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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump Tests Negative for COVID Ahead of Final Debate; Trump Says He May Change Strategy from Last Debate; Republicans Advance Supreme Court Nominee Despite Boycott by Democrats; Potential Paths to Victory for Trump and Biden. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired October 22, 2020 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: And he's also suggesting that the entire debate commission and process in unfair.

Here to discuss CNN's Jeff Zeleny and "Politico's" Laura Barron-Lopez. Jeff, Trump advisers are telling him loud and clear, lower the temperature, don't seem so angry. I have not seen much evidence of that yet.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Jake, if the President decided to do that, that would certainly be a change in approach and a change in course. We have rarely seen him do that.

Look, the big question hanging over the debate tonight, which President Trump is going to show up, is it going to be the grievance laced President Trump or is it going to be the one that Republicans really across the board have been clamoring for.

Someone to talk about the economy. Someone to talk about the Supreme Court. Someone to talk about the issues that they believe are more winnable issues. So far President Trump has really decided to pick a fight with virtually everyone every day this week, from Lesley Stahl to Kristen Welker to people that the American people really are not that focused on.

But the reality is the President going into this debate is trying to gain the ref series trying to say, look, this is an unfair process. This is the last, best opportunity for the President to get some of those people back on board who may be wavering.

I think that's a small slice of the electorate. No question about it. But there are people who like the Republican policies, they just don't necessarily like the Republican President's attitude and conduct. So perhaps he can attract those tonight. But Jake, we have not seen any indication he has a second act here. We'll see.

TAPPER: Yes, I mean, it's become so cliche now, almost as much as infrastructure week. People in the media saying well, will the President have a new tone. There might be like a moment of relative normalcy. But like even if he has a relatively normal debate, we know, you know, who will be back on the campaign trail the next morning.

Laura, there will be plexiglass barriers between Trump and Biden tonight and their microphones will be muted during portions of the debate. I mean there are some really extraordinary steps being taken here because of the pandemic and because of President Trump's behavior last time.

LAURA BARRON-LOPEZ, NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, POLITICO: Yes, that's right. I mean coronavirus is going to be on everyone's minds because of those plexiglass barriers, similar with vice presidential debate.

And then on top of it, yes, because of the way the first debate went and the President's behavior and the back and forth between the two, the commission decided to take extra measures so that way there could be a more -- there could be more from each of the candidates that the voters can hear from. Because a lot of the voters that I spoke to after the first debate said that they barely really heard much from Biden.

They described -- this was undecided voters to me, described Trump's performance as unhinged. They described it as not presidential, but they still had questions that they wanted answers about Biden's policy proposals. And so hopefully tonight's debate we'll see a bit more of that. Although, of course, who knows if actually it will work given that the President could lash out based on what he's done this week.

TAPPER: Yes, and Jeff, Trump has already said muting microphones, quote, is very unfair. Of course, they will be muted both for Biden and for him.

Theoretically he'll still be able to interrupt Biden and knock Biden off his game even if we at home or at work won't be able to hear it, Biden will still be able to hear it. What do you think Biden needs to do tonight?

ZELENY: Sure, they are standing on the same stage. So of course, the former Vice President will be able to hear exactly what the President is saying whether it's muted or not. So, we'll see how all that plays out on a technical basis.

But the reality is I'm told that Joe Biden has been planning in his debate practice sessions all week long for those interruptions. He's planning for this exact moment. So, I think it would be more of a surprise if they didn't come.

But look, Joe Biden I'm told is going to try and do one thing, first and foremost, again try and focus this discussion on how he believes the President and the Trump administration has let down America on coronavirus, has simply been asleep at the switch and not recognizing the truly challenges here.

Something that Joe Biden will have to do, and this can be tricky for him, Jake, as you well know. His family is very personal to him. And he knows that President Trump is almost certainly to go after Hunter Biden, his son. So that is going to be something that Joe Biden will have to deal with. I'm told again in those practice sessions all week long they were pretty brutal at times going after Hunter Biden in very personal terms. So that's what we will see.

It's hard to imagine at this point in the campaign any new information would come forward here. We've pretty much heard it all, especially with the President, you know, tweeting out so much of his own internal thinking here.

But that is what I'm told that Joe Biden is planning to do, trying to keep his cool over questions even Hunter Biden.

[15:35:00]

But at the first event you'll remember it was actually an empathetic moment when the President raised him because it gave Joe Biden a chance to talk about his son, challenges and all.

TAPPER: And Laura, we know at tonight's debate or we suspect anyway, that President Trump is going to say he created the greatest economy ever. It certainly was strong before the pandemic struck.

But 700 economists including seven Nobel winners wrote an open letter opposing Trump's re-election. They say his handling of the pandemic has been selfish and reckless and that he's been a chaotic and ineffective negotiator when it comes to trade.

How do you think President Trump should respond if Joe Biden brings that up?

BARRON-LOPEZ: Well, how I think he should respond is probably not how he's going to respond, Jake, given that he will likely refute the premise of the question and repeat the same claim that you just said. So, he will likely say that he did create the greatest economy. And a fact check by us as reporters and the fact check by economists is likely not going to change anything that he says, and he won't believe it.

Now what his advisers want him to say, as Jeff was saying, is that they want him to focus on what he'll do to make the economy better, what he'll do to try to bring back the country after the coronavirus pandemic.

But so far across his rallies, across the first debate and across his tweets, there's no indication that he plans on doing that.

TAPPER: Yes, and no indication that he has a plan to get us out of this coronavirus pandemic. Jeff Zeleny, Laura Barron-Lopez thank you so much.

You can see the final presidential debate between Donald Trump and Joe Biden right here on CNN. Our special coverage starts at 7:00 P.M. Eastern.

A medical milestone in the search for a coronavirus vaccine, 300,000 Americans are taking part in one clinical trial. What that could mean for when a safe vaccine, or if, is ready for you?

[15:40:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Back to our HEALTH LEAD, the FDA holding a special meeting today to focus on the effort to develop a successful coronavirus vaccine. The agency hoping that this daylong event will increase public confidence in the FDA approval process resulting in more people taking the vaccine when and if it becomes available.

CNN senior medical correspondent Elizabeth Cohen joins us now. Elizabeth, have we learned anything new at this meeting about the development of a coronavirus vaccine?

ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Jake, what we've learned actually is something that the CDC plans to do once the vaccine comes out on the market.

They've planned for this cell phone-based application where people who get the vaccine will be followed. They will get text messages, they will get e-mails saying, hey, how are you doing post vaccine? So, they would get a text or an e-mail every day for a week and then every week for six weeks after that asking them are you having any side effects, et cetera.

And I think this is really aimed at further increasing the -- or doing anything really that they can to increase the public confidence in a vaccine. If we know that they're following up on this first group, which will mostly be essential workers, hopefully that means that we'll get more information about whether this vaccine is as safe as they want it to be.

TAPPER: Also, on the vaccine front Moderna just reported hitting a major milestone in its Phase III clinical trials, it has enrolled 30,000 participants. Explain the significance of this.

COHEN: Right, the significance is that the very first trial that started in the United States for a COVID vaccine has enrolled all of its people. They've given them all their first shots. They've given nearly all of them their second shots. That tells us that things are moving.

However, it does not tell us that we will have a vaccine on the market any time soon, because just because they gave these people their shots, it doesn't mean that the vaccine actually works.

So, let's take a look at some of the details here. So as of this morning, Moderna enrolled all 30,000 of its participants. Half of them got the vaccine, half of them got the placebo. Nobody knows at this point who got what, the participants don't know, the doctors don't know, Moderna doesn't know.

But once 53 participants get sick with COVID, then a safety board will unblind it. And they'll see of those 53 if fewer than 14 received the vaccine, in other words, if 25 percent or fewer received the vaccine, then Moderna will ask the FDA for an Emergency Use Authorization -- Jake.

TAPPER: So that's 53 participants getting coronavirus on their own. It's not that they'll be infected with it --

COHEN: Right, of course.

TAPPER: -- like they're doing in that experiment in London.

OK, Elizabeth Cohen, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

COHEN: Thanks.

TAPPER: In the POLITICS LEAD, despite a boycott from Democrats today Republicans on Senate Judiciary Committee voted to advance Judge Amy Coney Barrett to the U.S. Supreme Court. This sets up a full Senate vote early next Monday just days before the election.

CNN's Manu Raju is live for us on Capitol Hill. And Manu, the final vote will give President Trump his third Supreme Court justice. And at this point I can't see anything Democrats can really do about it.

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No, they can't. She will get the spot, she'll get it on Monday, she will be on the seat for life, for as long as she wants to serve. And this despite the Democratic protest about the process, this being one of the quickest confirmation proceedings in modern time, happening in just over a month period.

Typically takes two to three months to get a nomination through. This happened in over a month. And despite the Republicans refusal to move on Barack Obama's nominee in 2016 eight months before the election that year.

[15:45:00]

But nevertheless, Democrats tried to register their objection today by not showing up to a Judiciary Committee vote that actually advanced the nomination to the floor. None of the Democrats showed up, in place they had pictures of people affected by the Affordable Care Act in their seats instead. And Republicans ignored that, disregarded the Democratic concerns and plowed right ahead.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC) CHAIRMAN, JUDICIARY COMMITTEE: This is a groundbreaking, historic moment for American legal community and really politically. We did the right thing. It would have been wrong to deny her a vote. In my view, if you're a Republican, it would have been crazy not to vote for her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now Democrats themselves have come under criticism from their own base, Jake, for not going harder at Amy Coney Barrett at last week's confirmation hearings. Dianne Feinstein for one praised the handling of those hearings, a lot of Democrats were critical of her. But today nothing they could do even if she had criticized the proceedings, they don't have the votes to stop her -- Jake. TAPPER: And Manu, Republicans may have been unanimous in their committee vote today but it might not be the case for Republicans for the full Senate vote next week.

RAJU: Yes, that's right. They expect to lose probably two Senate Republicans, Susan Collins of Maine in a difficult re-election race. She said that it's too close to an election to move ahead. She has already indicated that she would vote no.

Also, Lisa Murkowski of Alaska had a similar concern that she has raised. Now just today she told reporters that she also is likely to vote no. She has not said that outright but that is the expectation.

But this will be one the closest confirmation votes for any Supreme Court Justice, but she will get the votes, with those two votes defecting, Jake, still a 51-49 vote she'll get confirmed by Monday night -- Jake.

TAPPER: Still a W, that's right, OK, Manu Raju, thank you so much.

With just 12 days left to vote, a reality check on the road to victory. What President Trump and Joe Biden have to stay focused on during tonight's final debate. Stay with us.

[15:50:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: With just 12 days until election day, the Trump campaign is flooding the Rust Belt with stops from high profile surrogates making it clear that they see that region, the President Trump flipped from blue to red in 2016 as critical to his re-election.

Both President Trump and Joe Biden have one final debate tonight to make their last pitch to voters in such a large audience. So how could one face-off affect the race theoretically?

CNN's resident forecaster Harry Enten joins me live. Harry let's start with a reality check of where we are 12 days out.

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL WRITER AND ANALYST: Sure. I mean, look, this is the CNN electoral map right now as we see it. And I think it gives you a pretty good indication that former Vice President Joe Biden is ahead in this race, right. He's at 290 electoral votes, you need 270 to win. So, he's over that threshold.

Trump at just 163. And you mentioned the Rust Belt. You can see that we have Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania leaning Democratic. But, of course, we're still 12 days away, we have a debate tonight. So, this map could change.

TAPPER: Tonight, is the final debate as you note between Biden and Trump. What do past election cycles tell us about how or whether the last debate performance can affect the race.

ENTEN: Sure. I mean just take a look at the last two elections, right, 2016 and 2012. And what we can see is two things when we make a comparison to the polls now versus then.

The first thing you should note is that former Vice President Joe Biden has a larger lead than either Hillary Clinton or Mitt Romney, who was ahead at this point in 2012 and obviously it was Barack Obama who won.

And that gets to the second key point. Is that we do see some differences between the national poll average and the eventual popular vote in both of those elections. In fact, it differed by five points.

Now this year, let's say, Joe Biden's lead dropped by five points and he was only won the popular vote by five, that could be enough for President Trump to in fact carry the electoral college where he does have a slight advantage in comparison to the popular vote. So, I would say tonight could be something that ends up being pivotal, could shift the race, of course, we'll have to wait and see.

TAPPER: As they deliver their closing arguments tonight to an audience this big, what are the crucial voting blocs that Biden and Trump each need to be focused on winning over?

ENTEN: Yes, for Trump I think it's pretty clear, right. It's noncollege white voters that's his core group of support. He won them by 30 points in 2016 in the final pre-election polls in 2016. He's still ahead with them right now but it's only by 19 percentage points. And, of course, that group makes up a disproportionate share in the Rust Belt in those states that we know President Trump needs to carry.

Now for Joe Biden, it's Hispanic voters, right? Look, he's still ahead of them. But he's not up by the same margin that Hillary Clinton won them by. He's only up by 28 points, she led them in the final pre- election polls by 37 points.

And of course, that's a pretty key bloc in two key states, Florida and Arizona, which are tight races. And if Joe Biden really wants to secure that electoral map, he wants to make sure that he wins those states just in case something happens in the Rust Belt to his support there.

TAPPER: What do they need to say? What does Biden need to say, what does need to convey to Hispanic voters? What does Trump need to convey to white working-class voters?

ENTEN: I mean for me for Joe Biden I think it's just about running out the clock in all honesty. I think that he just wants to make sure that he doesn't say anything really silly. I think he wants to hit on an economic message, especially in South Florida with Cuban voters he wants to distance himself from socialism and say the Bernie Sanders wing of the party.

[15:55:00]

In terms of noncollege white voters it's particularly noncollege white women. Trump has really alienated them over the last few years. And he really wants to make sure that he speaks to women's concerns and doesn't do any of this stuff like he did in the last debate, interrupting all the time. Women voters really seemed to be repelled by that.

TAPPER: All right, Harry Enten, thanks so much, appreciate it.

The final showdown just hours away. How President Trump and Joe Biden are preparing for tonight's historic debate. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper. And we begin this hour with the 2020 LEAD. The final Presidential debate will kick off in just a few hours and with just 12 days until the election. It is likely neither that President Donald Trump nor Democratic nominee Joe Biden will have another chance to make their final pitches to as many voters as tonight will offer.

Tonight, there are new adjustments. The nonpartisan debate commission has announced new enforcement of the rules by muting candidates' mics during some portions of the debate.