Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

Kayla Mueller's Fate Remains Unknown; Kurdish Forces Hope to Retake Key City; Interview with Rep. Peter King; Measles Outbreak Spreads To Three New States, D.C.; Exit Stage West

Aired February 09, 2015 - 16:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

In world news today, a slick and sick new propaganda video released by the terrorist group ISIS today features a kidnapped British journalist slamming the U.S. and Britain for failing to negotiate with ISIS for hostages the way other countries have in the past.

This comes as the parents of American ISIS hostage Kayla Mueller wait for word on whether an emotional appeal to the barbaric terror group will help bring their daughter home.

ISIS still has not offered any proof to back up their claim that Mueller was killed in a Jordanian air strike last week. The uncertainty has understandably left Mueller's parents grappling with a range of emotions from hope to utter and complete despair.

I'm joined now by CNN's Pamela Brown.

Pamela, do we know if the family has heard anything back at all? Anything?

PAMELA BROWN, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's the question. And so far we don't really know, Jake. The family spokesperson hasn't said that they've heard anything back yet but we do know that intelligence analysts have been working around the clock to figure out Kayla Mueller's fate. But so far, we're being told that there has been no conclusive evidence in that regard.

This as another Western hostage sent an ominous message through one of the most recent propaganda videos from ISIS.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN CANTLIE, BRITISH JOURNALIST: Hello. I'm John Cantlie.

BROWN (voice-over): It may look like British journalist John Cantlie is just doing his job.

CANTLIE: It's been at the heart of the fighting.

BROWN: But this 12-minute video is actually the latest attempt by ISIS to use one of its last known Western hostages as propaganda and what Cantlie says is the final film of a series. COL. JAMES REESE (RET.), FORMER U.S. DELTA FORCE OFFICE: That could

be his sign-off moment saying hey, this is my last film and now my fate -- you know, my fate is with ISIS hands.

BROWN: New intelligence shows ISIS based around the Syrian city of Raqqa has been developing plans to kidnap more Western and international hostages in neighboring countries, including Lebanon and Jordan, according to a Middle East security source.

REESE: It's a very plausible scenario that ISIS could move to the refugee camps on the Turkish-Syrian border and Jordanian-Syrian border and target and isolate a Western aid worker or even reporter and try to conduct a kidnapping and pull them into Syria.

BROWN: The fate of 26-year-old American aid worker and ISIS hostage Kayla Mueller remains unknown. ISIS claims Mueller died in a Jordanian air strike but has only made public these images of a dilapidated building as proof.

KAYLA MUELLER, AID WORKER: I am in solidarity with the Syrian people.

BROWN: Mueller's family is holding out hope and sending a direct plea to ISIS. "We have sent you a private message and ask that you respond to us privately," the family said in a statement. "You told us that you treated Kayla as your guest and as your guest, her safety and well-being remains your responsibility."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It has been a living hell for the family and it is today. But Kayla's out there.

BROWN: Meanwhile, following the gruesome murder of a Jordanian pilot, coalition forces are continuing strikes against ISIS targets in Syria and Iraq. The United Arab Emirates has also rejoined the fight by sending a squadron of F-16s to Jordan to fly alongside Jordanian fighter jets.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And right now the U.S. military is trying to gather as much intelligence as it can about ISIS defenses in Mosul. That's according to a Central Command official, so that a key decision can be made about whether the U.S. should step up involvement of U.S. troops in the fight to retake Iraq's second largest city -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right. Pamela, thank you so much.

The war against ISIS in Iraq has reached a critical point with Kurdish forces now confident they are on the brink of driving ISIS fighters out of the country's second largest city.

CNN international correspondent Phil Black is live near Mosul.

Phil, how big of a role are air strikes playing in helping the Kurds as they try to gain ground in Mosul?

PHIL BLACK, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Jake, those Kurdish fighters will tell you those air strikes have played a huge role. And when you're standing at those front line positions looking out into what remains of ISIS controlled territory, you can see that the ability for ISIS to operate, to move around in that territory, has really been impacted significantly.

They can't move around during the day time, really. Certainly can't move around in big numbers. And so the Kurdish fighters tell us that they believe they, together with their international air power, haven't just stopped ISIS from advancing, they believe they have pretty much taken away its ability to surge forward, to advance and take new territory, which is very different to what it was like last summer, when ISIS was first rampaging across this region and it seemed very much an unstoppable force.

But that is only part of the job done. That remaining territory still needs to be cleared. As you said that includes the city of Mosul. Air power alone won't do it. The Peshmerga, the Kurds alone won't do it because it is not a Kurdish town. It's an Arab town so it falls to the Iraq army. That same military force which fled and melted away before ISIS last summer is currently being rebuilt, retrained with just such an operation in mind. But that's obviously a significant task -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right, Phil Black, thank you so much. Please stay safe.

Republican Congressman Peter King is a senior member of the House Homeland Security Committee. He joins us live from Long Island, New York.

Congressman, thanks so much for being with us.

REP. PETER KING (R), NEW YORK: Thank you, Jake.

TAPPER: I want to play some remarks made by the mother of journalist James Foley, who of course was -- unfortunately murdered by ISIS in August of last year. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DIANE FOLEY, SON JAMES FOLEY KILLED BY ISIS: Kayla, along with our son and others, were held for nearly two years. And there were many opportunities along the way, and yet nothing was done to save our young Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: We still don't know for certain the status of Kayla Mueller, the American aid worker. Meanwhile, the White House has said that they are re-evaluating the hostage negotiation policy. She has been very critical of it, saying that the White House basically kept her from trying to negotiate a ransom for her son.

What do you think the position should be of the United States? Should the U.S. be willing to pay ransom? Should we allow families to do so?

KING: Jake, first, let me just say my heart goes out to those families. And I don't know what I'd do if I were in their position. In fact, I guess you'd do anything to try to get your son or daughter back.

Having said that, I think it is very bad national policy to either ransom or even to allow relatives from the country to try to pay ransom because all that would do is encourage more kidnappings, it would give them funding that they would use to kill innocent people but also worse than that, it would just encourage more kidnappings.

You cannot appease people like this. And that's a harsh thing to say but again, a national leader, the president has to look at it from the perspective of the country, and I would say that we should not in any way be -- engaged in ransom at all with ISIS or any other terrorist organization.

TAPPER: James Foley's mother also said in that interview on ABC, talking about the failed rescue mission, that the intelligence obviously was poor.

It has to be asked, is the intel about ISIS so bad that the U.S. military should not even at this point be attempting any rescue missions?

KING: No, we still have to be attempting whatever we can and trying to get the best intelligence.

Jake, I think one of the problems with the intelligence is that when we withdrew all of our troops from Iraq, that made it much harder for us to have intelligence on the ground, it made it harder to get intelligence sources. And that's one of the prices you pay. And the same thing will happen in Afghanistan if we pull out all our troops out. Or even just -- you know, bring down the number of troops.

Certainly in Iraq, but pulling out all the troops, that made it much more difficult for us to get any type of intelligence assets on the ground and also, we have virtually nothing in Syria. So yes, it is more difficult to get intelligence. But having said that, no, we should never give up. And again, the raid that was unsuccessful was -- would have been successful 72 hours earlier. So they did find out a lot. They just didn't find it out in time.

But no, we should not give up but I understand the frustration of the family, absolutely.

TAPPER: Retired Marine General John Allen, who is the presidential envoy for the Global Coalition Against ISIS, says that ISIS is an entirely different enemy than al Qaeda, that ISIS is better organized, that ISIS' command and control structure is superior.

Do you think ISIS is the biggest threat, in your estimation, to the United States?

KING: I would think it's the biggest strategic threat because it controls -- it's almost a nation state. We never had that before where a terrorist organization actually is its own country. And that's almost what ISIS has formed in Syria and Iraq, the way it's surging through the Middle East. It certainly has far more numbers than any other group has and by bringing all these foreign fighters, it gives it the opportunity to send those fighters back to Europe, back to the United States to carry out attacks here.

I would say the biggest immediate threat to the U.S. is Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula. Because they have the capacity to attack here and they have attempted it before. But certainly over the next several years, I would say ISIS is by far the greater threat.

TAPPER: After withdrawing from the military campaign against ISIS, the United Arab Emirates has apparently resumed participation in air strikes over the weekend.

What happened, in your understanding of it? Why did the UAE drop out, why did they resume?

KING: The UAE dropped out -- my understanding is they dropped out because they didn't feel that there was enough support if one of their pilots was down, that the recovery efforts, there weren't enough American troops nearby to recover a pilot that went down. So I think they've lost some faith in us.

Now with Jordan going all out the way they are, UAE is coming back in with Jordan, they're flying support along with Jordan, and I have to give, you know, King Abdullah credit. I mean, here is a person who really responded immediately, showed leadership. He's been an outstanding leader over the years but never more so than over the last week. He has really, really stepped up.

And when you see what he's done over the last three or four days, and this is a small country, only several million people. They are able to do this much damage in three or four days, you wonder why hasn't the U.S. done more over the last six months. We have to go all out. If Jordan is the one who's going to provide the leadership, so be it, but it shows what can be done when a concerted effort is made.

TAPPER: Congressman Peter King, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

Coming up, brand new CDC numbers just out show a huge spike in measles cases across the country. Now adults are asking, how long does the measles vaccine last?

Plus, a shark attack leaving one man dead just a day after another attack in the area. Now lifeguards are scouring the waters looking for the killer shark. And experts say based on the man's injuries, the shark is massive.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. The National Lead now, the measles outbreak that has sparked an emotional debate over vaccines has now spread to three more states as well as Washington, D.C.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention released new numbers today putting the number of cases of the highly contagious disease at 121 with more than 100 of them directly linked to that outbreak that started at Disneyland in California.

Let's bring in Dr. Roshini Raj from New York University Medical Center. She is also a contributing medical editor for "Health" magazine. Dr. Raj, thanks for joining us. What do you make of this new uptick in measles cases?

DR. ROSHINI RAJ, NYU MEDICAL CENTER: Well, it's alarming. I mean, if we think about last year as being one of the highest measles cases we have had in recent history, over 600 cases, we are well on pace to exceed that number.

It's only the first week of February and we are over 100. So this is frustrating as a physician because we know that measles was all but eradicated several years ago due to vaccinations and now we are seeing resurgence because people are not vaccinating their children appropriately.

TAPPER: If you are an adult and you had a vaccine as a child, are you still covered?

RAJ: For the most part, you should be. No vaccine is 100 percent effective and for the measles vaccine, about 5 percent of people may not get full immunity.

Also, after several years, now there have been people vaccinated over 40 years ago, you will have some decrease in immunity, but you still should have some. The bottom line is as adults we wouldn't have to worry if the kids were being vaccinated.

TAPPER: Explain this to me, recommendations for the MMR, which includes measles vaccine, are that it happens for babies after the age of 1.

RAJ: Right.

TAPPER: But if you are, for instance, if you are one of those babies who is in the day care center where there was this outbreak, or even if you are six months old and are traveling abroad, there are recommendations that you can get a vaccine even if you are as young as six months old.

RAJ: That's right.

TAPPER: Why aren't all babies therefore vaccinated at six months for measles?

RAJ: Well, the 12-month age was chosen because that's when the vaccine is most effective so while it is safe at six months, you may not get the full immunity than you would at 1 years of age. So that's why if you are traveling with a small child, who is six months or older, it's worth it to give them at least some protection.

But they probably won't get as much of an effect as if they were 12 months of age. But in general, you brought up the daycare, which is a very scary situation, if you have been exposed to an outbreak. You want to speak to your doctor about checking your immunity, what you should do about your child.

And remember measles can live on a surface even after the infected person has left the room so proper hand hygiene is important. Washing your hands, using alcohol based hand sanitizer. It's a virus like any other virus and you have to take the same precautions.

TAPPER: What do you do if you are a mom and if you have a baby and you are about to get on an airplane, the baby is too young to have gotten a vaccine. I'm asking on behalf of one of the producers on my show. How do you protect your child from the coughing adult three rows back?

RAJ: Right. Again, I think the hand hygiene is probably the most important. You want to use the wipes to wipe down, I do this on any air travel but especially when you are with a young child, clean the surfaces, clean your hands, clean the baby's hands as much as you can. That's what's touching their face and that's how the measles and other viruses can enter their body.

TAPPER: All right, important stuff. Dr. Raj, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

RAJ: Thank you.

TAPPER: Coming up next, after taking six years off from the Grammys, maybe he just couldn't help himself. Kanye West makes his way up onstage again when Beyonce doesn't win "Album of the Year." It's what he said after the show, of course, that has everyone talking today.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome back to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. Finally from us today in Pop Culture, well, I'm going to just let Jay-Z's face tell you this next story. This was Jay's reaction while watching one of the most predictable sequels of all time.

It was as if millions of publicists suddenly cried out in terror when Kanye West stormed the Grammy stage during Beck's best album win, making it all about himself again while pretending to make it about Beyonce again.

After the show, Kanye could not help himself and suggested Beck, who plays more than a dozen instruments and writes his own songs, may not be a real artist.

In a more respectable moment, President Obama made an appearance last night trying to take advantage of the Grammys' huge audience to deliver a lesson about rape and domestic violence. But in that room last night, let's just say the hypocrisy displayed by the music industry may have been louder than any band.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER (voice-over): The truth about domestic violence was finally in the spotlight at the Grammys Sunday with this message from President Obama. BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: It's not OK and it has to stop.

TAPPER: And survivor, Brooke Axtell.

BROOKE AXTELL, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE SURVIVOR: You are worthy of love.

TAPPER: That was all well and good, but of course, the Grammys are about honoring the music, right? And this guy, the one waxing poetic about battering women, yes, he won for "Best Rap Album" within hours of the president's plea to stop domestic abuse.

Eminem, of course, was nominated along with Iggy Azalea, a talent that he wrote about raping in one of his songs. In November, Azalea tweeted my 14-year-old brother is the biggest Eminem fan and now the artist he admired says he wants to rape me. Nice.

We wonder how Azalea felt when he won. Then there's Chris Brown. His song was nominated for two awards last night. Of course, right before the Grammys six years ago, Chris Brown ignited a storm when he abused his old flame, Rihanna. The beating resulted in this infamous TMZ photo.

Brown pleaded guilty to felony assault, but he never served jail time for the crime. This photo of Brown watching the president's message from a prime area arena seat was posted on Twitter as viewers acknowledged the disconnect.

The music industry has a long history of turning a blind eye to abuse. Celebrated artist, Ozzy Osborne and James Brown and Slash, each have at least one Grammy and at least one abuse arrest on his record.

It seems if there is any hope of the industry giving long-lasting recognition to the president's anti-abuse message they may have to put it to a beat.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: A very popular stretch of Australia's coastline is now closed after a surfer from Japan had his legs ripped off and died in the second shark attack in as many days. The mayor of the town where the attack occurred since the 41 victim's friends brought him to shore and tried to stop the bleeding, but it was just too severe.

This was one day before this deadly shark attack 12 miles down the shore a 35-year-old surfer was mauled by a shark. He survived. We do not know whether this was just one hungry shark, but the mayor said he suspects the attacks are linked.

That's it for THE LEAD today. Make sure to follow me on Twitter @jaketapper and also @theleadcnn. Check out our show page at CNN.com/thelead for videos, blogs, and extras. You can also subscribe to our magazine on our flip board.

That's it for THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. Turning you over to Wolf Blitzer right next door in "THE SITUATION ROOM."