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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump Calls Off Coronavirus Relief Negotiations; White House COVID-19 Outbreak Grows; Sen. Mazie Hirono (D-HI) is Interviewed About Trump's Balcony Photo-Op and Republicans Pushing Ahead to Confirm Amy Coney Barrett; Pence Team Objects to Plexiglass Barrier at Tomorrow's VP Debate. Aired 4-4:30p ET

Aired October 06, 2020 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:01]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: This comes as President Trump is battling coronavirus himself, his physician releasing a new brief update on the president's condition, a short note saying Trump is now reporting no symptoms as he battles the virus, still leaving unanswered many key questions about the president's fight with the virus, such as his temperature, his lung scans, his current medications.

Meantime, President Trump is saying he has overcome the virus, and the country can, too, but, of course, he -- also saying that you can't let this lethal virus, which has killed more than 210,000 Americans -- quote -- "dominate your lives>" Can't let it dominate your lives, the president said.

The comment has offended many Americans who have lost loved ones to the virus or are suffering health problems, not to mention all of us who, of course, had to change our lives, whether through remote education for our kids or canceled weddings and bar mitzvahs.

The notion that this virus that has been mishandled isn't already dominating our lives specifically because of the government's inadequate response is, frankly, insulting and offensive to all of us.

Do you remember this from seven months ago today?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Anybody that wants to test can get a test.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Just seven months ago, he said that. It's still not true.

How great would it be if every student and every teacher could get a test? But they can't. The president continues to push lies to the American public about the virus, again falsely comparing the annual death rate from the seasonal flu to that of the novel coronavirus, using false numbers, even though the president is on tape in February privately to Bob Woodward admitting that he knows coronavirus is much deadlier than the flu.

Just one of the signs that the president's infection has only hardened those inaccurate views of the pandemic or willingness to lie about it, even as his own White House has become a hotbed of infection.

Joining me now is CNN White House correspondent Kaitlan Collins.

Kaitlan, it's not really clear what prompted the president to tweet that he is pulling out of stimulus negotiations less than a month before the election. It doesn't seem politically all that savvy to me.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, his advisers were certainly hoping it could actually help give him a boost.

But it's not clear what happened and what drove this, because the Treasury secretary, who was doing the negotiating on behalf of the administration, Jake, was supposed to meet with -- or speak with the House Speaker Nancy Pelosi in just a matter of hours.

And, of course, now that is not going to happen, since the president says they will not be making any agreement at least until after the election, which sent the stock market in the direction that the president does not want it to go in.

And, to be clear, these sides were not close to any kind of agreement, but they were at least talking and making some kind of progress. But now, thanks to what the president said, there will be no relief for the millions of Americans who do not have jobs or have not recovered their jobs yet, or, of course, the small businesses that need an influx of cash at this time.

The president says that is not going to happen until at least after November the 3rd.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

COLLINS (voice-over): Back at the White House from a three-day hospital stay, President Trump is downplaying coronavirus, and says he's looking forward to debating Joe Biden in nine days.

ALYSSA FARAH, WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS: He's looking forward to it. He's ready. And I think he's going to go in with an even new mind-set on the coronavirus.

COLLINS: Trump's own physician says he's still not out of the woods when it comes to his diagnosis, but, for now, he's staying in the White House residence and considering delivering a national address.

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I expect that you will see him in some form today. I will leave that to him exactly how that is.

COLLINS: Trump's press secretary is working from home after testing positive for coronavirus, adding to a growing list of officials who are staying home because they tested positive or were in contact with a colleague who did. At least one member of the military who is directly assigned to support the president in the Oval Office and residents tested positive, as did a third staffer in the press office.

With officials worried about possible exposure, the West Wing looked more like a ghost town today. And dramatic photos showed the Briefing Room being disinfected by White House employees dressed in full protective gear.

Alongside a final pitch for Joe Biden...

MICHELLE OBAMA, FORMER FIRST LADY: Votes are already being cast.

COLLINS: ... Michelle Obama referenced the White House outbreak today, noting that the Secret Service and residence staff should never be taken for granted.

The president didn't allude to the heightened concern as he returned to the White House Monday night with a staged entrance. A campaign spokesman wrongly claimed that the president was alone on the balcony when he took his mask off.

HOGAN GIDLEY, TRUMP 2020 CAMPAIGN NATIONAL PRESS SECRETARY: The president is alone on the balcony outside. He takes his mask off.

COLLINS: But that's not true. A photographer was right behind the president, and afterward he went inside to reshoot his entrance with a camera crew already waiting.

The president spent the day spreading misinformation, and Facebook removed one of his posts after he falsely claimed that the flu was responsible for more deaths than the coronavirus.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[16:05:00]

COLLINS: Now, Jake, earlier, White House officials said there was a chance we would hear from the president today. There was that talk of a national address.

But now my colleague Jeff Zeleny is told, it's likely just going to be a recorded address done in the next hour or so and released in the coming hours.

But, so far, officials are describing the atmosphere in the West Wing today as chaotic, Jake, because there's a lot of staff working remotely, of course, quarantining, whether or not they were positive or someone they knew were positive.

And this source said that the president is the one calling the shots.

TAPPER: All right, Kaitlan Collins at the White House for us, thank you so much.

Let's bring in CNN chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta. Sanjay, the president's doctor says he's showing no symptoms today. He's saying that he has ambulatory oxygen saturation levels of 95 to 97 percent. I will note that he wouldn't tell us what the negative oxygen levels were when he was in the hospital. But he's certainly willing to share the more positive ones.

But, be that as it may, what does this tell us about the president's condition?

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it tells us, right now, if you look at those numbers, that he's doing pretty well. I mean, if he's ambulating around, moving around, and he's keeping his oxygenation up, that's an encouraging sign, presumably not getting any supplemental oxygen.

I think it's -- those are good indicators. So you can say, at this point in time, he's doing well. But we know a lot about this disease. And we have to anticipate what might happen in someone who has active COVID disease, is dealing with these medications that he's receiving, the steroids, all those sorts of things.

You got to create a fuller picture, and you got to still say, look, does this mean he's free and clear, or does this mean he's got to continue to be monitored for several days, which is -- I think it's the latter.

TAPPER: And that's the point here is that Commander Conley is continuing only providing information that reflects well on the president's health, almost only.

What other questions do you need to have answered before knowing how well President Trump is truly doing?

GUPTA: Well, there's a lot of data, right? I mean, just basic vital signs would be good to know. We have been told his oxygen saturation.

Is having a fever today? What's his heart rate? Does he have any signs of other dysfunction of any organs? Does he have pneumonia? I mean, it's a respiratory virus? They still have not answered that question. There is an answer to that question, because they conceded did that he's had these imaging studies done. So what do they show?

They weren't normal, they said. They had findings, they said. That's a really important question.

I'd like to see lab results that give me an indication, how much inflammation does he have in his body? We know that that inflammation can be really problematic for other organs, can be associated with blood clotting. Is he on blood thinners?

I mean, there's lots of questions to ask. And, frankly, when medical people communicate, they usually put this in a one-sheet sort of thing. It's all the relevant information for someone to have a really clear idea what's happening.

They're obviously not giving us that, Jake. TAPPER: And the president's team, they admitted yesterday he's not

out of the woods yet.

Today, he's declaring victory over the virus, telling the American people to live their lives, not fear infection, don't let it dominate your lives.

We have seen a number of interviews and videos from people who have lost loved ones truly offended by the way the president is talking about this. What was your reaction?

GUPTA: I share their -- I share their being offended by it, I mean, pretty deeply.

I mean, taking off the mask and saying, you have nothing to fear, I mean, first of all, I mean, he's obviously in a very privileged position to be able to say that. Most people have nowhere near those resources.

But this is still a contagious, deadly virus out there. I mean, essentially, he is advocating for herd immunity, which is something we have talked about a lot on your program. And it's just this idea of, let's throw up our hands, we got nothing that we can do here. We're just going to throw up our hands and let this virus sort of run free through our nation.

I don't -- I mean, it's a terrible strategy. Maybe up to two million people would die, depending on the model that you look at. Hospitals would become overwhelmed. I mean, it would be so destructive. And yet that's essentially what he was sort of advocating, take off the mask, you got nothing to fear.

It's really problematic for people who are already not taking this seriously, obviously, Jake.

TAPPER: And lest the president only mislead about that, the president also tweeted this about the flu today -- quote -- "Flu season is coming up. Many people every year, sometimes over 100,000, and despite the vaccine, die from the flu."

Fact-check, that number is not true.

"Are we going to close down our country? No, we have learned to live with it, just like we're learning to live with COVID, in most populations far less lethal."

First of all, we haven't had 100,000 Americans die from the flu since 1968, I believe.

But, right now, more than 700 Americans are dying per day from coronavirus. Has any health expert suggested that the United States should just live with that?

GUPTA: No.

I mean, no public health expert has suggested that. And the reality is that, even without -- it's always been this false choice, right? You have to close everything down in order to save lives.

[16:10:01]

There's plenty of countries around the world, Jake, they wear masks when they go outside. They're good about hand hygiene. They keep distance. But the countries are very much up and running. And they are having a small fraction of the number of cases every day that we have, a small fraction of the number of deaths that we have every day.

So, nobody -- not only are people not suggesting that this needs to be the way that it is that this many people die today. They're offering a very tangible, easy-to-implement solution. They're not just presenting the problem. They're presenting a plan.

And the plan is an easy one to execute. So, it's one of these things where I think, if you look at public health experts, they have been -- they're frustrated, after so many months of saying the same thing, you might imagine.

Let me just follow up on the flu deaths really quick. I think we have this graphic. You're absolutely right, Jake. I mean there's some 210,000 people who've died of coronavirus this year, seven, eight months now. That's more than the last five years combined when it comes to flu.

So, flu is serious. I mean, we have always said it. And the flu vaccine is really important. But this coronavirus is exponentially worse right now. And we're still not addressing it.

TAPPER: Yes.

And there are flu shots, and there is not a vaccine for coronavirus.

GUPTA: There are flu shots.

TAPPER: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you so much.

Coming up next: what Democrats are saying about President Trump's decision to suddenly end stimulus talks, leaving thousands of Americans without a much-needed lifeline.

Plus: what one airport is doing to give travelers a little peace of mind when flying in the age of coronavirus.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:15:45]

TAPPER: We've got breaking news in our money lead. The Dow falling more than 375 points this afternoon after President Trump tweeted just over an hour ago that he is ending all negotiations on the coronavirus relief deal.

CNN's Alison Kosik joins me live. And, Alison, this isn't just about a one day drop you think. You

believe that there could be serious, long term impacts.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. I mean, the nervousness, you could just see it, just when President Trump tweeted that he wasn't going to go ahead negotiate the stimulus package anymore until after the election. We saw 622-point swing on the Dow. It had been up 206 points and then fell 416 points.

This is interesting because the president isn't listening to the Fed Chair Jay Powell who hours before held a virtual conference with the National Association of Business Economics repeating the need for stimulus that is key to keep the economic recovery going. In fact, Powell saying that the risk of Congress pouring too much stimulus into the economy are greater than not doing enough.

Another irony here with the president. The president uses the stock market, he uses the economy as a barometer of his success. In fact, he tweeted our economy is doing very well. The stock market at record levels. Jobs and unemployment are coming back.

Yeah, we are seeing a recovery but that recovery is stalling out. And when there's no stimulus package in the mix, you can't expect the economy to move forward. Jake, we've got millions of people out of work. Their basic -- you saw what happened when they had that supplemental unemployment. It helped them put food on the table. It helped them pay their bills.

But now, they've got nothing. And the reality is, Jake, these Americans and these small businesses, they need that money now.

TAPPER: All right. Alison Kosik in New York, thank you so much.

Joining us to discuss, Democratic senator from Hawaii, Senator Maize Hirono.

Senator, let's start with the president announcing this afternoon that he is ending the talks over the stimulus. Nancy Pelosi, the speaker of the House, had been talking with Treasury Secretary Mnuchin.

But President Trump tweeted: I have instructed my representatives to stop negotiating until after the election, when, immediately after I win, we will pass a major stimulus bill.

What's your response to that?

SEN. MAIZE HIRONO (D-HI): It's very clear that the president and Mitch McConnell do not put protecting American people as a priority. They make it so plain. This reminds me of Trump saying, I'm going to build a wall and Mexico will pay for it.

And if people fall for his lies one more time, oh, my goodness. So, that's the president.

TAPPER: We also --

HIRONO: That's one thing one day.

TAPPER: Yeah.

HIRONO: Another, another day.

TAPPER: We all saw President Trump last night moments after he returned to the White House, he was, in fact, remains infected with COVID-19. He came out on the balcony, took off his mask. There was a White House photographer behind him.

HIRONO: Uh-huh.

TAPPER: Today, the president's doctor released a memo in which President Trump said he is experiencing no symptoms. President Trump reports no symptoms.

What's your reaction?

HIRONO: Most medical professionals are wondering what exactly happened to the president are saying that he is not out of the woods yet. I would like to hear his personal physician say he is not out of the woods yet. I don't think we're going to hear that from this physician. If he does say that, he's not telling us the full picture.

So, here's the president --

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: Well, I mean, the White House physician say that. The White House physician did say it yesterday that the president is not entirely out of the woods. He wouldn't go in detail --

HIRONO: Well, there you go.

TAPPER: -- about a number of other items, but he did say that.

HIRONO: Good. But the president continues to play down this pandemic. He lied to us from the very beginning.

And so, you know, Dr. Fauci has to say that we should not trivialize this pandemic when you have 40,000 people a day testing positive, with 7 million now plus testing positive and over 210,000 people dying.

This is not -- this is not a trivial matter? Tell that to all of the families who are suffering from what's going on in this pandemic.

And, by the way, Jake, you know, this pandemic is touching all of us. My mother in Hawaii is in a nursing facility. I have not been able to visit her in seven months.

So, this is something that so many families are having to undergo.

And now, the president is saying, forget it, we are not going to do another stimulus when millions of people are out of work and millions are without health care. And the main thing they want to do -- hear me, Mitch, and Lindsey Graham -- is to put this nominee on the court just in time for her to listen to the Affordable Care Act case so that she can vote to strike down the Affordable Care Act, costing millions of people off of healthcare.

TAPPER: Yeah --

HIRONO: This is their number one priority.

TAPPER: I want to talk about Judge Barrett in a second. But I'm curious about what the protocols are for the safety of U.S. senators and their staff on Capitol Hill, because three of your colleagues right now have tested positive for COVID, including Utah Senator Lee and North Carolina Senator Tillis, people who attended that event announcing Judge Barrett as a Supreme Court nominee.

What is -- what is the protocol for somebody like you going into work? Do they require masks on Capitol Hill? Are you -- do you have access? Does your staff have access to COVID tests? Because it's quite possible that the hot zone at the White House might also become a hot zone on Capitol Hill.

HIRONO: Of course, when you have three senators that currently have tested positive. So there is no protocol that Mitchell McConnell or Lindsey Graham have put forward or veto (ph).

So, they want to have this hearing, come hell or high water, and there is very little -- in fact, they haven't said anything about how they (INAUDIBLE) to protect the senators who are going to be attending this hearing.

TAPPER: Can -- is there anything that Democrats can do to stop the nomination of Judge Coney -- Coney Barrett?

It appears to me from my reporting and conversations with Democrats and Republicans that really if they have the votes, they have the votes and there is not much you can do.

HIRONO: We are still waiting for two more Republican senators to develop some guts, but I'm not holding my breath. But, at the same time, we are in the middle of a pandemic that has entered really the Judiciary Committee and, yet, Lindsey Graham and Mitch McConnell do not prioritize the safety of their own senators.

So we are -- I'm going to take whatever precautions I can. I think most of us who attended judiciary hearing over the last week, most of us have been tested. I have tested negative. But that doesn't mean that I'm not still susceptible.

TAPPER: Yeah.

HIRONO: So we will see. But we, of course, are saying this is no time for us to compromise the safety of any of us. And it's not just us, it's our staff, all of the people who have to work at the Capitol.

TAPPER: Yeah.

HIRONO: But this shows so plainly that their number one priority is that justice would strike down the Affordable Care Act. We already know that because Amy Barrett has said that Chief Justice Roberts' decision that save the Affordable Care Act went way beyond what he should have done to find that act constitutional.

TAPPER: Senator Mazie Hirono, thanks for joining us today. I do hope you get to see your mom soon.

HIRONO: Thank you. Keep your fingers crossed. Yes, we need to get control over this pandemic.

TAPPER: I hope so. For all --

HIRONO: And we can't count (ph) on this president to do it.

TAPPER: For all the people who can't see their aging loved ones.

Thank you so much, Senator.

HIRONO: Thanks.

TAPPER: We've got breaking news on the vice presidential debates and the debate over the plexiglass barriers that the vice president's office is mocking.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:28:25]

TAPPER: Breaking news. The vice president's chief of staff, Marc Short, has just said that the Pence team objects to a plexiglass barrier being installed for both Pence and Senator Kamala Harris at tomorrow night's first and only vice presidential debate.

CNN's Ryan Nobles joins me now.

Ryan, just to make it clear, it is the Trump/Pence White House's own reckless behavior that has caused this -- the White House to become a hot zone and Pence has not been quarantining, even though he should be according to medical experts. And now, they are objecting to the idea that Senator Harris wants some sort of safety on the stage?

RYAN NOBLES, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: That's exactly right, Jake. The Harris camp asked for this provision after the debate between the two presidential candidates last week which, of course, President Trump shortly after that debate tested positive for the coronavirus. So they thought that additional precautions should be put in place here in Salt Lake City for the vice presidential debate.

Among the things they asked for was that the candidates to be separated further apart than what was originally planned. They agreed to that from seven to 12 feet.

And then the Harris campaign also asked that both the vice president and senator have a plexiglass barrier in front of them to separate them even more.

Now, the Pence camp said they had no problem with Harris having the plexiglass barrier around her. What they object to is the vice president having that same plexiglass barrier.

Marc Short, who is the vice president's chief of staff, telling our Jim Acosta they don't believe there is any additional safety benefit to having that plexiglass barrier put in place.

What we don't know at this point if it will have any impact whether this debate is taking place.

[16:30:00]