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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Putin, Xi Meet Before Olympics As Tensions Escalate With West; U.S.: Russia Planning Fake Video To Justify Invading Ukraine; United States Surpasses 900,000 COVID Deaths; Critics Say Ginni Thomas' Political Activism Is Supreme Court Conflict; Sources: Donald Trump And Rep. Jim Jordan Spoke For 10 Minutes On The Morning Of January 6; RNC Calls January 6 Events "Legitimate Political Discourse"; Opening Remarks Marks Official Start Of 2022 Olympic Games. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired February 04, 2022 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:00]

PRES. XI JINPING, CHINA (through translator): I'm glad to hold the first in person meeting with President Putin in more than two years took.

PRES. VLADIMIR PUTIN, RUSSIA (through translator): As for our bilateral relations, they are developing linearly with the spirit of friendship and strategic partnership and have reached an unprecedented level.

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Meeting just as the Beijing Olympics are getting underway pledging in a joint statement that there are no limits to their friendship, and sending an ominous sign, saying that both nations "oppose further enlargement of NATO," and "intend to counter interference by outside forces in internal affairs of sovereign countries under any pretext."

The White House downplaying the importance of that meeting and shifting the spotlight back to Ukraine as Russia's military buildup along Ukraine's borders only grows.

JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: We have our own relationship where we engage directly at a very high level, as you all know, but our focus right now is continuing to unite with allies and partners to respond decisively if Russia further invades Ukraine.

ATWOOD (voice-over): Yet many diplomats believe the Putin XI relationship will be a central factor in Putin's calculation over whether or not to invade Ukraine. U.S. officials have noted it was unlikely that an invasion would occur as the Olympics began.

WENDY SHERMAN, DEPUTY SECRETARY OF STATE: I think that probably President Xi Jinping would not be ecstatic if Putin chose that moment to invade Ukraine. So that may affect his timing and his thinking.

ATWOOD (voice-over): But still, the U.S. and NATO allies are on edge.

NED PRICE, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: It is only prudent for us to continue to take steps in the vein of defense and deterrence.

ATWOOD (voice-over): Today, Secretary of State Tony Blinken meeting his Polish counterpart, as U.S. troops arrive in Poland to showcase the United States commitment to the NATO guarantee that an attack on one is an attack on all.

ANTONY BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE: We're also here at a time of real concern for European security because of Russia's aggressive posture toward Ukraine.

ATWOOD (voice-over): All of this, as the U.S. says it has intelligence that Russia has plans to amass 1000s more troops in Belarus and could develop an elaborate fake and graphic video that they could use as a pretext to invade Ukraine.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

ATWOOD: Now, Jake, one thing that the two leaders announced today was a new deal for Russia to provide China with more Russian gas. Now, this is notable because Russian gas, Russian energy, has been a central topic of discussion. There have been mounting concerns that Russia could cut off its energy supply to Europe. They are a dominant energy supplier to Europe and that could create a widespread crisis, particularly if it is coupled with a possible Russian invasion into Ukraine. Jake.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: All right, CNN's Kylie Atwood for us. Thank you so much.

CNN Senior International Correspondent Matthew Chance joins us now live from Kiev, which as I understand it, is how the Ukrainians pronounce it or something like that.

Matthew, U.S. officials claimed this week that Russia is plotting an elaborate propaganda video to depict a fake attack against Russia. American officials bristled when journalists had the temerity to ask for proof, God forbid. How is this potential plot, this allegation being viewed in Moscow? And as a longtime Moscow based correspondent, does it strike you is strange that the Americans didn't give any evidence for this allegation?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's unfortunate because, you know, we don't have evidence for an allegation like that. It opens the door for the Russians, not just to deny it, but to ridicule it, as well. And that's what the Russians have done.

Sergey Lavrov, the Russian Foreign Minister, within the past couple of hours, calling that suggestion, that there is a propaganda video, remember, that will be made in the future according to the U.S. And that video will have explosions on it, it will have fake corpses on it, it will have NATO drones on it, will have actors, you know, pretending to be mourners, you know, very high level of detail that was given by U.S. official that tells us about -- this about what would be in this video that had not yet been made. The Russian Foreign Minister said it was delusional, then just say it was fabrication, he said that. He said it was made up. But he also said it was delusional.

And so, again, it gives the Russians not just to deny it, but to neutralize that allegation and other allegations that may be true against them. And so, you know, I think it's really unfortunate that that kind of very detailed allegation was made, what was actually put into the public sphere. I understand why they've done it, they did it because they said they wanted a front foot this and make sure the Russians knew that this was something the United States was aware of, in the hope of preventing it from happening. And of course, if it now doesn't happen, you can see how American officials will pivot on to say, well, we look at the deterrence effects of what we said.

But nevertheless, you know, it is something that I think in a Russian context, the people of Russia, the news channels in Russia will point to and they'll somewhat ridicule, Jake.

[17:05:04]

TAPPER: And Matthew, we saw earlier today how President Xi of China and President Putin met, had a meeting, they're celebrating the Olympics. How are Ukrainian officials responding to that?

CHANCE: Well, I mean, it's a very uncomfortable picture for Ukrainian officials. I spoke to some people tonight in the Ukrainian government about what they made of Putin and Xi standing shoulder to shoulder calling for NATO not to expand any further and specifically China agreeing with Russia that Ukraine should never join the Western military alliance. And they said, look, we haven't got a comment on it public, we haven't even got a policy on it, because they're in a difficult position.

China is a significant investor in Ukraine, there's economic problems in this country and they don't want to come out right and criticize Xi Jinping for holding the same position as their arch nemesis Vladimir Putin. But at the same time, again, this will have been very uncomfortable viewing indeed for the government in Ukraine as they watch that pairing, that that bromance between these two figures unfold.

TAPPER: Matthew Chance reporting live for us in Ukraine. Thanks so much.

Joining us now live to discuss, Bill Taylor, the former U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine.

Ambassador Taylor, thanks so much for joining us. So let's start with that meeting between Russian President Vladimir Putin and Chinese Premier Xi Jinping, the meeting on the sidelines of the Beijing Olympics. They released a joint statement that says in part, "The sides oppose further enlargement of NATO and call on the North Atlantic Alliance to abandon its ideologized cold war approaches to respect the sovereignty, security and interests of other countries," et cetera.

Help us to understand, what is the message they're sending and to whom are they sending it? I assume they're sending it to the Westin and specifically to President Biden.

WILLIAM TAYLOR, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UKRAINE: I'm sure they are, Jake. I mean, they -- here are the two largest autocrats apparently in sync. The degree to which they're in sync is still to be determined. Matthew mentioned that China has a lot of investments in Ukraine. And that goes both ways. The Chinese have hesitated to support any notion of the Russians invading Ukraine because they have investments there.

They're not -- we remember that in 2014, the United Nations Security Council tried to sanction the Russian invasion and takeover illegal annexation of Crimea, the Chinese abstained that time, they didn't support the Russian. So, it's ambiguous what the Chinese will actually do. They can make all these statements about we support the Russians, but when it actually comes to their economic benefits, their economic equities, it may be different.

TAPPER: Although some observers are also saying that how the United States and NATO respond to whether or not Russia invades Ukraine will be viewed very much by President Xi in terms of whether or not they do similar with Taiwan or Hong Kong.

TAYLOR: I am totally in agreement with that. I am sure President Xi is watching very closely how strongly what the -- how -- what the force of the United States push back on Russia, how much the United States is aggressively trying to deter President Putin, it's not passive deterrence, it's active deterrence. Moving troops, moving people -- moving soldiers from United States to Eastern Europe, being very clear about what the sanctions would be on Russia if they were to go across that border.

So, I think President Xi is watching carefully to see if the United States is pulling back, as they kind of hoped after Afghanistan, or actively pushing back against the Russians.

TAPPER: Do you see a significance with so many Western countries are boycotting, diplomatically, not with their athletes, but diplomatically boycotting the Olympics, including President Biden, do you see significance, pardon me, that President Putin is not? I mean, as I said earlier, I wouldn't expect President Putin to be offended by human rights abuses in China even genocide against the wiggers. But is this an opportunity for him to bond with a fellow autocrat?

TAYLOR: It is an opportunity to stand with a fellow autocrat. They have a long border. They've got -- there are a lot of Chinese and not many Russians in Siberia. They need to --Putin needs to be a little bit concerned about his big neighbor there. So, the opportunity to go to Beijing and to stand next to him and put out this long statement, this long statement that highlights the importance of democracy in their two countries.

TAPPER: Yes.

TAYLOR: It's interesting.

TAPPER: It's -- interesting as one word for the two countries talking about democracy. TAYLOR: Yes.

TAPPER: So, U.S. officials only talk to you about what Matthew was discussing a minute, U.S. officials alleging that Russia is preparing to create an elaborate graphic propaganda video that would depict a fake attack against Russia. Russia denies it, calls it ludicrous. U.S. officials have not provided any proof to the public.

[17:10:12]

When journalists have asked for evidence, given that governments lie, you know, we can say yes, the Russian government lies more than the American government, but governments lie. What's your take on this? I wouldn't put anything past Putin, but I don't know this to be true.

TAYLOR: Jake, getting intelligence released to the public, is very difficult. And so, the United States government, the Biden ministration has had to move carefully but they've moved pretty aggressively most other than previous times to declassify some of this intelligence that they've gotten. We remember last week, about the Brits actually released some information that the Americans had some role in determining as well, that said the Russians were trying to work closely with some Ukrainian Rada members, members of the parliament. We also remember --

TAPPER: To stage a coup.

TAYLOR: To stage a coup.

TAPPER: Yes. And they even -- they name names. Yes.

TAYLOR: And they name names. I know some of those people who's name in it. And most of those people are now in Russia. They fled with President Yanukovych to Russia in 2014. So those is not unbelievable. Those are -- it's credible that they would do it.

But they also released, United States also released intelligence about Russian special forces already in Ukraine preparing these same kind of false flag attacks. These will be Russians attacking Russians and blaming it on the Ukraine.

TAPPER: Right.

TAYLOR: So, that's -- and it is exactly what Matthew said. That is, it's an attempt to highlight, shine light on what might happen so they don't do it.

TAPPER: So they don't do it, yes. Again, like I said, I don't doubt it. I just haven't seen any evidence for it.

Ambassador Bill Taylor, good to see you as always. Thank you so much for being here.

As President Biden ways, his supreme court pick new questions about the longest serving justice. And if he should, perhaps, recuse himself from some cases. Plus, a CNN exclusive. What we're learning about former President Donald Trump's phone call with a controversial Republican Congressman on the day of the January 6 interactions. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:16:42]

TAPPER: Breaking news in our health lead, the United States has tragically now surpassed 900,000 deaths from COVID-19, that moments ago according to data from Johns Hopkins University. But we should note, deaths are no longer spiking in the U.S., they're holding steady at a rate of 2,400 a day. A vast majority of those dying are unvaccinated.

CNN's Chief Medical Correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta joins us now to discuss.

Sanjay, I remember when we passed 100,000 and what a calamitous moment that are. Our next milestone, of course, will be a million.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. I mean, this is, you know, these numbers, I think in the beginning of the pandemic, we sort of talked about the possibility that the numbers could be here, prepare for the worst hope for the best. And you know, I mean, these are tragic numbers. Even if you go back and look at 1918, now granted the population of the world was about a third of what it is today, but you know, that was a time when we did not have vaccines, we did not have intensive care units, the way that we do the technology of today's medical system and we've surpassed those death rates from that time period.

So, I -- you know, it's tough to say over and over again, I know people don't like to hear it, especially people who've lost loved ones, but so many, so many of these deaths, Jake, preventable, certainly, one since the vaccine came out.

TAPPER: Yes. Sanjay, a World Health Organization official is forecasting a, quote, "plausible endgame" to the pandemic in Europe because of deaths plateauing there. Is the U.S. in the same boat?

GUPTA: Yes, I think it's a very similar boat. I mean, we can look, first of all just at immunity, you know, in the United States versus Europe. And we've sort of tracked this all along, since vaccines came out. And you'll see that when it comes to vaccination.

It's pretty similar, you know, pretty similar rates over there. And then if you add in natural immunity, you know, you do have high levels of immunity here. You also have a decreased severity of the virus and Omicron. I think that plays into this as well. And, you know, look, the warmer weather is around the corner, you know, still a ways away, but that's going to make an impact as well.

I think a couple of caveats, one is that, you know, these are large populations that we're talking about. So you may see spikes in certain areas, even as the overall numbers come down. You mentioned this earlier, Jake, but when it comes to cases, they've gone down about 38 percent, you know, hospitalizations also down about 16 percent. That's up about 7 percent, you know, sort of flat, that's, of course, a lagging indicator.

And then I think it just -- it's this idea, Jake, of endgame and what that means and what is endemic mean. I mean, this virus is here to stay. People have been saying this since the spring of 2020, it's that contagious.

The remnants of the, you know, descendants of the flu virus from 1918 still circulate today. So this virus is going to be around. It's going to be a question of how much we're willing to tolerate in terms of its impact on us. That's going to dictate as well what we refer to as the endgame.

TAPPER: Colorado lifted its mask mandate today. The governor of Connecticut is signaling that he might drop the mask mandate for schools soon. We are getting data about just how effective masks are. Given that data, are the state's making the right move right now?

GUPTA: It's a tough call, Jake, because at the same time, we're talking about these numbers coming down, they're still really high. I mean, you know, kids -- infections on kids had a record breaking month overall last month. So the numbers are coming down and all those other factors we talked about make a difference.

[17:20:09]

We did get some new data in terms of the odds of contracting COVID based on the types of masks that people wear. And you know, you can see cloth masks to N95 masks, some of those may not be available for children, but you know, it makes a difference.

I think the big thing here, Jake, really, is that unfortunately when it comes to five to 11 year olds, only about 22 percent are vaccinated and about 56 percent of children 12 and older. It would be a lot better if you had higher vaccination rates in terms of curbing some of these other measures.

TAPPER: Yes. Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you so much. Good to see you as always.

The job of a Supreme Court justice, it's a lifetime appointment. But what about their lifetime partners? Could any influence be a concern? We'll take a look. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:25:20]

TAPPER: In our politics lead today, the White House is accelerating its extensive Supreme Court vetting process as lawmakers and outside groups begin jockeying to promote their favorite candidates and attack the candidates they do not like. The Biden ministration has also finalized its team that will guide President Biden's eventual nominee through her upcoming confirmation battle. There's also growing interest in another member of the court. As CNN's Pamela Brown reports, critics say the political activities of Ginni Thomas, the wife of Justice Clarence Thomas, raise questions about potential conflicts of interest for the courts longest tenured justice.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

PAMELA BROWN, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Ginni Thomas has been an outspoken passionate conservative activist for decades.

GINNI THOMAS, AMERICAN ATTORNEY: The second Reagan revolution is growing.

BROWN (voice-over): Most recently signing on to this open letter from conservatives to House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy denouncing the January 6 committee. One month after that letter, Justice Thomas was the lone public dissent in a case involving the January 6 committee. No other justices indicated they would have granted former President Trump's request to block the document handover from the National Archives to the committee. Thomas provided no explanation for his dissent.

STEVE VLADECK, PROFESSOR OF LAW, UNIVERSITY OF TEXAS SCHOOL OF LAW: There are surely substantive reasons consistent with his prior jurisprudence why Justice Thomas dissented from the court's decision to not help President Trump in that case. But for folks who are already skeptical of the court, for folks who already view the court as a deeply partisan and political institution, the fact that Justice Thomas is the sole public dissenter there, given what we know about Ginni Thomas's involvement, I think sets off some alarm bells.

BROWN (voice-over): Ginni Thomas's ties to former President Donald Trump and his aides go back years, including submitting a list of supposedly disloyal White House aides directly to Trump.

Just before the January 6 riot, Ginni Thomas sympathize with the Stop the Steal rally goers, writing, quote, "God bless each of you standing up or praying." She later may clear these were posted before the violence at the U.S. Capitol.

Given the appearance of a conflict, critics say Justice Thomas should have recused himself in the case involving the January 6 committee because of his wife's activism. Or defender say, she has every right to lead her own life and see no reason why that should have a bearing on her husband if she's on a party in a case or financially invested. There is no indication she has a financial interest in cases before the High Court.

JENNIFER STEFANO, INDEPENDENT WOMEN'S FORUM FELLOW: Clarence Thomas does not hold the views he holds because of any one person. Justices are going to have spouses that have the right to have opinions and be involved and engaged. And I trust Justice Thomas and other members on the Supreme Court bench to do what is right. BROWN (voice-over): But the debate has continued because of Ginni Thomas's ties to another issue before the court this term. She sits on the advisory board of a conservative group, National Association Scholars. That organization submitted to legal briefs to the Supreme Court in favor of plaintiffs challenging affirmative action and admissions at two universities. Peter Wood is president of the organization and says Ginni Thomas played no role in the legal briefs.

PETER WOOD, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF SCHOLARS: None whatsoever. As far as I know, she doesn't even know that we filed such briefs. I don't talk about those sorts of issues with her.

BROWN (voice-over): But Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington is calling for Justice Thomas's recusal.

NOAH BOOKBINDER, PRESIDENT OF CREW: In terms of the best practice where his wife is closely affiliated with an organization that has taken a clear position, it is -- it seems clear to us that his impartiality could be questioned.

BROWN (voice-over): The federal law states, quote, "Any justice, judge or magistrate judge of the United States shall disqualify himself in any proceeding in which his impartiality might reasonably be questioned," unquote. But it's up to the individual justice to decide if there is a conflict.

For his part, Justice Thomas has recused himself 32 times in the last 28 years according to Gabe Roth's group Fix the Court, but never because of his wife's activism.

In 2018, Ginni Thomas interviewed her husband for The Daily Caller, where he talked about his dedication to independence of thought.

JUSTICE CLARENCE THOMAS: As a judge, you don't get to be on one team or the other. You have to think independently in order to live up to the oath that you take.

[17:30:00]

BROWN (voice-over): Some experts think justices ought to explain their decisions to recuse or to not recuse more often in order for more transparency.

Ginni Thomas's activism stands in contrast to the spouses of other justices. Chief Justice John Roberts' wife Jane, retired from practicing law and resigned from a leadership role with an anti- abortion group. When late Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg became a circuit court judge, her husband left his law firm.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: And advocates of reform continue their calls for more transparent and stricter recusal rules -- recusal rather. Ginni Thomas declined CNN's request for an interview and declined to comment. Jake?

TAPPER: All right, Pamela Brown, thank you so much. Appreciate it. Coming up next, the outrageous language by the Republican National Committee in its censure of two Republicans investigating the deadly January 6 interaction. And the cleanup attempt they made just a few hours afterwards. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TAPPER: In our politics lead today, new details about a phone call that then President Trump made to Republican Congressman Jim Jordan on January 6, 2021.

[17:35:08]

The House Select Committee now has the call records that revealed the pair spoke for about 10 minutes before the deadly insurrection started. CNN's Ryan Nobles joins us live now. Ryan, give us the timeline when exactly did this call take place and what does it tell us?

RYAN NOBLES, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, according to White House call records that have been obtained by the January 6 committee and have been reviewed by two different sources that spoke to CNN, there was a phone call that was placed by the White House, by President Trump to Jim Jordan on the morning of January 6, and that that call lasted for 10 minutes.

Now, this is significant information. And it's the first time that it's been revealed. And it comes after Jim Jordan has been incredibly evasive, as to the communication, the amount of communication that he's had with the former president on January 6. In fact, almost every time he's been asked a question about his communication with Donald Trump, he's given a different answer, including today, when he told CNN that he only remembers talking to the former President as he left the House for on January 6. That's something he's never said before.

He also told the House Rules Committee at one point that he thought the only time he spoke to the former president was after the attack. Now that directly contradicts what we're learning and also what he said today. And there are members of the rules committee making note of that. The House Rules Committee Chairman Jim McGovern, tweeting today after seeing our story and pointing out that what they are learning directly contradicts what Jordan said in a House rules committee hearing.

This, of course, getting a lot of attention, because the January 6 committee is very interested in what Jim Jordan was talking to -- are talking about when he talked to the former president. Of course, Jordan, one of the leading Republicans that was attempting to get in the way of the certification of the election results on that day, he voted to object to those election results.

And the committee right now trying to figure out a way to get information from these Republican members of Congress that they believe played at least some sort of a role in the violence that took place here on January 6. Right now, Jake, the wrestling as to whether or not they should issue subpoenas, it's a complicated process, and the committee does not have a path forward. Jake?

TAPPER: All right, Ryan Nobles, thank you so much.

Let's discuss, a lot to discuss today. But actually, Kristen, let me start with former Vice President Mike Pence, just a couple hours ago, calling out his former boss by name stunningly, really. Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And I heard this week that President Trump said I had the right to overturn the election. The President Trump is wrong. I had no right to overturn the election. The presidency belongs to the American people and the American people alone. And frankly, there is no idea more un-American than the notion than any one person could choose the American president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: I mean, it's stunning not only that, he said Trump was wrong. He said what Trump was trying to do was, quote, un-American.

KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, FOUNDING PARTNER, ECHELON INSIGHTS: It's a pretty strong words from the former vice president to be sure. And I think up until this point, all of the data that I've seen doesn't actually suggest that Republicans had thrown Mike Pence overboard. You'll recall, I spoke with you a couple of weeks ago about some focus groups or a focus group I did for the New York Times, where we talked to a lot of Republican voters about January 6.

And when we talked about Mike Pence's role on that day certifying the election, even folks who are pretty sympathetic to Trump and felt that the election had been fraudulent said, you know, I think Vice President Pence was in a tough spot. They sort of gave him a little a lot of leeway for, hey, he was in a difficult position. I don't know what I would have done if I was in his shoes either.

But this by coming out and uttering the phrase, Donald Trump was wrong, that's a little stronger than what we've heard from him before. And so, if you may have been one of those Republicans on the fence, well he was in a tough spot. He may be clarifying opinions one way or the other for a lot of people.

TAPPER: And you know, Alexia, one of the things that's so interesting about this is it's so odd to see a politician do something that actually is against their own political best interest. And that's exactly what he did. What he said was true.

ALENCIA JOHNSON, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER, BIDEN PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN: Yes.

TAPPER: But that's not going to help him in anything he wants to do.

JOHNSON: No, it's not because as we know, Donald Trump has a very strong grasp on the Republican Party. We see what's happening at the RNC meeting. They're censoring people who are on the committee. You know, it is interesting to hear that Vice President Pence is doing this now. We have to wonder what this means potentially for midterms, what his influence could be versus Trump's influence. And so, I'm grateful to hear it, but it's partly a little too late. But it will be interesting to see what smoke will come Vice President Pence this way because of this.

TAPPER: And Gloria, let's talk about the RNC today --

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes.

TAPPER: -- voting to censure Congresswoman Liz Cheney and Congressman Kinzinger. They're basically being punished because they're working with Democrats to investigate what happened on January 6.

[17:40:01]

But here's part of the document from the center. It says, "Cheney and Kinzinger are participating in a Democrat-led persecution of ordinary citizens who engaged in legitimate political discourse." Now, Congresswoman Liz Cheney posted video of the January 6 rioters, the insurrectionists attacking cops and said this is not legitimate political discourse.

RNC Chair Ronna McDaniel's trying to clean it up. She's saying, no, no, no, we don't mean the violent ones. But the censure keeps it pretty vague who they're talking about. They could have called out the violent ones in the censure if they wanted to.

BORGER: No, they didn't want to. I think the Republican Party is a wholly-owned subsidiary right now, Donald Trump. And it used to be that you just had to say, OK, you know, I think the election might have been rigged. Maybe there was something wrong.

Now you have to be pro-insurrectionist. I mean, it -- with Trump saying that he would pardon these folks, he stepped it up a notch. So it's not only rigged election, it's these people didn't do anything wrong. It was legitimate political discourse, no matter how they try and put the genie back in the bottle. I don't think they can really do that.

And so you see Mike Pence today making it very clear. He's not on that team anymore. This -- they had had a separation. They hadn't talked for a year. This was the divorce totally. And Mike Pence, I believe, if he runs, it won't matter whether Donald Trump runs or not.

TAPPER: Yes.

BORGER: I think this is it.

TAPPER: And Zolan --

ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, WHITE HOUSE REPORTER, NEW YORK TIMES: This censure though today, I mean --

TAPPER: Yes. KANNO-YOUNGS: -- you have to really say it is the culmination --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: -- of a shift, you know, for many members in the Republican Party. It was about a year ago or after January 6, we saw certain members, including Kevin McCarthy as well, from the House as well, come out and criticize the events of that day. What a shift from that.

And I have to say, just as someone who was also there, I do think it's worth noting, as someone who was there reporting at the Capitol, that language as well, just detached from fact, really.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: When you think about, you know, seeing -- it is true, not everyone there was violent. There were thousands of people there. But when you do think of the people that were breaking windows, that were hoisting American flags, as they did slam on doors as well, that, you know, I think of the person as well that saying through a bullhorn, move forward, move forward as a crowd goes against police barricades, as well as members of Congress who were forced to evacuate and members of the media too. You know, all of that is worth kind of restating when we pair that with the language today as well.

TAPPER: Yes. And just also to make the point that the January 6 committee is not investigating people who are peaceful on the mall who, you know, who was --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. Right.

TAPPER: -- exercising their First Amendment rights. That's not what the investigation is.

ANDERSON: Well, there's a real big desire among rank and file Republican voters, I think, to draw a very big distinction between what happened at one end of Pennsylvania Avenue and what happened at the other. We heard that in those focus groups, that there's this real sense among Republican voters that this isn't what our side doesn't do that, our side doesn't hurt cops.

TAPPER: Right.

ANDERSON: Our side doesn't break windows. That's not what we do. And so, this today, I think this sort of secondary statement from Ronna McDaniel is trying to draw a distinction that they did not draw very clearly in that --

TAPPER: Except can I say, and Gloria, get you to weigh in on this. There's a tweet from November 2020, it's still up on the RNC page, right? Still on their Twitter feed. It's a video of -- I put it up if we can -- a video of Sidney Powell, the untethered from reality attorney who made all sorts of lies. And it says, "We will not be intimidated. We're going to clean this mess up now. President Trump won by a landslide. We're going to prove it," blah, blah, blah. I mean, if Ronna McDaniel wants to draw the distinction between the people who abided by the law and people who are tethered to reality and those who are not, she might want to start with her own social media chord here.

BORGER: Right. Yes, and the point is that Donald Trump doesn't want her too. I mean, she's taken her orders from Donald Trump. And the first line of that censure resolution really struck me because it says, whereas, the primary mission of the Republican Party is to elect Republicans who support the United States Constitution and share our values.

TAPPER: Final thought?

JOHNSON: You know, it's interesting Democrats, we sent your people who are voting against ways to save democracy. The GOP is censoring people who won't uphold their plan to destroy democracy. And that's the big difference and we'll see that in the midterms.

TAPPER: All right, thanks to one and all.

How going for Gold takes its toll. A medal winning Olympian on the mental health challenges facing the athlete. Stick around.

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[17:49:10]

TAPPER: In our sports lead, the Winter Olympic Games are officially underway in Beijing, China with the opening ceremony taking place this morning. And while the games happen under a cloud of diplomatic boycotts and human rights abuses and strict coronavirus protocols, it's also a chance to watch the best young athletes in the world putting their skills on display.

And here to discuss, former Team USA figure skater Gracie Gold who brought home a bronze from the 2014 Olympics. Gracie, good to see you. This Olympic environment is so different than the one you competed in. Athletes are living in the strict COVID bubble. Their family, their friends, their supporters, not there. Do you think that takes away for the Olympic experience or is it the competition itself that matters the most?

GRACIE GOLD, U.S. OLYMPIC BRONZE MEDAL FIGURE SKATER (2014): Yes, and 2014 Sochi, the Olympics that I went to, you know, the whole world was different in a way because it was pre-pandemic, it was pre-COVID. And to try to pictures, you know, my Olympic experience without, you know, my mom, without my sister, without the variety of spectators, it's almost like apples and oranges. It's hard to compare an Olympics without, you know, and to have gone without my family support, I think is extremely difficult for all of the athletes out there.

[17:50:24]

And with the COVID protocols and being in -- I've never done an Olympics in a bubble, but I have done events last year and this year in a bubble. And it was tough in a lot of ways. The change in routine, the disruption in your routine, you know, athletes rely on a routine for trust in yourselves. And so that when you go out there to compete, you know, the routine is there. It's just like another day.

So it's, it's a lot. I think it's a lot for these athletes to take on. And I think most of them handling it extremely well.

TAPPER: In addition to being a top-tier athlete, you're also a passionate advocate for athletes' mental health after some of your own struggles with anxiety, depression and an eating disorder. How do you think not being able to participate in some of the events and this strict quarantine bubble with no family members? How do you think that might affect the mental health of these athletes who are already under incredible pressure?

GOLD: It's definitely just kind of adding to that pile of stress. And don't get me wrong, the Olympics are an incredible experience. They are life changing. And my Olympic experience was magical in so many ways. And ultimately, you know, the performance aspects is why everybody is there. And that is maybe the most importance but you can't perform well.

You know, you might have trained physically and then all the right things, but mentally, that takes a huge toll. And I think people that aren't at the Olympics, you know, they saw -- I think we all saw how the worlds there was a deterioration and so many people's mental health during, you know, the first part of the pandemic, it's still going on, in many ways.

So, you know, you have skier Mikaela Shiffrin, anything less than golds in her runs is considered a disappointment. So she is going out to perform, you know, with all of that pressure, and then there's all these COVID restrictions. And, you know, just live it.

Yes, and in this pandemic world and in China with very strict lockdown, it's a lot.

TAPPER: Yes.

GOLD: It's a lot of stress. So much of it is out of the athletes' control, which just again, adds kind of to the pile.

TAPPER: But as a mental health advocate, what advice would you give people? What advice would you give any athletes who start to feel pressure?

GOLD: I know that the USOC has worked pretty hard to put some mental health protocols in place. You know, it's been a newer -- I don't even want to call it a trends, but, you know, putting mental health on the forefront. So I hope that the athletes, you know, are able to take advantage of that.

And I found comfort in -- during my own Olympic stress. In some ways, the skating part was even less stressful because it was the only thing that was familiar to me. Is that everything else, you know, millions of people watching, new environment and just the grand scale that when I got out on the ice, I was like, oh, this, I've done this part a million times.

Like I trained for so many years for this. I've done this before. And so, hopefully the athletes, you know, can just really, really enjoy the time that they have doing whichever sport that they do.

TAPPER: Right.

GOLD: And just take advantage of whatever mental health is there, trying to connect with the friends and family digitally and the other athletes and teammates that are there I think will be really important.

TAPPER: And you've been working on your figure skating comeback, including an impressive showing at the national championships last month. What does the future look like for you? Another trip to the Olympics, perhaps?

GOLD: We'll see. I mean, the verdicts still out on that. But in the meantime, I'm doing some Olympic reporting and I have a memoir coming out that I'm really excited about. And for everyone in the U.S., headlining the ice dreams tour. So we have a traveling show tour and current Olympians Tim LeDuc and Ashley Cain which are on Team USA's current Olympic team. They will be there with me.

Former 2014 Olympic teammate Jeremy Abbott will be there. So if we're in a city, you guys can come check me out there.

TAPPER: Awesome. Gracie Gold, thanks so much. Good to see you.

A fisherman's tale that is unbelievable and true. Dramatic video of a rescue in the frigid waters off Massachusetts.

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TAPPER: Three fishermen face death after their boat capsized and sank off the coast of Massachusetts Tuesday. One of the survivors telling CNN affiliate WBEZ that they held on to floating hoses for 45 minutes in the freezing water.

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JOE RODERICK, MASSACHUSETTS FISHERMAN: The whole boat flipped over. We got thrown in the water. And I remember swimming away from the boat because I don't want to get pulled down in the suction.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Shaken, bruised but alive. Roderick is recovering in a hospital. Thanks to local rescue teams and the U.S. Coast Guard, all three men survived. The owner of the boat says it was fully renovated in 2018. He adds the hoses, to which the fishermen clung, do not normally float.

Join me Sunday for State of the Union. We have an exclusive with Democratic Senator Joe Manchin and Republican Senator Lisa Murkowski together. I'm also going to talk to the U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations, Linda Thomas-Greenfield, Sunday at 9:00 a.m. Eastern and at noon.

Our coverage continues now with one Mr. Wolf Blitzer in "THE SITUATION ROOM." I'll see you Sunday morning.