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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump Downplays Virus as U.S. Cases Near 7.5 Million with 210,000+ Deaths; Coronavirus Cases Rising Across the Nation After Months of Decline; Poll Shows 21 Percent of Americans More Likely to Wear Masks After Trump Diagnosis; White House Declines CDC Offer to Help With Contact Tracing; White House Most Likely Using Email for Contact Tracing Instead of Calls; Top Pentagon Leadership Is Quarantining After COVID Exposure. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired October 06, 2020 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Back now with our NATIONAL LEAD as President Trump cancels stimulus talks and downplays the virus that hospitalized him for three nights. There remain more than 210,000 Americans who have died from the virus, and cases in this country are surging with just four states showing cases trending down.

The situation in New York City is also getting worse, but as CNN's Erica Hill reports, New York Governor Andrew Cuomo has yet to approve Mayor de Blasio's plans to roll back some of the openings.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ERICA HILL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This bustling New York neighborhood, one of nine hotspots in the city,

ROBERT CARROLL (D) NY STATE ASSEMBLY: I do think there's fatigue. I think it's been a long six months.

HILL: The Mayor pushing to close nonessential businesses in those areas. The Governor not yet on board.

MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D) NEW YORK CITY: The important thing is to come to a decision quickly so we can get going.

HILL: New York among the 22 states reporting an uptick in new cases over the past week, and one in five with an increase of more than 50 percent.

MICHAEL OSTERHOLM, DIRECTOR, CENTER FOR INFECTIOUS DISEASE RESEARCH AND POLICY, UNIVERISTY OF MINNESOTA: There are a number of us who fear that over the next 6 to 12 weeks, we could see a very substantial increase in COVID-19 cases that would far surpass even the peak that we saw earlier this summer.

HILL: Alaska, Utah and Kentucky just saw their highest seven-day average of new cases. Governor Andy Beshear urging his state to mask up.

GOV. ANDY BESHEAR (D) KENTUCKY: Now's our test, a test of values, a test of faith. Are we willing to live for other people?

HILL: The CDC updating its guidance again adding information about airborne spread. Guidance it posted and then removed last month.

Hospitalization hitting record highs in half dozen states.

JOHN LOWE, UNIVERSITY OF NEBRASKA MEDICAL CENTER: This is potentially a perfect storm for Nebraska.

HILL: The "New York Times" reporting the White House is trying to block new FDA Emergency Use Authorization guidelines for a vaccine. Which would likely push any approval past election day.

The FDA making it clear it wants two months of follow-up data after volunteers get their second dose of a trial vaccine before making any decisions.

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIRECTOR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: I think comfortably around November or December, we'll know whether or not the vaccine is safe and effective.

HILL: We already know masks can save lives. A new Axios/Ipsos poll finds 21 percent of Americans are more likely to wear one after President's positive diagnosis. His defiant photo-op striking a nerve.

FIANA GARZA TULIP, MOTHER DIED OF CORONAVIRUS IN JULY: It was the cruelest visual yet. Yesterday's tweet was cruelest tweet yet. And I truly do wonder how many people he killed with his actions yesterday.

DR. CHRIS T. PERNELL, LOST FATHER TO COVID-19: It feels as if he's mocking, and I really, really am calling on others to just to stand up and to say enough is enough.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HILL: Jake, I want to point out some important new findings from the CDC, that detail on not only how the virus spreads but will probably make everybody think twice about family gatherings.

A 13-year-old girl who had been exposed to the virus had a negative antigen test and then went on a family vacation. She had a little bit of a stuffy nose. That was her only symptom. Well, after three weeks of about five different family households sharing a house with five bedrooms and two baths, 11 people tested positive ranging in age from 9 to 72. There were also hospitalizations involved.

And what the CDC is pointing out here the takeaways they say are number one. Kids and adolescents can be spreaders even with mild symptoms.

Number two, physical distancing makes a difference. These rapid antigen test results should be followed up with a PCR test especially if someone's been exposed. And Jake, they're also saying, regardless, if you have been exposed to someone who you know has the virus, self-quarantine for 14 days.

TAPPER: President Trump should take that advice. Erica Hill, thank you so much.

President Trump promising with no evidence to back it up that a vaccine will be available momentarily. Now we're learning more about what he's been saying to executives at the pharmaceutical companies that are working on a vaccine. That story next.

[15:35:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: In our HEALTH LEAD today, President Trump has personally called and pressured CEOs of pharmaceutical companies to speed up their vaccine, saying he'd like to see a vaccine move quicker than even some of his own health advisers say is reasonable, according to a person familiar with the conversation speaking to CNN.

Joining me now is Chief of Infectious Diseases at Massachusetts General Hospital, Dr. Rochelle Walensky. Dr. Walensky, good to see you again. If the President is pressuring pharmaceutical companies to rush a vaccine, does that make you lose confidence in the safety and efficacy of the first vaccines that are going to be available?

DR. ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CHIEF OF INFECTIOUS DISEASES, MASSACHUSETTS GENERAL HOSPITAL: Good afternoon, Jake, here's what we know. We know that when the science emerges as to how well that vaccine works, we don't have any control whether it's 50 percent efficacious, 60 percent efficacious. We don't have any control as to how safe it's going to be when that science emerges.

What we do have control over is the public trust, and that public trust is going to be critically important, perhaps even more important than in fact how that vaccine works. Because it will only work if it's given to people. As is commonly said in the vaccine field, vaccines don't save people, vaccinations do.

And so, we really need to make sure there's public trust in what is rolled out, and I would say any sidesteps towards that public trust, towards rushing things will only undermine its ultimate goal.

TAPPER: Yes, and there's polling indicating that many people have lost faith in the process with President Trump pressuring these executives, that's not going to help.

[15:40:00]

I want to turn to contact tracing. The Centers For Disease Control And Prevention offered to help the White House with contact tracing, because, of course, the President and so many people in his orbit are positive for the virus, but the White House declined the CDC's offer.

You and I have talked before about how important it is to conduct contact tracing, to figure out who you were in touch with so they can all quarantine. What's your reaction to this?

WALENSKY: You know, I wish I could say I'm surprised. Here's what we know even going back a week or so. We know that the President, though he recognized he was exposed to Miss Hicks, boarded a plane and went to New Jersey.

We know that the Vice President, though he was sitting in two rows that were sort of a sea of COVID in that Rose Garden scene, has not been quarantined. We know that the President, who was in isolation for his COVID, was out and about in a parade during his hospitalization.

So, we have numerous examples of how proper infection control policies have not been followed, and so I think it stands to reason that perhaps contact tracing also wouldn't be.

I want to make one other point, and that is that I think at this point we know at least 14 people involved in White House activities have been diagnosed with COVID. We have early on talked about the R-Zero of this disease being about 2.5 when there aren't distancing and masking measures to prevent it.

In that context, we can probably estimate that about 35 more people have gotten COVID. Without contact tracing, without masking, without distancing, and that just further multiplies without the proper contact tracing and other measures to take this in check.

TAPPER: So the White House physician, Commander Sean Conley, said yesterday, that he believed contact tracing was being done, according to the "New York Times" however contact tracing has been limited mainly to e-mails notifying people of potential exposure instead of other forms of contact like a phone call. Are e-mails adequate? Is that enough?

WALENSKY: So, e-mails can be considered notification, indeed, but they can't be considered contact tracing.

First of all, I will say people who have generally been exposed to people with COVID have a lot of questions. What about my family? Can I go out? Who else should I be discussing this with? Who else might I have put at risk? What about my elderly parents?

There are a lot of questions that come up as you do this contact tracing, and in fact among those 14 people who were newly diagnosed, not just the President, or I should say 13 others, who have they have been exposed to in the 48 hours prior to their diagnosis, prior to their symptoms,? And they should be notified.

So there's a wave of people, it's a bit of a domino effect of people you really need to properly contact and answer their questions, make sure that they're informed, offer them testing if testing is appropriate, make sure that they understand the implications for symptoms if they develop. This is not an e-mail notification. This is a discussion.

TAPPER: I just have a quick yes or no question. If you were Senator Kamala Harris would you go on stage with Mike Pence tomorrow? WALENSKY: I think Mike Pence should not be on stage. I think Mike

Pence should be quarantined.

TAPPER: Dr. Rochelle Walensky, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

Coronavirus spreading beyond 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue into the halls of the Pentagon now, the national security implications, we'll discuss it with a former CIA Director, that's next.

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[15:45:00]

TAPPER: With all but one member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff now self- quarantining, and President Trump himself in recovery for COVID, there have been national security implications invoked in the last two days.

Former CIA Director John Brennan is with me now. He has a new book out just today It's called "Undaunted: My Fight Against America's Enemies at Home and Abroad."

Thank you so much for joining us Director Brennan, appreciate it, congratulations on the book. Let me just get your initial response to President Trump, the President of the United States, having coronavirus.

JOHN BRENNAN, FORMER CIA DIRECTOR, OBAMA ADMINISTRATION 2013-2017: Well, we all wish him a full recovery. I think we need to have two very healthy candidates vying for the election next month.

But I am concerned about the disruption to the national security hierarchy in terms of people who are falling ill as a result of COVID. And so clearly there is concern that our foreign adversaries might try to take advantage of that because of the preoccupation and distraction that is understandably underway right now, as we try to ensure that the health of our senior officials is going to be fine.

TAPPER: So how would they do that? How would foreign adversaries, whether Russia or China or Iran or North Korea, how would they try to take advantage of a situation like this?

BRENNAN: Well, might China try to do something right now on Hong Kong in terms of increased pressure. Might Russia try do something in Belarus a country that has experienced a fair amount of political instability over the last several months?

Might the Iranians try and do something in the Gulf, or a terrorist attack taking place thinking that the U.S. government is in fact preoccupied and distracted here in Washington because of the COVID pandemic.

So, I'm sure that foreign adversaries' intelligence services have their collection systems turned up to high, so they understand exactly how disruptive this pandemic is, again, on our national security structure.

[15:50:00]

TAPPER: Yes, and we should point out that on this day four years ago, the "Access Hollywood" tape hadn't even dropped. The WikiLeaks e-mails hacked by -- from John Podesta hadn't been dumped which the Russians obviously had a hand in according to the intelligence community.

Comey hadn't come back. There's still a lot of time for a lot of things to happen that could potentially impact the election.

BRENNAN: Absolutely, it's a very unsettled time. It always is before a major presidential election as a President and others are involved in the campaigning that goes along with that election.

So you layer on top of that the pandemic, and you layer on top of that then the economic disruption, if I were foreign, you know, adversary of the United States, I'd be looking at how we could take advantage of the United States position right now which clearly has been I think weakened.

Now I do think that there are very robust structures and chains of command in place in the U.S. military. So even though many of the Joint Chiefs are ill with COVID, they are an advisory body, they're not in the chain of command. So, I am confident that U.S. military forces, as well as the intelligence professionals around the world are continuing to carry out their jobs and are trying to do their utmost to keep this country safe.

TAPPER: Speaking of intelligence professionals. The Director of National Intelligence John Ratcliffe has now released a number of documents declassifying them including one that is your own handwritten notes on Russian intelligence alleging that Hillary Clinton was plotting to stir up a scandal about Donald Trump to distract from her e-mail scandal.

What can you tell about these notes that you wrote about this Russian intelligence and what do you make of DNI Ratcliffe releasing them right now?

BRENNAN: Well, John Ratcliffe is anything but an intelligence professional. It is appalling his selective declassification of information that clearly is designed to advance the political interests of Donald Trump and Republicans who are aligned with him.

But these were my notes from the 2016 period when I briefed President Obama and the rest of the National Security Council team about what the Russians were up to and I was giving examples of the type of access that the U.S. intelligence community had to Russian information and what the Russians were talking about and alleging.

Now, if, in fact, what the Russians were alleging that Hillary was trying to highlight the reported connections between Trump and the Russians, if in fact that was accurate and that's a big "if," there is nothing at all illegal about that. And so, John Ratcliffe and others are trying to portray this as potentially unlawful activity that deserves follow up investigation by the FBI. No, it was a campaign activity. But again, I was giving examples to the President and others of the types of access we had, and I was blind to whether it referred to one candidate or the other. I was blind to whether it would refer to one party or the other.

And what I might also point out, I know that John Ratcliffe released a memo that was sent over to the FBI, it's called a CIOL which is a Counterintelligence Operational Lead. Which was again a very selective release and declassification, there are a lot of other CIOLs that talk about the contacts that were taking place between individuals associated with the Trump campaign and the Russians.

So he might want to think about trying to balance some of these releases by providing information to the American public about what the intelligence community had unearthed during this period of time about Russia's interactions with those involved in the Trump campaign.

TRUMP: So, if the election's contested, you note it wouldn't be the first time. You wrote about the 2000 election, 20 hears ago in your book. You write, quote, a Supreme Court ruling effectively gave George W. Bush the electoral college victory five weeks after the last popular vote was cast. The CIA provided daily support to two "presidents-in-waiting" during that time. You were briefing both Al Gore and George W. Bush not knowing which one was going to be President.

President Trump has said that if he doesn't win in November, it's because the system is rigged. What happens if we have a similar situation, a contested election? How might foreign actors be preparing?

Oh, we lost John Brennan on Cisco Webex. In any case, his book is out. And it's called "Undaunted: My Fight Against America's Enemies at Home and Abroad."

We wish former Director Brennan best of luck with his new book.

Coming up, breaking news, the markets responding after President Trump kills any hope for another stimulus plan from Congress for thousands of Americans who desperately need help making ends meet. Stay with us.

[15:55:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. And we continue this hour with the breaking news.

President Trump tweeting late this afternoon that he is pulling the plug on the latest negotiations for a COVID stimulus relief bill which would, of course, leave millions of Americans without help in the midst of this coronavirus pandemic.

The markets reacting by falling. The Dow just about to close down some 350 or so points. Speaker Nancy Pelosi releasing a statement saying, quote, clearly, the White House is in complete disarray, unquote. This comes as the President Trump is battling coronavirus himself.