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The Lead with Jake Tapper
U.S. Cases, Hospitalizations, Deaths Hit Lowest Points in Months; Rep. Elise Stefanik Pledges GOP Party Unity, While Casting Doubt on Election Integrity; Caitlyn Jenner Praises Trump, Bashes Biden as She Ramps Up Run for California Governor; Caitlyn Jenner Praises Trump, Bashes Biden as She Ramps Up Run for California Governor; Secretary Blinken: U.S. Will Respond if Russia Acts Recklessly or Aggressively Against Ukraine; Medics in India Bear Brunt of Anger Over Mishandled Pandemic. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired May 06, 2021 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:04]
VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN HOST: "The Lead" with Jake Tapper starts now.
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JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Just please, everyone, keep getting vaccinated so we can all pack the stands and boo for the Astros -- boo against the Astros.
THE LEAD starts right now.
COVID cases in the U.S. at a seven-month low but the number of shots in arms per day continues to slow down. Can the U.S. continue to turn that corner if COVID vaccine resistance continues?
From the Terminator to the Trump-inator, Caitlyn Jenner making her case to win California's next recall election by praising the ex- president.
Plus, agony and anger. Doctors in India forced to hide from relatives of COVID victims after a series of beatings.
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TAPPER: Welcome to THE LEAD, everyone. I'm Jake Tapper. And we start today with our health lead.
The United States is turning a corner in the battle against coronavirus. That's the declaration from a leading infectious disease expert today. The usually quite cautious epidemiologist Michael Osterholm telling CNN this afternoon, while there remains work to do, the U.S., he says, should be celebrating the progress made so far with vaccinations.
Now, one of the reason for his optimism? Record lows in the United States in the average of new daily cases, the lowest level since October. COVID hospitalizations, a low we haven't seen consistently since last fall, and daily deaths from the virus, still tragically high, 776 deaths yesterday, but deaths have fallen to the lowest average since July of 2020. For context, there was a day just in January where we lost more than five times that number of Americans to the virus in one day, more than 4,000 in one day.
Today, we're also learning more about possible COVID vaccine boosters with the president of Moderna saying he expects a booster shot will be needed every nine to 12 months to protect against new variants, as CNN Nick Watt reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: His name is Alexander Hamilton.
NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Broadway tickets back on sale today.
Cruises almost back. Trial voyages with volunteer vaccinated passengers, and kids from Jersey soon play basketball out of state again.
DR. LEANA WEN, PUBLIC HEALTH PROFESSOR, GEORGE WASHINGTON UNIVERSITY: Things are only going to get better over the summer. I feel extremely optimistic about where we're headed.
WATT: The COVID-19 daily infection rate across this country, lowest it's been in seven months. And --
DR. ROCHELLE WALENSKY, CDC DIRECTOR: The models projected a sharp decline in cases by July 2021, and an even faster decline if more people get vaccinated sooner.
WATT: Vaccinations, the only number going the wrong way right now. Average daily doses in arms down 20 percent in a week. The president's goal? At least one dose in 70 percent of adults by Fourth of July.
Some states already there. A few getting close. Some a long way to go. Republicans are most hesitant.
But look at this new poll. The percentage of Republicans who say never is falling.
DR. SCOTT HARRIS, STATE HEALTH OFFICER, ALABAMA DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC HEALTH: We've encouraged particularly primary care doctors, but all physicians in the state to personally reach out to people that they have a relationship with and try to make the case for getting vaccinated.
WATT: Kim Simmons of Illinois was hesitant, now fully vaccinated.
KIM SIMMONS, GOT VACCINATED AFTER BEING CONVINCED IT WAS SAFE: I don't think it would be good to try to force people to get the vaccine, but I think they should think about their family, their community and herd immunity.
DR. PAUL OFFIT, MEMBER, FDA VACCINE ADVISORY COMMITTEE: I would say immunize at least 80 million to 100 million people and next winter comes, it will just be a bump instead of a surge. We can do that.
WATT: July 4th, we can probably gather to celebrate independence from the pesky Brits but not quite independence from this virus.
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WATT (on camera): Now the new frontier, the next frontier is going to be vaccinating younger teenagers.
Today, Moderna said in earlier results from trials, their vaccine is 96 percent effective in teens and no serious safety concerns. We're also waiting for the FDA to green light Pfizer's vaccine in younger people. If they do, then that CDC advisory committee meets next Wednesday to talk, giving the Pfizer vaccine to 12 to 15-year-olds -- Jake.
TAPPER: Those pesky Brits, eh?
Nick Watt, thank you so much.
WATT: Yep.
TAPPER: Appreciate your time.
Joining us to discuss is Dr. Megan Ranney, an associate professor of emergency medicine at Brown University.
[16:05:04]
Dr. Ranney, thanks for joining us.
The numbers certainly look encouraging, the lowest average of daily cases, hospitalizations and deaths in months. Do you think we have turned a corner in the U.S., or is it still too early to say?
DR. MEGAN RANNEY, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR OF EMERGENCY MEDICINE, BROWN UNIVERSITY: So, we have absolutely turned one corner, Jake. We have the vast majority of older adults are fully vaccinated. We have seen a dramatic drop in hospitalizations and deaths among that age group. I do not think that we will ever see the kinds of hospitalizations and deaths again that we saw this past winter.
So, we have turned one corner, but we have not yet eradicated this virus. We are still seeing younger people under age 65 who are getting infected, hospitalized and dying and because we have not yet gotten those vaccines out to the majority of Americans much less to the globe, we're still seeing new variants emerge and spread among our population.
And that, to me, is the wild card, as Dr. Walensky said that we can't yet fully predict, is how much will those variants spread and change our deaths in the year to come.
TAPPER: So, as you know, the U.S. still recorded 776 COVID deaths yesterday and that number is only worth celebrating in the context of the 4,000 a day we hit in January, but it's still way too many. Is that the new normal, hundreds of deaths every day? Should we expect to lose hundreds of people to COVID a day for the foreseeable future?
RANNEY: If we keep getting vaccines out at the rate we have been, no. By summer, we will be looking at maybe 100 or 200 deaths a day. There was a recent prediction out from the CDC saying by September, we could be at a dozen or two dozen deaths a day, but that is predicated on the fact that people keep showing up to get shots in arms.
TAPPER: So, so many people who are in the vulnerable categories, especially Americans 65 and older, have been vaccinated. So who are the people who are dying from coronavirus these days?
RANNEY: The vast majority of deaths right now are in the 18 to 54- year-old age group and actually the 18 to 34-year-old age group is more than half of deaths right now in this country. Now, of course, that's because that group only recently became eligible for vaccines. It's also because we're seeing greater hesitancy around getting vaccines around that age group.
I mean, things like Joe Rogan's podcast last week telling people who are 21 and healthy to avoid the vaccine is about the silliest thing I've heard in a long while. That's why that age group is getting sick, getting hospitalized and is representing the majority of deaths in our country right now.
TAPPER: Is there anything else we know about these young people who are getting it? Are they smokers? Are they morbidly obese? Do they have pre-existing conditions?
You might not have that data, I don't know. I'm just wondering, is there anything we know?
RANNEY: So we don't know a lot. If you're pregnant and you catch COVID, you are more likely to be hospitalized and to die if you're a non-pregnant woman. We know, of course, that if you're obese, if you're a smoker, that also increases your chance.
But I can tell you, as an E.R. doc, that I admit a lot of people to the hospital who have no pre-existing conditions, who are healthy 34- year-olds, 40-year-olds, 45-year-olds, got COVID and a week or two later, got bad pneumonia and had to get hospitalized.
We're still waiting on the details about those recent deaths, but I suspect we'll see the same thing, that there's just bad luck for some people, or there's some genetic trait that we haven't identified yet.
TAPPER: Today, the president of Moderna says he expects that those of us who have been vaccinated, which I am a proud member of that group, will need to get an annual COVID booster shot. Why exactly is that? Is there a chance we could need boosters more frequently than annually?
RANNEY: So could we need it more frequently? Still TBD. The science on this virus keeps changing. But the reason for the need of the booster is simply variants.
As the globe continues to see spread of this virus, I know you're talking about India later in this show. That is a ripe space for variants to emerge. But even here in the U.S., there are states where only 20 percent of people are vaccinated. Every time the virus spreads, a new variant has the potential to emerge and those variants can evade the vaccine-induced immunity.
Now, let me be very clear that the vaccines are better than natural immunity at protecting us against the variants that are currently out there, but as the variants emerge, it is likely that we are going to need booster shots to help boost our immunity against the new strains that have developed thanks to continued spread of COVID across the globe.
TAPPER: And that's not just from Moderna. Moderna, Pfizer, J&J, any other, right?
RANNEY: Yeah. That's a really important point. It's not just Moderna. It's not because Moderna somehow is inferior.
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It's because of the virus continuing to change as it spreads.
TAPPER: So, we know Republicans have been one of the main groups hesitant to get the vaccine. But a new poll by the Kaiser Family Foundation shows a number of Republicans who say they have gotten the COVID vaccine or intend to get one has increased 9 percent over the past month from 46 percent in March up to 55 percent now.
What do you credit for that increase?
RANNEY: So, I think this goes back to that debate between vaccine hesitancy and vaccine confidence. We find there are a lot of people who aren't anti-vaccine. They're not necessarily hesitant. They just didn't yet have confidence in the safety or efficacy of the vaccine.
As people see those around them get vaccinated, as people see that getting vaccinated gives you the ability to get back to normal, to take off your mask, to go on a cruise ship, to go to the movie theater, to go to a restaurant without worry. And as people see that getting vaccinated protects their community from getting sick, we're going to see more and more people be willing to show up and get vaccinated.
So, I think it's really just continued education, continued messaging. There was actually a recent study showing if you tell Republicans that they can take their masks off when they get vaccinated, you see almost a 20 percent jump in the percentage of Republicans who are willing to get a vaccine in arm. So those continued carrots are critical.
TAPPER: All right. Dr. Megan Ranney, thank you so much. Appreciate it.
How Republicans who want to boot Liz Cheney from her leadership position are proving this is not about policy, it's just all about blind loyalty to Trump and his lies. That's next.
Also, doctors in India, some of them hiding from families because of fears that they might be beaten as the health care system in India, many parts of it anyway, crumble.
Stay with us.
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TAPPER: In our politics lead, New York Republican Congresswoman Elise Stefanik is not letting those who object to her lies about the objection get in her way to push and replace Congresswoman Liz Cheney as House Republican conference chair. Though there are some conservative groups who note that Stefanik is way more liberal than Cheney and voted with Trump far less frequently and less reliably, Stefanik decided to play to her strengths which in the House GOP race is to keep pushing Donald Trump's big lie about the election. That is her only advantage over Cheney.
Here she is on Steve Bannon's radio show just moments after she promised to unite the Republican Party, promoting the deranged election audit going on in Arizona right now where a clean election in a state led by a Republican governor is being attacked by election liars.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ELISE STEFANIK (R-NY): I fully support the audit in Arizona. We want transparency and answers for the American people. What are the Democrats so afraid of?
The voters in Arizona and the State Senate in Arizona pursued this audit. I fully support it. Transparency is a good thing. We need to fix these election security issues going into the future.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: There are no election security issues in Arizona. Do you know how crazy this audit is in Arizona?
This is -- you have to understand this. They're actually examining the ballots with UV light to see if there are any traces of bamboo in the paper because one of the conspiracy theories holds that fake ballots were shipped in from Asia.
Remember, Arizona is largely run by Republicans, and because Liz Cheney is one of the only Republicans in leadership willing to see this insanity for what it is, she is being purged from her position. Man.
CNN's Ryan Nobles is live from Capitol Hill.
Ryan, what are these conservative groups saying about Stefanik's actual policy positions?
RYAN NOBLES, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, they're concerned about it, frankly, Jake, and there are a number of conservative groups that have ongoing ratings of House members and how they vote as it relates to conservative issues and in almost every metric, Liz Cheney is more conservative than Elise Stefanik. One of those is a Group for Growth, which is, of course, an anti-tax organization. They're very worried about any kind of tax increases.
And this is what they said after the news came out that Stefanik was likely to replace Liz Cheney. They wrote: She is a liberal, talking about Stefanik, with a 35 percent Club for Growth lifetime rating, fourth worst in the House GOP. House Republicans should find a conservative to lead messaging and win back the House majority.
And, of course, the Club for Growth is an outside organization, but I'm told there are concerns internally as well. The House Freedom Caucus, which is a conservative wing of the Republican Party and House of Representatives held a conference call last night where the members were expressing reservations about how quickly House leadership along with Trump rushed to install Stefanik as the replacement to Liz Cheney.
Now, they concede there's probably nothing they can do about it, that Stefanik is likely to become the next chair, but they want to talk to her on a wide range of issues, from LGBTQ rights to immigration and find out exactly where she stands because they're worried they could in the same position they are with Cheney, a conference chair putting out a message of the Republican Party that doesn't align with the members of the Republican Party.
TAPPER: OK. Ryan Thank so much. Let's talk to CNN's Jamie Gangel who joins me in studio.
And, Jamie, you have reporting about this tension that Cheney is more conservative than Stefanik, voted with Trump more often than Stefanik. But that it really doesn't matter because there's one big issue at play here.
JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: There's one big issue and one person, Donald Trump. I spoke to several conservatives today who represent large groups.
[16:20:04]
And they said Liz Cheney is a true conservative. As Ryan said, she has better ratings across the board, but --
TAPPER: Yeah, there's always a but.
GANGEL: But, quote, Elise satisfies the litmus test, and that litmus test is she is pro-Trump.
TAPPER: Not just pro-Trump, but pro-Trump's lies about the election.
GANGEL: And what's interesting is she was a moderate, but somewhere along the line, one ally of hers said to me, she figured out that the only way to survive was to pivot to Donald Trump. She did it with a vengeance.
I said, does she really believe in Trump? Or is it political expediency. This person said, I have no idea, but she's holding onto him tight.
TAPPER: Yeah, a lot of people who used to work with her at the Bush White House said they don't recognize her.
GANGEL: Correct, right.
TAPPER: They don't know if it's an act or she actually got a lobotomy.
Congressman Jim Jordan basically admitted today that this is all about Trump. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. JIM JORDAN (R-OH): You can't have a Republican conference chair reciting Democrat talking points.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: Let's just look at this a little bit. Democrat talking points. So, facts about the election as adjudicated by Republican appointed judges, Republican governors, Republican state election officials -- facts. That's a Democrat talking point now?
GANGEL: You're asking me to figure out Jim Jordan. This is way beyond --
TAPPER: You don't want to wrestle.
GANGEL: Right, no, no, no. But I will say this -- it is remarkable to me that January 6th didn't happen. They are completely down the rabbit hole. They are moving forward. It is clear that Donald Trump owns this party.
One conservative said something to me that was interesting about it. He said, all that counts these days in our coalition is Donald Trump, and I think we're a coalition today, not a party, because there are plenty of Trump folks and MAGA folks who are not true Republicans. But they're willing to go along for the ride.
TAPPER: It's quite a sight. It's quite a sight.
Jamie Gangel, thanks so much. Appreciate it.
The ex-Olympian, reality TV star, the guy who campaigned for the grisly bear, and a former adult film star -- must be recall season in California.
Stay with us.
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TAPPER: In our politics lead, with a celebrity and a porn actress and a live bear hitting the campaign trail, the California recall race for governor is turning into a full blown circus. And former Olympic athlete and reality TV star Caitlyn Jenner is at the center of the ring.
Jenner sat down with Sean Hannity for her first interview since announcing her gubernatorial bid. And while she spoke little on actual policy initiatives, at least in detail, she made sure to bash Biden and praise Trump -- as CNN's Kyung Lah reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST: Caitlyn Jenner now joins us.
KYUNG LAH, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Caitlyn Jenner on Fox News on her first interview as Republican candidate for California's governor embraced former President Donald Trump.
CAITLYN JENNER (R), CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR CANDIDATE: What I liked about Donald Trump is he was a disruptor. I think he did some things that I agreed with. Some things I didn't agree with.
LAH: That is a challenging dance in a state Trump lost by nearly 30 points in 2020. Jenner, her campaign advised by Trump aides, is trying to appeal beyond the GOP base.
JENNER: I am all for the wall. I would secure the wall.
We have not modernized our immigration system in the United States to make it possible to people to immigrate into this country.
HANNITY: Let me ask --
LAH: From an airplane hangar with her private airplane nearby, Jenner attacked California's Democratic Governor Newsom for being out of touch.
JENNER: What I see in Governor Newsom is a politician. There's one set of rules for Sacramento and there's another set of rules for everybody else.
LAH: Jenner is attacking Newsom for dining as the French Laundry, an exclusive restaurant in California's wine country as the state struggled with COVID restrictions. Newsom has since apologized for the dinner.
That mistake helped fuel this sixth recall attempt, qualifying it for the ballot.
GOV. GAVIN NEWSOM (D), CALIFORNIA: All right. Keep up the good work.
LAH: But Governor Newsom believes Trump will prove toxic against Republican challengers in his liberal state.
NEWSOM: An RNC-backed Republican recall of white supremacists, anti- Semites and people that are opposed to immigration and immigrants is an accurate assessment of who's behind this recall.
LAH: This is personal. This is about your job, Governor.
NEWSOM: Yes, about me, but it's about all of us.
LAH: Voters will find a growing list of colorful challengers. Self- funded millionaire John Cox, California bear in to you, is running this ad, asking --
JOHN COX, CALIFORNIA GOVERNOR CANDIDATE: You want beauty?
VOICE: Pretty boy, pretty boy.
COX: Or ball busting beast?
LAH: California's last governor recall in 2003 drew more than 100 candidates, including actor Gary Coleman, former porn star Mary Carrie, "Hustler" magazine founder, Larry Flint, and the Terminator, Arnold Schwarzenegger who won.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LAH (on camera): Larry Flint and Gary Coleman have since passed away since they ran in 2003. Mary Carey, the porn star, is still here in California. She's already said that she will run in this recall.
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It is a two-part question. Number one, yes or no on the recall. Number two, vote on the replacement -- Jake.
TAPPER: All right. Kyung, stick around.
I want to also bring in Maeve Reston.
Let's talk about this. So, Maeve, lots of folks kind of laughed it off when then reality TV star Donald Trump came down the escalator in 2015 and announced his run for president. And yeah, we all know how that turned out.
Could Caitlyn Jenner actually have a shot at becoming the next governor?
MAEVE RESTON, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, she's got some very steep odds here in California running as Republican. Obviously, Democrats outnumber Republicans here by more than 2-1. So, that's why you're seeing her sort of try to have this broader appeal, saying she doesn't care if you're a Democrat, or an independent or a Republican, but also playing up her past support for Donald Trump before she rescinded that in 2018. So it's going to be very tough.
The other thing to remember here, Jake, she's really a blank slate. We don't know what she thinks about a lot of different policies so far, whereas, you know, Arnold Schwarzenegger, when he ran for governor in 2003, he kind of had been poking around in politics, had been involved in ballot initiatives.
And so, Jenner has a lot of work to do here, sort of explaining what her elevator pitch is and why she wants to run the state, whereas Arnold could say, I'm the superhero who is coming in to save the day.
TAPPER: Yeah.
And, Kyung, in the interview with Sean Hannity, Jenner gave very little in terms of policy, specifics. I think it's fair to say she didn't demonstrate a tremendous grasp of policy details. I covered the recall in 2003. I have to say Schwarzenegger, even early on, seemed better versed on policy than Jenner does.
LAH: Yeah. And it's going to be very difficult for a reality TV star from her home in Malibu. She spoke from a hangar with her private jet nearby, to connect with a lot of people in California and their real frustrations.
If frustration and anger about some of these COVID restrictions is what drove people to want to sign up for this recall, then how does Caitlyn Jenner from her Malibu home convince those same people to vote for her? Just a fundamental question.
The other thing that's important to note is that the California of 2003 is not the California of today. The Republicans have lost registration by double digits. Democrats, as you heard Maeve say 2-1 outnumber Republicans.
But also, there's been a tremendous rise of independents. Independents in this state, if you look at no party, and other outnumber Republicans. That's why you are hearing Governor Newsom's team hammer away at the policies that Jenner and these other Republicans have. That's a powerful tool here in California because Donald Trump is deeply unpopular here.
TAPPER: And, Maeve, Jenner told Hannity she wishes Trump had done more on LGBTQ issues but she said he did do some good things. She didn't give some specifics. This could have been an opportunity for Jenner to separate herself on this issue that is very important to many Californians, and also just as a matter of policy, Trump was fairly hostile to issues relating to the LGBT community, especially the trans community.
RESTON: Absolutely. And she chose not to go into detail about that last night. That will be an interesting thing to watch, because I think, you know, one of the main points here is that she is not trying to portray herself as the trans candidate. She is running as governor, wanting to talk about a lot of these other policy issues.
So she didn't really delve into detail and didn't go into much detail after those comments she made to TMZ over the weekend, saying she does not support trans girls playing in sports teams. And so, there's a lot of questions there that we're still trying to get answers to, Jake.
TAPPER: Yeah. She's running as the Trump candidate, not the trans candidate as you note.
RESTON: Yeah.
TAPPER: Kyung Lah, Maeve Reston, thanks to both of you. Appreciate it. The former commander of U.S. troops in Afghanistan, why he says the
U.S. may regret President Biden's decision to withdraw troops by September 11th. General David Petraeus will join me next.
Stay with us.
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TAPPER: In our world lead today, a warning to Russia from America's top diplomat.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: If Russia acts recklessly or aggressively, as it did with the SolarWinds cyber intrusion, as it did with interference in our elections, as it did with what it's done to Mr. Navalny, then we will respond.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TAPPER: That was U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken to the BBC. He followed up that pledge while in Ukraine, as that country looks to defend itself from the regional bully, Russia.
Let's bring in retired General David Petraeus, who served as CIA director and as commander of U.S. and NATO forces in Afghanistan.
General, thanks for joining us.
Today, Secretary Blinken issued that warning to Russia in Russia's own backyard, Ukraine. What kind of response would be appropriate from the U.S. if Russia were to stage another one of these cyberattacks or other attack against Ukraine?
[16:40:00]
GEN. DAVID PETRAEUS (RET.), FORMER COMMANDER, U.S. CENTRAL COMMAND: Well, I think it would largely be an additional set of sanctions. There could be legal charges as well. There could be additional provision of secretary assistance to Ukraine. And with this administration in particular, it would certainly be joined by allies and partners.
That has been a hallmark of the early foreign policy in many respects. I applaud that. I think it's very wise to have the power of many. And I think that's what you would see take place.
So let's keep in mind what Vladimir Putin really fears most here is a successful Ukraine. So a lot of this intimidation or whatever is going on with the massing forces, some of which have been withdrawn, but many are in place, certainly, undoubtedly to scare off investors at the very least, and certainly make life more difficult for the government in Ukraine which is trying to pursue reforms, trying to achieve success democratically, and Russia very much fears that happening.
TAPPER: Yeah.
PETRAEUS: Putin doesn't want an example of what that right looks like right on his border.
TAPPER: And right now, right off Ukraine's coast, Russia claims that they're just doing naval exercises in the Sea of Azov, but CNN's Matthew Chance was riding along with the Ukrainian coastal patrol in that area, and the Ukrainian navy says very clearly, Russia's been harassing their boats in recent weeks. Do you think the U.S. should get involved in the tension between these two countries?
PETRAEUS: Well, I think that the overarching big idea is to be firm, not provocative, and I think that's really what Secretary of State Blinken was trying to do, to issue a firm, not provocative warning to ensure that Russia knows that we are focused very much on what it is that they are doing.
And again, so far Russia has not pushed the envelope further than that. They have a long history of activity in the Sea of Azov and the Kerch Strait which gives access to it. You may recall they took a Ukrainian boat hostage with its crew some years ago.
And you'll see some NATO ships in the sea there as well. Again, the key here is to ensure that Russia's keenly aware that there would be certain penalties if there is further action and if Russia indeed pushes the envelope either in Crimea or in the Donbass.
TAPPER: Let's talk about Afghanistan. You were commander of U.S. troops in Afghanistan during the Obama administration. President Biden now wants also U.S. service members gone from that country by September 11th. And U.S. troops have started that drawdown process this week.
You have said that you think the U.S. will come to regret this decision. How so?
PETRAEUS: Well, I fear that we will. We should be very clear that we are not ending the endless war. We are ending U.S. involvement in the endless war, and in so doing, by the way, by removing our final 3,500 troops, the coalition of 7,000 or so is also going to withdraw, and you may then well see contractors who are critical, thousands of them who are critical to maintaining the helicopters we have sold to Afghanistan or given to them with our security assistance, Blackhawk helicopters, Hughes 500Ds, various weapon systems and so forth.
Again, they don't have to logistical system, the maintenance systems and spare parts, so contractors are filling the gap in many respects. If the security continues to deteriorate, you may see them leave. We've already seen an ordered drawdown of the embassy. It's well known that other government agencies that are there are going top to have to shift their footprint, draw it in, and so forth.
And the result could be not only does the Taliban get what it wants without giving anything up, they want us to be gone, having gotten what it wanted under the previous administration, which was to get its fighters out of detention, and they are on the offensive now in the southern part of the country, in Helmand province, around the capital there. Security has eroded previously in other areas.
And if we have no bases on the ground there at the end of our withdrawal, it is a very long flight from the Gulf States even for our fast movers, much less our very slow-moving drones, which have been crucial on top of our Afghan security force partners to bring in the precision airstrikes and so forth that have enabled them to hold the line for the most part.
TAPPER: So, I want to have you back to talk more about this because, obviously, the counterargument is how long -- how long should U.S. troops be there? But we're running out of time.
And I do want to bring this up because it's an important issue. You recently urged Secretary Blinken to accelerate U.S. visas for some 10,000 or so Afghan and Iraqi interpreters and their families.
[16:45:06]
Your letter to Blinken reads, quote, Taliban's official spokesman has repeatedly said that working for the United States is punishment for death. It could lead to retribution on a much larger scale coming up.
Did you get a response to your letter? Is the Biden administration taking this group of people who helped our service members into account?
PETRAEUS: Well, there have been a lot of public statements about the importance of this from the administration, including from the secretary from the National Security Council. There have been meetings that the group, No One Left Behind, as you know, Ambassador Crocker and I both support, have engaged with the National Security Council staff on this issue.
But the special immigrant visa process has been stalled for some time, and it's going to take a good bit of effort to get it going. I fear now as the numbers are as high as 17,000, Jake, I fear we'll have withdrawn and will have drawn down our embassy and the ability to process them will erode even farther.
Let's keep in mind we have been able to put a satellite on Mars faster than you can get through the SIV process.
TAPPER: Yeah.
PETRAEUS: These are individuals for whom I feel we have a moral obligation. They served with our soldiers on the ground, shared risk and hardship with them.
TAPPER: Yeah, absolutely. Retired General David Petraeus, good to see you. Come back more, talk more about this important issue, both the special immigrant visas and also Afghanistan. Thanks for being with us.
PETRAEUS: Thanks, Jake.
TAPPER: Doctors being attacked as oxygen runs out and COVID patients die in India. There's no end in sight right now to the desperation and agony. CNN is live in New Delhi. That's next.
Stay with us.
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[16:51:01]
TAPPER: In our world lead, India's COVID crisis breaking new awful records. Its daily case count surging to its highest level so far, reported deaths nearing 4,000 a day for the first time. And now, some of those victims' families are turning their grief into anger and rage, aimed at doctors.
CNN's Sam Kiley reports from a hospital outside New Delhi.
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SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Frantic, knocking on the door to an intensive care unit for COVID patients. There's confusion among relatives and police.
When they push inside, what they find is horrific. The ICU has been abandoned, except for its patients. And there were six dead before the doctors left.
A voice says everyone ran away. There are no medicals here, there's no one here, no doctor, no guard.
How can doctors run away, leaving patients? A crime has been committed here. How can you leave them, he yells at a police officer.
There's been no crime. There has been a tragedy.
Medical staff were ordered out of the ICU and to hide when the oxygen ran out.
It's little hospitals like this that really form the backbone of the public health structures right across India. They're very much on the forefront of the COVID pandemic, dealing with patients but also dealing with the emotional fallout.
It's that fallout that caused them to briefly flee. Here's why.
(SCREAMING)
KILEY: Four days earlier, bereaved relatives of another COVID patient attacked staff, forcing calls to the police from doctors. When the oxygen ran out in the ICU a couple of days later, another attack on the doctors began.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fifteen people attacked us, we were sitting, and then I asked, I requested my doctors and staff, you please run away and hide on the third floor until I manage the situation, because I don't want them to get hit at any cost.
KILEY: COVID cases have soared past 20 million in India, with the official death toll climbing toward 4,000 a day. Many people have died through lack of oxygen. There's growing anger at state and national governments but it's often medics who bear the brunt.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please help us, understand us, love us, respect us, because everyone can be on the ICU any hour of the day. You have to need doctors to supply the oxygen to the patient. If you will hit them, then who will care for your patients?
KILEY: Her staff are back at work. The ICU again filled with patients. There is ample oxygen here, at least for now.
But as scientists are warning for a third wave before the second even peaked, anger and fear will continue to grow.
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KILEY (on camera): Now, Jake, Narendra Modi, the Indian prime minster, has reaffirmed his commitment to a $1.8 billion renovation and new construction in the Indian parliament building, construction of new parliament buildings and a new prime ministerial residence, and that is something that is really sticking in the craw and starting to anger people on the streets right across -- Jake.
TAPPER: All right. Sam Kiley, thanks so much. Appreciate the report from New Delhi.
We know a lot of her Republican peers are choosing Trump over the truth, but what do to voters in Wyoming have to say about their Congresswoman Liz Cheney? We're going there live, next.
And the United States may be turning a corner, but one hidden toll of the pandemic may have a long-lasting impact on America's health-care system. Stay with us.
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[16:59:35]
TAPPER: Welcome to THE LEAD. I'm Jake Tapper.
This hour, the U.S. turning a corner when it comes to the U.S. coronavirus pandemic and there is encouraging news about the vaccines and the variants. But as kids under 16 are about to get the green light to get the vaccine, will their parents let them?
Plus, breaking this hour, the controversial goodwill gesture the Biden administration is considering in order to get Iran back to the table for nuclear talks.
And leading this hour, New York Congresswoman Elise Stefanik's campaign to replace Congresswoman Liz Cheney as the House Republican Conference chair.
