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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Attorneys: Family Shown "Snippet" of Video from Police Shooting; AG Garland Announces DOJ Investigation into Police Practices in Louisville, KY; Democrats Push to Pass George Floyd Policing Act by May 25; Sources: Biden to Announce New Mask Guidance Tomorrow. Aired 4-4:30p ET

Aired April 26, 2021 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER starts right now.

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JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: A North Carolina family now asking what police might be trying to hide?

The new two-hour LEAD starts right now.

Breaking just minutes ago, the family of Andrew Brown Jr. claiming they were only shown a snippet of the video showing the moment their loved one was killed by police. Why wasn't all the footage shown?

New signs of normal. The Biden administration set to set new mask guidance as more vaccine shots in arms might mean more freedom. But is the vaccine effort about to hit a wall?

And shots in arms, money in pockets, CNN talks to Biden's COVID team about the effort to overwhelm the virus, including an interview with Dr. Anthony Fauci as you've never quite heard him before talking about Donald Trump.

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Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.

And we start with breaking news in the national lead today where moments ago the family of Andrew brown Jr., of North Carolina, just watched the body cam video showing the final moments of their loved one's life and it's not what they expected. The family's lawyers say they were only allowed to view a 20-second clip of the body camera video.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BAKARI SELLERS, BROWN FAMILY ATTORNEY: One body cam, 20 seconds.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Welcome to North Carolina. SELLERS: And an execution.

And so with all due respect, I know there were a lot of people who thought last week's verdict was justice and I told you then it wasn't justice.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's right.

SELLERS: Because we still can't get justice and accountability today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Anticipating unrest, there's already been a state of emergency in Elizabeth City, North Carolina, declared.

CNN's Brian Todd is in that city in North Carolina for us now.

Brian, family attorneys say they were only allowed to see a 20-second snippet of the body camera video. Well, what did that 20-second snippet show?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it showed, Jake, what the family and its representatives are calling an execution. And to say that they're upset, that they're outraged over this is a gross understatement. They feel essentially that they've been railroaded here by the county attorney Michael Cox who they say oversaw this process of them viewing this video.

We've talked about -- they have said only 20 seconds out of all the many minutes of footage, of body camera footage from at least eight officers on the scene, only 20 seconds was made available for them to see. And what we're told is when that 20 seconds begins, the officers, the deputies are already shooting at Andrew Brown and that he's got his hands on the steering wheel and he's posing no danger to them.

We've got more detail now from family attorney Chantel Lassiter who described in the most detail that we can get what is on that tape. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHANTEL LASSITER, BROWN FAMILY ATTORNEY: This was an execution.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I know it.

LASSITER: Andrew Brown was in his driveway. The sheriff truck blocked him in his driveway so he could not exit his driveway. Andrew had his hands on his steering wheel. He was not reaching for anything. He was not touching anything. He wasn't throwing anything around. He had his hands firmly on the steering wheel. They run up to his vehicle shooting.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sure did.

LASSITER: He still stood there in his vehicle with his hands on the steering wheel while being shot at. (END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: Chantel Lassiter says that contrary to posing any kind of a danger to those deputies, Andrew Brown, she says, was consciously trying to avoid harming them, backing up, trying to get around them and then trying to get away all with his hands on the steering wheel, she said all the time they were shooting at him in that 20 seconds of video. Multiple deputies she said surrounding his vehicle doing that, Jake.

Very dramatic account from Chantel Lassiter and the other attorneys. They are just so, so frustrated that they haven't been able to get more video, you know, accessible to them and haven't gotten an explanation to their satisfaction why they are not seeing more videotape.

TAPPER: That's the mystery, Brian, because it's not just that the authorities aren't releasing this body cam video which would be in the name of transparency. If there's nothing to hide, show it, but beyond that authorities have had very little to say about what led to their deputies killing Brown. You obtained the death certificate. I'm not sure how much you're able to put together from that document, but tell us what it says.

TODD: Well, the document that he obtained, the death certificate, says that Andrew Brown died of a penetrating gunshot wound of the head, that he died within minutes of being shot and that it was at the hands of, quote, others. That's about all the detail you're getting, but it does give you the detail that apparently the wound that killed him was a gunshot wound to the head from one of those officers who were firing at him.

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We can also say that Chantel Lassiter said these officers, these deputies had Glock handguns and they had assault rifles as well -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right. Brian, thanks so much.

I want to bring in retired Captain Ron Johnson who was the incident commander in Ferguson, Missouri, during the protests to the killing of Michael Brown in 2014.

Thanks for joining us.

So, Brown family attorneys, Andrew Brown family attorneys say they were only allowed to see 20 seconds of the body camera video. Obviously there's much more than that that's there. Early this morning, they were told the footage would be redacted.

Can you understand any scenario why the family would only be shown 20 seconds from minutes and minutes of footage?

CAPT. RON JOHNSON (RET.), FORMER INCIDENT COMMANDER IN FERGUSON, MISSOURI: No, and I would say that is unacceptable. You know, at this point the video will be seen by America and be seen by the attorneys and the families at some point so when you know it's going to be seen, why not show it? If there's nothing there to hide or nothing there that you see inappropriate, you should show that.

And so, I think we see it across the country. Police departments are showing the videos as soon as we can, and this should be shown here.

TAPPER: The attorneys say that the brown family, they were initially told only two family members would be allowed to see the video and that no legal counsel would be allowed to be present. What do you make of all of this?

JOHNSON: Once again unacceptable. We have a right in this country to legal counsel. I a think a lot of times when families see videos, of course, their emotions are there and they are seeing it in a different life.

So, I think it's only appropriate that the attorneys would be there. Of course, they had qualified attorneys, attorneys there from North Carolina. So there's no reason why the attorneys shouldn't be present.

TAPPER: The sheriff's office says they need to petition a judge in order to get the video released to the public and that they had already planned to do so.

Andrew Brown Jr. was shot and killed last Wednesday. This delay also seems as though it's only potentially creating more of a public uproar.

JOHNSON: I agree with you, and I believe some of the political leaders in that state need to get involved and speed up that process if it is in fact a process that they have to go through and get it done.

TAPPER: Also, there's so much we don't know. Authorities haven't said where or how many times Andrew Brown Jr. was shot. It's only because of audio from first responders that we know that he was apparently shot in the back. Is it more common practice for police agencies to push for releasing as much information as possible as quickly as possible, or this opaqueness, this refusal to be transparent the norm?

JOHNSON: Well, I think we've seen police departments across the country, some have been transparent, up front, and we've seen some that have -- that's doing what we're seeing here. And I think this just shows us how far we have to go and we have to put some policies in place that are consistent in what we do, consistent in how information gets out.

TAPPER: Elizabeth City, North Carolina, they have declared a state of emergency ahead of more protests tonight. Those calling for more transparency have been demonstrating since last week. Pro-police groups conversely have said on social media they also plan to protest tonight.

What do you think authorities should be doing right now to make sure that the protests this evening, that they are peaceful demonstrations? JOHNSON: Well, they need what they should have been doing a long time

ago, meeting with the public and meeting with the community and being a part and creating partnerships so they're going to have to do that now in the midst of chaos and with the videos coming out and not being transparent it's even going to be tougher, but they are going to have to continue to try. They're going to have to walk that path to do everything they can to bring this community together and find out who the leaders are.

TAPPER: All right. Retired Captain Ron Johnson, good to see you again. Thanks so much for joining us today.

Also this afternoon in the politics lead, Attorney General Merrick Garland this afternoon announcing a federal investigate will now examine policing practices in Louisville, Kentucky. This, of course, in the wake of Breonna Taylor's death, the 26-year-old woman killed when police botched a raid at her apartment last year.

The new Justice Department investigation comes as lawmakers are pushing for a more permanent solution to policing practices with the George Floyd Justice in Policing Act. That legislation, which already passed the House, would set up a national registry of police misconduct. It would ban chokeholds. It would ban no-knock warrants in federal cases. Some progressive lawmakers say that their push to remove qualified immunity protecting police officers from civil lawsuits is not on the table, not up for compromise, but that single issue has become a sticking point in the U.S. Senate, putting the entire legislation at risk -- as CNN's Manu Raju reports.

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MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Minneapolis, Louisville, Brooklyn Center, Columbus, Elizabeth City as deadly confrontations with police continue to mount, so is the pressure on Congress to do something about it. Democrats set a goal to get a deal done by May 25th, the one-year anniversary of George Floyd's death.

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But two huge issues are dividing the parties, whether to lower the threshold to charge police officers with a crime and whether victims can sue cops in civil court. Both Democratic demands that Republicans are resisting.

CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Are you willing to blow up this deal over that issue?

REP. KAREN BASS (D-CA): I don't know if I'm willing to blow up the deal. I don't consider that blowing it up. Officers right now are not really held accountable.

RAJU: South Carolina Senator Tim Scott, the chief GOP negotiator, who is slated to deliver his party's response to President Biden's Wednesday address to Congress has proposed a compromise. He says that police departments should be sued, not individual officers, and he says that Democratic efforts to make it easier to charge officers with a crime is, quote, off the table.

Republicans are signaling they will get behind whatever approach Scott ultimately endorses.

SEN. SHELLEY MOORE CAPITO (R-WV): I definitely support Senator Scott's efforts.

RAJU: But there's still a laundry list of other sticking points, including whether there should be a federal ban on chokeholds as Democrats demand or if the federal government should instead incentivize local police departments to curb the use of excessive force as Scott has proposed.

Progressive Democrats are urging their negotiators to hold the line.

REP. CORI BUSH (D-MO): We compromise on so much, you know. We compromise, we die. We compromise, we die.

RAJU: Biden is expected to address the issue during this Wednesday's speech to Congress.

JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: We will also talk about a range of priorities that he has for the -- for the upcoming months of his presidency, including putting in place -- working with Congress to put in place police reform.

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RAJU (on camera): And Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, the Kentucky Republican, just weighed in on the investigation by the Justice Department into his hometown police department in Louisville, Kentucky, telling our colleague Ted Barrett that there have been significant challenges there since the Breonna Taylor incident and went ton say it's certainly not inappropriate for the Justice Department to take a look at it.

Now, the number two Democrat in the Senate Dick Durbin said these Justice Department investigations could be a way of forcing changes at the local level, especially if they don't get a deal on the federal level, and on that federal legislation, Jake, Dick Durbin told me the federal ban on chokeholds is essential, very important he said to getting a final deal but he said he did not want to put any red lines as the negotiations continue -- Jake.

TAPPER: All right. Manu Raju on Capitol Hill, thanks so much.

Also breaking today, the U.S. is not using it, but until now they were not sharing it. That's its stockpile of the AstraZeneca vaccine, sharing it with the rest world. Is it too late to make a difference?

And will former President Trump give the vaccine effort a shot in the arm right now, why those around him are urging him to make a PSA, a public service announcement, for his skeptical supporters.

Stay with us.

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TAPPER: In our health lead today, encouraging signs that life in the United States is beginning to safely return to some semblance of normal. Sources telling CNN that President Biden is expected to announce new CDC guidance tomorrow on whether fully vaccinated people need to wear masks outdoors.

Dr. Anthony Fauci hinted over the weekend that regulations would soon be relaxed for those Americans who are vaccinated. Also today, we learn that the United States starts to plan doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine with other countries pending a safety review. That vaccine is not yet approved for use in the United States, but it could be crucial to containing the virus in other countries such as India where a devastating second wave is spiraling out of control -- as CNN's Nick Watt reports.

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NICK WATT, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Closing in on one-third of the U.S. population is now fully vaccinated, still far from heard immunity, but apparently normality is nearer than that.

DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, CHIEF MEDICAL ADVISER TO PRESIDENT BIDEN: You will reach a point even before then when you'll start to seat number of cases going down dramatically. It's going to be a gradual getting with regard to what you can do outdoors, what you can do with travel, outdoor sports, stadiums, theaters, restaurants.

WATT: Even European vacations could be okay this summer for the vaccinated.

ANDY SLAVITT, WHITE HOUSE SENIOR ADVISER FOR COVID RESPONSE: They are saying those Americans are safe to come to our country without risk of spreading COVID-19. Think about that. That's incredible.

WATT: But the pace of vaccination here is now slowing.

SLAVITT: It may not be as fast as the first 50 percent. I think it will be slower, but I think we're going to continue to get there.

WATT: Eight percent of people may have missed getting their second doses.

FAUCI: I would like it to be zero percent but I'm not surprised that there are some people who do that.

WATT: Allowing the vaccinated to go maskless outside might be an incentive to get the vaccine.

DR. WILLIAM SCHAFFNER, PROFESSOR, DIVISION OF INFECTIOUS DISEASES, VANDERBILT UNIVERSITY MEDICAL CENTER: People who have been vaccinated have wanted some reward from this.

WATT: Average daily new COVID-19 cases in the U.S. just dropped below 60,000 for the first time in about a month.

DR. SCOTT GOTTLIEB, FORMER FDA COMMISSIONER: Right now, the declines that we're seeing we can take to the bank. I think we can feel more assured because they are being driven by vaccinations and greater levels of population-wide immunity.

WATT: But in India, crisis mode. The U.S. now sending equipment, drugs, advisers and raw materials for vaccines.

The administration will, pending safety review, release doses from its stockpile of AstraZeneca vaccine, unauthorized in this country, and apparently not needed. Still unknown which countries they would go to.

DR. KRUTIKA KUPPALI, VICE CHAIR, INFECTIOUS DISEASES SOCIETY OF AMERICA'S GLOBAL HEALTH COMMITTEE: We really do have a responsibility to try and help vaccinate the rest world, and that includes India and other places that need it right now.

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WATT (on camera): And here in the U.S., that Johnson & Johnson vaccine is rolling out again after the polls while experts looked into those possible blood clots, very rare blood clots. Now there was some polling done during that polls, and 73 percent of the people said that they would not be willing to get that Johnson & Johnson vaccine. I haven't seen any polling since the pause was lifted, but, Jake, it's going to be fascinating to see how that plays out over the next couple of weeks.

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TAPPER: Indeed. Nick Watt, thanks so much. Appreciate it.

Let's discuss all of this with Dr. Jonathan Reiner. He's a cardiologist and a professor medicine at G.W. University.

Dr. Reiner, what do you think is the proper guidance for people who are fully vaccinated? Is it safe to not wear a mask if you're fully vaccinated and you're walking outside?

DR. JONATHAN REINER, CNN MEDICAL ANALYST: I do think it is. What we've learned now with striking clarity after vaccinating over 200 million people is that these vaccines work as advertised. So if you look at the first 87 million people fully vaccinated, there have only been about 5,000 symptomatic infections. That's a rate of like .005 percent, and if you look at the death rate in fully vaccinated people, it's, you know, two orders of magnitude less than that, like .0009 percent.

So the vaccines work. So I think that it's time to start opening the country to vaccinated people. Vaccinated people can if to a restaurant and eat.

TAPPER: Okay.

REINER: Vaccinated people can go out without masks on. TAPPER: What if I'm fully vaccinated, Dave Matthews is coming to D.C.

in August. Is it safe for me to be in a crowd there or if I were to go to a baseball game? Would that be safe where there are lots of people around even though we're outdoors?

REINER: So if we had vaccine passports or some sort of vaccine documentation, venues could open up.

So, you know, I recently had a conversation with someone who worked at the 930 Club in D.C. and places like that need about 80 percent occupancy in order to have enough revenue to pay the artists, so how do you up those places with just 20 percent, you know, socially distanced crowds? You can't do it so we're going to start to see commercial enterprises ask customers for proof of immunity so that they can bring in larger crowds.

You know, right now in a -- if I was in an environment with a fully vaxxed crowd, absolutely. I would go see Dave Matthews. I think the risk, even with unvaccinated people, are you being fully vaxxed is quite low.

TAPPER: At what point will it be safe for me to go -- as a fully vaccinated person, to go into the 930 Club which is an indoor venue and not wear a mask indoors with a crowd of people?

REINER: I think the risk to you right now is very low. There's probably not -- not -- not probably. We know there's not a zero risk of you becoming infected but I told -- I've already told you how low the risks really are and the risk of death is many of orders magnitude lower than that. I think you can do that now.

The problem is we need guidelines for the entire country, and it's been difficult for the CDC basically to -- to tell half the country, yeah, you can go to the 930 Club and half the country no, you can't.

TAPPER: Yeah.

REINER: So we'll have to work through this and the best way to do this is to get everyone vaccinated.

TAPPER: Yeah, an official confirms to the CNN that the U.S. is going to start sharing doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine which is not approved for use here in the U.S. with other countries after a safety review. Multiple world leaders have been pressing the Biden administration to release the AstraZeneca to them, for instance, India.

How important is this, what some people are calling vaccine diplomacy?

REINER: Yeah. It's about time. It's even a little bit late. That vaccine will never be used in the United States. So, you know, last year the Trump administration pre-ordered about 300 million doses of that vaccine, and we've -- we have about 10 million doses bottled and ready to go and another 20 million doses ready to go into bottles.

But AstraZeneca hasn't even applied for an EUA in the United States for that drug. I don't think we'll ever see that. You know, there was some hesitancy to let go of that vaccine, you know, for fear of manufacturing problems with the two RNA vaccines or the J&J vaccine and we've already seen hiccups in the plant that actually makes the AstraZeneca vaccine in the United States.

But I think the supply lines are very secure now for the vaccines that we have. We have 60 million unused dozes in the community, and this vaccine should go to places that really need it, like India. Yesterday, the United States had 33,000 cases and India had 350,000 cases and their case curve is vertical right now.

TAPPER: Yeah.

REINER: So we really need to get them vaccine as quickly as possible.

TAPPER: The head of the European Union told the "New York Times" that Americans who have been fully vaccinated against coronavirus will be allowed to visit Europe this summer. Is there a safe way for Americans to vacation abroad?

REINER: Yeah. The safe way is to be vaccinated.

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The sticky point, and it looks like the object of negotiations now is how do you prove that you've been vaccinated? How can countries and how can the United States develop a document, a vaccination document that will be accepted around the world? But, again, if you've been fully vaccinated, it's going to be safe for you to travel.

TAPPER: All right. Dr. Jonathan Reiner, thanks so much. Appreciate it.

As President Biden approaches his 100th day in office, CNN is taking a look at the Biden's administration's all-out effort to vaccinate America and what the administration was left to work with from their predecessors with the Trump administration.

Stay with us.

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