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The Lead with Jake Tapper
Eight Killed, Several Injured in America's Latest Mass Shooting; Police Identify FedEx Mass Shooting Suspect, Motive Still Unclear. Aired 4-4:30p ET
Aired April 16, 2021 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:04]
JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.
And we start with our national lead. Today, the epidemic of gun violence in the United States of America and another, another mass shooting. This one leaving eight families with funerals to plan and another community asking why, and could there have been prevented and if so how?
We know overnight in Indianapolis, a male gunman opened fire both outside and inside a federal express facility. He killed eight people, injured several others and then killed himself. The FBI says as of right now it is too early to speculate on any motive, but three law enforcement sources tell CNN that a family member of the suspected shooter had previously, previously gone to authorities warning about the potential for violence. We'll have more on that in a moment.
Today, flags across the United States, including at the White House, are back at half staff yet again. President Biden continues to promise action. In a statement he said, quote: Too many Americans are dying every single day from gun violence. It stains our character and pierces the very soul of our nation. We can and must do more to act and save lives, unquote.
This massacre, this latest one in Indiana, is the 45th mass shooting in the United States in just the last month, and we're defining mass shooting as four or more individuals shot, not including the shooter. This is a statistic no nation should ever face, and frankly most do not. It is depressing.
Honestly, it's embarrassing. Mass shootings have become so common in America that anniversaries of mass shooting are overlapping. Today marks 40 -- I'm sorry, 14 years since a gunman killed 32 innocent people at Virginia Tech in one of the deadliest mass shootings in American history.
We're going to start our coverage in Indianapolis today where moments ago we got some breaking news about the FedEx shooting suspect.
Let's go to CNN's Miguel Marquez. And, Miguel, it appears the suspect used to work at this very FedEx
facility.
MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. The FedEx spokesperson says that the perpetuator in this latest mass shooting used to work at this very place as investigators try to figure out why this happened.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
MARQUEZ (voice-over): In less than a couple of minutes --
DEPUTY CHIEF CRAIG MCCARTT, INDIANAPOLIS METROPOLITAN POLICE DEPARTMENT: He just appeared to randomly start shooting.
MARQUEZ: Eight more lives lost in America's latest mass shooting.
JEREMIAH MILLER, WITNESS: He was firing in the open, and I immediately ducked down and got scared, and my friend's mother, he came -- she came in and told us to get inside the car.
TIMOTHY BOILLAT, WITNESS: We heard three more shots, and then my buddy Levi saw someone running out of the building and then more shots went off.
MARQUEZ: Officials say a gunman entered the sprawling FedEx facility neither Indianapolis airport just after 11:00 p.m. last night. After opening fire in the parking lot killing four, he killed another four inside. Seven more injured in the rampage.
MCCARTT: He got out of his car and pretty quickly started some random shooting outside the facility. There was no confrontation with anyone that was there. There was no disturbance. There was no argument.
MARQUEZ: The shooter used at least one rifle, police say, responding within minutes to what police described as a chaotic crime scene, but gunman had already killed himself inside the building.
BOILLAT: I'm a little -- I'm a little overwhelmed.
MARQUEZ: The FBI is assisting local police in searching the suspect's home and car. So far investigators haven't identified the man, but CNN has learned he was known to federal and local officials after a family member reached out to them warning of a potential for violence.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It would be premature to speculate on that motivation. I can tell you that there is no further threat.
MARQUEZ: Family members of victims and those who worked at the facility gathered at a nearby hotel as police worked to identify the victims. The facility, the second largest hub in FedEx's global network with more than 4,500 employees.
In a statement, FedEx said the company is deeply shocked and saddened by the loss of our team members. MAYOR JOE HOGSETT (D), INDIANAPOLIS: Nothing we learn can heal the
wounds of those who escaped with their lives but who will now bear the scars and endure the memories of this horrific crime.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
MARQUEZ: Now, on that -- that indication to federal and local authorities that there was some concern about this individual, there was an investigation open, but the FBI is saying they eventually close it had because there wasn't enough information to keep it open. We expect an update from police in just a few minutes -- Jake.
TAPPER: All right. Lots of questions there about whether or not a red flag law could have been invoked, how the shooter got the gun and more.
[16:05:03]
Still a lot of questions unanswered.
Miguel Marquez, thanks so much.
Let's discuss this all with Dr. Megan Ranney. She's an emergency room physician. She has spent more than a decade researching gun violence as a public health crisis, which obviously it is.
Dr. Ranney, today, you said, quote, these mass shootings are the tip of the iceberg that a titanic of a country is heading into, unquote. What do you mean by that?
DR. MEGAN RANNEY, EMERGENCY PHYSICIAN, BROWN UNIVERSITY: So mass shootings, Jake, are horrific and should be never events, but they represent less than 1 percent of the gun deaths in our country on an annual basis. Every single day, more than 100 people are killed and more than 200 --
TAPPER: I'm sorry, Dr. Ranney. We're going to come back to you. But we have to take this press conference out of Indianapolis right now.
MCCARTT: After I do that, you'll have a short period of time to ask some questions, and I'll certainly try to answer what I can, but, again, many of those questions are still left unanswered, and I won't be able to provide that information.
Just after 11:00, the Indianapolis Metropolitan Police Department received a call for service at 8951 Mirabel Road, which is the FedEx Ground Plainfield operation for shots being fired outside of the building.
As they were responding, officers received information of a male walking through the parking lot shooting a rifle. Responding officers received additional information that a man shooting a weapon entered the building and multiple people were shot at the location. Officers arrived and began securing the scene by searching the business interior and exterior for the suspect and for anyone in into evidence medical services. Officers administered first aid and life-saving techniques until the
Indianapolis emergency medical services arrived on the scene. IEMS transported four victims with injuries consistent of a gunshot wound to various hospitals in the Indianapolis area. Two other victims received minor injuries and were treated by IEMS at the scene and released. A fifth victim with injuries consistent with a gunshot wound sought medical attention in another county.
Officers located a male with injuries consistent with a self-inflicted gunshot wound inside the building. Preliminary information gathered from the statements and evidence lead detectives to believe the male is the suspect in the shooting at this location. This individual has since been identified as 19-year-old Brandon Hole. FedEx officials have confirmed that Mr. Hole was a former employee at the facility, and he was last employed in 2020.
There were at least 100 people in the facility at the time of the incident. Many were changing shifts and were on their dinner break.
Detectives have served several search warrants at multiple locations and are continuing to gather evidence to determine the facts that led up to Thursday night's incident at the FedEx Ground Plainfield operations. Anyone with information on this incident is asked to call Crimestoppers anonymously at 317-262-TIPS or the IMPD homicide office at 317-327-3475.
I'll now try to answer any questions that you guys have, if I can.
REPOPRTER: Was the weapon an assault weapon, AR-15?
MCCARTT: It was a rifle. Specifically I don't know a make and mold, but it was a rifle yes.
REPORTER: Do you know if he was fired?
MCCARTT: If he was fired?
REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE)
MCCARTT: I don't have that information. I just know that he was last employed in 2020.
REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE).
MCCARTT: So we've recently identified him. So now the work really begins trying to establish some of that and see if we can figure out some sort of motive in this, but we don't have that right now.
REPORTER: What can you tell us about whether or not he was on IMPD or FBI's radar?
MCCARTT: The only thing that I can tell you he was found in a couple of police reports. That's all that we have. One of those is from last year, and one was from I believe 2013 possibly.
REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE) MCCARTT: That's what was in the 2020 report. That's correct.
REPORTER: Did his girlfriend work here?
MCCARTT: Ii have no information on that.
REPORTER: Are you able to elaborate on these reports?
MCCARTT: Excuse me?
REPORTER: Are you able to elaborate on the report?
MCCARTT: I honestly don't have a lot of information on that report. I know a gun was seized in the one from last year but that's all the information I have on it right now.
REPORTER: How much search warrants total are you executing?
MCCARTT: I couldn't answer that. We have -- we have a couple locations. We have a vehicle. We certainly have -- we may have electronic devices that if we seize those we'll seek search warrants on.
REPORTER: There is an indication that there was an investigation early on, that a family member had contacted police here and FBI, that there was an investigation opened and eventually closed.
[16:10:05]
But that gun that you all seized, that was part of that investigation. You don't have any knowledge of that investigation?
MCCARTT: I don't have that information.
REPORTER: Between your department and the FBI?
MCCARTT: There will be discussion between us.
REPORTER: Previous.
MCCARTT: Not that -- not that I'm aware of.
REPORTER: If he was a former employee, what brought him back here last night specifically?
MCCARTT: I wish we could answer that. No idea.
REPORTER: So nothing happened leading up to this last night?
MCCARTT: Not that we've learned at this point. That's obviously -- those are the questions that we work to answer right now, but we don't have those answers.
REPORTER: Have familiar lives all the victims been notified?
MCCARTT: No, we're still working on that. The coroner's office is working to make those notifications, and that's still going on as we speak.
REPORTER: Have all of the victims and the suspect's body been removed from the scene.
MCCARTT: No, not at this time.
REPORTER: Do you know if he possess that had gun legally that was found on his person last night?
MCCARTT: I don't, yeah. I don't believe that's the case, but I don't know that for sure. I don't believe it -- that's correct.
REPORTER: And not legally -- he wasn't legally --
MCCARTT: At this point, I don't know that it was illegally possessed. Correct.
REPORTER: You don't know if it was illegally possessed.
MCCARTT: Correct.
REPORTER: What did you seize from the home?
MCCARTT: I'm not going to give that information.
REPORTER: With regard to the victim, was there any characteristics that tied them together, race, religion, anything else?
MCCARTT: Not -- not at this time, and we're still -- like said, we're still identifying victims so we still don't have all that information. After everyone is identified then we'll certainly start working to see if there is anything that ties them together, ties them to the suspect, anything like that.
REPORTER: What kind of police background does he have?
MCCARTT: The report that I'm familiar with is last year, and I know a gun was seized from him in a report approximately a year ago.
REPORTER: Do you know if the suspect had any relationship with anyone inside the FedEx facility, girlfriend, family members, anything?
MCCARTT: No. We don't have any information indicating that right now.
REPORTER: No information as to why he was terminated?
MCCARTT: I don't know that he was terminated.
REPORTER: Do you know when he last worked here in 2020? Do you have anything more specific?
MCCARTT: I don't have exactly when that is. I believe it was in the fall of 2020, but I don't know that for certain.
REPORTER: Did any of your witnesses indicate to you that he said anything as he was going about doing this? MCCARTT: Not that I'm aware of, no.
REPORTER: The gun that was seized in the March report, was that the current report? What was the status of that?
MCCARTT: We're still looking into that.
REPORTER: And you're speaking to his family?
MCCARTT: Sure, absolutely.
REPORTER: Is there something you can share from that?
MCCARTT: No, we're certainly not going to share our conversations with -- with his family. I don't think that would be appropriate on many levels, but, no, we're not going to share that.
POLICE OFFICER: One more question.
REPORTER: What happens here now with the investigation, sir?
MCCARTT: Well, the same thing that's been happening, you know, since late last night, early this morning, so we continue. Crime lab is still here. They are finishing processing the scene. They are working closely with the coroner's office. We're to the point now are we're identifying victims, making notifications to the family and then hopefully we will wrap up the processing of this crime scene here very shortly and be done at least with this portion of the investigation.
REPORTER: Are all the victim's families been identified --
MCCARTT: That's still going on as we speak.
POLICE OFFICER: Thank you.
REPORTER: (INAUDIBLE)
MCCARTT: So the coroner's office is responsible for actually positively identifying the victims, and there's -- there's a very strict set of criteria that has to be met, and so those are either dental records, DNA or identification by family. So, obviously, any ID that they might be wearing certainly helps us, sets us in the right direction, but we still have to go through the right steps with the coroner's office to make those notifications and identifications.
REPORTER: Do you need to verify inside the building where it happened? They said that there's some type of security that employees have to go into before they go into the facility. Did it happen in the breezeway right there, or are you not going to share that?
MCCARTT: As I said before, there is some physical security inside that entryway and it served its purpose and did what it was supposed to do last night.
Thank you. TAPPER: All right. You've been listening to police in Indianapolis,
specifically Indianapolis Metropolitan Police Deputy Chief Craig McCartt giving an update on the mass shooting there. Police identifying 19-year-old Brandon Hole who they identified as a former FedEx employee as the suspect in the man shooting at the FedEx facility overnight. Police say they still do not have a motive. They note that he worked at that facility until 2020.
Still with us is Dr. Megan Ranney, an emergency room physician who's researched gun violence as a public health crisis.
[16:15:06]
I'm so sorry, I interrupted.
Before the police just started talking, we're discussing how today, you said that these mass shootings are just a tip of the iceberg that our titanic of a country is heading into. Please explain what you meant. You can start at the top, of course.
RANNEY: Yeah, thank you.
Jake, let me just say that my heart goes out to the families of all the folks in Indianapolis and their families across the country. These mass shootings are horrible. They should never be events.
But they are the tip of the iceberg. It's about those 100 deaths and it 200 injuries every day, each of which leaves an equivalent ripple effect tearing apart communities across the country. The things we don't talk about the suicides which make up two-thirds of gun deaths, the domestic violence homicides which are often deeply tied into these mass shootings and the fact that firearm injury is the second leading cause of death for American kids.
Each one of those deserves to be talked about, and it's only when we approach gun violence as a public health epidemic and addressing each of those different types of injury that we can even begin to hope to make a dent in these mass shootings which are the terminal event in the series of horrible things that are going wrong across the country.
TAPPER: Much of your advocacy has been fueled by your experience treating victims of gun violence. What is it like to be in an emergency room where you're dealing with gun shot victim after gunshot victim?
RANNEY: Taking care of gunshot wounds is a daily occurrence for ER docs across the country, and too many of us have been on the receiving end of these mass shootings. Let me tell you, Jake, that some of the worst cases I have taken care of are not what most of us imagine, right. So it is certainly about gang violence, but it's also, again, about the domestic violence homicides, the young women who are shot by boyfriends, fiances, the young men who shot themselves to take their own life.
It's exhausting. It is emotionally drank, and I think one of the most frustrating parts for many of us over the past 20-odd years has been that we were told that there was nothing we could do about it. We just had to accept it as part of our job.
And I often think of the parallels to COVID. They are similar in so many ways. There's this frustration of sitting at a patient's bedside and wondering what could have been done differently, and that's really what's driven me and many others to take up the clarion call that there is something that we can do to change the trajectory on firearm injury.
TAPPER: And, in fact, the people who are responsible in so many ways for stopping any sensible legislation involving background checks and the like, they have actually prevented people like you from doing research on this issue as a public health issue. You've been dis -- beyond that, you've also been discouraged from pursuing that as you became a doctor because so many of your colleagues said it was too political.
Has that conversation about gun violence as a public health issue, has that changed at all in recent years?
RANNEY: It has shifted. You know, a little over two years ago I and many others across the country led #thisisourlane, talking about how gun violence was a public health problem, sharing both our personal stories and, of course, the clinical stories that every physician, nurse, respiratory therapist and social worker has.
That led to a shift this year or in 2020 for the first time in 24 years. Funding was released from the federal government directly to the NIH and CDC to study gun violence as a public health problem.
That -- I cannot tell you how transformative that was. I mean, it's the equivalent of saying imagine that we knew COVID was here and we hadn't put any money towards studying how to fight it or to create vaccines or to study whether masks worked or to study treatments.
We were in the same space for firearm injury for 24 years where there was really no substantive federal funding to help us create solutions. So it has begun to shift, but it's still only a drop in the bucket, and we are far behind where we should be in terms of creating good public health solutions.
TAPPER: All right. Dr. Megan Ranney, to be continued. We'll have you back to talk more about this issue. Thanks so much for your time today.
RANNEY: Thanks.
TAPPER: This terrible week in America goes beyond this one mass shooting. The Derek Chauvin murder trial, the shooting death of Daunte Wright by police, the video showing the deadly shooting of a 13-year- old boy in Chicago, how to make sense of this week? We'll discuss that next.
And soon, we're expecting President Biden to hold his in-person joint news conference with a world leader, the prime minister of Japan. We'll bring that to you live from the Rose Garden. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:23:53]
TAPPER: Any minute, we're expecting President Biden to speak at the White House following his meeting with the prime minister of Japan. Both leaders will speak and then they will take questions from reporters. We'll bring that to you live once it begins, but, first, let's dive into our national lead.
On top of the epidemic of mass shootings, the United States of America is facing a different infliction point and crisis when it comes to race and policing, with some unsettling examples just this week.
In Chicago, the police body cam video was released of a 13-year-old boy Adam Toledo shot and killed in an officer's split second decision during a chase. Police claim the boy had a gun in the moments before he was shot. Toledo's family attorney says the boy was trying to comply with the officer's demand to show his hands. That's just one case.
And then in Brooklyn Center, Minnesota, Daunte Wright was shot and killed Sunday. The then-police chief said that now former Officer Kim Potter mistakenly pulled her Glock and shot 20-year-old instead of using her Taser.
And then, of course, in nearby Indianapolis, the case that put one of the brightest spotlights on policing and racial bias in America, the killing of George Floyd.
[16:25:00]
Closing arguments will begin Monday after gripping testimony in that murder trial of former Officer Derek Chauvin.
So how is the United States of America handling all this?
Let's bring in our guest, W. Kama Bell. He's host of CNN's "UNITED SHADES OF AMERICA", along with psychologist, Alfiee Breland-Noble.
Thanks to both of you for being here.
So, Kamau, let me start with you. The mass shootings, the deadly police shootings, are these moments that will inspire change, or is just this -- where were as a country right now?
W. KAMAU BELL, CNN HOST, "UNITED SHADES OF AMERICA": You know, I think that we are -- they are not going to inspire change if we keep looking at them as separate acts, if we keep looking at them as individual acts and not as systemic failure of policing, then they won't inspire change.
And that's what a lot of black people are feeling right now. We have a moment once again where many white people are like, oh my god, I didn't know. And we like, we have been known, we have been done known as I say. We knew this was happening, but we have to talk about the system and get away from worrying about the bad apples. As Trevor Noah said earlier this week, the tree is rotten. The system
of policing in America is a rotten tree that is built on top of black people and against black people.
TAPPER: And, Alfiee, you're a psychologist. On an emotional level, not the political sociological level that Kamau was talking about, but on an emotional level, how do we process this?
ALFIEE BRELAND-NOBLE, PSYCHOLOGIST: I don't know that there's any one way to process it. I think for so many of us, it's just heavy, right? I've talked about how before for African-Americans and black people, people of the African Diaspora, this is daily, unfortunately.
And so, you know, this is not just today. This is historical. This is many years ago. This is yesterday.
This is hopefully not tomorrow but you never know what's going to happen. So I think for most of us who are black and for those folks who love black people, this is just he have and it's traumatizing.
We talk about this issue of vicarious trauma, this is what pretty much all of us who are black and those who love us are experiencing in this moment. And for other folks, it's just witnessing the people they care about struggle with this and wanting to do something but feeling powerless to be able to make any kinds of change.
TAPPER: And, Kamau, you went so far as to call conservative televangelist Pat Robertson woke for this moment on his show, the 700 Club, which I admit I was stunned to see myself. Let's roll it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAT ROBERTSON, 700 CLUB: I'm pro-police, folks. I think we need the police and we need their service and they do a good job. But if they don't stop this onslaught, they cannot do this. Why don't they hope their eyes to what the public relations are. They've got to stop this stuff.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: As our friend Don Lemon put it last night, it can't just be black people talking about this problem.
BELL: Yeah, and I think, that you know, first of all, I was kidding I don't think that Pat Robertson is pretty woke.
TAPPER: Right, I know.
BELL: I don't he's going to -- see him with Antifa any time soon, but I do think when you see somebody like that who has been so clearly pro-police and so clearly not in the lane talking about this, the fact that this old man can talk -- this old while man, this hold white man of immense privilege can talk about it, that shows that there's a real problem, and I hope that he keeps talking about it, because this is important that white people hear it from other white people. TAPPER: He seems to be saying that he wants police to succeed and as
long has police keep ignoring this, they are not going to be able to succeed so he's coming at it as an ally.
And, Alfiee, you know, as I don't need to tell you, these police killings, these types of killings are not new. There was a church in Chicago after what happened in Ferguson that tried to educate young black men on how to get home safely in a powerful public service announcement. This is from 2014 I believe.
Let's roll that tape.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do not make any sudden movements and keep your hands out of your pockets.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Number seven.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do not.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do not.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do not. Do not. Do not. Do not.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do not run, even if you are afraid.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Even if you're afraid.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: I mean, just devastating seeing these little boys and girls saying this. And, Alfiee, as you know, these cases present a unique stress when it comes to black boys and men in particular.
How do parents break through? How do you make sure you're having these conversations effectively?
BRELAND-NOBLE: I think my spouse and I were actually talking about this today, and my spouse is a male and a black man.
And he talked about, you know, what's horrifying is even with all of those admonitions, even with all the encouragement around, you should do "X," you should do "Y." Don't run. Be still, be complaint. Say yes and no. Be very clear.
There's still no guarantee that you won't be negatively impacted, that it won't result in a death, that you won't be shot, that you won't be hurt. And that's the part that's scary and horrifying for those of us who are -- I'm a black mom. I have a son and I have a daughter and it just horrifies me. It scares me.
And so, I think one of the things that we can't do is that we can't stop having these conversations with our children in age appropriate ways. We don't want to overwhelm kids. I think we also have to ask parents and the friends, the parents of our children's friends to also be accountable, and not shy away from these conversations because we can't have these conversations in a vacuum.
So for parents, you know, for black parents out there, I say keep talking to your children, keep shielding them from things until they're ready to engage and take them in.
