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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Campaign Strategies?; Voter Intimidation Concerns Growing; President Trump Expresses No Regrets Over Pandemic Response. Aired 3- 3:30p ET

Aired October 21, 2020 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:03]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

And we begin with the 2020 lead today -- quote -- "Not much."

That's what President Trump said today when asked if there is anything he would do differently to combat the COVID pandemic, "Not Much."

The president and Democratic nominee, Joe Biden, are in the final sprint of this historic election. And now, with more than 221,000 Americans dead from coronavirus, more than eight million Americans infected, tens of millions facing economic hardship, kids not able to learn in classrooms, President Trump is saying that, if given the opportunity to do it all over again, he would not change much about his handling of the pandemic, talking to Sinclair television's "America This Week."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ERIC BOLLING, SINCLAIR BROADCAST GROUP: Is there anything that you think you could have done differently?

If you had a mulligan or a do-over on one aspect of the way you handled it, what would it be?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Not much.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: "Not much," the president says, an astounding claim, given that the us has both the highest death and highest infection rates in the world, according to official numbers, and the fact that the virus is right now on the wrong trajectory.

No expression of regret for downplaying the virus in February and March, for not getting an aggressive nationwide testing and contact tracing program up and running, for not setting an example and wearing masks and social distancing.

"Not much," the president said. Instead, President Trump is continuing to hold his reckless rallies

during this deadly pandemic, no masks required, no distancing, just one potential super-spreader event after another, including tonight in North Carolina, risking their health and even the lives of his supporters, and everyone else with whom they come in contact, while he attacks the nation's leading infectious disease expert, Dr. Anthony Fauci, and the restrictions put in place in other states, such as Pennsylvania, to keep Americans safe.

Let's get right to CNN's Kaitlan Collins live outside the White House.

Kaitlan, this "Not much" comment from the president is without question going to be used against him. But, according to Trump, that's how we think see, he's done a great job, and it's Dr. Anthony Fauci is the one who's made mistakes.

This is an opinion, we need to point out, at odds with pretty much every one of the respected leaders in the medical and health community.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jake.

And if you speak to those people in the medical community, they say that those statements made by Dr. Fauci, and even others, like the surgeon general, were made at a time when people learned more about this pandemic that people did not know about, and they learned as they went on.

And that's why their guidance, including from the CDC, changed. But that's not the way the president has used it. Instead, he hasn't gone after the surgeon general for what he said about not wearing masks earlier on in this pandemic. Instead, he's chosen only to attack Dr. Anthony Fauci, who of course, has high approval ratings and has been a prominent figure out in interviews.

And so the president's comment to Sinclair saying that there is very little he would change about his response to the pandemic is going to be a question of how that looks in the eyes of voters, who, of course, so far, Jake, have rejected the president's handling of coronavirus.

And that's something he even acknowledged at his rally last night in Pennsylvania. I was there, and he was saying that, if it had been pre- pandemic, he likely wouldn't have even needed to go to a place like Erie, Pennsylvania, as he was last night, because his numbers were so good.

But he acknowledged that his standing has been hurt by the fallout from coronavirus. And that's something that, of course, his advisers worry is going to cause him to lose reelection in two weeks just from today.

TAPPER: Last night, during his rally in Erie, he criticized the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania for having more stringent lockdown measures than other states led by Republican governors.

What's he getting at? COLLINS: He also mischaracterized what we have seen as these surges

in the United States.

He talked about places like Florida and Texas and Arizona, saying that they saw surges, and then they were able to get them back down, though, Jake, of course, we know numbers are surging all over the U.S. at this point, even in places like Pennsylvania, where they had 15 days straight over 1,000 new cases per day.

Yet the president was saying that they need to urge their governor to open the state back up, and saying the state wasn't open. And, of course, that was at a rally the president was holding that was in contradiction of what his own federal government has said should be the health guidelines during this pandemic, as we navigate our way through it.

And the health and human services secretary was asked about these mixed messages going on between the task force and the president and Dr. Scott Atlas, who is the newest member of the task force, and he insisted there aren't any, Jake, though we can see it. There's living proof it in the president's rallies that he's holding each and every day.

TAPPER: Of course there's mixed messages. That's not even a question. That's just a lie from the secretary of health and human services.

Thank you so much, Kaitlan Collins.

While Joe Biden is off the campaign trail for last-minute debate preparations, he's rolling out arguably his most popular campaign surrogate, former President Barack Obama, who is making his first in- person appearance of the 2020 race this evening.

CNN's Arlette Saenz is live in Nashville, which is the site of tomorrow night's debate.

Arlette, what do you think we're going to hear from President Obama when he takes the stage tonight at this drive-in rally at Citizens Bank Park, where the Phillies play?

[15:05:01]

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, Jake, President Obama is trying to bring it home for Joe Biden in this final stretch before the election.

The former president can personally vouch for Biden in the White House after their time in the White House for those two terms together. And the Biden campaign really believes that the president has helped engage voters over the course of the past few months, both virtually and through fund-raising.

And, today, he is taking that basically straight to the campaign trail. One group that they believe he can -- three groups that they believe he can help with are black men, Latinos and young voters, trying to mobilize them in these final weeks before the election. You saw the former president release a video yesterday targeted to young voters, saying that they are the generation that can help create a new normal in this country, and arguing that Biden is on the right side of the issues and can help advance their causes.

And you are seeing President Obama hitting the campaign trail in that all-important Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, one of those three states in that Rust Belt area where the Biden campaign really believes that they can make a dent in President Trump's past advantage there after he had flipped those states red back in 2016.

And those are exactly the type of areas in Pennsylvania that the Biden campaign is going to be targeting in these coming weeks. And they're hoping President Obama can help with that today.

TAPPER: And we will be bringing the viewers some new fresh polling from two of those battleground states, including Pennsylvania, in a few minutes.

Arlette, besides Philly, where else is the focus for the Biden campaign today?

SAENZ: Well, while Joe Biden is back home in Delaware preparing for this debate against President Trump, his running mate, Kamala Harris, is down in the battleground state of North Carolina, where polls have shown a tight race right there now, after President Trump won that state back in 2016.

The Biden campaign hoping to cut off every path that the president might have to regain the presidency, again, back in November. But it's not just important where these candidates are traveling to. It's also important to pay attention to where they are running advertisements on television.

And, last night, you saw the Biden campaign roll out this minute-long ad during the World Series. This follows advertisements that they aired during NFL games, just showing the advantage and power of that money they have that they have raised, as they have a sizable advantage over the president when it comes to fund-raising in these closing days before the election.

TAPPER: All right, Arlette Saenz in Nashville, thanks so much.

A record-shattering number of voters have already made their voices heard in this election. Just look at the lines. People are showing up in droves to polling sites and waiting for hours to cast their votes in early voting.

Almost 40 million ballots have been cast so far, 40 million. That's almost 200 percent more compared to this point in 2016.

Today, there is troubling new concern about voter intimidation, as CNN's Pamela Brown reports in our latest installment of "Making It Count."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) PAMELA BROWN, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): With the election less than two weeks away, voter intimidation is coming to the forefront.

Election officials in Florida and Alaska went to the FBI after dozens of people reported receiving e-mails threatening to vote for Trump, or else.

RYAN KENNELLY, FLORIDA VOTER: I think calling it out and letting it be seen for what it is will hopefully encourage people to ignore it.

BROWN: The e-mail was made to look like it came from a far right group, the Proud Boys, but they have denied involvement.

And a CNN analysis found the e-mails were actually sent in a sophisticated way, routed through foreign servers. More cries of possible voter intimidation in Miami, a police officer in full uniform wearing a Trump mask inside a polling place called out by the mayor.

FRANCIS SUAREZ (R), MAYOR OF MIAMI, FLORIDA: His actions have violated departmental policy, and he will be disciplined.

BROWN: And, in Memphis, a poll worker was fired for asking voters to turn their Black Lives Matter shirts inside out.

SUZANNE THOMPSON, SHELBY COUNTY, TENNESSEE, ELECTION COMMISSION: This particular incident was the bad behavior of one poll worker.

BROWN: Tennessee laws ban any clothing worn to polling places that endorses a political candidate or party. Social justice messages like BLM are allowed.

But, overall, early voting remains in high gear. More than 39 million ballots have been cast nationwide so far. Over a million people have already voted in the battleground states of Wisconsin and Ohio, and staggering numbers in Texas, where more than 5.3 million have cast ballots, representing more than 31 percent of registered voters.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just like to vote in-person. I just know it's going to be there, and I can guarantee it.

BROWN: It's clear many Americans have been relying on the post office to deliver their votes. But, as Election Day approaches, Michigan's secretary of state is encouraging voters to turn ballots in personally to drop boxes or their county clerk's office, if they can.

JOCELYN BENSON, MICHIGAN SECRETARY OF STATE: There are a lot of uncertainties and variables with the Postal Service.

[15:10:01]

BROWN: A new post office inspector general report finds the post office never investigated how controversial cuts to service in the summer would affect mail delivery.

BENSON: My office used the CARES Act funding from the federal government to install close to 1,000 -- over 1,000 drop boxes all around the state for that very reason.

BROWN: The postmaster general, who has defended the cuts as nonpolitical, postponed the changes, but on-time mail delivery is still suffering.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And, Jake, that number for those early ballots cast continues to rise, now crossing more than 40 million ballots cast early.

And I do want to point out, given the issues with the Postal Service and how close we are now to the election, election experts are saying, if you haven't already requested a mail-in ballot, your best bet is to go and vote in-person, preferably early.

And if you still haven't received your ballot, you may want to come up with a plan B to go in-person, vote, and vote early -- Jake.

TAPPER: Definitely go vote. Whoever you're voting for, definitely go vote.

Thanks so much, Pamela Brown.

Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez may get points for creativity, but can her unique approach to motivating young voters actually work? We will discuss.

Plus, an alarming development for one of the vaccine trials. We learned today that a volunteer died. What does this mean for testing going forward?

That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:15:36]

TAPPER: In our health late: It's grim news.

There are no longer any states in the U.S. showing a downward trend of new coronavirus cases, painting a daunting picture of what might be to come; 26 states are going in the wrong direction, and 15 states saw their highest seven-day averages.

North Dakota saw its highest number of new cases yet. Ten states are reporting record high hospitalizations. And the death toll yesterday was 933, higher than in recent days and weeks.

Joining us now to discuss is William Haseltine. He is a former professor at Harvard Medical School.

So, I have to ask you. President Trump earlier today was asked, if he could do it all over again, would he change anything about his handling of the coronavirus pandemic? He said, "Not much."

Your response. DR. WILLIAM HASELTINE, INFECTIOUS DISEASE EXPERT: That's a terrible

response. There's a lot that can be done.

If you look around the world, there's some countries, like China, New Zealand, Taiwan, that have no COVID at all. Or China -- a country like China has 11 cases, not 60,000 cases a day.

Australia, New Zealand and Taiwan have gotten very close to zero. Leadership makes a difference. And, unfortunately, he hasn't exerted that role. He could have done a lot more.

At best, he could have kept silent and let the -- I mean, at least he could have kept silent and let the public health authorities speak. But he's not done that. He's countermanded the best advice of our public health authorities.

So, rather than helping to control the epidemic, he has done the opposite.

TAPPER: The virus is clearly surging. Hospitalization numbers are rising.

But take a look at this. If you look at this graphic, the hospitalization rate is not as high as it was in April or July. And I'm wondering if you think that this is a sign that things are not as bad as they currently seem, or merely that the worst is still yet to come.

HASELTINE: I am afraid it's the latter.

It is probably a result of much more testing picking up a lot more asymptomatic people, that the ratio of those who are positive to those who have died is lower. There's also, I might point out, a two-to- three-week lag in those two numbers.

So, first you get the indication that the epidemic is on the increase. Then you get the increase in hospitalizations. That's followed by a lag, but you get an increase in the number of deaths. We will see that number climbing inexorably as this pandemic goes on its way, as it is now.

TAPPER: In the past two weeks, the number of children testing positive for coronavirus jumped 13 percent. Children still, thankfully, make up just a small number of deaths and serious cases proportionally.

Do these numbers alarm you? Or is it just a matter of more testing?

HASELTINE: No, that's alarming.

And there's a new study out where we actually know that children can give it to other children reasonably effectively. And the reason we know that, there was a massive study done in India, where they followed the -- they actually did really follow up for contact tracing. Not only did they identify the contacts of infected children; they identified whether those children were infected. And, in fact, the infection rates were pretty comparable across all

age ranges. And what was interesting is children predominantly infected children. Teenagers infected teenagers. Young adults infected young adults, and older adults infected older adults, but pretty much at the same rate.

So it is worrying, yes.

TAPPER: This morning, the U.S. surgeon general, Dr. Jerome Adams, tweeted -- quote -- "There is no example of herd immunity as a successful strategy against COVID-19. And it could, in fact, lead to many deaths."

The only people I hear discussing herd immunity seem to be at the White House.

HASELTINE: Well, herd immunity is a very, very dangerous concept. It's basically a justification for doing nothing, because herd immunity holds, if you do nothing and let the infection roll, it will eventually burn itself out.

First of all, that isn't likely for COVID, which is like the flu. It keeps coming back. All the coronaviruses we know just keep coming back. And, secondly, if you did that, with a death rate of 1 to -- a half-a-percent of 1 percent, at the very lowest, you're talking many millions of Americans dying.

And I don't think any of us want to see that. We need to get this under control. It's not too late. We could still do it. And we have got to act soon to do that.

[15:20:03]

TAPPER: The U.S. surgeon also made clear that he would get a vaccine once one is authorized or approved. He highlighted how minority communities are less likely to get a vaccine, because of a lot of reasons, including the horrific Tuskegee experiment.

He said, it's important to make sure that's not the case for coronavirus.

Do you worry about vaccine hesitancy within the black and brown communities in the U.S.?

HASELTINE: I worry about it altogether, certainly amongst those communities, but I worry about vaccine hesitancy altogether.

And I understand that, for a vaccine that's being pushed through very, very rapidly, probably more rapidly than it should, but that should not affect the use of other vaccines. Vaccines are the best tool we have to prevent massive infections and to improve childhood survival, the very best tool.

And I encourage everyone to get the standard vaccines.

The question of whether and when you should get the COVID vaccines are -- is a question that's, I think, up in the air right now. But, in any event, we're not -- anybody's not likely to get them -- normal people aren't likely to get them until, I would say, earliest, late spring, summer, is the earliest.

So it's not an immediate concern right now.

TAPPER: All right, William Haseltine, thank you so much. Appreciate your time and your expertise, as always.

Joe Biden's campaign is crushing President Trump in fund-raising, blitzing NFL games, battleground states, and the World Series with TV ads. Whether it's enough to avoid a repeat of 2016 is another matter.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:27:34]

TAPPER: We're just 13 days from Election Day with two very different strategies from two very different presidential candidates.

President Trump is holding yet another reckless rally in North Carolina tonight, no masks, no social distancing required. While Biden remains off the trail, we're told he's preparing for the final debate tomorrow.

Joining us now to discuss, former Republican Congresswoman Mia Love of Utah, Democratic strategist Paul Begala.

Congresswoman, so many of the most damaging things that have happened to President Trump have been at his own hand. And I think about that because, just earlier today, he was asked by Eric Bolling if there was anything he would do differently when it comes to his handling of the pandemic, if given a chance to do it over again.

And he said, "Not much" -- quote -- "Not much."

I mean, 221,000 Americans have died, eight million infected, so many unemployed, struggling. Kids can't go to classrooms. Is this the message he should be pushing?

MIA LOVE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I don't think so.

And I think that, even when we behave in the best way possible, which I'm not saying that this is the case here, there's always -- when you look back, there are always things that you can do. There's always improvement.

First of all, nobody knew exactly what we were dealing with. Everybody was trying to figure it out. And, of course, if you knew every -- if you knew some things, you have to say that I could have done better here, I could have done better here.

And I think that that's a sign of humility. But, as we all know, that this is not the style of this president. And he tends to believe that he's done nothing wrong. And I think that there'd be more people that would trust him if he would just say, OK, well, I could have handled this better, I have got it, or -- it would instill a little bit more trust.

TAPPER: Paul, if you were an adviser to President Trump -- I love asking you these questions -- what would you tell him to say to that question?

And the question, again, from Eric Bolling was, if you could do it all over again, if you got a mulligan, how would you handle this pandemic differently? What's the correct answer?

PAUL BEGALA, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: The correct answer -- first, the correct answer is, hire Mia Love to be your chief of staff.

I hate to lose her from CNN, but that was very good advice.

(LAUGHTER)

BEGALA: The first thing a president has to show is empathy. OK, he -- we have lost -- you just said it. We have lost 220,000 of our sisters and brothers, mothers and fathers, grandparents and children.

How you preside over that as a president, and not feel that pain, is really quite remarkable. But we know he's bereft of empathy. But that's the first thing is, even before you get to the policy mistakes, like maybe it wasn't a good idea to ship millions of tons of our personal protective equipment to China as this virus was hitting.

But maybe it wasn't a good idea to disband the pandemic response unit that Obama had set up. Maybe it wasn't a good idea to cut the funding of the CDC for prevention of pandemics by 85 percent.

Before you get to those operational matters, you have to start with empathy.

But saying that Donald Trump needs empathy is like saying he needs six-pack abs and a full head of hair. It's just never going to happen.

TAPPER: Congresswoman, new filings show that, going into October, the Trump campaign had $63 million, compared to more than twice that for Biden, $177 million.

Now, Trump campaign officials note that Hillary Clinton both outraised and outspent Trump in 2016, and she still lost.

But that is a big difference when it comes to cash on hand.