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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump's Political Plans?; Trump Culpable For Capitol Riot?; Philadelphia Lets Some Kids Return to Classrooms Twice a Week. Aired 4:30-5p ET

Aired March 22, 2021 - 16:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:32:47]

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: In our politics lead today: The January 6 capital insurrectionists could face sedition charges, according to the man who was in charge of the investigation.

Michael Sherwin, the former acting D.C. U.S. attorney, also tells "60 Minutes" that former President Donald Trump may be culpable for that insurrection.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL SHERWIN, ACTING U.S. ATTORNEY FOR DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA: We have soccer moms from Ohio that were arrested, saying, well, I did this because my president said I have to take back our house.

That moves the needle towards that direction. Maybe the president is culpable for those actions.

QUESTION: In short, you have investigators looking into the president's role?

SHERWIN: We have people looking at everything, correct.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Joining me now is CNN's Evan Perez.

And, Evan, you're learning there's been quite a bit of fallout over Sherwin's comments about all that.

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, look, Jake, this is the new no drama Justice Department after January 20, certainly after the arrival of Merrick Garland, who's coming off 25 years serving on the federal bench.

They don't believe that -- the officials here in this building, that is, do not believe that the prosecutor should be out there talking about an ongoing investigation. And, in particular, it's the comments that Sherwin made about the sedition charges. He made clear that he believes that the facts currently support bringing those charges.

That is something, by the way, that we have previously reported. prosecutors have recommended bringing those charges against some of the insurrectionists from January 6. And that decision now is in the hands of the bosses upstairs from where I'm sitting.

And so what could happen now is, obviously, this makes clear that, if they go in a different direction, we will know that there was a difference of opinion behind the scenes, something that you don't usually get here at this building.

TAPPER: And, as of now, there's no indication that a formal criminal investigation has been opened against Donald Trump. So what does culpable, what does that really mean?

PEREZ: Well, look, I think culpable means that that is one of the factors that people upstairs are going to be weighing in deciding whether the president should be held criminally liable in this investigation.

There is a lot of other evidence. If you hear some of his comments from Sherwin's interview with "60 Minutes," he says also that, obviously, there's free speech elements to this. There are some people who showed up and said they did this on purpose because they knew Trump wasn't going to do anything.

[16:35:16]

So, I think, his comments about culpability, I think, will be part of what the attorney general and other officials here will be trying to weigh as they make a decision whether the president should be facing charges.

Again, at this point, Jake, we don't really see that as the likeliest outcome, but you never know what the facts will show at the end of this investigation.

TAPPER: Big difference between morally culpable and legally culpable.

PEREZ: Absolutely.

TAPPER: Evan Perez at the Department of Justice, thanks so much.

The new political plans for former President Trump, including a return online that his supporters claim will redefine social media.

That's next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:40:19]

TAPPER: In our politics lead: Former President Trump trying to play kingmaker, backing a challenger to run against incumbent Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger.

You might remember Raffensperger. He refused to overturn his state's election results in November, even after Trump infamously phoned him and told him to find the needed number of votes to overturn the election results, a matter currently being investigated by Georgia prosecutors.

On a podcast, Trump said that and listed the Republicans he thought would be the future of the GOP. All, of course, have a long history of being very loyal to him, also notable, some whom he did not name.

Let's discuss with our political panel.

And, Melody, let me start with you.

The man that Trump endorsed for secretary of state, Congressman Jody Hice, he's a fervent Trump loyalist. He spread the same election fraud lies that Trump pushed. He backed the lawsuit to overturn Biden's victory in battleground states. He objected to the certification of the Electoral College votes even after the insurrection.

So, this is something of a fringe member of Congress, and Trump wants him to be in charge of the elections in Georgia. What's your reaction?

MELODY BARNES, FORMER WHITE HOUSE DOMESTIC POLICY ADVISER: Well, first of all, it's great to be with you, Jake.

Secondly, I would say the rough-and-tumble of politics and picking and choosing who you would like to run and who you will endorse is standard fare. But I think what's unusual here is that Trump has taken the enemy of my enemy is my friend attitude to a whole new level, because he's going against people who wouldn't do him the favor of breaking the law for him.

And what that leads to is the situation that we're in now, where he's endorsing people who he believes have been loyal to him, and doing that in a state where he's also encouraging the kind of voter suppression and changes in laws that will undermine, fundamentally undermine American democracy.

And I think, at base, that is the essential question here. If we're just focusing on whether or not Donald Trump is seeking revenge, we're taking our eye off the ball, which is what's happening to American democracy.

TAPPER: And the president gave an interview on Lisa Boothe's podcast, Lanhee, where he was asked about the future of the Republican Party.

Asked to name some future stars, he named Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, Missouri Senator Josh Hawley, Texas Senator Ted Cruz, Kentucky Senator Rand Paul, Arkansas gubernatorial candidate Sarah Huckabee Sanders, and South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem, loyalists, one and all.

Among those not mentioned, Vice President Pence, who I guess -- I guess, Lanhee, he failed the loyalty test.

LANHEE CHEN, FORMER POLICY DIRECTOR, MITT ROMNEY CAMPAIGN: Yes, I guess that's the case.

Look, I have been involved, Jake, in three Republican presidential primary campaigns. And I can tell you, the lanes in these primary campaigns, they get pretty narrow. So, the notion that you're playing only for Trump's vote or only for Trump's support, I think, ends up being a fundamentally losing strategy in this.

I mean, look, I think a lot of these guys are going to claim to be the heir apparent to Donald Trump. But, at the end of the day, that's a risky proposition, because you don't know where Donald Trump himself is going to land. You don't know who he's going to end up endorsing. You don't know if he's going to run himself.

And so you have to really approach this very carefully if you're one of these folks that's thinking about running in 2024. How do you position yourself vis-a-vis the president? How do you garner support with the president's supporters, while not hinging too much of your campaign on the president's support himself?

Because that, by its very nature, I think is going to be quite capricious.

TAPPER: And, Melody, in the same interview, Trump said he will decide sometime later if he's going to run for president again.

What do Democrats need to do to prepare for a potential Trump presidential run, you think?

BARNES: Well, a couple of things, Jake.

One, if you're in Donald Trump's head, which is an interesting place to be, there are reasons to think about running. I mean, he had the -- we had the highest voter turnout in 120 years. And he placed second only to the winner, President Biden.

And he also managed to pick up among Asian Americans, among African- American men, in the Latino community.

And I think, while Democrats are also focused on governing right now and the control they have over the White House and over both branches of government, there are important and critical questions that they have to ask and answer as to why that happened, why Donald Trump was able to exploit something there in those communities and what the message was, and simultaneously, while you have got the reins of government, do things that help American people understand that you're working for them, and, in fact, that government can work for them.

[18:45:01]

And I think that that's what the recovery -- the rescue plan was about. That's why they are talking about going big on a job and infrastructure bill.

TAPPER: And, Lanhee, I never know how much to believe any Trump flack when they go on TV but according to one of them, Trump is going to have his own platform on social media in the next two or three months. Maybe that's true. Maybe it's not. I don't know.

What did you think when you heard that? CHEN: Yeah. I mean, look, Donald Trump will continue to try to figure

out ways to influence the political dialogue, whether that's on his own social media network or via the good old-fashioned press release that goes out and is covered by mainstream media, he's going to try and figure out how to remains involved and engaged.

So if he comes up with a new way to do it, you know, more power to him. I do know not being on Twitter any more has meant a lot more peace for people's lives and has also meant frankly that his reach has been a little more limited since he's no longer able to get the word out as quickly.

TAPPER: Quite limited.

Lanhee Chen and Melody Barns, thanks to both of you. Good to see both of you.

Coming up next, what it takes to reopen our schools. The COVID safety precautions in one great city could serve as a lesson for educators nationwide.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:50:19]

TAPPER: In our national lead, the majority of high school students returned to in-person learning in the nation's largest school district today and half of them will be back in their New York City classrooms five day a week -- five days a week.

It's not the same story in the great city of Philadelphia where a hybrid learning plan has is its pre-kindergarten through second graders in school just two days a week and the rest still learning just online, leaving some educators worried about setbacks for the students as CNN's Bianna Golodryga reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DAN LAZAR, ELEMENTARY SCHOOL PRINCIPAL: I feel optimistic, guardedly but I feel optimistic.

BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's been nearly two weeks since students have returned to Philadelphia's Greenfield Elementary School, and already some familiar sounds.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why don't you share what you've got so far.

LAZAR: Really had no issues with kids following the safety protocols or guidelines and at the same time we're trying to make it fun for them.

GOLODRYGA: Fun but far from normal. Under Philadelphia's hybrid plan, pre-K through second grade students are back in school buildings two days a week. LAZAR: We can lay out what our plan is and try to get those -- get

all the families who want to come back to come back. People are going to have to make their own decision of what they feel comfortable with.

GOLODRYGA: The district has installed hand sanitizers, mandated masks, six feet of social distancing and even devoting an entire day to scrubbing down schools.

Some medical experts don't think that's necessary.

What made you decide to impose one day where children are not in school dedicated to just cleaning?

WILLIAM HITE, SUPERINTENDENT, PHILADELPHIA SCHOOL DISTRICT: That was done in part because of the recommendation but also in part to develop and build that trust for individuals.

GOLODRYGA: Superintendent William Hite is especially concerned about the city's youngest students. Recent data shows an almost 15 percent decline in reading comprehension for first grade students.

HITE: The regression has occurred. It is real, and for young people, many young people who are already struggling, they have been disproportionately impacted.

GOLODRYGA: An in-person option will be expanded for more students in the coming weeks.

What is your realistic goal in terms of what a classroom is going to look like by the end of this school year?

HITE: My realistic goal is to get as many children in as possible.

GOLODRYGA: K through 12.

HITE: K through 12, right. So -- and if we get up to middle school, then that would be success for us, but if we get to 12th grade, that's even more success.

JA-LIN GUZMAN, HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: High school was our chance to still have our childhood and to be kids and now we don't have that.

GOLODRYGA: We met up with three high school students outside of their school which remains closed.

ANGELICA LOV SPEECH, HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: I don't even know like where the school life and the just every home life, it's blurred and I feel like I'm always in school.

GUZMAN: It's hard because the older kids in the household, we're also like in school and trying to help our siblings in school and trying to provide while our parents are at work.

GOLODRYGA: The toll of remote learning is almost immeasurable.

GUZMAN: My mental health hasn't been good. SPEECH: I just got a therapist, you know.

GOLODRYGA: And yet despite all of their setbacks, they are nervous about returning to the classroom whenever that maybe.

DENA STILES-LAWSON, HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT: It's hard not being like being able to see your friends, but at the same time, like, I definitely would not want to go back if it means endangering my friends.

GOLODRYGA: Hite is well aware of the sacrifices high school students are making.

HITE: I want them to understand that this is -- this is not going to be forever.

GOLODRYGA: What is it going to feel like for you when you go back into the classroom with your peers for the first time again?

STILES-LAWSON: Oh, my God. It would be like euphoric. Like I don't even know how to explain how much I miss my friends.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GOLODRYGA (on camera): And, Jake, it's not every day that we hear from older students, high school students in particular about how this year has impacted them, which is why it's so important for us to find those three young woman. You can see what a toll this year has had on them even though they are still alarmed and nervous about going back to school.

Now, Superintendent Hites said he hopes to have older students back by the end of this school year and he's also going to be implementing summer school programs to get more of these students on board.

TAPPER: All right. Bianna Golodryga with the latest in our series "Education in a Time of COVID", thank you so much.

Coming up, hear from a survivor of the Atlanta spa shootings as leaders push for new hate crime laws in the wake of the senseless tragedy. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:59:21]

TAPPER: Before we go fade we want to take the time today to remember one of the 542,000 lives lost to COVID in the U.S.

Today, we want to take the time to remember Bishop Omar Jahwar. People in Dallas knew him as Bishop Omar. He used his organization Urban Specialists to be a peace-maker between rival gang members. It was not unusual to see him in court testifying on behalf of people facing jail time.

Bishop Omar was also a go-to for former felons getting out of prison trying to get their life back on track. COVID consumed his last six months of life. He was diagnosed back in October. Lung infections kept him in the hospital. He died last Thursday.

His family held a burial earlier today. His wife wants to remember his love, his spirit and his integrity for all mankind.

To the Jahwar family, our condolences. May his memory be a blessing.

Our coverage on CNN continues right now.

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