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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Companies Respond to Insurrection; Interview With D.C. Attorney General Karl Racine; Trump Refuses Any Responsibility for Capitol Building Siege. Aired 4-4:30p ET

Aired January 12, 2021 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:02]

DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, CNN PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: And he's going to find the full force of the law coming after him, not just problems with sedition, but the New York Southern District, what he did in Georgia.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: So much more.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Gentlemen, forgive me. I'm out of time.

I want to hand it to Jake.

Doug and Harry, thank you.

Jake Tapper, "THE LEAD" starts right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: And welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

We begin today with the politics lead and the final eight days of the Trump presidency. Today, as President Trump faces his second impeachment, he's claiming that his remarks before a crowd of supporters were -- quote -- "totally appropriate." They were, of course, not.

The president spread election lies for months, essentially pouring gasoline on the nation. And then, the morning of the attack, the president lit the match, inciting the mob, demonizing the Congress, and even his own vice president, and directly encouraging the furious crowd who would do anything for him to go down to the Capitol and -- quote -- "fight like hell."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're going to have to fight much harder. When you catch somebody in a fraud, you're allowed to go by very different rules.

We're going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country. So, let's walk down Pennsylvania Avenue. You will never take back our country with weakness. You have to show strength and you have to be strong.

We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: And then the crowd, the mob, they did just that.

President Trump told the crowd to go down to the Capitol to show -- quote -- "strength," to -- quote -- "fight like hell." And now five people are dead, a terrorist attack on the U.S. Capitol, on the United States, lives lost, lives threatened, including his own vice president.

And the president of the United States since then and today showing zero remorse, no regret for his role in inciting an insurrection. Tomorrow, President Trump is expected to be impeached again. This time, at least a handful of Republicans are expected to join Democrats.

It would be a bipartisan rebuke, though, with no major effort by Republican leaders or by MAGA media to calm people down, to tell the truth, to correct the lies, to stop the madness, the MAGA remains incited.

And the FBI is warning this could just be the beginning of the violence. Thousands of armed pro-Trump extremists are plotting to surround the U.S. Capitol ahead of inauguration, one lawmaker who was briefed on the series of new threats tells CNN.

And now there are metal detectors outside the House chamber for lawmakers and their aides to go through before going on to the floor of the House.

This comes after Democratic members of Congress tell me there have been multiple conversations among Democrats about concerns they have about their colleagues, specifically freshman Republicans -- quote -- "insistent on bringing firearms, in violation of law and guidelines," one Democrat tells me.

Now, normally, members of Congress and their guests have been able to bypass metal detectors going into the House or going on to the floor of the House. But after the terrorist attack on the Capitol, there are now legitimate concerns that Democrats have about some Republican members of Congress and their potential guests and the threats that they might pose.

Said a second Democratic member of Congress to me: "I don't know who they're going to bring to the inauguration who can bypass the metal detectors. Until there's an investigation and until we understand our colleagues' level of complicity, we don't know how involved they really were. Until we have answers. I don't think we should trust them."

That first Democrat said this afternoon that, in the recent security briefing the Democrats had with Capitol Police, they were reminded that bulletproof vests are -- quote -- "reimbursable expenses."

Moments ago, President Trump briefly mentioned the deadly riots on Capitol Hill. He, of course, complained about unfairness to him about his impending impeachment. And then he launched into a speech about the border wall.

CNN White House correspondent Kaitlan Collins joins me now live.

And, Kaitlan, President Trump, he had a chance to tone down his rhetoric this afternoon. Not surprisingly, he did not take it.

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

And, Jake, before he got around to addressing what happened on Capitol Hill last week, he started out with the threats to his own power and the talk, of course, of invoking the 25th Amendment, something we have been reporting on about conversations with the vice president, with the Cabinet, and whether or not those are real or likely, and the president appears to be listening as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Free speech is under assault like never before. The 25th Amendment is of zero risk to me, but will come back to haunt Joe Biden and the Biden administration. As the expression goes, be careful what you wish for.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[16:05:10]

COLLINS: So, that appeared to be a veiled threat, saying that the 25th Amendment could be used against Joe Biden, when the questions are about whether or not it'd be used against the president.

And, Jake, of course, right now, we have reported that seems incredibly unlikely. But there is a very real threat to the president's power. That's impeachment and whether or not he's going to be the second president ever to be impeached, something that could happen as soon as tomorrow.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

COLLINS (voice-over): Without an ounce of regret, President Trump took no responsibility for inciting a violent mob of his supporters who breached the Capitol, attacked police officers, and threatened to kill the vice president.

TRUMP: It has been analyzed. And people thought that what I said was totally appropriate.

COLLINS: As he left the White House today, Trump denounced violence, but insisted he didn't instigate it.

TRUMP: They've analyzed my speech and my words and my final paragraph, my final sentence. And everybody to the T. thought it was totally appropriate.

We fight. We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore. And we're going to the Capitol. We're going to try and give our Republicans, the weak ones, because the strong ones don't need any of our help, we are going to try and give them the kind of pride and boldness that they need to take back our country.

COLLINS: The president portrayed himself as the victim of a new effort by Democrats to impeach him a second time.

TRUMP: It's really a continuation of the greatest witch-hunt in the history of politics. It's ridiculous. It's absolutely ridiculous. This impeachment is causing tremendous anger.

COLLINS: Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer responded by saying Trump shouldn't be in office for another day.

SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY): What Trump did today, blaming others for what he caused, is a pathological technique used by the worst of dictators.

COLLINS: After he landed in Texas, Trump delivered scripted remarks on the attack.

TRUMP: Respect for law enforcement and the great people within law enforcement -- so many are here -- is the foundation of the MAGA agenda.

COLLINS: Unlike Democrats wanted, it became less likely that Vice President Pence would galvanize the Cabinet to invoke the 25th Amendment and remove Trump from power after he finally spoke to Trump for the first time since Wednesday.

Trump and Pence pledged to serve the remainder of their term, as one member of Trump's Cabinet didn't rule out conversations about the 25th Amendment.

ALEX AZAR, U.S. HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES SECRETARY: The rhetoric last week was unacceptable. I'm not going to get into or discuss the 25th Amendment here. I'm committed -- I have wrestled with this -- I'm committed to see this through in my role as health secretary during a pandemic.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COLLINS: Notably there, Azar not standing up for the president.

But, Jake, one other note. It's been less than a week since Senator Lindsey Graham got on the Senate floor, gave that impassioned speech, talking about how he and the president had a hell of a journey together, but it was time to count him out because -- quote -- "Enough was enough."

Lindsey Graham was seen flying on Air Force One with the president to Texas today ahead of hours of what could be -- the president to be the first president to be impeached twice.

TAPPER: All right. Thank you so much, Kaitlan Collins. Appreciate it.

Moments ago, the acting U.S. attorney wrapped up a press conference outlining significant sedition and conspiracy charges coming for people involved in the Capitol riots, 170 open investigation so far -- quote -- "just the tip of the iceberg."

We also learned that the pipe bombs left outside the Republican National Committee and Democratic National Committee headquarters were real and had timers. "The Washington Post" reports today that an FBI office in Norfolk, Virginia, issued a warning about -- quote -- "war" looming at the Capitol before last week's attack.

As Shimon Prokupecz reports, this is raising fresh concerns about the federal government's ability and readiness to stop another attack.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Chilling new details are emerging about what federal investigators fear are more plots to overthrow the government all across the country.

REP. CONOR LAMB (D-PA): They were talking about 4,000 armed patriots to surround the Capitol and prevent any Democrat from going in. And they have published rules of engagement, meaning when you shoot and when you don't. So, this is an organized group that has a plan.

PROKUPECZ: The threats come as there are a lot of questions over an intelligence failure leading up to Wednesday's attack on the Capitol. "The Washington Post" now reporting, a day before the January 6 insurrection, a Virginia FBI field office issued a dire warning: Extremists were going to Washington for violence and war.

This directly contradicts the FBI claim that there was no intelligence indicating threats of violence. Federal investigators now speaking publicly for the first time.

STEVEN D'ANTUONO, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, FBI WASHINGTON FIELD OFFICE: The FBI receives enormous amounts of information and intelligence. And our job is to determine the credibility and viability of it. I want to stress that the FBI has a long memory and a broad reach.

[16:10:10]

PROKUPECZ: Despite the dire warning, no preparations were made. And now there is a nationwide manhunt for 150 suspects, as lawmakers call for some of the perpetrators to be added to the no-fly list.

SCHUMER: The people, the insurrectionists who breached the U.S. Capitol fall under the definition of threats to the homeland and should be immediately added to the TSA no-fly lists.

PROKUPECZ: With the inauguration on track for next week, the FBI is warning of threats of violence and mayhem on a massive scale in a memo obtained by CNN -- quote -- "Armed protests are being planned at all 50 state capitols and at the U.S. Capitol."

The bulletin warns of a potential uprising if the president is removed from office prior to January 20, Inauguration Day. But even if Trump is allowed to finish his term, the bulletin warns -- quote -- "An identified group planning to storm government offices in the District of Columbia and in every state regardless."

LAMB: We're in the midst of an ongoing series of crimes and an ongoing threat to the United States Capitol, to our institutions, to communities all around the United States.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PROKUPECZ: And, Jake, there is real concern across the country that, because of the success of this attack on the Capitol, others have been emboldened by it and will act.

One official telling us that the chatter is off the chart, and, as we heard from the acting U.S. attorney there, saying that what they have so far have uncovered will be shocking to many people.

TAPPER: President Trump and the Republicans in Congress who support him could hold a press conference and tell them not to do that. But, of course, they haven't done that.

Shimon Prokupecz, thanks so much.

Republican aides expect perhaps up to 10 Republican lawmakers will break ranks tomorrow and vote to impeach President Trump for his second time. In a sharp departure from the first impeachment, House leaders, Republican leaders, are not pressuring their members to fall in line, with conference chair Liz Cheney calling the decision a vote of conscience.

CNN's Manu Raju is live for us on Capitol Hill.

Manu, could Republican leaders like Liz Cheney ultimately vote to impeach President Trump?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Potentially.

Liz Cheney herself has not said how she would come down, but she does consider this a vote of conscience. She's been one of the few who have spoken out against the Republican efforts by Trump, led by Trump, to overturn the election.

So it remains to be seen how she comes down. The Republican leader, Kevin McCarthy, will side with Trump. He said that impeachment is not the way to go right now. But other Republicans are considering breaking ranks. This is much different than 2019, in which no Republicans broke ranks. They sided with the Republican leadership, who were pressuring their members to fall in line.

They are not doing so here. And the Senate side is a big question too. When the trial comes, ultimately, it will be up to 17 senators there to decide whether or not to convict this president. Just moments ago, Senator Rob Portman of Ohio just put out a statement saying the president bears some responsibility for what happened in the Capitol last week, calling on the president to address the nation. But will he vote to convict the president? Still a question in the days ahead -- Jake.

TAPPER: Address the nation? What good could that possibly do?

Manu Raju, thanks so much. Appreciate it.

From rioters to President Trump, we're going to talk to D.C.'s attorney general about who he's looking at possibly charging for the terrorist attack

Then: The federal government is changing the guidelines for who can get the COVID vaccine right now. Pay attention, baby boomers.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:17:39]

TAPPER: In our politics lead today: Sources tell CNN that White House advisers and lawyers are urging President Trump to reduce his legal liability by toning down his rhetoric and denouncing violence.

The attorney general for the District of Columbia says he is looking into potentially charging President Trump and other speakers at last Wednesday's rally, charging them with incitement of violence.

Joining us now is the attorney general for the District of Columbia, Karl Racine.

General Racine, thanks so much for joining us.

How's the investigation coming? What charges are you currently looking at? And who are you investigating?

KARL RACINE, D.C. ATTORNEY GENERAL: Sure. Let me break it down for you.

First of all, I think assistant U.S. attorney Sherwin did a great job in talking about the federal counts that he is looking at, sedition and the like. At the office of attorney general, we're focused on weapons offenses, ammunition offenses, disorderly conduct, curfew violations, and incitement of violence.

Of course, that last charge, incitement of violence, has gotten a lot of attention. In that regard, words do matter. And individuals who are found to have incited violence, encouraged people to go on to the Capitol, and to cause havoc would, in the strict definition, be liable.

But we're going to be very careful and thoughtful in regards to our full investigation. TAPPER: President Trump said today that everything he said was

perfectly appropriate.

RACINE: Well, that's no surprise that President Trump would exculpate himself.

I think, at the very least, his comments were absolutely reckless, totally unpresidential, and certainly didn't help matters. Whether they rise to the level of incitement, we're going to look at all of our law books and the facts, including the recording of President Trump's comments.

We will also take a look at the comments of others, including Don Jr., Rudy Giuliani and Congressman Brooks. All of their comments were inflammatory at the lease and merit a full investigation.

TAPPER: What is the difference between inflammatory, which is a judgment call, and incitement, which is a legal standard? What does one have to do?

When Donald Trump Jr. says, we're going to go after you, and we're going to have fun doing it, he's going to argue in court or not in court, I meant that, politically, we're going to go after you.

[16:20:06]

Mo Brooks, who said it's time for patriots to take some names and kick some ass or something like that, he's going to say, I didn't mean it literally.

What's the difference? How do you build a case?

RACINE: You know, I think that those are really hard questions.

And it's a really focused case-by-case analysis, focused on the timing of the remarks, exactly what else was being said by the speakers and the crowd, how close the crowd was to the Capitol. What exactly was the direction and instruction? What did the crowd itself think they were being urged to do?

All of those facts will be relevant. And, to be sure, these are close calls. And one doesn't bring a criminal case lightly. I can guarantee you we're going to be responsible in evaluating the evidence. We will bring a case if we think we can make the case. We won't if we think the speech was protected.

TAPPER: Is it relevant to your case that one of the president's most fervent defenders, former Attorney General Bill Barr, said about his former boss -- quote -- "Orchestrating a mob to pressure Congress is inexcusable"?

Could that be relevant to your case?

RACINE: Well, I think that General Barr's characterization and framing of the president's comments and behavior is exactly right. I don't think, in fact, in evidence, General Barr's opinion is

evidence that will be admissible. And so it's helpful, but, no, it's not evidence. What we will look at is the evidence of the case.

I do want you to know, Jake, we have brought 20 such incitement cases in the past. It's a new law, relatively, brought into effect in 2011. So, our prosecutors know exactly how to make these fine distinctions. And that's what they're doing right now. They're going through all of those cases, all of reported cases and other jurisdictions with similar laws, so that we can make the right decision.

TAPPER: Just to remind our viewers, we heard in the previous segment, we heard President Trump and his inflammatory language, as you describe it.

Here are some of the other individuals you just mentioned.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP JR., SON OF DONALD TRUMP: Stand up and fight! Stand up and hold your representatives accountable!

RUDY GIULIANI, ATTORNEY FOR PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: Let's have trial by combat.

REP. MO BROOKS (R-AL): Today is important in another way. Today is the day American patriots start taking down names and kicking ass!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: You have already said that you're investigating those three individuals as well for possible incitement.

Another big -- just big picture question, have you discovered any evidence that this was a planned attack -- it seemed like some of these individuals came ready for combat -- and, if so, whether or not they had any conversations with anybody in the president's circle, whether on the Trump campaign or in the Trump White House?

RACINE: That latter point, whether there was a collaboration, collusion, conversation, that's a matter for deep and intense investigation. And I can't comment on that.

But you did make an excellent point when you focused in on the crowd. And, Jake, you know and we knew even before the events at the Capitol Hill, that what we were talking about are not just normal Trump voters. We're talking about known hate groups, known white supremacist violent extremists.

When they get together, they don't get together for tea. They get together to cause harm. And I think that becomes relevant as to what the speakers were telling those types of individuals.

You saw them trained, practiced, bruising mob. That becomes relevant to our analysis. TAPPER: All right, Attorney General for the District of Columbia Karl

Racine, thanks so much. Hope to have you on back to keep us updated on the status of this investigation into a horrific terrorist attack on this country.

Thanks again.

RACINE: Thank you.

TAPPER: Republicans still on the Trump train being thrown off the gravy train.

Will U.S. corporations cutting them off finally get the point across?

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:28:45]

TAPPER: Major companies are now moving away from President Trump and from some Republicans.

CNN's Tom Foreman explains how money talks.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Cut off after more than 25,000 tweets, shut down on Facebook, the plug pulled on Parler. The president's bully pulpit is shrinking fast, and he's furious.

TRUMP: I think that big tech is doing a horrible thing for our country and to our country.

FOREMAN: But the violent attack on Congress is bringing more than just a muzzle. Trump's vaunted business empire is taking real financial hits.

RICK WILSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Markets matter. And market pressure matters. And this is a classic market pressure campaign.

FOREMAN: The PGA has broken off from the golfer in chief, pulling a major championship tournament from one of his clubs next year.

Two huge banking partners that have handled hundreds of millions in loans for Trump and his family businesses are also severing ties, one of them calling for his resignation and adding in a statement: "Signature Bank pledges it will not do business in the future with any members of Congress who voted to disregard the Electoral College."

Other companies are also pledging to stop donations to lawmakers who attended the rally before the insurrection and supported Trump's election fraud charade.