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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Judge Rules Against Johnson & Johnson in Opioid Case; G7 Summit Fallout; Sanders, Biden, Warren in Virtual Tie in New 2020 Poll. Aired 4-4:30p ET

Aired August 26, 2019 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:00]

ANA CABRERA, CNN HOST: I'm Ana HILL:.

"THE LEAD" starts right now.

ERICA HILL, CNN HOST: President Trump said it is not about the money; it's location, location, location, as in the president's golf resort.

THE LEAD starts right now.

An empty chair and a story that doesn't add up. President Trump absent from a key meeting, another head-scratching moment at a summit heavy on chaos and confusion.

He has a long history of racially charged, bigoted comments. Now former GOP Congressman Joe Walsh is taking on Trump in 2020 and going after the president's rhetoric. How is he the alternative? I will ask him this hour.

And breaking now, a judge moments away from ruling in what could be one of the biggest financial penalties in U.S. history against a company we all know. And you may even use their products -- that company accused of helping get America hooked.

Welcome to THE LEAD on this Monday. I'm Erica Hill, in for Jake Tapper.

And we begin today with the politics lead.

President Trump on his way back to Washington right now after and often chaotic, confusing, contradictory three days at the G7 summit with world leaders.

Speaking with reporters earlier today, Mr. Trump claims China in a series of high-level calls indicated it wants to make a deal to stem the rapidly escalating trade war. The president saying he will only sign on, though, if it's -- quote -- "fair to the United States."

He also opened the door to meeting with Iran's president under certain circumstances and continued to suggest he may invite Vladimir Putin to next year's G7 summit, which the U.S. will host, likely at a Trump property in Florida. CNN's Abby Phillip starts off our coverage from the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This is a truly successful G7. There was tremendous unity.

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Trump ending this year's G7 summit with his rendition of kumbaya during a joint press conference with the French president.

TRUMP: We would have stayed for another hour. Nobody wanted to leave. We were accomplishing a lot. But I think, more importantly, we were getting along very well, seven countries.

PHILLIP: But minutes later in a solo press conference, the divide between Trump and other world leaders on the climate crisis, Iran and Russia were on full display. Hours after skipping a meeting attended by other G7 leaders on the impact of climate change, Trump once again dismissing the crisis he once called a hoax.

TRUMP: I'm not going to lose that wealth. I'm not going to lose it on dreams, on windmills, which, frankly, aren't working too well.

PHILLIP: Trashing the Iran nuclear deal he pulled the United States out of.

TRUMP: I have to say the JCPOA was a bad deal, should not have been entered into.

PHILLIP: This as France's President Emmanuel Macron defended the deal by meeting with Iran's foreign minister on the sidelines of the summit.

As for the prospect that he might meet with Iranian leaders, Trump initially wouldn't commit to a meeting, but later warmed up to the idea.

TRUMP: I think that there's a really good chance that we would meet.

PHILLIP: Trump continuing to push for Russia to rejoin the G7, despite other world leaders not agreeing.

PHILLIP: Meantime, with global markets in flux as the trade war with China escalates, the issue seemed to dominate the summit.

TRUMP: China wants to make a deal. And if we can, we will make a deal.

PHILLIP: The president offering no apologies for his chaotic strategy to resolve the trade dispute.

TRUMP: It's the way I negotiate. It's done very well for me over the years, and it's doing even better for the country.

PHILLIP: Even as tariffs escalate on both sides, Trump claiming -- without evidence -- that China is now ready to come to the table.

TRUMP: I believe they want to do a deal. The tariffs have hit them very hard in a fairly short period of time.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PHILLIP: And President Trump said that he did not believe that this was weekend was the right time to meet with Iran's foreign minister, who was at the G7.

But he may have another chance. Emmanuel Macron, France's president, says he is working to broker another meeting between President Trump and Iran in the next few weeks -- Erica.

HILL: We will be watching for that. Abby, thank you.

As you take stock of everything we just heard from the president, the president, when asked about his chaotic messaging with China, as we just heard in Abby's piece, which sent the markets into a tailspin, he said that was part of a negotiation tactic.

Amanda, this is the way he negotiates. Is it effective?

AMANDA CARPENTER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, we will see what happens.

I think there's a lot of people in the business community who are hoping for a deal with China. You hear some people say, well, if he gets in electoral trouble, maybe next summer, he will come to the table and make something happen if the economy needs it.

And so I think people are giving him a lot of rope on this. But if you were looking for answers coming out of this summit and clarity on anything from China to Russia to Iran, you weren't going to find it.

I do think he was more statesmanlike here then he has been, given the bar is very low. But he does seem more at ease with outsourcing some of these talks possibly with President Macron, with Iran.

[16:05:08]

And so there is a little bit more steadiness. But, man, this is still rocky ride.

HILL: Next summer is a long way off, by the way.

(LAUGHTER)

CARPENTER: Yes, it is. Yes, it is.

HILL: If you're saying a deal next summer. So there's that.

It was interesting too because he was asked specifically about Russia.

And, Shawna, what he did was he turned once again to former President Obama. Here's that moment. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: He was outsmarted by Putin. He was outsmarted. President Putin outsmarted President Obama. Wait a minute.

And I can understand how President Obama would feel. He wasn't happy. And they're not in for that reason.

I think it would be better to have Russia inside the tent than outside the tent. I do nothing for politics. I do what's right.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: He does what's right. He was asked there specifically about welcoming Russia back in. And the question started off with, oh, hey, by the way, remember the meddling in the 2016 election? Do you think Russia should still be back?

And then this is where he went on the answer. It's fascinating that he's obsessed in some ways with the former president.

SHAWNA THOMAS, VICE NEWS: He is still obsessed with the former president.

I also thought it was interesting that Yamiche Alcindor, who asked him about this, yes, then did a follow-up basically, saying, OK, Russia was kicked out of the G7, frankly, not because they messed with the 2016 election, which is a whole thing for us to deal with, because they annexed Crimea, because they took part of Ukraine and said, now it's ours, which they still have.

And then our president went on this whole rant about how that happened under President Obama, as though he doesn't understand totally that all these things connect together. It doesn't matter if something happened under President Obama. Wars happened under President Obama. Wars happened under President Trump.

These things -- like, the entire world is interconnected. But since, I mean, he leads with this America first idea, and he is now president. And so whatever happened then is not his problem. And that includes the Iran deal, which he got out of, the climate -- the climate pact, which he got out of, and then talking about this.

He sees it under those terms, but also invoking President Obama does stoke his base. And we have to remember the one thing he is really, really good at -- and not just one thing. He's good at multiple things. But the one thing he is really good at is understanding sort of how to play the media to get his message out there, so that his base knows he's fighting for them and is still against President Obama.

HILL: It is fascinating.

And, look, there are some legitimate criticisms of how things may have been handled when it came to Ukraine. That's a topic for another panel, but, to your point, not exactly the way it was laid out there. When we talk about Iran and the possibility of an Iran deal, the president saying he's open now to this meeting. Why not? I mean, you look at it, why not try to get a better deal?

XOCHITL HINOJOSA, DNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Well, I think, right now, I mean, the whole entire trip so far has been failed leadership. And just going back to his base, his base wants America first.

And I think that is what everyone -- what we have seen in polling, but yet he hasn't done that in every step of the way throughout this meeting, whether it is who Putin and putting Russia back into the G7, or whether is not showing up to the climate meeting, or whether it is trying to have the next G7 at his resort, which that's not putting America first.

That's putting Donald Trump first. If you want to put America first, why don't you have it someplace where America benefits? So, again, I think, throughout this entire trip, it is -- we need to start out with showing how this president has failed to do anything.

HILL: So one of the things that has been interesting on this trip is that the White House has been doing a fair amount of cleanup.

And probably -- you just touched on this, but one of the most obvious examples was this meeting earlier today, or -- where the president was not there for this meeting about climate. And he said, well, it was happening later on.

The White House put out a statement saying the president had scheduled meetings and bilaterals with Germany and India, so a senior member of the administration attended in his stead.

But then there was the photo that showed Angela Merkel, that showed Prime Minister Modi. They were at the meeting and the president's chair was empty.

It's amazing, and yet not.

JACKIE KUCINICH, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: And yet very par for the course.

I mean, this -- the cleanup is kind of one -- it's kind of hand in hand when it comes to being a communicator for this administration. The president says one thing and they try to cover for it. But sometimes there's photo evidence that completely -- and -- actually, this has happened several times -- that completely contradict what the White House says.

I mean, the bottom line, climate is not a focus for this administration. I'm actually kind of surprised they worked double duty to try to cover this up, because they have -- their actions show how much they aren't really concerned about climate change. It's not a priority.

It won't be a priority for this administration. The president has said it's a hoax propagated by China. So that doesn't really leave a lot of room for open-mindedness on that issue.

HILL: Stay with us.

We also have breaking news at this hour, a landmark legal ruling. A judge finds a company that we likely all know guilty of a substantial role in one state's opioid crisis.

That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

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ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

HILL: Breaking news in the national lead, a landmark decision in Oklahoma.

A judge finds Johnson & Johnson played a substantial role in that state's devastating opioid crisis. Now, for the first time, a pharmaceutical company is being held accountable for what is one of the worst health epidemics in history.

And here was that key moment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The opioid crisis is an imminent danger and menace to Oklahomans. My judgment includes findings of facts and conclusions of law that the state met its burden that the defendants, Janssen and Johnson & Johnson's misleading marketing and promotion of opioids created a nuisance, as defined by 50-OS Section 1, including a finding that those actions compromised the health and safety of thousands of Oklahomans.

Specifically, defendants caused an opioid crisis that is evidenced by increased rates of addiction, overdose deaths and neonatal abstinence syndrome in Oklahoma.

[16:15:11] This is a temporary public nuisance that can be abated. And the proper remedy for public nuisance is equitable abatement. As I just stated, the opioid crisis has ravaged the state of Oklahoma. It must be abated immediately. For this reason, I am entering an abatement plan that consists of costs totaling $572,102,028 --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: There you saw the judge.

Joining us now, CNN's Alexandra Field, who's at the courthouse in Norman, Oklahoma.

Alex, let's start with you. So, tell us a little bit more about this decision. A significant number but that is far less than they were asking. ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Less money than they were

asking for. But this is really a landmark decision, and this is going to be studied in states across the country. There are dozens of states working to sue big pharma for the role that they say those companies played in fuelling the opioid epidemic that has killed hundreds of thousands of people in the last 20 years, success for the state of Oklahoma, the first state to take a big pharmaceutical company to trial making those allegations.

They claimed that Johnson & Johnson had created a public nuisance, one that cost the state billions of dollars and claimed thousands of lives. After eight weeks of testimony, more than a hundred witnesses the judge said the state had met its burden.

Now, Erica, the state was seeking $17.2 billion worth of abatement that would go toward programs within the state for prevention and treatment and other addiction services, too. The judge in the end ordered $572 million, still a big number. Not what the state was looking for. Not clear how exactly the judge came up with that number. He says if more money needs to be allocated to the crisis, it is something legislators will have to take up.

But, certainly, this is something that's going to be watched closely as you got thousands of other claims against pharmaceutical companies now advancing.

HILL: Absolutely. And the judge so stark in his language there. Not only did they meet the burden, but saying their actions compromised the health and safety and contributed a rise in addiction rates, overdose deaths and neonatal issues as well.

Sanjay, as you look at all of this, and you have covered this so well for so many years, I'm just curious your initial reaction to the finding?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: It's, as Alexandra said, it's a big deal. It's reminiscent of big tobacco sort of drawing this cause and effect. The actions in this case by a drug company led or in part led to this opioid epidemic. It's the first time as Alexandra said, we've had this sort of ruling. So that's a big deal.

You know, for a long time, these drug companies have been saying, look, we weren't to blame. We were the makers of these drugs but it was the over-prescribing of the drugs or cultural issues or whatever it might be, that's not really because of us. This ruling obviously suggests that that's not the case. That there was misinformation that was deliberate and it helped fuel this opioid epidemic.

I think also, you know, if you look at the total economic cost according to the CDC per year of the prescription opioid epidemic, it's around about $80 billion a year, and there is 2,000 cities and counties and states that have filed suit. So, where this goes from here, I don't know. But it's going to make a lot of waves throughout the medical world, throughout the entire world. HILL: Elliot, we'll let you tackle the legal aspect of that. When

you look at this, what could be next? Sanjay mentioned all these other cases. There is other pending legislation and I would imagine that those folks will now be looking at this ruling out of Oklahoma.

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: And it's a remarkable legal theory because I believe this is the first time that a drug company has been found to have created a public nuisance for putting out a drug that functioned exactly as it was intended. It's not like in the 1980s and 1990s where you had the IUD and breast implants that hurt people because they were defective. I mean, these drugs worked the way they intended, they just were intended through what the judge said was misleading advertising and pushing on individuals where there had already been deaths.

And so, this is a fascinating legal theory and, certainly, this case in Ohio that was alluded to a little bit earlier, it's something like 2,000 municipalities have brought lawsuits and those are being consolidated together and they will be looking at this particular legal theory, that a drug company can put out a product as intended, but through a desire -- frankly a desire to generate profits and a desire to keep prescribing when in spite of evidence of individuals being harmed, there you go.

GUPTA: One thing to point out, a nuance there, Elliot is absolutely right. But also the idea that may have worked as intended but the dangers could still be understated.

WILLIAMS: Right.

GUPTA: That there was knowledge about the risk of addiction from this and the impact on the brain that caused these overdose deaths.

[16:20:06] So, it's both. It worked as intended but the dangers were known, I think. And that is part of the concern.

WILLIAMS: And minimized, of course.

GUPTA: Minimized, yes.

WILLIAMS: They knew of the harms and just simply chose not to tell doctors -- not to tell the public or as the judge found that more people could be harmed.

HILL: It's a major ruling and we'll continue to follow it as well, and the fallout.

Elliot Williams, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, Alexandra Field, thank you all.

The first major national poll of 2019 that does not show former Vice President Biden in the lead. We're now talking about what is essentially a three-way tie. Where Biden is losing support, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:25:28] HILL: In our 2020 lead, a new poll out today highlighting the battle at the heart of the 2020 Democratic race. The progressive wing of the party versus the moderates. Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren now virtually tied at the top of the field in the new Monmouth University poll. But is that poll an outlier?

A CNN poll just last week found Biden comfortably at the top. What is not in dispute, though, Senator Warren drawing what maybe her largest crowd to date, as CNN's Jeff Zeleny reports.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D-MA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're not going to win this by just saying not Trump. We're not.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Elizabeth Warren sharpening her electability argument and delivering the message to some of the largest crowds yet of the 2020 campaign. In Seattle on Sunday, and last week in St. Paul, Minnesota, Warren draws thousands in a sign of rising enthusiasm and growing curiosity about her candidacy.

WARREN: And that's what I'm seeing in the crowds, people who are all in.

ZELENY: It is a subtle but mistakable contrast with Joe Biden whose audiences have been far smaller. Yet Biden is still leading the Democratic field by most metrics. As he insists he's the strongest candidate to defeat President Trump. He's not calling for a revolution, but rather hoping to make the race a referendum on Trump.

JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's going to take a movement. It has to be a movement grounded in our values and our ideals that define us as a country. And they're being crushed.

ZELENY: The 2020 contest has been remarkably stable throughout the summer. But campaign advisers tell CNN they believe the race could be far more fluid heading into the fall. A new Monmouth University poll today shows a three-way fight with Warren, Bernie Sanders, and Biden at the top of the field.

Yet that survey stands in contrast to a CNN poll last week that showed Biden with a double-digit lead over Sanders and Warren.

Sanders is also drawing impressive crowds. Just like he did in 2016. A reminder that crowd sizes do not always translate to victory.

But then, like now, the fight for the nomination is framed about whether a progressive or moderate approach offers best chance of winning back the White House. That divide on critical issues like health care on clear displace between Montana Governor Steve Bullock and New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio at back-to-back town halls Sunday night.

GOV. STEVE BULLOCK (D-MT), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't think the best thing to do would be to start all over. I don't want to take away 165 million people that have employer-sponsored health care and take it way. MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There should not be

such a thing as an American who doesn't have insurance or health care. That should be a thing of the past.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ZELENY: Now as for Elizabeth Warren and Joe Biden, the competition between the two of them is intensifying. But so far, they have not yet shared a debate stage. That could soon change. This week, we'll learn which candidates are qualifying for that September debate in Houston.

So far, ten candidates have made the cut, and we'll have until Tuesday -- excuse me, until Wednesday to reach the criteria. So, we will find out if Biden and Warren are side-by-side next month -- Erica.

HILL: We will if they are. All right. Jeff, thank you.

As we look at all of this, it is fascinating to look at these two polls. So there's this new Monmouth poll, as we've just been talking about, and you see Sanders and Warren and Biden basically tied. The margin of error there, six points.

Compare that with the CNN poll from last week, also a six-point margin of error, where you see Joe Biden with the comfortable lead there and then Sanders and Warren at 14 percent and 15 percent.

What may be the biggest takeaway though here and I'll throw this to you as our den at the table, is it really the rise of Elizabeth Warren.

HINOJOSA: Absolutely. I think all of our candidates -- and we're looking at especially the top few and head-to-head against Trump will beat Donald Trump in a head to head. I think that's why he is running scared. But we always knew this is going to be a competitive primary. News flash, this is -- we have a lot of good candidates in the race.

And, you know what? Guess who is not lying about her crowd size. That's Elizabeth Warren. That's a lot of the Democrats around. They are not lying about crowd size the way Donald Trump is.

And so, we're really excited about it. There are ten more debates. I think a lot of people will go after Labor Day. The polling I think will continue to tighten but at the same time, that's when people pay attention. It's right after Labor Day.

So, we still have a long way to go and the voters will decide from there.

HILL: One of the things I thought was interesting, Jackie, I throw this one to you, is the swing among conservative and moderate Democrats. So, if we look at from June, 40 percent were supporting Joe Biden, 10 percent behind Bernie Sanders, 6 percent behind Elizabeth Warren. Now, you look at these numbers, Joe Biden is at 22 percent.

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