknowledge the fact that we made a decision that was not justified based on what we now know were the facts on the ground, and that we should have a time to end.
We should be doing everything we can to involve the rest of the world. If Saddam was such a threat, he wasn't a threat to us, but he was a potential threat to Europe, certainly to our ally in the Middle East.
BUCHANAN: We're talking Monday, Jim.
MORAN: Huh?
BUCHANAN: We're talking Monday.
MORAN: Monday.
BUCHANAN: What do we do Monday? The elections ha now occurred and you are saying should we...
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Well, we're going to go ahead with the elections. But he's now said, if we get 10 percent turnout, that's a great victory. That's not a great victory. That's laughable.
(APPLAUSE)
MORAN: And the reality is that -- that the people that are going to be elected are going to have closer ties to Iran than they are to the United States, Bay.
Ali Sistani is Iranian. He grew up in Iran. And the second popular guy is Muqtada al-Sadr, who is a clear enemy of the United States. And anybody that is successful is going to be successful because they come out in opposition to the American troops' presence.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Congresswoman, let me play another piece of tape from the president's press conference today. He stated what his goals will be in foreign policy in really a breathtaking manner. Here's the president today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: And I believe this country is best when it heads toward an ideal world. We are at our best. And, in doing so, we're reflecting universal values and universal ideas that honor each man and woman, that recognize human rights and human dignity, depends upon human liberty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEGALA: Set aside the notion of an ideal world. Why is it, if the president so loves democracy, he's so rough on France, which is clearly a democracy, and so easy on Saudi Arabia, which is a dictatorship? Why is that?
(APPLAUSE)
ROS-LEHTINEN: Well, I believe that we should be tougher on Saudi Arabia.
BEGALA: Amen.
ROS-LEHTINEN: And I say shame on Saudi Arabia for giving such a pittance of aid for the tsunami.
BEGALA: And shame on Mr. Bush for holding hands with the dictator of Saudi Arabia?
ROS-LEHTINEN: But congratulations to the Bush administration for everything that we're doing for the tsunami aid relief effort.
And I would say, you know, we try to just shrug our shoulders and pretend that freedom doesn't matter and liberty doesn't matter and elections and this is a sham.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: These people are taking -- no, no, to say that 10 percent...
BEGALA: I said we should honor liberty in Saudi Arabia.
ROS-LEHTINEN: To say that 10 percent election turnout is laughable and to be derisive, I think that these citizens are Iraqi are taking -- of Iraq are taking a very positive and courageous step in going out to the polls. They have lived 35 years...
BEGALA: But it ain't going to be an ideal world.
ROS-LEHTINEN: It isn't going to be an ideal. And this is not a Jeffersonian democracy.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: And when we first started here, blacks did not vote and women did not vote. And that was shameful then.
BUCHANAN: Jim, you...
ROS-LEHTINEN: And we are going to have a representative government in Iraq. Let's give them a chance to go out there to the polls. And don't be so derisive.
MORAN: Fourteen -- 1,400 American soldiers dead and we get a 10 percent turnout to...
ROS-LEHTINEN: No, no, no. No, no, no. First of all...
BUCHANAN: You have to start somewhere, Jim.
ROS-LEHTINEN: We don't know what the percentage is. And that's the first step. And this is going to be the first of many elections of the Iraqi people this calendar year.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: This is not going to be the only election. And one election, a democracy does not make. And to say that it's not perfect and to say that we didn't get 100 percent turnout, to say that it's just not right to be in Iraq, you don't know what it's like to live in an oppressive regime.
I come from communist Cuba. My native homeland, they would love to have an opportunity to hold an election, like the Iraqi people are holding on Sunday.
BEGALA: Let me let Congressman Moran respond. Then we'll take a break.
Go ahead, Congressman.
MORAN: Do you want to talk about the Bay of Pigs? The reality...
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: The Bay of Pigs, when the Cubans were abandoned by...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Just a second, Congresswoman.
Final word on this...
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: The point is, Saddam was not a threat to us. He's a bad guy. We had the will, but we did not have the reason to go to war in Iraq. And I thought that President Bush was going to have the press conference to express condolences to the fact -- over the fact that this was the deadliest day in the Iraq war. And so I do think...
ROS-LEHTINEN: It was a very sad day. And they will be hearing from President Bush.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Yes. The problem is that then it reflects on him.
(CROSSTALK) ROS-LEHTINEN: The Iraqi people are better off now without Saddam Hussein than with him in power.
BEGALA: But we'll be a lot better off if we make these commercial breaks, because that's what pays my salary.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: So hang on just a second, Congresswoman and Congressman. Just a second.
When we come back, we'll shift to the Bush domestic agenda and ask the question, does the president have a mandate to borrow $2 trillion from Social Security and replace guaranteed benefits for seniors with guaranteed fees for stockbrokers?
And then, later, will the 2006 New York Senate race be Rudy vs. Hillary, the sequel?
And then, in Iraq, as we've mentioned, the deadliest day for U.S. forces since the war began. With four days to go before Iraqis head to the polls, will it be safe enough to cast their votes? Wolf Blitzer will report next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington.
Coming up at the top of the hour, a helicopter crash in Iraq kills 31 U.S. troops on the deadliest day for Americans since the war began.
A commuter train wreck near Los Angeles kills 10 and injures more than 100. Police say it was no accident.
And a shocking discovery in North Carolina, a car wreck victim given up for dead, but then still breathing.
All those stories only minutes away on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS." Now back to CROSSFIRE.
BEGALA: Thank you, Wolf. We look forward to your report, while here at CROSSFIRE, we're talking about President Bush, who today promised a second term very much like his first, divisive, dangerous and very expensive.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: Joining us to talk about this, Ileana Ros-Lehtinen. She is a Republican congresswoman from Florida. And Jim Moran, he's a Democratic congressman from Virginia.
BUCHANAN: Paul, that was a very objective assessment of the press conference, I must say.
(LAUGHTER) (CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Jim, Social Security obviously on the president's agenda. He says that, to be leaders, to be bold, it's time that we really step forward and address the Social Security problem. It's nothing different than Bill Clinton said, but did nothing, six years ago. He said that we do have -- a crisis is looming, he said.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: We must act now, act now, he said, to save Social Security. That is your man Bill Clinton. Do you not agree?
MORAN: Bill Clinton left a $5.6 trillion surplus and the plans to put over $1 trillion into the Social Security trust fund to make Social Security and Medicare solvent for next 75 years. And if we hadn't blown that through ill-advised tax cuts, we wouldn't have this issue. This is a manufactured crisis, Bay.
(APPLAUSE)
ROS-LEHTINEN: You know what? It's great to have a surplus when you ignore every problem that exists in the world domestically and internationally.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: When you ignore that the World Trade Center -- OK...
MORAN: We had the strongest economic boom in American history, Ileana.
ROS-LEHTINEN: When you ignore that the World Trade Center was bombed, when you ignore that our U.S. embassies in Africa were bombed, when you ignore all of the problems...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: When you ignore, like Dr. Rice did, a memo that says bin Laden determined to strike in U.S.?
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: You don't want to face the problems, we can have a great surplus.
BEGALA: But, Congresswoman, do we really want to talk about ignoring things, when Dr. Rice...
ROS-LEHTINEN: How about solving the problems?
BEGALA: How about shifting to a different topic, which we talked about earlier today, this pundit payola scandal? Would you support an independent congressional investigation of whether the Bush administration is violating the Anti-Propaganda Act? ROS-LEHTINEN: Well, I don't know that an investigation needs to be in place. Armstrong...
BEGALA: Oh, come on. You supported investigating Clinton's sex life. Can't we investigate whether Bush's propaganda, Congresswoman...
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
ROS-LEHTINEN: Look, I don't support it. I think it's wrong.
BEGALA: I mean, my goodness.
ROS-LEHTINEN: If it's illegal, then those people who did it should be prosecuted.
BEGALA: But we should investigate it. We should know. How should we know?
ROS-LEHTINEN: And I'm sure they will.
But the gentleman who accepted the money admitted that he did wrong. He should have disclosed it. Whatever law was not -- was not adhered to, those people should be prosecuted.
BEGALA: But you don't support investigating it?
ROS-LEHTINEN: But you are not going to say that President Bush OKed it, that he signed the check, that he approved that, that this was his plan. I mean, you always want to hang all these problems on President Bush, as if he were micromanaging every part.
BEGALA: As if he were actually running the government.
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
ROS-LEHTINEN: No, no. Come on. Come on. It's ridiculous.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Who hired the secretary of education.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: And now we have got a new leadership in the Department of Education. And that's not going to happen. And the president was clear today. He was not in favor of it. He's against it. They've got new leadership. It's not going to happen.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: But if the education secretary had a secret girlfriend on the side, you would investigate that, wouldn't you? Come on. We investigate girlfriends, but not propaganda?
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: We have another person that has been exposed that was doing the same thing.
BUCHANAN: This is no exposure. There is absolutely no grounds for that whatever. The person wrote some pamphlets, got paid for it three years ago. And now somebody suggests there is something wrong? She wouldn't have taken that money? That's what she has done in her entire life. Maggie Gallagher...
MORAN: Yes, but we didn't know she was being paid by -- with our tax money.
BUCHANAN: Three years ago. She's allowed to have a job once in while. My golly day.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Paul, you better...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Congressman Jim Moran from Virginia, thank you very much.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: You seem a little defensive there.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: I'm sorry to cut you off.
MORAN: Anything you want to share with us?
(LAUGHTER)
BUCHANAN: I wish I had gotten $300,000 I could discuss with you all, but I did not.
BEGALA: We're going to have to take a break.
Congresswoman Ros-Lehtinen, thank you very much.
ROS-LEHTINEN: All right. Thank you, Paul. Thank you, Bay.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Congressman Moran, thank you as well for a fun session.
ROS-LEHTINEN: Thank you.
BEGALA: Do New York Republicans really think that Rudy Giuliani wants to walk away from millions to become a sacrificial lamb? Well, we'll have the answer for you when CROSSFIRE returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEGALA: Welcome back to CROSSFIRE.
"The New York Times" says that New York state Republican Party Chairman Stephen Minarik wants former Mayor Rudy Giuliani to face Hillary Rodham Clinton when the senator runs for reelection in 2006. Giuliani's people cagily say he's -- quote -- "not even thinking about politics right now" -- unquote -- for good reason.
Here's my prediction. Whoever the Republicans put up against Hillary will get beat like a bad piece of meat, beat like a barred mule, beat like a red-headed stepchild, as we say back home in Texas. Go, Hillary.
BUCHANAN: The last thing Hillary wants is to have somebody running against her two or three -- two years from now. She is out there recreating herself as somebody who is far more moderate. She doesn't need to be exposed two years ago and then have to do it again.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: She is actually a lot more moderate than people think. I know firsthand.
From the left, I am Paul Begala. That's it for CROSSFIRE.
BUCHANAN: And from the right, I'm Bay Buchanan. Join us again next time for another edition of CROSSFIRE.
"WOLF BLITZER REPORTS" starts right now.
(APPLAUSE)
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Aired January 26, 2005 - 16:30 ET
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(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: CROSSFIRE. On the left, Paul Begala; on the right, Bay Buchanan.
In the CROSSFIRE: President Bush lays out an ambitious agenda for his second term. And with four days until the election in Iraq, he urges Iraqis to stand up to terror threats and head to the polls.
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Some are feeling intimidated. I urge all people to vote. I urge people to defy these terrorists.
ANNOUNCER: Meanwhile, the deadliest day yet for U.S. forces since the Iraq war began after a Marine helicopter goes down. Is Iraq out of control?
And despite Democrats' protests, the Senate confirms Condoleezza Rice as secretary of state.
Today on CROSSFIRE.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(APPLAUSE)
ANNOUNCER: Live from the George Washington University Paul Begala, and, sitting in on the right, Bay Buchanan.
PAUL BEGALA, CO-HOST: Welcome to CROSSFIRE.
Thirty-one American troops were killed in a helicopter crash in Iraq. Six more were killed in action. President Bush today held a news conference in which he covered the waterfront, from the election in Iraq to the election in Ukraine, from Social Security to national security. So there is lots to talk about today in the CROSSFIRE.
And joining me on the right to talk about all of it, Bay Buchanan. She's a Republican strategist and the president of the American Cause.
Bay, welcome back to the CROSSFIRE.
BAY BUCHANAN, GUEST CO-HOST: Thanks. Always good to be here.
BEGALA: Should be fun.
And we will begin as we always do, with the best little political briefing in television, the CROSSFIRE "Political Alert."
Well, 30 Marines and a Navy corpsmen were killed when their helicopter crashed near the Iraqi-Jordanian border this morning. Four more Marines were killed in combat in the western Iraqi province of Al Anbar. Two more American soldiers were killed in attacks around Baghdad, making today the single bloodiest day since the United States invaded Iraq in 2003.
Except for a vague comment to what he called -- quote -- "enormous sacrifices" -- unquote -- President Bush did not even mention the deaths in his prepared remarks at his press conference today. Look, we're not Republicans or Democrats on a day like this. We're not even supporters of the war or opponents. We are instead Americans, united in grief and committed to honoring every one of the 1,418 Americans who made the ultimate sacrifice for our country.
They deserve a lot better than a commander in chief who went out of his way to talk about Ukraine in his prepared remarks, but failed to even mention their deaths until someone asked him about it. I think it's tragic, Bay.
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: Paul, this man, the president, suffers enormously for every one of those deaths. There's just no question about it. I think to mention these deaths over yesterday's or this week's, we've had a very, very bad week. There's no question about it. And I think he anticipates that there's going to be some more trouble between now and Sunday.
And so I don't see what the problem is.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: We do know that the man feels very, very badly about this.
BEGALA: I wish he had mentioned it. That's all.
BUCHANAN: The Democrat Senate Campaign Committee hopes the party faithful will be motivated by Senator Barbara Boxer's recent railing on the new secretary of state, Condoleezza Rice.
But the DSCC sent out a fund-raising letter with a smiling Senator Boxer promoting her tough questions during the Rice's -- during Condoleezza Rice's confirmation hearing. But here's what I don't understand. What is gained by taking on Condi Rice? She's this articulate, tough, and competent black woman beloved by American women across the country. It's like beating up on Colin Powell.
Rice is the first black woman to become secretary of state, a fantastic role model for young black women. And America wants her as our secretary of state. In politics, you have to pick your fights. Blaming Condi Rice for that war makes Democrats look mean-spirited and angry. If they want to pick somebody to blame, why don't they take on the man responsible, the president? Oh, that's right, Paul. You all did that and lost an election.
BEGALA: Well, you make a point. The president is ultimately responsible.
But Dr. Rice misled the country. She said things that were false. It came out in the hearings. Senator Boxer, to her great credit, showed that. I think it's disgraceful that the Senate confirmed her. In the main, the president should have his team, it's true.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: But not someone who misled us about a war. She should not be our secretary of state.
BUCHANAN: You know, you all have spent so many months now telling us all about how the president lied and so and so lied and this person lied.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: We don't believe you anymore.
BEGALA: We don't believe Bush anymore, is the problem.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: I do not believe she misled. I do not believe for a minute that she misrepresented, deliberately misrepresented or lied to the American people.
BEGALA: Well, I do.
Well, speaking of misleading, Howard Kurtz of "The Washington Post" and CNN reveals today that conservative pundit Maggie Gallagher was paid $21,500 by the Department of Health and Human Services while she was writing columns supporting President Bush's marriage initiative. Now, Ms. Gallagher says she was paid to do research and writing about marriage for the department, not to flack for any proposal.
Howie's story follows the revelation that right-wing pundit Armstrong Williams was paid to promote Mr. Bush's education agenda. Now, when he came on CROSSFIRE, Mr. Williams admitted wrongdoing and wholeheartedly apologized. After that, when I was interviewing him, I moved on to ask about the Bush administration's pattern of violating the anti-propaganda law.
Now, this prompted one former Broadway critic, now a weekend pontificator in "The New York Times," to attack me for going too easy on Mr. Bush and Mr. Williams. Look, my view then and now is that the bigger scandal is the potentially illegal activity of the Bush administration, not the ethical lapses of a pundit. I guess I'm just too civil for Frank Rich's taste, but at least I knew where the story was going. BUCHANAN: Yes. You know, Paul...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: That's what we should be talking about.
BUCHANAN: Yes. And I don't mind talking about that, but I want to put the record straight. Maggie Gallagher should not be put in the same category. This contract she had was two years ago, three years ago now, 2002. And she made a presentation and prepared a brochure and got paid for it.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: It had nothing to do with what was going on during the election. She wasn't paid to promote anybody's agenda. She has been for marriage for many, many years.
Here's one of those attacks on common sense that we have come to see more and more often coming out of our court system. A federal appeals court has reinstated part of the class-action suit that blames McDonald's restaurants for making people fat. The suit says thousands of American kids have all kinds of health problems because of McDonald's misleading advertising.
The appellate court says that part of the lawsuit can go forward. But the lower court judge had it right when he pointed out that this law can't protect people from themselves if they choose to supersize. And exactly who has been driving all these little fat kids to McDonald's in the first place and buying them all those Big Macs and fries?
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: It's the parents. And don't tell me they were fooled by the advertising, because we all know Big Macs are fattening. They taste too good to be anything else.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: Well, I don't know that the court system is the best place to resolve this. But I do wish that our Congress would require all of these fast-food companies to simply put the nutritional information on the wrapper that it comes in, like they do at the grocery store.
If you're at the grocery store, it's required that, on the packaging, they tell us how fattening it is specifically. And I think that's what we should make these fast-food companies do.
BUCHANAN: I should be looking for my carbs as I'm biting into that Big Mac? I think they're not going to tell me anything I don't already know. No problem with that.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: They should just disclose. If they're trying to fill our kids with their fat, they ought to tell us how much fat is in it.
(BELL RINGING)
BUCHANAN: I actually don't have a problem with any disclosure.
BEGALA: Disclose...
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Well, anyway, next in the CROSSFIRE, the president discloses his second-term agenda, spending political capital he thinks he has and money we know he doesn't. Oh, and he's also going to rid the world of tyranny.
And then later, the 2006 election is a long way off, but New York Republicans are desperately seeking a candidate to lose to Hillary Clinton. Could 2006 be seen as Rudy vs. Hillary, part two? We can only hope.
Stay with us to find out.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: CROSSFIRE. During his news conference this morning, President Bush talked about setting a bold new goal for the future, as he set out an ambitious agenda for the next four years. And he says that agenda includes spreading freedom around the world.
Today in the CROSSFIRE, Democratic Congressman from Virginia Jim Moran and Florida Republican Congresswoman Ileana Ros-Lehtinen. Excuse me, Ileana.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: A member of the House International Relations Committee.
BEGALA: Good to see you both again.
REP. ILEANA ROS-LEHTINEN (R), FLORIDA: Thank you. Thank you, Bay.
BEGALA: Welcome back to the CROSSFIRE, Ileana.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Jim.
Congresswoman Ros-Lehtinen, let me ask you about something I mentioned earlier at the beginning of this broadcast. Our president today held a news conference. He had an introductory remark that he had -- remarks that he had prepared. In those remarks, he talked about Ukraine, wherever that its. He talked about Palestine. This is a country that doesn't even exist. He didn't mention 37 Americans killed today in the theater of Iraq.
Why?
ROS-LEHTINEN: Well, I think the president has made it very clear in the way that he's reached out to the families who have lost their sons and their daughters in Iraq and in Afghanistan. He does so in a very private manner.
The Democrats tried to attack him for not showing the coffins as they came off the planes. They tried everything they could to show him as an uncompassionate, unfeeling commander in chief, when in fact...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: And yet, what he did today did more than anything the Democrats could ever do, Congresswoman.
ROS-LEHTINEN: Because what you want him to do is showboat and...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: No, publicly -- these men died for our country. They deserve a public acknowledgement from their commander in chief, don't they?
ROS-LEHTINEN: The president knows that. And the president knows that and the families know that they will get a call from the president. And if they want, they will get...
BEGALA: So they don't deserve a public acknowledgement of their sacrifice?
ROS-LEHTINEN: And he has done so time and time again.
And the president knows that this is a rough situation. It's a tough situation. My stepson will be in Iraq serving in August. And we pray for the lives of all of those young men and women. The president has stated his deep commitment to democracy and his honor that he is the commander in chief when they make these great sacrifices. He is not a man that you say can he does not care about these deaths.
BUCHANAN: Jim, I want you to listen to the president. And you probably watched him this morning.
REP. JIM MORAN (D), VIRGINIA: I did.
BUCHANAN: But let's just see if we -- this is a particularly interesting comment I think that he made here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: In late 2004, the people of Afghanistan defied the threats of terrorists and went to the polls to choose their leaders. The Palestinian people have elected a president who has renounced violence. This week, Ukraine inaugurated a new president, President Yushchenko. And just four days from now, the people of Iraq will vote in free national elections.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BUCHANAN: Jim, the president is obviously proud as he makes those comments. And I think he deserves credit for some of what is going on, these elections, historical elections in these four countries.
MORAN: Why? What has he done? What did he do in Ukraine?
BUCHANAN: My question to you is, how is it you can suggest -- I didn't say that he deserves all the credit for everything going on. Certainly, the Iraqi people deserve a lot of credit.
MORAN: There was the assumption that he deserved credit for what has happened. I don't know what he's done.
BUCHANAN: He is proud that this is happening. He's president of the United States. Clearly, he can take credit for what went on in Afghanistan and certainly much of the credit what is going on in Iraq today or this Sunday.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Well, that's the point. He should take responsibility for what is going on in Iraq, Bay.
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: Are you not for elections in these...
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Are you not for elections in these countries? Are you against them?
MORAN: Of course I'm for elections. And I'm for democracy.
But the risk-reward ratio for our going into Iraq did not justify our taking that action. This has been a disastrous war. This is the deadliest day in a very deadly war. We are paying the price and we -- he was not a threat to the United States, Bay. This did not make sense.
(APPLAUSE)
BUCHANAN: What you are arguing is whether we should have gone in or not. We are there, Jim. We are there. Now, would you not agree, though, that, if we are going to be there...
MORAN: But if you don't learn from your mistakes, you are going to keep repeating them, whether it's Iran or any other country.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Should the president just pull out on Monday? Should he just pull out and bring all the troops home? Is that what you're recommending?
MORAN: I'm suggesting he should acknowledge the fact that we made a decision that was not justified based on what we now know were the facts on the ground, and that we should have a time to end.
We should be doing everything we can to involve the rest of the world. If Saddam was such a threat, he wasn't a threat to us, but he was a potential threat to Europe, certainly to our ally in the Middle East.
BUCHANAN: We're talking Monday, Jim.
MORAN: Huh?
BUCHANAN: We're talking Monday.
MORAN: Monday.
BUCHANAN: What do we do Monday? The elections ha now occurred and you are saying should we...
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Well, we're going to go ahead with the elections. But he's now said, if we get 10 percent turnout, that's a great victory. That's not a great victory. That's laughable.
(APPLAUSE)
MORAN: And the reality is that -- that the people that are going to be elected are going to have closer ties to Iran than they are to the United States, Bay.
Ali Sistani is Iranian. He grew up in Iran. And the second popular guy is Muqtada al-Sadr, who is a clear enemy of the United States. And anybody that is successful is going to be successful because they come out in opposition to the American troops' presence.
(APPLAUSE)
BEGALA: Congresswoman, let me play another piece of tape from the president's press conference today. He stated what his goals will be in foreign policy in really a breathtaking manner. Here's the president today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BUSH: And I believe this country is best when it heads toward an ideal world. We are at our best. And, in doing so, we're reflecting universal values and universal ideas that honor each man and woman, that recognize human rights and human dignity, depends upon human liberty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BEGALA: Set aside the notion of an ideal world. Why is it, if the president so loves democracy, he's so rough on France, which is clearly a democracy, and so easy on Saudi Arabia, which is a dictatorship? Why is that?
(APPLAUSE)
ROS-LEHTINEN: Well, I believe that we should be tougher on Saudi Arabia.
BEGALA: Amen.
ROS-LEHTINEN: And I say shame on Saudi Arabia for giving such a pittance of aid for the tsunami.
BEGALA: And shame on Mr. Bush for holding hands with the dictator of Saudi Arabia?
ROS-LEHTINEN: But congratulations to the Bush administration for everything that we're doing for the tsunami aid relief effort.
And I would say, you know, we try to just shrug our shoulders and pretend that freedom doesn't matter and liberty doesn't matter and elections and this is a sham.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: These people are taking -- no, no, to say that 10 percent...
BEGALA: I said we should honor liberty in Saudi Arabia.
ROS-LEHTINEN: To say that 10 percent election turnout is laughable and to be derisive, I think that these citizens are Iraqi are taking -- of Iraq are taking a very positive and courageous step in going out to the polls. They have lived 35 years...
BEGALA: But it ain't going to be an ideal world.
ROS-LEHTINEN: It isn't going to be an ideal. And this is not a Jeffersonian democracy.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: And when we first started here, blacks did not vote and women did not vote. And that was shameful then.
BUCHANAN: Jim, you...
ROS-LEHTINEN: And we are going to have a representative government in Iraq. Let's give them a chance to go out there to the polls. And don't be so derisive.
MORAN: Fourteen -- 1,400 American soldiers dead and we get a 10 percent turnout to...
ROS-LEHTINEN: No, no, no. No, no, no. First of all...
BUCHANAN: You have to start somewhere, Jim.
ROS-LEHTINEN: We don't know what the percentage is. And that's the first step. And this is going to be the first of many elections of the Iraqi people this calendar year.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: This is not going to be the only election. And one election, a democracy does not make. And to say that it's not perfect and to say that we didn't get 100 percent turnout, to say that it's just not right to be in Iraq, you don't know what it's like to live in an oppressive regime.
I come from communist Cuba. My native homeland, they would love to have an opportunity to hold an election, like the Iraqi people are holding on Sunday.
BEGALA: Let me let Congressman Moran respond. Then we'll take a break.
Go ahead, Congressman.
MORAN: Do you want to talk about the Bay of Pigs? The reality...
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: The Bay of Pigs, when the Cubans were abandoned by...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Just a second, Congresswoman.
Final word on this...
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: The point is, Saddam was not a threat to us. He's a bad guy. We had the will, but we did not have the reason to go to war in Iraq. And I thought that President Bush was going to have the press conference to express condolences to the fact -- over the fact that this was the deadliest day in the Iraq war. And so I do think...
ROS-LEHTINEN: It was a very sad day. And they will be hearing from President Bush.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Yes. The problem is that then it reflects on him.
(CROSSTALK) ROS-LEHTINEN: The Iraqi people are better off now without Saddam Hussein than with him in power.
BEGALA: But we'll be a lot better off if we make these commercial breaks, because that's what pays my salary.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: So hang on just a second, Congresswoman and Congressman. Just a second.
When we come back, we'll shift to the Bush domestic agenda and ask the question, does the president have a mandate to borrow $2 trillion from Social Security and replace guaranteed benefits for seniors with guaranteed fees for stockbrokers?
And then, later, will the 2006 New York Senate race be Rudy vs. Hillary, the sequel?
And then, in Iraq, as we've mentioned, the deadliest day for U.S. forces since the war began. With four days to go before Iraqis head to the polls, will it be safe enough to cast their votes? Wolf Blitzer will report next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Wolf Blitzer in Washington.
Coming up at the top of the hour, a helicopter crash in Iraq kills 31 U.S. troops on the deadliest day for Americans since the war began.
A commuter train wreck near Los Angeles kills 10 and injures more than 100. Police say it was no accident.
And a shocking discovery in North Carolina, a car wreck victim given up for dead, but then still breathing.
All those stories only minutes away on "WOLF BLITZER REPORTS." Now back to CROSSFIRE.
BEGALA: Thank you, Wolf. We look forward to your report, while here at CROSSFIRE, we're talking about President Bush, who today promised a second term very much like his first, divisive, dangerous and very expensive.
(LAUGHTER)
BEGALA: Joining us to talk about this, Ileana Ros-Lehtinen. She is a Republican congresswoman from Florida. And Jim Moran, he's a Democratic congressman from Virginia.
BUCHANAN: Paul, that was a very objective assessment of the press conference, I must say.
(LAUGHTER) (CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Jim, Social Security obviously on the president's agenda. He says that, to be leaders, to be bold, it's time that we really step forward and address the Social Security problem. It's nothing different than Bill Clinton said, but did nothing, six years ago. He said that we do have -- a crisis is looming, he said.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: We must act now, act now, he said, to save Social Security. That is your man Bill Clinton. Do you not agree?
MORAN: Bill Clinton left a $5.6 trillion surplus and the plans to put over $1 trillion into the Social Security trust fund to make Social Security and Medicare solvent for next 75 years. And if we hadn't blown that through ill-advised tax cuts, we wouldn't have this issue. This is a manufactured crisis, Bay.
(APPLAUSE)
ROS-LEHTINEN: You know what? It's great to have a surplus when you ignore every problem that exists in the world domestically and internationally.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: When you ignore that the World Trade Center -- OK...
MORAN: We had the strongest economic boom in American history, Ileana.
ROS-LEHTINEN: When you ignore that the World Trade Center was bombed, when you ignore that our U.S. embassies in Africa were bombed, when you ignore all of the problems...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: When you ignore, like Dr. Rice did, a memo that says bin Laden determined to strike in U.S.?
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: You don't want to face the problems, we can have a great surplus.
BEGALA: But, Congresswoman, do we really want to talk about ignoring things, when Dr. Rice...
ROS-LEHTINEN: How about solving the problems?
BEGALA: How about shifting to a different topic, which we talked about earlier today, this pundit payola scandal? Would you support an independent congressional investigation of whether the Bush administration is violating the Anti-Propaganda Act? ROS-LEHTINEN: Well, I don't know that an investigation needs to be in place. Armstrong...
BEGALA: Oh, come on. You supported investigating Clinton's sex life. Can't we investigate whether Bush's propaganda, Congresswoman...
(CROSSTALK)
(APPLAUSE)
ROS-LEHTINEN: Look, I don't support it. I think it's wrong.
BEGALA: I mean, my goodness.
ROS-LEHTINEN: If it's illegal, then those people who did it should be prosecuted.
BEGALA: But we should investigate it. We should know. How should we know?
ROS-LEHTINEN: And I'm sure they will.
But the gentleman who accepted the money admitted that he did wrong. He should have disclosed it. Whatever law was not -- was not adhered to, those people should be prosecuted.
BEGALA: But you don't support investigating it?
ROS-LEHTINEN: But you are not going to say that President Bush OKed it, that he signed the check, that he approved that, that this was his plan. I mean, you always want to hang all these problems on President Bush, as if he were micromanaging every part.
BEGALA: As if he were actually running the government.
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
ROS-LEHTINEN: No, no. Come on. Come on. It's ridiculous.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: Who hired the secretary of education.
(CROSSTALK)
ROS-LEHTINEN: And now we have got a new leadership in the Department of Education. And that's not going to happen. And the president was clear today. He was not in favor of it. He's against it. They've got new leadership. It's not going to happen.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: But if the education secretary had a secret girlfriend on the side, you would investigate that, wouldn't you? Come on. We investigate girlfriends, but not propaganda?
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: We have another person that has been exposed that was doing the same thing.
BUCHANAN: This is no exposure. There is absolutely no grounds for that whatever. The person wrote some pamphlets, got paid for it three years ago. And now somebody suggests there is something wrong? She wouldn't have taken that money? That's what she has done in her entire life. Maggie Gallagher...
MORAN: Yes, but we didn't know she was being paid by -- with our tax money.
BUCHANAN: Three years ago. She's allowed to have a job once in while. My golly day.
(CROSSTALK)
BUCHANAN: Paul, you better...
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Congressman Jim Moran from Virginia, thank you very much.
(CROSSTALK)
MORAN: You seem a little defensive there.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: I'm sorry to cut you off.
MORAN: Anything you want to share with us?
(LAUGHTER)
BUCHANAN: I wish I had gotten $300,000 I could discuss with you all, but I did not.
BEGALA: We're going to have to take a break.
Congresswoman Ros-Lehtinen, thank you very much.
ROS-LEHTINEN: All right. Thank you, Paul. Thank you, Bay.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: Congressman Moran, thank you as well for a fun session.
ROS-LEHTINEN: Thank you.
BEGALA: Do New York Republicans really think that Rudy Giuliani wants to walk away from millions to become a sacrificial lamb? Well, we'll have the answer for you when CROSSFIRE returns.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BEGALA: Welcome back to CROSSFIRE.
"The New York Times" says that New York state Republican Party Chairman Stephen Minarik wants former Mayor Rudy Giuliani to face Hillary Rodham Clinton when the senator runs for reelection in 2006. Giuliani's people cagily say he's -- quote -- "not even thinking about politics right now" -- unquote -- for good reason.
Here's my prediction. Whoever the Republicans put up against Hillary will get beat like a bad piece of meat, beat like a barred mule, beat like a red-headed stepchild, as we say back home in Texas. Go, Hillary.
BUCHANAN: The last thing Hillary wants is to have somebody running against her two or three -- two years from now. She is out there recreating herself as somebody who is far more moderate. She doesn't need to be exposed two years ago and then have to do it again.
(CROSSTALK)
BEGALA: She is actually a lot more moderate than people think. I know firsthand.
From the left, I am Paul Begala. That's it for CROSSFIRE.
BUCHANAN: And from the right, I'm Bay Buchanan. Join us again next time for another edition of CROSSFIRE.
"WOLF BLITZER REPORTS" starts right now.
(APPLAUSE)
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