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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Interview With California Congressman Ed Royce; Snowstorm Batters Northeast; Terror of ISIS; CDC Warns Large Outbreak is Possible; Strong Storm Hits Midwest & Northeast

Aired February 02, 2015 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Is ISIS moving closer and closer to establishing that rogue state of Islam tyranny?

I'm Jake Tapper. This is the THE LEAD.

The world lead. ISIS delivers on another one of its evil promises and beheads a Japanese journalist. They still have four more hostages that we know about, including an American woman. Should the world, however, be more concerned about the terrorist group blasting its way toward Baghdad?

The national lead. Chicago's Magnificent Mile turned into mount misery, snow already piling up in the Midwest and Boston being bombarded right now, as people in airports from coast to coast look up at the departure boards and hope and pray that their flight has not been waylaid by this wintry blitz.

Plus, the money lead. Speaking of blitzes, another Super Bowl, another record number of eyeballs glued to TV sets. This year's game, unlike last year's, was actually worth watching. But some of those commercials, man, downright depressing. Which ones worked and which ad makers might have been fired this morning?

Good afternoon, everyone. I'm Jake Tapper. Welcome to THE LEAD.

We are going to begin today with our world lead. The ISIS campaign to establish a brutal caliphate in Iraq and Syria continues, seemingly undeterred, with four Western hostages, including an American woman, an aid worker, in their deadly grip.

Today, the terrorist group released new pictures showing an assault on an Iraqi army base just about 30 miles west of Baghdad. Overnight, the U.S.-led coalition hitting ISIS 17 more times in Iraq, 10 more in Syria, this after the terror group killed a Japanese hostage, Japanese journalist Kenji Goto, and posted the video, the snuff film, online.

The fate of the Jordanian fighter pilot, Muath al-Kaseasbeh, remains unknown.

Earlier today, President Obama told Savannah Guthrie of NBC News that he has watched some of the terrorist group's brutal stuff.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I think it's fair to say that anything related to these terrorist actions, I take a look at.

Every morning, I get a presidential daily briefing and it gives me a pretty clear sense of some of the terrible stuff that's happening and it's part of the reason why we have to be so vigilant and so aggressive in going after a vicious organization like ISIL.

SAVANNAH GUTHRIE, NBC NEWS: It must affect you deeply to see something like that.

OBAMA: Well, I think it would affect anybody who has an ounce of humanity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: That's the scene today in Amman, Jordan, people hosting a vigil outside the Japanese Embassy in Jordan, lighting candles in the memory of the Japanese journalist, rallying against the terrorist group ISIS.

Barbara Starr is live at the Pentagon with the latest on the fight against ISIS -- Barbara.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Jake, tonight one country in mourning, another country holding its breath and everyone asking, what is it going to take to change the status on the ground of ISIS' strength?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

STARR (voice-over): Jordan still pressing to get its pilot, Muath al- Kaseasbeh, free from ISIS.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The proof of life that we have asked for did not come yet.

STARR: Ominous silence from ISIS, which never publicly offered to release the pilot in return for Sajida al-Rishawi, a would-be suicide bomber held in Jordan since being convicted of a series of hotel bombings in 2005.

After the horrific ISIS video of the beheading of Japanese journalist Kenji Goto, U.S. intelligence agencies scouring every frame for clues and wondering if ISIS still might respond to Jordan.

PETER BERGEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: ISIS seems to be in touch with somebody in the Jordanian government. And we haven't really had that line of communication before.

STARR: The U.S. following all of this closely as an American aid worker remains an ISIS hostage. It's been something the White House has been reluctant to talk about, but President Obama telling NBC News: OBAMA: Our obligation is to make sure that we can do anything we can to try to make sure that any American citizen is rescued from this situation.

STARR: But ISIS apparently undeterred, though it may only have a few hostages left. It is sustaining some other losses.

BERGEN: They are losing ground in Iraq. They are maintaining ground in Syria. They are getting recruits coming in from overseas at quite a clip.

STARR: Outgoing Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel telling CNN ISIS still expert at exploiting social media.

CHUCK HAGEL, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: This is as sophisticated a terrorist group as we have ever seen, the sophistication of their social media. We have never seen anybody, a terrorist group like ISIL just from that dimension.

STARR: The latest ISIS photos near their Syrian stronghold of Raqqa claiming to show life is normal. But for the family of the Jordanian pilot, it's anything but.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We can't sleep. We can't eat. We can't do anything. Our work has stopped. Our life has stopped.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

STARR: U.S. policy for now remains unchanged. The airstrikes will continue. The hope, the U.S. says, is that if they put the priority on Iraq, they can at least buy the Iraqi forces enough time to counter ISIS. A lot of people, however, still remain very doubtful -- Jake.

TAPPER: Barbara Starr, thank you so much.

In Japan, where that nation is in mourning over the murder of Kenji Goto, there's a strange brew of defiance and grief. In the modern era, Japan has been famously reluctant to thrust its military into any sort of conflict, but Prime Minister Shinzo Abe has responded to Goto's beheading with outrage, vowing to make the terrorists pay the price.

The reaction from Goto's family is quite different. In a statement, his family apologized for Goto causing so much trouble. Goto's mother through her tears said she does not want her son's vicious end to inspire any more violence.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JUNKO ISHIDO, MOTHER OF KENJI GOTO (through translator): I don't want this sorrow to create a chain of hatred.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Goto is survived by his wife and his infant daughter.

I want to bring in the chairman of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, Republican Congressman Ed Royce from California.

Sir, thanks so much for joining us.

You just heard Peter Bergen's assessment of where the fight is, that ISIS is being pushed back in Iraq, but they are maintaining their stranglehold on parts of Syria. Is that correct, and do you think the U.S. is winning this war against ISIS?

REP. ED ROYCE (R), CALIFORNIA: I think, Jake, the size of territory they hold right now is about the size of Great Britain.

And it's interesting to look at this battle in Kobani, where, yes, the Syrian Kurds pushed them out, ISIS lost maybe 2,000 fighters, but that town is now uninhabitable. The hope that the Kurds have is that they now move into Mosul. But that's an inhabited city, so clearly this is going to be a horrific battle between ISIS and the Kurds, and, of course, we lend the air support for this campaign.

I think at this point, the answer to that question is they have been able to recruit just as fast, if not faster, than the losses on the battlefield. So this is very much a situation where it's a close-run battle between ISIS and...

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: Can't say the U.S.-led coalition is winning at this point?

ROYCE: Well, I think we are definitely degrading, but as long as they are able to use social media so effectively to bring new recruits in and as long as the Turkish government haven't effectively sealed that border, we are going to see additional ISIS fighters joining the battle.

TAPPER: Why hasn't Turkey effectively sealed the border?

ROYCE: I'm not sure. I don't know if it's just very difficult for them to do, or if, as part of their negotiations, as you know, they would like to have a no-fly zone to protect the Sunni population in the north of Syria.

And they have not been all that cooperative because we haven't been -- we haven't given ground on that idea of preventing the aerial bombardment by the Syrian forces of the Sunni refugee population in the north. So it's a rather complicated negotiation at this point.

TAPPER: Right. As this fight against ISIS intensifies, there is also this question and debate about what is driving the threat. A lot of people in counterterrorism and others say this is radical Islam. You heard the British prime minister say something similar a few weeks ago.

But I want you to listen to part of an exchange between President Obama and CNN's own Fareed Zakaria.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) OBAMA: I reject a notion that somehow that creates a religious war, because the overwhelming majority of Muslims reject that interpretation of Islam. They don't even recognize it as being Islam.

And I think that for us to be successful in fighting this scourge, it's very important for us to align ourselves with the 99.9 percent of Muslims who are looking for the same thing we're looking for.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: There's a real reluctance by President Obama and, before him, President Bush to make this a war against radical Islam or anything associated with Islam. There's a reluctance to identify this as part of the religion.

What's your take on this? Some people say that this reveals a blindness by this administration and the previous one.

ROYCE: Well, I think the technical term is Islamist in order to distinguish it from the religion, but to explain that this is a political movement. It's an ideology, an Islamist ideology.

I think it's important to make that distinction. And I think, with that, it allows us to identify exactly what we are struggling against, while at the same time putting us on the side of the overwhelming majority of Muslim population, which is against ISIS.

TAPPER: I know that there's a lot of reluctance by U.S. policy-makers to talk about this American aid worker who is in ISIS custody right now being held as a prisoner or hostage.

I guess the question that I would ask is, is the U.S. government in any way communicating with ISIS, either through an intermediary? Is there any sort of attempt to negotiate or even to talk to ISIS?

ROYCE: Jake, I don't know the answer to that. But part of the difficulty in beginning to pay ransom is that extortion and ransom are two of the main ways that ISIS gets its money.

So, for example, Italians, French, Swiss businessmen, they are very likely to be abducted and held for ransom. The U.K. and the United States have long had a position of not paying ransom. And the reason is because ransom actually feeds the activities and makes it possible to recruit. For that reason, we have not walked down that road and neither did Abe. When Abe was asked to pay $200 million...

TAPPER: The Japanese prime minister.

ROYCE: Yes, the Japanese prime minister.

He said, instead, we will put that $200 million in to help those who are fighting ISIS, to help those displaced people and others struggling...

TAPPER: So, we're not -- so we won't negotiate. Let me ask you, philosophically, is there really that big a difference

between the U.S. government negotiating with the Taliban to get Bowe Bergdahl back, Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl, and negotiating with ISIS to get back this American aid worker? What's the difference? They could negotiate with the Taliban, but not ISIS? I don't...

ROYCE: Well, Jake, that is why some of us, myself included, spoke out against this original negotiation, because those five Taliban operatives, two of them were senior commanders who were responsible for the death of 5,000 religious minorities in Afghanistan that they had liquidated simply for the political beliefs of those people when they controlled that area.

So it is -- it showed us, just the release of those five, how dangerous that ISIS; 30 percent return, approximately, to the battlefield. We know one of those five is trying to return to the battlefield. So it's another example of why it's a bad policy to negotiate and either pay ransom or release terrorists. It just feeds the beast.

TAPPER: Congressman Ed Royce, chairman of the House Foreign Relations Committee, thank you so much. Really appreciate it.

In our national lead today, the Centers for Disease Control just hours ago saying the measles outbreak in this country is getting worse, more than 100 cases reported, most linked to that initial outbreak at Disneyland in California. Now President Obama and potential Republican presidential candidates are weighing in on the debate. But what is there to debate? The science is clear.

That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

The national lead now: a sober warning from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention today about a potentially deadly disease, a disease that the U.S. government 15 years ago said was eliminated from this country. But now, health officials are sounding the alarm about the possibility of a, quote, "large outbreak of the measles." There are already reports of 102 cases in 14 states, most of which can be traced to an outbreak that started at Disneyland in California.

Now, this is a serious and potentially fatal disease. It's also one that the CDC says is entirely preventable if parents who can vaccinate their children would simply vaccinate their children.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: All I can say is that we vaccinated ours, but I understand parents need to have some measure of choice in things as well.

TAPPER (voice-over): Today, Governor Chris Christie entered the fray of the raging debate over the childhood measles vaccine. CHRISTIE: I didn't say I'm giving people the option. What I'm saying

is you have to have that balance in considering parental concerns.

TAPPER: The New Jersey governor made his remarks in London about whether parents should be able to not vaccinate their children.

Also this morning, another 2016 potential hopeful, Senator Rand Paul, threw his opinion into the ring saying most vaccines should be voluntary.

SEN. RAND PAUL (R), KENTUCKY: While I think it's a good idea to take the vaccine, I think that's a personal decision for individuals to take.

TAPPER: Both statements seemed in contrast with President Obama on NBC, who minced no words.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: There is every reason to get vaccinated. There aren't reasons to not.

INTERVIEWER: Are you telling parents you should get your kids vaccinated?

OBAMA: You should get your kids vaccinated.

TAPPER: The medical community says the question of whether or not parents should vaccinate their children is not up for political debate, it is better left to science, and the science is clear. Getting your children vaccinated prevents disease.

According to the Centers for Disease Control, among children in the U.S. age 2 to 21, vaccination will prevent an estimated 322 million illnesses and 732,000 deaths.

JENNY MCCARTHY: I believe vaccinations triggered Evan's autism.

TAPPER: But some high profile spokespeople have launched a public movement against childhood vaccinations, based on the false and discredited theory that vaccines in some way cause autism.

MCCARTHY: We deserve safe shots, and a safer schedule.

TAPPER: The medical and scientific communities are very clear on this. There are no links, they say.

DR. ANNE SCHUCHAT, CENTERS FOR DISEASE CONTROL & PREVENTION: There have been rumors, there have been concerns, there have been questions. There is a huge evidence base now that the MMR vaccine is not linked to autism.

TAPPER: But the quackery built on the tragedy of a rise in autism diagnoses, has propelled an anti-vaccination movement, one that is now linked to the spread of preventable contagious diseases that can kill.

DR. THOMAS FRIEDEN, CDD DIRECTOR: Choosing not to vaccinate your child also endangers the health of others in your community. TAPPER: A recent outbreak of measles that began at Disneyland now

accounts for most of the 102 measles cases spreading across more than a dozen states. Putting the most vulnerable at risk, those kids too young or too sick to get immunized are the most in danger. The science and medicine on childhood vaccines recommended by the CDC is settled, but the presidential contest may inject some serious ignorance into the bloodstream of this important public health issue.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: We sent a list of the immunizations for children that are required in New Jersey to Governor Christie and a list of immunizations for children required in Kentucky to Senator Paul. We asked their offices which immunizations they thought should be made voluntary, if any, as opposed to mandatory. We did not hear back from either office.

When we come back, huge areas of the country getting pummeled once again with snow and frigid temperatures. We'll go live to Boston next where they are running out of places to put the piling snow.

Plus, a huge win for the Super Bowl in the ratings. Just how many people watched the game and is that number inflated? Just joking. That's ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD.

More national news now: a nasty, nasty deadly snowstorm smacking the Midwest, pummeling the Northeast right now. This comes just days after the blizzard that walloped New England. Those are some live shots you're looking at right now out of Boston, where heavy snow is falling.

This is the snowiest 10-day stretch that Boston has ever seen. Think about that. Let me show you what the streets look like in Chicago.

That's a CNN crew from earlier today helping a driver struggling to get over a snow mound. Good job, guys. Never see MSNBC or FOX do that.

We have reporters scattered across the Northeast where the storm is now. Let's start with CNN's Brian Todd.

Brian, you have been roving that region in an SUV today. Show us the conditions now. Man, that looks rough.

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's rough, Jake. And the conditions have been getting progressively worse all day.

I'm in Lowell Street in Andover, Massachusetts. You really cannot see more than about 70 yards away from your location. And, technically, although this storm was less volume of snow than last week, two, two and a half feet in most areas, this is only supposed to be about 10 to 14 inches, you can see all around here, it's really much more difficult in a couple of different ways.

As we come over to this camera, I'm going to switch from our photojournalist Khalil Abdullah's (ph) camera to our dash camera until Khalil gets in the car, then we're going to show you what it's like on the interstate just a block away.

But what really is the problem this week is visibility. You just saw it here. You're going to see it again. And also, the volume of vehicles on the road. As I switch from the dash cam, we're going to get in the vehicle, pull out of this street in just a second and get on Interstate 93 which is just about a block down.

The problem is there's not a travel ban today. A state police official just told us that they only issue travel bans when there's about two and a half or more feet of snow. And again, today is not going to meet that standard.

But take a look as we pull out here, you can now see, let's switch Martin Dougherty (ph), our other photojournalist here, will switch out the front of the vehicle. Check out this visibility or lack thereof. As we head over here to the exit for Interstate 93, this is one of the biggest interstates in the state of Massachusetts. We're going to take this exit and show you what it's like on a major highway, Jake. And it really isn't any better.

The volume of vehicles, because of a lack of a travel ban today, there are a lot more vehicles on the road than there were last week. A lot of people in Massachusetts are treating this like a normal work day and officials have told us they are concerned about that, especially now as we head into the rush hour period that we're in now. We have noticed an extraordinary number of vehicles on the road and check this out. I mean, this visibility here is almost just in the negative numbers as we head on to I-93.

So, the highways are not safe, you know, where to put the snow is a big problem. Cars pulling over to the side of each road is a very big problem because they clog the exits, they clog the roadways, the plows can't do their jobs. Here we have a plow trying to make some extra space over here.

So, the major highways are not good, the side roads are not good. There's no place to put the snow. There's no place to put your car if you're stuck.

Even the parking lots are not safe, Jake. We've got word a little while ago of a woman in her 50s who was struck and killed by a snow plow in Weymouth, Massachusetts, just south of Boston. We went out and checked out that scene.

So, it is very dangerous all the way around here, Jake.

TAPPER: All right. Brian Todd, thank you. Please travel safely.